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Does Anyone Here Who Went Induction Regret Your Choice?
Initially, I didn't even want to entertain the idea of replacing my range with an induction model. But I've read nothing but glowing reviews from those responding to my queries on this/Cooking & Kitchen forums. I feel myself beginning to cave....
I'd love to hear from anyone who has owned and used an induction range who now second guesses their choice. Do any of you wish you'd stuck with a gas cooktop?
I just want to say that in comparison with gas, it may be a toss up. We don't have gas where we live so electric is our only choice. So, between the old coil top range I had before and the induction - of course induction wins hands down. I have only cooked on gas for the 4 years in college and really missed it, but that's been 30 yrs ago :)
I would think the induction would be safer than gas? especially with young ones around? but I'm thinking of the old range I had in college where you could bump the knob and it turned just enough for gas to escape but not light. Bad thing!
Um, no-offense, but it kinds sounds like you are feeling peer-pressured.
Induction is a choice to consider, but I think we get distracted when we look at induction in the abstract. You do not buy a stove in the abstract. (Well, I suppose some people try to do that which may well lead to regrets.) What I mean is that you might find this easier if you were looking at specific models of stoves and found out how well (or poorly) their mixes of other features and trade-offs matches up with your preferences.
You may very well find that that the induction stoves overall give you more, less, or not enough of what you want from a stove. You may very well find out, as I recently did, that it is the mix of other features and functions that matter more than whether the stoves has induction or gas on the cooktop.
I say this as somebody who has used induction off and on over three decades, whose cookware is almost entirely induction suitable, who set out to buy an induction stove, and wound up buying --- what, a gas stove? Yup. For me, it turned out not to be a choice between gas or induction but, rather, was a matter of seeing that each stove has its own mix of features and tradeoffs, and the ones that eventually nudged my decision were features and tradeoffs other than induction versus gas stoves.
The thing was, I had a budget. I also had taken the time to write out a list of "absolute must have" features and separated out the list of "would like to haves." There were numbers of induction stoves out there, but when I factored in the budget limit and my "must have" list, I discovered that there were only two free-standing induction stoves that I liked well enough to consider buying. Neither was ideal. (Well, actually, each had some aspects for which I really did not care.) So, I also looked at the gas and dual-fuel stoves in my price range, I wound up with a similarly short list.
WHen I seriously compared the four stoves, what I found was that there was no choice between gas or induction. The choice was between stove s A, B c and D. Choosing between them was mainly about about things other than gas versus induction. Some things were relatively trivial. For example, I'm okay with using backsplash mounted digital touchpad controls but I'm happier using front-of-stove-mounted rotary knob controls. Maybe you hate touchpad controls? That pretty much knocks out induction for you. Unless, of course, you have the $5K+ budget for an Ilve (now on offer at AJ Madison) o5 the $7.2k budget for a Viking induction range. (I really liked the Viking, which can be had in color, but the financially implausible price took it out of the running for me.)
Now, clearly there are going to be some things that affect preferences strongly. If your neighborhood was devastated by Sandy and Athena, one may have a dim (pun intended) view of induction and any electric stove. In some communities, though, there was no gas or electric service, so nothing particularly to regret in the choice of a stove in that event.
Ultimately, then, when you ask about regretting getting induction, I think you will find that most objections were to the particular stove or cooktop rather than induction in general.
I went induction but have a fear of gas.
I was planning on getting over my irrational fear when I discovered induction.
I am still making friends with it- I would recommend testing it before taking the plunge.
It is amazing that I can use it like a crock pot or boil water super fast.
There is buzzing- I think those who say - no buzzing might need hearing aids.
The buzzing is most noticeable with layered pans than single metal pans but there are advantages to the layers also.
The buzzing is also louder when the pan is cold.
Would I do it again - yes
Never looked back. Love the induction. It has cut our cooking time, Pan warm up , heating oil or boiling water is very fast . I also use the very low heat as a slow cooker. We usually can start cooking dinner at least fifteen minuted latter from when we used Gas. Reflected in our utility bills Our Gas and Electric bill arrive as one bill. Our gas is way down and electric is only slightly higher...
Thank you for the responses.
JWVideo, I don't feel I'm succumbing to peer pressure to buy an induction range, but I do feel that I should push myself to be more open-minded to the concept because I could be missing out on something I'd love to have and use. I grew up around electric ranges and that's all I cooked on before we moved to a home that had a dual fuel range in it. I don't think I would ever have gone out and purchased one, but it has added so much to my cooking enjoyment. I tend to stick with tried & true, so the pressure I feel is coming from me.
As you did, I've listed my wants/needs and while budget isn't as constraining as it would have been if we hadn't decided to wait until after the holidays to purchase, cost is something I have to consider. Since my range is probably the most important purchase I'll make in the next 10 yrs. I'm willing to splurge a bit, but that would mean compromises somewhere else.
I haven't yet thought about what my "dream range" would be (given the current layout of my kitchen) if I could choose anything with no concerns about cost.
No regrets here. Unless you must have the look, or you really want to turn knobs, I don't see the argument for gas anymore. Maybe there's some ultra gourmet dish that will turn out more perfectly with gas, I don't know. What I like best with induction is the precision, power, speed, ease of clean up, extra flat work surface and safety. I'm glad to be done with gas. Just one opinion.
I'm glad you are not feeling pressured. I was just concerned because we here at GW sometimes tend to unbridled positivism. I'm sure I've contributed my share of it on induction.
If you liked a DF stove after moving from electric stoves, you likely will enjoy induction.
The buzzing thing is hard to generalize about except to say that the occurrence of buzzing seems to vary between the stoves (and cooktops) and the cookware used, and noises register differently with different people in different situations. If you have not already read it, this thread illustrates the variety of different experiences and reactions:
I want to second a2gemini's suggestion of trying to find a place where you can either try out induction cooking or at least see an up-close demonstration.
BTW, I know exactly what you meant when you said "I'm willing to splurge a bit, but that would mean compromises somewhere else." That's the point I reached when I decided it was time to look at my actual choices and make concrete comparisons between them. I really liked the GE slide-in induction range (except for the Jetson-cat-eye oven glass styling) but buying that stove meant me giving up the dishwasher I was pretty sure I wanted (and getting a much cheaper and noisier and slower model.) That's what prompted be to make concrete comparisons between stoves I actually could consider.
Induction for 7 years now in the current house and the new house will be getting its induction cooktop next week.
Talking cooktops here, not ranges, but hubby and I had always thought we would install propane if we ever replaced our coil cooktop. I can't stand regular electric cooktop; used in a few vacation rentals, the surfaces get extremely hot, difficult to clean. We don't have gas available so propane would have been our only option. We had checked out induction years ago, but then felt gas would be a better option for us. My mom has gas and I've cooked on it on and off over the years, but last Spring Break I cooked extensively on hers the week we were there and did not like the heat generated while doing long term cooking. I didn't like the clean up of her gas range either. When we decided to update this fall, we went for induction for many reasons. A biggy was nothing special added on as part of the switch from coil; ours was already wired properly with 220V so no upgrade necessary.
The induction is a delite to cook on and a breeze to clean up. Pots heat up, not the cooktop. Cooking bacon? Layer paper towels on the cooktop between it and the pan - simply toss them when you are done! Water boils faster than my microwave. When cooking, the response time is immediate. We do not grill inside - we grill outside year round. We are not into deep frying foods, although I cannot see that as being an issue if we did.
I have a Bosch 800 series, I have no issues with strange noises that I have noticed. There is a very, very slight hum at the beginning when a pot is on the highest setting with boost.
I did read after installing that induction is considered the most efficient cooking; induction somewhere around 80%, followed by electric and I don't remember that efficiency, and last was gas with about 40% efficiency. I don't regret the decision we made.
No regrets here. Hubby loves frying eggs on the induction cooktop, over the old coil style cooktop. He says they cook more evenly. I love the easy clean-up on the smooth top. One of my sisters has a Wolf range and the thought of moving those humongous cast iron grates, to clean up and around each burner, makes me shudder.
Induction is actually more efficient in the kitchen than 80% and gas may be less than 40% efficient. Power ratings (KwH for electric and BTU-Hr for gas) are about energy consumed. The US DOE says that induction burners put at least 84% of their input energy into the pot. Some manufacturers adertise that their units are rated at 90% efficiency. The efficiency of gas burners is variable with 40% being the high end. Depending on factors such as pot-size, burner-size, burner grate designs, and altitude, gas burners often drop as low as 33% (the rest goes into the kitchen as waste heat.) So, your point is even stronger.
Of course, while induction is hands-down the most efficient use of electricity for cooking, we are not talking about "green energy." When you factor in production and transmission activities, neither gas nor electricity turns out to be any more green than the other.
>>>Unless you must have the look, or you really want to turn knobs, I don't see the argument for gas anymore. Maybe there's some ultra gourmet dish that will turn out more perfectly with gas, I don't know.I might have agreed with this six months ago, but that was before I started comparing actual stoves I might buy. By going through the process of comparing stoves and actually having to buy one, well, that taught me that there still can be plenty of arguments for having a gas stove.
I do agree that some of the arguments about gas vs induction have seemed a little silly at times, particularly the neo-Luddite claptrap about high-end gas stoves being necessary for ultra-gourmet cooking. There is no such thing as an ultra-gourmet dish that will turn out more perfectly on gas. Well, except for those people who want ultra-gourmet roasted/charred peppers on a stovetop or, maybe, ultra-gourmet s'mores. ;>)
But just as I would say that there is no reason to not consider induction as choice (except for those who do not have ready access to a sufficient 240v circuit), so also I would say that there no inherent reason to automatically reject gas stoves.
I do think that almost everybody who buys an induction stove is happy with induction cooking. They might not be happy with their particular stove or cooktop but the things that make them unhappy are rarely induction itself.
BUT, there still are plenty of reasons why somebody might find that they prefer stove A (which happens to be gas) over stove B (which happens to be induction). Personal preferences go well beyond the choice of knob controls over touchpads.
Again, I want to emphasize that I'm talking about choosing between real stoves which have attributes beyond having gas and induction burners. Those other attributes can wind up mattering in different ways to different people. I cited the control knob thing as an example of something that will be unimportant to some folks, interesting to others, and really crucial to still others. Besides the example of control designs, here are some other considerations which may shift preferences towards one stove or the other:
(a) Cooktop space: do you want to be able to run four large pots at once and be able to put any pot, anywhere on the cooktop? For example, I do about 12 or 14 events a year where it is handy for me to run, say, two 12-inch skillets and two large diameter stockpots on a 30-inch stove (which is the cooking appliance I have to run in my small kitchen). When I looked at stoves in my budget range, I found one gas stove (a pro-style range) which allows me to do that. There were two induction stoves in my budget range that met my other requirements, but both were freestanding ranges whose backsplashes crowded the cooktop. Clearly, this kind of cooktop space is not something that everybody will want or need. But, if you do want it, as I did, then this is a factor that will favor gas stove A over induction stoves B & C.
