text:
- John Moonstroller
- Canton, GA
- United States
This conversation is closed.
Is Atheism just another cult, with their own dogma, like religious cults?
Is Atheism just another cult, like a religious cult, with people who believe there is no god, and in most cases also that what is presented by science is the absolute truth? Do people of an Agnostic persuasion believe, atheists have a blind faith in science, believing what they show, and measure is the last word about reality; believing that this Science supports their side of the debate while excluding the Religious view.
Those in the middle of the God/No God debate (Agnostics) have stated that such a claim is delusional and is indicative of cult mentality on par with religious cultism. It requires blind belief God does not exist which is dogmatic because there is no proof (currently) that is acceptably to the Agnostic crowd that God is or is not. Agnostics see the gaps in Scientific knowledge and try to keep an open mind pertaining to spiritual ideas and their connection to the real world. They have sometimes been accused of creating the Scientific idea of Creationism which has gathered steam in the last decade or so. Being in the middle, They are attacked by both sides of the debate, as will be demonstrated in this debate question.
Biting and Kicking is allowed by the Author and leaves it to TED to tell us where the limits lie.
Closing Statement from John Moonstroller
"Is Atheism just another cult, with their own dogma, like religious cults?"
"The word cult in current popular usage usually refers to a new religious movement or other group whose beliefs or practices are considered abnormal or bizarre.[1] The word originally denoted a system of ritual practices. The word was first used in the early 17th century denoting homage paid to a divinity and derived from the French culte or Latin cultus, 'worship', from cult-, 'inhabited, cultivated, worshipped,' from the verb colere, 'care, cultivation'." ~ Wikipedia
"Dogma is the official system of belief or doctrine held by a religion, or a particular group or organization" ~ Wikipedia.
Organizations of atheists ritually denounce the existence of God. They have become an organization, dedicated to the activity of removing all relic's of Theism from public places. Their dogma is based entirely on their notion or belief that God does not exist. These organizations work tirelessly towards this effort.
It is no longer possible for an individual to simply state they are an atheist, by reason of personal belief, and not be affiliated, by membership or indirect alignment with these organizations.
These organizations have an official system of belief and their doctrine is to end the belief of theism on this planet.
They are exclusive, ritualistic, and have a belief system which generates activity within and beyond the boundaries of the organization. They are a Cult.
Not everyone agrees with this interpretation but the meaning of words evolve over time. To be an Atheist is to believe in a dogma and be a member of a club or organization. In the least, an individual is indirectly aligned with these clubs or organizations by belief or personal assertion they are an atheist.
John Moonstroller
Sep 27 2012: If people get touchy, offended or angry about an opposing view in these atheism/God debates, then there is usually a strongly held belief system in there somewhere - on either side.
Is atheism a belief system? Of course it is. In fact it has become just as dogmatic as the thing it seeks to oppose.
Sep 27 2012: That's a good point to make Allen.
Tim Powers
Sep 25 2012: "I don't understand the statement about agnostics or creationism. What do you mean?"
- +4
I meant calling atheists cultists because they have blind faith that there's no proof that God does NOT exist, is not something I've ever heard an agnostic say. I've heard creationists say things like that, because they often do not understand where the burden of proof lies. Generally, agnostics understand that you don't need proof that something DOESN'T exist; you would need proof that it DOES exist.
"Tim, most of this question has already been answered by other commentors."
Sorry, I thought it was a debate, not a question. I was weighing in with my take. But you're right, I'm sure my points have already been made by others. (And, yes, the forum setup is a bit confusing, with newest posts on top, but nested replies.)
Sep 25 2012: Well Tim Powers, you say, "I meant calling atheists cultists because they have blind faith that there's no proof that God does NOT exist, is not something I've ever heard an agnostic say.".
I say, obviously you haven't heard everything there is to know on the matter.
It is a debate. But if you don't read, how can you properly debate? How can your debate skills be demonstrated and used to persuade others of the correctness of your position or idea, if all you do is repeat the same thing over and again? Doesn't that have more to do with being a parrot in a tree, than a debater of ideas?
We all have something to say, but if someone has already said it, of what worth is an echo? Why reinvent the wheel?
Tim Powers
Sep 25 2012: "I say, obviously you haven't heard everything there is to know on the matter."
- +4
Then you're prepared to cite your sources, correct? Given that it would be a really ignorant thing for an agnostic to say, I tend to wonder if you attributed the notion to agnostics, when you meant to attribute it to a common creationist stance.
"We all have something to say, but if someone has already said it, of what worth is an echo? Why reinvent the wheel?"
I find this curious. Surely you don't imagine your debate point is original, so what was the worth of your echo? If you're allowed to echo a question based upon an incorrect notion of where the burden of proof lies, I'm certainly allowed to echo a logical correction.
Sep 25 2012: My intentions in the debate, were to illicit comments on the issue of how people view atheism and it's characterization as almost a religion of total counter theism, rather than a debate on the idea of religion. If religion is theism, than is atheism simply anti-theism? If the aura of religion or the idea that religion is justified in becoming organized and seeks to mandate their followers proceed to seed the population with this idea, then is it possible for the anti-theistic movement to also do the same?
The role played by the Agnostic is one of wonder and introspection. From this perspective the agnostic can set back and view both parts of the debate and interfere in the mandates or take issue with the postulation of either side. This places the agnostic squarely in the middle. It has absolutely nothing to do with Creationism, but many agnostics are accused of being creationists as demonstrated by some comments to the author of the debate, which is me.
Personally, I like to provoke debate on this issue and taking the side of the Devils advocate is sometimes a good tool to expand some commentators views about whither or not their comment should have weight in the final analysis. Your comments for instance, will be tossed in the bin because you don't offer anything new. I don't mean that personally, just as an example of how the analysis will take shape. I do have to write closing remarks to this debate when it ends. Think about that and see if you might want to participate in a different way. I appreciate your interest.Sep 25 2012: Tim I notice you don't have a PM feature on your profile Is there some way to talk to you privately? My personal email is email@example.com
I can't leave this post up very long because it is off topic and will be deleted. I usually delete them myself but sometimes forget and TED does it for me. :)Sep 25 2012: Why would you start a debate..and then attack people who respond?
Sep 25 2012: Henery if you feel I've attacked you I apologize. It was not my intention to do so.
Comment deleted
Sep 25 2012: George Carling was the Cyber bully of Television Don. He intimidated Liberal, conservatives, the innocent and the guilty, alike. Not many people can do what he accomplished in "Real" life. Nothing was sacred to George Carling.
Virtual reality is just that Virtual. It's not real. The people are real (sometimes) but the human element, the soul, the thing inside us that makes us human to other human beings is easily subdued in this virtual environment. Those with a finer grasp of vocabulary have the edge in this arena.
There is a moment in combat when you realize the enemy is dead. That's the time you should stop pumping the lead, so to speak. In the virtual word, the enemy never dies, they always come back and this is an obstacle to some personalities. So, they adopt other methods to try and kill the opposition, They develop Troll and Cyber-bullying techniques, become physiologically and additively attached to these techniques because they believe they have accomplished in the virtual world what they think is the equivalent of the real world. To the pathetic mind, the words and phrases are the ammunition by which they defeat their opponents. An internal sense of Catharsis usually follows the exchange when an opponent appears to be defeated. A sense of pleasure.
There is an interesting debate which took place in October of 2011, involving a different set of TEDsters then are currently online today. It was a debate entitled: "jails should be more widely known as schools", introduced by Griffin Tucker of Canberra Australia. I found this exchange to be very demonstrative of how people can talk about a subject that they have little or no experience with
as if they were experts on the subject and, in the case of some of the members, just outright lie about their connection and experience within the subject area. It was very interesting reading. Sometimes the old conversations are much better than the new. TED is a maze, sometimes a laboratory.
John Frum
Sep 23 2012: Hi John. You have mixed up the two different kinds of atheism. The attribute, "people who believe there is no god", is not applicable to Dan Dennett and Richard Dawkins, and possible others in the list of TED speakers you have linked to.
- +3
Reference: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negative_and_positive_atheism
On the one hand, the agnostics I have come across have made stronger claims than you. Most state that it is impossible for us to know whether or not a god exists. (which god?) On the other hand, most atheists I have come across, personally or in books and other media call themselves "agnostic atheists" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agnostic_atheism.
Putting it in another way, I have come across many atheists, but none of them have the "blind belief God does not exist". They have all said, "demonstrate a proof, and I'll believe".
Sep 23 2012: John you said, "On the one hand, the agnostics I have come across have made stronger claims than you.". I am an amateur agnostic and don't belong to any organization of agnostics so my pitiful attempts should be overlooked sometimes.
hat said, I will repeat what I have stated in other places in this debate. It is a question that I hope will reveal more truth so we (I) can become more enlightened on the issue, via your wisdom and the wisdom of others. I would add your not the first to offer this information. It has caught my attention and made me scratch my head a bit.
I have read about agnostics, I have not researched them with the intentions of writing a dissertation on their personalities or characteristics or belief system. My lot is internalized towards understanding and defining myself.
If you have suggestions about how I should reword the question, then by all means, state them to me, perhaps the email would be a better venue. If you can prove this with some official evidence or a private poll conducted by you in request to an official posting agency, I will be more than happy to work with you and alter the question and remove the "blind belief" part with the permission of the other contributors here. I suppose we could try polling every one in an unofficial capacity:
How many think the wording of "Blind Faith" should be changed or delete and what would I exchange it with?
One person, one vote.
Until then, I'm kinda stuck with it and don't clearly see any reason to alter it.
Thanks for pointing this out to me John.
Perhaps I should use CAPs more often?
Sep 23 2012: I'm sorry -- I should have been clearer. By "stronger claims", I meant the opposite. Consider the following:
1. Obama has an apple in his left hand right now.
2. Obama may have an apple in his left hand right now.
Sentence 1 is a "stronger claim", requiring the person claiming it to provide evidence. I like the weaker kind of atheism and the weaker kind of agnosticism. I am a "weak atheist" myself. I think it is to your credit that you did not make the stronger claim.
Only after writing what I wrote in my original post, above, did I scroll down and see that others had made similar comments, and mine was quite redundant.
That said, I have a login id on richarddawkins.net. Many people there tend to blame religion for every little thing, rightly or wrongly. Many of them take the attitude that person X is a christian or muslim, therefore, all his principles are wrong. I have often argued against that attitude too. It's generally the opposite on TED. For example, I have heard claims that atheists are immoral, or even that we have no reason to live. I have argued against such people on TED. I don't know if I'd appear to be a cultist in your eyes.
Sep 23 2012: Here in Cherokee county Georgia. TED is black listed because the people in charge of the school system deem them to bee too anteisic and Liberal, therefore, a danger to the mental health of their children....
That's just the way regional attitudes flow. It's an indication that TED, as presented, as the tool to end all ignorance is just another stop on road to blog city. Some Tedsters believe they have fallen in Liberal Heaven and are very bold. Others think they are warriors on a quest to defeat the dragon monster TED. :)
It's too funny really. you need to join my forum at www.moonstroller.com.
And no John. I've read nearly all your posts on TED. You are one of the people I'd invite to my forum. I have no problems with you efforts to advance the cause of blogging. I just let you take the foreground in case there might be snipers in the trees. ;)Sep 24 2012: I don't quite get what you mean by "I just let you take the foreground in case there might be snipers in the trees." Are you making me the bait for those snipers? I don't mind :-)
I'm not sure if I'd let my own kids venture into TED forums unless they have developed a modest ability for critical thinking, and a hard-enough skin. So, I'm not sure I disagree with what the Cherokee county's decision, despite our differing motivations.
Sep 24 2012: Yes, the image you imagined was correct. You're the bait.
If your not a Vietnam veteran you don't see the humor in it.
Yes. I agree. I've been a Liberal minded person all my life. Did you see the movie "The Hunger Games"?
I've been trying to analysis the authors internal feelings about the theme. It could just be a commercialization without any real meaning, just pulling on people's neurons a bit. I've read the reviews.
When I imagine the future it takes on the setting in that movie. Complete Isolation of the have from the have none. With education and technology centered near an energy rich, location Like Indiana, or up around the Great Lakes, with the rest of society spread out in districts. I guess it would look more like a Greek City State.
The world my great grandchildren will live in.
I'm not so sure I want the Liberal dream anymore. I'm not sure we will survive to create it.
One day someones going to push the trigger and it will be gone in a flash.
Did you know they exploded over 2000 Nuclear bombs between 1945 and 2009. That's 31.25 bombs per year since 1945.
They say that wwIII would waste the planet but 2000 bombs is a very large number. 31 bombs a year is a large number.
If 2000 bombs didn't destroy the planet, is it possible that we could survive a nuclear war with, say 500 detonations in one weeks time frame?
We have really been beating this planet up since the end of WWII.Sep 24 2012: No, I haven't seen The Hunger Games. Thanks for the recommendation! I'll check it out one of these days. The sad part for me about all those nuclear explosions is that scientists can no longer do carbon dating of anything created after 1950. It's dead!
Have you seen this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BlE1BdOAfVc ?
