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- 1 Untitled
- 2 Etruria
- 3 Recent additions
- 4 Ancient Romans to Commit Suicide
- 5 References
- 6 Peer Review for this page
- 7 How true
- 8 Bias?
- 9 No More Corrupt than any other?
- 10 Ooo big no no's here.
- 11 Hey I don't know who all those names are
- 12 This is who supposes to tell me what the facts of the Catilinarian Conspiracy are?
- 13 And this person?
- 14 " I am still in grade school, almost going into my first year of high school"
- 15 This user is pretty anti social...This user has numerous personal issues?????????
- 16 Does not exit?
- 17 Does not exist
- 18 None of these exist
- 19 User Durova
- 21 Furthermore
- 22 Moreover
- 23 The Truth of the Matter
- 24 "What actually happened"
- 25 Remove copyrighted material
- 26 This IP is an Internet Stalker
- 27 This IP is a stalker
- 28 Please CONCISELY explain the problem.
- 29 Apparent non-sequiturs
- 30 Civil war dates
- 31 What?
- 32 "... Rome had no penalty for libel"
- 33 Interesting aside
I don't know which webpage the intro came from, but it's probably copyrighted. The rest is doubtless public domain, but so far outdated and NPOV as to not be useful as an article. Text is below if anyone can use it. -- April
A vigorous account of the notorious conspiracy of Catiline in 63 B.C. to overthrow the civil power in Rome, Sallust's Catiline is one of the best histories in Latin literature. The narrative is vivid and consistent, and the sketches of character are admirable in their power and conciseness. Although the author obviously hated the democratic party with which Catiline was connected, and had no great admiration for Cato or Cicero, his work is wonderfully impartial. Sallust's conception of history, indeed, as is exemplified also in his Jugurthine War, was very modern. He attempts to bring before his readers not only the incidents of history, but also their causes; further, he invariably seeks to establish the connexion between events that a contemporary would have treated as isolated facts.
Begin long Sallustian Quote
I esteem the intellectual above the physical qualities of man; and the task of the historian has attracted me because it taxes the writer's abilities to the utmost. Personal ambition had at first drawn me into public life, but the political atmosphere, full of degradation and corruption, was so uncongenial that I resolved to retire and devote myself to the production of a series of historical studies, for which I felt myself to be the better fitted by my freedom from the influences which bias the political partisan. For the first of these studies I have selected the conspiracy of Catiline.
Lucius Catilina [commonly called Catiline] was of high birth, richly endowed both in mind and body, but of extreme depravity; with extraordinary powers of endurance, reckless, crafty and versatile, a master in the arts of deception, at once grasping and lavish, unbridled in his passions, ready of speech, but with little true insight. Of insatiable and inordinate ambitions, he was possessed, after Sulla's supremacy, with a craving to grasp the control of the state, utterly careless of the means so the end were attained. Naturally headstrong, he was urged forward by his want of money, the consciousness of his crimes and the degradation of morals in a society where luxury and greed ruled side by side.
The wildest, the most reckless, the most prodigal, the most criminal, were readily drawn into the circle of Catiline's associates; in such a circle those who were not already utterly depraved very soon became so under the minister and seductive influence of their leader. This man, who in the pursuit of his vices had done his own son to death, did not hesitate to encourage his pupils in every species of crime; and with such allies, and the aid of the disbanded Sullan soldiery swarming in Italy, he dreamt of subverting the Roman state while her armies, under Gnaeus Pompeius, were far away.
The first step was to secure his own election as consul. One plot of his had already failed, because Catiline himself had attempted to move prematurely; but the conspirators remained scatheless. Those who were now with Catiline included members of the oldest families and of equestrian rank. Crassus himself was suspected of complicity, owing to his rivalry with Pompeius. The assembled conspirators were addressed by had constitutional authority to grant. Thus, when news came that a Catilinarian, Gaius Manlius, had risen in Etruria at the head of an armed force, prompt administrative measures were taken to dispatch adequate military forces to various parts of the country. Catiline himself had taken no overt action; he now presented himself in the senate, was openly assailed by Cicero, responded with insults which were interrupted by cries of indignation, and flung from the house with the words, "Since I am beset by enemies and driven out, the fire you have kindled about me shall be crushed out by the ruin of yourselves."
Seeing that delay would be fatal, he started at once for the camp of Manlius, leaving Cethegus and Lentulus to keep up the ferment in Rome. To several persons of position he sent letters announcing that he was retiring to Marseilles; but, with misplaced confidence, he sent one of a different and extremely compromising tenor to Quintus Catullus, which the recipient read to the senate. It was next reported that he had assumed the consular attributes and joined Manlius; whereupon he was proclaimed a public enemy, a general levy was decreed, and Antonius was appointed to take the field, while Cicero was to remain in the capital.
Meanwhile, Lentulus at Rome, among his various plots, intrigued to obtain the support of the Allobroges, a tribe of Gauls from whom there was at the time an embassy in Rome. The envoys, however, took the advice of Quintus Fabius Sanga, and while he kept Cicero supplied with information, themselves pretended to be in full agreement with the conspirators.
Risings were now taking place all over Italy, though they were ill concerted. At Rome, the plan was that when Catiline's army was at Faesulae, the tribune Lucius Bestia should publicly accuse Cicero of having caused the war; and this was to be the signal for an organized massacre, while the city itself was to be fired at twelve points simultaneously. The insurgents were then to march out and join Catiline at Faesulae.
The Allobroges were now departing, carrying with them letters from Lentulus to Catiline; but, according to a concerted plan, they were arrested. This provided Cicero with evidence which warranted the arrest of Lentulus and other ringleaders in Rome; and its publication created a popular revulsion--the lower classes were not averse from plunder but saw no likelihood of benefit to themselves in a general conflagration of Rome.
A certain Lucius Tarquinius was now captured, who gave information tallying with what was already published, but further incriminated Crassus. Crassus, however, was so wealthy, and had so many of the senate in his power, that even those who privately believed the charge to be true, thought it politic to pronounce it a gross fabrication.
The danger of an attempted rescue of Lentulus brought on a debate as to what should be done with the prisoners. Caesar, from whatever motive, spoke forcibly against any unconstitutional action which, however justified by the enormity of the prisoners' guilt, might become a dangerous precedent. In his opinion, the wise course would be to confiscate their property and place their persons in custody, not in Rome but in provincial towns.
Caesar's humanitarian statesmanship was answered by the grave austerity of Cato. "The question for us is not that of punishing a crime, but of preserving the state--or of what the degenerate Roman of to-day cares for more than the state, our lives and property. To speak of clemency and compassion is an abuse of terms only too common, when vices are habitually dignified with the names of virtues. Let us for once act with vigour and decision, and doom these convicted traitors to the death they deserve." The decree of death was carried to immediate execution. In the meantime, Catiline had raised a force numbering two legions. He remained in the hills refusing to give battle to Antonius.
On hearing the fate of Lentulus and the rest, he attempted to retreat to Gaul, but this movement was anticipated and intercepted by Metellus Celer, who was posted at Picenum with three legions. With Antonius pressing on his rear, Catiline resolved to hazard all on a desperate engagement. In exhorting his troops, he dwelt on the fact that men fighting for life and liberty were more than a match for a foe who had infinitely less at stake.
Thus brought to bay, Catiline's soldiers met the attack of the government troops with furious valour, their leader setting a brilliant example of daring and generalship. But Petreius, on the other side, directed his force against the rebel centre, shattered it and took the wings in flank. Catiline's followers stood and fought till they fell, with their wounds in front; he himself hewed his way through the foe, and was found still breathing at a distance from his own ranks. No quarter was given or taken; and among the rebels there were no survivors. In the triumphant army, all the stoutest soldiers were slain or wounded; mourning and grief mingled with the elation of victory.
Exit Sallust
Deb writes: It's not clear if you are aware of this, April, but the above (apart from introduction)is a literal translation of parts of Sallust's work, "Catiline".