(b) How you feel about long term durability and repairability? Induction stoves run through proprietary electronics which give them lots of features. However, most of us cannot fix much of anything that could go wrong and we all know that circuit boards and high-heat can be problemmatic. The long term durability of the current proprietary circuit boards (and the long term availability of replacements) is just not known. I am not saying this makes induction a bad choices;only that we do not yet have the track record to reassure those folks for whom this is a concern.
OTOH, many (if not most) gas stoves and cooktops use standardized, simple, durable and mature designs with reliable components which are readily available from local parts supply warehouses. Many homeowners can do their own repairs. For those gas and DF stoves which have electronics running the oven, a failed oven controller will not take down the whole stove. You may still be able to use the cooktop. Obviously, this may be of less concern if you have a kitchen large enough to separate the cooktop and oven(s), but not everybody does. Equally obviously, there are some models of gas stoves where everything is run through a controller whose failure takes down the whole stove. The latter two points bring me back to the need to look concretely at actual stoves. For those bothered by the uncertainty, a simple AG stove may be preferrable to induction.
(c) Do you run large canning kettles? You may not be able to use them on certain induction stoves whose manuals forbid pots over a certain diameter. (Some makers advise that efficiency is served by using pots with diameters no more than 1" greater than the burner diameter, but say you can go greater if you want to. Others may say going over that diameter may damage the cooktop. Other makers may tell you that running two large canners could be excessive weight for the cooktop or could otherwise damage the stove. You do not have those kinds of problems with gas stoves (or coil-burner electric stoves, for that matter.) Again, this will be a concern for some people and not others. If it is a concern, it may favor the gas stove over the induction one.
(d) Do you want to run a large, rectangular stove-top griddle? Some induction stove and cooktop manuals forbid spanning burners with a large griddle. Others have burner arrangements that make running a large rectangular griddle infeasible. But, then there are the GE induction stoves (freestanding PHB925/915 and slide-in PHS925) which have two 8" diamter burners aligned to permit bridging and GE will tell you that you can do so. Samsung's NE597NOPBSR has twin burners that can be linked and run as a single 9" x 18" burner for rectangular griddles, roasting pans and other other very large pots. (LG has an induction cooktop that also does this, and comes with its own griddle). But GE, Samsung and LG models start at $2k and go up from there. If you are working with a $1500 stove budget, this factor may favor gas stoves over the induction stoves (Maytag, Whirlpool and a Samsung NE595) which are in that price range.
(e) What are the relative costs of electricity and gas in your particular area? For me, who lives in town with electricity supplied at 11.5 cents/KwH by a large regional utility conglomerate, the difference between the cost of running induction and gas stoves will be small if not trivial. Not so for my rancher friends who are served by a rural electric coop for whom "deregulation" has resulted in electric rates of 35 to 40 cents per KwH.
(f) Do you live in an area where extended power outages are a problem and, if so, do you have convenient back-ups and alternatives for cooking? Some do, some do not. For those who do, having induction is not a problem. For those who do not have ready back-ups (say folks in tall buildings in NYC) there have been a lot of postings about this in the wake of Sandy and Athena, a factor that for many of them now favors gas stoves.
(g) There is no question that induction burners put less heat into your kitchen, but the importance of this fact varies. This factor will be important to folks who live in a hot climate in a house with central air conditioning, It will be a good deal less important to somebody who (like me) lives in the Northern Rockies where we commonly have 8 months of winter and few homes have central air conditioning.
This is a short way with a potentially very long list but I think it points out considerations that may warrant buying a gas stove over an induction one.
Now, to go back to the point of the original question, I think what the OP is looking for is the experience of persons who for some reason did not like induction after they bought an induction cooktop or stove. She would like to hear (and I think it would be interesting to find out) what it was that they did not like. When you know their reasons, you can decide how applicable or inapplicable those reasons are to your own situation. It may be that somebody regrets after having been left "power-less" in the wake of Sandy/Athena, a reason that may or may not be important for the OP.
Or, it may be that nobody here will express regrets and the only way to find out will be a long thread of postings from folks with no regrets.
This post was edited by JWVideo on Mon, Nov 26, 12 at 19:34
Depends on what you require in terms of conversion/cost for decisions.
I always had natural gas and loved it. When we moved to Washington, it was all propane or electric. Propane is similar but not as nice (for me) compared to natural gas. The house we bought had electric and adding propane where the cooktop was would add $600-800 just for the connection. I do not regret induction at all...AS responsive as natural gas...maybe even a little better.
My only regret was that I had several thousand $$ in all-clad brushed aluminum cookware, which would not work on induction. I have enough le creuset that it was not an immediate hardship, just an emotional/cost one.
No regrets here. Mine was a semi-impulse purchase because I saw a good deal on a floor model; I had been using electric coils. I like induction for the same reasons as everyone else, though I will say that I don't think the quality of my cooking has changed at all. It's just another method of applying heat to food. It is more fun, though -- meaning the quickness of temperature changes. I never liked smoothtop electric at all; this is not the same.
I was going for a more or less vintage look in my kitchen remodel, so aesthetically speaking, the white coil top range probably fit in better than the induction one. [grin] I still like my induction, though, and I'd buy it again -- but if cost were a major concern, I wouldn't change out a working range for it; I'd wait till the range needed replacing and then get induction.
p.s. Part of the fun was finding new cookware, which in my case was not a lot (some of mine worked on induction already); and I treated myself to a blue enameled cast iron dutch oven, which is a joy to use just because it's pretty to look at.
The one "problem" with induction that I haven't solved is canning. All of my big pressure canners are aluminum, so they don't work on induction. Some of of my water bath kettles are granite ware and some are stainless, but the stainless ones are only weakly magnetic, so they don't work well, and they heat quite spottily compared to the gas burners.
I have never heard of a magnetic-metal pressure canner, though I suppose it may be technically possible to make one (it would be very heavy, I think). And replacing my water bath canners (basically enormous stock pots) with induction-ready ones would be a formidable cost.
I have both an induction unit now and my gas (propane) range. If I were forced to replace my range I would try to find a "dual-fuel" model (not diff. top and oven fuels, but both induction and gas on the top.) Not sure if such a creature even exists outside of one French model (Lacanche, I think) which is too pricey for me.
We have solar panels so switching as much cooking as possible to induction is to use more home-grown power, which is the greenest, and most reliable into the future, power source, as well.
But no canning. (Plus, a vexation with induction, I can't use my pyrex glass double boiler. I'd really miss it if all I had was induction, YMMV.)
Re buzz: my induction unit makes a mildly audible hum, but the cooking noises easily drown it out, even just boiling water or the slight crackle of heating oils overpowers the hum. Heck, even whisking a bechamel sauce is louder than the hum.
My induction unit is a portable Viking, and only 110V, so I imagine cooking on a built-in unit is even better.
lirio and sandra - I also can a lot. I bought a 21 quart induction-ready water bath canner for about $70. It's currently listed on Amazon for $90 - see link. This works on my induction cooktop and is more solid than my old granite wear. Like the granite WB canners, the steel one comes with a canning rack which will hold up to 8 wide mouth quart jars.
Pressure canning isn't possible with induction yet. The only approved pressure canners are aluminium. We got a propane burner which we set up outside on the patio. If you search on the Harvest forum, you'll find a lot of people do their pressure canning this way, whether they have gas or induction in their kitchens.
Fagor makes a pressure cooker which is induction ready. I've used it several times to cook beans and chickpeas. If you wanted to take the risk, you could use it to can, but as there's no gauge and no weights you wouldn't know what the true pressure actually was.
Here is a link that might be useful: Ball water bath canner
I have a stand alone portable burner for the pressure canner. I speed the process up by filling it with boiling water heated on the you-know-what.
Here is a link that might be useful: Waring Portable Burner
liriodendron: "(Plus, a vexation with induction, I can't use my pyrex glass double boiler. I'd really miss it if all I had was induction, YMMV.)"
While I do not doubt your sincerity, this vexation sounds odd; OMDV. Before we switched to induction -- 13 years ago -- we used a double boiler (bain marie) frequently; we have seen no need at all to use one since the switch. At low heat -- we can set induction lower than any level that we could maintain with gas -- using a decent pot, our induction cooktop distributes the heat so evenly that can do anything (including melting chocolate) that we ever did with a bain marie, so we gave away the latter to a friend who does not have induction.
Thank you JXBrown for the burner link. That is just what I am looking for! I dont really want replace my current canning supplies since I only use them for a few weeks each year. A pro for a stand alone unit is I can locate it anywhere, using my current stuff, and still cook on my induction. Thank you!
liriodendron wrote: >>>" If I were forced to replace my range I would try to find a "dual-fuel" model (not diff. top and oven fuels, but both induction and gas on the top.) Not sure if such a creature even exists outside of one French model (Lacanche, I think) which is too pricey for me."Check out American Range's "Step-Up Hybdrids" which combine gas and induction in a range.
>>>"We have solar panels so switching as much cooking as possible to induction is to use more home-grown power, which is the greenest, and most reliable into the future, power source, as well."Is your solar system linked to the grid or is it an off-the-grid system?I ask because you need a very big system to run an induction stove and range.If you've got a linked system (where you are basically selling power back to the grid), there should be no problem running an induction stove.But, for off-the-grid use, a four-burner induction stove and electric oven require 240v/50amp power supply which is a lot more than many solar voltaic systems produce. Your countertop induction unit is different. It only using a 120v/15amp circuit (or maybe a 20 amp circuit.)It's still a big draw for most solar panel systems but is manageable the way things like like microwaves and blow dryers may be "do-able" with home solar power.
This post was edited by JWVideo on Tue, Nov 27, 12 at 15:11
amck --
I kept thinking I'd seen another long discussion of your question and finally stumbled across it. (Sometimes stuff turns up in Google more easily than it does with GW's search engine.) Anyway, the discussion in the link below started in 2007 and ran up through last year, and you may find additional info in it.
Here is a link that might be useful: Challenge: anyone w/ induction exp who'd go back to gas?
Following up on herring_maven's question, what do you use that glass double boiler for? I've found that numbers of recent stoves of various kinds can go low and evenly enough that a double boiler is not needed. For example, the gas stove I now have is one that supposedly allows me to melt chocolate on a paper plate without burning the paper. While I think that's a stupid pet trick, I have not had any trouble, say, melting chocolate in a saucepan and holding it for over an hour. Likewise, with the induction stoves I've cooked on previously, I've never ever needed a double boiler.
