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Lie Down in the Darkness, Rise up from the Ash: 9. The Road Goes Ever On
From the eaves of the woods came toiling three figures in the late light of the day: Aragorn, Gimli, and Legolas walked slowly, burdened as they were by the body of their friend. Elf and Dwarf each had a grip on one side of the rough bier, while Aragorn supported the front end alone.
Gimli had argued somewhat over Legolas's participation, for despite his earlier words, it was clear that the Elf was in pain. But Legolas would not be gainsaid, and Aragorn, sensing that further talk over this matter would only lead to ill-feeling, had suggested the compromise. "For though we would not slight Boromir's memory, we have much need of haste," he argued. "Come, take the left side, Legolas, and Gimli stand to the right. There!"
So they had settled the issue, and now emerged from the shadowed woods onto the open bank and none could forbear to hold his breath, anticipating the worst, afraid to hope for good news lest they be dreadfully disappointed.
When they had come to their camp site, the companions gently set the bier down and gazed about. Aragorn stood silent an instant, following the hobbit prints with his eyes, remarking the scrapes that indicated the sliding passage of a hull into the water. Of a sudden, he strode swiftly to the remaining boats, glancing first at the baggage and then peering into the little craft. After a brief moment, to the surprise of his friends, he began to laugh softly, and there was in the quality of that laughter relief that bordered on pain, so deep did it cut.
"What is it?" Legolas called, for neither he nor Gimli were willing to risk marring any useful marks before Aragorn had had a chance to read them: they stood still by Boromir, leaving clear the slight depression where lay their gear. For answer, Aragorn grabbed the prow of one of the boats and tipped it to starboard, exposing the keel. Elf and Dwarf stared for a moment, then exchanged a look of profound, almost wearying, satisfaction as they saw the rents in the bottom.
"One would say that they wished to be certain we could not follow them!" Legolas laughed.
"Neither we, nor any other, less well-intentioned hunters. Frodo kept his wits about him, which gives me hope." The Ranger sighed softly, raising eyes noticeably brighter to gaze at his companions. "Well, they have crossed the river after all! For that at least, we may say that Boromir did not die in vain."
"What shall we do now, though? We have not the time to build a cairn," Gimli asked. "What is the custom of Gondor in such circumstances as these?"
"Were he in Minas Tirith, he would go to lie with his ancestors in the Houses of the Dead," Aragorn replied, and shook his head. "Else, the Gondorrim bury their fallen comrades together upon the field."
"But we have no shovels," Legolas frowned.
For a time, all three stood silent, considering the problem, but finally, Aragorn gave a soft grunt and sighed. "I can think of but one thing to do," he said reluctantly, seeming as one who likes not what need brings. "We have not the time to fell a tree for wood, but the boats will provide both setting and fuel. I would not have it thus, but that we have no other choice and I think Boromir would not wish us to tarry o'erlong on his behalf. At least there is a precedent: in the earliest days of the Third Age, after the Dagorlad, the dead lay hip deep in places. Rather than let time and the carrion beasts wreak their havoc, the survivors burned the bodies and scattered the ashes over the battlefield."
Legolas grimaced in distaste and Gimli, too, seemed unhappy with this solution, but neither spoke, for it was clear that there was nothing else that they could do. Aragorn glanced from one to the other, seeming to want to be certain that they were in agreement, ere he continued, "Before we send Boromir to his final rest, though, let us put all in readiness to depart. And I would see to you, Legolas, as well."
So, while Gimli hauled their baggage away from the boats and began to sort through their belongings, Aragorn took Legolas aside to tend to the other's injury. The mark showed dark and ugly against the Elf's pale skin, but he did not flinch as the Ranger examined him carefully. The arrow had opened a long gash down Legolas's back that ran over his shoulder blade and skittered at the end as the head had deflected off the quiver. Although no bone showed through the wound, Aragorn frowned, for such an injury, though not serious, would be slow to heal.
At least I see no sign of poison, Aragorn thought. And there has been time enough for all but the most sophisticated of them to show, so I shall not now worry over that at least! Aloud, he said, "Fortune walks with you, son of Thranduil, for the wound is clean and, given time and rest, should heal well enough."
"But? Come, Aragorn, tell me all! For your voice holds some reservation, and an Elf's ears are not easily deceived," Legolas prompted, turning his head to watch the other out of the corners of his eyes.
"But," Aragorn paused, acknowledging the other's perception, "a wound like this may not close quickly because of where it lies. Walking or running, the muscle beneath it will contract and break any stitches I might set; even breathing, if labored, may be enough to open the injury. And then there is the matter of straps and quivers. You would do well to move the latter to your hip, and Gimli and I will take as much of your baggage as we are able. In the mean time, I will do what I can, but I fear that until we reach a place of safety, where you may rest, this will give you trouble. Unless you remain behind…."
"Nay, I shall not!" Legolas replied firmly, laying to rest any hopes Aragorn might have entertained.
"Then be sure to tell us when your pain grows too great," the Ranger responded, rising. He took a few swift strides to where Gimli knelt, sifting the contents of their gear, and after a moment's surveillance, reached unerringly for a dark, well-worn sack that nestled among his belongings. Returning to the Elf's side, he took from it a small jar, a set of clean bandages, and a small vial. There came the sound of water splashing on the sandy ground, as Aragorn quickly washed the grime from his hands. Then Legolas hissed as the Ranger began to clean the wound.
"Time is short, and I fear I used the last of the athelas that I had tending to Sam after Moria," the Ranger said by way of apology. "But shadur will serve as well, though less gently! Deep in Harad, where fresh water is scarce and precious, and heat kills, they crush the chidah leaf and ferment the liquid. This they then use to cleanse wounds. One cannot drink it, 'tis so strong – the Haradrim value it for its medicinal use alone, and it is not difficult in the north to make something near to it for the same purposes."
"I thought that Harad was barren desert," the Elf said, surprised, welcoming the distraction of conversation.
"It depends upon the province. Many are very dry. But the chidah is a water-heavy plant, and there are many small seas scattered throughout Harad where it will grow, though I suppose 'lake' or even 'pond' might be a better word for such seas. They are as wells that lie too close to the surface of the earth, and so seep from the ground to form long, shallow pools. Oft one can tell somewhat of the soil to look at them, or to taste the water.
"The Haradrim hold such places dear, and say that different waters are cure different ills, much as we use different herbs for different maladies." The Ranger paused and set aside the vial, picking up the jar of salve instead. Gently, but swiftly nonetheless, he began to smear the clear, viscous stuff over the cut. "A fascinating place, Harad, but one I was glad to leave behind. I fear that this will be a nightly chore, Legolas," he added, winding clean bandages around the Elf's torso and then up cross-wise over his shoulder.
"So long as I am able to run the next day, I shall endure it," the elven prince replied easily enough, shrugging carefully to test the bandaging as he stood and snatched his tunic from the ground to examine the blood-stained tear in the fabric. With a slight grimace, the Elf folded it neatly and went to put it away, hunting through the piles that Gimli had made of his gear for a good minute ere he found what he needed. Whatever the salve that Aragorn had used, it seemed to have more properties than the Ranger had told, for Legolas felt the pain fade to an odd numbness as he pulled a fresh tunic on over his head.
Alas, without its distraction, other pains prick the sharper, the Elf thought, throwing his cloak about his shoulders and fastening the broach as he turned to stare at the bier, where Aragorn now knelt. He felt another presence at his side, and glanced down to where Gimli stood, gazing with no small concern at their human friends.
But after a moment, the Dwarf laid a hand on his arm, suggesting with that touch that they leave the Ranger what privacy they could. Legolas followed the other's lead, turning away. And while he waited, he took advantage of the moment to try to reconcile himself with what must come next. He knew well whereof Aragorn spoke, for there were among his father's people many who remembered the Dagorlad, but he could find no comfort in the idea of committing a dear friend to the fire. That Aragorn seemed troubled as well only unsettled him further, but there truly was no other choice, and the Elf grieved silently.
For we failed him, Gimli and I. We failed both of them: Aragorn no less than Boromir. I should have trusted Gimli's judgment better, and spoken with Aragorn ere we left Lothlórien. Alas, we shall never know now what might have been, had I done so! Behind him, he heard a soft sigh, and then Aragorn's voice, low and taut, reached him: "It is time. Gimli, if you would…."
With a nod, Gimli assented to the half-spoken request, and went to the Ranger's side. Stooping, the pair lifted the bier once more, and Man and Dwarf bore it to the boats. Carefully, they laid their fallen companion within one, and Legolas glided over to join them. He and Gimli stood silently, uncertain of themselves for neither were familiar with southern custom, or with that of Aragorn's people.
And so they said nothing, watching as Aragorn knelt once more to remove the great horn that Boromir kept ever at his side. Slinging it over one shoulder, he said, "If it be my fate and luck, I would return this to his family, for ere the Stewards ruled Gondor, this horn was a mark of their line. And I will do all I can to honor my promise, Boromir. Fare you well!"
With that he stood, and beckoning once more to Gimli, went to the other boat, which they hefted and set as a cover over the first, forming almost a coffin. A moment they stood still, while Gimli fumbled in his pouch for his tinderbox. No torch had they, but the boats caught quickly, and the flames began to lick along the edges, spreading with a marvelous swiftness to consume all. Dwarf and Man bowed their heads, though after but a brief space, Aragorn raised his eyes again, seeming unable to bear to look away.
For his part, Legolas found himself struck by an almost physical awe and horror, the like of which he had never before felt, and he staggered back, grasping blindly for his companions in a most unusual fit of discomposure, as the world seemed to dim before his eyes.