That's what we suspected. If it is properly introduced and indentified, and if the translation has passed into the public domain (translations hold copyrights independent of the text being translated), then it is a fine thing to include here, but mere data-dumping just confuses a reader more than enlightening him. --Lee Daniel Crocker
- I believe you, Deb - another one of these was from Caesar's Histories. They're great historical sources, don't get me wrong, but they're not, in their raw form, useful for an encyclopedia (in my opinion, and I haven't heard complaints from other Wikipedians yet!). There's a whole discussion on http://meta.wikipedia.com about "Project Sourceberg": whether we want to use Wikipedia to store everything from the works of Shakespeare to those of, well, Caesar or Sallust. The consensus was, "no." Basically, such things are already online thanks to Project Gutenberg - our efforts here, as I understand 'em, are to condense things down to a precis of available knowlege. -- April
I was actually on the liberal side of that discussion; I don't see any reason not to include whole works here, but only if they are here to illustrate real articles, and are properly identified, introduced, and not confused for articles themselves. Perhaps we might need some better conventions for handling such things: a naming convention, or a page background color, or something. --Lee Daniel Crocker
My opinion is that this is an encyclopedia -- which means it's supposed to give a good overview of things. To quote Sallust in context is fine, as to discuss his view, but Encyclopedia are by nature secondary sources. There are enough examples of contributors on the site who don't know how to read ancient sources, primary or secondary, critically -- I don't think that it's in the best service of the goals of an encyclopedia to provide such information without a critical overview. My opinion, but based on professional experience as somebody who teaches the stuff to the average Joe. JHK
- I stumbled across a mention of Catilina in a story about the Federalists and Republicans at the dawn of the United States. Specifically, about the use of Catiline as an epithet bandied about by pretty much everyone to tar opponents as people willing to betray the ideals of the new nation in favor of political or monetary gain. A lot of people, myself included, come to Wikipedia for more depth and understanding than this article provides. The article as it exists here seems almost a stub, describing skeletal outlines of the person's life but imparting no real understanding of his context, motives, objectives and pressure on history (something that, apparently, was both common knowledge and an important metaphor in the late 18th C). On the other hand, the monolithic Sallust quote doesn't help me much either, since it is infused with assumptions and common knowledge that existed around 30 BCE, and apparently alluding to much more than is actually said. I would like to see someone with the knowledge on the subject (like most of the folks contributing to this talk page) expand and give some life to this bloke. An "His Significance" section, ala Sallust, might be a good start, especially since the current political clime in several Western nations might warrant a resurgence of the Catiline epithet... Kevin/Last1in 14:09, 13 July 2005 (UTC)
Recent uncited, anonymous addition: "He fled to Etruria." Just a heads-up for anyone who may be "half monitoring" this, because I do not know enough to know whether this is a useful addition of vandalism. -- Jmabel | Talk 20:02, Mar 4, 2005 (UTC)
- I don't know where it comes from, but I think that he left for his place of exile, and made a "side trip" to Etruria.--Agreatguy6 23:35, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
- It is in fact from Sallust's Bellum Catilinae. Yes, it is legit.--Agreatguy6 00:51, 12 October 2006 (UTC)
Recent additions[edit]
The recent additions look mostly solid. I did a light edit and fixed a few small issues. There are a couple of passages I found very confusing; I've marked them in the text with HTML comments. I don't know enough about Cataline to resolve these myself.-- Jmabel | Talk 01:58, 7 January 2006 (UTC)
- I tried to revise some of the passages. If it still isn't clear, I can work a little more on it. As for the dates, to me it sounded like all dates should be linked. "Linking dates may not seem useful; however, please link dates since it enables the use of a user preference in how dates are displayed." Cmcentee 20:37, 7 January 2006 (UTC)
- That only applies for month+day and any accompanying year. For example, [[7 February]] [[2001]] can display as 7 February 2001 or February 7, 2001 depending on user preferences; there are probably some other choices for the display, I don't know offhand. -- Jmabel | Talk 19:28, 8 January 2006 (UTC)
- I don't know if this matters, but in both the Cicero and Sulla entries all of the dates are linked. Is it just style then? Maybe in the furure there will be an option in preferences for selecting either BC and AD or BCE and CE. Cmcentee 22:41, 8 January 2006 (UTC)
- Yeah, there are people who do this, but it's really pretty clear in the MoS that they shouldn't. I don't know whether it comes from misunderstanding the month+day thing, or what. People have talked about automating the BC/BCE and AD/CE thing, but it seems awfully silly to me. -- Jmabel | Talk 07:34, 9 January 2006 (UTC)
- I don't know if this matters, but in both the Cicero and Sulla entries all of the dates are linked. Is it just style then? Maybe in the furure there will be an option in preferences for selecting either BC and AD or BCE and CE. Cmcentee 22:41, 8 January 2006 (UTC)
- That only applies for month+day and any accompanying year. For example, [[7 February]] [[2001]] can display as 7 February 2001 or February 7, 2001 depending on user preferences; there are probably some other choices for the display, I don't know offhand. -- Jmabel | Talk 19:28, 8 January 2006 (UTC)
Ancient Romans to Commit Suicide[edit]
I don't think that it can be claimed that Catiline committed suicide. He died in battle. He did not die by his own sword like some other Roman generals such as Cassius. Cmcentee 18:56, 12 March 2006 (UTC)
There are many forms of suicide. Upon realising the gravity of the situation, Catiline is said to have dismounted and fought in the thickest of combat. Sallust mentions he died bravely, his wounds all in front, and Appian says "Neither Catiline nor any of the nobility who were associated with him deigned to fly, but all flung themselves upon their enemies and perished." TheOldOligarch 02:27, 28 April 2006 (UTC)
To editors of this article: please use footnotes to show where and from whence facts from this article came from listed references. 184.108.40.206
188.8.131.52 23:22, 4 November 2007 (UTC)==Non-working Footnote== Hullo! Footnote 6 doesn't work. Ohmie.
Peer Review for this page[edit]
Do not revert. Don't play tyrant with license to publish this has been revoked.
How true[edit]
Yes I think its true too. Catiline was a follower of Sulla and that man Catiline was after all a rapist. The author of this article has not done well. The assertion that Catiline was trying to be like the Gracchi is categorically false. He's showing pretense under the rubric of the word "reformer," reformer according to who? If heading the republic back in the direction of Sulla's dictatorship is reform? Or the dictatorship of Marc Antony was reform? I say not. Besides there's way too much evidence from very credible sources that Catiline did these things, so it really does come down to what someone thinks is moral and what they think is immoral.
I don't think the author of this wiki knows what he's talking about or just has bad motives. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.127.116.11 (talk) 21:53, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
Do not revert. Don't play tyrant with me your license to publish this has been revoked. Your POV genius has been saved below.
- Nope, sorry, but the language IS POV; 'if not for his crimes then for his undemocratic spirit' implies that everything these historians said was true; 'possessed numerous reasons' implies that those reasons were true (and not, for instance, power-plays and maniulations on the part of Cicero and the Optimates, which there's at least the possibility they might have been); this idea that Catiline believed the leadership of the state should be hereditary is unsourced and, so far as I'm aware, patent nonsense; the phrase 'Catiline's base morality and his political corruption' is laughably POV; as is calling him a 'notorious criminal'. Assuming good faith (ha ha) I'll simply choose to believe you're unfamilliar with the policies of Wikipedia, and not just a fanatical troll.
- I don't paticularly want to continue debating matters of history with you, but your comments in that final paragraph are unacceptable in Wikipedia, and your opinion as to my username is irrelevant and should be kept to yourself. Also, I have nothing to do with the original text; I was simply browsing, came upon this POV rot you are apparently responsible for and then reverted it, as any good Wikipedian should. Lordrosemount 11:55, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
No More Corrupt than any other?[edit]
"Thus, some view Catiline as a reformer such as the Gracchi who met similar resistance from the government. However, many place him somewhere in between, a man who used the plight of the poor to suit his personal interests and a politician of the time no more corrupt than any other."
Oh come on. Like Cicero married his daughter? Like Catiline wrote a brilliant monograph for which he was later called florentissimus auctor? And naturally after he was killed he was no doubt aclaimed "Father of his country"? Good gods! O tempora o mores!184.108.40.206 23:56, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
- The idea that Catilina married his daughter is a baseless assertion; the paternity of that girl is impossible to prove either way. You can cite a source for the fact that it was claimed she was, no doubt, but there's no possible way to prove whether it was true or not. Lordrosemount 11:58, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
Ooo big no no's here.[edit]
Someone who doesn't read Latin annotating to to Latin texts? There's no doubt that an annotation is there, but this is not what Sallust said. Not good. Indeed very very deceptive. If he could read Latin he never would have needed to plagerize the other guy's translations in the beginning. Very tricky.126.96.36.199 20:35, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
Hey I don't know who all those names are[edit]
But you are introducing a number of original content here. That Catiline was a criminal is the NPOV. It the one that was established long ago. Don't go around accusing someone of being this or that when you don't know who they are.126.96.36.199 22:52, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
rv unexplained reversion by Edward H. Campbell (aka: Inopibus, almasakin, majdur travail, Ted Campbell). Suggest protecting this page from anon edits.) (undo) Who? are all these people? How do you claim to know all this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.8.131.52 (talk) 22:53, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
This is who supposes to tell me what the facts of the Catilinarian Conspiracy are?[edit]
User:Patar knight From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia • Ten things you may not know about Wikipedia •Jump to: navigation, search This is a Wikipedia user page. This is not an encyclopedia article. If you find this page on any site other than Wikipedia, you are viewing a mirror site. Be aware that the page may be outdated and that the user to whom this page belongs may have no personal affiliation with any site other than Wikipedia itself. The original page is located at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Patar_knight.