OTOH, maybe you are just used to working with that Pyrex pan and don't want to change techniques and recipes? In that case, you can put a cast-iron skillet on an induction burner and it will work like a hot plate for your glass pot.Or, you could buy an "induction interface disk."See http://www.chefscatalog.com/catalog/search.aspx?scommand=search&search=max%2bburton for an example.
A CI pan or induction disk will be fine for anything I can think of making in a glass double-boiler. Also, Cooks Illustrated reports finding that they had no difficulty making very excellent pancakes in a non-stick aluminum skillet over a disk on countertop induction unit.In theory, you also could use the disk to run a big canning kettle or pressure canner, but my experience has been otherwise.When I tried doing that with a 20 quart aluminum canning kettle on a cast-iron griddle over an induction stove, it took foreeverrrrrrrr to even get to a simmer. Maybe somebody else has had a different experience?
This post was edited by JWVideo on Wed, Nov 28, 12 at 1:14
I appreciate all the replies. And, JWVideo, I will check out the link you supplied above. You've raised many points to ponder in your posts and I am weighing all the pros/cons.
I'm no great chef, but a pretty good home cook. I enjoy the process, and one thing I realized is that I've really liked working the big, sturdy front knobs on my Dacor to control the gas flame. For most of my life I've driven a car with a stick shift. Initially it was because back when I bought my first car, they were less expensive than automatics. Years later, I paid a premium for standard shift because though it required more effort, I enjoyed driving more when I was more engaged. I think, initially, I would miss my knobs if I went to electronic controls. Subjective factors, like these, I know I'll have to figure out myself.
When I posted this question I thought that under the cloak of anonymity some folks might dare to say they tried induction, liked many aspects, but now missed cooking on gas. I can't help thinking of when water beds came out (yes, I'm that old..)and everyone I knew who'd bought one was singing their praises and encouraging us to buy one, too. In very short time they all ditched the waterbeds, which they later said had never been comfortable or practical.
By the lack of negatives regarding induction on any GW forums, I'm becoming more & more convinced this isn't a "waterbed" situation where people are wanting to justify their choice. I'm reading that folks who've traded gas for induction are really happy with their choice.
JWVideo, I wrote the post above before I began reading through the posts you linked from '07. I was surprised to see in just the first few posts that others had compared using gas v. induction to driving stick v. automatic vehicles.
On the one hand I'm disappointed (& a little red-faced) because I thought my comparison was an original thought. But I also feel a little relieved. I was afraid no one else would relate to the comparison.
Lots of good information in that thread. Thanks again for providing it.
No need to be embarassed by not finding the other thread. You didn't know it was there and it didn't turn up in the search engine for me even though I thought I remembered it being out there. That seems to happen sometimes with the GW search engine. I only found it because it turned up today for me in an entirely unrelated Google search.
If the stick shift analogy works for you, go with it. I've also used a diesel engine vs gas engine analogy. TS Eliot once said that bad poets merely borrow but good poets steal. Or something like that. He probably stole that from somebody else. And never apologized. :>)
I love the comparison - in reality, I love to drive a stick shift and had one most of my adult (and teen years).
I now have an automatic (after 2 years with a Mustang-DH choice but I had to drive it in the snow as I only have to drive a couple miles vs 40 miles for DH)
I guess my cooking will be automatic transmission also!
For those with the canning setups, couldn't you just go get a small cast iron dutch oven or small pan or something similar and put it inside, on the bottom of your existing pot? Then fill up the pot with water and put on the induction unit
Then the induction would be acting on a the right type of metal (through the aluminum or steel) and be much more efficient since the entire heated surface would be exposed to the water.
I had gas growing up, in my first 2 apartments and in our first 3 house (as an adult). I made the switch to our Miele 36" 5 burner Induction Cooktop prob 2 years ago, and I will never, never, never, never, never, never, never own or cook on gas again. Induction is quicker, much more efficient, better and supremely precise, BUT...for is it is really about the clean up. NO heavy iron grates, no scrubbing food and liquids off the cooktop or range, no knods, no gas burner parts and bolts/rings. With induction it is really a spray of Windex and a swipe or 2 with a microfiber cloth. Voila...clean and shiny. Now, I do not even think twice about doing a stir fry, frying chicken or potatoes. And the kitchen stays SO, SO much cooler. There is NO heat from the gas flame making the kitchen hot!! I love Induction more than words can describe!!!!!
I'd have to say the canning issue is the only thing I regret about induction - and since I raise most of our food, it's a big thing.
I don't have gas on the property, or I don't think I'd have gone induction - but now that we have it, I don't think I'll ever give it up - but if we move, I'll have a gas hob or two also - just for canning.
My current solution includes a 10qt Fagor Stainless cooker/canner (smallest size considered "safe" to use as a canner) for small batches on the induction cooktop.
I have a 220 hotplate that I can use the bigger aluminum canners on, and the best solution, not practical for many, I have a summer kitchen with a coil cooktop.
I'm just starting to get into wok cooking, and I cheat in that I have an electric one.
My mom and dad canned for years using a Coleman gas camp stove. I think it was a 2-burner. Mom got it all ready and dad sat out in the carport in a lawn chair and watched the stove. Didn't have to worry about heating up the kitchen either. If you want to can, having an induction cooktop doesn't need to stop you ;)
I've read where folks use Bayou propane cookers for canning. I don't can -- I just read. Various sizes and types, way more BTUs than any home range indoors.
Here is a link that might be useful: Lotsa BTUs
What a great thread. One thing that has sold me on induction (making the switch in January) is the safety factor. If you have small children -- or, like me, if you have an occasional Bad Cat incident -- having a constantly cool stovetop is a blessing. I haven't had a gas stove in 30 years because I don't like the notion of pilot lights. I just have an irrational paranoia they are "giving off" something into the air.
Induction might be helpful for someone -- say, an elderly person, or my husband ;-) -- with an attention span that isn't all it should be. Interestingly, at my son's university in the UK, they have ripped out all the gas stoves and replaced them with induction in the past year due to safety concerns, and because they are more energy efficient.
I have used a variety of induction units while traveling, it looks to me as if gas is fading fast in Europe. I will be surprised if, ten years from now, there are many professional chefs in Europe still using gas. That said, I do see the sensory attraction of a real flame. And it hasn't been too many years since I gave up my stick shift, either.
The safety factor isn't just a consideration for families with little kids. I have teenagers that like to cook. They're wonderful kids, but teenagers aren't known for their attention to detail or taking care with things that might be dangerous. I worried about the occasional towel or hot pad edge catching fire, or not turning off the hob completely, or catching s sleeve on fire. To be honest, had I decided that induction was not for me, I'd still have gotten gas and just done some intensive training. But the more I read the more I liked it...instant heat adjustment, easy clean up and turn off timers on each burner. The actuality of it has not disappointed and I have absolutely no regrets.
We started out thinking we would go with induction. Reasons we changed our minds:
* We would have to upgrade our electrical supply, which would cost around $5K.
* We don't like the way pans with convex bottoms spin around on smoothtops (lots of All Clad pans come that way).
* Inexpensive aluminium non-stick skillets that can be replaced when they wear out don't work on induction.
* We like having multiple big burners and not having the cooktop dictate which pan must go where.
* We don't like that buzzing noise.
* >>> EDIT: THIS ONE IS A MYTH, FOLKS HERE RAN TESTS FOR ME AND HIT 550F easily ON induction >>> We want to sear with very high heat (enough to cause an induction cooktop to shut down).
* We want to use a real (thin, spherical bottomed) wok with very high heat.
* We want to be able to cook when the power is out.
* A "pro style" gas rangetop that jumps out at you as soon as you walk into the kitchen is better for resale than a smoothtop ("wow" factor). Induction is still something you have to explain, and in sales, like politics, "if you're explaining, you're losing".
Even despite all of the above, I still have some regrets. Our ideal kitchen would have a combination of gas and induction. We may very well get a countertop induction burner for super-low/long simmering (yes, we plan a CC rangetop).
This post was edited by PeterH2 on Sat, Dec 8, 12 at 14:49
" * We don't like the way pans with convex bottoms spin around on smoothtops (lots of All Clad pans come that way). "
FWIW, we have an 8 year-old set of the All-Clad 'Stainless' pots & pans. They are flat and sit beautifully flat on our new induction cooktop. No buzzing sound, either.
I would not want to put in an induction cooktop if I had to upgrade for $5000 either. I just had to add a circuit for a speed oven and add a subpanel and that only cost a few hundred dollars, but prices may be higher where you live than here in San Diego. Both of my induction cooktops replaced existing electric cooktops so no upgrade was needed.
The buzz is minimal. Many pans don't buzz at all and the sound of boiling water is louder than the buzz from the ones that do.
I use inexpensive, non-stick Farberware Millenium pans. Most of my pans are cheap and none of them spin. The Farberware pans are pretty sturdy. The two that I have are at least 6 years old and frequently used. Their coating is still fine. Most of my other pans are Lodge or Sitram stainless -- all inexpensive. I'm surprised that All-Clad are a problem, I thought they had a pretty good reputation.
High heat searing is not a problem. The only time I've had a pan overheat and shut down the burner was a time that I forgot that I was heating an empty pan. I was pleased that it was smarter than me.
I don't match pan size to the circles on t he cooktop. I just use whichever is convenient. My little tiny moka pot and my water bath canner both work fine.
I'm not in any way criticizing your decision. However, anybody who is worried about the issues you list should be reassured that they are very unlikely to be a problem. Since we do not experience weather events here in paradise, I can remember only one power outage in the last decade (a transformer went out) and it was back when I had a fancy gas range. I went out for a pizza rather than cooking in the dark!
PeterH2: "We started out thinking we would go with induction. Reasons we changed our minds"
I agree with you completely. No question: you, especially, never should try induction. You have enumerated a litany of conspiracy theories that suggest that any ills that you would suffer after a switch to induction would be blamed upon the technology.
"* We would have to upgrade our electrical supply, which would cost around $5K."
Amps is amps, watts is watts, and volts is volts. If you currently using an electric range for cooking, or, if your household can support an electric clothes dryer, chances are very high that you would not need to upgrade your electrical supply. Just look at the electrical specification (amps, watts, volts) and see whether you really would need to upgrade. Most households in the United States would not need to upgrade.
"* We don't like that buzzing noise."
Have you ever heard a buzzing noise from pots on an induction cooktop? No, I thought not. Yes, some (rare) pans have resonances that induction units can incite. If the noise bothers you, you can replace the specific pots; but the odds are that you will not encounter the rare pot that buzzes. The vast majority of pots do not buzz on induction hobs.
"* We want to be able to cook when the power is out."
The citizens of San Bruno, California, discovered that cooking with gas allows you to have a barbecue out in the street even if the electrical power is out: see the link below.
"* A "pro style" gas rangetop that jumps out at you as soon as you walk into the kitchen is better for resale than a smoothtop ("wow" factor)."