He felt Gimli catch his arm on one side, and Aragorn braced his shoulders from the other as the three of them retreated from the heat of the blaze. Distance did little to calm his chaotic emotions, but at least the movement and the feel of the others at his side bolstered him. Still, when he spoke, his words came in Sindarin, for it seemed Westron had abandoned him. At his side, he heard Aragorn translating, as if by rote habit, and their words blended with the roar of the flames:
"So even with Fëanor was it, that to ash all returns when the spirit is fled!"
Pippin woke in pain, and such was the noisome assault upon his senses that he retched violently. Perhaps fortunately, he had nothing in his stomach to vomit, for he doubted that the orc that carried him would have appreciated that overt sign of his discomfort. His head throbbed in time to the jarring strides, and he felt as though his arms were being wrenched from their sockets. All around him, harsh breathing and swift, heavy footfalls sounded, the rushed tempo broken only by the occasional orcish curse.
Where am I? And where am I being taken? he wondered miserably. Flashes of the battle in the woods returned to him, and he gritted his teeth, wishing he knew whether the others were even still alive. How could they be? There were so many orcs! And the arrows…! Thought of his friends lying among the foul orcs, unmourned and unburied, pulled a sob from his lips that turned swiftly to a gasp as his particular orc abruptly shouldered a companion hard. The impact rocked Pippin's head on his shoulders and the flurry of guttural, hateful orcish grated on his nerves like claws.
What are they on about? he wondered in spite of himself, his curiosity overcoming even the horror of his situation. Can they not just run? Why all this shoving and fighting? Or are they only happy when they're making each other miserable?
Such questions had no answers, he knew. So instead of trying to solve the riddles, Pippin craned his neck to search for Merry, but he could see nothing to fore over the orc's head, and he hadn't the freedom to twist about for a glimpse behind. To either side, he saw naught but the iron helms and hideous, snarling faces of more orcs. A pang of loss settled in his stomach, but he firmly tried to crush it.
After all, I should be glad, shouldn't I, that maybe Merry isn't here? That he's missing this journey? Maybe he slipped off into the woods, and is making his way home… wherever that lies now! So he told himself, but it was hard to feel good about anything in such circumstances. Still, he did try, and ere he let himself slip away into dark dreams once again, he spared a thought for Sam and Frodo, hopefully safely across the river. Safe! To think that I should call anything safe, and especially a walk into Mordor. But there you have it, they are safe… I hope!
With that, he slipped deeper into the recesses of his own mind, locked away in desperate memories of better days, forced down deeper and deeper by the pain that penetrated to the bone until oblivion claimed him.
The first inkling that Pippin had that anything had changed was the jarring impact with the ground. Groaning, he opened tired eyes to a forest of dirty, hard-muscled and iron-clad orc legs standing all about him.
Why have we stopped? The hobbit rolled onto his back and squinted at the sky, which was yet dark and gave no sign as to the time. His whole body ached, and his hands were numb from poor circulation, for the bonds were cruelly tight. Beside him, a soft moan sounded, and Pippin stiffened, glancing to his left to see Merry Brandybuck huddled on the ground beside him, looking as though he desperately wanted to be sick. "M-Merry? Are you all right?" he whispered hoarsely, afraid that his captors might hear.
"As right as I can be… I guess!" Merry managed after a moment, offering a pathetic smile. A dirty bandage was wrapped about his head, and he truly looked a bit dazed still. "And you?"
"Oh, I'm not so bad, myself," Pippin lied, making his voice as cheery as he could for the other's sake, though his heart sank. So he didn't get away after all!
"What about the others?"
"I don't know. The last I saw of them, they were fighting hard… I don't know… they may not have…." Just at that moment, an iron-shod foot kicked Pippin in the back, and the hobbit gasped, trying to roll away from the assault.
"All right, vermin, shut your wide traps and listen!" An orc loomed over them, his scarred face set in a hideous scowl as he grated, "No talking, no whining, and no trying to escape! You'll do what you're told and hop to it if you know what's good for you! Otherwise…."
"Ah, shut it, will you, you worthless goat!" came another harsh voice from near at hand. "You haven't got the guts for that sort of thing, even with orders! Bloody mountain folk got so much air between their ears it blows out their mouths every time they open 'em, but they couldn't take a tark on a moonless night!"
"Is that so, snaga?" the first orc hissed, and there came the ring of metal as a sword was drawn. "At least I didn't run all this way from Lugbúrz just ta take orders from an Isengarder that don't want nothing but these worthless half-grown slugs! They haven't got a bloody thing on them worth takin', 'less you count those pretty stickpins of theirs!"
"I thought the orders were no spoiling!" the second voice grew softer and smooth as silk in anticipation of a fight.
"I'm not one of your wretched kind, to balk at taking what's mine just because some higher up that can't even keep his own command tells me not to! Want me to show you one of those daggers?"
"That's enough!" a new voice interjected, and the hobbits squirmed round to stare, for of a sudden the two antagonists fell utterly silent, and there was a general sense of unease as a large orc stalked forward, glaring. "Put your play things away! And you," the orc made a quick swipe and grabbed something out of the first orc's fist. Merry gasped, for he recognized the dagger as his own, and such was the discomfiture of the orcs that no one thought to kick him for the sound.
"Are you brainless as well as spineless? Do you know what these are?!" With a hiss, he tossed the blade aside as if it burned, and he continued, "Those knives have killed your folk for generations, and you think you can carry one along in this troop? Not while I command!"
"And how long will that be, pray tell?" someone else demanded with surly temper.
"As long as the rest of you swine buckle down and keep your senses, because make no mistake: the horse boys will come riding for us, and you had best hope we don't leave you to them! Until we reach Isengard, we are all in danger here, but I won't come home empty-handed because a couple of worthless mountaineers don't know enough to leave well enough alone! Keep your hands to yourselves, and if I find out that either of those two is missing anything when we get to Isengard, you'll pay me in blood, understand?"
"And who is to say we shall go to Isengard, Uglúk?" yet another orcish voice rose, and Pippin shivered, for although it was softer, it was more malignant.
"That's what my orders say, and that's where I'm going, Grishnákh!" Uglúk snarled. "And any who know what's good for 'em'll follow straight off!"
"Is that so? And what are those orders worth? The work of some ragtag wizard, they are! I serve the Great Eye, I and all who hold with me. We know where the true power is, and I say we cross the river and return to Mordor with these two."
"Do as you like!" Uglúk sneered. "Stinking cowards, the lot of you! The Uruk-hai will see to this business, and as we took the prisoners, we'll bloody well keep right on taking 'em where we please. Off with you, if you're afraid, but tell the whiteskins hello! You'll not escape them, and you won't be able to take them alone."
There were some more curses and jostling, but none offered any further resistance for the moment. The gathering broke up a bit, and the hobbits, who had lain very still, listening, began to breathe again, sensing that the immediate danger was past. Merry closed his eyes wearily, and Pippin felt his spirits sink.
Isengard! He remembered it vaguely from the debates back in Rivendell, but in truth he knew not where it lay. Somewhere in the Gap of Rohan, wherever that is. And does that mean, then, that we are in Rohan now, since they speak of riders and horsemen? Likely it did, and for some reason, that bothered Pippin greatly, inciting in him a feeling of utter displacement.
We are lost, Merry and I! Baggage misplaced and misclaimed. I only wish Strider and the others would come for us. But I don't even know if they're alive. I suppose my best hope is that this Grishnákh fellow won't take kindly to Uglúk's arrogance, and start a fight. Maybe they'd kill each other off, these orcs. But given the threat of pursuit, that seemed unlikely, and the hobbit sighed softly in the darkness.
Ere long, the orcs began to muster again, and Pippin was torn from his reflections by a slap across the face and the growled command: "Get up!"
Cracking his eyes open, he saw Uglúk glaring down at him, and the orc drew a blade. For a moment, Pippin thought he meant to stab him, but the leader of the Uruk-hai only bent and cut the thongs binding his legs. "We've carried you far enough to get to the bottom of that blasted hill. Time you repaid us and learned to run yourself! Up, both of you!"
He turned his attention to Merry, dragging him to his feet and giving him a hard shove forward, shaking his head when the hobbit stumbled and collapsed. "Best you learn to use your legs, swine, because orders or no, I'll lick you with this whip if you don't keep up! All right, move! All of you! Run, if you serve the Eye, or so help me I'll give you to the horse boys with my thanks!"
Pippin staggered forward as the line began to move, and Merry struggled along at his side, both of them trying desperately to keep pace with their captors. White Hand and Red Eye, whatever their allegiance, the orcs ran swiftly and made no effort to keep a clean line. Indeed, Pippin had to swerve several times to avoid being crushed by orcs who were pushed out of place by their fellows, and Merry nearly collided with one once.
But gradually, in spite of his general misery, Pippin began to notice that the emblem of Mordor, the Red Eye, seemed to have disappeared from the ranks. He dared not try to look back, but it was certain that before him and to either side, there were no soldiers out of the Dark Land, and he wondered at that. Did they really leave? I would have thought that they would fight harder!
But for now, the mystery would have to wait, for he could spare no attention from the grueling march, and he grit his teeth and tried to shut his mind away from the agony. His breath came hard and ragged, all his muscles burned with exhaustion and pain, his vision swam and his head ached, and still, the road went on and on.
The miles fell away behind them, and as the night wore away, the orcs swept onward towards Fangorn Forest.
The hills were featureless under the darkened sky, for the moon above was but a sliver, shedding no light to guide them. Aragorn had known dark journeys before, and he did not worry over his ability to climb even this treacherous slope by feel alone, but he feared to lose the path of the orcs entirely. Already, it was difficult to read, and though he would have wagered his life that they were bound for Isengard, still, proof of that would have been welcome.
And there is also Gimli to think of, for he has not Legolas's eyes, nor my training, Aragorn reminded himself, glancing back over his shoulder for all the good that that did. It was too dark to see the Dwarf's silhouette, and only the sound of his breathing and the echoes of dislodged pebbles as they descended in his wake testified to his continued presence in their line. Behind and below him, Legolas brought up the rear in utter silence, and that too gave the Ranger cause for concern.
