text:
Discussion in 'Thread Candidates' started by lwien, Aug 18, 2014.
I think the guys as 7th Floor have spent way too much time staring at Christmas tree color wheels.
Wow, The world's finest vaporizer? I had no idea.
I wonder if 7th Floor sold out to another company. With statements like that along with different colored flashing LED's makes me think they may be going through a bit of an identity crisis, eh?
here is some more information within the comments of herb-nerd, he is a (claimed ) representative of 7thfloor
Losing too many sales to Volcano, clearly. The 'we do it our own way' uniqueness of that company seems completely gone. They used to do their own thing, and now its just cheap chinese knock-off pens and 'me-too' features instead of pushing the industry forward, but thats just my $.02. Are they merely playing catchup? I used to really back this company, and hard. But...yeah I agree they may have sold out to someone bigger. When you used to see the company at festivals and trade shows, they have for years claimed how dumb bags are, and talked sooooo much trash on Volcano. They espouse the simplicity of their products(and they were right) but this sounds like added features that destroy that simplicity. Now, bags are cool. I must say that LED lights feel like, 'would you like fries with that?'
No, I haven't used it and shouldn't have an opinion. But I just feel that multi-colored LED lights probably don't improve vapor quality. And are they saying that the LED's will make the vape look like that all the time?
If you love your SSV(I know I do) and you have always wanted it to fill balloons just like a Volcano or Extreme Q or ONE or HerbalAire, then 7th Floor just made your day. I hope they rebound from the pens and this proves to up to the same quality as the original.
Yeah, I'm really disappointed in the direction they're taking. Looks like they want to just appeal to the masses now. To me, they really seemed to have carved out a nice niche for themselves in the market but strictly from a financial point of view, they may have gone as far as they think they could have gone with their current product and business may have dictated that they appeal to a wider base.
I just stated my opinion about this vape on YouTube where this vid was posted (which is on 7th Floors YouTube account) with a link to this thread.
Hope they show up here for a bit of discussion.
That would be nice to hear some official info
Well, for a split-second i confused the SSV and the LSV, which doesn't matter so much really. But then i read about having a fan inside so now i can only hope Steve's SSV Elev8 won't emulate the worst features offered by his competitors, so to speak...
to be honest, although the rave lights dont mean much to me and will be disabled if i were to ever own this, i think this is pretty interesting. I've wanted a tasty vape, but due to the large amount of people that visit my house frequently i've wanted to use a vape that can handle bags as well. This has the best of both worlds for me. Also, if you read through the reddit, the 7th floor rep says they are
"...developing new whips and configurations in order to allow log-style bowls and efficiency with much smaller loads."
^I'm not a naive child who's going to believe that just because he said this, it means they've created something as efficient as the enano. Its still worth keeping an eye on though...
And how do we know that that's really a 7th Floor Rep? I've read through most of that thread and the way he constructs his posts, it causes me to have my doubts.
Also, being that you want a multi-mode vape, what has been keeping you from getting either an Extreme Q, HerbalAire or Herbalizer?
this one is actually steve from 7th floor: http://www.reddit.com/r/vaporents/comments/2dmymg/ask_me_anything_here_at_7th_floor/
I was a big fan of my old SSV so I'll wait to see this release before making any decisions. If the price is fair, I might pick one up.
I'm thinking about getting a bag vape for social situations with more than 3 people (passing the EVO around with my glass makes me nervous) and this might fit the bill.
Like i said on grasscity, i've always been stuck between the LSV, Enano, and EQ. The LSV was appealing due to its taste, the enano for its efficiency, and the EQ for its multi-mode function (I find it more appealing than the herbalaire, and the herbalizer is too costly for my modest budget DX ).
If this comes out as advertised and at a reasonable price, i'll at the very least have a tasty vape with multi-mode function, which tackles 2 of the 3 main things i want out of a vape.
Dimensionally it seems the only change is the super thick base that holds all the now-necessary electronics (the lack of which were the former hallmarks of the SSV, per the owner) the temp knob is no longer custom glass, but looks like they went with the plastic version from the DBV and LSV. All these new parts made in the USA? Still fully rebuildable and serviceable? A screen in the heater cover now to prevent blow-back flame ups? I guess I need to hit the reddit page up and ask some more ?'s
Wonder if they're going to release a Super Da Buddha; the no frills, no bullshit version for those of us not interested in pretty colors and flashing lights.
People who are bitching about the led lights....smh....just turn em off if u purchase. If the lights are that big of a turn off there are other threads to peruse
Wait a second..........I started this thread with the specific intent to question the use of LED's which to me seems a bit gimmicky, especially from a company like 7th Floor. Are you suggesting that I leave my own thread simply because I don't like a specific feature of a yet to be released vaporizer which is kinda the reason I started this thread in the first place?
Hey, I gotta suggestion. If you really don't want to hear about opinionated negatives on a new vape, than maybe it is you that should either persue another thread or start your own thread stating that it should only contain positive opinions about the vaporizer in question.
Just got a newsletter from 7th Floor about this unit (so hopefully they release it soon). I love my SSV, it gave me many years of service before I upgraded to a herbalizer. If this unit performs as well as I hope and doesn't bust the bank I just might have to scoop one up! Can't wait to hear more about it!
Maybe the LEDs have another feature like displaying the relative temp via color? Like low end is green, mid temp is yellow, highest temp is red. Idk I'm just guessing lol
The led lights are kinda cool imo, they take me back to black lights and lava lamps and hopefully they will also be defeatable as tastes and moods vary. If the balloon mode is good it will be a major step forward, also it would be nice to have a thermostat for temperature stability as part of the new electronics. For myself, a 7th floor (non-vip) fan that owns two ssv's and an lsv, it's about time for some innovative new features.
couldn't agree more
If they place them so they can shine onto your load and/or wand, I think they could be very useful. I hate vaping in the dark because I can't tell when to stir or if the load is browning. Would be nice if they where flexible lights.
As for the new Heater Covers, I wonder if they will go with Ground Glass with some type of metal clip.
I for one can't wait to see what they have up their sleeves.
7th floor have considerable street cred based on their big 3, but unless this one fills bags as well as the Zephyr or Volcano, it's about as interesting to me as their vapor pens, which is to say, not very much.
PUMPED (at least hopeful)
i feel like if you didn't like the leds then buy a normal SSV but i'm hoping this doesn't end up being a disappointment :/ it could end up being pretty great!
Temp indicator will be a nice addition, not really a fan of bag vapes but maybe this feature will make it easier to construct an all glass water path. I hope they've put some thought into how the wand connects to the HC so you can vape a full load without stirring or disconnecting the wand.
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I know this is overly obvious, but can you say CART?
Dave Kallmann offers news, notes and perspective on the wide world of auto racing
What if NASCAR teams banded together . . .
I'd be lying if I said I knew how this would play out. I'm not sure what the real motivations are, although I suspect they're not quite as pure as portrayed. »Read Full Blog Post
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I agree with you Dave...there is much more here underneath the surface than the press release states. There are many questions as to why only the top 7 organizations (let's not pretend that Petty and SHR are more than closely held satellite teams with paper owners) banded together and excluded teams like FrontRow, Furniture Row, Germain, TBR, and others. Banding together for insurance and travel expenses makes most sense for the teams with the least...not the big dogs of the sport.
This whole thing stinks of ulterior motives...like $8B of them. IMO, the big dogs want a bigger slice of the TV money than the 25% currently allocated to the purse. With attendance, viewership, and sponsorship values declining, the big dogs are looking at the one area that will provide them with additional consistent for the next decade.
Since NASCAR is a collection of independent contractors with one single family controlling the sanctioning body, which is not an owner, this collective will not be like CART, although they will try. As much as I detest BZF's led NASCAR, it is still their court and their ball. The collective may do more harm than good.
It is also possible that they want more control on when the phony yellows get called as well as the ability to choreograph the crashes for maximum entertainment value.
CART was formed by the obvious dissension among the owners with USAC. If you believe in the "if it ain't broke don't fix it" mentality, one has to wonder what their real agenda is. If it were to merely secure bulk pricing for parts/services, they wouldn't need to publicize it.
CART was formed to sell the national television rights to their races because USAC didn't lock them up, and individual promoters couldn't deal with the national networks for rights. Everything else was just icing. In this case, NASCAR owns all the rights. Perhaps this is more like ASPAR vs. Indianapolis Motor Speedway in 1946-47.