The projected theoretical future resale value certainly will improve your ease of cooking (and clean-up) while you still live in your home, and will make the food that you have cooked on the non-induction cooktop taste ever so much better, to be sure. We make all decisions about the equipment of our own home solely on the basis of whether potential purchasers in the future of our home are likely to be ignorant. We seriously expect that the future buyers (whom we have not yet met) will be under-informed.
Here is a link that might be useful: Neighborhood S'mores party
This post was edited by herring_maven on Thu, Dec 13, 12 at 12:57
As the resident pro-induction curmudugeon who wound up with a gas stove, I want to respond to Peter H2.
It strikes me that the posting is putting us back to the ongoing, irresolvable gas versus induction partisanship which does not answer amck's question. Amck wante to know about people who had induction and didn't like it.
PeterH2's points are mostly reasons that a gas partisan would never buy induction. Which is fine, but off the point.
For example: Peter's kitchen either does not have 240v service at all or does not have wiring sufficient for the 40 amp or 50 amp service required for most induction ranges. (Or maybe he was looking to install both an electric oven and an induction cooktop which would require additional breakers and maybe more lines.) This is a reason to not get induction at all rather than a reason that induction turned out to be unsatisfactory when in use..
>>>"* We don't like the way pans with convex bottoms spin around on smoothtops (lots of All Clad pans come that way)."Some people have had this problem but most of us do not. This strikes me as an All-clad warranty issue, not an induction issue.
>>>"* Inexpensive aluminium non-stick skillets that can be replaced when they wear out don't work on induction."Agreed, though I'm not sure how much a a downside this really is. Buying induction does limit cookware choices. But, if I had induction, would I be throwing it out because I couldn't use a $15 aluminum NS skillet? I don't think so.
>>>"* We like having multiple big burners and not having the cooktop dictate which pan must go where."Well, it seems to me that this is about stove design and layout, and not really about induction. PetereH2 seems to me to be comparing a range with a pro-style cooktop to a freestanding range. You pretty much get to the same place even if both stoves happen to be induction or gas. Make no mistake, I think this flexibility can be important to some folks, as it was for me. I found that there were induction stoves that could give me this flexibility. They just cost more than my budget allowed. So, again, we have to be talking about specific stoves. The comparison of specific stoves may lead to choice that actually has little to do with induction.
There is one caveat to this. Induction burners can limit flexibility a bit. A 12" diameter induction burner may not recognize a 5" diameter pan. If I have an induction stove and want to use that 5" diameter pan (say for the morning oatmeal), I pretty much need to put it on one of the small burners on the induction stove. I don't see that as a particular problem but it is an important consideration to some folks. Again, however, this is a reason you decide to not buy a particular induction stove rather than a reason you now wish you had not bought an induction.
>>>"* We don't like that buzzing noise."This is one of those things that gets tossed around and makes me wonder if this is this personal experience or an assumption from what reading? If your experience was with a countertop/hotplate unit, that may not be representative. I've got experience with induction stoves going back three decades in which I hardly ever heard any buzzing. OTOH, I recently was given a Max Burton portable induction burner and find there can be a lot of initial noise when firing up a pan on it's higher power. It is less of a buzz and more like combination of high-pitched hum and a vibrating, ringing rattle. Goes away as the pans reach full heat. The countertop unit is also, by far, the noisiest induction appliance I've ever used because of the cooling fan. It is definitely a portable unit. But, even so, that tabletop unit is hardly representative of my experience with stoves.
>>>"* We want to sear with very high heat (enough to cause an induction cooktop to shut down)."Again, I have to ask if this is personal experience or something you read in a manual about over-temperature protections? I have to say that I've never had such a problem with any induction stove I've ever used. I've gotten cast iron pans pretty near red-hot on a Cooktek unit without the burner shutting down.
>>>"* We want to use a real (thin, spherical bottomed) wok with very high heat."This kind of comment provokes me to say -- you want authentic and exquisite? Skip the frigging residential range and install a tiled stall with a full-on commercial wok system (and commercial venting system) or at least go to the back-yard with 50k-btu-hr turkey fryer burner. Okay, rant over.
There is nothing wrong with traditional wok cooking and, if you really enjoy round bottomed woks, they induction stoves are not for you. (Cooktek and some other companies do make concave wokking units, but that is a lot of expense and specialization. If you hate flat bottomed woks and really want round bottomed units on extraordinary heat, then you are not interested in induction stoves.
>>>"* We want to be able to cook when the power is out."When people say this, I am reminded that not everybody is as fortunate as I am to have to have multiple back-up systems. This subject is a valid reason for deciding that any electrical stove components are not for you. As I said repeatedly above, this factor may be a reason that numbers of folks might decide to abandon electric stoves in the wake of Sandy and Athena. In my case, I've got a generator with which I can power my rangehood while running an LP-fueld camp stove in the kitchen, if I had induction and lost power. I can run my gas-bbq-grill oven (with quarry tiles) as an oven. If I lived in a n urban highrise, I could not do any of this. So, this is a real consideration.
>>>"* A "pro style" gas rangetop that jumps out at you as soon as you walk into the kitchen is better for resale than a smoothtop ("wow" factor). Induction is still something you have to explain, and in sales, like politics, "if you're explaining, you're losing"."Well, maybe if you are flipping a house or trying to sell it on HGTV, but this strikes me as a discussion about stoves and maybe more than a little misdirected. Will people find a kitchen more "impressive" with a a $7k pro-style gas stove than they would with, say, a $1500 induction stove that most will assume is standard radiant smooth top? Of course. That's like saying people will be more impressed with your $100K Mercedes than with my fifteen-year old Subaru. But, if I have a $7.2k Viking induction range instead of a similarly expensive gas range, who is going to care except HGTV. ("OMG, I can't buy this house because somebody painted that Viking stove!)"
When I was comparing a pro-style gas stove to an induction stove, I was not comparing a $5600 Capital Culinarian to some nebulous induction stove. Instead, I was comparing an $1899 NXR DRGB3001 to an $1899 Samsung NE597NOPBSR. I don't live in a mansion, and they aren't any in my neighborhood of "quaint" old miners' houses. Neither stove is going to measurably impact the resale value of my home if I were selling it. If had bought that Samsung instead of the NXR (as I almost did), I wouldn't be lying awake at nights regretting getting an induction stove because it might somehow adversely affect the resale value of my home.
>>>"Even despite all of the above, I still have some regrets. Our ideal kitchen would have a combination of gas and induction. We may very well get a countertop induction burner for super-low/long simmering (yes, we plan a CC rangetop)."If you are talking about a portable burner, see my comments above about countertop units. Also, I believe there was long thread on chowhound about the limitations of using lightweight portable induction burners for long simmerings. Many of them shut off automatically after 3 three hours.
This post was edited by JWVideo on Mon, Dec 3, 12 at 3:46
On the "plus" side for gas over induction, one can boil water and cook during daylight hours when the electricity has gone out, although the vent hood won't work. And if one is prone to dropping things or temper fits, one can slam a large cast iron skillet onto a gas range grate with no fear of breaking or cracking the glass top that induction has.
A lot of my friends have and luuurrrrvvvve their gas stoves. Each to their own. It is nice that there is something for everyone. :-)
This post was edited by Cavimum on Mon, Dec 3, 12 at 8:08
I've read a few articles about the benefits of induction cooking. There are definitely a lot of benefits, though growing up in a rural community, I do see one big benefit of gas over induction. With gas cooktops, if you lose power, you still have the ability to cook, whereas with induction, you would lose that ability since it is electric. This probably doesn't effect many people, but for those who live in areas prone to power loss, it's something to consider.
Here is a link that might be useful: Induction Cooking - It's Awesome!
I cannot answer OP's question directly because the only experience that I have with induction is my portable Waring induction burner, which I use when I make tea. However, I think this is a great informative thread. I, too, am one of those people who likes flame, at least for caanning, roasting peppers, and wok cooking, which I do regularly on an old, ugly, thin metal Chinese wok. Given the way the electricity supply works in my neck of the woods (coal generated, not allowed to sell power to the local electrical coop, hail storms in the winter, summer temperatures so high that solar becomes less efficient, need for expensive deep-cycle batteries and expensive back-up grid standby), and the low natural gas and propane costs relative to electricity compared to the costs and inefficiencies of getting electricity to the house, I tend to opt in favor of gas. That said, I see lots of attractive aspects to induction. So, I am wondering if OP has a generator that could take over for an induction unit needs in the event of a power outage. Does anyone here have any experience with induction and generators during power outages? Also, would OP consider induction coupled with a separate gas module with one or two burners for the times gas is preferable to induction? Both the induction and gas units could go under the same, but longer, hood.
I've told this story recently, but we were house shopping for most of this year. We went in to one rather worn house and as the seller's agent was droning on about possible updates to the house she said, "Of course no one likes to cook on electric, but gas is available in the house already." I looked over and there was a brand new 36" Thermador induction cooktop. There was a bidding war and the house sold for a crazy amount of money to someone who was planning on gutting it. I bet it's been "upgraded" to a hyper expensive gas range by now. I thought about swinging by and asking if they wanted to sell the Thermador....
Farberware Millenium pans are 25% off with free shipping from the Farberware site right now. The 10" saute is $23 and it ia a fine little pan.
Wow - I gave a list of perfectly reasonable factors which when taken as a whole explain why we chose gas over induction. In return, I got a bunch of offensive sneers and outright personal abuse, mixed in with a bunch of straw-man nonsense.
The response that really surprised me was from JWVideo, who seems to have gone down exactly the same decision path we did and come to exactly the same conclusion for very similar reasons, but still attacked me.
To cover just a few of the comments:
* We have a fairly large house with a rather meagre 100 Amp service that is already quite heavily loaded. To go with induction, we'd need to upgrade to 200 Amp service. To make matters worse, we have underground service. Digging a trench by hand around our irrigation system and mature tree roots, laying a new cable, replacing the meter base, etc., is at least $5K.
* We heard buzzing on a high-end induction cooktop in a kitchen showroom; it was loud enough to be irritating. Many people on these forums who are otherwise delighted by their induction cooktops have commented on buzzing.
* I said "rangetop" not "range". We were choosing between a gas rangetop and an induction cooktop.
* My reference to multiple big burners was about power, not diameter. Sure, your smallest induction burner may heat a big saute pan, but it won't do it very quickly.
* This thread was specifically asking for negatives. My list of factors we found to be negatives is far more on-topic than all the lists of positive experiences in this thread.
* We are not gas partisans; we started out really wanting induction. No single factor on the list would have been enough on its own to decide us (not even the service upgrade).
The list of negative factors I gave is the list that mattered to us. I assume anyone reading that list could make their own mind up how much, if any, of it applies to them. I didn't state all the positives we also considered because they had already been covered multiple times by others in this thread.