Ordinarily, he would not have feared for Legolas at all, given the Elf's inborn, sure-footed grace, but he knew well that the Prince of Mirkwood suffered. His reaction to the funeral pyre, which had left him as one dazed for some minutes, was all out of proportion. Certainly, Legolas had been at a loss to explain it, though he had insisted afterward that he was well enough.
Aragorn had no grounds to gainsay him, but he mistrusted that assurance beyond the obvious fact that the injury clearly pained Legolas, and resolved to watch him carefully in the days to come. As for the pain itself, that was only to be expected: they had not even bothered with a sling, knowing that soon enough they all would need use of their hands for this climb. Legolas had assured them that he would manage it, and indeed, he seemed to have found his way well enough while the daylight lasted, but as time wore on, his responses to their inquiries grew more curt. If he slipped now, no one would be able to help him, for they would not know anything was wrong until the Elf cried out in alarm. Turning his attention back to the path, Aragorn noted that the crest of the hill was not far above them, and hoped that no mishap would overtake them ere they reached it.
And I hope also that Merry and Pippin live still unscathed, the Ranger thought. It was, in some ways, a selfish hope, for so long as the hobbits lived, there was the risk that they might be made to speak of the Company's business, and that would be immediate disaster. Even should the three of them overtake their foes and somehow slip the hobbits free of their captors' claws, Aragorn knew full well that they could not hope to destroy all those who would have heard the tale from captives desperate for an end to torment.
Yet though a pair of bodies so early in the chase would likely mean that the Fellowship's secrets remained untold, Aragorn could not bring himself to hope for such an end. And in truth, the risk was likely less than fear made it.
For what orc would seek out hobbits, unless ordered to do so? And if someone should take care to give such orders, then he must know what Frodo carries. Saruman and the Dark Lord both know, yet I doubt me they wish their orcs to hear aught of the rings of power, he thought grimly as he pulled himself at last onto the top of the ridge. Likely enough, then, Pippin and Merry were safe until they reached Isengard.
Turning back along their path, he reached to give Gimli, who had managed to scramble onto the ledge beside him, a hand. Then both Man and Dwarf stood gazing down, hesitant, unwilling to offend Legolas with an offer of help, but worried nonetheless that their friend would not be able to manage the last part of the ascent. In the end, however, their fears proved groundless, for wounded or no, the Elf made his own way up the slope easily enough in spite of the hazards of the terrain.
When at last he stood beside them, Aragorn gave him a long look, ere he turned to gaze out over the flatlands that spread below them, dimly revealed in a pale light. "Behold Rohan," he said then. "Would that the moon gave more light, for we might then see much upon the fields."
"Whither shall we go?" Legolas asked, voice taut, whether with anxiety or strain, it was impossible to tell. "Shall we begin our descent now and in this place, or seek an easier path?"
"In one thing only may we trust an orc, and that is that he will find the swiftest way down from these heights," Aragorn said wryly. "Come! The trail leads yonder, and then plunges into the ravine."
"Is it wise to dare such a descent on so blind a night?" Gimli asked, and cast a significant glance at the Elf's back.
"You need not fear for my safety, Master Dwarf," Legolas replied, discerning his friend's silent concern nonetheless. "But I shall be annoyed if you turn an ankle and force me to carry you!" At which Gimli snorted, and Aragorn grinned in the darkness, shaking his head.
"Alas, I fear you must have taken a blow to the head in addition to an arrow to the back if you think I shall make any such careless error, Master Elf!" Gimli retorted, much relieved as well.
"Come then, since we are agreed," Aragorn said, intervening ere the banter could continue, though in truth he found much comfort in the swift repartees. So long as Legolas can turn an insult, he is safe to continue, I suppose. "The night is still young enough, and we have far to run ere sunrise."
"And with the sun, may there come also strength!" Gimli muttered. "It shall be a long chase."
"Aye, it shall," Aragorn replied. "But we shall not let it deter us, and after a long chase, vengeance is the sweeter, however short-lived!" To that, neither Elf nor Dwarf responded, but they followed him without hesitation.
As the night waned, and the dawnlight grew nearer, the three hunters wound their way towards the basin floor, knowing that there the race would begin in earnest.
And we dare not lose, the Ranger thought grimly, for let the hobbits pass the gates of Isengard, and we are undone! So ran captainly concern, which was a thing apart from a friend's wrath, and as cold calculation struggled to solve the problem of how to reclaim hostages in time, grief and anger lengthened his stride. At the least, he would look on the pair again, if only to assure them a better end than any orc or turncoat wizard would give them. Thus resolved, he pressed onward, and Man, Elf, and Dwarf passed swiftly through the night.
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quote:Kentucky Sports Board
quote:Awesome link from KSR. Has UK commits and JC signees
quote:Awesome link from KSR. Has UK commits and JC signees.LINK Stoops can close with Hatcher, Hearns, Timmons, and Badet, then I see UK moving up in the top 30 class.
quote:ESPN is the absolute worst of the big four at ratings.
quote:You're not getting Hatcher. Sorry man.
quote:I'm not saying that he will become a Cat, but he's in state, not 100% on USC, and cancelled his visit to Louisville... visited Kentucky instead.
quote:Mike there is already 6 pages of recruiting information on the Recruting board already. You posted the exact same information in the thread and then came here and started a new thread.
quote:Hearns can get into UK but not Auburn or FL??? I doubt that. He's JuCo bound or a WVU like school that doesn't care about grades.
quote:We have room and he's good enough to wait for.
quote:I just don't think he has much of a shot to make it in. I wouldn't get your hopes up.
quote:Braylon Heard
quote:Would be an absolute coup to get him from what it sounds like


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The Rolling Stones Preview New 'Grrr!' Track Online
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The Rolling Stones have released their second new song from the upcoming hits compilation, Grrr!, called "One More Shot." The tune, which is the name of the band's upcoming pay-preview special raped at next month's Newark, New Jersey gig, was written mostly by Keith Richards. "One More Shot", along with the Mick Jagger-driven "Doom And Gloom," are the only newly recorded tracks on the set, which is due out on November 13th.
Keith Richards has owned hundreds of guitar over his lifetime -- some have been stolen, some have been given away -- but there are still a few that he keeps near and dear to his heart. He was recently asked about which legendary axes he would take with him if stranded on a deserted island: "I'd take a Martin early-'30s acoustic -- an early-'30's job for an acoustic. Gibsons I love and everything, but if you say one on one, I'd take a Martin. And I gotta say for myself, I'd take a Fender. I'd take a telecaster, they're just so sturdy. And it's a working man's guitar, y'know, I mean nothing goes wrong with that thing. You can hit people over the head with it and it'll still stay in tune, y'know? (laughs)." )
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Results 61 to 75 of 214
Thread: Best Space Opera
January 14th, 2008, 07:05 AM #61
January 14th, 2008, 07:50 AM #62
I've always loved certain sub-genres of Science Fiction. For whatever reason, my brain/background/experiences/etc, my taste tells me that there are also several genres within Science Fiction I have no or at least a very limited interest in. Like I've mentioned before, my favorite kind of Science Fiction happens in space (Star Wars, B5, Dune, Firefly, Galactica, Trek, Stargate, Hitchhikers, Dr. Who). Not so much alien inventions of earth (like War Of The Worlds, Independence Day), nor nearly realistic near future explorations of our solar system (2001), nor unexplainable/paranormal mysteries in present time (like the X-Files), certainly not vampires (Buffy), or monsters (Frankenstein), or vampires (Dracula), and whatever other sub-genres doesn't fit the space genre. If a work in any genre is fantastic, I'll probably like it anyway, but that's not the point.
More often than not, I've seen all these dramas I like, presented as Space Opera, and I've found no other combining name/genre. That's how I found this thread (by searching for Space Opera on Google), and that's why I combined the list of the suggestions people have made in this thread. A lot of the novels suggested does indeed seem to fit what I'm looking for, or at least close enough, while one or two clearly are not. It would be a shame then, if Space Opera is only used for stories with big guns, big heroes, and tales too incredible to swallow. Perhaps then, there is another name for the genre I'm looking for?
Last edited by Anders; January 14th, 2008 at 03:18 PM.
January 14th, 2008, 08:16 AM #63
yes, at the current time it most definately is different; lacking the definition that everyone else is working off of kind of guarantees that, doesn't it.
I'm not attacking a definition I haven's seen. I'm merely making the observation that "back in the day" space opera was identified as a specific sub-genre that was mostly 'blood-and-thunder' action adventure. And many of the works in the list were not placed in that category when they were originally published.
Definitions can certainly change with time (as they apparently have). Dune, for example, was hailed as the first "ecological" science fiction novel ever (with an interesting pseudo-feudal society thrown in) - not as space opera; the two novelettes that were cobbled together to create the novel were originally published in Astounding Stories - most definately NOT the home of space opera science fiction at the time. (In fact, Campbell railed against that type of SF when describing the kind of fiction he would be publishing, and Bova followed suit when he took over.)
If someone could find an active link to the definition, it would be appreciated.
Last edited by RimWorlder; January 14th, 2008 at 08:28 AM.