Sep 24 2012: I never gave that any thought. Thanks I'll look into that.Oct 4 2012: Let me first assume that with atheism, you imply more than "not believing in any kind of god".
If you assume the naturalistic worldview (like the Bright movement states http://www.the-brights.net/ ),
then you cannot claim it is the same as a religion or a cult.
Pure atheism is rare, I call myself an atheist because for me the likelyhood of any given god is close to 0... (I just round down).
Of course a lot of people that have a naturalistic worldview still want to have rituals or spiritual congregations or other aspects that are found in religion (like Alain explains here: http://www.ted.com/talks/lang/en/alain_de_botton_atheism_2_0.html)
Oct 4 2012: "Pure atheism is rare, I call myself an atheist because for me the likelihood of any given god is close to 0... (I just round down)." ~Christophe Cop
If pure atheism is rare, is impure atheism more common?
IF you round up, does it change the likelihood?
Your statement yields two questions which require answering before we can reach a conclusion.
Steve Zagata
Oct 1 2012: If it's a cult it's a cult everyone is born into.
- +2
Atheism has become a handy term to define people who do not believe in god or gods. I am constantly referred to as an atheist but don't consider myself one. How would I describe it? "I don't believe in something that doesn't exist"? I simply consider myself a human being.
That said, if people want to call me an atheist I don't lose sleep over it, better than saying I'm delusional.
The term atheist depends on religion, if religions didn't exist neither would the term atheist. So if it's a cult it is because of religion.
Oct 1 2012: No one decided that the term atheist would apply to those who didn't believe in God or Gods. It was invented to describe those who did not believe in the God(s) of the defining society. It was a curse word a derogatory word intended to demean or belittle another person who did not share the beliefs of the society in charge.
"The term atheism originated from the Greek ἄθεος (atheos), meaning "without god(s)", used as a pejorative (derogatory term) applied to those thought to reject the gods worshiped by the larger society."~wikipedia {with emphasis added by me}
When a Religious person calls you an atheist, it is this fashion they are using the word, so they are correct in their usage.
In this sense it does depend on Religion and it is possible that if there never was any religion, there would not be such a word. But, it could also be argued that by the power of evolution that we would be dinosaurs instead of humans if they weren't wiped out by a cataclysmic event and you wouldn't exist at all as a human being. So, you are a human being by "what?" an act of providence or by design, or just by coincidence?
Steve Zagata
Oct 1 2012: If we were having this discussion a few thousand years ago you would be correct but words and language are flexible and their meanings change over time.
- +1
In your same wikipedia page you will find:
"Atheism is, in a broad sense, the rejection of belief in the existence of deities"
All other definitions say basically the same thing. This is the meaning of the word today.
By the way, it is a well known fact that the dinosaurs were atheists. I imagine this angered the boss almighty and may have had something to do with their extinction.
Oct 1 2012: Enjoy your fanaticism, I'm going to sleep....Oct 1 2012: I guess followers of a particular religion with its particular gods or goddesses are atheist to the gods and goddess of other religions.Sep 30 2012: @ John,
I am not sure if you genuinely misunderstand or are just being obtuse.
Yes there is no teapot, that is the point, but you cannot prove that, and any reasonable person would expect me as a 'teapotist' to prove it's existence, not for you as a teapot atheist to disprove it. That is the point of the example, religion is a belief, and that is fine if people admit it is just that. Otherwise don't hid being the 'you can't disprove it' fallacy and offer some genuine proof. Simple.
Atheism is NOT a journey to disprove something, it is a position that this something does not exist and a statement that there is no real proof for it. It amazes me how words are twisted and games played rather than openness from those who claim to be honest and pious. This does not seem to align with my understanding of the point of religion. But then as an agnostic I guess I can claim I wouldn't understand.
As per my reply to Peter, I don't think atheism is remotely cult like. Some proponent of atheism have been mistakenly drawn into reason and evidence free debates on this subject that does not do them any favours when we should stick to the scientific position of expecting reason and evidence, but that is as far as it goes for me.
As my previous post stated this likely will go round in circles, and we clearly have opposing views the other is unlikely to change. This is proving to be true.
Sep 30 2012: There is no teapot to hide behind Kevin. I am in the open and never condescending. If theism is the belief then is atheism the anti belief?
A position, as you imply is a point along the path of the journey
What is closed minded and dishonest about the statement: "...there was a man named Jesus who was God, came to this earth as a man, preformed miracles, then ascended to heaven after his death?", which is the claim of the Christians. Perhaps it is true you don't understand; you would know better than I.
Atheism the definition is not a cult. Atheism the dynamic population of organized members, I believe, is a cult. It matches all the definitions of "Cultism". They are an anti-belief.
Your last statement is very true.
Bruno Carre
Sep 28 2012: John you seem to pay attention to etymology (cultus in Latin, worship). So atheism or agnosticism doesn't imply to worship anything. It's a belief without any specific rules to follow, events to attend or authority.
- +2
So I'd answer: No. It is not a cult.
I believe it's just that simple :-)
Sep 28 2012: 1 vote no from Bruno Carre. Thanks.Sep 29 2012: We all have gods..............money, power and so on. What we don't do is have worship services to adore that particular god.
Oct 3 2012: We do have festivals to adore one another and birthday parties also. The idea of adoring successful people is documented all over the TED website especially in the Talks section. When we clap our hands, we give reverent respect to the speakers.
Worship is a broadly defined term I think.
Oct 4 2012: John...I guess so.....but I was thinking of special rituals.Sep 26 2012: Not all atheists choose to be on the side of science. As for the ones who do, they do so because it makes more sense in their eyes. Atheists don't have a cult or cults, we do not have gatherings (I am atheist) in which we share our religious ideologies. Science isn't a cult either, its just the study of things. Religion has its views on what is true and what is false and they show these very strongly. With science, it looks for the facts of what occurred and didn't. In some sense science can be viewed as a religion because science is looking for similar answers that religion stories say are plausible. As for me I'm atheist because I feel that believing in a creator or a god isn't needed. That doesn't mean I don't take into consideration what others have to say about what they believe. I'll listen to what people say, just so I know their stand point on things, and I don't judge those who believe and who don't. A person shouldn't be judged by their beliefs, and in some cases I feel that religion changes the mind of people into doing just that. Its a way to make a religion grow. Again this is just my opinion, I'm not one to say what is plausible or not.
Sep 26 2012: By (we) you are really taking about yourself I assume Stephen Torres.
Stephen you can Google and see the number of atheist organizations that have grown since the 60's. It's a large number and the internet has only allowed them to grow stronger. They have a political agenda that is set off from their philosophical views and belief system.
They aim to destroy all religious beliefs and set the world straight. They are just as powerful as a mob organization (criminal) and will stop at nothing to achieve their goals. If you are religious, they want you off the planet. All you need do to discover this information is join up and move through the system to the inside circle. I suggest you don't get caught.
These atheist organizations have their tools to stimulate hate, confusion, and conflict. It's strange but sometimes they are allied with christian hate organization. The recent film that has set the Muslim world on fire today is an example of such collaboration. I could say more but I won't. (a hint to the wise.)
You can get more information from this site.
You have to email them to find specific information about such groups as Atheist organizations. These Atheist organizations have their own lawyers.
The world is not the calm peaceful place we here in the US wake up to when we sit on our decks and drink our coffee in the morning. It's aflame.
Jimmy Strobl
Sep 26 2012: Haha, I didn't know that you had renegade atheists in the US!
- +5
I must say that I really enjoy seeing mankind transform into a more enlightened species.
Anyway John, I easily tire of these debates so I'm just going to leave my thoughts and never return to this conversation, enjoy!
First of all science is basically the opposite of dogma, religious people don't really seem to get that...
You really don't get science at all! There would be few things cooler for a scientist then proving that everything we knew was wrong! There is no truth in science, only probability. So you see, the being dogmatic argument goes away quite fast.
I think that religious people "attack" agnostics way more then atheists perhaps do. I as an atheist would only ask an agnostic what kind of odds he/she thinks there is for (a) "God". Most people here seem to be Teapot-Agnostic/Atheist http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russells_teapot
And to answer your question: No, we're not in a cult, it's the other way around!!! I'm really not kidding you, snap out of it man!
(no offence)
Sep 26 2012: I am just like you in this one response. I don't get into the whole battle of faith and non-faith discussions. But I do like to read others opinion on the matter.Sep 26 2012: Jimmy: None taken :) It's been fun talking with you. Come back and join us when ever you can. It's refreshing to have a very young perspective on how we old people missed everything there is to know about the world, people and ideas. We were too busy destroying the world to notice I guess.
Later.Sep 27 2012: John,
If I might make a suggestion. Your heading states is atheism just another cult.
That is bundling up all those who don't believe in gods, all those who consider themselves atheists as part of a cult.
Hopefully this is obviously clearly false. As discussed not believing in gods does not mean you automatically belong to any cult. It is a position on one question.
Atheists can join any cult or group they like, but atheism isn't a cult. It is a position on one question.
Now I get your point about some atheists organising for whatever reason. Some might consider religion harmful. Some might even cross lines I consider reasonable. Still I suggest you might consider most of these political or philosophical organisations rather than cults.
You may be doing a disservice to your argument by bunching all atheists together as a cult.
If there are atheists trying to force others to give up religion or other impingements on the rights of others that should be resisted.
Others might like to see an end to religious type superstition or at least the negative impacts, but would not force people to be atheist.
Sep 27 2012: I really like the post by you obey, I've seen more of them in other debates. Kind of a side note to the last bits you said; if there are atheist organizations trying to end religion by any means, isn't that the same for religions causing trouble for atheists or those of a different belief. What I mean is something like the Crusades, Christians traveled across many countries killing all who didn't fallow their belief system. So in other words history is repeating itself on a daily basis. But now it's by other means.Sep 27 2012: So you are saying that the definition of "Cult" is the point of your argument.
That could be a valid point Obey. I could reword the topic but would that be fair at this juncture of the conversation?
Atheism is accepted within some religious and spiritual belief systems, including Jainism, Buddhism, Hinduism, Neopagan movements[17] such as Wicca,[18] and nontheistic religions. Jainism and some forms of Buddhism do not advocate belief in gods,[19] whereas Hinduism holds atheism to be valid, but some schools view the path of an atheist to be difficult to follow in matters of spirituality.[20] ~wikipedia
It appears that in some religions, Atheism is a religious notion and as such can be called a cult.Sep 27 2012: Thanks Stephen.
It is similar I guess. I support freedom of religion even though I argue against it in many regards. Mainly because it is so powerful and can be used to excuse many bad things. But I'm okay with religion if it doesn't harm people or isn't forced on others. Even then I will debate if people are willing. I will protest if religion is trying to undermine secular institutions like chaplains and scripture classes in state schools etc.
It's a funny position, like supporting freedom of speech, within limits, even if you use it to disagree with me.
But there is something about religion that is really hard to have reasoned discussion. How do you argue with " because god said so".Sep 27 2012: Hi John - not asking to reword the statement
Just suggesting that while atheists can join cults or be superstitious or not, atheism is not a cult.
Some atheists may be part of something cultish. But atheism is not a religion or a cult.
I suggest cults do exist. Often led by charismatic individuals. Usually very closed. Jim jones etc. there is a continuum and some groups might easily be classed a cult but others may share some cultish aspects. Remember the om supreme truth sect. Classic cult. Then you have particular immans or preachers under the umbrella of a larger tradition that may influence small groups in a cultish manner, but may not meet all the trappings of a cult.
Sep 28 2012: Atheism is accepted within some religious and spiritual belief systems, including Jainism, Buddhism, Hinduism, Neopagan movements[17] such as Wicca,[18] and nontheistic religions. Jainism and some forms of Buddhism do not advocate belief in gods,[19] whereas Hinduism holds atheism to be valid, but some schools view the path of an atheist to be difficult to follow in matters of spirituality.[20] ~wikipedai.
Note religious affiliations.
Your western minded world mindset is just a part of the whole world viewpoint Obey.Sep 26 2012: In some religions what you call "Dogma" is actually what I would call "A foundation"; a basic building block on which the belief stands. Even science has these basics.
It is not that these basics have to be accepted without argument; it is just that sometimes arguing about both basics is like arguing with someone who tells of the sun rising from the north when we all know which direction to look in order see a rising sun.
chen xin
Sep 26 2012: you know science and religion are two different things .
- +1
once religion had tried to prevent the science development .in the acient the religion try to kill pwople they hurt many famous person who do not agree with their cults ..
while at last science broke out .and now science is the lead of the world .! ist it ?
Sep 26 2012: They are similar in enterprise-ship, but different in behaviors.
Lol, the way you reference them sounds as if they are in opposition to one another - which is not the case.
Some religious groups do still try to prevent scientific investigation, but in touche topics like stem cells and fetus research. Which they should be touche, playing 'God' in a laboratory should be heavily mandated by some form of policy - similar to the laws involved in cloning.Sep 27 2012: You are so correct about science taking the lead in developing our new knowledge Chen xin, but,
science was developed so we could kill each other or, exploited if you like.
Archimedes developed war machines, that's what got him started with sponsors.
Leonardo Di Vinci, created some really good war machines. He needed sponsors too.
If we removed all the military funding from science research today, there would be many scientist, applying for jobs at Wallymart and Home Improvements are us.