This post was edited by PeterH2 on Mon, Dec 3, 12 at 18:03
I'm sorry you feel personally attacked by me. While I was arguing with some of your ideas, I was also taking them seriously enough to give you a specific responses rather than calling you names or questioning your integrity. This response will address the specific points you have just made.
>>>"* My list of factors we found to be negatives is far more on-topic than all the lists of positive experiences in this thread."You have a valid point that the many proclamations of affection and positive testimonials are not really on topic. I agree entirely with this and said much the same thing earlier in this thread.
If it was not clear from what I wrote above, I think you made a rational and very informed decision about what stoves, rangetops, cooktops would be best for you. I neither made nor intended any criticism of your choices (apparently, a Capital Culinarian?)
However, your list of negatives was not presented as (and does not stem from) your own experience in having bought and used an induction stove or cooktop. The OP asked for the experience of people who have owned and used induction cookers and then regretted it or at least decided to get something else.
From what you have described, I see only one first hand experience with induction: a salesperson's demonstration of one expensive model which produced annoying buzzing. (And that bad experience is certainly a good enough reason for you to have dropped consideration of induction right there given your other circumstances.) But, beyond that, the receitation of negatives is a summary of the anti-induction position in the long-running debates here including the following:
Again, I am not saying and did not mean to suggest in any way that you made a bad choice. My only point in the opening paragraph was that your list seemed no more on point than the cheerleading and talk about "deserving" induction.
>>>"The response that really surprised me was from JWVideo, who seems to have gone down exactly the same decision path we did and come to exactly the same conclusion for very similar reasons. . ."We did not go down the same decision path. Because of your situation and your preferences, induction was pretty much out of the question for you. Nothing wrong with that. I'm sorry if you took my response on specific points as suggesting that there was something wrong with your choices.
OTOH, I have experience with induction. I very nearly bought an induction range (a specific stove.) Unlike you, I likely would have been as happy with that induction apppliance as with with the gas appliance I did wind up buying. There were no installation or support issues for me.
Buying an induction cooktop and electric oven (or an induction range) for you would have been inordinately expensive (over and above the cost of the cooktops) which is a very good reason to drop induction and look at gas stoves, particularly the pro-style stove you wound up with. But it is not experience with induction.
>>>"* This thread was specifically asking for negatives."The OP's questions was a lot more specific and was about experience. There must be a couple of dozen threads here where people ask questions like: "if you pick either, which would you choose and why?" Amck asked the much narrower question about negatives from people who had actually bought an induction range or cooktop and then decided they did not like it.
Now, I admit I may have some responsibility for taking this thread a bit off track when I responded to JOC6820's statement that, apart from knob controls that there is no reason ever consider anything other than induction. But, if you read my response, you will see that everything I said kept coming back to the question of how well particular stoves or apppliances will meet somebody's particular preferences and needs and also kept coming back to actual experience with induction.
>>>"* We have a fairly large house with a rather meagre 100 Amp service.Did you think I attacked you on this? I thought it was clear that this is a perfectly rational reason to drop consideration of induction appliances. You cited an expensive electrical upgrade. You got responses suggesting you did not know what you were talking about and should go check your system. At that point, I noted that there may any number of reasons, including wiring, why a home might not have the necessary electrical service. There are numbers of old houses in my town with the same problem you have. There are others which have "some" 240v service, but do not have the wiring needed to run the 240v/50 amp service required for an induction stove or the greater amount required for an in induction cooktop and electric oven (which actually may require even more capacity). For some of these houses, upgrading could cost a lot more than $5k. So, again, this is not a personal attack but a clear recognition that there are reasons why induction is not a suitable choice for some folks. That is not a personal attack. It is a straightforward recognition of economic reality. But, it is an economic reality that says "forget induction" rather than "I tried it and did not like it because. . ."
>>>"* We heard buzzing on a high-end induction cooktop in a kitchen showroom. . ."Good, you have one actual, first hand experience with one cooktop and you found that unit to be unacceptably noisy for you. If you had simply said that you had seen a particular cooktop in use and were bothered by the noise you heard, you might not have gotten as sharp a response from herring_maven as you did. Without that qualification, you sounded like you were just repeating stuff. My response was to ask if you actually had experience and, if so with with what. As I said previously and emphasized, the buzzing affects different people differently and it also occurs differently in different situations. That was why I echoed a2gemeni's suggestion that the OP try to see live demonstrations. (Go back and read what I said if you are still feeling offended.) I also gave my first hand experience over three decades. I mentioned the Max Burton portable unit as a particularly egregious offender although it is often recommended here for trying out induction. If the Max Burton had been my introduction to induction (rather than my aunt's Kenmore some 30 years ago), I would have been appalled.
>>>"* I said "rangetop" not "range". We were choosing between a gas rangetop and an induction cooktop."I'm missing something here because I do not understand why this should make any difference to this discussion. The OP said she was looking for a range, and that is why a lot of the discussion has been couched in those terms. But, it seems to me, that it all comes down to the same thing whether we are talking about burners on the top of a range or on a cooktop. Did I say something that makes you feel demeaned on this?
"* We are not gas partisans; we started out really wanting induction. No single factor on the list would have been enough on its own to decide us (not even the service upgrade)."
I am sorry that you felt I was implying that you are merely a gas partisan. I tried to frame that sentence so I was talking about the points and not you. And, again, I was trying to get this back to a discussion of experience with induction rather than a decision about why somebody would or would not buy an induction appliance.
>>>"* My reference to multiple big burners was about power, not diameter. Sure, your smallest induction burner may heat a big saute pan, but it won't do it very quickly."I don't see an argument on this from me, but if you took what I said as an attack, it was not meant as one. My point about induction burner diameters was that there was a limitation in the form of minimum pan sizes that some might find inconvenient in addition to the point you mentioned. I was not attacking your points.
JWVideo - thankyou for your thoughtful response. While I felt some of the things you said were a tad barbed, it was primarily herring_mavens's intemperate comments that provoked me to reply, and my responses were to all of the follow-ups, not just yours.
On thinking about this overnight, I realised that one factor probably was a deal-breaker - suitability for (semi-)real wok cooking. We actually do have a 100K BTU/Hr wok burner that we can use outdoors, so we know what "real" is, but for various reasons that's not very practical for day-to-day use. While 22K BTU/Hr is nowhere near as good as that burner, numerous BS and CC owners on these forums have attested that it's still pretty darn good. If this was our "forever" house and we had the space, a dedicated "real" wok burner, an induction cooktop, and a professional salamander (for searing duties) would be a killer combination.
Like most things related to remodelling a kitchen, the power upgrade issue was (still is) not as simple as you might think. Upgrading the supply would give us headroom to do other things in future (in particular, add more A/C), so we might have been able to talk ourselves into that (we're at the "hysteria/delirium" stage in the project where we are so punch-drunk from sticker shock that a few more $K here or there seems like nothing).
Finally, I missed a point in my previous comments: at least one person mocked us for being willing to live with the clean-up issues of an open burner gas range. This is a great example of how different folks value different things. We actually have an open burner gas cooktop right now, and we don't find clean up a big issue, but that's because we don't mind if it is not kept spotless. I fear that some folks here would think we are slovenly; we prefer to think that we practice "just-in-time" cleaning. :)
This post was edited by PeterH2 on Tue, Dec 4, 12 at 12:12
If this was our "forever" house and we had the space, a dedicated "real" wok burner, an induction cooktop, and a professional salamander (for searing duties) would be a killer combination.
For me, killer would be a true zoneless and virtually limitless induction. This means that I could put a pot ANYWHERE on the cooktop, including straddling the edge if necessary. I would also be able to use more than a set number of pots with the only limit being the overall power of the entire cooktop. I want something like an induction French Top, if you will. Alas, such a technology either doesn't exist or is prohibitively expensive, so I had to go with gas.
This post was edited by jscout on Tue, Dec 4, 12 at 14:34
@PeterH2 - while I do not want to move around the heavy cast iron grates of a gas cooktop/range, having a little bit of seasoning in the vicinity wouldn't bother me if I saw some. It adds flavor, right? Just like the inside of my oven, and my old electric coil cooktop.
OTOH, our new induction cooktop shows everything (a 'negative' if you will), including the dog's hair that floats about and settles on it. Perhaps it is the "new" of the cooktop and I'll turn a blind eye to all that, after a while. ;-)
I moved into a house with an old induction cooktop (c.1983) and that cooktop was the main motivator for remodeling the kitchen (that is saying a lot since the kitchen was pink). You know how long planning takes. By the time the actual remodel came around we had grown to appreciate it and replaced it with induction.
Funny thing, though, I've since relocated to a place with a cruddy old JA ceramic electric and I don't really miss the induction that much (except when canning--oy it takes forEVAH to boil water without induction!).
I replaced a BlueStar with a Bosch 800 Series and haven't looked back. I don't need to list all the Pros that people have listed here again. I will go over complaints that people listed.
Buzzing - There is no buzzing or anything when we cook, even on boost. We use Demeyere and Le Creuset cookware without any problems. However, the Bluestar was quite loud when the burners were turned to high.
Double Boiler - there is no need for a double boiler on induction. Although, I didn't need a double Boiler for the BlueStar either.
Wok cooking - while I did enjoy using a nice round bottom wok on our BlueStar, we are currently very happy with the flat bottom All-Clad wok we are now using on the induction cooktop. We produce the same quality of food and is in no way a step down. I still use the round bottom wok in the Big Green Egg when I feel the need to break it out. We had the All-Clad wok from years ago when we had an electric cooktop in an old house we owned. Barely used it then, so it was practically brand new when we broke it out again. By the way, it does not buzz and sits totally flat.
While clean up was not a deciding factor when changing over to induction, it certainly is a dream when you finish cooking. It's nice to not have food burnt to everything.
"* We would have to upgrade our electrical supply, which would cost around $5K."
I could see this definitely being a problem. 100A isn't very much and wouldn't leave much room for anything if you fired up some type of electric cooking device. We have 400A service, so not much of an issue.
"* We want to sear with very high heat (enough to cause an induction cooktop to shut down)."
"* My reference to multiple big burners was about power, not diameter. Sure, your smallest induction burner may heat a big saute pan, but it won't do it very quickly."
These two confuse me. My induction cooktop is more powerful than our BlueStar which had 22 BTU burners. The induction is more efficient and provides more energy to cook with than gas. I can saute just as easily, if not better, than on gas. The mention about saute pan on the small induction burner makes no sense. The small burner on the BlueStar wouldn't heat a saute pan quickly either.