January 14th, 2008, 08:49 AM #64
I've copied your list (sorry - I didn't see your disclaimer the first time I read the list) and will note the novels I'm familiar with and the ways they were categorized when either - originally published or during the pre-internet era when I first read them:
E. E. Smith's Lensman definately space opera
George R. Stewart's Earth Abides nc
Ray Bradbury's Martian Chronicles definately NOT space opera
A. E. van Vogt's The Voyage of The Space Beagle Space opera
Isaac Asimov's Foundation Series definately not: most blurbs/discussion was of the "new (potential) science of psychohistory"
Clifford Simak's City dystopian, not opera
Arthur C. Clarke's Childhood's End hailed as "one of the most important novels of our time" not space opera
Robert A. Heinlein's Tunnel in the Sky SF juvenile - adventure in a sense, but more frequently advertised as a morality tale. (Heinlein was NEVER identified as a writer of space operas)
Alfred Bester's Stars My Destination These days I see where the categorization comes from, but it was not perceived in the same way back when
James Blish's Cities in Flight again, see where it comes from these days, but these were 'character stories' set against the backdrop of the use of spindizzies; again, Campbell-Astounding based so, according to him, its not space opera...
Daniel Keyes' Flowers for Algernon ?? how did this get in here? lol
Walter M. Miller's Canticle for Leibowitz - great novel, post apocolyptic send-up of then current issues. Not space opera
Harry Harrison's Deathworld series definately space opera. (Hey, Campbell was allowed to break his own rules...) If you want a seminal definition of S.O. along with Harrison's perfect sense of humor, read Bill, The Galactic Hero or Star Smashers of the Galaxy Rangers.
Phillip K. Dick's Man in the High Castle not
Jack Vance's The Demon Prince series probably
Frank Herbert's Dune most definately not
Arthur C. Clarke's 2001: A Space Odyssey - based on the short The Sentinel. Not space opera
Ursula K. Le Guin's Left Hand of Darkness Not
Anne McCaffrey's The Ship series can't say, never got 'into' Anne
Poul Anderson's Tau Zero probably. Better example of Anderson's space opera would be The High Crusade
Larry Niven's Ringworld HARD SF - not opera. HARD SF is the 'answer' to space opera. We can't have space pirates because its impossible to match velocities if the other guy doesn't want to cooperate, and besides, we'll fry them with our message laser...
Ben Bova's The Exiles Trilogy maybe
Frederik Pohl's Heechee stories not
Larry Niven and Jerry Pournelle's The Mote in God's Eye space opera
Piers Anthony's Cluster read Omnivore, read Orn, can't handle any more...
Douglas Adams' The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy comedic send up of the sub-genre
David Brin's The Uplift stories a looser version of hard sf, but still harder than space opera
Joan Vinge's The Snow Queen Cycle ?
C. J. Cherryh's Downbelow Station I think CJ would object
M. K. Wren's The Phoenix Legacy ?
Jack Chalker's Four Lords of the Diamond most definately and a better example would be the Well World series. I miss Jack.
Anne McCaffrey's The Crystal Singer series haven't read
Piers Anthony's Bio of a Space Tyrant
Orson Scott Card's Ender Saga personal issue here - can't and won't read him
Arthur C. Clarke's Songs of Distant Earth not
Celia S. Friedman's The Braxi/Azea duology ?
Iain M. Banks' Culture series ?
W. Michael Gear's Way Of Spider series ?
Dan Simmons' Hyperion Cantos "Modern Space Opera", to distinguish it from the Doc Smith type
Greg Bear's Queen Of Angels series ?
S. M. Stirling and David Drake's The General Like both of them well enough, haven't read them together
Kim Stanley Robinson's Mars series - he's claim Hard SF
Vernor Vinge's A Fire Upon The Deep/A Deepness in the Sky definately "modern" space opera
David Weber's Honor Harrintgon series self-proclaimed carrier of the space opera flame
Timothy Zahn's Conquerors trilogy ?
C. J. Cherryh's Foreigner ?
Simon R. Green's Deathstalker series ?
Catherine Asaro's Saga of the Skolian Empire ?
Peter F. Hamilton's The Night's Dawn Trilogy ?
David Weber's Heirs Of Empire series yes
Lois McMaster Bujold's Vorkosigan Saga ?
after this you're getting into territory I'm not familiar with - and, lol, notice the dates. I'll admit I'm pretty stuck in everything 80s and earlier - but every time I pick something 'new' up at the store, it just doesn't do it for me these days.
January 14th, 2008, 11:42 AM #65
wikipedia defines space opera quite adequately as i see it:Space opera is a subgenre of speculative fiction or science fiction that emphasizes romantic adventure, and larger-than-life characters often set against vast exotic futuristic settings with remotely plausible technology such as time travel and interstellar travel, complex alien civilizations and fictional depictions of the human future.
January 14th, 2008, 03:33 PM #66
That sounds like a logical definition to me, although I'm a bit confused as it doesn't include any mention of space travel.
I've already agreed that some of the novels on the list doesn't quite fit the genre, but if we follow the definition above I think you're being a bit strict Rimworlder. Dune seems to fit the definition quite well to me. You also said that the "Foundation Trilogy is political/sociological SF", but isn't that something you could say about stories from all various types of SF? How then do you differentiate between the different types of SF (f.ex. monster vs space)?
Last edited by Anders; January 15th, 2008 at 01:54 AM.
January 15th, 2008, 03:13 AM #67
If Space Opera simply meant cardboard characters, trivial love stories, and old style western plots, it might be lightly entertaining, but it would not be what I'm looking for. Since my background in this is mainly from TV and movies, I'll use Babylon 5 as an example of a clever tale, full of twists, changing characters, both political and philosophical in its core.
I've seen some people use terms such as Space Fiction and Space Adventure as a way to redefine/define the genre, but obviously if it becomes too broad, then 2001 and Star Wars would end up standing side by side, and I'm not sure that would make much sense.
"It takes a certain ambition to try to get your editorial arms around space opera because it seems that everyone has their own definition of it. It's as if the definition of it is as subjective a thing as success or beauty."
"Space opera used to be a pejorative locution designating not a subgenre or mode at all, but the worst form of formulaic hackwork: really bad SF.
Many readers and writers and nearly all media fans who entered sf after 1975 have never understood the origin of space opera as a pejorative and some may be surprised to learn of it. Thus the term space opera reentered the serious discourse on contemporary SF in the 1980s with a completely altered meaning: henceforth, space opera meant, and still generally means, colorful, dramatic, large scale science fiction adventure, competently and sometimes beautifully written, usually focussed on a sympathetic, heroic central character, and plot action [this bit is what separates it from other literary postmodernisms] and usually set in the relatively distant future and in space or on other worlds, characteristically optimistic in tone."
Last edited by Anders; January 17th, 2008 at 05:14 AM.
January 17th, 2008, 03:05 AM #68
January 18th, 2008, 10:37 AM #69
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Ian M. Banks - Pretty much all his books, though the culture ones are best.
Stephen Donaldson - Gap series.
C.S. Friedman - most of her sf books, especially "In conquest born".
Dan simmons - Hyperion/endymion series.
Chris Bunch - Not the best i have ever read but straightforward space opera.
Larry Niven - Ringworld series. (The first two are pretty good).
Thats the ones i can think of atm.
I see many are recommending the nights dawn triology, but i could never get into it. I struggled through the first book hoping it would improve but i lost interest in continuing the series.
January 21st, 2008, 03:21 PM #70
January 26th, 2008, 10:26 PM #71
January 28th, 2008, 03:57 PM #72
For those who want to learn more exactly what "Space Opera" is or is not, I highly recommend a recent massive anthology: The Space Opera Renaissance by David G. Hartwell (Author), Kathryn Cramer (Author)
I am nearly finished with it, some really great stories, and the authors do a really good job of defining what "Space Opera" is now, and how this subgenre has evolved over the years...
Introduction: *How Shlt became Shinola, Definition & Redefinition of Space Opera, by Hartwell & Cramer
I. Redefined Writers
"The Star Stealers" by Edmond Hamilton
"The Prince of Space" by Jack Williamson
"Enchantress of Venus" by Leigh Brackett
*"The Swordsmen of Varnis" by Clive Jackson
II. Draftees (1960s)
***"The Game of Rat & Dragon" by Cordwainer Smith
"Empire Star" by Samuel R. Delany
"Zirn Left Unguarded, the Jenjik Palace in Flames, Jon Westerly Dead" by Robert Sheckley
III. Transitions/Redefiners (late 1970s to late 1980s)
*"Temptation" by David Brin
"Ranks of Bronze" by David Drake
*"Weatherman" by Lois McMaster Bujold
"A Gift from the Culture" by Iain M. Banks
IV. Volunteers:Revisionaries (early 90s)
*"Orphans of the Helix" by Dan Simmons
"The Well Wishers" by Colin Greenland
*"Escape Route" by Peter Hamilton
"Ms Midshipwoman Harrington" by David Weber
"Aurora in Four Voices" by Catherine Asaro
**"Ring Rats" by R. Garcia y Robertson
*"The Death of Captain Future" by Allen Steele
V. Mixed Signals/ Mixed Categories (to the late 1990s)
*"A Worm in the Well" by Gregory Benford
**"The Survivor" by Donald Kingsbury
"Fools Errand" by Sarah Zettel
"The Shobies Story" by Ursula K. Le Guin
"The Remoras" by Robert Reed
"Recording Angel" by Paul McAuley
"The Great Game" by Steven Baxter
"Lost Sorceress of the Silent Citadel" by Michael Moorcock
"Space Opera" by Michael Kandel
VI. Next Wave (21st Century)
"Grist" by Tony Daniel
"The Movements of her Eyes" by Scott Westerfeld
*"Spirey and the Queen" by Alastair Reynolds
*"Bear Trap" by Charles Stross
"Guest Law" by John C. Wright
March 11th, 2008, 05:08 AM #73
The plot is not as sharp as either of the other two books I mentioned, it drags on at times, and some situations feels artificially created, but the reader is always left guessing what Miles will do next. I do wish Bujold had given more time to build the other characters as well, and the plot could have been more original. However, it was a fun and pleasant read, and I can easily see myself going back and reading more Bujold/Miles novels.