My Userboxes 1,000+ This user has made over 1,000 contributions to Wikipedia.
This user is a fencer. This user comes from Canada. This user enjoys playing chess. This user is a Go player.
♦♦ This user is a better skier or snowboarder than you are.
This user is a member of the
Military history WikiProject.
This user supports the Canadian Armed Forces. This user is part of the Geography Wikiproject This user is a member of Wikiproject Fencing. En Garde! This user is a member of WikiProject Halo.
I am a Wikipedia user, who resides in Canada. I am of chinese descent and heritage, although I was born in Canada. I am still in grade school, almost going into my first year of high school, and has been recognized as "gifted" by the Ministry of Education of Ontario. In school, I excel at history and geography. In fact, for the school year of 2006-2007, I have done very well in the 13th (is it?) annual Great Canadian Geography Challenge. Under the guise of Patar_knight, I have contributed mainly to historical articles (war, battles, weapons, etc.), fencing articles, and geographical articles. My starsign is Scorpio. I enjoy playing sports, such as fencing, soccer, tennis. Of course, I also enjoy browsing and contributing to Wikipedia, which I think is a good place to get general knowledge from. I also enjoy browsing Uncyclopedia, which I find mildly humourous (of course when it's in good taste), and have an account there, which is also called Patar_knight, although it is not particulary active.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ I serious doubt you credentials —Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.8.131.52 (talk) 23:05, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
And this person?[edit]
User:Lordrosemount From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia • Find out more about navigating Wikipedia and finding information •Jump to: navigation, search
This user studies or has studied at the University of St Andrews
It would appear that I don't have a user page yet. Well, here we are - I suppose I'll have to put something more inspiring than this down sooner or later, but it's a start...
Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Lordrosemount" Category: Wikipedians by alma mater: University of St Andrews
Excuse me your royal highness, but you better get cracking on some books before you get flipent. You're not qualifed either. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.8.131.52 (talk) 23:07, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
- What the Devil do you mean by posting users' info pages on a talk page, as though they had any relevance whatsoever to anything, and appending your abusive comments at the end? This behaviour is completely unacceptable, and your comments about the qualifications of myself and others are not only ignorant, but they demonstrate a complete lack of understanding of the rules of Wikipedia (never mind common decency) that show you to be unqualified to make any useful contribution here at all. Lordrosemount 12:02, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
" I am still in grade school, almost going into my first year of high school"[edit]
Take your F kid, and like it.184.108.40.206 23:13, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
What, you don't understand my sentence? It's perfectly grammatically correct... And an "F" for this article? If you really want to improve it, add your information, but with no POV. Calling Catiline "infamous" is blatant POV. There are two sides to every story, and of course, one is usually more correct. However, this is an encyclopedia, and must be neutral. Even the Wikipedia Article on Adolf Hitler, Bonnie and Clyde, and Joseph Stalin do not contain the word "infamous" even once. Also, you list several references to sources that only the most educated scholars of Classic Antiquity would know, which are consequently meaningless to the layman. You should also read WP:No Personal Attacks and WP:3RR, as you are very close to violating both of them. --Patar knight 22:14, 31 October 2007 (UTC)
User:DeadEyeArrow From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia • Ten things you may not know about Wikipedia •Jump to: navigation, search DeadEyeArrowOh snap! It's the DEA!Main Talk Awards Archives Email
[edit] About this user This user is 21 and lives in Key Largo, Florida. This user is pretty anti social, but not because he wants to be. This user has numerous personal issues, none of which he is being medicated for but he probably should be.
"User has no idea what he is talking about." Did you forget something in your bio?184.108.40.206 23:26, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
Does not exit?[edit]
User:Inopibus From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia • Have questions? Find out how to ask questions and get answers. •Jump to: navigation, search Wikipedia does not have a user page with this exact name. In general, this page should be created and edited by User:Inopibus. If in doubt, please verify that "Inopibus" exists.
Start the User:Inopibus page Search for "Inopibus" in existing pages. Look for pages within Wikipedia that link to this title. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 18.104.22.168 (talk) 23:28, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
Does not exist[edit]
User:Almasakin From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia • Learn more about citing Wikipedia •Jump to: navigation, search Wikipedia does not have a user page with this exact name. In general, this page should be created and edited by User:Almasakin. If in doubt, please verify that "Almasakin" exists. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 22.214.171.124 (talk) 23:30, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
None of these exist[edit]
User:Campbell From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia • Ten things you may not know about images on Wikipedia •Jump to: navigation, search Wikipedia does not have a user page with this exact name. In general, this page should be created and edited by User:Campbell. If in doubt, please verify that "Campbell" exists. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.108.40.206 (talk) 23:32, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
User Durova[edit]
"although my limited background on the subject restricts my ability to comment"
I've noticed18.104.22.168 23:39, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
- I'm sorry if people have been giving out your personal information, but it had nothing to do with either myself or, for all I know, the other user you started talking about, but my objectiion wasn't to the fact that you'd posted the contents of my user page, but that doing so was irrelevant, and your idea that what someone has in their user page in some way indicates their credibility on any given position is pretty absurd.
- You're also mistaken on your ideas of who needs to prove what. Yes, I agree that if all the credible, unbiased sources were agreed about the character of a person - as in the case of, say, a Hitler - then to try and come up with some radical new theory claiming that they were a hero would be pretty silly, and ought not to be included. But the fact is that the ancient sources about Catiline were all written by people who had grudges against him, and you can't be much of an historian if you don't recognise that this calls their writings on the matter into question. Moreover, the idea that Catiline may have been unfairly aligned is neither particularly radical nor particularly new; a great many quite distinguished historians have taken this view. So in a situation like this, where a legitimate debate exists, surely the role of an encyclopaedia is to report what the sources say and note any factors that may have influenced them - to show what we know to be a fact, which is that a debate exists about the man. I don't need to prove he was innocent of his accusations any more than you need to prove he was guilty, because short of the invention of time travel there no way we can really know what was in the hearts of Cicero and Catiline when they said and wrote what they did. That's the point of the NPOV.
- This, by the way, is an interesting discussion that I'm enjoying having with you; I hope you'll appreciate that it's far better to be level-headed and good-natured, than to start slandering someone just because you happen not to agree with somebody about something. Lordrosemount 20:43, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
Do not revert. Don't play tyrant with license to publish this has been revoked. Billiance has indeed been saved below.
- Someone who really believed that Catiline was innocent/misrepresented might well, yes. But as I've asserted no position on whether he was or not - but, again, simply repeated that a debate exists that it's silly not to acknowledge - this once again has nothing to do with me. Your second argument is unsound, too, because what people 'honestly believe' is only based on what they actually know. It's entirely possible that a person could be thought by almost everyone else in the world to be guilty of some crime, and yet not be, so what people happen to think on the matter really has nothing to do with what actually happened. Lordrosemount 20:49, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
- That Catilina attacked Cicero for being a 'new man' might show that he was a bit of a snob - which hardly distinguishes him from any other patrician of the era - but it certainly doesn't show that he believed in rule by heredity. There were a great many patricians, and even those who believed that rule should be restricted to the patrician class still couldn't be described as believing in hereditary rule. To cite the example of mediaeval Scotland, rule there before the time of Malcolm Canmore was by the system of tannistry, where kings were selected from alternating lines of the royal family, by means of a kind of electoral college. This was rule by the elite, but, unlike primogeniture, it wasn't rule by heredity.
- Also, if you believe Catilina was indisputably guilty of consorting with Fabia (that he raped her is a further extrapolation), how do you explain that they were both acquitted for it? Lordrosemount 20:56, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
Do not revert. Don't play tyrant with me license to publish this has been revoked. Your glorious writing is below.
