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I cross posted this in remodeling, but I'm thinking this should go here? I'm fixing up my house to see if I can sell it for a good price in the spring. If I can't get what I want for it, I'll stay in it. So when fixing it up, I'm trying to do things for buyer appeal but also what I want, should I stay. Now that the counter is installed (the fabricator did a great job), I see that it is lovely. But the overall effect is not what I thought it would be. It's more of a creamy effect and looks awful with my white appliances. My walls are white, my general decorating scheme is cottage-y. My den, which is a combo with the kitchen, has camel and dark browns & muted colors (with red accents), which blend with the countertop (which is one reason I got it). I had considered black quartz or a white quartz, but went with the granite. Now I think it was a mistake. To make the kitchen look coordinated, I'll have to plunk down $$ to get new stainless appliances, and the backsplash (which will be beadboard) can't be the stark white I wanted but will have to be antiqued or soft white, which will look odd with my stark white sink. The pattern on the counter also bothers me (I've had solid white formica for 20 years). All the patterns on it just bother me. I got a leathered finish, so that looks nice and makes it go better with my 50+ year old house, though. I now think I should've gone with the black quartz. A simple solid color. I'm even considering getting the quartz and throwing out this granite countertop. Maybe I could get someplace to pay me something for it. I'm pretty upset about it. I just imagined it all wrong. I thought it would be a lighter effect that would go with true colors better, but it's more muted. Maybe once I get the beadboard backsplash up and do it true white, it'll help blend with the white appliances? Should I get new stainless appliances? Does anyone have any suggestions? It's not like I'm this way with everything. My new door, new door handles, new hardware, other things I love. It's just this one thing. |
Follow-Up Postings:
- Posted by TexasPenny (My Page) on Fri, Jan 17, 14 at 22:36
A picture would be a big help. It's difficult to offer opinions/suggestions without seeing the space. |
Could you post some pictures to help everyone see what it looks like? I think they could give better suggestions that way. |
What color are the cabinets? Yes, pictures would be very helpful. If you can post some, you will probably get a bunch of replies. It would be a shame to have to toss the granite. It may just be that some time needs to pass. As you said, you've had plain white formica for a long time. So your eyes may still be in a bit of a shock. With time, you may grow to love the stone. I am in a similar situation in needing to appeal to a buyer, so your post comes at a good time for me. I also have all white (laminate) and have been advised by realtors to install granite even though our move may be 18 months away. I'm finding it hard to imagine my space with a "patterned" counter. |
Here is a pic that has part of the white tile backsplash left. I was intending to paint the cabinets white, but now I'm thinking just having them refinished might be better. I can't remember how to post pics, although I've done it before. Couldn't find the instructions on the site. But I'll take a shot. |
Here's a pic of the close-up of the pattern. It's an off white background with shades of burgundy or reddish rust with faint dark gray (not that noticeable), and just a few spots with blackish tones. It gives an overall appearance of off white or cream with reddish brown bits and a bit of gray. |
- Posted by threegraces (My Page) on Sat, Jan 18, 14 at 10:50
I think it looks really nice with your cabinet color and that you are probably just having buyer's remorse when making such a big (and heavy) decision. A warm toned backsplash, and possibly a new sink, would be a much less expensive solution. I wouldn't necessarily replace the appliances either. |
I love your granite with your cabinets. I hate the backsplash. Once the backsplash is done, it will all pull together. I would not get rid of the granite. |
- Posted by carsonheim (My Page) on Sat, Jan 18, 14 at 12:17
I agree that the granite is great, and doesn't clash with the appliances. The backsplash... well... I would definitely replace. I also like your cabinet color with the granite -- it complements nicely. good luck! |
- Posted by live_wire_oak (My Page) on Sat, Jan 18, 14 at 12:24
If you want to paint the cabinets, a very light gray that looks white would be a good choice. Replace the back splash for sure. |
This could be just a distortion in the photo, or on my computer screen here, but I couldn't help noticing the somewhat yellow light in that globe ceiling fixture. Perhaps that is a standard incandescent bulb, which does produce a warm-toned yellowish light. It might be worth your time to try some other bulbs, either a "daylight" type compact fluorescent, or an LED bulb. The color of the light will really change the way things look, and you might light the color blends better. I'd surely try it before I took out that nice granite. |
Thank you all so much. Yes, maybe it's that my kitchen has been stark white for so long, I'm in shock from a more muted tone and from what I imagined it would look like. The pictures on Houzz.com show White Spring granite with white cabinets quite often (usu. Benjamin Moore "Cloud White"), but that's not the way it looks to me in person. The backsplash tiles are gone, now. I'm putting up beadboard, which can be painted any color. I can go with a soft white to blend with the counters. Thanks for your opinions. It's so helpful to get opinions from others who have gone through similar things. It's hard to imagine some things installed, from pictures and seeing big slabs in stone yards. Thank you so much! It helped clarify things. Also about the cabinet color. |
It looks good with your cabinetry and is fine with the appliances. Bright white with dark wood is a stark looking contrast. Warmer looks better, imo. As mentioned, you could paint the cabinets light to get a more cottage feel. That would look better with a beadboard back splash, imo. I don't think that seems like a good fit, as is, with the rich wood cabinets. |
This post was edited by snookums2 on Sat, Jan 18, 14 at 13:32
- Posted by TexasPenny (My Page) on Sat, Jan 18, 14 at 12:57
I too agree the granite looks just fine with your white appliances. It's really pretty with your cabinets. . |
To smiling: Yes, the light is white, not yellow like it appears in the pic. It's an incandescent bulb. You know, that's an excellent suggestion that hadn't occurred to me. Getting a daylight-tone light might make a difference. |
- Posted by detroit_burb (My Page) on Sat, Jan 18, 14 at 17:31
also adding very cool under counter lighting can really change the look of things, in one house I had blue pearl granite, it looked incredibly sparkling blue with the white fluorescent lighting on it, and kind of black in warm fluorescent light. check the side of the box your bulb comes in and chose a cooler bulb to see if things change - it's just a few dollars. I think it looks good enough to sell, the region you are in will make a difference, too, some areas demand higher level finishes. |
If the storage isn't absolutely necessary, it would really open up your kitchen to remove the cabinets over the peninsula. I like your granite and cabinets together. : ) |
I would not paint the cabinets. The granite is pretty with the cabinets....you did a wonderful job coordinating it with the existing cabinets! The white sink looks GREAT with it. I am not sure about the beadboard backsplash...I would want some color, especially with a cottage feel. Nancy |
I think you're going to be fine. I like the granite and cabinet combination. It works with white appliances, but a buyer who had to have something else could easily slide them out and plug in what they want. Those are really the easy things in your kitchen, Plunk another $100 into a new light fixture and fabric or wood shade for the window, maybe a rug on the floor and you'll be looking good. Make sure to give the stove top and oven a good cleaning too. I would not paint the cabinets. Getting a white on white look that works is harder than it may seem. If you miss, you have too cold or too stark and more people will be turned away. You will also lose some buyers who don't want to try to keep white looking clean and fresh. |
I am questioning if breadboard will work with that granite.... Btw, I have that or a very similar granite and have never been able to figure out what to do about a backsplash - but breadboard says cottage to me and that granite does not. Btw. I love both, but would want to see a photoshop picture of them together with you cabinets before committing. |
I want to add that I think the granite is lovely (and I don't like many granites!) and it also looks fine with your sink. It is a funny thing but white porcelain just seems to be right with so many different looks. I like your cabinets,they look great with the granite -- don't paint them unless you really want the change; if you do paint them, you might consider a soft color instead of white. |