March 25th, 2008, 02:10 PM #74
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About David Weber's Honor series- is it completed now or is he still writing books in it?
March 25th, 2008, 04:04 PM #75
This might ruffle a few feathers, but I really enjoyed James Somers's Soone. I've only read the first book--Heir to the King, but I thought it was really fun, even if it smelled a bit like Star Wars. But, that much being said, I'm really not the biggest sf reader, so I'm pitifully ignorant. But I'm making an effort to change, I swear!


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HELP. Lots of spiders in my house. What is normal for a house...
How much spider activity do you have in your homes? What are you doing/what have you done to combat the spider population? How many spiders do people normally find in their houses on a daily basis?
I've read a lot about spiders, and I realize that they are beneficial in keeping the nasty insect population down and that it's almost impossible to eliminate them from a home completely. I'm wondering if what I'm seeing now is the male spiders that are looking for mates this time of year. I DON'T want any spider-mating activity in my house...lol...I don't want another increase in the spider population any time soon.
I have always had lots of spiders in my house ever since I moved in, but I never experienced anything like this in previous homes possibly because this is an older house with crevices for creepy crawlers to get in. I've hired an exterminator in the past, but that didn't help one bit (I had more spiders than ever when we had an exterminator). We've also sprayed the interior and exterior with an insecticide and sealed all gaps we could find on the outside of the house and in the basement, yet that didn't alleviate the problem. Since spiders do not die when they walk on the dried insecticide, all of this spraying with insecticides doesn't seem to help too much. I don't see many insects inside, except for the occasional centipede or earwig (never had those in any other home).
A few days ago, I thoroughly dusted all the walls, ceilings and doors with my Swiffer dry cloths to make sure there were no webs, and then I dusted all furniture and vacuumed my floors and under the furniture. During this cleaning, I found five semi-large spiders. I thought that the thorough cleaning would help, however, it didn't appear to make a difference (I always vacuum at least twice a week anyway). The last straws were a couple of days ago when I had a large spider on my computer screen and then yesterday when there was a spider on my clean sofa and one on the kitchen counter. In the past hour, I killed a spider on my wall near my sofa. I again re-dusted the area tonight. By the way, I've been keeping all my windows closed for the entire summer.
One problem is that I have all wooden floors in this house (except in the kitchen and bathroom), so there are gaps around the radiators (I must fill those gaps soon). Also, several of the wooden floor boards have tiny gaps between them and small gaps where they meet some of the walls/trim, and so I don't know what to do for these tiny gaps because wood expands and contracts with changes in humidity. I read that spiders can get in through floor boards (this creeps me out). I have some of my personal belongings stored in boxes in one room that I don't use, and so I just bought some large plastic totes to replace those boxes where spiders can hide. I can't do all of this work overnight, though, and I'm nervous about going through boxes that have been undisturbed.
Anyway, I'm at my wit's end right now. I can deal with finding one spider a week, but not all of these spiders.
Thanks for reading all of this and for any input on my spider problem and for sharing your personal experiences in dealing with spiders.
I just want to add that I have those electronic pest devices plugged into my outlets, and they apparently don't work at all for spiders.
I found yet another spider on my bedroom ceiling the size of a quarter. I had just cleaned the whole room thoroughly a few days ago and sprayed the perimeter of the ceiling and floor with Permethrin which unfortunately doesn't kill spiders that walk on the dried residue.
Does anyone else scan their walls, ceilings, floors for spiders? I never used to be like this before living here. Ugh.
Anyway, I want to have my whole basement thoroughly cleaned from top to bottom, and this will likely help a bit. I only have a small amount of boxes down there and a washer/dryer and furnace & oil tank. What type of a professional can I hire to clean my basement (vacuum webs, wash floors, walls, etc.)?
I used to rent a home that had a similar problem! OMG, I know what you mean. I though several times I would have a breakdown. It was spiders, ig brown hairy wood spiders - tons of them, they would go into hiding during the winter, its cold here. Anyhow, my advice is this: Diatemaceus Earth. Go to a local Amway or Agway, it comes in a can. You sprinkle it about just like carpet fresh. Vacuum atleast every other day. Get pest control in with an appointment with your landlord. Also, there has to be a moisture issue, or possibility of attic issues? Put a doorsweep on all door bottoms going outdoors. You can get some peel and stick rubber ones for a couple of bucks. It sounds silly, but the space under the door lets in alot of stuff. Pay attention to where your seeing them the most. Point it out to your landlord. It sounds like your getting infested and you don't want it to go past a certain point. Good Luck, be vigilant against the buggers!
itsnotworking, thanks for your response. Yikes, hairy wood spiders! I've seen one in the basement a few years ago. Mine are mostly house spiders and the occasional outdoor spider. They are black and super fast. I also get light-colored spiders. I don't know how many different varieties there are in my house.
I have Diatomaceous Earth on my list of things to buy. I was reading about the pros and cons of using it indoors. It can be very dusty to use. I read that if a spider's legs are long, the DE will not get on its body and so the spider will not die. I'd definitely like to spread DE outside around the foundation and in the basement. It has to be re-applied if it rains.
I already have door sweeps installed. There's just too many crevices in this house. I have a fireplace, and they seem to be coming from around that wall and from the crevices where the brick meets the wood mantel. I've sprayed the heck out of the fireplace many times to no avail. The fireplace is all clean with nothing inside it. I really don't want spiders in my bedroom, and I've already seen five of them there in one week - bedroom is clean with no clutter and never have clothing on the floor.
There is some moisture at times in the basement. I haven't been in the attic in a long time, and nothing is stored up there. I'm sure there are spiders in my attic *shudders*. If I get an exterminator, I'll have him/her do the attic.
But like I wrote, I had an exterminator for a while, and it did nothing to reduce the spider population. This house obviously had an issue when I moved in; I would have never moved in had I known.
lazypup, I've read that, too, but it depends where you are sitting/standing. It's not always 5 feet (sometimes closer/sometimes farther).
Some people say that they only see a spider once a month or less. I wonder if it's because they don't have many spiders or if they happen to not see the spiders when they are crawling about. All I know is that in the other homes I've lived in, I rarely saw spiders and didn't find webs indoors.
Get a cat, they'll eat them! Kidding, but we also had a problem with spiders after a leaky pipe leading to the upstairs bath required that we cut a hole in the kitchen ceiling drywall. Spiders just seemed to pour out of the hole afterwards so I'd constantly be knocking out webs with my duster. The hole is patched now and it's much less spidery. Maybe you can examine the crevices around your mantel and see if any of them can be filled in?
We have a well maintained 50 year old home, and we rarely see a spider.We do occasionaly have small lizzards. We have a large population of horned lizzards whom I am sure like to dine on outside spiders. We consistantly dust and vacume. What is strange, we sometimes will have a spider or two in our pool.
I've heard that putting those small cedar balls inyour windows will prevent them from coming in that way. Ive actually found that by vacuuming it upsets them and I always see some right after. Suck them up and get rid of the bag because when they lay eggs its a lot of eggs...we removed shutters from our first home and behind each shutter on each shelf of the clapboard was a spider. It was like a condominium for spiders! Needless to say every house we've been in since then, one of the first things we do is remove the shutters! I got a bite on my eyelid once and it was just awful. Got infected and just plain dangerous! I so hate spiders, any kind.
I'll definitely buy some cedar balls or chips to see if that helps.
We don't get lizards here, and I don't think that there are too many spider predators. I probably wouldn't mind lizards if they ate spiders.
My fireplace, well, that's going to be a big job to seal all the crevices. Plus, there is about a 1/4" gap between where the top part of the wood mantel meets the wall, and I've seen a few spiders come from there, even though I've sprayed in that gap many times. I think it's too large of a gap to put a silicone sealer or wood filler. Not sure how to fix that gap.
Of course, wouldn't ya know it, last night before I was going to go to bed, I found a spider on the ceiling right above my bed, and I got it with the vacuum. I had a hard time falling asleep after that. My bedroom is very clean; I try to make it as inhabitable as possible for any bugs.
We have horned lizzards, horny toads, geekos and dragon flies, not to mention a large bird population. This time of year we also have yellow crested night herons. When I mow the lawn, black birds follow me around. Hardly anything gets past this managerie.
ugh...I just came back to bed after catching a HUGE spider in the bathroom, and taking it outside. Including legs it was the size of a quarter. AND there was a smaller version stuck in the sink, and an even smaller one nearby. I think my house has too many spiders too. The daddy long legs dont bother me as much. But these hairy brown spiders, and reddish brown shiny ones, and brown ones that are house spiders but remind me of mini black widows.......yuck. I know they are beneficial and will not likely bite me. But they just trigger a primal disgust and fear in me. I think removing webs, sealing openings and crevices, and diatomaceous earthsound good. Around here we always see many more when it is getting colder out side and I think they come in for the warmth. Around here many spiders seem nocturnal, so you see more if you walk around the house in the dark, with a flashlight. Yuck again! I see several spiders each day! I try to catch them and put them outside, but especially at night I might just get them with a wad of kleenex. I always say "I am sorry but I am a mom and I can't have you possibly biting my kids"
lafdr, I give you lots of credit for bringing the spiders outside. You're much braver than I am. I haven't seen any daddy long legs in this house. I've been finding light-colored spiders lately. They're all fast. I'm also disgusted by spiders, and I'm not afraid of anything else but spiders.
I hope to get to the store this week to buy some cedar chips. I'll put some between the window screens and window sashes, since I see some webs in my windows (I cleaned and sprayed insecticide in there, yet the webs keep forming). I'm still finding house spiders almost daily, even though I've been vigilant at cleaning.
I think that there are more spiders wandering around indoors at this time of year because it's the mating season now, and so the males are searching for mates. I should put up a sign: "No spider mating allowed." Need to find some sort of humor in this.