- I haven't said any of the sources were lies; I said they were biased, which is a fact. It's also possible that Cicero may have been mistaken about Catilina's actions too. The fact is, we don't know - but we know what Cicero, Sallust and all the others said, so that's what we ought to let Wikipedia reflect. We have plenty of historical sources about things that aren't true; the existance of Hybrasil or a north-west passage, for example - but they were yet false. How did they know the woman Catilina married was his daughter - did they give him a paternity test, or something? Her mother had never been his wife, and she'd never grown up with him, so it's hardly what you'd call an open-and-shut case. I like and respect Cicero a great deal, but blimey, not everything that ever came out of his mouth was true, you know. Lordrosemount 21:04, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
The Truth of the Matter[edit]
- No more speculation: How do do KNOW that what Cicero says is not true? Lord Rosemont has says above you haven't said they're lies, and then you say they are not true: you would not lie to us, would you, gallant Lord Rosemont? Are you implying that he lies in his collection of over 800 letters, comprising nearly all of what we know about Republican Rome? That he wasn't the most published philosopher of his age? That his speeches, numbering around 25, aren't the only extant speeches from the period, and that he isn't the ONLY primary source on the Cataline Conspiracy, unlike Sallust, who is from the imperial period,several hundred years after the fact. Isn't it rather Sallust who has a motivation to rewrite history, for the sake of it's winner: perhaps for Caesar, a populari (some argue, the dictator party) like Cataline? And can we not also conclude that they would want Cicero, who was so representative of the republica, to be unpopular? On the other hand, what reason would Cicero have to lie? Power-hungry? Well, Cicero was already the consul by 63, so not to gain the consulship. Nor did he, like Casesar, take up the dictatorship, and refuse to put it down, as a power-hungry man would do. No, like a Cincinnatus, he took the reigns of the dictatorship long enough to put down the threat, and then when Cataline and his army which threatened Rome had been dealt with, put the reigns down again. Moreover, before 63, when he still had the consulship to gain, in fact, it was Cataline who was clearly going to lose the consulship, when he acted. Likewise, Therefore, if Cicero did not lie about the situation to gain political power, what reason could we assume as a politician Cicero had to lie? His personal contribution to the history republic is unparalleled, including trying to preserve it after it had fallen in a book by the the same name, and so despite the great debt we owe him, continues to ignore his contribution to the history of civilization. It is logical to consider, Lord Rosemont, that there may be more truth about history to what Cicero is saying than you think. What did Cataline ever do for you? There's enough budding classicists out there in high school, like young Sir Patar, who believe that "there are two sides to every story" is an epistemological argument for the truth, and not that the truth was the fact that Cataline maybe was doing something wrong because he was an entitled aristocrat who thought that the consulship was his due. What did Cataline ever do for you? To respond to you from a standpoint of rhetoric, as this seems to be your main concern, and as Cicero is a rhetorician and does reserves the right to disseminate if not outright lie, his true meaning was all too transparent in the Cataline Orations, something which he was sure to correct in later speeches. Those things you mention as lies are parts of vituperation. He also does it where you complain here: "Also, if you believe Catilina was indisputably guilty of consorting with Fabia (that he raped her is a further extrapolation), how do you explain that they were both acquitted for it? Lordrosemount 20:56, 1 November 2007 (UTC)" And here: "The idea that Catilina married his daughter is a baseless assertion; the paternity of that girl is impossible to prove either way. You can cite a source for the fact that it was claimed she was, no doubt, but there's no possible way to prove whether it was true or not. Lordrosemount 11:58, 1 November 2007 (UTC)." Just because you're not familiar with this type of invective attack, or discerning where Cicero is telling the truth, using a rhetorical technique, or illustrating symbolically and allegoricaly, it means you should apply yourself to the study of the art of rhetoric, and there is no better way than imitation, and I cannot think of a finer example (nor can anyone) than Cicero. You'll find the harder you look for his view, the more you'll find he espouses the views of philosophy, and that there's something he desparately wants to tell us about history. I hope in the intervening years you've both had the opportunity, as I have, to study these topics deeply in higher education and hopefully, learning the truth of the matter. However, Wikipedia is not the place for amateur classical historians in high school and middle school to present their views. Therefore, comments such as "In all likelihood, Catiline was not involved in the so-called First Catilinian Conspiracy, although several historical sources implicate him in it. There does not seem to be a single account that is represented in all of the sources: rather, it seems that the accounts represent a collection of rumors accusing different political figures in attempts to tarnish their names," DO need to be cited, or that author needs to re-examine their sources (Sallust is a SECONDARY source). Quotes like "It is unlikely that Catiline would have been involved in the First Catilinian Conspiracy or if, indeed, it even existed at all," MUST be cited, as that is conjecture, along with the same statement, " Cicero's accusations prior to 63 BC are likely unfounded." [[[User :simulosopher|simulosopher]] 20:38, 6 July 2011 (UTC)
"What actually happened"[edit]
Do not revert. Don't play tyrant with license to publish this has been revoked.
Remove copyrighted material[edit]
You are not legitimate to edit my threads. Permission to publish my writing has been revoked. If you're trying to save something for a lawsuit save it off line.
Inopibus 18:53, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
This IP is an Internet Stalker[edit]
Stop harassing me or I will contact the FBI.Inopibus 23:18, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
- Please do not make legal threats against other editors. See WP:Legal. Exxolon 23:49, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
Is this individual an editor?Inopibus 23:53, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
Your license to publish my writing has been revokedInopibus 23:55, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
This IP is a stalker[edit]
(deleted Image:Stalker.2.4nov07.jpg as not helping and not necessary)
Inopibus 23:50, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
Is giving out personal information against wikipedia Privacy Policy —Preceding unsigned comment added by Inopibus (talk • contribs) 23:51, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
- Yes - see Wikipedia:Privacy. Please go to the WP:ANI thread to clarify exactly what is going on here. Exxolon 00:11, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
Please CONCISELY explain the problem.[edit]
Could all people involved here please explain what is going on CONCISELY and avoiding personal attacks on other editors? Matthew Brown (Morven) (T:C) 01:36, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
Yes, that's enough of this silliness. Now, I want you, Inopibus to clearly explain why you have been removing material from this talk page. I would also like everyone to calm down, and clearly lay out what's going on here like Morven asks. You claim that this IP address is "outing" you; but you have repeatedly claimed to be this person on this very talk page. Please explain the situation clearly and calmly so I can work out what to do about it. --Haemo 01:37, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
Apparent non-sequiturs[edit]
Well, anyone reading this page as it stands right now would probably assume I'm some kind of schitzophrenic; equally unfortunately, however, we had one or more users here exhibiting trollish tendencies, and my comments above that appear to lack context were responses to various activities of this user, which included 3RR violations, POV editing and, which has been preserved, some attempt to discredit the people who were reverting him/her by posting the contents of our user pages and making derogatory comments about us which, I confess, made me a little annoyed. Yet now I check back here out of nostalgia only to discover that this user's comments have all vanished (along with some of my own responses, as it happens); anyone who's particularly interested can probably find the intervening mess through the page history.
Just wanted to fill any new browsers in on the background. Have a good night! Lordrosemount (talk) 02:04, 7 December 2007 (UTC)
Civil war dates[edit]
The civil war dates "84 BC–81 BC" don't seem to link up nicely with dates given for the civil wars. JMK (talk) 09:00, 27 July 2009 (UTC)
What are you all arguing about? It is too hard to tell since you all edit each others comments to the point where they no longer make sense. 220.127.116.11 (talk) 00:16, 12 November 2010 (UTC)
"... Rome had no penalty for libel"[edit]
This quote is from the section on the First Catilinian Conspiracy. IANAL but as I understand it this is not libel but slander as the Cicero's accusations would have been spoken in court Defamation. The Twelve Tables in table 8 says that anyone committing slander shall be clubbed to death The 12 Tables The Latin Library - The Law of the 12 Tables. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 18.104.22.168 (talk) 17:34, 24 November 2010 (UTC)
- Defamatory or not, wasn't there at least some measure of immunity for utterances in the Senate? — J M Rice (talk) 20:47, 12 June 2011 (UTC)
Interesting aside[edit]
The quote from Florus — "Catiline was found far away from his own soldiers among the corpses of his enemies. It would have been a glorious death if he had thus fallen fighting for his country" — reminds me of what American historians say about Benedict Arnold. Had he fallen at Saratoga, he would have been in the pantheon of American heroes. J M Rice (talk) 20:03, 12 June 2011 (UTC)
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Selling Sex: The Media, Fantasy, and How I Fell in Love with Britney Spears
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Behind the Music
26 Mar 2007 // 5:59 PM
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U2: Songs of Innocence
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Is Bono Just a Little Too Cozy with the Powerful People? 'The Frontman: Bono'
30 Jul 2013 // 11:05 PM
Without denying the practical good achieved by some of his projects, Harry Browne, a Dublin-based "activist and journalist", criticizes Bono's cozy neo-liberal, market-funded loyalties.