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Multifunction DAQ with WiFi, Ethernet, and USB
T7:Ethernet, USB, 16-bit ADC, 100kS/s,
T7-Pro:All T7 features plus 802.11b/g WiFi & 24-bit ADC,
OEM Versions available: ✓
- 14 Built-in Analog Inputs, expandable to 84 analog inputs with Mux80 add-on
- Analog input ranges: ±10V, ±1V, ±0.1V and ±0.01V
- 16-bit high-speed ADC (up to 100k samples/s)
- 24-bit low-speed ADC (resolution as low as 1uV noise-free)
- 23 digital I/O
- Watchdog system
- Up to 10 counters
- 2 analog outputs (12-bit, 0-5V)
- Serial protocols: SPI, I2C, and more ...
- Up to 8 PWM, quadrature, pulse width, and more ...
- Thermocouples, load cells, bridges, and more ...
- Industrial temperature range (-40 to +85C)
- Compatibility with most SCADA Modbus TCP enabled systems for both wired and wireless operation
- Capable of standalone operation via Lua Scripting
T7 Pricing
Analog Input
- 14 Analog Inputs built in (16-24 Bits Depending on Speed & Device Type)
- Expand to 84 analog inputs with Mux80 add-on
- T7: 16-bit high-speed ADC (up to 100k samples/s)
- T7-Pro: 24-bit low-speed ADC (resolution as low as 1uV noise-free)
- Software Configurable Resolution Settings
- Single-Ended Inputs (14) or Differential Inputs (7)
- Analog input ranges: ±10V, ±1V, ±0.1V and ±0.01V
- All analog input features are software programmable by configuring the Analog Input Registers
- High speed sampling configurable by using Stream Mode. Speeds up to 100kS/s
- Low Latency Sampling and Control (less than 1ms) is made easy with Command-Response Modbus messages
- Easy integration with sensors like thermocouples, load cells, bridges, and more ...
Analog Output
- 2 analog outputs (12-bit, 0-5V)
- Future support for waveform generation via Stream Output
- Integrated LJTick-DAC support for multiple +/-10V outputs
Digital I/O
- 23 Digital I/O
- Supports SPI, I2C, and more... (Master Only)
- 5 PWM Outputs with individual phase control
- 5 Pulse Outputs with configurable number, frequency, and width
- 2 Frequency Inputs returning both frequency and period
- 2 Pulse Width Inputs measuring time spent high and low as well as duty cycle
- 2 Line-to-Line Inputs measuring the time between edges on 2 different lines
- 4 High-Speed Counters
- 6 Software Counters w/ debounce capabilities
- 6 Quadrature Inputs
- Information about Digital I/O features can be found in the DIO Extended Features section of the T7's datasheet
Fixed Current Outputs
- 200 µA
- 10 µA
Communication Options
- Ethernet
- 802.11b/g WiFi
Other Highlights
- Built-In CJC Temperature Sensor for easy thermocouple temperature readings
- Watchdog system
- Field Upgradable Firmware
- Programmable Startup Defaults
- Industrial temperature range (-40 to +85C)
- For more information please visit the hardware overview section of the T7's datasheet
T7-Pro vs. T7
The T7-Pro has all the features of the normal T7 with the major addition of 802.11b/g WiFi connectivity and an auxiliary low-speed high-resolution (24-bit) sigma-delta ADC.
OEM Versions
The T7 and T7-Pro come in standard and OEM versions. The OEM versions are intended to be embedded in another device. They are missing the enclosure and most connectors, as it is easier to install connectors than it is to remove them. LabJack can customize the boards to add or remove hardware before shipping, for an additional fee. More information on OEM versions can be found in the OEM Versions section of the T7 Datasheet.
Other Highlights
- Each purchase includes lifetime support
- Actively monitored and highly informative forums where users can share ideas, ask questions, and get answers from both peers and our technical support staff
- Free applications to configure, test, and log data to file
- Free examples: C/C++, C#, Delphi, Java, LabVIEW, MATLAB, Python, VB.NET and more...
- Modbus TCP – Use any platform that supports TCP/IP, no driver required
- Free cross-platform LJM Library – Extends/wraps the Modbus protocol for convenience
- Expansion boards – Add ±10V DACs, 4-20 mA inputs, terminal boards, relay boards and more...
Every feature of the T7 can be accessed directly using the associated Modbus TCP address, or use the LJM Library to access all features by name. This provides a powerful yet simple interface for almost any language or program.
LJM Features
Why LabJack?
- We don't force you into a certain operating system, software, or programming environment. We provide free support for C/C++, C#, Delphi, Java, LabVIEW, MATLAB, Python, VBA, VB.NET, DAQFactory and more. If you use something we don't already support, we will work with you to add support.
- Add new kinds of sensors on-the-fly. We provide inexpensive signal conditioning modules.
- Control valves, motors, lights, pumps, etc - using one of many digital I/O control options.
- Embed LabJack DAQ hardware in your product using our OEM options.
Quality Hardware
- Leveraging smart designs and the latest semiconductors, allows us to provide more performance for less money.
- Have confidence in your measurements. Each device is individually tested and calibrated traceable to NIST standards.
- New features are readily available through field-programmable firmware.
- Each device has multiple protection mechanisms on every I/O to help prevent damage.
Legendary Support
- Free lifetime support.
- Timely Email responses that actually answer your question.
- Get answers from the engineers who made the product.
Package Contents (Non-OEM)
- T7 (-Pro) unit itself in red enclosure
- USB cable (6 ft / 1.8 m)
- Ethernet Cable (6ft / 1.8m)
- USB 5V power supply
- Screwdriver
- Antenna (T7-Pro only)
- Other package details: No software CD included. Download the software from www.labjack.com/support/software.
- Retail packing (Package) size: 10" x 7" x 3"
- Retail packing (Package) wt: 1.2lb
Getting Started
Please visit the T7 Support Homepage to get started.
Download LJM Library
|Windows Installer 79.27 MB 2015-06-03 15:45
This is the installation package for Windows for the U3, U6, UE9, T7 and Digit. It supports both 32-bit and 64-bit versions of Windows XP, Windows Vista, Windows 7 and Windows 8. All high-level functions within the LJM library will be available through this installation.
This installation includes the driver, libraries, documentation, and utility applications listed below
Utility Applications
- LJControlPanel 2.32 - Simple configuration and testing utility for the U3/U6/UE9
- LJSelfUpgrade 1.30 - Updates firmware on the U3/U6/UE9
- LJLogUD 1.18 - Logging program recommended for < 100 Hz for the U3/U6/UE9
- LJStreamUD 1.18 - Logging program recommended for > 100 Hz for the U3/U6/UE9
- LJLogM 1.03 - Logging program recommended for < 100 Hz for the T7
- LJStreamM 1.04 - Logging program recommended for > 100 Hz for the T7
- Kipling 3.0.9 - Basic configuration and testing application for the T7
- Otero 1.53 - Configuration and downloader for the Digit series loggers
Code Libraries
- LJM Library 1.0803 - Library of high-level code functions for the T7/Digit
- LJM Constants 2015.05.29.A - JSON constants file for the LJM library
Low-level Driver
- LabJackWinUSB Driver X.XX - Driver for Windows USB communication to and from all LabJack devices
Tip: Uninstall previous versions before installing new versions. If a LabJack is connected during installation, unconnect and reconnect when done.
The normal ways of uninstalling previous versions of the package are:
- Do Start => Programs => LabJack => Uninstall.
- Go to Windows Control Panel (not LJControlPanel), then go to Add/Remove Programs, then find "LabJack" or "LabJackUD".
Here are the alternative manual steps:
- Go to Start => Programs, find the LabJack group, right-click on it, and delete from the start menu.