You're granite is very beautiful. Take a deep breath and give yourself time to figure out how you would like to tie it all in. I feel your white appliances, white sink, and wood cabinets look fine with your granite. Personally I prefer white sinks and appliances to stainless. As much as I like bead board, I feel it is not the right look with the granite. I think the texture of the bead board, no matter what color painted, is too busy with your granite. They don't mesh well. I would think about tying in the creams and whites in your stone with curtains or other type of window treatment. I'm confused if you had plans on removing all the tile that is on the walls. I think I would remove the tile if it were me, but I'm not totally sure what to recommend in it's place. Perhaps a nice soft shade of cream or ivory paint. Paint is relatively inexpensive (even the top brands) and would give you a clean slate. If you have a scrap piece of your granite you can take that to the paint store to help select a soft complimentary shade. Let that gorgeous counter shine! Throw rugs, art work, a piece of pottery, curtains or a shade, all of that can help tie in the counter with the cabinets and your appliances without spending too much or exhausting yourself. I'm not normally a "granite person", but I truly like the granite you have. I think what is really bothering you right now is that the other elements in your kitchen, and have gotten used to, are now not working for you. You also had a different mindset..... "cottage", and need time to adjust to a slightly different direction. Your kitchen can still be warm and homey ("cottage", but in a different way). "Cottage" doesn't have to be a strict definition like the magazines are defining it as. |
Sandy...thanks for your thoughts. You're the second poster to state that you don't think the beadboard, esp painted a white, would go with the cabinets. Regarding the white tile backsplash I had, that is gone, now, and new dryall installed, ready for a new backsplash. I didn't want to do tile again, since I don't care for tile with granite (too busy). That's why I thought of the beadboard. My plan was to paint the cabinets, so the beadboard would go with it. I was thinking, now, if I don't pain the cabinets, the beadboard would still go, since they would be painted the same color as the rest of the walls in the combo den-kitchen (some sort of soft white). I hate cream in a kitchen, so will not do that. Kitchens should have crisp, clean colors, IMO. But my former, all-white kitchen was a bit glaring and didn't blend with the den too well (mahogany & cherry furniture & colors, dark camel, black tv, red accents, soft white walls). As for keeping the cabinets dark, I do have wood floors that will be refinished, and so will compete with the wood cabinets. Cabinets painted a soft white would solve that problem. I thought beadboard would be plain enough not to be too busy with the granite, since it's only vertical lines, and would tie in with the shutters. I'm hesitant to remove the shutters because that is a window theme throughout the house and are in the den part of the combo den-kitchen. I'm now looking at maybe tin with a pattern, so that the backsplash is silver, but that's probably too busy. I could just leave the plain drywall, add some wood molding (painted), and leave it at that. I'm mulling it over. It's good to know that others don't think the white appliances and sink look awful. That really was the most shocking thing to me. I was horrified by how they looked with the granite. In pics in Houzz, White Spring granite is repeatedly shown in white kitchens (white walls and cabinets & doors). I do think maybe I'm in shock since it doesn't look how I imagined and is so different from what I had. The stove is that new ice white and not the softer white of old, so that's part of the problem, I think. I considered stainless too modern a look for my old house, which is why I didn't get that before, but now I see that stainless would go with the new countertop and avoid any "color" issue. Thanks. |
- Posted by may_flowers (My Page) on Mon, Jan 20, 14 at 9:56
Everything is new except for the cabs, which is the problem. The heavily stained cabs don't work with the light granite and white ice appliances. On my monitor, the stain looks uneven and the cabs look a little dinged up. I would paint them, or even better, get new doors and drawer fronts and have the frames professionally repainted. Add end panels to the peninsula and overhanging cabinets. If you search for Linelle, that's what she did to change her oak kitchen to a white Shaker kitchen. It cost several thousand, but it was cheaper than buying SS appliances and replacing granite. |
We just had white springs installed with cherry cabinets and are now trying to figure out a backslash so I'm very interested in this thread. Please post pictures of your final backslash. Obviously, I think you made the correct granite choice. It looks great! |
LindaNew: What a coincidence. What were you thinking of doing with your backsplash? What shades of white or cream are you using in your kitchen, if any? My cabinets need refinishing or painting, so I could go with any color for the cabinets, but cherry goes very well with the granite (I think my cabs are cherry stained oak? Not sure. No one knows what kind of wood they are.) Everyone's different with backsplashes. I think I'm a bit different in that I don't care for ceramic tile backsplashes with granite, as a rule (too busy), although there are a few exceptions. I have seen some that I love. I saw a solid color glass subway with granite that I loved, and I love the tumbled brick look. I guess the grout lines are not noticeable in those. I've looked at a lot of beadboard backsplashes on Houzz, and I've loved every one of them. Currently I'm thinking I'll stick with that. I'd love a soft white glass subway tile, but I don't think I'd like that more than beadboard, and the tile would cost so much more and be more hassle. Another option is to paint the backsplash, finish it off with molding, and leave it at that for now. Not my favorite option, but it is an option. My house is small, and I'm updating several areas, which means budget concerns, so my situation may be different from yours |
Beadboard is not that expensive, is it? Could you go ahead and get enough for a moderate section (like next to the window), cut it to size, paint it, then fit it into place without securing it? -- then you could see whether you like the look or not before you commit to the whole kitchen. |
- Posted by Brandywine72 (My Page) on Tue, Jan 21, 14 at 15:08
Go slowly. Live with things for a while. You will not recoup your expenses of new granite when you put your house on the market. I do think that the counters and cabinets are a great combo. I would not do beadboard. Instead, I would just for the moment take out your current backsplash and paint the wall that nice cream wall color I see in the right side of the picture. I would then add a new light, window treatments, and maybe new knobs to the cabinets. Then decide if you are going to put your house on the market or not. If not, then figure out what to do next. But I think you have a good thing going here. |
- Posted by detroit_burb (My Page) on Tue, Jan 21, 14 at 18:19
OK, so I really like that granite, and I really like the way it looks on your base cabinets. Problem is, I don't like the backsplash (you said it's gone) and the uppers. In the finished kitchen blog you will find similar granite on walnut with a white subway backsplash and white uppers - this has been done a number of times in different permutations, and always looks good. http://finishedkitchens.blogspot.com/ |
Thanks, Detroit. I'll check that out that blog. Yes, the cabinets need either painting or refinishing. It's decent quality wood, but they are dark with age. Brandywine, regarding getting my money back on the counter, my old counter was damaged so had to be replaced. The only decision to be made was what substance to use. I went with granite, since that's still the rage here. I kept the cost down, so I think I may get the $ money back. But besides getting money back, there is the fact of simply getting an offer! I think your suggestion of just painting the backsplash might be wise. That way, a buyer can add one that they want without having to take out an existing one. I could add wood molding to finish it off. I agree that the shutters look bad, so I'll change that to something new, like a clean-look blind. I think giving it some time is wise, too. I've moved on to the bath, while I consider what to do to finish the kitchen. Thanks so much. |
Here's a vote for the beadboard. I don't like the backsplash to be the dominant item in a kitchen. The poster who suggested you remove the upper cabinet over the peninsula is right on. Just take it down, and you will not believe the difference. Doing this, allowed me to "deal" with ugly kitchen cabinets (really, really ugly) for a couple more years, until I had time to get the feel of a newly purchased house. I'm not a granite fan either, but I think yours looks great. |
I have had the same, or very similar, granite for the past 7 years and I have wood stained cabs and a cottagey house, too. When it was first installed I didn't sleep for a couple of nights worrying I had made a huge mistake. It was more than 2 years after installation that I was finally able to choose a bs. I wound up with ordinary tumbled marble in alabaster, the first row set on the square above the counter, then a row of 1" onyx tiles that have all the colors of the granite in them. The rest of the bs is the tumbled marble set on the diagonal. Grout matches the gray tones in the granite (can't recall the color name). The rustic matte finish and rough edges of the marble bs calmed down the extravagant look of the granite and made it a more earthy, casual kitchen, which is what I wanted. I do have ss appliances but don't think they look any better with it than white would have as the stone has quite a lot of white splotches. My window coverings are top down/bottom up fabric shades in the warm gray tone of the granite. I hope this helps a little bit and that you end up liking your granite, as I did. All the best to you! |