Counterbalance No. 82: U2's 'Achtung Baby'
18 May 2012 // 1:00 AM
Did U2's 1991 blockbuster disappoint you? Or leave a bad taste in your mouth? Either way, it's still the 82nd Most Acclaimed Album of All Time. Counterbalance has a listen.
10 Songs That Will Make You Love U2
26 Jan 2012 // 12:00 AM
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I attended all five shows of U2's Chicago residency -- nearly 12 hours of Bono & Co. in the flesh -- that ended Thursday night at the United Center.
U2 Aims for Intimacy, Presence on Latest Tour
26 May 2015 // 7:30 AM
"We build our songs so they don't get worn out quickly," the Edge said, "and often, that means that they take a little longer to connect."

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So in our quest to view as many "popcorn" movies as possible this summer, we rented The Fast and the Furious. I have to admit it was so bad it was good. Paul Walker is the new Keanu Reeves with his monotone line delivery of "Hey man he was in my face" and pretty much anything coming out of anyones mouth in this movie is unintentionally hilarious. Some choice examples:"What is this guy, sandwich crazy?""Time? You want Time, go get the magazine!""Ted...Kiss my shoes?""What's he planning on racing with, hopes and dreams?""You're lucky that hundred shot of NOS didn't blow the welds on your intake""You never had me. You never had your car" "TORETTO! TORETTO! SWAT came into my house, disrespected my whole family because somebody narc'd me out! And you know what? IT WAS YOU!"Greeter at the top secret event Race Wars: "Hello and welcome to Race Wars"Or how about operating a laptop while driving 120 mph on a surface street?!Truly, a classic. Off topic anecdote: A few years back, Andrew and I were at the drive-in, and told the cashier we wanted to see the movie "Cars". He took our money, and told us which lot to park in etc. A few minutes into the film, we realized we were watching "The Fast and the Furious: Tokyo Drift". True story.
I have to admit this looks good to me, despite the Nic Cage like wig. Although I'm baffled as to why its being released in the fall. Who are they kidding? It looks like popcorn fare to me.


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April 26 2011, 05:12 AM
Cutter John
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Re: Minecraft
I liked to tell myself that the wolves were running around and frolicking while I was sleeping, or off adventuring.
Just like I tell myself that since they're in a rainforest next to a desert, I'm doing all those sheep a favor by taking their wool.
"The way I see it, every life is a pile of good things and bad things. The good things don't always soften the bad things. But vice versa, the bad things don't necessarily spoil the good things or make them unimportant."
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Recent and Upcoming Assessment Hearings
Public Hearing Dates, Assessment Rolls, and Assessment Maps
State statutes allow the City of Raleigh to pass a portion of the cost of street, sidewalk and utility improvements to abutting property owners in the form of a special assessment.
Property owners are notified of the City's intent to assess their property and given the opportunity to speak at a public hearing before an assessment is adopted by the City Council.
Once an assessment has been adopted, it becomes a lien against the property.
Upcoming Hearings to Authorize Assessment Projects
Before construction begins on an assessable project, abutting property owners are notified of the City's intent to assess their property for an upcoming improvement project. At that time, a public hearing is scheduled to allow the City Council to receive public input before authorizing the project to proceed.
Once a project is authorized, property owners are notified of Council's decision and the affected properties are entered into the City's assessment database.
The projects listed below have been scheduled for a public hearing to authorize assessments or referred for further consideration.
No upcoming hearings at this time.
Upcoming Hearings to Confirm Assessment Rolls
Once an assessable project has been completed and the assessment amounts calculated, a public hearing is scheduled to allow the City Council to receive public comments regarding the project.
After the hearing, the Council may confirm the assessment charges or refer the assessment roll to a committee or to administration for further consideration.
The projects listed below have been scheduled for a public hearing to confirm assessments or referred for further consideration.
No upcoming hearings at this time.
Recently Confirmed Assessment Rolls
Assessment fees for the projects listed below were confirmed at recent City Council meetings. If an assessed property is inside of the city limits, assessment notices are usually sent within a month of the confirmation date. Annual installment notices are sent each August, and annual installments are due by September 1.
June 2, 2015
Paving & Sidewalk Assessment Rolls 938, 938A, 418 &
418A – Perry Creek Road
Installation of curbs, gutters, drains, and paving 65' back-to-back from Capital Boulevard to Louisburg Road for approximately 1.6 miles with sidewalks on both sides. Assessments for street improvements and sidewalk to apply.
Assessment Roll 938 & 938A / Perry Creek Road Assessment Map
Assessment Roll 418 & 418A / Perry Creek Road Assessment Map
Paving Assessment Roll 939 – Juniper Court
construction of a 22 foot wide strip pavement street (no curb/gutter) on a variable 40 foot minimum right-of-way for approximately 270 linear feet.
Assessment Roll 939 / Juniper Court Assessment Map
November 5, 2014
Paving Assessment Roll 936 - Norman Estates Way
Installation of curbs, gutters, drains, asphalt repair, milling and resurfacing 26 back-to-back approximately 602 linear feet per special agreement to allow the City to accept street for continuous maintenance.
Assessment Roll 936 / Norman Estates Way Assessment Map
Paving Assessment roll 937 - Greyson Street
Installation of curbs, gutters drains, and paving 26 back-to-back approximately 620 linear feet with sidewalk on South side. Assessments for curb and gutter only.
Assessment Roll 937 / Greyson Street Assessment Map
October 7, 2014
Resurfacing Assessment Roll 935 - S Wilmington Street
Repair and resurfacing improvements on South Wilmington Street from Chapanoke Road to Tryon Road, approximately 1,698 feet with 100% of the cost of construction assessed to the abutting properties.
Assessment Roll 935 / S Wilmington St Assessment Map
March 4, 2014
Paving Assessment Roll 934 - Alleghany Drive
Installation of approximately 1,646 linear feet of curbs, gutters, drains and paving, of a 27' back-to-back street, from Alamance Drive to Yadkin Drive and 1/2 27' back-to-back street from Yadkin Drive eastward along the property at 3515 Alleghany Drive.
Assessment Roll 934 / Alleghany Drive Assessment Map
Sewer Assessment Roll 1351 - Creedmoor Road
Installation of 143 linear feet of 8 inch sanitary sewer main through an easement to serve the property located at 8116 Creedmoor Road.
Assessment Roll 1351 / Creedmoor Road Assessment Map


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Diet Coke and Rebecca Minkoff Launch Design Contest
Whether it's reworking a vintage piece, integrating the new "it" color or searching for the perfect pair of leather skinnies, style mavens everywhere are gearing up for the fall fashion season. And to help fashionistas stay extraordinary all season long, Diet Coke will launch a new, limited-edition T-shirt available exclusively in Target stores.
The new T-shirt is the winning design from the second season of the Diet Coke Young Designer Challenge. Part of the brand's iconic "Stay Extraordinary" platform, the challenge asked creative individuals to create an original T-shirt design inspired by the extraordinary style of Taylor Swift and the people who enjoy Diet Coke every day. Hundreds of designs poured in from across the country from eager, aspiring designers looking for the ultimate career boost - to see their design on Target store shelves.
"Diet Coke is more than just the great-tasting smart boost staple in the lives of fashionistas. It's the ultimate accessory," said Caroline Kibler, senior brand manager for Diet Coke. "The brand is synonymous with style, and fashion-focused programs like the Young Designer Challenge put the extraordinary talents of our fans in the spotlight."
A public vote on social media in June narrowed submissions down to 10 finalists, and a fashionable judging panel, led by acclaimed designer Rebecca Minkoff, selected the winning design. The panel selected a creation from Brooklyn-based Julianna Bass as the grand-prize winner of the Young Designer Challenge. A rising star in the fashion world with experience working for several top designers, Bass edged out the competition with a glamorous sketch of a self-assured woman in a dramatically flaring red skirt leaning on a Diet Coke logo.
In addition to being the judging panel's favorite, Bass's design also won the popular vote online. Of the more than 135,000 votes submitted during the public voting phase, Bass's design stood out as the clear frontrunner from the beginning.
"The new Diet Coke T-shirt is a refreshing take on the classic white tee," said Rebecca Minkoff, designer and Diet Coke Young Designer Challenge season-two judge. "Julianna's design perfectly captures the energy and boost that Diet Coke provides."
Bass will receive an extraordinary portfolio boost as the winner of the Diet Coke Young Designer Challenge. In addition to having her design sold in the beverage aisle in all U.S. Target stores beginning Sept. 1, she receives a $10,000 cash prize to pursue creative endeavors and a fly-away trip to meet Swift at one of her final U.S. RED Tour stops in Nashville, Tenn., next month.