- On your hard drive delete the LabJack folder which is usually in "C:\Program Files\" or "C:\Program Files (x86)\"
- Find and delete delete labjackud.dll in your system directory (i.e. "C:\windows\system32\" or "C:\windows\SysWOW64\").
|Mac OS X Package 2.97 MB 2015-06-02 18:46
This is the installation package for Mac OS X for the T7, Digit. All high-level functions within the LJM library will be available through this installation. This installation does not include any utility applications
Installation instructions: Run LabJackM.pkg
Code Libraries
- LJM Library 1.0803 - Library of high-level code functions for the T7/Digit
- LJM Constants 2015.05.29.A - JSON constants file for the LJM library
Low-level Driver
- Exodriver 2.5 (liblabjackusb) - Driver for Mac and Linux USB communication to and from all LabJack devices
|Linux 32-bit Package 1.54 MB 2015-06-11 16:15
|Linux 64-bit Package 1.51 MB 2015-06-11 16:16
|Linux ARMv7 Package 1.35 MB 2014-10-02 17:27
This is the installation package for Linux for the T7, Digit. Select the i386/i686 (32-bit), x86_64 (64-bit), or ARM (32-bit) package. All high-level functions within the LJM library will be available through this installation. This installation does not include any utility applications
Installation instructions: Untar the package and run the LabJackM.run script:
$ sudo ./LabJackM.run
For more information, see the LJM Support page.
Code Libraries
- LJM Library 1.0803 - Library of high-level code functions for the T7/Digit
- LJM Constants 2015.05.29.A - JSON constants file for the LJM library
Low-level Driver
- Exodriver 2.5 (liblabjackusb) - Driver for Mac and Linux USB communication to and from all LabJack devices
Get the latest version of Kipling
We are in the process of releasing a new control program for the T7 and T7-Pro that doesn't get installed automatically with the LJM Library download. Please visit the dedicated Kipling support page for instructions on how to download and install it. Information about the version of Kipling installed by the installation link above (windows only) is available on the old Kipling page.
Kipling aims to educate customers about the T7 and T7-Pro's many features and expose some of the more complicated ones to make them easy to use. When used side by side with our other documentation sources, custom program development can be fast and efficient.
Kipling Highlights
Device Selection
Kipling features a simple device selection process that makes it easy to see a device's connectivity options and provides users immediate information about each found device. The information provided is particularly useful for users trying to connect to devices using a local area network.
Program Usability
Multifunction DAQ devices, especially the T7 and T7-Pro have a lot of built-in features. Kipling combats this by being fast and organized. Kipling keeps a tabbed based interface but formats all information so that it is both easy to understand and easy to find.
Analog Input Functionality
The T7 and T7-Pro are highly capable devices with a multitude of different analog based features. Kipling makes them easy to learn about, configure, and use. Explore the device's extended features through a GUI interface before trying to program them with only command line based tools and a datasheet for debugging.
Device Scripting
Explore the T7/T7-Pro's most unique feature, Lua Scripting. Write, run, and debug Lua scripts that get executed locally on the device to explore the device's capabilities and allow the T7 to function independently from a computer. Lua script examples are built into the program!
Device Updating
The employees at LabJack are dedicated to making the T7 a quality data acquisition and control device that fits many people's needs. In order to do this we release device updates with new features, bug fixes, and more. Kipling makes this easy by automatically downloading and installing firmware files that used to be only available on the firmware page.
Windows Only Applications
LJLogM is a windows only utility program that can periodically read, display, and log to file any LJM register. These values can all be offset by a custom scaling equation. For more information, go to the LJLogM page.
LJStreamM is a windows only utility program that makes acquiring and logging high frequency data with the T7/T7-Pro's streaming system simple and easy. For more information, go to the LJStreamM page.
Quick Links
- Kipling - Test & Configure
- LJM Modbus Map
- Programming - C/C++, .NET, LabVIEW, Python, MATLAB, and more.
- Basic Free Applications - Various simple but useful applications for Windows.
- 3rd Party Applications - Applications created by other software companies.
Getting Started
Please visit the T7 Support Homepage to get started.
Hardware Related Links
- T7 Datasheet - Discover, research, and learn about all of the T7 and T7-Pro's features.
- App Notes - In-depth detail on various DAQ topics.
- LJM Modbus Map - Search through register names and descriptions to learn about how to use the T7 and T7-Pro.
Software Related Links
- T7 Datasheet - Keep an eye out for code snippets and register descriptions for each feature.
- LJM Library User's Guide - Library/Driver/SDK/API for the T7 on Linux, Mac OS X, and Windows.
- LJM Modbus Map - Use it while developing software to double check register types, names, and functionality.
- Programming Resources - C/C++, .NET, LabVIEW, Python, MATLAB, and more.
- Basic Free Applications - Various simple but useful applications for Windows.
- 3rd Party Applications - Applications created by other software companies.
Still Have Questions?
- Search - Try using the search box on every page. It works.
- App Notes - In-depth detail on various DAQ topics, we have a lot of them.
- Forum - Search for answers and post a new topic.
- Contact Support - Fast email responses. You can even call us for free, if that is preferred.
- LabJack Installer
- LJM Library - Updates here if any.
- Kipling - The test & configuration app. Updates here if any.
- Firmware - Download here, then use Kipling to apply the update.
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Why do couples say "we're" pregnant. I don't know about others for sure, but I do know that I was pregnant and that my husband helped get me in that condition. He has never been pregnant, didn't get fat and go through labor or had a child in his body.
What the? Who started that crap?


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Full story for Bryan Singer's planned SUPERMAN RETURNS sequel revealed
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December 12 2010, 02:51 PM
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Location: Regina, SK, Canada
Re: Full story for Bryan Singer's planned SUPERMAN RETURNS sequel reve
I think the pay-off would be that come people would finally realize WHY Superman doesn't just become their new God: He doesn't want some sort of spineless cult worshipers who will rely on him for everything and forget their own ability to do good and effect change in the world.
That in the end, he wants it to be for humans to realize that only they will be the ones to choose and achieve their own destinies.
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Carb heat while cruising
Re: Carb heat while cruising
Ya'know, Both of you guys are talking way over my head. If I need to know all this stuff (which I don't and really don't want to), then I had better hang up my prop right now and watch you guys fly...
I have done a lot of hangar listening and never felt this stupid.. It's evident George and Walter are having issues - but take them outside and settle them - I doubt you can settle them on this forum.. A lot of folks may be afraid to chime in on any subject unless they have an engineering degree in everything PLUS Aviation.
Re: Carb heat while cruising
Hi Gang,
I've been following this thread pretty closely and have a little bit to add.
I have a pretty good selection of tech manuals for all flavors of engines and airframes in my shop. I don't have advanced degrees in engineering nor do I profess to be Chuck Yeagers mentor....I'm just another I.A. who spends every day in the G.A. trenches trying to keep these things safe and reliable so my customers can come back to spend more money.
What I do have is a pretty sound understanding of the systems that have to sing together to make the prop turn. I've poured over all my "secret" stash of tech tips and ops manuals and just can't seem to find a reference for metering alcohol into fuel systems to defeat the effects of water in fuel. I have this cool little gadget...made out of clear plastic and it even has a little reversable screwdriver on the pointy end.....you just push the open end of this thing up on the "drains" under the wings and this smelly, blue stuff comes out. Rolling around towards the bottom of the clear plastic thingy will often be a little liquid globule of other stuff that your engine probably doesn't want to eat....so dispose of this foul elixer in an appropriate manner and repeat this "drain" technique until just smelly, blue stuff comes out. Then pull the little white handle up front and kill the weeds under your airplane for a few seconds or, with help, catch what you can in the plastic thingy and scrutinize it for offensive floaters and sinkers. Repeat all until satisfied.
Now, go fly in whatever temperature/moisture level you're comfortable with and fiddle with the mixture and carb heat to produce the smoothest running engine you can.
Land, park and refuel ONLY with smelly, blue stuff. Go into the nice, heated hangar, soak your bunyons in Marvel Mystery Oil and pour that alcohol down your neck while you read Lycoming, Continental or Franklin operation & service manuals concerning the correct way to feed and fondle your engine :^)
Of course, if you use Jeep gas in your plane I don't know what to suggest......
Gregg Horrell
Not Trying to Sell Anything
Tucson, AZ
Re: Carb heat while cruising
From my 1981 172P P.O.H. Section 8, page 8-12. ..."Therefore, to alleviate the possibility of fuel icing occuring under these unusual conditions, it is permissible to add isopropyl alcohol or ethylene glycol monomethyl ether (EGME) compound to the fuel supply"...