I feel your spider pain...in the last week I killed a ginormous spider in my newly finished basement that after much horrific photo-filled internet research I ID'd as a wolf spider. I also had one of those black speedy house spiders crawl from up from a crack in the stairs as I was bringing laundry up.
I have more bugs in general in this house than in my old house - I think probably because I have a basement here and also because this house is 85 years old and there are just more cracks and crevices. I have found that having a quarterly extermination service does help to keep populations down - I always see a rise in numbers as I am nearing the time when I am due for the next treatment. The guy who treats my house is good and very thorough.
One other thing you might want to try - there are these balls called hedge apples that I think are technically a kind of fruit (I think in other parts of the country they're called osage oranges or horse apples). They are green and kind of cool looking - google them. I get them from a tree that's in a park in my neighborhood for free, and put them around my basement as they are supposed to repel spiders and other bugs. At least in my part of the country (Mid-Atlantic) you can find them now through probably early November, which nicely coincides with the cooler temps when bugs start to move indoors.
jrldh: So very true, plus, the webs are natural rather than store-bought - that's a huge savings right there. Now, you know I'm joking :)
hlg222: I relate to you, too. I haven't seen a wolf spider yet, though I've seen pictures. I'd have a real issue if I saw one of those here. My house is over fifty years old. It's almost impossible to seal all the cracks and crevices. I had Terminex spray every two weeks to a month, yet there was no change in the # of spiders. I'll look into a local company this time. We don't get osage oranges here; I've never seen one in person.
I was going to put cedar chips in my windows, but then I learned that they don't repel spiders. Most cedar chips are not 100% cedar. The diatomaceous earth is good to kill a spider's meal source, but as far as directly killing spiders, well, in order for DE to kill spiders, it would have to get on the spider's body, and since most spiders have long legs, they just walk over the DE and continue to live. The residual sprays don't work directly for killing spiders; you have to get the spray on the spider's body for it to die. But at least the residuals reduce some of a spider's food source. I've sprayed the entire inside & outside perimeter of my house with insecticide, but I've not seen one dead spider inside, and they've built webs right where I recently sprayed. Those electronic pest repelling devices are a joke and a waste of money.
I think the best way to find webs (to remove them) is either when the sunlight is shining on them or if you shine a flashlight on surfaces with the lights dimmed or turned off. You'll be surprised at what you might find with a flashlight :(
I'm so frustrated. After all of my hours of thorough cleaning (floors, walls, ceilings, furniture), I got a silk thread across my face as I walked into the kitchen last night and then a couple across my arms as I walked into the hallway. Found a spider on my bedroom wall, too. So some spiders must have been at work while I was sitting at my desk for an hour. Then I took a closer look and saw some webs across my interior doors/door trim/furniture and other areas that I had just cleaned a few days ago. So I spent my late night washing off all these webs again and dusting the wood floors. I can't stand this house any more, since I hate spiders (I never saw any webs and rarely any spiders in my last place, but that was a condo).
Hmm. I don't know what my pest control company is using, but most of the bugs I find in the house between treatments are already dead, including spiders. When I first moved in, the house was totally infested with "spider crickets" another large and creepy bug, they look like big spiders but jump (AT you!!!) like crickets, and I was second guessing my decision to buy the house. Every time I went down in the basement, I'd see at least 5 or 6 of them on the walls or floor, the storage room walls were covered in them, and I was killing about 3 a week upstairs in the house. It was making me nuts. After the pest control company came out, within a week everything I was finding was either dead or moving extremely slowly, and I have not really had a problem since. I have noticed a big difference with some technicians who are not as thorough as others...the company who services my house had some turnover and I had a couple of visits by new guys who were not as thorough, and it showed in the number of bugs I was seeing.
Your situation sounds awful - if it doesn't improve, I would probably consider moving, if I could (but I REALLY hate spiders!)
Also, I COMPLETELY agree with you about the electronic repellents being a waste of money - I bought a couple when I had mice in the house and they did nothing. I actually spotted a mouse a few feet away one night!
hlg222, that pest control company you have seems great right now. Thank goodness you don't have to deal with those crickets on your own anymore. It's so true that the success of a of pest treatment depends on how thorough a technician is. I think that the guy who treated my house for a year did a poor job. The company kept sending him back to do more treatments, and I didn't think at that time to ask for a different technician.
I didn't see a spider for a few days, and then tonight I found a decent-sized one on the wall by my sofa (I caught it). I'm glad that the spider activity subsides in late October/early November, but I begin seeing spiders again in the Spring.
I've heard other people around here complaining about spiders. Even some of my local stores have thick webs inside near the ceilings, and I don't know why someone doesn't take the webs down. I know that spiders help control pests, but it's kind of creepy to see webs hanging from the ceilings in stores. If I see one silk spider thread in here, I remove it right away.
Actually, I've been considering selling this house for more reasons than just the spiders. It would be great to no longer have this spider problem, of course.
How often do any of you see new webs (silk strands) in your house after having removed the previous ones?
I was just sitting on my sofa writing, and then I noticed something. It was a spider hanging a few inches from my leg! I jumped away and moved the sofa to the wall and caught the spider with a glass as it crawled down its silk strand to the floor. I'm surprised I didn't see it on the ceiling before it made its descent. And if I wasn't sitting there, the damn thing would have ended up on my sofa. So then when I walked into the bathroom, there were a couple webs cris-crossing in front of the door that weren't there two hours ago. And there's now new webs in the kitchen and in my bedroom. I just examined the rooms two days ago and ran the vacuum along the doors and walls, and there were no webs.
I don't understand why I keep finding new webs so often. This is the worst I've ever had it in this house. I can't be wiping down walls, ceilings, etc every day.
I seriously can't take it here anymore. I'm all alone here dealing with this. I've complained all summer to my family members who own this house (I have a small ownership), and they have done nothing at all. If I only had clothes to move, I'd be gone tomorrow. This is all making me sick. I've never experienced anything like this in my life. I know some may say, it's just spiders, but I am afraid of them and don't want them in my living space. Plus, these are not tiny spiders.
There are way too many cracks and crevices in this house that can't be filled, so spiders have too many hiding places. I'm sure the basement has plenty of spiders, and I won't go down there. I don't know what's going on in the attic (I don't have anything stored up there), but there are some hairline cracks in my ceilings that may be an entryway.
I'm really disgusted right now. Sorry that I needed to vent. Is there anyone else out there who is dealing with a similar situation?
Have you ever tried hedge balls (also called osage oranges)? They are available for purchase in the fall of the year (I just bought 10 last week). You place them throughout your home/they repel spiders. Maybe other bugs too, the only bugs I ever see in my finished but mostly unused basement are dead. I replace them (the hedge balls, not the bugs!) every year. Worth a try.
this thread is really creeping me out.
knowing this is not reassuring at all:
According to the entomologists at Ohio State University no matter where you are, you are never more than 5 feet away from a spider of one sort or another...LOL
I recently had a spider start crawling across
my face when I was asleep. woke up throwing
something across the room. once the light was on
I saw it was..shudder..a spider.
this happened twice within a 3 week period.
I bought flea bombs for the room (didn't have
the problem in other areas of the house)
put twice the amount they specified..
no more spiders..so far.
so here is what I can help with.
spiders build their webs where air moves.
find a spiderweb..you'll find an air leakage
site behind it.
if they are building their webs at ceiling moldings
then it is the gap behind the molding where the air
moves. caulk top of molding to ceiling, and bottom
to wall. caulk cuts in corners.
spiders like to come in at plumbing penetrations
cause it is dark & cool.
plumbing penetrations can be hard to seal..esp
at sinks where escustions are installed to
cover the hole where the pipe comes in.
there is a product called Thumb Gum that is
a rope caulking. use this to seal escustions
to walls, and to pipe.
plumbing penetration for tub is really big
you'd have to use metal flashing caulked
& screwed in place to seal this large of an area.
at the fireplace gap..use backer rods to fill in
the gap that is larger than caulk will seal.
(anything over 1/4" wide needs filler before caulking)
stuff the backer rod in the gap then caulk both sides
of the backer rod to the brick & wall area.
spiders like return air chases because of the air
movement. so check in there too. clean surfaces
to be caulked prior to caulking.
with any caulk job, you need to let the caulk dry.
then go back and examine caulking for any missed
areas, or places where the caulk shrank as it dried.
I do a LOT of caulking in my work. I like a water based
caulk for easy clean up. long life caulk that goes on
white and as it dries turns clear.
Dap's Alex brand 25 or 35 year life is what I use.
wet your finger to push caulk into gaps, I usually
caulk with a wet washcloth to wet my finger..
and clean up as I go along.
not only will the caulk keep critters out, it
also is sealing air leakage into your home.
so it will be easier to clean, heat & cool.
don't know what to tell you about gaps in
flooring. other than sealing it from underneath.
ok..hopefully I won't have spider nightmares
or visitors tonight.
and GW'r who emailed me to post here about
another creepy spiders in my house thread..
we are square now.
thankfully no one attached any spider pictures.
and yes I know..spiders are our friends
(as long as they aren't in my face..in my house)
have a good weekend everyone.
and best of luck.
Thanks for the responses...
justretired: I'd try hedge apples but they aren't native to this area where I live, and I've never seen them in the stores. I'm so glad they work for you.
energy_rater_la: I hope you don't find any more spiders in your bed with you. Thanks for all the advice you posted. That's a lot of great information, and I'll refer back to it. This seems like a huge undertaking with this house. All of the radiators have gaps where they meet the walls, and the gaps need a sealant that can withstand the heat of the radiators and can adhere between metal and plaster walls. And like you wrote, any gap larger than 1/4" needs a filler, so I'll put a list together to get the proper materials when I go to The Home Depot.