The celebration of extraordinary style continues in New York City throughout September, when Diet Coke will sponsor multiple events to bring extraordinary taste to fans in the fashion capital of the country. Diet Coke fans also can win a new fall wardrobe simply by showing how they would style the winning T-shirt design in a Pinterest contest launching August 27. Contest rules and restrictions available at http://CokeURL.com/dv4m.
About The Coca-Cola Company
The Coca-Cola Company (NYSE: KO) is the world's largest beverage company, refreshing consumers with more than 500 sparkling and still brands. Led by Coca-Cola, the world's most valuable brand, our Company's portfolio features 16 billion-dollar brands including Diet Coke, Fanta, Sprite, Coca-Cola Zero, vitaminwater, Powerade, Minute Maid, Simply, Georgia and Del Valle. Globally, we are the No. 1 provider of sparkling beverages, ready-to-drink coffees, and juices and juice drinks. Through the world's largest beverage distribution system, consumers in more than 200 countries enjoy our beverages at a rate of more than 1.8 billion servings a day. With an enduring commitment to building sustainable communities, our Company is focused on initiatives that reduce our environmental footprint, support active, healthy living, create a safe, inclusive work environment for our associates, and enhance the economic development of the communities where we operate. Together with our bottling partners, we rank among the world's top 10 Private employers with more than 700,000 system associates. For more information, visit Coca-Cola Journey at www.coca-colacompany.com, follow us on Twitter at twitter.com/CocaColaCo or check out our blog, Coca-Cola Unbottled, at www.coca-colablog.com.
About Rebecca Minkoff
With a vision of building a lifestyle brand for the downtown romantic, San Diego-born designer Rebecca Minkoff founded her company in 2001 after she developed a small apparel line. She spent the next few years working on the small collection until 2005 when Rebecca developed the "Morning After Bag". The bag became an overnight sensation and Rebecca began solely concentrating on developing additional styles to build out her romantically themed day-to-night handbag collection. After four years of consistent growth in accessories under her belt, Rebecca returned to her original love of apparel design and introduced a ready-to-wear collection in 2009. Rebecca Minkoff's designs are a favorite for modern, trend-setting everyday women and celebrities alike.
SOURCE: BUSINESS WIRE ©2015 Business Wire
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- 'Big Brother 17': First Evicted Houseguest Talks "Twin Twist" and First-Outs Season The Hollywood Reporter - 2 minutes 53 seconds ago
THR talks to 'Big Brother' 17's first evicted houseguest Jace Agolli. More »'Big Brother 17': First Evicted Houseguest Talks "Twin Twist" and First-Outs Season
THR talks to 'Big Brother' 17's first evicted houseguest Jace Agolli.
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Excuse Us, your Holiness, but can we snap a selfie?
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The mixture was preserved on a small stone flake excavated by Lyn Wadley, of the Evolutionary Studies Institute at Johannesburg's University of the Witwatersrand, at a site about 40 km (25 miles) north of the port city of Durban. "Our analyses show that this ochre-based mixture was ... a paint medium that could have been …
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The euro may be facing an existential crisis but the giant 14-metre sculpture of the euro symbol that towers over downtown Frankfurt, home of the European Central Bank, was still getting its biggest makeover in 13 years on Monday. Considered an eyesore by many Frankfurters, the run down blue and gold structure situated …
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behavior chart at 3
Comments (9)
We started a chart like this for my ODS around age 3 because he wanted to save money for a bike. He really liked the chart idea so we occasionally start a new one up for him. He gets a small amount of money at the end of the week for a full chart. If he loses a sticker he gets a chance to do an extra chore around the house to earn it back. He is 5 YO now so he has some more advanced activities/chores but the ones you listed above sound great for a 3 YO! Are you offering a reward for filling up the chart?
Mommy to Jack 2/20/07, Kate 1/10/09, Alex 6/2/11, & baby due 11/17/15
We have started a sticker chart with our 3yr old DD.
She gets them fir eating all her food, being good at preschool, listening cleaning up....
We don't take them off. For 5 stickers she gets a small prize like a book or something from the $1 store. And when she gets to 25 she gets something big like a new DVD or go to the movies.
It works well. She does a better job helping - has not yet stayed in her room all night but hey she is getting better at it.
Married Best Friend: 8-18-06
Brought Beautiful Girl to World: 1-13-09
Brought Handsome Boy to World: 9-27-10
Most of the behaviors mentioned above seem like expected behavior, not anything above and beyond. Are you sure you want to teach the children that they will get rewards for normal expected behavior? I beleive that is a problem with 20yos today. They are expecting rewards and promotions for doing the job they were paid for. I worked with interns and temps for the past 5 years and many just don't get it. You have to work extra time and be exceptional to get promoted quickly and get more than the average raise.
It was my understanding that the behavior chart was to only be used when there are critical discipline problems.
I am just putting this out there for thougth
We started one with my son ( We bought it off of Amazon...it's a Mellisa and Doug magnetic chart). I like it because it has pictures of chores/behaviors and can be swtiched out as needed. It also doesn't need to be re-created once full (like a sticker chart). There are blank ones to fill in for a chore or behavior that might not be listed.
We make our son earn 40 magnets in a week for a special treat (he usually picks out gummy worms or a matchbox car). It works great. If he goes above and beyond we give an extra one. He likes earning them, and it gives us a chance at the end of the day to talk about what he did well, and the things he may need to work on and do better.
Married DH: 4-14-07
I'm with xabrinax. Our stance is, This is what we do here, so please do it.
Read Punished by Rewards by Kohn (or any of his books).
hope that helps.
ds 1/09 ds 6/11
Lindsey (31) & Aaron (32) 4-23-2005
Mommy to my AMAZING Aubrey Jean 1-18-2009
Mommy again to our UNEXPECTED Colton Aaron 5-5-2011
We also don't do rewards for expected behavior for similar reasonmings as pp. We use lots of positive reinforcement. If they do what they are told right away we tell them great listening ears or something like that.
Occasionally they get desert when they eat a good supper. Generally, we don't though. They just go hungry until the next meal. If they don't eat lunch - they don't get an afternoon snack...if they don't eat supper they don't get a bed time snack.
We did rewards for potty but the excitement, praise and cheers had more influence.
Mother of one precious baby girl - Callie born December 30 2008 and expecting number 2 March 14th!


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Undergraduate study
Read more about our SPS programmes, our typical offers, and what you could do after your degree.
Postgraduate study and research
Meet our students
"I honestly can't think of anywhere else I'd rather be. The teaching is first class, the college system allows for a brilliant pastoral care element, and the city of York itself is absolutely beautiful."
Catherine Hennigan, 3rd year student
Welcome to the School of Social and Political Sciences (SPS). The School of SPS is a joint collaboration between three of the UK's leading social science departments – Politics, Social Policy and Sociology. This distinctive programme combines a strong foundation in the core concepts and concerns of the social and political sciences with the possibility of individually tailored programmes of study allowing specialism within and across individual disciplines. The School of SPS has recently introduced a joint degree with Philosophy, which is also designed to allow a flexible choice of modules.
Students graduating from the BA programmes in SPS are highly valued for their insights into contemporary global challenges, and for their critical understanding and analytical and communication skills which are required for higher degree study and increasingly demanded worldwide by employers in education, business, law, policing, public policy, public management, marketing, management consultancy, media, international development and the not for profit sector.
Posted on Tuesday 30 June 2015
Congratulations to all our 2015 graduates for achieving outstanding results. All students achieved a First or Upper 2nd class degrees. Well done!
Posted on Tuesday 2 December 2014
Interested in applying to study Social and Political Sciences at York in 2016? Come along to one of the Open days taking place in June and September.
Seminar series
Bringing leading acadmics to York to share their expertise with SPS students.


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Latest Local Headlines
- Fireworks spark 500 acre Rail Canyon fire
- Firefighters battle more than a half dozen wildfires
- June water usage up 14-percent from 2014
- Navy SEAL faces long road to recover after bar fight injury
- Investigations find deputy did not strike bicyclist
- If you absolutely have to shoot fireworks be smart and safe
- Deputies searching for armed, dangerous fugitive near Royal City
- Take care of your car to avoid fires
- Record-breaking heat taking toll on firefighters
- Oregon House backs Oct. 1 start for marijuana sales
- Oregon State Police: California man killed in I-5 standoff
- Ore. man convicted in 32-year-old murder
- House approves bill making schools publish vaccine rates
- Autopsy: man died of blunt force trauma to head, face
- Montana had 2nd highest rate of health exchange re-enrollees
Sound Off
- Sound Off for July 2nd: It's here to stay, so how would you make Obamacare better?