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LF confessed to me the other day, when he was a might bit younger, when he heard his classmate say he was writing down Fibonacci numbers, that he [LF] was just sure it was a formula for lying. Thought the math "geeks" over here would get a giggle out of that! He does know better now after I showed him the significance visually. |
Follow-Up Postings:
- Posted by endorphinjunkie z7bAlabama (My Page) on Wed, Dec 1, 10 at 12:49
Fibanacci sequences are incredibly beautiful. One can see them in certain seashells and also in how a galaxy rotates. It's one of the essence of the universal that is seen at all levels, micro- and macroscopic. And by the way, mathemagicians are not all that geeky. One must be tough to be a mathemagician, and admit to it. |
Not just gorgeously beautiful in nature, how we as humans emulate it knowingly or not. It amazes me how people try to claim this whole thing is an accident, there is so much purpose in it all. Essence is right. I love all [math] geeks including you Michael (my work is full of them. Scientists who use math to quantify heart disease). My son is a total geek, not just math. Science, math, history, he loves it all. Heck, I'm geeky too, how else could I have devined he heard "fib" "oh not" "ye" in all that? (((big grin))) |
Rob, I have to confess, I had NO clue what that was, so I googled it :) Lisa :) |
Really cool humanly created fibonacci sequence at the bottom. It's seen in architechture, paintings, scarves, pinecones, sunflowers, romanesco cauliflower, faces... it's everywhere! |
Here is a link that might be useful: circular photo collage
Another non math person here. I looked it up and got a headache immediately after I exclaimed cool! This is almost as bad as when I found out there are more than one kind of geometry. As in something besides Euclid. |
- Posted by west_gardener (My Page) on Wed, Dec 1, 10 at 19:35
Kudos to you Rob, as a parent,that when LF brought this issue to your attention, you took proactive action and introduced him to the RL possibilities. |
- Posted by endorphinjunkie z7bAlabama (My Page) on Wed, Dec 1, 10 at 20:00
These are more beautiful than fractals,which always amaze me.Now I'm going to looking for fabonacci patterns everywhere I go. |
- Posted by anneliese_32 6 (My Page) on Thu, Dec 2, 10 at 6:06
As another non-math person, I see the pattern but the math behind it escapes me. |
Plants and trees are beautiful to the eye when they appear balanced. Balance in the plant world follows fibonacci patterns. Planting three trees in a group is more balanced to the eye than two or four. Bonsai teaches placement of branches in spirals and vertical spacing. A good tree trimming job looks like a good haircut as in pleasing to the eye and following the order of the natural growth, something was done but it looks as though it grew that way naturally. This link shows the interconnection of nature and fibonacci patterns, the rest of her site is interesting also. |
Here is a link that might be useful: Fibonacci numbers in nature
- Posted by west_gardener (My Page) on Fri, Dec 3, 10 at 20:12
Don_social, I also think of the Fibonacci numbers as balance. Nature knows how to give balance, I have to work at it. I made a scarf with a mathematical straight sequence, I then made a hat (circular), yet I used a straight math sequence. I luv the site you posted, a very good example of nature's way. I'll keep striving for balance. |
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The 7th Annual Mar Vista Green Garden Showcase will be Saturday, April 25, 2015. This Earth Day celebration, presented by the Mar Vista Community Council, seeks to empower Angelenos to adopt environmentally conscious living solutions. With many people walking or biking their tours, there is a tremendous sense of community as garden enthusiasts from throughout Southern California join our neighbors to celebrate our shared vision for a greener life.
Click here to see a map of the areas we'll feature in the 2015 Showcase. We're looking for potential garden clusters now. Eligible gardens should have one or more of the following sustainability features: California native/drought tolerant plantings, edibles or water catchment systems. This is a curated show. The deadline for garden submittal is February 1, 2015.
Do you have gardens to recommend or questions about eligibility? Would you like to be on the Green Garden Showcase email list? Contact us at email@example.com.
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Suffolk Downs
Recount Confirms Defeat Of Mass. Casino Proposal
A recount has confirmed the defeat of Mohegan Sun's bid for a resort casino in the town of Palmer.
Gambling Commission Wants Suffolk Downs To Explain Casino Shift
The state gambling commission is asking Suffolk Downs to explain its bid to shift a proposed casino to Revere.
Suffolk Downs Reconsidering Options After Voters Reject Plan
Suffolk Downs says it will reconsider its options after voters rejected a plan to build a casino.
Suffolk Downs To Reassess Casino Bid After Defeat
Suffolk Downs says it will reassess plans to build a resort casino at the 78-year-old thoroughbred race track after East Boston voters rejected its proposal.
East Boston Casino Vote Testing Friendships
Neighbors are at odds over the proposed casino at Suffolk Downs in East Boston.
Suffolk Downs Gets Approval To Pursue Casino Bid
The owners of Suffolk Downs say they're pleased with the decision by the Massachusetts Gaming Commission to allow them to move ahead with their bid for one of three casino licenses.
Suffolk Downs Says It Seeks New Casino Operator
Officials of the Suffolk Downs thoroughbred race track told state gambling regulators on Tuesday that it is in discussions with several potential casino operators but may not have one in place before host community votes scheduled for next week.
Mass. Casino Panel Reviews Suffolk Down's Background
Operators of the Suffolk Downs thoroughbred race track will soon learn whether they can move forward with a bid to win the sole eastern Massachusetts casino license.
Casino Operators Fault Mass. Gambling Regulations
Steve Wynn said any other business offering to create hundreds of jobs and spend billions of dollars would get a much warmer reception from state officials.
Suffolk Downs Drops Caesars From Casino Bid
The Suffolk Downs ownership group said late Friday that it dropped partner Caesars Entertainment from its bid to build a $1 billion resort casino at the racetrack, weeks ahead of a public vote on the proposal.


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Alcoa Chairman And CEO Klaus Kleinfeld Applauds Bipartisan Effort To Establish Russia PNTR; Joins President Obama At The White House Signing Ceremony
Alcoa Chairman and CEO Klaus Kleinfeld (NYSE:AA) praised the bipartisan leadership that led to today's signing of the Russia and Moldova Jackson-Vanik Repeal Act of 2012 in the Oval Office at the White House. President Obama's signature paves the way for permanent normal trade relations with Russia through the rules-based World Trade Organization (WTO).
Kleinfeld witnessed today's signing by the president in the Oval Office. "We applaud President Obama for signing this important legislation that guarantees U.S. companies the same advantages of Russia's WTO commitments as our foreign competitors," Kleinfeld said. "This is a historic moment in U.S.-Russia relations and marks the beginning of a new era in bilateral commercial cooperation that will benefit global trade and American jobs."
Alcoa first began commercial operations in Russia in 1993. Today, the company employs approximately 5,300 people at its manufacturing operations in Samara, Belaya Kalitva and in Moscow. With over 140 million people and over $300 billion in imports in 2011, Russia represents a large and growing market for U.S. manufactured goods and the ninth largest economy.
About AlcoaAlcoa is the world's leading producer of primary and fabricated aluminum, as well as the world's largest miner of bauxite and refiner of alumina. In addition to inventing the modern-day aluminum industry, Alcoa innovation has been behind major milestones in the aerospace, automotive, packaging, building and construction, commercial transportation, consumer electronics and industrial markets over the past 120 years. Among the solutions Alcoa markets are flat-rolled products, hard alloy extrusions, and forgings, as well as Alcoa® wheels, fastening systems, precision and investment castings, and building systems in addition to its expertise in other light metals such as titanium and nickel-based super alloys. Sustainability is an integral part of Alcoa's operating practices and the product design and engineering it provides to customers. Alcoa has been a member of the Dow Jones Sustainability Index for 11 consecutive years and approximately 75 percent of all of the aluminum ever produced since 1888 is still in active use today. Alcoa employs approximately 61,000 people in 31 countries across the world. More information can be found at www.alcoa.com.