I believe if we removed all the military funding world wide, Science might decline at a considerable rate.
Science also invented the Atomic bomb...... yes Chen.... science can not only kill, it can do so very effectively and wholesale.Sep 26 2012: I was just thinking along this line yesterday, then forgot it. I'm glad you brought it up. I'll have to look at my notes but there is something very useful in what we call our "belief" system. Something basic, something lost to newer minds. Something we need to revisit and bring it back into our common knowledge bank.Sep 27 2012: Science has the scientific method as a foundation.
Islam has the Koran and bible to a lessor extent
Christianity has the nt and ot to a lessor extent
Science changes when better explanations are found.
Religions tend to resist change.
More different than similar.
In a way science and religion are responses to ignorance. One has led to vaccines, computers, electricity generation and a whole array of technologies that we know work.
I'm writing this comment on an iPad running on electricity, harnessed by science. You can pray to god, sacrifice some goats, but that won't recharge the battery, or make crops grow in the way that science based technologies work.
Sep 28 2012: I am yet to see a religion that tells one of the herbs for treating diseases; or the ways to build houses; or have a detailed description of the world and its citizens/its geography; I am yet to see a religion that gives one lectures on diet or how to prepare food.
Mr No1Kinobe, you've missed the point. Religion is focussed on inter-personal relationships and relationships in human societies. There are moral laws and guidelines for harmonious relationships.
There have been scientists who are christains, and christains have contributed immensely to science. No human system is perfect. Just as there have been times when so-called christains have done things that is contrary to the teachings of Jesus Christ, Scientists have also made mistakes.
Scientic inventions are great, but what is the use of great inventions if it would be tools in the hands of depraved human beings?
Now, depraved human beings are no good, either they are affiliated to any religion (the fact that someone makes a claim to a religion does not make the claim a right one) Or if they are scientists.
True religion, as stated in James 1:27 in the Bible, is meant to give a human face to knowledge and science.Sep 28 2012: Obey, Science is a practical method of defining knowledge based on mass and energy.
It is not a way of life, method of ideology, lessons in morality and other social concerns.
It is not a political affiliation. I does not deal with issues of Vise, morality, Virtue, etc.
This idea is old and off the track Obey...Sep 25 2012: Sure you have heard this one before 'Reality is a social construction'. Humans incredibly complex and diverse and aware of self. Have to develop some kind of filtration system to process information received in minute by minute existence. Filtration partly within ourselves and partly in communities we live in. Idea that lives dictated by' a higher conscienceness' pervasive throughout culture and history. Maybe it is about finding a balance. A person might feel paralysed by the notion they are ultimately responsible for what happens in their lives, a social structure helps creativity and communication even if the end product is detrimental to a particular individual. Lucky enough to live where I can observe nature and the seasons. Never fail to be impressed by sheer opportunism of life force. People notice energy. Where does it come from and where does it go and how can an individual survive a chaotic and random existence without some belief system, no matter how irrational or insane.
Sep 25 2012: You make a good point Elizabeth. Do you think that a belief system is just a tendency of the human condition to make sense of the world around themselves?
Sep 26 2012: Not 100 percent certain and a combination of many other people's ideas. Got idea from thinking about people who end up in psychiatric institutions (and big business). Tend to be people with very specific information filters in place. So much so that communication with a range of people compromised. Good for individual if makes them good fit for a particular business (something about driven business leaders often being psychopaths). Do like your big idea 'keep your money in your own pocket'. Confusion in younger generation good consumer somehow good citizen. Cheeky article on internet, if you don't use Facebook, you are some kind of social misfit. Author was arguing social media just another method of sifting potential customers for product selling. Hope not straying too far off original debate here.
Sep 26 2012: I think I understand. In my forum, we like to talk about these ideas, not debate them. We seek to understand, not only the idea but the person behind the idea. You are invited to join if you like. There, we have more room to discuss idea then we come to TED to test those ideas (hopefully_ on qualified minds. I'm afraid I haven't seen many and those who are tend to be a tad irrational if you disagree with them. But, considering the fact many people who are not qualified tend to offer suggestions that sound justified instead of inquiring, I see whey these qualified people get frustrated.
Tim Powers
Sep 25 2012: I don't mean to be overly argumentative, but your closing line said biting and kicking were allowed :)
- +2
"My intentions in the debate, were to illicit comments on the issue of how people view atheism and it's characterization as almost a religion of total counter theism, rather than a debate on the idea of religion. If religion is theism, than is atheism simply anti-theism?"
Absolutely not. The prefix 'a' simply means "without." Asexual reproduction is reproduction without sex, not reproduction that is anti-sexual. Amoral means without morals, not bad morals or anti-morals. Likewise, atheism is without a belief in a personal god.
Sep 25 2012: How would you suggest I correct this shoddy statement. I mean this sencerily. I would like to correct the statement and reach out to you for the proper criticism. Tim.
When I changed the list selection from newest to oldest, it became apparent to me that I've inappropriately answered some of your comments in a disorderly fashion.
Sorry. Later I will go back and alter those misnomers.
I'd like to start over with this reply. Do you think I'm implying that I'm a creationist of sorts, within the religious context or that I'm associating agnosticism with Creationism?Sep 25 2012: Good thing about being agnostic...you can attack all you want....I have plenty to defend myself.
I see this position as the only "absolute" position to have.
However, let us not value information too much. Religion has positive sides.
With our technology and new ideas..we may just be distracting ourselves.
I guess the only answer...is to "not know" unless you "believe" which is not something you can just "pick up".
I respect all opinions and all forms of debate. I cannot claim to know...because I do not...and any other statement is false.
Sep 25 2012: Sounds like you're up to the task Henry Woeltjen. I see our profile. you are an interesting individual. I used to live in Miami in the park with the rest of the hippies. :)
So you view yourself as Agnostic, is that correct?
And, that this stance gives you ammunition to compete with other stances like Religion (Thesis) or Atheism (athesis)? Do you think that both Atheism and religion exhibit cult like behavior, requiring adherence to an explicit set of rules and ritualism to maintain it's membership?
'Sep 28 2012: I'm right there with you on this. Well put. I'm not big on using logic in debates regarding this topic because it sort of becomes nonsensical to me. It's pretty simple, one cannot know. Using logic to try and 'win' a debate on this --semantics aside -- is fruitless in my book. burden of proof is irrelevant at best.
I think a good take-away from these lively debates could be asking oneself -- for those debating from the atheistic or theistic sides -- 'am I debating from a context of having to be right?' 'what bias am I bringing into the equation, how open am I?'
Tim Powers
Sep 24 2012: Atheists do not have a "blind faith in science." They simply default to the Null Position of not believing in something for which there is insufficient evidence.
- +2
As for your claims that agnostics view atheists as cultists because they "... requires blind belief God does not exist which is dogmatic because there is no proof (currently)..." this sounds eerily like what creationists say about atheists, not agnostics.
Atheists don't need proof to NOT believe in something. An atheist doesn't need proof that the tooth fairy doesn't exist. He's not in an atoothfairiest cult. Someone who doesn't believe in big foot is not an asasquatch cultist.
The idea of agnostics being the inventors of creationism seems pretty absurd. That's like saying the NFL created baseball's designated hitter rule.
Sep 24 2012: Come on Tim. Man up and tell me what you really mean. I can see it in your message. I won't be offended. Are you aware that it takes, roughly the same amount of electrical energy to send a post as it does to move a 2000 lb. Vehicle 3 feet? Why so many words and welcome to TED. :)
Sep 24 2012: "Are you aware that it takes, roughly the same amount of electrical energy to send a post as it does to move a 2000 lb. Vehicle 3 feet?"
I've never heard that, so I guess I'm forced to take the null position unless and until I do some research on the matter. :)
I'm not sure why you think I'm not saying what I really mean? Care to elaborate?
Sep 25 2012: Tim. Unless you can create knowledge out of thin air, I guess your right. ;)
Or, you could google it.
Good joke Tim.... I like you already.
I see you just joined up?
I don't understand the statement about agnostics or creationism. What do you mean?
Tim, most of this question has already been answered by other commentors. You might try reading the whole conversation. There is a button box where you can select oldest first to traverse the discussion from start to finish. I feel you question will be appropriate answered.
I have heard from other commentators that the setup of this system sometimes allows the conversation to appear confusing.
Peter Law
Sep 23 2012: Hi John.
- +2
Good question.
As you probably know I would be considered as a Christian Fundamentalist on this site. However, looking at things analytically, I would say that we are really all Agnostic. We are all fallible humans; we all think we are right, but are all open to deluding ourselves, or just simply misunderstanding things.
I see a spectrum from Atheism to Fundamentalist, with guys like yourself in the centre. I came at this question seeking the truth of our existence, I studied the data & decided there had to be a designer. I studied the candidates & decided Jesus Christ was that designer. Changed my life. I assume Mr. Dawkins followed a similar path & decided Mr. Darwin had the right idea. We all decide for ourselves. Certainly many seem to be religious just for the sake of it, just like golf, or sailing; but to me that's a different issue.
So, if you consider Christianity to be a cult, then you should really consider Atheism one also. They are just different interpretations of the same data. I don't consider either to be a cult, but if it fills a need in some of us to reinforce a prejudice then I guess that's understandable.
Sep 23 2012: I moved from one side of the question to the other, before finally settling in the middle to avoid all the rocks and bottles. but some of them landed on my property and almost hit me in the head a few times, if you now what I'm talking about. :)
So Peter I assume you've at least examined the flagellum of bacteria and seen the super micrograph photos of them. They look amazingly just like a machine don't they.
It easy for folk to defend the idea of evolution creating an eyeball, etc but when you get to the real itty biddy parts of the bigger machine, they start to take on the appearance of some very fundamental machinery we find in the garage and tool shed.
We must admit, in front of the backdrop of genetic research that the possibility to create life is a promising proposal in the laboratory at some time in our future. Genomic researchers like our fellow Tedster: Dr. Gabriel Moreno-Hagelsieb Associate Professor, Biology, are bringing this information to our attention everyday. In Dr. Gabo's case, sometimes many times for days, with a peculiar type of insistence, that can sometimes put people off. :)
Sometimes super intelligence comes with a price tag but, if we want the research we have to pay for it, not always in money :)
Amazing stuff. Hence the tag in my profile of Super Alien Scientists.
However. In my minds creationism will have to evolve towards a scientific stance to support their logic because Science is being hijacked to allude to a God creature with the expectations of dropping all that creation stuff and falling back to their "True word of God = the King James Bible" as soon as they capture a majority of the voters.
So it's better to look at these things and develop some kind of rational flow of dialog, that offers others the opportunity to try and identify this race of aliens instead of giving the impression that God is the one and only creature with the capacity to create life which is distinct from creating all reality
Peter Law
Sep 24 2012: Hi John.
- +1
My training & career has been in mechanical engineering; most of my life has been involved in designing & building stuff. In the early days, when I looked at evolution, I was sort of persuaded, because it was to do with chemistry, about which I know zilch. However, thanks to electron microscopes we can see that this magical chemistry is really nano-engineering. The flagellum is just a little motor. I listened to a guy a while ago on about a part of the cell that seemed to act like a jet engine. He was interested in getting some effect, so he asked a jet engine guy how this could be achieved in a real jet. When he tried it in the cell, it did exactly as predicted.
There is nothing magical about engineering, it involves a lot of directed, intelligent, funded, effort. Nano engineering more so. The cat is out the bag, this universe is a precisely engineered mechanism; humans & all.
The majority of scientists down through the ages assumed a god of some sort. It is difficult to imagine such a uniform & predictable creation without a singular architect. This belief has never been a problem to doing science, & it isn't today. We can trust things to unfold in a predictable & orderly fashion.
The reason many creationists start from the bible, & work out wards is that it saves time. Like me, they have discovered that these 66 musty old books were authored by the same guy that created everything. They still have to do the science though, which they have been doing for hundreds of years. The only real contention is with evolution, the majority of scientific endeavour sails on regardless.
On the Super Alien Scientist front. This, of course, is a possibility, but we are still left with the question of where these guys come from, & what's the point in the whole shebang anyway ?
Sep 25 2012: OK I think some of these points have not been addressed.
Peter said:
"However, thanks to electron microscopes we can see that this magical chemistry is really nano-engineering."
No, it really IS just chemistry. For example, those pictures you see of flagellum are artists renderings made so we can visualize how it works. They're drawn to look like mechanical parts because their function is being described in terms of mechanical parts that most will understand. Actual photos from the e-scope are grainy and only show the general shape.
That some things in nature act and/or look like things that man can engineer means nothing.
"The cat is out the bag, this universe is a precisely engineered mechanism; humans & all."
There are many examples of humans being very poorly designed. If we are the product of a Designer, he's no Master Engineer. More like a second-year liberal arts major who attended one chemical engineering lecture because he had a crush on one of the TAs.
"The reason many creationists start from the bible, & work out wards is that it saves time."
No, it's because they start and stop with the Bible. Where science and the Bible conflict, they'll just ignore the science. For example, C-14 dating is called completely useless by young-earthers. But when c-14 dating is used to date a tunnel under Jerusalem to Hezekiah's time (Hezekiah's tunnel), then suddenly C-14 dating is accurate and reliable.