- Sound Off for July 1st: Should fireworks be banned everywhere this summer?
- Sound Off for June 30th: Do you approve of the new budget deal in Olympia?
- Sound Off for June 29th: What are your thoughts on California's school vaccination bill?


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MADRID (AP) — A northeastern town has declared the king of Spain an unwelcome person, dealing another blow to the 74-year-old monarch who has faced scalding criticism for going on an elephant hunting trip during a severe financial crisis.
The town council of Berga — population 17,160 — in the region of Catalonia approved a symbolic motion proposed by the pro-independence Popular Unity Candidature party declaring King Juan Carlos "persona non grata," or not welcome.
The censure was published on the town's website Saturday after having been approved by vote in the council chamber two days earlier.
The king has faced condemnation after breaking a hip while on a lavish safari in southern Africa at a time when nearly one in four Spaniards were unemployed and the economy entered its second recession in three years.
The accident happened in the early hours of April 13 while the king was on the fourth day of an elephant hunt in Botswana's northern Okavango region, and he was immediately flown home by private jet for emergency hip replacement surgery.
In a separate statement, the party published its proposal which said the king's "personal behavior has been marked by all kinds of scandals" which, it added, "reach a climax with the Bostwana affair in April."
Continue reading this story on the...


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Even evil gets lonely.
Goblins descended on civilised land from the east nearly one thousand years ago. Now, it's time to descend upon them with all the fury they have shown us they are capable of.
People live inside a series of walls. Outside the walls, there are Titans (giants, unless you actually want to use the Titan, which are fetching powerful). There's a spell that needs breaking to return everything to normal size. That can only be done by collecting the elemental devil arms. Hot dang.
Or why you should always look women in the eye
"What do you mean the vault is empty?!"
"Just that, sir. It's empty."
"There was a half tonne of gold coins in there! Did you see a cart? Any orcs or ogres? A dragon?! It's not like it just got up and walked away!"
"Actually, sir..."
The Odaneimo Mountains aren't exactly the sort the bards talk about, they dont tear at the sky or trip the gods. They are still tall enough that you just can't go hiking over them. There are just two passes through them, Oshen Pass down in the south, and Zoran pass, in the north. It would be worth a pretty penny if someone could find a middle pass through.
Diad, Teamsters Guild-boss
A man approaches you with a proposition; a cult that seeks to only protect the weak; plots mingling and causing destruction.
Death, it seems, shall stalk the land of Merthia tonight- unless, of course, the PCs can stop it.
UAC Scientists have discovered a strange artifact on the surface of Phobos. They wish to transport it to an 'off-the-radar' base above Saturn's moon, Titan, but fear that space pirates may have gained intel on the artifact. Additional protection is needed; this is where you come in!
A Cosmic Era, Event Horizon/Doom-influenced Plot, for the optional Occult Brotherhood quest.
The lost story of the pommel stones.
When a wizard named Mendalus develops a spell that summons an obedient woman named Catherine--exactly like any other summoning spell--it creates chaos in the wizard-metropolis of Meltheria, as many interested parties struggle to understand the nature (and legality) of the Catherine spell, while vast fortunes hang in the balance.
"Many hungry people in these parts and the roads are dangerous. So you have a choice, you can give us most of your provisions to feed the starving, or all your silver to pass safely. The choice is yours, wanderer."
For those who enjoy comfort and discretion, and don't mind paying a few extra coins
during their stay in Ak-Var.
This great square lies a few feet below the level of the surrounding streets. A place of where emotions run high; a place of both awe, and despair.
They were made as a promise of everlasting peace and unity. One has been opened to prevent a war. A second sits on display in a Dwarven hold. The last has vanished, and to this day, has never been found.
An interesting little idea I came up with. Also my first attempt at a 100 Word Challenge.
Sneaky bastards, the lot of them
What does it mean to be Innocent? The flowers seem to know...
It's not who we are, it's what we do
Lavish glade and lush green field,
Wizen'd oaks; to the blight all yield.
Weeping trees of crimson blood,
the Fields of Flesh turn life to mud.
Will you tread and smile and sleep
where devils dance and angels weep?
A bloated corpse shows up downriver from a Taoist monastery. Brought to you by
the words bloat, corpse, redhead, Tao, monastery, murder, underwater treasure,
chains, Wuxia, and romance.
Once every decade on the eve of St. Poskov's Day during mid-winter, the coastal city of Tiyabon experiences a horrific event. Quool's Tide rolls in, depositing hundreds of bloated, fish-eaten corpses upon the pebbly shores of Tiyabon's wide bay. This singularity is to this day unexplained, though countless theories abound. It is said for example, that these corpses are not eaten by the myriad fish of the seas completely, due to the fear all creatures of the seas hold for Quool.
Named for Quool, a terrible, antediluvian god of seas and storms, who no longer exists for he has no worshipers, the Tide chokes the beaches and surf with the countless rotting bodies of those who had perished at sea in a violent way.
Almost immediately, the lifeless corpses are fed upon by crabs, gulls, and worse things that await the horrid feast. The townsfolk let nature take it course with disinterested disgust, though lately some enterprising adventurers have taken to searching along the beaches of flesh for former deceased companions, with intentions of raising them again!
Surprisingly no undead ever rise from among the many corpses. This is also a mystery.


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Thursday, July 2, 2015
Following two major incidents involving gangsters that recently aroused public attention and horror, New Taipei City Mayor Eric Chu said yesterday that the city government has joined a national program, aiming to protect teenagers during summer vacations, and will be checking on locations where teenagers often go more regularly, including Internet cafes, bowling alleys, KTVs and movie theaters.
Wednesday, July 1, 2015
Around 10 people were arrested and accussed of throwing signal bombs and crashing cars, including burning cars in fornt of a police station on the streets at midnight Tuesday, according to police officers of New Taipei City Police Department, Sanchong Precinct yesterday.
Monday, June 29, 2015
Taipei City's Department of Education yesterday announced that a joint draft plan created for Taipei, New Taipei and Keelung slated for use for the 2016 school year would not be implemented. An alternative strongly pushed by many Taipei district parents may be put in place, with that plan calling for next year's enrollment to be determined using measures that have historically been provided by the Ministry of Education (MOE).
A photo exhibition prepared to celebrate the 70th anniversary of the Republic of China's victory in the 1937-1945 war of resistance against Japan will be held at the Sun Yat-sen Memorial Hall in Taipei July 3-30.
Sunday, June 28, 2015
Former Taipei Mayor Hau Lung-bin (郝龍斌) on Thursday said that the Taipei City Government has been suffering from an exodus of employees since the incumbent mayor took office.
Taipei Mayor Ko Wen-je said Saturday that the city government hopes that 30,000 volunteers will sign up to do administrative work and provide services during the Summer Universiade set for Aug. 19-30, 2017.
Saturday, June 27, 2015
The Taiwan High Court has ordered New Taipei Fire Department to pay more than NT$4 million in damages to a man who was injured during a rescue operation five years ago.
A Indonesian man died Friday after he jumped from a height of about three stories off a 30-story building in Taipei around noon.
Thursday, June 25, 2015
The Ministry of Justice (MOJ, 法務部) yesterday returned the Taipei Dome (大巨蛋) and MeHAS City (美河市) cases to the Taipei City Government without review.
Tuesday, June 23, 2015
To prevent the spread of MERS, the Taipei Public Health Department (TPHD) has issued guidance to the management of 488 hotel and concert venues on how to best meet the needs and health requirements of recently arriving South Korean pop stars.


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June 26th is the feast day of
St. Josemaria Escriva.
Around the world, Masses are celebrated in his honor and everyone is invited!
Special thanks to www.josemariaescriva.info for making these videos available.
