text:
Does Gallery Place's new audio teen-repellent work? Try it out.
Theresa Vargas writes about an effort by Gallery Place business owners to chase away loitering teenagers by zapping them with a device that emits a high-pitched, headache-inducing sound that only young ears can hear.
The Mosquito, as the $1,000 device is called, is apparently annoying not only its intended targets, but also some of their sharp-hearing elders.
Want to know whether to take ear plugs on your next trip to Chinatown (or just want to drive whippersnappers away from your computer)?
Try out the audio samples (provided by movingsoundtech.com) below. Then tell us what you think.
13 KHz - Should be audible 50 years old and under
14 KHz - Should be audible 45 years old and under
15 KHz - Should be audible 40 years old and under
16 KHz - Should be audible 35 years old and under
17 KHz - Should be audible 30 years old and under
18 KHz - Should be audible 25 years old and under
Christopher Dean Hopkins
| August 31, 2010; 10:56 PM ET
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Sounds like a television set.
Posted by: blasmaic | August 31, 2010 11:42 PM | Report abuse
I'm 52, and I could hear all of them. I have young ears! I might wish my face and body were equally youthful.
Posted by: Yoki | August 31, 2010 11:45 PM | Report abuse
I could hear all of them no problem, and I'm no teenager. I'm glad I know not to shop places that use these now. I wasn't sure if I'd be bothered before, now I know I will be.
Posted by: Nymous | September 1, 2010 2:18 AM | Report abuse
The question isn't whether it succeeds in driving young people away. The question is whether driving young people away is morally legitimate.
These devices ought to be criminally prohibited. Meanwhile, WMATA should sue the company that installed one by a Metro entrance for interfering with Metro customers' use of Metro property.
Posted by: philautos | September 1, 2010 2:21 AM | Report abuse
These sounds keep roaches and rats away, so it should work great for teenagers too. I just hope it does not hurt dogs.
Posted by: matrox | September 1, 2010 2:39 AM | Report abuse
Two things:
1. At what volume level should these samples be listened to?
At 3/4 volume I could hear them all tho 13K sounded intermittent and scratchy. I'm 61. I found the samples overall pretty poor quality.
2. Just because you can't hear a sound doesn't mean its not affecting you in other ways...the sound energy is still there.
I think this technique of producing high energy sounds to drive away loitering teens is a form of acoustic pollution and should be illegal.
Posted by: cul2 | September 1, 2010 4:37 AM | Report abuse
The question isn't whether it succeeds in driving young people away. The question is whether driving young people away is morally legitimate.
These devices ought to be criminally prohibited. Meanwhile, WMATA should sue the company that installed one by a Metro entrance for interfering with Metro customers' use of Metro property.
Another person that doesn't think a business has a right to protect itself. Must be another liberal slug. Another reminder why it's not worth starting your own business. You have no rights as a business owner according to liberals and bleeding hearts.
Posted by: LiberalBasher | September 1, 2010 7:04 AM | Report abuse
Why not just play music by Frank Sinatra, Tony Bennett, Rosemary Clooney, Peggy Lee, etc. at moderate volume? I would bet it would repel teenagers much more effectively, and entertain Metro's older patrons at the same time.
Posted by: jblatt | September 1, 2010 7:27 AM | Report abuse
There's gotta be a better way to prevent loitering and mischief. I'm almost 40 and can hear all of the sounds clearly; they're quite irritating. They'd keep me from spending money at a place that uses the sounds. I like the idea of playing Sinatra, Bennett, etc. I'd stay, shop, and probably sing along. Hmmm...singing along would scare the kids away.
Posted by: taconista16 | September 1, 2010 7:43 AM | Report abuse
Something is not right. At 52, I could hear all of them quite well. I think something is wrong with your test.
Other than that, I think it is a great idea. I say use it everywhere, your home, schools, church, let's get these out of control teens in line.
Posted by: Woodie731 | September 1, 2010 8:20 AM | Report abuse
I am in my twenties, and get a headache from these sounds that are supposedly are confined to teens. I think the Gallery Place businesses will soon notice that the teens might be gone, but so are many of their customers, myself included. It will be interesting to see how well Gallery Place works as an over 40 hangout...
Posted by: ChrisinDC | September 1, 2010 8:26 AM | Report abuse
They should also install one above the steps of the Portrait Gallery where they all hang out at night.
Posted by: bryman | September 1, 2010 8:30 AM | Report abuse
I'm 60 yrs and could hear down to the 50 yrs (yes, yes, I know, this is not an audiologist's lab.), but the sound was kind of annoying.
Posted by: sitspin | September 1, 2010 8:43 AM | Report abuse
Wow! I can hear them all and I'm 28. So I guess it may work because I'm not going down to Verizon Center now.