..."Alcohol, if used, is to be blended with the fuel in a consentration of 1% by volume. Consentrations greater than 1% are not recommended since they can be detrimental to fuel tank materials"... ..."Any high quality isopropyl alcohol may be used,"...
Refer to your aircraft POH for approved fuel additives and instructions on how to mix and introduce them into your aircraft fuel system.
Someone was going to apologize?
Del Lehmann
Mena, Arkansas USA
Re: Carb heat while cruising
Thanks Del,
That IS news to me! I apologize for not being aware of that. Now I'll have to see if your POH for a 1981 172P with Lycoming O-320-D2J authorizes alcohol in Lenny's 1967 172 with the Continental O-300-D.
I may've missed that part in my 1966 when I owned it. I'm not saying it isn't there...just never remember seeing a reference in older Cessnas for adding alocohol or glycol to fuel.
I do appreciate you sharing your POH info...it may put out some other fires on this thread :^)
P-Model Cessnas are pretty nice BTW....Cessna finally admitted the 172N's H2AD was an anchor and put a proper engine in the next model year. Larger dorsal and rudder trim were nice features.
Thanks again,
Gregg Horrell
Re: Carb heat while cruising
Your mileage may vary. You are free to believe anything you wish.
There are a growing number of pilots and mechanics who are becoming comfortable in relying on hard data rather than someone's unsupported opinion. Some folks would rather not be bothered with the facts when holding dear a longheld opinion or belief... even when it is clearly in error.
Even when Mr. Lehman presented supporting documentation on this particular issue, there was the ever-present, "Yeah, but..." and not a single hint of "Oops, maybe I was wrong."
Thank you.
Walter Atkinson
Re: Carb heat while cruising
Well I'll be dipped! After further digging I found the following jewels. So, for the purpose of this thread I'm sorry I scoffed at the idea of glycol additives for water emulsification. Hear that, Walter? ;^)
That said, I still endorse thorough pre-flight draining and inspection. Another possible cause of Lenny's loss of power could have been filter icing. I've experienced this in Germany and it shows by an INSTANT increase in power when carb heat is pulled...even a little bit...because you're by-passing the blocked filter.
So, if you have the proper measuring equipment you can dump EGME into the fuel, not to exceed the following limitations:
(From Sacramento Skyranch...a wealth of information)
Lycoming Service Letter L172B dated January 25, 1980 says in part "...tests conducted with EGME used as an ice inhibiting fuel additive have shown to be satisfactory for use in all Avco Lycoming engines with no adverse affects on engine operations when used in concentrations up to 0.15% by volume in Aviation Gasoline. The use of EGME as a fuel additive in Avco Lycoming engines is approved by Avco Lycoming and the FAA."
Continental Service Bulletin M81-11 Rev. 1 states in part "...Under certain ambient conditions of temperature/humidity, water can be supported in the fuel in sufficient quantities to create restrictive ice formation along various segments of fuel system." "... ethylene glycol monomethyl ether compounds conforming to military specification MIL-L-27686E, if approved for use in the aircraft fuel system by the aircraft manufacturer, can be added for this purpose. The ethylene glycol monomethyl ether compound must be carefully mixed with the fuel in concentrations not to exceed 0.15 percent by volume."
Continental issues the following warning that is important to understand:
"Mixing of the EGME compound with the fuel is extremely important because concentration in excess of that recommended (0.15 percent volume maximum) can have a harmful effect on engine components. Use only blending equipment that is recommended by the manufacturer to obtain proper proportioning."
Hopes this helps,
Gregg Horrell
Walter...George....Peace :^)
Re: Carb heat while cruising
FAA Advisory Circular AC43-16 also addresses the subject.
This article was excerpted from a Special Issue General Aviation Airworthiness Alert issued in Dec. 1985.
While proper fuel sampling and sumping is essential in preventing the formation of ice due to free water in the fuel, it will not eliminate the hazard of ice blockage of fuel flow. Under certain conditions, water in suspension or solution may form ice crystals. Since water in suspension or solution is not removed by sumping, the formation of ice crystals must be prevented by adding anti-icing additives, such as isopropyl alcohol or ethylene glycol monomethyl ether (EGME), to the fuel. Both additives absorb water and reduce the freezing point of the mixture. Teledyne Continental and Avco Lycoming approve the use of both additives in their engines, subject to approval by the respective airframe manufacturers. When alcohol or EGME are used, instruction for their proper use must be carefully followed. Obtain and follow the aircraft and engine manufacturers recommendations regarding the use of anti-icing additives in the fuel for your aircraft.
Proper sumping is very important during the preflight check. Sufficient fuel should be drawn off into a transparent container to see if the fuel is free from contaminants. Extra care should be taken during changes in temerature, particularly when it nears the freezing level. Ice may be in the tanks, which may turn to water when the temperature rises, and may filter down into the carburetor or fuel controller causing engine failure. Water can freeze in lines and filters causing stoppage. A small amount of water, when frozen, can prevent proper operation of fuel pumps, selector valves, and carburetors."
also AC23.1521-1B paragraph 5(g)
"g. ASTM D 910, Standard Specification for Aviation Gasolines, allows the use of isopropyl alcohol conforming to the requirements of ASTM D 4171, Specifications for Fuel System Icing Inhibitor, as a fuel system icing inhibitor. Accordingly, isopropyl alcohol conforming to ASTM D 4171 may be used in consentrations up to 1% by volume, to benefit safety, as an icing inhibitor..."
So what does all this mean? My own conclusion:
We (aviators) have been using alcohol as an anti-icing additive for decades. It is not illegal or dangerous when added in accordance with the respective manufacturers recommendations. Isopropyl alcohol can and should be used, in certain conditions, as an anti-icing additive.
Did anyone else notice that the majority of the opinions and facts were from people in the south, where we have no experience using the stuff?
Re: Carb heat while cruising
Your concern about the "very high consentration" that would occur resulting from several months of use, and Walter's 100% agreement with that assessment, is understandable. Someone wishing to use isopropyl for the winter season should add up to 1% isopropyl alcohol to their tanks during refueling, at the start of the cold season. Then they would add 1% isopropyl by volume of the fuel added from this time on. Obviously, any fuel remaining in the tanks after a flight would still be 1% isopropyl, making it necessary to treat only the amount of fuel that is added. For my aircraft I would add about a fifth gallon to each of my 21.5 gal. tanks, equal to about 2 of George's German beers to each tank. Seems like alot, but it's actually under 1%.
Disclaimer: The use of alcohic beverage containers as measuring devices is not recommended, not not recommended, approved, unapproved, banned, or even mentioned in any aviation related document, to my knowledge. It just wouldn't look good. As for a proper measuring device, I believe that we can all make it up as we go. Use whatever you want, providing you know the volume, and that it is clean. Yes, even a Dixie cup. Maybe we could start another topic of discussion on this disturbing, outlandish, dangerous, illegal, misunderstood, controversial old wives tail (tale).
Also, important to note is that the isopropyl alcohol used as an additive to aircraft fuel DOES have to meet certain specifications, possibly different for the various manufacturers. My FAA Approved Airplane Flight Manual uses the verbage " any high quality". This excludes anything you might purchase at Wal-Mart. "Rubbing" alcohol is allready saturated with water and would do more harm than good.
I agree that fuel quality standards are "strictly adhered to" at the refineries. I also know that after having been transfered numerous times into and out of tanks, tanker trucks, inground and above ground tanks, and then into our aircraft, that the quality can and does vary. How much? I don't know. What kind of regulations govern Av fuel transporters and retailers? Do they have required intervals for changing filters and taking periodic fuel samples to insure quality? Does everybody do what their supposed to? I don't know, I'm asking.
Excellent and enlightening discussion. I've learned alot. From everybody. Many thanks.
Not affiliated with anyone.
And no, I don't get a commision either
Del Lehmann
Re: Carb heat while cruising
Hi All:
Let me get this straight... "Lycoming says" up to .15% may be added... (that is .15 of ONE PERCENT) so lets just say 1/10 of one percent (1 part per 1000) to keep it EZ. Soooo climbing up on the ladder... in the rain and snow... I am trying to measure out the correct amount for a refueling of... say 10 gals. per tank to keep it EZ again. Hummm.... 1/10 of one percent of ten gals. is.... hummm.... well... humm... 10 gals. is 60 pounds... 1/1000 of that is 0.06 pounds... at 16 oz to a pound... one once is .0625 pounds... close enough.... soooo one once per 10 gals is the approved amount...