>>>"These two confuse me. * * * The mention about saute pan on the small induction burner makes no sense. The small burner on the BlueStar wouldn't heat a saute pan quickly either."Maybe I can clarify this for you. I took PeterH2's comment as referring to his preference for having all burners being same size and capable of full range heat, a layout which is common on pro-style stoves. A lot of people like having burners of different sizes, which is a reason that kind of layout is typical for stoves and cooktops from major manufacturers and most induction stoves and cooktops. Another reason to have burners of differing sizes with induction is that standard induction burners have minimum pan sizes. If you have all big burners, then you may not be able to use small pans. The zoneless cooktops mentioned by jscout may be a way around this difficulty.
But, again, these kinds of layout preference seems to me to be something that makes you say "I'm not going to buy an induction appliance because I don't like the burner layout" rather than "I quit using induction because ....."
I suppose it could be asked: has anybody given up induction because you cannot stand having burners of different sizes?
>>>" The induction is more efficient and provides more energy to cook with than gas."I agree and can illustrate this with a concrete example. Take the induction stove I was considering, the Samsung NE597NOPBSR. It has an 11" diameter burner that can go to 3.4 kwh on boost, two 9" diameter burners rated at 1.85 KwH which can both be boosted to 2.35 KwH (or run together as a single burner and boosted to 4.6 kwh), and 6" diameter burner rated at 1.5 kwh (2 kwh on boost). To compare power with a gas burner (rated in BTU-Hours), you first multiply the KwH by 3412.142. Then you factor in the relative effectiveness of heat delivery (that is, how much of the input power is actually applied to the pan and how of it much goes eleswhere).
The US DOE computes that induction burners deliver at least 84% of input power to a pan while the figure is between 33% and 40% for gas burners. (Some induction makers claim 90% but I do not know how they got their numbers so I'm using the DOE rate.) For a 15,000 btu-hr. gas burner, the efficiency of 33% to 40% translates an effective power range of 5000 and 6000 btu-hrs that actually heats your pan. A 23,000 btu-hr. burner (on a Capital Culinarian) will be delivering "only" 9200 btu-hr to the pan at a 40% efficiency and 7600 btu-hr if the burner is at 33% efficiency category. (The acutal efficiency depends on so many variables including altitude and pan size that we have to talk about a possible range of values). The Blue star's 22,000 btu- hr.burners will be slightly less. One of the Samsung's 1.8 KwH induction burners, on boost, can draw 2.3 KwH. On boost, the burner will be delivering 2.3KwH * 3412.142 * 84% = 6735 btu-hrs. The standard (non-boosted) power max of 1.85 KwH translates to 5302 btu-hrs. The Samsung's largest burner draws 3.4 KwH on boost which translates to 9800 btu-hrs. It's non-boost max of 2.6 kwh translates to 7452 btu-hr of effective heat. If you have a really big pan and want the greatest possible amount of heat, you can use Samsung's "Flex-zone" to link the two 9" burners to yield 4.6 kwh on boost which translates to over 13,000 btu-hrs of effective power, which is half again more than the high-btu Culinarians and Blue Stars.
But a lot of this strikes me as being as academic as arguments about horsepower in cars. In actual usage, very few of us will be running burners at full throttle for anything except boiling very large quantities of water. Some folks apparently need full power for a flash sear, but as has been said before, at those heat levels it can be a near instantaneous trip from char to charcoal.
It also strikes me that there is a bang-for-buck argument that gets made here, too. To get those 23,000 btu-hr burners on a Capital Culinarian, you are looking at an entry fee of at least $5600 while that Samsung is only $1899. So why would anybody buy the CC? If sheer power were the only consideration, why indeed? Well, sheer power is not the only consideration. As I discovered in choosing a stove, there are a lot of other aspects of stove design and construction that have little or nothing to do with induction, and those may matter more in the end.
And that brings me back to the point I keep making here: it strikes me as unlikely that very many people bought an induction stove or cooktop and quit using it because they did not like induction. I'm guessing that most folks who abandon induction do so for reasons like getting a lemon of a stove or cooktop or other problems (like post-Sandy rejection of electric stoves and cooktops.)
So, again returning to the OP's question, has anybody bought and then given up an induction stove or cooktop because they found they just could not get enough heat into a pan? Maybe if you wanted to melt lead in a pan on the stovetop?
This post was edited by JWVideo on Thu, Dec 6, 12 at 14:10
FABULOUS THREAD! Just yesterday, I ordered a freestanding GE induction range for a new patio home. It has no gas service, so this was a great alternative.
As an avid cook and gas user since childhood (I am pushing 70), other than small stints with electric (both coil and smooth-top), I can honestly say I have grown tired of the 'in-your-face' gas heat, and the mess of cleanup (both burner and grates). The ONLY positive gas feature for me, at this point, is the instant control. And it seems induction will also provides that.
Understand, this is strictly one persons opinion, and what is right for me may not be right for others. But I speak from years of experience using everything from 1930's open burners, to 1980's Thermador, to 1990's Wolf Professional, to 2003 GE Profile.
For some the aesthetics matter most, the trendy look, the big knobs. Others are serious cooks and enjoy the performance. Me? FWIW...I am counting the days until 'cool' and 'responsive' reside in one well-performing unit.
JW and Peter - AFAIK the only pro-style gas cooktop which delivers the same output to each burner is Capital Culinarian. Perhaps this is standard in Capital products? I never looked into Capital which has no distributor in my area. The cooktop I considered before going with induction was the Bluestar 36" cooktop or rangetop. In this case, the maximum output varies from 9K BTUs (true simmer) to 22K BTUs (high power). The griddle and grill put out 30K BTUs.
My Thermador induction unit's maximum output to the 5 hobs varies from 1.8 to 2.6 kW, not boosted. Converting that to effective BTU (see theinductionsite.com for discussion of effective conversion), that is roughly 13K to 24K BTUs. On boost that becomes 18.5K to 34K BTUs. Each of the hobs on the cooktop can be boosted, but not all simultaneously. At most, you can have 3 hobs on boost, and for a maximum of 8 minutes. Hands down, the induction cooktop puts out more power per hob, more consistently with less waste heat. DH thought that with 34K BTUs he might be able to weld.
Answering some of the other comments, our cooktop does not hum, buzz or make other noises. On boost, a fan turns on, I presume to dissipate the heat being produced, but it is low frequency and low power. The overhead vent fan (Kobe, chosen for its efficiency and low noise) makes more noise. Before someone (a2gemini?) casts aspersions on my hearing, it was tested this year and is in the 97th percentile. No, there is no hum. No, I am not deaf. No, this is not with special cooking equipment.
Obviously the cost of installation varies with each home. For us the total cost charged by the electrician was $250.
Getting back to the OP's question, we have never regretted installing induction and would not go back to gas.
>>>" AFAIK the only pro-style gas cooktop which delivers the same output to each burner is Capital Culinarian."We're getting a bit off topic here, but I know that 30" Wolf AG and NXR also have four equal burners and I believe that Viking does as well. My recollection for Blue Star is that the 30" RCS stoves come standard with one simmer burner three 15k btu-hr burners but you can replace the simmer burner with a full-range one. My only point about this, though, is that it is one of those personal preference things that factors into choosing a stove.
>>>"DH thought that with 34K BTUs he might be able to weld."You betcha, hence my snarky comment about maybe needing all that power to melt lead in a pan on a cooktop.
>>> our cooktop does not hum, buzz or make other noises."That was pretty much my experience over the last three decades until I received that portable induction unit recently. And, for me, that noise from the portable unit becomes undetectable when the range hood is running. To me, the heating-up buzzing is merely annoying. A friend of mine has hearing aids that somehow amplify that particular noise frequency and it becomes excruciating for him. As the above discussion shows and the links to prior discussions, the buzzing noise happens in some installations with some models of stove with some pans and mostly does not. When it occurs, it affects different people differently.
>>>"Getting back to the OP's question, we have never regretted installing induction and would not go back to gas."At this point, I think it is pretty safe to say that this is an opinion almost universally held by folks with induction appliances. In my case, I found a gas stove that I liked a little bit better than the induction stoves in my price range, but it would not have taken much to shift the decision the other way. Thirty years ago, Kenmore and GE were selling induction stoves and we had one in the family for a while. Then they stopped selling them here. The last time I went shopping for a stove a decade ago, the only available induction ranges were the Diva models which cost about 4 times my stove budget. Now, it is completely different. The are numbers of capable induction ranges within my budget. So, as I said, my choice of stove would have been different with a slight change in circumstances. For instance, if I lived in a hotter climate, I would not have even looked at a gas stove for my kitchen given the range choices now available. As it was, I almost bought an induction stove and if I had, I would not be thinking of going back to gas, either.
This post was edited by JWVideo on Thu, Dec 6, 12 at 16:25
I haven't researched stove pricing, but a Bosch 800 series 36" cooktop is ~$2.7K at AJM; a Capital Culinarian 36" rangetop is ~$4K. so, not quite as big a difference as for stoves, but still pretty hefty.
OTOH, the Viking 36" induction cooktop is ~$4.7K - more expensive than the CC.
kitykat, congratulations! You're going to be very, very happy. You'll redefine instant control the first time you power on your induction. ;-)
For everyone else, isn't it great to be able to hover around the cooking area without getting a flash burn from a gas cooktop? I love to be able to lean in to get a better look. Never noticed it until I pulled the gas cooktop out and dropped in the induction.
Since I also didn't actually answer the OP, no regrets switching to induction. I'm disappointed in myself for not going this route 4 years ago when I bought the BlueStar.
@JWVideo - We live in a hot, humid climate where the kitchen faces due west and temp in the kitchen reaches 80F in summer when cooking (AC thermostat set at 78F). The old coil elements threw off enough side-ways heat, making gas less attractive and induction more attractive to me.
One regret . . . sometimes during winter, my hands get so cold (heating thermostat set to 69F) that I would turn on a coil electric burner and hold my hands over it, just to warm them up. Seriously. That won't work with induction. Now I'll have to boil water on top of the induction and hold my hands over the steam, which is not such a bad idea, as it would help humidify the dry air.
Cavimum - I think I have your hand problem - but never tried the burner trick - and now I have induction so would have to use your new trick or just sit on them.
It all comes down to personal preference or what you electric panel or gas situation is...
Also - I just saw UMHS is doing a research study on the effects of gas cooking on health - I am sure the next one will be on induction..
interesting read. Haven't been on GW much lately; I too thought Herring's post was pretty harsh. Is this a trend?
Also, small correction: Miss Lizzie wrote, " I haven't had a gas stove in 30 years because I don't like the notion of pilot lights. I just have an irrational paranoia they are "giving off" something into the air."
Gas stoves don't have pilot lights anymore. They have electric ignition.
I have both gas (GE) and induction (electrolux) ranges. For most recipes, I
prefer using my induction range. In general, I have found that I have more precise control with my induction - a fact that really surprised me. Perhaps it is a function of the GE. For me and the way I cook induction wins easily!!! That being said, during Hurricane Sandy, I was very glad to have gas burners. So, if emergencies are more of a concern, then day to day cooking, stick with gas.