Posted by: auburnyellowrose | September 1, 2010 8:45 AM | Report abuse
I am 71.. I hear the 13khz well... The 15khz faintly... And nothing above that...
As a method to reduce loitering by mobs of youngsters with nothing to do and excitement on their mind, I only wish I had thought of it...
dr. o
Posted by: ad4hk2004 | September 1, 2010 8:47 AM | Report abuse
"Why not just play music by Frank Sinatra, Tony Bennett, Rosemary Clooney, Peggy Lee, etc. at moderate volume? I would bet it would repel teenagers"
jblatt, surely you joke. I was just 17 when the Beatles sang "Well, she was just 17, if you know what I mean", and believe me, this music would repel me.
Posted by: dcc1968 | September 1, 2010 8:48 AM | Report abuse
No, just play any Neil Diamond song that isn't "Sweet Caroline". Or anything by the Percy Faith Orchestra.
Posted by: joshlct | September 1, 2010 8:54 AM | Report abuse
This is a cruel device. I clicked "No" not because it may not work, but because it is cruel and it opens yet another door to brainwashing the public. What a sick society this is becoming.
Are there no laws anymore about subliminal trickery? If this device is allowed, what's to stop other purposes of not-quite-heard sounds such as brainwashing -- for what purpose, guys? To make us go away, to make us docile, or to make us buy brand X? Once these devices are installed, who is going to tell us when the brainwashing messages start playing?
Posted by: rubyredshoes | September 1, 2010 8:58 AM | Report abuse
I have six decades of "life experience" and I could hear all tones. I experienced nausea while listening to the tones -- I have a history of migraines and take preventive medication for migraines. Are these establishments going to risk exacerbating the suffering of those of us with medical conditions triggered by sounds? This is dangerous to a subset of the population (that includes me!).
Posted by: kwbryson | September 1, 2010 9:12 AM | Report abuse
I'm 63 and I could hear all of them.
Just play anything by Josh Groban.
Posted by: bozhogg | September 1, 2010 9:13 AM | Report abuse
Freaked my children out big time. That'll keep me, my kids, and my money away. Mission accomplished!
Posted by: jb1151 | September 1, 2010 9:19 AM | Report abuse
What a terrible thing to do. It may well drive away some of the kids but it's punishing anybody who can hear it, whether they are older people with good hearing or younger kids who are minding their own business and aren't making trouble. Meanwhile the kids who have already ruined their own hearing won't care about it, whether they are troublemakers or not.
Posted by: MrDarwin | September 1, 2010 9:23 AM | Report abuse
So younger people can hear more, is that what this is saying? I couldn't hear the first one so maybe there's something to it. But jb1151 has a point, some of us old fogies have kids we have to tote around. Don't make our jobs harder.
Posted by: forgetthis | September 1, 2010 9:49 AM | Report abuse
33 here and I can hear all of them. And they are annoying. Guess I won't shop near Gallery Place.
Posted by: HerndonBiker | September 1, 2010 9:52 AM | Report abuse
I suspect that most of what the older listeners are hearing (myself included) is a lower-pitched artifact of their sound systems. You really can't reliably replicate the result over the web and via the average sound card and sound system.
But more importantly, let's be candid about what this is really about: repelling young AFRICAN AMERICAN people. The kind about whom much has been written in recent months right here in WaPo, and at these specific locations. This may well be a harbinger of an entirely new science of keeping various groups in their place, as technologists figure out ways of differentiating various groups based on differences in sensory capacities, tastes, and sensitivities.
Posted by: JohnQCitizen | September 1, 2010 10:01 AM | Report abuse
Much easier fix would be to block or otherwise disable cellphone coverage within 50 ft of the metro entrance. Yes, in this country it's illegal, but that doesn't mean the laws can't change. They ought to do the same thing in theaters and other public places....
Posted by: blackbear336 | September 1, 2010 10:07 AM | Report abuse
When the sound sample was played on the news last night, it clearly hurt my dog's ears until I could get to the mute button, so, no, it's not a good idea. I could not hear all of the samples, but I experienced nausea while each played. I agree with others, play some big band era or classical music. Maybe some of the teens will gain an appreciation for real music. At the least I'd want to spend more time and money there.
Posted by: eed017 | September 1, 2010 10:14 AM | Report abuse
I just can't wait to sue the h3ll out of the stores that cause permanent hearing loss.
Let's just keep pushing people around until they're extinct with this kind of nasty technology.
Posted by: seraphina2 | September 1, 2010 10:17 AM | Report abuse
I'm 24, and this thing drives me bonkers. And I'm not African American. So the idea that this is "targeting" a specific group of people is bunk.