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The most valuable player in the world under the age of 21 is an Englishman.
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The state of Florida is stout enough financially to weather the federal government shutdown, at least in the short term, economic experts say.
But if a dysfunctional Congress fails to act decisively by Oct. 17 to prevent a fight over the nation's debt ceiling, "a return to recession would be a real possibility."
Those are the findings of a team of experts headed by Rick Harper, the senior policy adviser on economic affairs for state Senate President Don Gaetz.
Harper's group prepared reports on the specific impact of the federal government shutdown and an overall risk assessment. The findings will be revisited as the crisis in the nation's capital plays out, Gaetz said.
Economic impact on Florida (subject to change). >>
Preliminary assessment of risks. >>
Gaetz credited good financial management and "laying aside money when the temptation is to spend" with helping to shelter Florida from the most recent impasse in Washington, D.C.
"The good news for now is the state has reserves that are very healthy and the best bond ratings we can have," Gaetz said. "Good stewardship at the state level, in contrast to our friends in Washington, now gives us benefits."
There are 132,595 federal jobs in Florida. Harper estimated one-third "of the non-postal civilian workforce," or roughly 32,900, will be affected by furlough.
At Eglin Air Force Base and Hurlburt Field alone, more than 3,750 people were sent home from work on Tuesday, accounting for more than 11 percent of the state's total.
If history is an indicator, the government shutdown won't last long, and those laid off will be reimbursed "in a lump sum after this is over," Harper said.
Based on that, his team predicted the shutdown has the "potential to modestly reduce economic growth in the short-run, most likely by delaying or slowing down growth that would later return."
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Furloughs to civilian Department of Defense employees could "disproportionately impact" areas such as Fort Walton Beach, Pensacola and Panama City, Harper said.
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The 2014 NATO Summit closed on Friday with one main accomplishment: the increased militarization and institutionalization of a new Cold War.
A memo to Angela Merkel from Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity.
US fallacies may be leading to war with Russia.
As world leaders fail to end the bloodletting in Gaza, it is up to civil society to demand justice for Palestinians.
To understand the present crisis over downed Malaysian flight MH17, we need to look at the roots of the new Cold War.
The old left sneers at the recently elected Matteo Renzi. But he's already carried out undeniably redistributive measures during his brief tenure.
The regime has repeatedly carried out artillery and air attacks on city centers, creating a humanitarian catastrophe—which is all but ignored by the US political-media establishment.
The conviction of three Al Jazeera journalists yesterday underscored the hypocrisy of US support for Egypt's General Abdel-Fattah el-Sissi.
Members of Modi's Bharitaya Janata Party have demonstrated their power to oppresss Muslims, wade into censorship and police the arts.
The Hindu nationalist ran on a platform of "good governance." What will happen now that he's won?