Right now, it appears that the spider activity has ended for the season, except I found a spider's drag-line inside near the front door this week. I haven't seen a spider in a couple of weeks (knock on wood). I'm not looking forward to Spring when spiders will be active again, though.
I spoke too soon. With the recent mild temps, the spiders are coming out. I found two spiders in my kitchen a couple of days ago, and I woke up today with webs in the kitchen. I just want a break from spiders!
I've never seen webs in November before this year.
We have a lot of spiders too, our pest control guy says spiders are hard to get rid of as they don't clean themselves much so don't ingest the poison. We also have lots of scorpions and same issue there. It does get less with pest management but we see a lot more of them the first week or so after treatment.
I know it sounds like a lot to go over and seal, but consider this will also save you some heating/cooling costs to seal these areas. Give you something to do over the winter;)
I think if you break it out into a few smaller tasks or seal one thing a day, it will seem more manageable.
For large gaps you could also add some wood trim and seal around the wood with caulk. My daughters room has the least amount of bugs in it because I went through there and caulked around all the trim like where the quarter round meets the floor. I did it as an experiment and plan on doing it for other rooms as well.
Look at pipe insulation to put around the radiator pipes. There are different thickness available, then you can use caulk to seal the outside perimeter of it or use expanding foam if it is still a large gap. Then you can add escutcheons or trim to cover it. Or you could skip the insulation and put escutcheons on and caulk around it and to the pipe.
They have escutcheons that come in two pieces so you don't have to disconnect the plumbing to put one on. I'm guessing the first one would take you a little time, but after that you'd do the rest real quick. I've linked below to examples of a two piece escutcheons.
Here is a link that might be useful: Link to google image search of escutcheons
lyfia, thanks so much for all the info and advice. I didn't know that there are two-piece escutcheons. It is overwhelming when I think of caulking the whole house, so you're absolutely right that it's best focus on doing one small area at a time.
That's really good to know that caulking your daughter's room made a big difference.
The poster writes,
" The problem is that I have all wooden floors in this house (except in the kitchen and bathroom), so there are gaps around the radiators (I must fill those gaps soon). Also, several of the wooden floor boards have tiny gaps between them and small gaps where they meet some of the walls/trim, and so I don't know what to do for these tiny gaps because wood expands and contracts with changes in humidity. I read that spiders can get in through floor boards (this creeps me out). I have some of my personal belongings stored in boxes in one room that I don't use, and so I just bought some large plastic totes to replace those boxes where spiders can hide. I can't do all of this work overnight, though, and I'm nervous about going through boxes that have been undisturbed."
I have been told by a very experienced exterminator we will never seal our houses tight enough to keep out any critters. Think about it, if we sealed enough to keep out a bug or egg barely visible we wouldn't have any air to breath. Sealing our homes well is a good thing but sealing it up so a bug can't get in is impossible. I cam probably name dozens of places in a building envelope one would never be able to seal. For example vent openings. You don't want to seal these, think soffits and roof vents that prevent mold from growing and wood rotting in our attic spaces. For a 1400 sqft house the roof vents alone should have 7 sqft of opening, that's just the roof plus another 7 ftsq for the soffits. And one thinks putting items in plastic totes will contain bugs? Sorry, nope.
Because 1 exterminator wasn't successful doesn't mean it doesn't work. We live on the shoreline of Lake Erie, are surrounded by trees and spiders. We successfully are virtually spider free all season long, but do see spiders in the dead of winter if we don't respray in the fall, which we don't, not worth the expence for a few spideys.
Spraying will help a lot when done with the correct formula. Spiderman, the name of our exterminator company, has to tweak his formula through out the spider season.
Don't give up, you don't need to share your space with the multi legged little burgers, but you will NEVER be able to get them all, and will never be able to seal your home enough to keep them out, unless you have decontamination rooms at each door opening.
I don't remember seeing spiders in the winter here before, but I just saw one crawling on my living room wall. It's probably due to the mild winter so far, and I'm afraid that means that we'll have lots of spiders again in the spring just like this past year.
I had mentioned plastic storage totes because at least they are better than cardboard boxes for storing items in. So plastic totes will help prevent spiders from setting up house inside the storage containers, and the totes can be easily dusted. I'd rather not store anything in cardboard boxes any more.
The thing about spiders and residual sprays is that if a spider walks on the dried residual insecticide or pesticide, the spider will not die. So an exterminator can kill any spiders he or she sprays, but after the spray has dried, the spiders will not be killed as they walk over it (they don't groom themselves, so they cannot ingest the poisons). This house has been sprayed so many times (inside and out), and it didn't make much difference, probably because of all the gaps and crevices of this old house. But I will think about hiring a different exterminator towards springtime to try it again.
Frankly, I'm ready to move out (been wanting to move for years, but life got in the way). I've never lived in a place that had spider drag-lines forming across doorways and across rooms with all kinds of spider activity.
I've heard that spiders do not like citrus, mainly lemons. That is how they handled spiders in the movies. A lot of research told me (I have a spider problem like you, but not nearly as bad) has led me to get some lemon pledge & chestnuts. Dust window seals, baseboards & doors (inside and out) with lemon pledge & lay chestnuts along windows in-between screens and along doorways on the outside. I only have wolf spiders, but I have small kids (2 years & 4 months). We just started having a problem with them, I can't imagine how you feel. Hope you get your problems taken care of soon!
spiders build and live on the webs they
construct. find a spiderweb..you find
an area where air leaks into the house.
a couple of weeks of not vaccuming/dusting
will be ample time for spider to build its web.
then caulking the crack will eliminate the
good feeding ground for the spider.
this is a long lasting solution.
wolf spiders would give me a heart attack.
just to see one in my house, wouldn't matter
if it bit me!
spiders outside..fine with me. inside...
not fine with me. while even in my well
sealed house it is only the big (2" & bigger)
that I kill. overkill. wrap in toilet paper
and double flush down toilet.
I try to remember...spiders are our friends,
that they are God's creatures & the wive's tale
that killing a spider is bad luck.
does't always work for me.
a lady I know is recovering from brown
recluse bite. nasty wound. and a small
in summer I find black widows & garden spiders
(golden orb spiders). I know where to look
for the black widows..but the garden spiders ...
I've toppled off the back of the riding mower
more than once. even knowing that I should
do a walk through of my yard before cutting grass,
they sometimes catch me by suprise.
to all of you with spider problems,
from the bottom of my heart...
best of luck!
lisaportillo78: I'm so sorry that you have wolf spiders. I've not seen any here, but I can imagine how you might feel about them. I hope to never see one in person.
energy_rater_la: I'd have a heart attack, too, if I saw a wolf spider. Oh, if I walk outside in the very early morning (spring to fall), I most likely will get a web across my face from a drag-line/web that runs from a tree or electric lines to something close to the ground. Never experienced this years ago in any home. If you have lots of spiders in your yard, maybe carry a broom with you and brush away all the webs before you start yard work. I wish you luck as well. I can tolerate spiders as long as I don't have them in my house, in my car, or coming into contact with me.
Unfortunately, it's a myth that Lemon Pledge, hedge apples/horse chestnuts repel spiders. But catnip oil helps to repel spiders (I'll have to get some). Here's one of a number of sites regarding spider myths (warning: there is one small photo of a spider): http://homes.yahoo.com/news/5-myths-facts-non-toxic-ways-keep-spiders-234200437.html. I'm not too thrilled to learn of this myth regarding a clean home: "Myth: A pristine home environment eliminates spider populations. At Washington State University, researchers found that house spiders -- those that hatched inside the home -- were different from their exterior counterparts. House spiders have adapted to deal with a 'poor food and water supply.' As a result, even the cleanest home may have a few resident spiders." I would think that cleanliness must have some affect on spider populations.
I'm in CA so may be different than rest of country, we tend to be dry most of year out here. I have had plenty of spiders so I just use "sticky" mouse glue traps. Come in several types. Box or flat piece with goo all over. Any will work if you keep away from kids & animals so inside fireplace you don't use, in cabinet cats can't get in etc. Best in areas you see the most spiders. Can get 2 or 4 traps for $1 at Dollar type stores & you might get some larger critters too so don't be surprised. Mouse or small lizard.
Don't know if this works, but a friend just sent me this as a helpful hint. Won't hurt to give it a try.
Natural spider killer or preventer... take one cup of vingar, one cup of pepper, a teaspoon of oil and liquid soap. Put it into a spray bottle and spray along the outside of your outside door and along windows; refresh after it rains.
I hear your pain. Your comment resonated for me that you are not afraid of anything else, just spiders, as that is how I've always been. At certain times of the year I often wake up with spider bites, and these bites often inflame and take long to heal. I suspect they are from the small fast light-colored spiders I call biters; I suspect that in part drives my fear. In the basement I find larger sometimes brown but often fast black spiders with long pointy legs. Every year or two I will find an absolutely enormous one that will make me ill to see it, and I had better be able to kill it in order to function in my own home. Even when I do, I have real trouble going back into the basement. On a number of occasions I have bombed the basement with foggers, but really am concerned about chemical residue for me and also my cat, and so do not want to do this anymore. (we leave for the day) although I have found many dead spiders after each bombing. But, I do notice fewer spiders of late, and attribute to 1. spraying foundation 2x a year now, and I think most importantly, 2. completely removing vegetation from around the foundation. I have removed everything from 2 1/2 sides of the house, and hope to complete by the next year or so. I also hope to hire someone to caulk around the inside of the sill plate/openings someday, but haven't found anyone yet. BTW, I don't watch action/thriller or horror movies, but for me Arachnophobia is my go-to horror movie I watch every few years!! I could not continue to live in your house if I couldn't resolve the issue. Good luck!