So I've had my Viking induction range nearly 6 months now.. I'm as happy today as the day I installed it ... It seams the first thing people say about induction is how fast it boils water, which it has the 3 -4 times I've boiled water for pasta... But where induction really shines , is in its ability to control heat .. Couple this with a tri- ply pan , it will saute ,sear ,simmer in blazing speed between all heat ranges ..simmer to boil, boil to simmer is nearly instant.... And couple this with ability to clean quickly and at anytime during the cooking process, it's the perfect range for me ...I love the debate as there is is no right answer , only personal preference ... And as induction gains in popularity , so will its design choices... Just as ProStyle gas ranges have over the past 10 years.. I chose the Viking not because of its price tag , but it offered the features that I was looking for in a range with out compromise ... And as I always say , you need to actually demo an induction to fully appreciate ... You wouldn't buy a car without buying one would you ?
It's been almost exactly a year with our GE freestanding induction. No regrets at all. Even DH, who practically demanded gas and had no idea what induction was, is very happy. He loves it!
It's also been a huge step toward my slow remodel to streamline cleaning. I'm embracing my laziness and hatred of cleaning and as we remodel I am trying to keep that in mind. The induction is so easy to clean because stuff doesn't get baked on. Some glass cleaner and a razor (for stuff that gets under the pan) work wonders, and when we fry we just put paper towels under the pan. Yes, you read that right, you can cook on paper towels since the only heat applied is radiated down from the pan. No more cleaning coils, no more scrubbing those things under the coils, and no more burned on gunk!
I suppose it does bear mentioning yet again that using paper or silicon baking mats works for things like regular frying (where the oil temp is kept below 375F) and candymaking (where temps are tightly controlled -- something for which I've found induction to be very useful because of the amount of control and rapidity of adjustment it gives you --- and where you want to keep hot sugary drips off the glass cook-top surface). The paper trick does not work for gonzo steak searing (where some folks apparently feel that no sear is worthwhile until their CI pans reach well over 500F -- if not to 600F or 700F -- and all the seasoning is getting burned off the CI pan). Nor is the paper trick suitable for anything like wokking or other high temp sauteing where pan temps will get above 450F. Remember "Fahrenheit 451," the sci-fi novel about book burning?
This post was edited by JWVideo on Sun, Dec 16, 12 at 14:00
Of course any super high heat cooking is a little different. I find though that any time I want heat that high it either involves a lot of moving around of food, or a very short sear followed by oven finishing. In either case having the "burner" area visible is much more important than clean up. The pan needs to stay completely within the designated area to use the very high heat effectively, completely negating the practicality of paper towels. Attempting an ultra high heat saut� with the "burner" obscured is exceedingly frustrating.
We rarely use the paper towel method, but when making a whole pan of bacon or homemade French fries, it's fantastic. Even placing the paper towels not under, but immediately next to the pan works very well, and the heat exposure is much less than under the pan.
Well, ..... silicon baking mats or coatings on parchment paper are not going to be that much more heat resistant than plain paper towels. It may give you another 20F to 50F, but that's a pretty thin margin when you consider the efficiency of induction putting heat into a pan. If you get fussy and start cutting circles into the paper towels, newspaper, or parchement, you can avoid the problem of singeing or igniting the paper under the pan. That degree of fussiness will appeal to some and not to others. It is something that appealed to me for deep-frying large quantities of chicken until I figured out how easy it was to spritz with Windex and wipe the cooking surface clean. A bigger deal for me was working with sugar syrups.
Thanks again to those who continue to post their experiences with induction. I asked a group of 22 at a work holiday dinner this weekend if they had/or knew someone who had an induction range and most were unfamiliar with the concept. This is the only place I've been able to get reviews from owners.
luv2putt, your post hit on something that I was looking to hear from users - that the quick heat control was a big factor in why you like your range. The water boiling is impressive, but I don't boil large quantities of water in my day-to-day cooking. What I do a lot of, especially through the winter months, is a lot of simmering in my big Dutch oven. Two to three times a week I'm making stock and/or soup of some kind. It would be great to have even, low heat for things like chowders...
Besides offering very even low heat, induction offers precise timing. I've gotten used to setting the timers so I can't forget that I have something on a burner.
I'm the only person in my social group with an induction cooktop, but everyone who has seen it has been very impressed. Not only by the speed, power and responsiveness, but a big plus for parents is safety.
This is a no brainer choice.
If even, low heat is important to you, then definitely get a small induction burner to try out the technology. That's what sold us. Took all of maybe 15 minutes. I now have a 5 burner Miele and I absolutely love the control I have over the heat. I can get a true simmer on a big pot of stock, or I can melt chocolate right in a pan and hold it there. Of course, it does blast furnace, but I find I use the lower settings for rice and soups/stews/stocks, etc. far more often. Like others, I love the turn off timers on each burner. I like to use a pressure cooker, and I can bring a pot up to pressure, set the timer, and move on to the next task, knowing that I won't end up with overcooked or burnt food if I forget to turn it off. At first I enjoyed the novelty of putting paper over the cooktop while doing messy things, but I quickly found that it was easier just to give it a wipe with a soapy rag and a polish with a microfiber afterwards. I've really become quite spoiled. :-)
Amck ... Heat control is second to none with induction ... So your saute and you throw a handful of veggies in, it only takes as long as you turning the dial to regain the heat ... And for me , it's not how long it takes to boil , but how fast I can return to a simmer before it boils over because I wasn't paying attention ... Feel free to write me direct with any questions you may have
email@example.com. Brad
This post was edited by luv2putt on Sat, Dec 22, 12 at 16:43
" And for me , it's not how long it takes to boil , but how fast I can return to a simmer before it boils over because I wasn't paying attention .."
I so totally agree! That is what impresses me the most about induction cooking. I tell everyone I know that it's like cooking on gas without the flame.
What I do a lot of, especially through the winter months, is a lot of simmering in my big Dutch oven.
We just got our induction cooktop installed two weeks ago and my DH made a batch of beer as his first experiment with it.
In beer-making it's important to get a slow steady simmer without boil over which can get messy. I can report without hesitation that the induction cooktop held the simmer perfectly at a steady temperature for one hour. That is pretty impressive imo. I have cooked on both gas and induction and at this point if I had to choose, I would go induction.
why_not_me, I tried googling UHMS back when this thread was fresh and only found a reference to a maybe-future study about the possible dangers of cooking with gas. It looks like no such study has been done, so no conclusions drawn either way. When googling today, I could only find a hit about UM Housing fire safety.
Here is a link that might be useful: UM Fire Safety Bulletin
a2gemini - I remembered this thread from a few months ago. Is this what you're looking for? The funniest part was picturing the guys at Thermador standing on the cooktop.
Here is a link that might be useful: Weight limit on ceramic cooktop
Yes and no. Initially I purchased a Brandt induction (same company makes Fagor induction). I loved it. BUT, after only two years, half of the cooktop quit working in spectacular fashion - loud bang, flash of light, and after I peeled myself off the ceiling realized half the cooktop was dead.
I now have a Bosch induction. It is rated at the same power as the Brandt but is MUCH heavier, much larger wiring, just overall better build quality.
Bottom line: I really do love induction, but would be very hesitant to purchase one from Fagor/Brandt.
We re-did our kitchen just before Christmas 2012. We replaced a Thermador 30" Gas range with a Bosch 30" Induction cook top (NIT8065UC) and I haven't missed cooking with gas yet. I am really enjoying cooking with induction and so far our Bosch is excellent. The pans I bought for using with our cook top are great and are Calphalon with the flat bottom (Cooking with Calphalon from Kohls) and they are a great buy! They cook very well, dishwasher safe and will hold up to years of use. I also bought a few pans by Berndes (12 qt. dutch oven and 11" deep chef pan) and love them also. Bosch gave an Auto Chef pan with the cooktop that is non stick and it is great. I am going to buy a smaller one at some time since the one they gave is 9" and I would like a small one for single omelets.
I really like not having fire in my face while I cook with no extra heat through out the kitchen as when cooking with gas and induction cook tops are the easiest cleanup of all! I boiled over a pan of noodles the other night and my husband grabbed a towel, took off the pan and we wiped up the water and mess (even the starchy water) as easy as wiping off the counter. The induction cook top was perfectly clean in seconds, we put the pan back on and I kept cooking. It would have been a mess with my old gas stove top. Nothing sticks to it since it doesn't get hot, hot, just the pan does. The settings are better than gas. I can go from 1 to melt butter, keep warm, to 9 for boil and boost to boil water in less than 2 minutes. I really like not smelling the gas smell also when you start a gas stove. Induction is quiet, clean, no smell, easy cleanup, super settings from low,low to high high.
So far I haven't missed anything about cooking with gas and love cooking on induction. I guess the only thing I would miss is if the electricity goes out then I can't use it like I could gas but in all the 25 years of cooking on gas I never once used it when the electricity went out so I don't think about that.
I don't know why you couldn't do canning on induction. Walmart has very large pans that are induction ready and you can put the water in, put in the jars and can......I used to do canning for years and can't understand why it would not be the same on induction versus gas or electric? Can anyone tell me why you can't?
I give induction cooking a 10 because I haven't found a reason to mark it down from there. When or if I do, it would be probably a 9. I am so glad to have induction and would not want to go back to gas. If we ever would move, we would probably take the cook top with us......:>)
We had a 36 inch electrolux icon induction cooktop for three years and loved it! So easy to clean, quick to heat up and cool, great temperature control (e.g. melt chocolate, no problem) etc etc as described in the posts above. Then we downsized last July and the house we bought has a GE profile gas range and oven. As there are so many cooking with gas enthusiasts, we decided to give it a try and keep our minds open. Bottom line though is that after six months I can't wait to get back to induction.
I find the gas burners and their underbits get very dirty and are very hard to clean (we must be messy cooks and are spoiled by the ease of induction cleanup). It takes much longer to boil liquids. We had to dig out out the old bain marie.... Cooking turns out just as well and in our case better on the induction. Then there is the safety factor. I like that the induction goes off if the pot is taken off, there is no open flame and the whole surface does not heat up.
Luckily our power very rarely goes out, but my back-ups in that event are the BBQ and an old-fashioned fondue;)
My first post in this thread is a long way above, so instead of simply editing it, I am replying to myself (!) here. As a result of comments in this thread, plus some issues with our previous plan to use a Capital Culinarian rangetop, we revisited the idea of going with induction. To that end, we went and spent several hours playing with Bosch and Thermador induction cooktops, and several more studying manuals, installation guides, etc.