Forward-Looking StatementsThis release contains statements that relate to future events and expectations and as such constitute forward-looking statements within the meaning of the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995. Forward-looking statements include those containing such words as "anticipate," "expect," "plan," "should," "will," or other words of similar meaning. All statements that reflect Alcoa's expectations, assumptions or projections about the future other than statements of historical fact are forward-looking statements. Forward-looking statements are subject to a number of known and unknown risks, uncertainties, and other factors and are not guarantees of future performance. Important factors that could cause actual results to differ materially from those expressed or implied in the forward-looking statements include: (a) material adverse changes in aluminum industry conditions, including global supply and demand conditions and fluctuations in London Metal Exchange-based prices for primary aluminum, alumina, and other products; (b) deterioration in global economic and financial market conditions generally, or unfavorable changes in the markets served by Alcoa; (c) the outcome of contingencies, including legal proceedings, government investigations, and environmental remediation; (d) the inability to complete the remediation of the Grasse River as planned, within cost estimates, and by scheduled completion dates, whether due to unexpected events beyond Alcoa's control, regulatory requirements, or other reasons; and (e) the other risk factors summarized in Alcoa's Form 10-K for the year ended December 31, 2011 and other reports filed with the Securities and Exchange Commission. Alcoa disclaims any obligation to update publicly any forward-looking statements, whether in response to new information, future events or otherwise, except as required by applicable law.Check Out Our Best Services for Investors
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Golden Retriever Puppy Attack!
This is the real cure for depression. Unless you have a phobia of being tickled and kissed to death by 13 golden retriever puppies… I don't know about you, but i'd pay for this!
This post was created by a user and has not been vetted or endorsed by BuzzFeed's editorial staff. BuzzFeed Community is a place where anyone can post awesome lists and creations. Learn more or post your buzz!


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Messages relating to layoffs at Johnson Controls Inc. are presented below the company info.
Johnson Controls Inc.
Company information:
- Industry/Area of Activity:
- Autos & Auto Parts
- Company Stock Ticker:
- Stock traded at:
- Industry Code:
- 3355
Comment! It's anonymous! Post information you know, rumors you heard, your experiences, or contribute to the discussion by answering or asking about layoffs at Johnson Controls Inc.. The comment form is located near the bottom of the page.
Posts regarding layoffs at Johnson Controls Inc.
JCI loss is my potential gain..... please read
Heard about the downsizing that took place last week at Air Control. I am seeking one experienced sales professional to represent our products in the U.S. I can be reached at email@example.com or check our website caminosystems.com
Downsizing at JC Waynesboro - April 2014
Our Waynesboro plant (refrigeration equipment) will be closed. It'll take over a year to finalize this and people will be let go, downsized... UAW Local 1296 is working on this, not sure if they will be able to do anything. 200 positions will be cut, both union and non-union. Motor and compressor work may be going to Mexico.
30 to be cut (Feb 2014)
30 to be cut at our two St. Joseph locations... The Pear street location (battery assembly) will be affected.
Within six months johnson controls will fold and all of you will be w/out work. Say thanks to greenspan and that joker W.


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But what shall I do when I can't print anything.
When I choose printer in my software i get this kind of comuunicate.
I couldn't say, when exactly started this problem but I am sure that it was on this same time on both computers.
I have reinstalled alle software, and still I have this problem.
It isn't depends on any file.
Please give me some advice.
Create a new file: not from a template, but an actual 'empty' new file.
In this file, manually create your desired plot parameters using PAGESETUP command.
SAVE the file and give it a name.
Draw a few lines, then try to PLOT them: your file or AutoCAD crashes?
Sorry, but your advice in not useful because when I use comman PLOTSETUP i new file i get this FATAL ERROR.
It is really strange.
Do you have the Object Enabler installed to allow you to access Civil 3D objects? Since you said that the XREF's are generated by a C3D workstation
Sorry Nik-D but I don't understand You and I'm not sure that is cased by my English or just Your answer isn't connected with my problem. I don;t have Civil 3D. only AutoCAD 2007 & 2008
You mentioned that the XREF's you attach come from a user who is using C3D. If the XREF's contain objects specific to the C3D platform then it is possible that they are causing your version of AutoCAD to crash. By installing the C3D Object Enabler it would allow the use of these objects, shopuld there be any, in your version of AutoCAD.
It is another box to tick off top solve the problem.
No, it was mistake.
I haven't mention about any XREFs or Civil.
I have only refreshed this case in order to not to make similar case.
Please help me!
Now i get similar error when I use any command!
I really don't know why.
Do you know what can be a reason?
Back up all of your work files, and any customizations. Twice, to two different locations not on your PC.
Reinstall Windows.
Reinstall AutoCAD.
Update all.
Test. Retest. Ensure it all works.
Now you can reinstall each of every other application you need, starting with your anti-virus: test AutoCAD after each one is installed.
Repeat until you are back up to speed.
If AutoCAD breaks, the last application you installed is the culprit.
Have questions about Autodesk products? Ask the community.
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Press release ETP Slovakia relating to the police intervention in the settlement Budulovská, Moldava nad Bodvou, Slovakia
ETP Slovakia – Centre for Sustainable Development, a non-profit organization issues the following statement relating to the police intervention in the settlement Budulovská, in the town of Moldava nad Bodvou, which took place on Wednesday 19 June 2013. Based on available information on the extent and severity of wounds of inhabitants of the settlement, as well as property damage, there is a serious concern that excessive and inappropriate force may have been used by the Police. ETP Slovakia is requesting the Ministry of Interior of the Slovak Republic to investigate this intervention.
On Saturday 15 June 2013, in settlement Budulovská, Moldava nad Bodvou, a final presentation of the results of a long-term project aiming to clean up the settlement took place. The project was a part of an educational program called RomaNet. This final event was organized by three men from Budulovská settlement, who have had long-term support for their activities by ETP Slovakia and Equity.
The event was attended by inhabitants of the settlement and invited guests, and included cultural and sporting activities. After the end of the official program at 5.30 pm, an informal celebration continued. Both the event and the follow-up celebration took place approximately 1,5 km from the town's residential area. During the evening, a police patrol of the Municipal Police arrived (the organizers had invited the municipal police to the event), did not identify any problems and promised support should it be needed.
Around 11 pm), members of Slovak State Police Force arrived and requested the music volume to be turned down. This request was complied with. This patrol returned to the site again, in early morning hours, when the celebration had finished and the organizers were disassembling the equipment. One of the police officers assaulted a juvenile, Leonard H., referring to allegedly "unsettled matters from the past". A skirmish ensued between the settlement inhabitants and the police officers, which included throwing rocks at the police vehicle resulting in a broken window. Two persons (juvenile Leonard H. and mentally disabled Ernest R.) were arrested and taken to the police station in Košice, where they were held until Wednesday 19 June 2013.
On the same Wednesday afternoon, around 5 pm, the Police Force arrived in the settlement Budulovská with approximately 20 vehicles (cca. 60 masked police force members). Without any announcement or communication with the inhabitants, they began searching the houses. The inhabitants of the settlement put up no resistance during this intervention, during which, more than 30 persons were injured. Several inhabitants had to seek medical attention and marks of being hit by police batons are visible even in small children. In addition, the police action caused significant damage to housing and property of the inhabitants (broken doors and windows, furniture, vehicle damage). Around 15 people were arrested and taken to the police station in Moldava nad Bodvou, where those arrested were further physically assaulted by the Police. Subsequently, the people were released without charge.
Based on all available information and personal inspection of the site of intervention – see attached photo documentation – there is a strong belief that the Slovak Police Force used inappropriate force during the intervention and thus may have breached relevant legal regulations. ETP Slovakia – Centre for Sustainable Development, who on a long-term basis and in cooperation with the municipality provides comprehensive social services in the settlement of Budulovská, Moldava nad Bodvou, will request the Ministry of Interior of the Slovak republic to conduct a formal investigation into the actions of the Police.
2 Responses to Press release ETP Slovakia relating to the police intervention in the settlement Budulovská, Moldava nad Bodvou, Slovakia
Názor OZ - reakcia says:
…To čo sa udialo v Moldave nad Bodvou je iba dôsledok dlhodobého neriešenia rómskeho problému. Preto je potrebné odhaliť príčinu, prečo všetky vlády nenašli vôľu riešiť postavenie rómskych komunít, najmä v osadách.
Štát vynakladá značné finančné prostriedky na rôzne inštitúcie, ktoré by mali tento problém riešiť, ale nikto nevyžaduje od uvedených inštitúcii, aby sa za tieto vynaložené financie vytvorili podmienky pre lepší život ľudí v osadách.