I have virtually no experience with anything other that an occasional spider. One of my jobs to help my wife is to thoroughly vacuum the entire house once a week. I use attachments to go along base boards and along ceilings. In addition, I use a shop vac to clean the garage. I use a Dyson especially formulated for dog hair as we have two Corgis. I would suggest that as fast as you see spiders or webs, that they get vacuumed up. It helps to be proactive.
I have a small lake cottage that the spiders LOVE.
As strange as it sounds crab apples do a great job of keeping spiders away. I just wish they worked for mice too.
I just set crab apples on a small piece of aluminum foil (for easy clean up later) around the house in out of the way/out of site locations. When the apples have decomposed/dehydrated just use the aluminum foil to wrap them up and throw away.
Good luck!
We live in the Midwest and have lots of spiders including the Wolf variety. Yuck. Especially now that I have a very curious 2 year old she'll stop and look down the tiny holes in the ground. Sometimes I'll see a bunch of beady eyes looking back at us. Then I grab her hand and we run!
My grandma lives in a rural part of the Missouri Ozarks and two years ago just before I pulled in her driveway there was something huge and black in the middle of the road. From a distance I thought it was a weird looking skunk that didn't have a stripe or something. Then I slowed down and realized it had 8 LEGS!!! No one believed me! I swear on my life it was a gigantic tarantula (my dad did tell me they're all over down there because of the very rocky and wooden undisturbed areas.
We did have a lot of spiders at an apartment, and I wiped ammonia across the window and door sills. Sure it may have stripped the paint a little, but I don't remember having another spider.
"something huge and black in the middle of the road. From a distance I thought it was a weird looking skunk that didn't have a stripe or something. Then I slowed down and realized it had 8 LEGS!!! "
and there folks...is tonights nightmare.
harry potter sized spiders.
Just wanted to let you know I also tried those electronic pest devices that plug into outlets. Our backyard led into the woods but I was not happy finding one spider a week inside. I was the same as you with the cleaning and bug spray and even the professional pest control. Nothing worked. I am also scared of spiders so I tried the devices that plug into outlets. I special ordered them off a website and made sure that I used a product that the brad was familiar to me which was Black and Decker. It said to allow up to 2 weeks for them to have the desired effect. Spiders were listed as a pest they are supposed to repell. However, being the type of person to check the walls etc... when I enter a room due to my fear of spiders (as long as I can get to them to kill them I am ok), the problem is I began to see more spiders once those things were plugged in. I went from seeing one a week to seeing 3-4 a day. Maybe the electronic devices were only drawing the spiders that were already in my home out into the open or maybe not. All I know is there were spiders everywhere. It was as though those things were attracting them not repelling them. Instead of only giving them 2 weeks to work I kept thinking maybe it is just me so I gave them 2 months to work and finally my boyfriend admitted to me that I am not nuts those things were bringing more spiders in not keeping them away. So I unplugged every one of them took them out of every room and then I stopped seeing the spiders. I not only went back to seeing them only about once a week it ended up being more like 1-2 times a month. This happened within the day after removing those things from my outlets. Let me know if you find something that works in case this ever happens to me again. Thank you
It sounds strange, but I found out (by accident) that the best way to get rid of spiders (& every other bug) is... more spiders. Namely Daddy Long Legs. They are hunters and voracious spider eaters. They'll eat just about anything & don't bite people. I remember putting sticky traps down. Other spiders would get caught in them but all I'd find the next day were 8 legs & no body. Apparently the DDL can walk right across the traps to get an easy meal. They are to bugs what snakes are to mice. The downside is that they poop out ugly webs but they don't string them across doorways. They look like cobwebs but are easy to spot and knock down. It only takes a few spiders to clean house. They spend the days in a corner and hunt at night. I had 3 or 4 at a time in my house and NO other kind of bug. I even gave them names (the one in the living room I called Fluffy.) If you see a pair of them getting amorous just slurp them into the vacuum cleaner (that'll take the romance out of their eyes!) When spider season is over just slurp your herd of daddy long legs into the vacuum. They are easy to find during the day.
It's an odd solution, but an effective one. That house was in the woods in Washington state (spider central) and leaked like a sieve. But I still never saw any other bugs than Fluffy and his friends.
I learned about daddy long legs from my 90 year old grandma who lives in the Ozarks. Trees, water, and rocks. Eh. They seem to after just about everything but Black Widows and big Brown Recluses which she also has. My grandma would slap the hand and give a stern lecture to anyone who killed a daddy long legs.
Funny we have moved to NE Iowa to a 175 year old farmhouse and I have not seen any daddy long legs. I wish I had some. Maybe I could go to my grandmas house and trap some. I just got through the harvest round of mice killing, but I guess that's another story.
I learned about daddy long legs from my 90 year old grandma who lives in the Ozarks. Trees, water, and rocks. Eh. They seem to after just about everything but Black Widows and big Brown Recluses which she also has. My grandma would slap the hand and give a stern lecture to anyone who killed a daddy long legs.
Funny we have moved to NE Iowa to a 175 year old farmhouse and I have not seen any daddy long legs. I wish I had some. Maybe I could go to my grandmas house and trap some. I just got through the harvest round of mice killing, but I guess that's another story.
I learned about daddy long legs from my 90 year old grandma who lives in the Ozarks. Trees, water, and rocks. Eh. They seem to after just about everything but Black Widows and big Brown Recluses which she also has. My grandma would slap the hand and give a stern lecture to anyone who killed a daddy long legs.
Funny we have moved to NE Iowa to a 175 year old farmhouse and I have not seen any daddy long legs. I wish I had some. Maybe I could go to my grandmas house and trap some. I just got through the harvest round of mice killing, but I guess that's another story.
Me again. The never-ending battle continues. I am moving out of here in less than a year. I think (*hope*) my next place will be better, since it won't be an older house with lots of crevices. And since I've never experienced anything in my life like in this house, I'm hoping it's just this particular house and this plot of land. I've never seen drag-lines crossing doorways or going across rooms during the night like here...it gives me the creeps. I clean any drag-lines immediately.
Then again, I hear about other people who have lots of spiders as well. And something about the bat population being down, the mild winters, more insects for spiders to feed on...all having to do with an increased spider population.
I haven't seen any daddy long legs in a while. Those things scare me, too. But if you're not afraid, then perhaps it's good to have them around for spider control.
I try to keep things in perspective in that at least we don't have those large Australian huntsman spiders here. Or tarantulas. And I haven't seen a wolf spider, brown recluse or black widow (*knock on wood*). If spiders would just stay on the ground and not crawl on walls/ceilings and hang from things and hide in crevices, they would be more bearable for me.
Is anyone else finding spider drag-lines inside your homes? I found one late last night in the kitchen going from the top of the fridge to the ceiling. It must have been made while I was in another room, because it wasn't there an hour before. Spiders are making these drag-lines during the night. I remove the silk threads right when I find them, but I hate it when I walk into one in the dark. Plus, I found two spiders yesterday. This spider stuff is giving me issues...
We just sold our house but we had an awful spider problem but only on the first floor. The half upper story was usually pretty clear, but had the occasional spider. The first floor.. I was constantly running into spiders and they were light colored and they would be on my countertops. But we never really had webs... they just would crawl everywhere and a couple times they would drop down in front of my face! I feel for you, we are building right now and I hope to never deal with that many spiders again. When I saw them I would just get the vaccum and suck them up..
gosh mia, so sorry you are still dealing with this.
Many years ago when I was a student there were cockroaches in my apartment. I had never seen one before and went to a small local pharmacy hysterical. The sold me a box of boric acid (it looks like corn starch) and honestly I made a perimeter around every room, in every corner, in all the windows. Then I started to see dead cockroaches. Needless to say, one semester and I was out. It was a shame really, lovely turn of the century row house with fabulous fireplaces turned into apartments. But yikes, I was afraid I'd bring them home with me. I think I threw almost everything out when I moved, and kept everything else in my car for a week in subzero weather.
At any rate, search for boric acid and spiders, and I sure hope it helps you. I lived alone, and I don't know if you have kids or pets, so that might influence how liberally you dust this stuff around.
And make sure there aren't any bushes, tall grasses, or anything too close to the house that might be a breeding ground with easy access into your house.
I hope this helps! Please keep us posted! Stay positive!
Here is a link that might be useful: Will Borax Kill Spiders?


text:
THE VITAL BODY - LECTURE 9 of 10
— Organizing & Conserving Personal Energy Resources
— Psychic Malpractice: Can We Be
---Influenced Against Our Wills?
— Energy
The first step in the study of the Ancient Wisdom Teachings is not the "quest for knowledge," but the preparation of the self to "receive knowledge." This is the first obstacle faced, where most truth-seekers make their first mistake. With their eyes turned toward the heavens, they rush ecstatically toward "illumination," only to stumble, like Thales, "into the ditch of their own unprepared-ness."
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Linus thinks disassmblers and debuggers are for people who cant code.
Phoronix: An In-Kernel x86 Disassembler For Linux Kernel
Patches for an x86 disassembler for the Linux kernel have been proposed. An in-kernel disassembler could prove useful for developers in cases of kernel panics and other happenings...
Linus thinks disassmblers and debuggers are for people who cant code.
Yaay, let's put everything into the kernel. In 2 years we pull in gcc, in 3 years we'll have in-kernel firefox. Kernelcode is just *faster*.
I fear for Tanenbaum's health today.
//EDIT: Also, what will happen if the UVD part of fglrx crashes Bridgemans PC? He will have disassembled, copyrighted UVD code at his screen... Will he ever be allowed to even think about implementing UVD into the FOSS driver again?
Last edited by V10lator; 04-05-2012 at 03:20 AM.
2. (EDIT) If they put debugging symbols etc that would be their problem. And I don´t think Bridgeman uses linux, eitherway he is not forced to it.
"Will he ever be allowed to even think about"
I never knew AMD censors his brains.