Jeez why brother... that is a very, very small amount to measure... and repeated doses risk concentrations that are not approved. And, as Mr Horn pointed out... my Cessna manual says no additives are to be used.
Blue skies to all, Bob
Re: Carb heat while cruising
I hope this doesn't sound muffled, speaking thru all the egg on my face.
Walter Atkinson, I sincerely apologize. I not only apologize for the personal nature of the criticism, but also for the unprofessional manner in which I did it.
I apologize to all who read my previous messages in this thread. My previous comments were improperly based upon obsolete information. The egg on my face is well-deserved. (Not a defense, there being NONE for my comments, but checking the cancellation history of Advisory Circulars prohibiting alcohol in fuel, would have been appropriate. I never. As they say, …Never say never.)
I actually have plenty of experience Del, in cold northern climates using anti-icing additive in fuel. I used it on the trans-Atlantic ferries that once was my job. Considered a banned substance at the time, it just wasn't alcohol. It was supplied by the refiner, added at the fuel farm or injected at the fuel nozzle on the truck in prescribed dosage. Isopropyl alcohol was only used to clean windshields of grease and oil and adhesives, and filters and tools on the workbench,… not as a fuel additive.
I'm confident of my previous comments regarding dosage. 1% approval ratings or not, I'd not add it to my own fuel over the wing. (How do you know how much water is in it?) So, personally I'll only use fuel anti-ice additive that is pre-mixed at the pump.
There are some "old aviator" sayings that really should become more ingrained in my memory. One of the best ones is "If you find yourself in a hole….quit digging."
Maybe I should contribute a new one: "Stay off high horses. Not even a high horse will allow you to see out of a really deep hole."
Thanks Walter, Del, and all, for the lesson. And please accept my apology.
Re: Carb heat while cruising
Thank you. No harm, no foul! <g> As I've said in the past on this forum, a keyboard is a terrible way to communicate. Humans were meant to TALK to one another. In my haste to communicate my experience, I neglected to explain what I meant by a small amount. Me thinking tiny amounts like cc's could easily be thought of as a beer can full by someone else. Not good communication. My friend who lives in Cadillac, MI, where I go to fly ski planes in the winter and float planes in the summer has a 10cc syringe kept behind the seat where the fuel tester lives.
A 10cc syringe works quite well to titrate the appropriate amount of anti-icing liquid he keeps in the baggage compartment when the lakes are frozen over. I'm a Southern Boy. All I do is add the correct amount for the fuel added that he has listed on a sheet of paper when I add fuel. It's ............ a small amount by my standards, since I measure stuff in a shot glass as FULL. <vbg>
WE are all in this row-boat together. We aviators are a small group and we need to remain friends against those who would have us walking. I can think of NO topic which should separate us to the point of incommunication... unless you want me to stop flying.
I get over 200 e-mails a day asking engine questions. I visit 5 other forums almost daily. I sometimes answer expiditiously with incomplete explanations, and seldom take the time to site references. I try VERY HARD not to answer a question I have no experience with. There is only so much time in the day for me , too... since most all of us have real jobs. I will try to do better, too. Thank you for your response, George. It was kind of you. It would have been easy not to respond. You did not do that and I respect that.
Now, let's argue something that MATTERS... like Cessna vs. Piper!!! (yeah, I know, it'll be a short discussion!) <VBG>
Walter Atkinson
Re: Carb heat while cruising
Bob White,
There have been 2 anti-icing additives discussed here; Ethylene glycol monomethyl ether (EGME), and isopropyl alcohol. The mixing ratio that you mention is for the EGME, and is correct, only for EGME. Isopropyl, as an anti-icing additive, is mixed a full 1% by volume, roughly 10 times the amount in your example; remember, by volume, not weight.
Which model Cessna is it that you say prohibits the use of additives? Is this info contained in the Service Manual or POH?
Re: Carb heat while cruising
Thank you for the prompt to check out my manual. Yep... I think all that talk of alcohol got me a little woozy. I just carefully re-read My "1958 Cessna Skylane's Owner Manual" and in fact, it has NO provision for using fuel additives. It only says that "Aviation grade fuel should always be used..." I was remiss, in that I recollected it saying prohibited, rather than saying nothing about them. It has cold weather provisions for diluting the oil and all that, but not a word about additives. I think my memory converted that "nothing to not." BTW, in the ten years I've owned the plane I've checked the sumps before every flight and I don't believe I recovered more than a teaspoon of water TOTAL in all that time... but the fear of contaminated fuel is always in the back of my mind. How much water do other plane owners find?
Blue skies to all, Bob
Re: Carb heat while cruising
it is -40 here this morning 200 miles north of quebec city.
you ask -40C or -40F .well look on a thermometer and youll see its the same .
i flew last week end at-20f .you have to be more carefull but it can be fun .sure gets great performance.
also spoke with a commercial operator who have 25 beavers and otters.he is operating all of them from june to november for fisherman and hunters.in winter he keeps 2 running on skis to dispatch staff to companies that operates further north .
he always operated these 2 beavers all winter down to minus 40 .
only this year he gave a new instruction to his pilots nor to fly below -5F.not for fuel freezing but due to cylinder cracking .
they also never put an additive on the fuel except when the plane has been hangared .in that case they add isopropyl alcool that they buy at wal mart.they also have no fancy formula .they just put 'some'. they never have problems with that operating system in last 25 years
Re: Carb heat while cruising
Most of Wal-Marts (or whatever store you buy it from) alcohol is 50% alcohol...if you get the stuff that costs a little more its 70%...the rest is water. I think the stuff they use for sterylizing is still only 90%.
You'll need to go to a Home Depot or some other supply house to get "the good stuff" (It works great for wiping off silicone sealants)
This is neither a recommendation to or not to use the stuff in any manor that you see or don't see fit.
Re: Carb heat while cruising
Remember, radial engines have lower compressions (6:1) and can handle lower octane fuels than the engines most of us are running in GA airplanes. Adding alcohol has less effect on the detonation margin of those radials than it does on the higher compression engines in our airplanes. Caution in the amount used is wise. A very small amount is effective and a lot is no more useful and possibly harmful.
Walter Atkinson
Re: Carb heat while cruising
<HTML>My favorite argument concerning alcohol still remains: less filling! No, tastes great! Actually, I live in Alaska and only have had chronic appearance of water in the fuel when living where the temperature frequently was rising and dropping below the freezing mark combined with a lot of rain, in coastal towns. I've never used alcohol in either my car or airplanes and have never had trouble. One adage I've heard from old-timers in Alaska is that once you start using Heet (alcohol) in a car, you need to keep using it. This may be because the alcohol not only mixes with and disperses water through combustion, but it can help attract water from the humid ambient atmosphere and pull it into solution. I don't know if its true, but its food for thought. Cheers!</HTML>
Re: Carb heat while cruising
* This may be because the alcohol not only mixes with and disperses water through combustion, but it can help attract water from the humid ambient atmosphere and pull it into solution.*
That's an interesting thing to ponder. Since a gas tank has a cap and air is not *supposed* to go in and out of it in large quantities, I wonder how much vapor would be introduced? Let's start with the assumption that this happens a lot and there is a lot of moisture present. Wouldn't *pulling it into solution* be the object as opposed to allowing it to collect as a liquid contaminate in the bottom of the tank?
I could be wrong, but I've always thought that having a tablespoon of water evenly distributed in solution throughout 30 gallons of 100LL would be far less of a problem than having the whole tablespoon go into the fuel system at once. I've seen that effect and it can make your heart attack you!
What am I missing?
Hmmm? I'm figuring on how to set up this experiment. <g>
Walter Atkinson
Re: Carb heat while cruising
There is actually quite an opportunity for water to get in the tanks.
Each day the fuel warms and cools. Expands and contracts. The air above the fuel is expelled and re-inspired. Any humidity will condense in the tanks and any alcohol will attract it and grab it and hold it in suspension. At least until the alcohol is loaded to capacity, and then the water will precipitate out. (Or worse, the airplane will climb to cool altitudes and the water will suddenly precipitate out and overwhelm the gascolator with more than it was intended to deal with and the engine can't burn water.)