What follows are my original negatives, with comments based on our experiments:
> We would have to upgrade our electrical supply,
> which would cost around $5K.
We might get away without the upgrade (though it's still a risk). The fact is, it's extremely unlikely we would ever run an induction cooktop at its theoretical maximum output. Under normal conditions, most cooking seems to require a low percentage of the maximum. The Bosch/Thermador cooktops actually allow you to set a reduced maximum power to avoid the risk of tripping a breaker.
> We don't like the way pans with convex bottoms spin around on
> smoothtops (lots of All Clad pans come that way).
Still an issue, but it turns out we only have one "spinner", because I hammered the two worst pieces flat years ago when we were cursed with an electric smoothtop. The remaining piece that spins flattens out once heated, so this is not an issue for us. YMMV.
> Inexpensive aluminium non-stick skillets that can be replaced
> when they wear out don't work on induction.
Our cheap T-fal skillets appear to work on Bosch/Thermador induction cooktops (YMMV with other models). I say "appear", because we haven't cooked on them, just run tests with water and an IR thermometer, but they certainly get heated. The trick is that they have a thin steel disc set in their bases.
If T-fal stops making that range of cookware, I haven't found any good but cheap equivalents that are easy to get here in the USA.
> We like having multiple big burners and not having the cooktop
> dictate which pan must go where.
Still true, but something we could live with.
> We don't like that buzzing noise.
We encountered some mild buzzing with some pans under some circumstances, but nothing as bad as the first time we encountered induction. Our conclusion was that this wasn't really an issue for us with our pans.
> FOR ME AND HIT 550F easily ON induction
>>> We want to sear with very high heat (enough to cause an
> induction cooktop to shut down).
Confirmed in our tests. HOWEVER, what we also found was that cast iron heats very unevenly on induction. We observed differences of 100F across a 12" Lodge cast iron skillet on the large (11") ring. Even when we heated the pan slowly, increasing the power in stages and allowing time for the heat to spread, there were differences of 50F or more.
> * We want to use a real (thin, spherical bottomed) wok with very high heat.
True, but we came to the conclusion we just can't get enough ventilation through our kitchen to make real wok cooking feasible anyhow.
> * We want to be able to cook when the power is out.
This was a problem at our previous house, but when we thought about it we realized that we almost never get power outages where we live now.
> A "pro style" gas rangetop that jumps out at you as soon as you
> walk into the kitchen is better for resale than a smoothtop
> ("wow" factor). Induction is still something you have to explain,
> and in sales, like politics, "if you're explaining, you're losing".
This is still a concern for us. Renderings of the kitchen design with the big shiny rangetop definitely have more impact. OTOH, the large vent hood that we had planned to handle searing and wokking on a big gas rangetop really didn't fit well into the design, so there's a trade-off.
We identified one additional negative during our tests - induction does not heat evenly (tests run on a variety of cookware, using IR and contact thermometers). That is to say it heats about as well as a sealed gas burner (both heat a donut-shaped ring), but not as evenly as a BlueStar or Culinarian gas burner. This can be mitigated by using pans with thick conductive bases. Based on comments on these forums, it doesn't seem to be a huge issue, though our observations with cast iron suggest that that material is not the best choice.
Everything in Kitchen planning involves compromise. There is no cooking appliance that is perfect for all situations. In the end we have swung round to induction. For us, the positives that others have listed above outweigh the negatives. The biggest single factor for me is the precision and repeatability of power settings; you just can't get that with gas.
Here is a link that might be useful: T-fal skillets that work on induction
PeterH2 - I don't want to de-rail this yes/no induction discussion; just wanted to mention to you that, if you're stymied in your T-Fal search, you might want to try Ikea's 365-series non-stick pans.
We recently splurged on an All-Clad frying pan, mostly due to the persuasive salesman and my husband's Christmas generosity. By the time we got home from that expen$ive little expedition I had serious buyer's remorse, so it sat gathering dust while I dithered for so long we couldn't return it, doh.
I more recently splurged on an Ikea 365+ non-stick wok, which isn't a real wok imo, however I notice I do use it for just about everything, beginning with perfect poached or scrambled eggs most mornings.
The Ikea pan was exactly ONE TENTH the price of the All-Clad (and the All-Clad was on sale, 40% off I believe!). The Ikea pan has a convex base, which flattens out when hot, so it sits still on a ceran cooktop. It heats and cooks very evenly, not a wobble or spin in sight. I've never had a non-stick pan that is so non-stick, nor cleans as easily.
OK, the Ikea pan probably won't be happy with the super-high heat required of steaks, etc, but then I wouldn't use any non-stick pan for that sort of cooking.
For the record, I'm an ex-pro cook, currently cooking on a 10yo KA cooker with a glass (ceran) top, which I think gets the job done just fine. I'm hankering after a Bluestar for the reno, but I'm being seriously swayed by this discussion on induction, as I really like cooking (and the clean-up!) on a totally smooth surface, but want better power with better control than I currently have on the KA.
(My personal jury is still out on the All-Clad: I should get over it, but every time I use the darn thing I get cross with myself for spending so much - but that's my problem, not yours. ;) It's good, but 10x as good? Not convinced yet...)
Here is a link that might be useful: Ikea's 365+ no-brainer-$15-wok
"Why not me": if you are OK using a conventional electric smoothtop, I think you would be ecstatic using induction. You should definitely try to find a live demo somewhere. Reading about it does not really convey what the hands-on experience is like; we found it quite seductive.
I have some not expensive non-stick skillets for my induction cooktop. I got two from Marshalls called TVS from Italy. I've never seen them since, though other versions have popped up from time to time. Marshalls and TJ Maxx tend to have a lot of European brands appear, and they are more likely to be induction friendly. At BB&B I found a line by Oneida, I think it was called Artisan, and I got a deep 12" non-stick skillet. I think it was less than $30, before the 20% coupon. I just always carry a magnet in my purse.
I bought a set of induction-ready stainless pots from Costco for $160. I use my cast iron pots, both bare and enamelled, and I found carbon steel skillets and woks which work very nicely. My Fagor pressure cooker still works but I had to get another big stockpot in stainless. Total outlay was under $300.
I miss the even heat and easy clean up that anodized aluminium offers, but I can live with the pots I now have.
This is the relatively inexpensive saute pan that I use,
Here is a link that might be useful: Farberware Millenium Saute Pan
Peter - yeah, I have played with induction quite a bit, and am well-impressed.
It's just that I (thought I!) prefer cooking by gas: gradually re-thinking that. Our local (only) Bluestar dealer is smug and intractable (no competition), which is another minor irritation...
Also, if we get induction, then I need to get wall ovens, and I don't much like wall-ovens...
Pickypicky, eh.
I have never had a problem with buzzing from the electrolux slide in induction range. And, as others have stated, the flame control on induction is extremely precise. As far as cookware for induction there are many options available, both inexpensive and high end. For example,Macy's has an emeril line of cookware which is induction friendly and is made by al clad. It goes on sale a few times a year and is excellent. Walmart also a wonderful line of induction cookware called tramontina. There is actually a thread somewhere on garden web (maybe under cooking) about induction cookware. I used it to find inexpensive but excellent quality cookware. I did indulge in a more expensive non-stick omelet pan on sale for $49.00 by Zwillig from Chefs Catalogue. Its quality is top notch. The catalogue has an excellent selection of induction cookware - some high end like de buyer, swiss diamond, and mauviel.
After reading about induction cooktops, I ordered one (in 2003) from New Zealand. I never ever want to use anything else. Cooking with gas seems like caveman cooking to me now. Open flame? Seriously? My Brandt is far more powerful than gas cooktops costing five times as much, is less than 3" thick (so I installed a drawer where the cabinet normally has a dummy panel), and cleans up so easily. Love it.
I'm a bit puzzled by all the people who say they love their induction cooktop, except for canning. I guess these are all people doing pressure-cooker canning? I have a terribly ordinary set of enameled steel water-bath canners that work brilliantly with my induction cooktop. Starting with hot tap water, the pint canner is at a full rolling boil in 10 (!!!) minutes, and the big quart-jar canner is ready in 30. I haven't finished peeling the peaches or cooking the apples or whatever I'm canning before the water's ready to go, and my cooktop tops out at a fairly modest 2800 watts per hob. The pot is quite a bit bigger than the cooking circle, but that doesn't seem to have bothered the unit at all.
Go to potsandpans.com and farberwarecookware.com. Find sku75498, a Farberware Millennium Stainless skillet. 29.99. that is
1 non stick
2.dishwasher safe
3 oven safe to 500
4 metal utensil safe
5 has a mfr lifetime warranty
6 not the least, it is induction compatible.
I have at least one.pan It works. It works well. It works on any of my 4 hobs. Yes, really. It's fun but that's subjective. Doesn't slip or spin. (Who came up with that silliness? spinning? Oh, yeah, thin, misshapen and spinning.)
You all agree that induction gets hotter than gas, it cooks hotter. It sears, really. Cant believe that? Well Weber Grill has a 10k Sear Plate.. Ok, well then test it. (Oh the mfr warrants it's performance in a 500 degree oven) Get the connection?
Everything is true. These are the manufacturer webssites Not Auntie Sally's thoughts.
.No way nearly as heavy as cast iron but feels substantial and not cheap. Makes you a proud cooker
At least as of a year ago, best bets for decent normal ranges were the GE Profile and Electrolux. That seemed to be consensus here, and also CR. I had a hard time deciding, but ended up with the GE profile and am very happy with it. I have not seen any discussion here of new models taking that title.
Try sites like AJ Madison, Best Buy, HD/Lowes, and Sears to see what's available and read some reviews.
My induction range is an Electrolux. Love it! The cooktop is awesome. I dont have any of the problems that people mention. In fact i have NO problems/complaints. As opposed to reg radiant heat cooktop - no comparison. Blows it away
The oven is convection and I love how the racks glide.
The lower drawer is not just for storage either - it's an actual oven. I rarely use it tho as it takes a while to heat up and it's barely tall enough for a casserole dish. But definitely works well as a warming drawer (doesn't go above 400 I think)
Anyhow my E-lux retails at around $2700-3000. There are cheaper induction ranges out there but I'm glad I chose this one. The E-lux is just heavier and doors/racks seem sturdier than other brands I looked at. HTH!
I've had my GE Profile slide in induction range for about one month now - I absolutely love it. I would never go back to plain electric. There is a very low buzzing noise for the first few second the elements are turned on, but once the pan heats up (in like 15 seconds) the buzzing stops. Everything cooks nicely - and the clean up is a breeze. I've used the probe feature to roast a leg of lamb in the oven and it was terrific. The warming drawer is a nice feature if you have a large family or are having a big dinner. Takes away the need for 2 built in ovens. There are 3 racks, one of them is a glider.
I paid $2900 at Sears Canada (on sale from $3200).