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Over the course of one hot post-graduate summer, Hannah falls precariously in and out of love. A breaker of hearts and chronically dissatisfied, she finds herself drifting away from her newly unemployed boyfriend and drawn to two of her co-workers, Matt and Paul. "Hannah Takes the Stairs" is a delicate look at friendship, ambition, and the pursuit of happiness.
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The Nissan Juke with Ministry of Sound limited edition that is the ultimate jukebox
Nissan has teamed up with London super club The Ministry of Sound to create a limited-edition version of the Nissan Juke that comes packed with speakers and a dedicated playlist to get the party started.
The limited run of 3,000 cars will go on sale later this year transforming a standard family car into something more suited for clubbers looking to feel their tunes.
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Sadly however it doesn't appear the speaker is included in the models that will be on sale, but then, hey, if they were, where would you put your shopping?


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I would like to create some denim jeans type texture, specifically on the Marvel select Avengers Hulk.
Sculpting at the pants would increase the bulk quite a bit and thus reduce articulation. Are there ways to put some texture on it?
eg some painting techniques etc?
Any help or suggestions appreciated


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This resource explores in detail the rich differences and surprising similarities of cultures outside the United States to those within the United States. Topics range from dating customs within a particular country to an overview of leisure time activities and other contemporary culture related topics.
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Stories from people who were children during World War II and the objects in this exhibit animate the past and inform us of a time when war took over daily life. "Retrospect is a very interesting thing," says Ruthie Kallnder. "At the time I don't recall any of the information we got as being propaganda," but the government tried to influence children to make "necessary" sacrifices. Propagandists made the war a battle between good and evil, democracy and fascism. They also asked children to share in the war effort. In response, many children took on more responsibilities. Ruthie explains that boys and girls felt "if that's what it was going to take" to win they "were willing to do it." The memories of the people in this exhibit and their wartime actions show the power of propaganda's messages and its lasting affect on their lives. Propaganda posters, children's books, and classroom assignments demonstrate how propagandists reached children and involved them in the national war effort.
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Delfina Bookcase
A thoughtful mix of detail and simplicity gives our hardworking collection its versatile appeal, while the heavily distressed vintage white finish replicates the warmth and patina of a much-loved antique.
- Crafted of kiln-dried hardwood with fine veneers
- Features 3 adjustable shelves that accomodate our shelf storage
- Includes glides and adjustable levelers on feet
- Vintage white finish is heavily distressed to replicate the aged look of an antique
- This item is handcrafted with meticulous care. Given its hand-finished nature and natural variations in the wood grain, each item is unique and no two will be exactly alike.
- Furniture Tip Restraint included
- Wipe with a soft, dry cloth. Avoid direct sunlight and heat to protect the finish.
Delfina Bookcase
- Overall: 34"W x 14½"D x 62"H
- Shelf: 30½"W x 13½"D
- Weight: 47 lbs.
Delfina Bookcase
Wood Swatch - Distressed Vintage White