If the fuel has no alcohol in it, any water from atmosphere will settle out to the sumps and/or be captured by the gascolator to be drained during preflight. Thats the scenario I propose, anyway.
I thought I'd be clever about 20 years ago and added alcohol to all my ground power equipment because I'd read about alcohol being a good anti-icing agent, and winter was coming.
My equipment was unuseable only 3 months later and the fuel tanks had to be removed and acid-cleaned, and epoxy coated inside to correct all the corrosion from the accumulated water. (The fuel appeared to have about 5% water precipitated inside the tanks. It amounted to several cups of water in the bottom of the tanks. The carburetor bowls were ALL excessively corroded and required overhauls.) This previous experience back in 1985 might explain why I developed an aversion to usng alcohol in fuel.
A more recent example is only this winter with my emergency power generator, garden tiller, and pressure washer out here on the ranch. They were all stored in the hangar this winter with automotive fuel in them, that I am highly convinced were alcohol laced by the distributor as part of the winter fuel recipie. All THREE of those tanks have been discovered with large quantities of water in them and two of them have had to have their carbs removed and overhauled to get them to run. The bowls were full of what looked like calcium deposits. (I'm sure it's corrosion by-products from interaction between the aluminum carb body, the steel bowls and the precipitated water that drained into them from the gravity fuel system those two have. The water served as the electrolyte, is my belief.)
It cost me a whole day of labor and lots of $$$ to get them serviceable again, and the fuel tanks are now internally damaged with rusted areas. I will ony store them in the future with (TCP-spiked) 100LL avgas in them (and I'll use AeroShell oil in the engine crankcases since they are all air-cooled and will be burning leaded fuel.)
Re: Carb heat while cruising
You sure make a compelling argument against the use of alcohol on a regular basis. In this case it seems as though the engine management non-issue is clearly overshadowed by the significant maintenance issue the practice may present. I appreciate the time you took to address that in the manner in which you did. After reading that, I think you're probably right about it being a bad idea to use it regularly. As I said, I'm a southern boy and have no long-term experience with this. When it's *cold* here, it's 25dF!! We don't play football in the snow either. <g>
The only reason I can think of to use it would be if you SUSPECT a problem and think you might avoid having water freeze in a line which would be a bad thing! I can think of other, better options, however. <g>
I have BIG gascolators in my Twin Beech and I have noticed that if they are not cleaned rather regularly, corosion can become a problem.
Good points. Thanks. You educated me and I appreciate it.
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Saturday, June 27, 2015
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We went to the Taroko National Park - absolutely beautiful - got in some hiking as well as walking, and had to wear a helmet in parts because the overhanging ledges occasionally collapse. (Didn't collapse on us!)
Had a great time - it was ... Read more
Thursday, June 25, 2015
5 comments
We enjoyed Taipei, and had a wonderful afternoon at the National Palace Museum. Now, we're on the east coast of Taiwan, where the mountains roll down to the sea, with dramatic gorges in between.
We enjoyed our train ride, and now we're hav... Read more
Friday, June 19, 2015
6 comments
We seem to just fall into festivals - and this was a great one! Teams in boats that look like dragons, racing up and down the river, all day long for two days! Then the winners will race each other on Sunday, for the championships!
Read more
Tuesday, June 16, 2015
4 comments
People here in Taipei are so friendly, and apologize for their limited English. I keep saying hey, I only speak two words of Chinese, you're doing better than we are!
But after New Caledonia, where I could communicate in French, it feels v... Read more
Sunday, June 14, 2015
6 comments
We arrived in Taipei, Taiwan, late last night. Between resting up after 13 or 14 hours of flying, and trying to miss the thunder storms of the afternoon, we had lunch at Starbucks. And did our grocery shopping at the 7-11 nearby. Except 7-11s... Read more
Wednesday, June 10, 2015
8 comments
We didn't get to the south end of the island, we had a few rainy days and it just isn't the best time to drive around when you don't know where you're going.
So we had a few relaxing couple of days, turned in the car, and continued to enjoy... Read more
Tuesday, June 09, 2015
6 comments
People on strike were blocking the roads, so we had to change our travels. Ended up missing out on the entire east coast of the island. But we had fun despite the changes, and the rain.
rollingluggagers.blogspot.com/2015/06/wh... Read more
Thursday, June 04, 2015
4 comments
We liked Malabou beach so much we spent a second day here - it was just gorgeous, and our bungalow was right by the beach! Comfy and roomy, but cozy. Not tripping over each other, but all in a little thatch covered hut.
Read more
Tuesday, June 02, 2015
3 comments
We've been heading north along the national highway, and the scenery keeps getting prettier and more mountainous. New Caledonia really is a hidden treasure - I don't know why more people don't come here?
Well, it is rather off the beaten t... Read more
Tuesday, June 02, 2015
6 comments
It isn't turtle nesting season in New Caledonia, since we're south of the equator. But this is the beach where turtles come - enough that there are signs all over about the life cycle of the turtles, how to help an injured turtle, and what to d... Read more
Saturday, May 30, 2015
7 comments
We didn't get very far on our first day, but we have 10 days to cover an area roughly as big as Connecticut. As some areas don't have roads. So we can take it slowly and enjoy the travel.
This country is BEAUTIFUL! Really gorgeous! Unex... Read more
Friday, May 29, 2015
6 comments
Polynesian dancing is great exercise - men jumping and leaping, women twirling their hips faster than a speeding bullet - and curvaceous is a necessity for the women's dancing!
rollingluggagers.blogspot.com/2015/05/polynesian-d<... Read more
Thursday, May 28, 2015
8 comments
Still having a great time in New Caledonia! When the weather gets windy, the wind surfers come out in full force - it was incredible to watch them! (I've tried, and I know how difficult it is to wind surf!)
rollingluggagers.blogsp... Read more


text:
Just like SQL Server 2008, you can install SQL Server 2008 R2 on a MUI system. Additional checks have been added to SQL Server 2008 R2 to ensure you don't install on an unsupported localized or MUI system. Therefore it is important you properly configure your system prior to the installation.
Here is the official documentation on the SQL Server language support: http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ee210665(SQL.105).aspx.
In summary:
Below, I have the instructions on enabling MUI on a Windows 7 system but should be similar for other operating systems.
1. Open up "Region and Language" and choose Japanese.
2. Change System Locale on the Administrative Tab by clicking on "Change system local…"
3. Select the Current System Locale:
4. Click on "Install/Uninstall languages…" to install the language pack.
5. Go through the wizard and install the language pack
6. Now run the localized version of SQL Server. If you immediately see a message indicating the language is not supported, ensure the language that you are trying to install matches the MUI language and the setting above are correct.


text:
Green River only allows one adult tent and one child's tent per each tent site (children must use tent). On our water and electric sites we allow one adult tent and one child's tent (children must use tent), however if they wish to have two adult tents, they must pay the same site price for the second adult tent.
An additional tent can be placed on these sites for an additional fee of $23.00 or $28.00 depending on site location. Electrical hookup(s) available on this site: 15/30 amps. These sites are waterfront sites, paved only, with a metal picnic table and a lamppost. These ARE NOT concrete sites.


text:
Originally written on Bush League Chronicle | Last updated 9/14/12
Does this tough economy have you feeling down? Are you looking for a job with a MLB franchise that is quite literally head and shoulders "above the rest". Then look no further than the newest job opening in the Kansas City Royals organization.
The Royals are seeking to find a qualified candidate to fill their vacant window cleaning position. Here is the job description:
Applies and removes cleaning solutions to glass and similar surfaces throughout the stadium using tools including scrubbers, brushes, chamois, squeegees, scrapers, poles, and sponges, etc.
Other duties as assigned
1. Are you afraid of heights?
2. Do you have experience repelling off building to clean windows?
3. Do you have at least 2 years of window cleaning experience?
4. Are you at least 18 years old?
5. Are you able to work flexible hours including weekends, evenings and holidays?
6. Are you able to walk and stand for long periods of time and maneuver stairs?
Do you think you have what it takes to be the clear choice for the job? Don't let this window of opportunity pass you by. Apply today.
A tip of the cap to Ben Lindbergh of Baseball Prospectus for the link on Twitter.