Žiaľ na Slovensku nie je žiadna sila – inštitúcia a ani osoba, ktorá by poukázala na podstatu problému.
Aj média poukazujú iba na dôsledky, a neodhaľujú podstatu problému.
V minulej reakcii sme upozornili na to, že predchádzajúce vlády zriadili, vyškolili, vybavili a zaplatili 400 kukláčov a nedokázali zriadiť pozíciu pre jedného špičkového manažéra, ktorý by riadil riešenie rómskej otázky. Splnomocnenci vlády pre rómske komunity sú vždy politický nominanti, nie špičkový manažéri.
Na Slovensku ani po 23 rokoch neexistuje štruktúra, ktorá by mala právomoci rómsky problém riešiť.
Tu je hlavná príčina, prečo sa rómsky problém nerieši!!!
Experimenty – koncepcie, stratégie a reformy vždy zostali iba vo verbálnej polohe.
Na Slovensku poznáme stovky ľudí, ktorí si z riešenia/neriešenia rómskej otázky urobili svoj vlastný biznis. Žiadny kontrolný orgán nemá záujem tento biznis odhaliť.
Osoby, ktoré na rómskom probléme ryžujú by boli najradšej, keby sa tento problém riešil ešte niekoľko generácii… -
rekcia says:
Pán minister Kaliňák dokázal vybaviť 400kukláčov, ktorých už niekoľko rokov musí štát platiť a zatiaľ nedokázal vytvoriť ani jednu pozíciu pre špičkového manažéra, ktorý by bol vybraný výberovým konaním a začal by konečne skutočne žalostné postavenie Rómov v osadách.
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The project Let´s Learn How to Learn has been supported by Iceland, Liechtenstein and Norway through Active Citizenship » čítať ďalej
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New home owners in Rankovce are waiting for the faucets to be installed
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Presentation of Andrej Salner and Michaela Farenzenová from the Slovak Governance Institute delivered at the workshop on the Feuerstein Method » čítať ďalejSharing our Presentations from the Workshop
The Feuerstein Method Received Positive Feedback We are glad that our workshop on the Feuerstein Method of Instrumental Enrichment received such » čítať ďalejTeaching Requires a Relationship
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Welcome to christine_zone5's Member Page
See my Clippings See my Journal See my trade list Send me an email
I am somewhat new to gardening. After purchasing my first new house (2years ago), which has a large yard (1.5 acres), my husband and I found we had a large job ahead of us to landscape our yard. In the process we have both discovered we really enjoy gardening. Planting trees, shrubs and flowers, and watching them grow and caring for them is very enjoyable for both of us. The Garden Web has provided me with very helpful information for my garden.
I live in: United States
My zone is: zone 5 MI
My favorite forum 1 is Trees.
My favorite forum 2 is Shrubs.
First registered on April 16, 2002 .


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The Bachelor Episode Three: A Kiss (And Kick) From A Rose
Whatever happened to dinner and a movie?
You have to give it to the cupids who come up with Bachelor Brad's dates—they're hard to beat. On last night's show, Brad and his date Ashley S., (the nanny from NYC who scored the first impression rose), hit up Capitol Records in Hollywood to record a rendition of the hit Seal ballad, "Kiss From A Rose." It just happens to be Ashley's favorite song, one that her now deceased father used to sing to her. Hmm...coincidence? Doubtful. Why do you think those applications to appear on the show are so long? To find tearjerking information in hopes of causing breakdowns among the already fragile women in the house, naturally! I bet they know which hands she wipes with, too.
Anyway, the duet commences and it's. just. awful. Brad and Ashley are all smiles, but the poor dude recording this ear ache isn't so fond of their budding love. So they go into another recording studio, and wouldn't you know it, it's Seal! Singing "Kiss From A Rose"!
After Mr. Klum serenades them, Brad and Ashley retire to the roof where Ashley gets the rose. And a kiss.
Back at the mansion, the group date card arrives. Michelle warns the camera that if she's in the group, she will NOT be happy. Of course she gets chosen. The next day, the gaggle of spandex-clad girls meet Brad to film an action movie! He surprises them with an impromptu ninja fight (which he wins), and then tells each gal that they get to film an action scene with him.
Shawntel's kick butt moves make her stand out to Brad and snag a smooch. All the while, Michelle gives a play-by-play account of her feelings and how much it sucks that Brad is swapping spit with that hoochie. 6 Dead-End Dating Patterns—And How To Change Them
Brad throws the girls a wrap party after the shoot, and the claws come out. Each lady wants her one-on-one time with the man of the hour. Brad's really vibing with one girl, until he spots Michelle out of the corner of his eye, lurking in the dark. The added Psycho music adds a nice touch. Michelle steals him away and finally gets that kiss she's wanted. But Brad still gives the rose to Shawntel, the funeral director. Oh, snap!
The next day, Emily finally gets a one-on-one date with Brad. She's nervous about telling him about the daughter she had with her fiance, who died in a plane crash five years ago. Heavy stuff. To make it worse, in the grossest display of blatant emotional manipulation ever before seen on TV, want to guess what their date was? A freaking plane ride.
Really, ABC?! You have zero class.
Much to the dismay of the producers, who clearly set her up for a mid-air breakdown, Emily stayed cool as a cucumber.
The date continues in Santa Maria for a zip through wine country. Brad asks Emily pointed questions, which she deflects. At dinner, she finally tells him her sad story, after which they both relax and start getting along really well. Yes, Emily gets the rose.


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Will Eisner: A Dreamer's Life in ComicsIn Will Eisner: A Dreamer's Life in Comics, Michael Schumacher delves beneath Eisner's public persona to draw connections between his life and his art. Eisner's career spanned a remarkable eight decades, from his scrappy survival at the dawn of comics' Golden Age in the late 1930s to the beginning of the twenty-first century, when Pulitzers began going to graphic novels (a term Eisner is widely credited with creating). Schumacher's extensive research and interviews with Eisner's family, friends, and colleagues, as well as other comics creators who have built upon his work, create a detailed portrait of Eisner the man and Eisner the artist. |
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Review: Will Eisner: A Dreamer's Life in Comics
User Review - Cindy Samul - GoodreadsWill Eisner's life spanned the history and evolution of comics, from the cheap disposable entertainment of the 1930's to the award winning graphic novels we're familiar with today. Very early on ... Read full review
Review: Will Eisner: A Dreamer's Life in Comics
User Review - Alexander Veee - GoodreadsWith the exception of the novel's villains, who are largely caricatures motivated by greed or a lust for power, Eisner's characters in A Life Force are complex individuals trapped in a harsh world of ... Read full review


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Contact this shelter/rescue group to see their pets for adoption. |
Our Featured Waxahachie, TX Partner:
Ellis County SPCA
Dog adoption and cat adoption saves lives. Adopt a dog or adopt a cat and you'll have a friend for life! Contact us, or contact another local humane society, animal shelter or SPCA.
2570 FM 878 Waxahachie, TX 75165 (972) 935-0756 |
Email: Website: http://www.elliscountyspca.org |
Pets at Our Shelter:
Cities, Towns, and/or Counties We Serve:
We are the housing facility for the Ellis County Sheriff's Office and the Cities of Palmer, Garrett, Milford and Ennis.We are a private non profit animal shelter.
About Our Shelter:
The Ellis County SPCA opened to the public in August 2004. We are a private non-profit 501(c) (3) organization and are located in Waxahachie, Texas. We are not affiliated with any other SPCA or the ASPCA of New York. Our success depends on the support of donors, volunteers, and animal control contracts with the City of Ennis and the Ellis County Sheriff's office. Due to the extreme number of animals brought in by animal control, we are unable to be a no kill shelter.Due to an increase in population in Ellis county, there is also an overpopulation of animals. A group of concerned citizens has formed the Ellis County Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals (EC-SPCA) in an effort to increase adoptions of these animals, to educate our community about the importance of spaying and neutering, to provide information on proper animal care including kindness towards animals, and to help build a modern animal care center.
The Ellis County SPCA (Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals) was founded in April 2003 by a group of volunteers from the community who saw the need to:
Increase adoptions of unwanted animals by offering them a second chance for life in a loving home;
Foster public sentiment of humanity and gentleness toward animals, and;
Encourage and promote responsible pet ownership by increasing spay/neuters.