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- Consumer Tip of the Day
- At Home and in the Garden
- On the Go
- At Work
- At School
- In the Community
- How Do I Recycle My...
Learn about Hazardous Waste in Your Community
How to Set Up a Local Program to Recycle Used Oil (PDF) (38pp, 748.7k, about PDF)
Explains the organization, design, implementation, and promotion of a used oil program. Appendices include sample brochures and letters.
Household Hazardous Waste Management: A Manual for One-Day Community Collection Programs
Helps communities plan for one-day, household hazardous waste (HHW) drop-off/collection programs. Provides community leaders with guidance on all aspects of planning, organizing, and publicizing a HHW collection program.


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Disability Awareness Week Features Theater of the Blind Troupe
Student Disability Services in Academic Planning and Support Services (APSS) will celebrate diversity at St. Edward's during Disability Awareness Week, April 16–20. Campuswide events will provide information about disabilities and educate the campus community. Two events guaranteed to draw attention will be a "Flash Awareness Event" and the production of "Don Quixote" performed by the Theater of the Blind Troupe consisting of 11 St. Edward's students and two alumni, a student project managed by Brown Scholar Samantha Cook '12.
This year, Disability Awareness Week is a true reflection of collaboration across the St. Edward's community. When Catherine MacDermott, professor in the School of Management and Business, and faculty member for the Business Living Learning Community (LLC), heard about the Theater of the Blind project, she thought it would provide a great service opportunity for her LLC students.
The students helped develop some of the sound effects for the show. They also conducted research on disabilities, visited with campus offices to discuss their findings and promoted "Don Quixote." They're each completing a total of 12 service hours on the project. View a teaser trailer of the production.
"This form of media can be used to create equality in theater, with casting based on voice instead of weight, ethnicity, or physical or mental ability," Cook said. To stay true to this idea, Cook and the rest of the crew were blindfolded during auditions and callbacks, seeing the actors for the first time at the read-through after casting.
Furthering the collaboration, Roel Martinez, academic counselor and advisor to the Business LLC, introduced the idea of including the Theater of the Blind to Kendall Swanson, director of SDS. Swanson invited Cook to join the campuswide committee for Disability Awareness Week. The committee also includes representatives from The Health & Counseling Center, Dean of Students, and APSS. When Cook joined the committee, she brought the student perspective necessary to fully incorporate faculty, staff and students.
Get Involved in Disability Awareness Week
April 16–20: Be on the lookout for Disability Awareness Week posters featuring different types of disabilities that are accommodated through SDS. Disability counselors will also be available in the Ragsdale Center April 17–19 to offer assistance and answer questions.
April 18 at 11:55 a.m., "Flash Awareness Event:" Students, faculty and staff members across campus will "flash" informative signs around campus that highlight services and student experiences, such as: "1 in 13 students at St. Edward's utilize Student Disability Services." Some St. Edward's professors are offering extra credit for their students to participate in this event. Student leaders such as Student Orientation Leaders and Health & Counseling Peer Educators will participate, and others are encouraged to join. If you would like to get involved, please contact Dana Mazur with APSS.
April 13–22, "Don Quixote:" Theater of the Blind: For this special experience, the audience is blindfolded and led into the performance space, and they remain blindfolded as the action takes place all around them — similar to a surround sound radio show. The program is designed to raise awareness of sightlessness.
Because of its unique methodology, this production can only seat 62 people per show in order to allow the full experience for all audience members. To Cook's knowledge, this style of theater has only been produced twice before — in Argentina and Scotland.
The production will be at 7:30 p.m. April 13, 14, 15, 16, 19, and at 2 p.m. April 21 and noon April 22 in Mabee Ballroom A in the Robert and Pearle Ragsdale Center at St. Edward's University. Tickets are $4, but additional donations are encouraged. The profits from the show will be donated to the Texas School for the Blind and Visually Impaired theater department. Cook hopes to raise more than $1,000. To reserve tickets, email Samantha Cook.
By attending and participating in these events, you can show support and help prevent prejudice and discrimination against people with disabilities. If you need information about SDS, contact Kendall Swanson or Candice Vasquez.


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Our hotel staff are at your service during your stay in Paris. Our multilingual team are there to help you and to cater for all your needs whatever the time of day or night.
The rooms
- Flatscreen digital TV and DVD player, unlimited wifi access, ipod speakers, safety deposit box, minibar, hairdryer, air-conditioning, room service 24 hours a day, complimentary Molton & Brown toiletries...
- Room adapted for the disabled
- Room service available 24 hours a day
Concierge service
If you wish to book a taxi, a transfer to the station or airport, a restaurant or a show, our hotel staff are at your service to ensure you enjoy a memorable stay in Paris.
Also available on request: laundry service, massages and beauty treatments, baby equipment (cot, changing table...), babysitting, sports coach, personal shopper, private car, electric scooter...
Our reception staff offer a first class service and pay attention to detail.
Meeting room
The hotel has a meeting room for your business meetings or cocktails for a small number of people (15 people maximum).
Nearby :
The Sèvres-Babylone car park is easily accessible from the Boulevard Raspail, rue de Babylone and rue Velpeau.
Domestic animals are welcome.


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Ask Slashdot: Little Boxes Around the Edge of the Data Center? 320 320
Posted by timothy
from the gee-look-at-all-the-little-black-dots dept.
from the gee-look-at-all-the-little-black-dots dept.
First time accepted submitter spaceyhackerlady writes "We're looking at some new development, and a big question mark is the little boxes around the edge of the data center — the NTP servers, the monitoring boxes, the stuff that supports and interfaces with the Big Iron that does the real work. The last time I visited a hosting farm I saw shelves of Mac Minis, but that was five years ago. What do people like now for their little support boxes?"