"May you seek Christ, May you find Christ, May you love Christ." - St. Josemaria Escriva
Copyright © 2015, St. Josemaria Institute


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VIEWS: 28 PAGES: 2 CATEGORY: Business POSTED ON: 12/22/2010 Public Domain
Archiving Management document sample
FROM ELECTRONIC ARCHIVING TO KNOWLEDGE MANAGEMENT CONTACT INFORMATION contact organisation: Chambre des Deputes contact city: Luxembourg contact country: Luxembourg contact telephone: +352 46 69 66 612 contact fax: +352 220 230 contact email: email@example.com contact website: www.chd.lu DESCRIPTION OF THE BEST PRACTISE CASE sector: Central and Regional Government Is the project a joint venture? No What key words would you use to describe this project? Electronic document management, workflow, knowledge management, IT technologies What can the participants of 3QC learn from this best practice case? From an electronic ar- chiving system, IT-services of Luxembourg's Parliament have grown into an integrated knowledge-management system where members of parliament, their assistants and parlia- mentary staff have web based access to all relevant information for their work through a dedicated portal. THE AIMS OF THE PROJECT What are the aims of the project? To provide simple and comprehensive access to all rele- vant information on a 24 hour basis from any location and organize the flow of documents within the Parliament and towards its users. Have these aims been quantified? No Are the aims recorded? Yes Where are the aims recorded? Before every phase of the project a study was carried out to define the objective of the phase (electronic archiving, knowledge management, etc.). THE IMPLEMENTATION What steps were taken to achieve the aim? 1. To ensure that the system would respond as closely as possible to the needs of the users working groups identified possible sources or internal and external information 2. A knowledge center was set up manage and monitor the contents of the Knowledge management system. Describe if and how the project was structurally embedded into the business operations: The responsibility for the project resided with the "Bureau de la Chambre des Deputes" com- posed by the President, the Secretary General and Members from all political groups repre- sented in the Parliament. Monitoring of the progress was achieved through an "ad hoc" steer- ing committee. Specify (to benefit the learning effect) the primary obstacles during the implementation of the project. How were these overcome? Negative attitudes of some categories of the targeted users were overcome by involving in the analyses. Were there positive or negative side effects? The offered IT services are accepted by all Members of Parliament. Transparency of the work of the institution towards the public is also improved through the fact that citizens have also better access to all relevant parliamentary documentation. THE RESULT Has an evaluation by citizens (or companies) been conducted? Yes If so, explain the results of the evaluations: Citizens and professionals have access to large parts of the archiving system, thus allowing them to evaluate the system and take advantage of facilities offered to the members of Parliament themselves. Feedback from these external users is generally positive. THE INNOVATION AND TRANSFERABILITY OF THE PROJECT Is the project innovative? Explain: Yes, for instance through switching from paper to elec- tronic forms of documents and creation of a single working space permitting access to all relevant forms of information. Is the project transferable to others? Yes If so, which elements? Electronic document distribution through Push technology, knowledge management portal, workflow elements. Did other organisations adapt the whole project or elements of it? No Are there special factors that contributed to the success of the project? User friendliness and focus on the users needs. Why must this best practice case be included in the conference? Luxembourg's Knowledge Management project illustrates how the efficiency of the work of an administration can be enhanced through the well planned and targeted use of IT technologies.
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"Archiving Management"Please download to view full document


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Originally written on Larry Brown Sports | Last updated 11/30/12
New York Giants cornerback Prince Amukamara was interviewed by MSG's Jill Martin during halftime of the Knicks-Wizards game on Friday, and he dropped a load on us. The second-year corner revealed that he used to go No. 2 as part of his pregame ritual, but he says he no longer does it. "That stopped working for me, so I discontinued that," he said. Amukamara then capped off his intimate revelation by saying, "the ladies call me "Princie-poo." Little did he realize that nickname suddenly had a dual-meaning. H/T Jimmy Traina
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SOCOM: U.S. Navy SEALs Tactical Strike
|SOCOM: U.S. Navy SEALs Tactical Strike
North American Cover Art
|Slant Six Games
|Sony Computer Entertainment
|Modified Logan's Shadow engine
|PlayStation Portable
|Release date(s)
|Single-player, Multiplayer
SOCOM: U.S. Navy SEALs Tactical Strike is the third handheld game in the SOCOM series. In Tactical Strike, the player is in command of four combatants. Tactical Strike, SOCOM: U.S. Navy SEALs Confrontation and SOCOM: U.S. Navy SEALs Fireteam Bravo 3 are developed by Slant Six Games instead of original and now defunct developer, Zipper Interactive.
SOCOM: U.S. Navy Seals Tactical Strike focuses on the player being able to maintain tight control of a four-man special operations squad. The game represents a major departure from the "run and gun" gameplay of the previous SOCOM games. In Tactical Strike, the player himself is never able to physically shoot, run, etc. Instead, he or she must tell the squad to do such actions. The player often has to evaluate a situation and then plan accordingly, usually having to incorporate some stealth into his or her movements. The squad is moved around using a "skimmer" (the analog stick of the PSP); the player can preview where the individual members of the squad will move to before they opt to actually move the team. The squad can be controlled from the points of view of different soldiers; additionally, the four man-team can be split up into two teams of two. The player can even choose to select an individual member of the squad.
At the start of the campaign, the player chooses from one of nine special forces teams to command: the Australian SASR, the German KSK, the British SAS, the French GIGN, the U.S. Navy SEALs, the Spanish UOE, the South Korean 707th Special Missions Battalion, the Italian Col Moschin, or the Dutch KCT. Although the storyline of the campaign is the same for every team, the voice track is voiced by native speakers of the different languages (with English subtitles).
Before each mission, the player can choose the loadout and accessories for each individual, upgrade each soldier's attributes with skill points obtained from previous missions (skill points are awarded for killing enemies and completing objectives), and choose one of two places to insert into the mission (if applicable).
An emergency occurs when a meeting between an ambassador from the player's country and Panama's Interior Minister is interrupted by insurgents, known as La Mano los Gente (The Hand of the People), who take the two men as hostages. When the ambassador's country becomes aware of the situation, a special forces team is inserted into Panama to resolve the hostage crisis.
Initially, the special forces team's efforts are frustrated by the insurgents' frequent relocation of their hostages. However, they get a solid lead after tracking the movements of men under the command of La Mano leader and drug trafficker Cesar Rojas. Infiltrating a La Mano compound, the special forces team manages to eliminate the guards and rescue the Panamanian Interior Minister. He informs the team that the ambassador was also being held in the compound, but was moved when the team began their assault.
After an infiltrating Cesar Rojas's home, analysis of his satellite phone shows that he has been in contact with ex-GRU Dimitry Lutchenko, who arrived in Panama a few weeks ago. During a mission to capture La Mano's second-in-command Hector Ortiz, the insurgents are seen in a fierce firefight against black clad mercenaries. While being interrogated, Ortiz reveals he has ordered his troops to plant explosives at a pumping station along the Trans-Isthmus Oil pipeline, the destruction of which would cause severe economic and environmental damage to Panama. Fortunately, the special forces Team is able to intervene and, with the help of a pair of engineers, disable the explosive charges while fighting off La Mano forces.
It is later learned that the mercenaries who attacked Ortiz's men, known as the "Wolf Brigade," are under the command of Lutchenko, who is in turn in the employ of Alexander Volchkov, a known arms dealer and CEO of Petroskya Oil and Gas. After being tipped off by an informant, the special forces team faces off against more armed insurgents, and is finally able to capture Cesar Rojas. Rojas reveals that he made a deal with Volchkov: in return for money and weapons, he agreed to have La Mano sabotage key pieces of Panamanian oil infrastructure. This would interrupt the supply and delivery of oil, allowing Voltchkov to profit off of the situation. Rojas also reveals that Lutchenko, who still has the ambassador in his possession, has taken over a hotel with his Wolf Brigade.
Taking out a large number of Wolf Brigade forces, the special forces team successfully infiltrates the hotel and secures the ambassador. Lutchenko manages to slip away and leaves behind Wolf Brigade reinforcements to tie up the ambassador's rescue. This proves futile, as the ambassador is successfully extracted.
Satellite tracking follows Lutchenko to the Panama Canal, where he plans to use explosives on a ship currently in the canal. This would shut down the canal indefinitely, resulting in incalculable damage to the world economy. Despite being heavily outnumbered, the special forces team disables bombs on both the ship itself and a nearby dam, fights off Wolf Brigade mercenaries, and subdues Dimitry Lutchenko.
As an epilogue, a newscast reveals that Cesar Rojas and Hector Ortiz have been charged for their crimes, and that Panama has entered talks with NATO regarding regional security, both encouraging a drop in oil prices on the world markets. Alexander Volchkov, surprisingly evading punishment for his role in the Panamanian incident, appears at a shareholders' meeting for Petroskya Oil and Gas, promising a bright future for the company.
SOCOM: U.S. Navy SEALs Tactical Strike received an average rating of 72% at Metacritic.com.[1]
GameRevolution gave it an average rating of A-, saying the game "has a nice musical score." [2] IGN gave the game 7 out of 10.[3]
GameSpot gave it 7.5 out of 10 (good).[4] The reviewer appreciated the change of pace by making a strategic SOCOM title, but disliked the sometimes difficult controls.
1UP gave the game a C+, citing poor squad AI as a downside, but also saying "When Tactical Strike works, it works really, really well."[5]
External links[edit]