Why we cannot be a "No Kill" Shelter
No Kill shelters limit the type and number of animals that they take in based on their adoptability and space available in their facility. Animals that are turned away from these types of shelters must still go somewhere. Every animal shelter must do some euthanasia of animals that are sick, aggressive or hurt. We want to help the MAJORITY and cannot limit ourselves to which homeless animals are brought to us. To help pay for overhead of $250,000 annually and to keep our facility open, we current hold two contracts with the Ellis County Sheriff's office and the City of Ennis. We receive over 400 strays monthly from those contracts alone.
We do not set a maximum amount of time we will keep an animal up for adoption. Decisions about euthanasia are based on the adoptability of the animal and the space available to humanely house the animal at the shelter. Rather than setting a time limit, we strive to ensure that each animal remains healthy and adoptable. If the animal becomes stressed, aggressive, or sick at the shelter, or if space becomes a problem, euthanasia may be considered.
It is estimated that animal shelters care for between 68 million dogs and cats every year in the United States, of whom 34 million are euthanized. There are simply not enough responsible homes for all of these wonderful, innocent animals. At this point in time, it would be impossible to humanely house every unwanted animal in the United States.
Come Meet our Pets:
Our shelter is located at 2570 Fm 878 in Waxahachie. We are 2 miles east of Hwy 287 going toward Palmer.Adoption hours are Tuesday - Friday 12-4pm and Saturday and Sunday from 1-4pm


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Friday, April 12, noon. The Woodland Senior Center Computer Club, Inc., will hold an open lab for any Yolo County resident 18 or older until 3 p.m. at the Woodland Community & Senior Center, 2001 East St. The cost is $1 per session to use the computers; five cents per printed page. Assistance is available. For more information, check the website at www.wsccc.com or leave a message at 662-9598.
Saturday, April 13, 9 a.m. There will be a bicycle swap until noon at Woodland Adult Education, 575 Hayes St., in the Parking lot on First St. Buy a bike or swap a bike.
Saturday, April 13, 5:30 p.m. The Pioneer High School FFA Friends & Family Boosters invites people to their 9th Annual Dinner & Auction at the Woodland Elks Lodge, 500 Bush St.
Sunday, April 14, noon. The Davis Odd Fellows will be sponsoring a "Second Sunday Bingo" fundraiser for Yolo Military Families. It will be held at 415 Second St., Davis. Doors will open at noon and play will begin at 1 p.m. Tickets are $20 and you must be 18 to participate.
Wednesday, April 17, 10 a.m. Joann Hatchett, RN, returns to assist seniors in planning for care in the future. This seminar dives deep into completing Advanced Directives for Health Care and Physicians Orders for Life Sustaining Treatments. The documents needed are provided in addition with help to complete them. Held at the Woodland Senior Center, 2001 East St., Woodland. For information, contact the Woodland Senior Center at 661-2001.
Friday, April 19. Today is the deadline to RSVP for tickets to the Yolo County's Taxpayers Association Annual Dinner, which is scheduled for 5:30 p.m., Thursday, April 25, at the Hotel Woodland, 436 Main St., Woodland. The cost is 40 per person. To make reservations, call 753-7529; or email email@example.com. The guest speaker for the evening will be Davis Enterprise columnist bob Dunning who will be speaking on the topic "Sustainable Governance." Membership to the Association is not required to attend the dinner.
Monday, April 22. The 35-year reunion for the Woodland High School Class of 1978 is scheduled for Saturday, July 13. Monday, April 22, is the deadline to make reservations by calling Becky Ervin at (707) 954-6636.


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Conner Mach drove in the game-winning run in the 11th. |
March 30, 2011
SAN MARCOS, Texas - Junior third baseman Conner Mach hit a game-winning single in the top of the 11th inning to propel the Mizzou baseball team to its second-straight extra-inning win as it topped Texas State, 3-2. The win improves the Tigers to 13-12 on the season. Senior lefty Kelly Fick earned the win for the Tigers as he threw the final two innings of the game, allowing just two hits. He was one of eight pitchers used by the Tigers in the win.
The Tiger pitching staff continues to be the story as of late as the eight hurlers did not give up an earned run in the 11 innings of action on Wednesday. In fact, dating back to the final two innings of the Central Arkansas series finale, the Tiger pitching staff has given up just one earned run in the last 33 innings as both of Texas State's runs on Wednesday were unearned. The streak is also at 18 straight innings without and earned run for Mizzou.
The Tigers used a wild 11th inning to take a late lead over Texas State. With two outs and a runner on second, Brannon Champagne struck out, but Bobcat catcher Andrew Stumph let the ball go through to the back stop, allowing Champagne to reach base on the passed ball. That also allowed Jesse Santo to advance to third, setting the stage for Mach, who laced a single to left, knocking in the game-winning run. Fick closed out the game, pitching out of a bases-loaded jam in the 11th to earn the win.
Mach led all Tiger batters, going 3-4 at the plate with a pair of RBI and a walk. Dane Opel also put together a nice game, going 2-4 with the other RBI for the Tigers. Of the eight Tiger pitchers, none went more than two innings and Fick was the only pitcher to throw more than 30 pitches in the outing. Santo led the team with a pair of runs scored in the game and second baseman Eric Garcia also scored a run.
Followed by four scoreless innings by the Tiger pitching staff, Mizzou got on the board in the fifth inning after a sacrifice fly from Mach, scoring Santo who reached on a seeing-eye single through the right side earlier in the inning. But Texas State was able to get out of the inning after Eric Garcia struck out for the third time in the game.
Texas State got on the board in the bottom of the sixth, also scoring on a sacrifice fly. The runner reached base on an error by Santo, making it an unearned run for the Bobcats. They added another unearned run in the seventh after Garcia short-armed a routine 4-3 groundout, allowing a run to score. They went on to load the bases, but McCormick pitched out of the jam to keep the Tigers down by only a run.
That was big because Mizzou came back to plate the tying run in the eighth on an RBI single by Opel, scoring Garcia, who atoned for his seventh-inning error by reaching base and scoring the tying run in the next frame. Mizzou loaded the bases with one out, but a strikeout by pinch hitter Dillon Everett and a groundout by Santo stranded the bases loaded.
McCormick came back on the eighth and retired the side in order, using a sensational 1-3 groundout for the second out, keeping the Tigers in the game. In fact, he and Fick were nearly flawless in the final 4.1 innings of work, setting the stage for the late-game heroics.
Mizzou will be back in action this weekend as they will stay in Austin for a three-game series with No. 8 Texas, beginning at 6 p.m. For all the latest on Mizzou baseball, stay tuned to MUTigers.com and follow the team on twitter @MUTigerBaseball.
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Charlie Wittmack risks it all to complete World Triathlon
Wayne DrehsThis story appears in the July 25, 2011 issue of ESPN The Magazine. See Wayne Drehs' story on ESPN.com here. THE DOTS ARE ORANGE. A new one appears every 10 minutes. This is the only way Cate Wittmack knows her husband is still alive. Halfway aroun...
Blog | Conversation | July 17, 2011 -
"Super Bowl Shuffle" rocked the NFL 25 years ago. Here's the stor...
Wayne DrehsCHICAGO -- On the night Julia Meyer finally had enough, she was watching television. Mindlessly flipping through the channels, trying to fall asleep, she stumbled onto a home shopping channel special featuring a framed collection of photos from the...
Blog | Conversation | December 09, 2010 -
Fear and loathing in Greeley
Wayne DrehsWayne Drehs looks at what could be the most out-of-control college football program in the country, and it isn't Miami.
Story | Conversation | November 06, 2006 -
Teammate sabotage? It happens
Wayne DrehsWith so much money and fame at stake, should we be surprised by the alleged teammate sabotage at Northern Colorado?
Story | Conversation | November 06, 2006 -
Stabbed punter still lives in fear
Wayne DrehsUniversity of Northern Colorado punter Rafael Mendoza struggles to come to grips with an attempt on his life ... perhaps by a teammate.