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Carolina Herrera Bride Barbie® Doll
Carolina Herrera Bride Barbie® doll wears an elegant gown, perfect for the most romantic wedding. The beautiful, beaded gown features ecru corded lace. The bodice is crisscrossed with satin-edged organza ribbon. The lovely veil of off-white tulle is edged with lace and embellished with faux pearls. Pretty blue ribbons decorate the shoes. A white rose bouquet and earrings complete this bridal beauty.
Carolina Herrera™ is a protected trademark of B.E.M. Enterprise, Ltd. and is hereby used under license.
For the adult collector.
Production doll may vary from the photo shown above. Mattel reserves the right to modify the fashion/fabrics, sculpt, hair color/style, and accessories. Doll cannot stand alone as shown.


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Skip to Section Subnavigation Skip to Page Content
For first-year and transfer students.
Associate and bachelor's degree programs for men and women 4 full years out of high school.
Elementary, middle level and secondary certification for men and women with a bachelor's degree.
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Wilson graduate Sami Winkler '09 recently earned a Master of Research degree in primate biology, behavior and conservation from the University of Roehampton in London. She plans to use her degree to educate the public about the importance of conservation.
"Conservation of primates is important because many are endangered, soon to be endangered or soon to be extinct," said Sami, who hopes to work at a zoo one day.
While she looks for a job in her field, Sami — who completed her master's degree in September but will return to London for graduation in March — is currently working in her hometown of Chambersburg. She volunteers at East Coast Exotic Animal Rescue in Fairfield and recently applied for a job as a primate keeper at the Smithsonian Institute's National Zoological Park in Washington, D.C.
Sami has loved animals since she was a child. As a teen, her role model was British anthropologist Jane Goodall. When she learned she could have a career studying primates, Sami set her sights on it. And while studying in London, Sami actually got to meet Goodall at a school lecture.
Sami graduated from Wilson College in 2009 with a Bachelor of Science degree in psychology. "Ultimately, I wanted to work with animals, specifically non-human primates such as monkeys and apes," she said. "I was most interested in their behavior."
Sami credits Wilson College for giving her the confidence to succeed in graduate school and beyond. "Wilson made me a more independent thinker," she said. "The experience pushes you to stand out in the crowd and voice your opinion. Professors push you to your limit. The experience set me up for studying in another country and having the confidence to succeed."


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Times 'Times+ member' by CHI & Partners
The Times is pushing its Times+ membership, the rewards programme for subscribers, in digital and print ads created by CHI & Partners.
Photographs, taken by Hamish Brown, are set on a backdrop of art detailing each member's connection with the Times newspapers and the Times+ service.
Behind-the-scenes and "making of" footage will be available on the Times website, Facebook and YouTube.
The Times+ campaign is also being supported online on the Times and Sunday Times sites and by ads on both iPad editions.


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A piece on American Thinker points to the fact that Valerie Jarrett, an WH staff member has a Secret Service contingent of SIX around the clock, that follow her shopping, hobnobbing around DC, and even on vacation. Even cabinet members do not get six SS fellas protecting them.
Yet the ambassador to Libya, during a chaotic, dangerous transition period, got only TWO security personnel, and even those two seemed to have gone AWOL when the chips were down.


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I'm working on a utility to find objects that exist in a
custom/emergency fix library that would have a create date *LT the
create date of the object in the standard library, thus sign of an
issue. Utility done, working.
However, I found a scenario where we received a new object (*prtf) for
an upgrade. Because we change some print attributes on a few of these,
we place a copy of these prtf file objects in the fix library.
The upgrade is done, replacing the objects in the standard library.
Here's the issue.
The prtf object in the fix library was created with crtdupobj, prior
to the upgrade being done.
Creation date/time . . . . . . . . . : 08/15/11 10:41:44
The prtf object in the standard library has a create date for the day
of the upgrade.
Creation date/time . . . . . . . . . : 08/28/11 10:49:35
The objects are valid, but being flagged because of the create date
issue. I'm looking for some other field on the object, not finding
Many of our upgrade processes do this. The upgrade process does a
CRTDUPOBJ, thus the object loses its original info, (create date,
created by user)
This mailing list archive is Copyright 1997-2015 by MIDRANGE dot COM and David Gibbs as a compilation work. Use of the archive is restricted to research of a business or technical nature. Any other uses are prohibited. Full details are available here. If you have questions about this, please contact


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Leaving No Trace
Recreation always disturbs natural conditions. From soil erosion caused by heavily used trails to vegetation losses at backcountry campsites, the ongoing challenge facing DNR resource managers is how to provide recreation opportunities while protecting the aesthetic and ecological functions of natural areas from overuse.
One of the most important means of minimizing these impacts is by educating visitors on Leave No Trace (LNT) ethics. Please be sure that you are skilled in employing these techniques and educating your traveling companions on their importance to protecting the environment. By doing so, we can ensure that visitors will continue to enjoy areas maintained in a healthy, natural state.
Adventure-based recreation continues to be the leading trend, both regionally and nationally, in outdoor recreation. Check out our self-guided recreational opportunities available on Maryland's public lands for the novice to experienced enthusiast, as well as the family with young children.
Below are a few examples of LNT ethics that you can employ while visiting Maryland's public lands.
Younger visitors can check out the Leave No Trace website for kids.
- Minimize activity to approximately 12 participants to reduce potential adverse impacts of larger groups. Make sure everyone in your group picks up litter and leaves the area cleaner that you found it.
- If possible, select a site for the activity that is under-visited and managed properly. Consult the Department of Natural Resources land manager to avoid sensitive areas or seasons that cannot sustain visitor use.
- Travel single file on trails to avoid widening the trail or making new ones. Do not "pioneer" new campsites in areas where use is restricted to designated sites. Concentrating use -- except in very lightly used, pristine areas -- is necessary to minimize vegetation loss and soil compaction and erosion.
- Dispose of human waste properly. Use the cathole method. Check with the Department of Natural Resources land manager on available facilities or any restrictions on human waste disposal. Some highly sensitive areas along waterways require that all human waste be packed out. Please be sure you have the equipment and skills necessary to comply with these protections to the environment.
- Report trail damage or other environmental impacts that may need corrective management attention to the responsible Department of Natural Resources land manager. Volunteer for trail stewardship management projects. Help keep your natural resources attractive, healthy and available for future use.
A complete guide to Leave No Trace -- Outdoor Skills and Ethics:
- Plan Ahead and Prepare
- Travel and Camp on Durable Surfaces
- Dispose of Waste Properly
- Leave What You Find
- Minimize Campfire Impacts
- Respect Wildlife
- Be Considerate of Other Visitors
is available from Leave No Trace, a national program that promotes responsible outdoor recreation. Leave No Trace curriculum and wilderness skills training courses are taught through a partnership with the National Outdoor Leadership School. Visit the Leave No Trace website at www.lnt.org or contact them for additional information at 1-800-332-4100.
Contact the Park Service
- Toll Free: 1-800-830-3974
(Annapolis Office)
- Reservations: 1-888-432-2267
- Park Watch: 1-800-825-7275
- Email Us
Find A Park
Our Mission
The mission of the Maryland Park Service is to manage the natural, cultural, historical and recreational resources to provide the best use for the benefit of people.


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Sports Illustrated™ Swimsuit Barbie® Doll
Barbie® made quite a splash at her March 9,1959 premiere. Sporting her trademark blonde ponytail and eye-popping black and white bathing suit, she is "`the doll that started it all." Always a snapshot of style in-the-moment, Barbie® gives girls of all ages a guide to glam, a license to dream, and a way to make a personal fashion statement.
Now, Sports Illustrated celebrates the iconic status of Barbie® and her zebra-striped suit in their 50th Anniversary "Legends" issue. Barbie® poses in her original 1959 "original fashion model" suit and other iconic bathing suits, culminating in this 2014 reinterpretation of one of her all-time most famous looks! From her very first Malibu maillot to this updated Hollywood halter, Barbie® remains always in the swim!
Doll Details
|Body Type:
|Skin Tone:
|Facial Sculpt:
|Fashion Sewn On?:
Included with doll:
Shoes, earrings, cuff bracelet, sunglasses.
Limit one doll per order.
SPORTS ILLUSTRATED is a trademark of Time Inc. Used under license.
For ages 6 and over.
Production doll may vary from the photo shown above. Mattel reserves the right to modify the fashion/fabrics, sculpt, hair color/style, and accessories. Doll cannot stand alone as shown.


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For those interested, I have updated the Exposure Northwest website with most of next years workshops. For more information please visit exposurenorthwest.wordpress.com/ or shoot me an email for more detailed information.
I HAVE HAD 7 PEOPLE ASK TO BUY THIS IMAGE THROUGH 500PX TODAY. IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO INQUIRE ABOUT THIS IMAGE OR ANY OTHER, PLEASE CONTACT ME DIRECTLY THROUGH MY WEBSITE. I DO NOT OFFER MY WORK AS $2 DOWNLOADS THROUGH 500PX AND NEVER WILL. Thank you for your interest just the same!
All images are copyrighted by Aaron Reed. Do NOT use my images on blogs, personal or professional websites, or any other digital media without my explicit permission.