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text: Appendix The appendix is near the junction of the small bowel and the colon. On occasion, it may become infected. Although most people are familiar with appendicitis, it is a relatively uncommon disease. It is treated by surgical removal of the appendix (appendectomy). Recovery time for uncomplicated appendicitis is usually just three days. Review Date: 5/21/2012 Reviewed By: Harvey Simon, MD, Editor-in-Chief, Associate Professor of Medicine, Harvard Medical School; Physician, Massachusetts General Hospital. The information provided herein should not be used during any medical emergency or for the diagnosis or treatment of any medical condition. A licensed medical professional should be consulted for diagnosis and treatment of any and all medical conditions. Links to other sites are provided for information only -- they do not constitute endorsements of those other sites. © 1997- A.D.A.M. content is best viewed in IE9 or above, Firefox and Google Chrome browser. Content is best viewed in IE9 or above, Firefox and Google Chrome browser.


text: Family Pathways Kids First, Circle of Friends and Mora Teen center participated in the "I Can Camp" program recently, sponsored by Wild River State Park. Nineteen students and six adults camped overnight in the park. The "I Can Camp" staff taught camping skills such as setting up a tent, c...Read More


text:
Privacy and Cookies
Singapore's decision to drop one of the three contenders for its Next Generation Fighter requirement only months before a final decision is expected was not only unexpected but has left the bidding team looking for answers to some searching questions.Eurofighter GmbH and BAE Systems had some reason to be optimistic after the Typhoon reportedly 'won' the Republic of Singapore Air Force (RSAF) evaluation. This was not a competitive fly-off, and was only one element in a broad evaluation, but the Typhoon demonstrated impeccable serviceability. It was able to delivery everything they wanted, including supercruise, when its competitors could not. Radar performance was reportedly far in excess of what Singapore had expected to see, and the aircraft was able to climb to operating altitude without making a tortuous series of turns to avoid Malaysian air space.Neither the Typhoon, nor the Dassault Rafale, nor the Boeing F-15 can meet the RSAF's requirements in their present form. But there was every reason to believe that the Typhoon in its Tranche 2+ configuration could meet - and comfortably exceed - Singapore's requirement. The fact that Eurofighter GmbH was able to fly Singaporean pilots in the active cockpit, demonstrating the planned capabilities and enhancements in a realistic simulated sortie, reportedly impressed the evaluation team. By the end of the evaluation phase, the Typhoon was, apparently, the RSAF's favoured technical solution.The aircraft was then rejected before either of its competitors, showing that it not only 'failed to win', but that it had become the 'third choice.'It is believed that the decision had little, if anything, to do with the Typhoon's capability and planned capability per se, but was instead a natural reaction to what insiders called "a shambolic performance" by BAE Systems during the early part of the bidding process. It also apparently reflected Singaporean unease about the risks surrounding the advanced Tranche 2 capabilities it required.In particular, the Singaporeans were concerned about delivery timescales and were said to be worried by the continuing inability by the Eurofighter partner nations to finally define the Tranche 2 and Tranche 3 Typhoon specifications. Singapore wanted a delivery timescale that could "just about have been met with Tranche 1 aircraft", but required Tranche 2 capabilities that are "road-mapped" but still unfunded, and whose development has not yet been started. Only a basic air-to-ground capability (using the Litening 3 laser designator and enhanced Paveway LGBs) has been set in stone, and this falls far short of the capability required by the RSAF.Confidence in the Typhoon's future capabilities may have been undermined by continuing doubts about the programme's long-term future, with Britain's Chief of the Air Staff casting doubt on Britain's need for Tranche 3, and with the Liberal Democrat party seizing on cancellation of the project in the recent UK general election. BAE insiders say that while in days gone by BAE had a formidable reputation for putting together watertight bids, with a highly-regarded bid centre and "red teams", these withered after the merger with GEC. By the time the Typhoon campaign in Singapore began, the company no longer had the structures in place to put together a winning bid, with a sensible price and a convincing technical specification. Belatedly recognising this, one of the company's remaining marketing gurus (who had reportedly been responsible for the biggest recent Hawk sales successes) was drafted in to oversee the bid last autumn, and a price and specification was submitted to the Singaporeans in February. Sources close to the bid have been scathing about BAE Systems and UK MoD middle/senior management, who are said to have been inefficient, obstructive or unhelpful to the bid team, though dealings with industry in the other three partner nations have reportedly been trouble-free. Others criticised industry's commercial performance, and compared it with Dassault's "hunger". The French bid was made by one government and one contractor, working closely together with a real need for a sale, and willing to make some offers which a consortium of four nations/industries, with a huge Tranche 2 order book already in place, were unable or unwilling to make. After a week of frantic media speculation, Singapore's MINDEF confirmed that it had "narrowed down the selection for the next fighter replacement programme to Dassault's Rafale and Boeing's F-15" and that it had "decided not to consider the proposal from BAE Systems any further."It added that the Typhoon was a "very capable aircraft", but pointed out that "the committed schedule for the delivery of the Typhoon and its systems did not meet the requirements."Eurofighter GmbH has officially denied that there were any problems with the bid, and chief executive Aloysius Rauen praised BAE Systems, Rolls-Royce, the UK government, Procurement Minister Lord Bach, the RAF, and DESO for their "excellent support". There seems to be a new willingness in the consortium to offer greater flexibility, and to consider the early adoption of particular capabilities to meet the requirements of export customers, after the failed Singapore bid.BOXTEXT: 'It is believed that the decision had little, if anything, to do with the Typhoon's capability and planned capability per se, but was instead a natural reaction to what insiders called "a shambolic performance" by BAE Systems during the early part of the bidding process.'
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text:
Spanakopita With Tzaziki
40 minutes
[section]For the spanakopita:[/section]
1 (16 oz) package wonton wrappers
1 (8 oz) brick cream cheese
1/2 cup feta cheese
about 40 spinach leaves
1 small white onion
1 large garlic clove
olive oil
salt & pepper
[section]For the tzaziki[/section]
1 32 oz container greek yogurt
1 large cucumber, peeled
1 large garlic clove
2 tbsp lemon juice
salt & white pepper
How to make it
[section]for the spanakopita[/section]
Preheat oven to 400 degrees Fahrenheit. Line some baking sheets with aluminum foil or parchment paper, set aside.
Mix cream cheese and feta together in a bowl, set aside.
Heat olive oil in a saute pan. Finely chop onion and garlic, add to pan. Thinly slice spinach leaves, discarding stems, and add to pan. Cook until spinach begins to wilt & onions are translucent. Season with a bit of salt & freshly ground black pepper. Pour spinach and onions into bowl, & mix well with a spoon.
Lay out the wonton wrappers on a large cutting board, or any clean workspace, and brush edges with olive oil. Put a teaspoon of the cheese-spinach mixture in the middle of each wrapper, and fold once until opposite corners are touching; forming a triangle. Brush liberally with olive oil and arrange on baking sheets so that they are not touching. Bake for 15 minutes, or until golden brown.
[section]For the tzaziki[/section]
Pour yogurt into a large bowl.
Finely chop cucumber & garlic, mix into yogurt.
Add lemon juice, and season with salt & white pepper, to taste. Enjoy!
Print it!


text:
Meeting Minutes for November 18, 2003
Campus Master Plan
Committee Meeting
November 18, 2003
Present: Tom Meravi, Carl Holm, Jim Thams, Michael Truscott, Paul Duby, Leonard Heldreth, Gavin Leach
Absent: Daryl Delongchamp, Ken Chant, Steve DeGoosh, Scott Seaman, Ed Niemi
Guests: Kathy Richards
1. Minutes of October 21, 2003, approved as written.
2. Site Plan Review- Student Apartments
As part of Phase 200 site plan review, Carl Holm provided an overview of the proposed student apartments. The new apartments will be a one three-story facility with common corridors. An elevation was provided for review.
Current capacity as presented is 190. The unit facility will be constructed with basement for Mechanical systems only with heat being provided by gas-fired boilers.
Overall cost is currently $109 a square foot. Carl has been working with the Architect to try and reduce construction costs. Carl is trying reducing debt service and operating cost for the new apartments.
General discussion took place regarding the current design and possible ways to reduce construction costs. Suggestions included: Increasing lease periods from 8 to 12 months, simplifying the building layout and reducing common space.