Story | Conversation | November 05, 2006 -
Getting religion at the Super Bowl
Wayne DrehsWayne Drehs discovers during his Super Bowl Lives series that football wasn't the only religion in Jacksonville on Sunday.
Story | Conversation | February 07, 2005 -
Super Bowl high life on wheels
Wayne DrehsWhat happens in the limo, stays in the limo . . . except when Wayne Drehs rides along at the Super Bowl.
Story | Conversation | February 06, 2005 -
Pulling strings at the Super Bowl
Wayne DrehsCan't get into the exclusive Super Bowl functions? Wayne Drehs spends a day with the one person who can pull strings for you.
Story | Conversation | February 04, 2005 -
Fast times at the FHM party
Wayne DrehsWayne Drehs spends a Super Bowl evening in the fast lane with 100-meter Olympic gold medalist Justin Gatlin at the FHM party.
Story | Conversation | February 04, 2005 -
The Super Bowl on cruise control
Wayne DrehsWayne Drehs spends the day with a cruise ship social host who has sailed over the bounding main to get to the Super Bowl.
Story | Conversation | February 03, 2005 -
Case worker: SB XXXIX beer wars
Wayne DrehsWayne Drehs spends a day on the front lines of a Super Bowl battle through the mud and the blood and, especially, the beer.
Story | Conversation | February 01, 2005 -
The Streaker does Hollywood
Wayne DrehsAfter streaking at the Super Bowl last year, Mark Roberts was the toast of the town -- so why is he packing his bags?
Story | Conversation | January 26, 2005 -
Wayne DrehsAfter a tragic accident, Brad Hurtig overcomes enormous obsticles to return to the playing field.
Story | Conversation | May 20, 2004 -
Athletes are cheerleaders, too
Wayne DrehsTerrell Owens and Allen Iverson can't get a crowd fired up like those scantily clad athletes roaming the sidelines.
Story | Conversation | March 15, 2004 -
Requiem for a foul ball
Wayne DrehsA massage? A last supper? A security entourage? An execution? Only Cubs fans would go to such lengths to lift a curse.
Story | Conversation | February 27, 2004 -
Follow the yell leaders!
Wayne DrehsPage 2's tour of college football concludes with swaying and screaming at Texas A&M.
Story | Conversation | November 25, 2003


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What a beautiful scene. |
Just stumbled upon your gallery. you have some really interesting stuff here. Just shows the skill and vision of the photographer is more important than having all the most expensive equipment. Well done you |
Both brilliant. I am totally jealous - could only dream of getting a couple of shots like this. |
ABsolutely beautiful. Love the full frame composition. you have really caught the velvety texture and depth of colour |
Lovely shot. Like the close crop, full frame composition |
Gatekeeper (Pyronia tithonus) by Snapitt Great detail |
Colours Galore! by barbarahirst fabulous colours and composition Barbara. I have never been to the carnival but you have certainly shown me what I have been missing - maybe next year! |
Scotney Castle (view 2) by dbedford Hi David, long time no 'talk'. Lovely shot here. Thanks for your kind words about my starlings but you are being far too modest. Your portfolio has some great additions since i was last here and as always your presentation is super. |
Hub Cap Reflection by pdsdigital Really well seen and taken. Makes a very attractive image |
Thingvellir National Park by WhiteRose1 Looks blinking cold too. Super landscape. Lovely reflection in the middle ground. |
Another great set of images Carol |
Lovely colours and composition |
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From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia - View original article
Common land (a common) is land owned collectively or by one person, but over which other people have certain traditional rights, such as to allow their livestock to graze upon it, to collect firewood, or to cut turf for fuel.[1] Originally in medieval England the common was an integral part of the manor, and was thus legally part of the estate in land owned by the lord of the manor, but over which certain classes of manorial tenants and others held certain rights. By extension, the term "commons" has come to be applied to other resources which a community has rights or access to. The older texts use the word "common" to denote any such right, but more modern usage is to refer to particular rights of common, and to reserve the name "common" for the land over which the rights are exercised. "Common land" does not mean state-owned or public land, but land that is owned by private individuals or corporations called partition units. A person who has a right in, or over, common land jointly with another or others is called a commoner.[2]
Today commons still exist in England, Wales, Scotland, and the United States, although their extent is much reduced from the millions of acres that existed until the 17th century.[3]
Historically most rights of common were appurtenant[4] to tenancies of particular plots of land held within a manor, and the commoner would be the person who, for the time being, was the occupier of a particular plot of land (or in the case of turbary, even a particular heath). Some rights of common were said to be in gross, that is, they were unconnected with tenure of land. This was more usual in regions where commons are more extensive, such as in Northern England or the Fens, but also included many village greens across England and Wales. Most land with appurtenant commons rights is adjacent to the common or even surrounded by it, but in a few cases it may be some considerable distance away. Manorial courts defined the details of many of the rights of common allowed to manorial tenants, and such rights formed part of the copyhold tenancy whose terms were defined in the manorial court roll.
Example rights of common are:
On most commons, rights of pasture and pannage for each commoner are tightly defined by number and type of animal. For example the occupier of a particular cottage might be allowed to graze fifteen cattle, four horses, ponies or donkeys, and fifty geese, whilst the numbers allowed for their neighbours would probably be different. On some commons (such as the New Forest and adjoining commons), the rights are not limited by numbers, and instead a marking fee is paid each year for each animal turned out.[7]
A partition unit is a corporation that owns common land. In this case, the land is not state-owned or in joint-ownership under a trust, but is owned by a definite partition unit, a legal partnership whose partners are the participating individual landowners. Common lands and waterways owned by a partition unit were created by an agreement where certain land was reserved for the common use of all adjacent landowners.
In contrast to wasteland or unclaimed land, common land has definite owners. It is often thought that a common is somehow owned by everyone, or at least by the community in some sense.[citation needed] While that may have been true more than a thousand years ago, when wasteland would be used for grazing by the local community and over which there would not be, nor would there need to be, any particular limit or control of usage; since at least late Anglo-Saxon times, the right to exercise a right of common has been restricted to a commoner. Similarly, state-owned forest or areas are distinct: for instance, Royal Forests are legally separate from ordinary commons, but most have a similar commoning system.
Pasture commons are those where the primary right is to pasture livestock. In the uplands, they are largely moorland, on the coast they may be salt marsh, sand dunes or cliffs, and on inland lowlands they may be downland, grassland, heathland or wood pasture, depending on the soil and history. These habitats are often of very high nature conservation value, because of their very long continuity of management extending in some cases over many hundreds of years. In the past, most pasture commons would have been grazed by mixtures of cattle, sheep and ponies (often also geese). The modern survival of grazing on pasture commons over the past century is uneven.[8]
Surviving commons are almost all pasture. In earlier times, arable farming and haymaking were also included in the commons system, with strips of land in the common arable fields and common haymeadows assigned annually by lot. When not in use for these purposes, such commons were also grazed. Examples include the common arable fields around the village of Laxton in Nottinghamshire, and a common meadow at North Meadow, Cricklade.
Lammas rights entitled commoners to pasture following the harvest, between Lammas day, 12 August (N.S.), to 6 April, even if they did not have other rights to the land. Such rights sometimes had the effect of preventing enclosure and building development on agricultural land.[9]
The legal position concerning common land is confused. Most commons are based on ancient rights, that is to say common law (coincidence of term only), which pre-date statute law laid down by parliament. The exact rights which apply to individual commons were in some cases documented but more often were based on long-held traditions. The UK government tried to regularise the definitions of common land with the Commons Registration Act 1965,[10] which established a register of common land. However numerous inconsistencies and irregularities remain.[11]
There was a belief that if an Englishman or woman could build a house on common land, raise the roof over their head and have a fire in the hearth between sunrise and sunset, then they could have the right of undisturbed possession.[12] The belief was actually a fallacy, but to stop landless peasants unlawfully squatting on commons, an act known as the Erection of Cottages Act 1588 (31 Eliz c. 7, long title "An Act against the erecting and maintaining of Cottages"), was introduced.[12][13]
Registered commons often abut each other, so what appears to be a single large common may in fact consist of several commons with no visible boundary between them and perhaps in different parishes. The commoners will have reciprocal rights over one another's commons.