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MindFreakOnALeashBlakelyRachelle's blog
lmfao, some people and their stupid fucking hate mail XD haha!!
i dont care if jonathan starts singing opra, i'd still listen to it :)
What? no, not you, YOU! no, not you either, jeez. yes, YOU, with the face! NO! Not you! Oh, never mind...... ;P
i was getting really into the path of totality album, so i checked out some skrillex, and fell in love. then i went to youtube to check out killbot sound surgery. not at all what i was expecting. lol, don't judge a book by it's cover. by the looks of that robot, i was expecting a darker, murderous, more heavy bass undertone, and mabee some of jon's insane growling rapp. but i got more of an...
korn came to my house!! (in my dream) well, first thing i remember in my dream, we were on a field-trip to some sort of cave- swimming hole. i dunno, it was like a river, with a road running along side it, and trees, but their was a roof, and walls? slimy walls, like a cave. well anyways i was there, and my mom was having parking issues. (she ended up parking on a hill in the trees... i dont...
for their creative ever changing open-mindedness, dealing with all of peoples criticism, and still inventing music that speaks to the soul, every time. Keep it up guys!!
hope you all have a great day today!
ok, i was thinking about getting my first tatoo, and i want it to be KoRn with the lyrics of one of their songs filling the letters, and a desighn around the outside, and i want to get it on my lower back. but that would be classified as a 'tramp stamp' and i am definitley NOT a tramp.... but then again, does it matter what anybody thinks?
well, i love to sing, especially KoRn songs, but i am very 'soft-spoken', (in other words, my voice sounds like a little kindegardeners XD), and it doesn't help that im a girl, so when i sing it sounds really weak. any suggestions?
just curious.... please and thanku :)


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Action/Adventure, Comedy
In the dark underbelly of Mumbai City a nihilistic new leader has risen to rule the fetid underworld. His name is Babban Singh. Cruel beyond imagination, psychotically violent and far more devious than any gangster the city has ever known, Babban perceives other human beings as objects to amuse or occupy him with. Nobody has ever seen Babban and if they did, they didn't survive to tell the tale. But one man believed in his existence. And that is inspector Narsimha, an encounter specialist who has a single-minded determination to finish Babban.
Rated No Rating .
Visit the official site
Cast: Amitabh Bachchan, Mohanlal, Ajay Devgan, Nisha Kothari, Prashant Raj
Produced by: Prabhuraj
Directed by: Ram Gopal Varma
Written by: Javed Akhtar, Salim Khan
Running time: 2hr 43min
Opens: Aug 31, 2007 Limited


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Have you tried any of the mods through Steam Workshop yet?
I never bothered with them before as I wasn't too keen on some of the stuff on 'Nexus' and it seemed like a lot of faffing about for someone like me who doesn't know much about computers and installing/changing files. However, with Steam's versions just require one click and are automatically updated as they go along.


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Every ket has a dual bra, written as . For example, the bra corresponding to the ket above would be the row vector
This is a continuous linear functional from to the complex numbers , defined by:
where denotes the inner product defined on the Hilbert space. Here an advantage of the bra-ket notation becomes clear: when we drop the parentheses (as is common with linear functionals) and meld the bars together we get , which is common notation for an inner product in a Hilbert space. This combination of a bra with a ket to form a complex number is called a bra-ket or bracket.
The bra is simply the conjugate transpose (also called the Hermitian conjugate) of the ket and vice versa. The notation is justified by the Riesz representation theorem, which states that a Hilbert space and its dual space are isometrically conjugate isomorphic. Thus, each bra corresponds to exactly one ket, and vice versa. More precisely, if is the Riesz isomorphism between and its dual space, then
Note that this only applies to states that are actually vectors in the Hilbert space. Non-normalizable states, such as those whose wavefunctions are Dirac delta functions or infinite plane waves, do not technically belong to the Hilbert space. So if such a state is written as a ket, it will not have a corresponding bra according to the above definition. This problem can be dealt with in either of two ways. First, since all physical quantum states are normalizable, one can carefully avoid non-normalizable states. Alternatively, the underlying theory can be modified and generalized to accommodate such states, as in the Gelfand-Naimark-Segal construction or rigged Hilbert spaces. In fact, physicists routinely use bra-ket notation for non-normalizable states, taking the second approach either implicitly or explicitly.
In quantum mechanics the expression (mathematically: the coefficient for the projection of onto ) is typically interpreted as the probability amplitude for the state to collapse into the state
Bra-ket notation can be used even if the vector space is not a Hilbert space. In any Banach space B, the vectors may be notated by kets and the continuous linear functionals by bras. Over any vector space without topology, we may also notate the vectors by kets and the linear functionals by bras. In these more general contexts, the bracket does not have the meaning of an inner product, because the Riesz representation theorem does not apply.
Operators can also be viewed as acting on bras from the right hand side. Composing the bra with the operator A results in the bra , defined as a linear functional on H by the rule
This expression is commonly written as
If the same state vector appears on both bra and ket side, this expression gives the expectation value, or mean or average value, of the observable represented by operator A for the physical system in the state , written as
A convenient way to define linear operators on H is given by the outer product: if is a bra and is a ket, the outer product
denotes the rank-one operator that maps the ket to the ket (where is a scalar multiplying the vector ). One of the uses of the outer product is to construct projection operators. Given a ket of norm 1, the orthogonal projection onto the subspace spanned by is
Just as kets and bras can be transformed into each other (making into ) the element from the dual space corresponding with is where A† denotes the Hermitian conjugate of the operator A.
It is usually taken as a postulate or axiom of quantum mechanics, that any operator corresponding to an observable quantity (shortly called observable) is self-adjoint, that is, it satisfies A† = A. Then the identity
These rules are sufficient to formally write the Hermitian conjugate of any such expression; some examples are as follows:
If is a ket in V and is a ket in W, the direct product of the two kets is a ket in . This is written variously as
For instance, the Hilbert space of a zero-spin point particle is spanned by a position basis , where the label x extends over the set of position vectors. Starting from any ket in this Hilbert space, we can define a complex scalar function of x, known as a wavefunction:
It is then customary to define linear operators acting on wavefunctions in terms of linear operators acting on kets, by
For instance, the momentum operator p has the following form:
One occasionally encounters an expression like
This is something of an abuse of notation, though a fairly common one. The differential operator must be understood to be an abstract operator, acting on kets, that has the effect of differentiating wavefunctions once the expression is projected into the position basis:
For further details, see rigged Hilbert space.
Consider a complete orthonormal system (basis), , for a Hilbert space H, with respect to the norm from an inner product . From basic functional analysis we know that any ket can be written as
In quantum mechanics it often occurs that little or no information about the inner product of two arbitrary (state) kets is present, while it is possible to say something about the expansion coefficients and of those vectors with respect to a chosen (orthonormalized) basis. In this case it is particularly useful to insert the unit operator into the bracket one time or more.
Let be a Hilbert space and . What physicists would denote as is the vector itself. That is
Let be the dual space of . This is the space of linear functionals on . The isomorphism is defined by where for all we have
One ignores the parentheses and removes the double bars. Some properties of this notation are convenient since we are dealing with linear operators and composition acts like a ring multiplication.


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Tendinopathy describes two conditions that are likely to occur
together: tendon inflammation, known as tendinitis, and tiny tears in the
connective tissue in or around the tendon, known as tendinosis. Tendons are the
tough, ropey fibers that connect muscles to bones.
Tendon injuries can develop in many different parts of the body.
Any activity that requires repeated twisting or rapid joint movements, such as
certain sports or jobs, can cause a tendon injury. Aging can also be a factor,
as the wear and tear that occurs to tendons over time can also make them
vulnerable to injury.
Common symptoms of tendon injury include pain, tenderness, and
decreased strength and movement in the affected area.
Home treatment for tendinopathy includes rest, ice, and pain
medicine. Weeks to months of rest from any activity that makes the condition
worse may be needed to allow the tendon to heal. The amount of rest needed
depends on how bad the injury is.
Last Revised:
December 6, 2010
Healthwise Staff
Medical Review:
William H. Blahd, Jr., MD, FACEP - Emergency Medicine & Kenneth J. Koval, MD - Orthopedic Surgery, Orthopedic Trauma
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