3. Lot 28
Jim Thams provided an overview of the design changes being recommended by Engineering and Planning for Lot 28 to help reduce construction cost. The new design will reduce capacity, but still be able to meet the demand of the surrounding facilities. Estimated cost saving: $300,000.
Good of the Order:
Gavin Leach suggested the committee review ways to help reduce facility maintenance costs through design. The committee will review at the next meeting.
Next Meeting is scheduled for: December 16, 2003, at 1:00 p.m. in Conference Room 132 of the Services Building.
Minutes prepared by Engineering and Planning


text:
BPL Community Profile
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Ohm vs Mariposa plus?
I am thru hiking the AT and fell and broke my ankle ( fibula )last Thurs. I was near the 300 mile mark. I am home recuperating now and can't wait to heal and get back out there( has anyone had ...
Golite Wisp at Second Ascent
Great deal and great customer service. Just got one from them. I highly recommend. http://www.secondascent.com/s/index.php?target=products&product_id=30532
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WTB Ibex merino glove liner
WTB Ibex merino glove liner
Size large. Will consider Icebraeker also. This is my favorite glove and I recently lost one so now I am looking for a new pair. Most retailers only have small sizes.
The Travel Tap-Please help
Thanks but that one has to use chemicals also. The Travel Tap is a stand alone system.
The Travel Tap-Please help!
I currently use the Bota of Colardo system for filtering water. I can put up with the slow flow rate when I'n moving on the trail but when I get to my destination and try and squeeze out enough...
UL Montbell Jacket
My xl weighs just under 9oz. I like the idea of pockets. I could give up the tail for pockets.
UL Montbell Jacket"
Anybody who owns one care to comment? Thanks
UL Montbell Down Jacket
I have the 2006 or 2007 button down model with no pockets. It extends a couple of inches in the back. Do the new models have this back extension also? I have looked at all the pics and description ...
All Reader Reviews by Bill Reynolds
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text:
David Mitchell: Back StoryCD-Audio
List price $31.38
You save $13.76 43% off
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When will my order arrive?
Additional formats available
- Format
- Paperback $11.10
- Publisher: HarperCollins Publishers Ltd
- Format: CD-Audio
- Dimensions: 136mm x 140mm x 24mm | 222g
- Publication date: 11 October 2012
- Publication City/Country: London
- Edition: Unabridged
- Edition statement: Unabridged
- Illustrations note: (2x8pp plates)
- Sales rank: 141,926
Product description
David Mitchell, who you may know for his inappropriate anger on every TV panel show except Never Mind the Buzzcocks, his look of permanent discomfort on C4 sex comedy Peep Show, his online commenter-baiting in The Observer or just for wearing a stick-on moustache in That Mitchell and Webb Look, has written a book about his life. As well as giving a specific account of every single time he's scored some smack, this disgusting memoir also details: * the singular, pitbull-infested charm of the FRP ('Flat Roofed Pub') * the curious French habit of injecting everyone in the arse rather than the arm * why, by the time he got to Cambridge, he really, really needed a drink * the pain of being denied a childhood birthday party at McDonalds * the satisfaction of writing jokes about suicide * how doing quite a lot of walking around London helps with his sciatica * trying to pretend he isn't a total **** at Robert Webb's wedding * that he has fallen in love at LOT, but rarely done anything about it * why it would be worse to bump into Michael Palin than Hitler on holiday * that he's not David Mitchell the novelist. Despite what David Miliband might think
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'One of the best celebrity memoirs of last year...his outsider geek personality translates just as well on the page as it does on TV.' Metro 'It livened up about half way through with the appearance of me. But enough of David's life. The book is wonderful from beginning to end.' Robert Webb 'David Mitchell is an extremely funny man on screen, in person, in print and very probably underwater.' Sam Bain, co-writer of Peep Show 'He can write' Evening Standard 'Fluent, discursive, intelligent.' Evening Standard 'If you like Mitchell on television, you will like him in this book.' Shortlist


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Tag Results for "Lane"
Showing 145 Videos result(s) "Lane"
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Jinx Lennon at The Liverpool Irish Festival
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Stars turn out for launch of new Liverpool restaurant
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text:
Vocab Video of the Week:
Bulletin Board: WHAT'S NEW?
March 2nd, 2014
Long time, no see? I apologize for not being able to post more videos recently. My computer has apparently joined the stone-age and can no longer effectively manage the task of editing videos.
So, I'll be getting a new Macbook soon enough so I can hop right back on the horse.
In the meantime, I'll be adding more written content in the Writing category. Check out my method for teaching the writing process.
December 1st, 2013
We're back with a new video each week. I've got a lot of missed ground to make up for. But, I'm up to the task.
Enjoy BRAWNY for now.
October 15th, 2013
I'm adding an "About This Word" and a "Vocab Teaching Tip" for each video. New videos already have these (just go to the video's page). Old videos are being updated.
October 13th, 2013
I have remastered one of my first videos, SUPERCILIOUS, to include some root analysis. And, I've posted PARADOX.
Working on more goodness for next week already!
October 7th, 2013
I had technical problems. My Final Cut Pro X program isn't playing well with YouTube. And, to further complicate things, YouTube doesn't seem to be recognizing Fair Use.
I have found work-arounds for both obstacles. On to the next
September 29th, 2013
TingoEd is back in business. I'm sorry about the delayed absence. I won't make excuses. I'll just post more videos instead.
August 15th, 2013
I'm working on UNDULATE and some other videos. I'll get back to posting soon enough (and will make up for lost time). But, I have added an entire page to how I teach vocabulary on the top tool bar. Check it out.
July 22nd, 2013
Just posted ASCEND/DESCEND. Thinking about VEXATIOUS next. Added HOW TO ANNOTATE and a small unit outline for Dr. Jekyll & Mr. Hyde to my Curriculum section.
July 20th, 2013
Woah, I'm behind! I've been quite busy finishing up one contract, signing another, and visiting California this past week. I've add HOW TO ANNOTATE to my Curriculum section. I'm almost done with ASCEND/DESCEND. I swear!
July 10th, 2013
Having a rough week with finals grading. Will get ASCEND/DESCEND up on Thursday and another video on Monday. Thanks for the patience!Voc
July 1st, 2013
Goodbye Tumblr! It's been fun, but it's time to expand and graduate to a more professional platform. TingoEd has entered into Phase 2 of its development. Now, this site will feature even more free high-quality content.
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Ludmilla Butenko, World Bank Country Manager for Kazakhstan.
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Ms. Larisa Leshchenko is the World Bank Country Manager for Azerbaijan.
Job Title: Country Manager for Azerbaijan
Language: Russian, Ukrainian, Czech, English
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Alternate Executive Director for Cyprus, Israel, and the Netherlands.
Job Title: Alternate Executive Director: EDS19
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text:
Nutrition & You: Kaweah Delta Health Care District hosts
this free Nutrition & You Series from 12-12:30 p.m. on Wednesday, Jan. 15,
at Kaweah Delta Medical Center, 400 W. Mineral King Ave. Class meets in the
Acequia Wing Conference Room, just inside the lobby when entering on Acequia
Avenue. Topic: Weight Management Part 2. Speaker will be Alana Unger,
Registered Dietitian. Information: 624-3448.
Copyright © 2015 Kaweah Delta Health Care District. All rights reserved.
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use
Phone: (559) 624-2000


text:
Outfielder Nelson Cruz trying to get settled in Baltimore
Story | Apr 2, 2014 | 6:14 PM
Outfielder Nelson Cruz trying to get settled in Baltimore
Story | Apr 2, 2014 | 6:14 PM
Venezuelan pitcher Eduardo Rodriguez has potential to be big league starter one day
Story | Nov 12, 2012 | 4:00 AM
Some expectations for Halladay and the Phillies today
Story | Jul 23, 2012
Today's start could be very telling for Roy Halladay. While he pitched well in his last start (2 ER, 5.0 IP), which was his first since coming off the disabled list where he spent more then seven weeks with a...
Klentak leaves Orioles to become Angels assistant GM
Story | Nov 23, 2011 | 3:34 PM
New Orioles executive vice president Dan Duquette has been working this week to bolster his front office, and now, at least theoretically, he'll have another hole to fill. Matt Klentak, the club's 31-year-old director of baseball operations, accepted an...