The maintenance of fences around a common is the responsibility of the occupiers of the adjacent enclosed land, not (as it would be with enclosed land) the responsibility of the owners of the grazed livestock. This can lead to difficulties where not all adjacent occupiers maintain their fences properly.
The act of transferring resources from the commons to purely private ownership is known as enclosure, or (especially in formal use, and in place names) Inclosure. The Inclosure Acts were a series of private Acts of Parliament, mainly from about 1750 to 1850, which enclosed large areas of common, especially the arable and haymeadow land and the better pasture land.
Some commons are managed by Boards of Conservators for the wider public benefit. The Commons Act 2006[14] provides for the establishment of Commons Councils to manage common land. Those provisions of the Act are not yet in force, but the Department of the Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (DEFRA) plans to bring them into force in the spring of 2009. The Commons Councils established under the Act will have a similar role to that of existing Conservators.[15]
The use of commons rights were (and are, where they still exist) carefully controlled, and so in practice commons do not usually suffer from uncontrolled exploration. For example, in response to overgrazing a common would be stinted,[16] that is, a limit would be put on the number of animals each commoner was allowed to graze. These regulations were responsive to demographic and economic pressure; thus, rather than let a common become degraded, access was restricted even further.
After the Second World War, most lowland commons became neglected because commoners, who could find better-paid work in other sectors of the economy, largely stopped exercising their rights. When open habitats are no longer grazed they start to develop scrub and then dense woodland, losing the grassy or heathland vegetation which may have occupied the land continuously for many centuries. In 2007 Ashdown Forest, the beautiful Sussex heathland recognised worldwide as the setting for the Winnie-the-Pooh stories, became the centre of a dispute between some local residents and the Forest's governing body, the Board of Conservators, which is responsible for administering the Forest's 2,400 hectares (5,900 acres) of common land. The Conservators wished to restore the Forest's landscape to one that predominantly consisted of heathland—its defining characteristic until the mid-twentieth century, but something that was in danger of being lost after the Second World War as a result of the advance of woodland into traditional heathland areas when
...returning soldiers gave up trying to scratch a living out of the forest. Whereas once hundreds of commoners used the wood and heath—their livestock obliging by chewing down young tree shoots—today there is only one commercial grazer.[17]
The Conservators were forced to intervene to stem the invasion of trees, scrub and bracken that threatened the ecologicially precious heathlands, cutting down saplings, removing scrub and mowing the bracken. Some residents complained that the results looked like a First World War battle field. This is not a problem restricted to this common, but according to Jonathan Brown writing in the Independent on 21 April 2007 "similar debates are raging between locals and the authorities at other heathland areas in the New Forest and Surrey".[17]
Commons are often crossed by public roads, and this leads to another problem on modern pasture commons where grazing survives (or is to be reintroduced). Historically, the roads would have been cart-tracks, and there would have been no conflict between their horse-drawn (or ox-drawn) traffic and the pastured animals, and no great difficulty if pastured animals wandered off the common along the roads. However, these roads now have fast motorised traffic which does not mix safely with animals. To continue (or restore) grazing, such roads may need fencing or at least blocking at the edge of the common with cattle grids — however fencing a common is reminiscent of the process of enclosure, historically fatal to its survival, and permission for fencing on a common is a bureaucratic process which can be interrupted or prevented by objectors (see neglect of commons above).
Joachim Radkau[18] assumes the treatment of the commons in the scientific literature of the 18th and later centuries as politically motivated to hasten the Enclosure Movement. The omnipresent examples of "Klapprige Allmendekühe" (thin cows of the Commons) in the writings of early agricultural scientists were used[19] to modernize existing common land rule towards a more capitalized and ownership based agriculture.[18] In Germany, based on the English experience, Albrecht Thaer suggested a similar approach. The Allmende or Commons were used to establish experts rule in agriculture, which had before been based on an empiric and practical approach without much interference of trained staff.[20] Radkau assumes that the real Commons estate - meadows and grassland are not at all exhausted but very rich from an ecological standpoint.[18] Neither the old or new use of the Tragedy of the Commons, e.g. of Garrett Hardin who used the example to ask for management of global common goods (asking for an 'Ökodiktatur', ecodictatorship[18]) were in line with the state of real "Commons". The latter are useful examples of sustainable agriculture and not a failure at all.[18][21]
All land in England and Wales is owned by someone, and in most cases that person has all the rights of exclusive ownership, to use the land as they wish. However, for common land the owner's rights are restricted, and other people (usually local residents) have some rights over the land. These people are known as commoners—the landowner retains other rights to the land, such as rights to minerals and large timber, and to any common rights left unexercised by the commoners. For example, there are 500 practising commoners in the New Forest, England.[22]
The Countryside and Rights of Way Act 2000 gave the public the right to roam freely on registered common land in England.[23]
There are seven main types of common land in Scotland,[3] some of which have similarities to common land in England and Wales.
The overwhelming majority of areas of common land in lowland Scotland and the Highland fringes were commonties. A commonty is an area of land where the rights of property or use are shared by two or more neighbouring (though not necessarily adjacent) landowners. They are not therefore truly 'common' land in the sense that anyone can use them, and this distinction meant that it was often very easy for commonties to be divided between landowners after a series of Acts permitting this were passed by the Parliament of Scotland in the 17th century, most notably the 1695 Act for the Division of Commonties. As a result the number of commonties declined very rapidly in the 18th and 19th centuries.
Common mosses were areas of bog where the right to dig peat for fuel were shared by neighbouring landowners. They are therefore similar to commonties and most commonties included a common moss. However the difficulties of dividing such wet areas meant that they were left out of many commonty divisions and many common mosses may still survive, un-noticed because of the decline of peat-cutting.
Run rig is a system of agriculture involving the cultivation of adjacent, narrow strips of raised land (rigs). Traditionally adjacent rigs would be used by different farmers and the rigs were periodically re-allocated between them. The system was common throughout Scotland until the 18th century, but survived longer in the Western Highlands, where runrig was often associated with an adjacent area of common hill grazing which was also shared by the same farmers as the runrig.
Scattalds are unique to Shetland and are based on udal law, rather than the feudal law that predominated in the rest of Scotland. However, Scattalds are very similar to commonties and many were divided under the same 1695 Act that allowed for the division of commonties.
Crown Commons were areas of land held directly by the crown and therefore the common rights that could be used were rights of use rather than rights of property. Unlike commonties, the rights to use crown commons (for example for grazing livestock) were available to anyone, not just the neighbouring landowners. There are no crown commons left in Scotland; those that survived into the 20th century were taken over by the Crown Estate.
Greens were small areas of common land near a settlement where livestock could be kept overnight, markets held and other communal activities carried out. Sometimes they were adjacent to drovers' roads near river crossing points or overnight accommodation. Most were genuinely common land with only the Crown holding any title to them. A loan was a common route through private property allowing access to an area of common land or other public place. As the traditional uses of greens and loans declined, they were often absorbed by the neighbouring landowners.
Burgh commons were areas of common land where property rights or privileges of use were held by the burgh for their inhabitants. They could include any of the other six types of common land and were sometimes shared with landowners outside the burgh. By the early 19th century, most burgh commons had been appropriated by the wealthy landowners who dominated burgh councils, and very few have survived.
Common land, an English development, was used in many former British colonies, for example in Ireland and the United States. The North American colonies adopted the English laws in establishing their own commons. A famous example is the New Haven Green in New Haven, Connecticut.
Similar common property regimes are also to be found in southern Asia (e.g., India and Nepal) and Latin America (e.g., Mexico, see ejido), and a concept similar to the Commons is still in use in the alpine countries, especially in Switzerland, known by the German word Allmende. In Finland, water areas are usually commons, owned collectively by the landowners of the shores.
The freedom to roam in Scandinavia and elsewhere is a distinct concept of common land, since it grants rights which are not exploitable for profit, but purely for personal enjoyment. Rights of ownership, habitation, hunting or making fires are not transferred. In Sweden this is termed allemansrätten.[24]