What it will do is keep away those of us 21-25 who would be visiting bars down there.
Posted by: whitneyuevans | September 1, 2010 10:17 AM | Report abuse
Simply play classical music.
Posted by: rexreddy | September 1, 2010 10:19 AM | Report abuse
I think its a great idea. Im a early 30's black guy and I dont even want to go down to Gallery Place anymore due to all the rowdy teens. Something like this may make me want to go to the movies or have a meal down there now, maybe.
Posted by: jaytee22002 | September 1, 2010 10:27 AM | Report abuse
"What it will do is keep away those of us 21-25 who would be visiting bars down there."
Huh. No it won't. What it will do is prevent you and others from standing around, doing absolutely nothing but looking for trouble. I won't keep you from walking by to to go Rocket Bar or Fado. I will keep teens from looking for the next target to mug. That's the point of this. You are a paying customer heading to a bar. They are standing on a street corner looking tough until they can find a reason to fight someone.
That being said, DC should probably instead pass strict loitering laws, and have an absolute zero tolerance for threatening behavior.... and the classical music idea isn't half bad. Hard to look tough when Beethoven is piping through the speakers, they'll move on.
Posted by: JG55 | September 1, 2010 10:27 AM | Report abuse
I'm 27, going on 28. I can hear all of them very well...in fact, listening to the "under 25" sound, it was so painful to my ears that I gritted my teeth and frantically clicked on the mouse to turn the @*$*@$*$ thing off. Forget getting rid of *teens*, apparently this thing can get rid of anyone short of retirement age...
Posted by: Eleiana | September 1, 2010 10:28 AM | Report abuse
I'm 72, and listening to these sounds confirm what I already suspected--I have very good hearing. That's why I always complain at the gym that I can hear the recorded music above my iPod, but don't want to turn my iPod too high and ruin my hearing.
Posted by: Vallee | September 1, 2010 10:28 AM | Report abuse
more passive aggressive bullsh|t from Big Brother types.
I thought conservatives wanted MORE people to shop and spend money for businesses, not FEWER.
But when these businesses go belly-up because people don't want to shop in the "beep beep beep" stores, they'll blame Obama or socialists or the NY mosque.
Posted by: Please_Fix_VAs_Roads | September 1, 2010 10:30 AM | Report abuse
Just play muzak, that would chase away the devil himself.
Posted by: darkglobe5 | September 1, 2010 10:41 AM | Report abuse
I couldn't hear anything above 15KHz. And I'm only 31! Guess I have "old ears."
Posted by: itsme1 | September 1, 2010 10:54 AM | Report abuse
I could hear all of them, and I am 47. I also have a hearing loss in one ear from otosclerosis (a hardening of the bones in the inner ear). Why not just play Barry Manilow or some form of muzak?
Posted by: lydandy | September 1, 2010 11:04 AM | Report abuse
Hmmm……. This could keep the Vampires and Werewolves away too.
That's not good because they generally have loads of cash and enjoy art.
I hear werwolves are also fond of Beef Cho Mein.
Posted by: rexreddy | September 1, 2010 11:16 AM | Report abuse
51: clearly heard all i was supposed to. Clearly did NOT hear any from "45" and younger.
Posted by: redrocket | September 1, 2010 11:29 AM | Report abuse
I'm 66 and I could hear all of them easily. But the descriptions of the samples are backwards. Only the loudest tones should be audible to us geezers, while the softest tones should only be audible to those under 25. The descriptions imply the opposite.
IMO what this article shows mostly is that the WPO needs more copy editors.
Posted by: andym108 | September 1, 2010 11:29 AM | Report abuse
The kids that hang out there are so noisy they won't hear these sounds above their own skreetching
Posted by: emilymn | September 1, 2010 11:32 AM | Report abuse
Better this than firehoses and german shepherds
Posted by: weetabixjihad | September 1, 2010 11:33 AM | Report abuse
32 years old, and I can hear every one of them.
Posted by: ericroks | September 1, 2010 11:33 AM | Report abuse
My teenage son uses a ring tone on his phone that is similar. I can't hear it when it sounds.
Posted by: edbyronadams | September 1, 2010 11:48 AM | Report abuse
I'm 36 and have mild hearing loss. I couldn't hear anything higher than the 14 kHz, and that one was harder to hear. Of course, my ears also sometimes just buzz on their own.
I would think the effects on us even if we couldn't hear it would be a concern, not to mention on other animals that might be able to hear it. What about guide dogs? Birds?
Posted by: patsy630 | September 1, 2010 11:52 AM | Report abuse
I'm retired, and I could hear all of them. So I guess that I cannot shop in any store that has this device.
Posted by: alamo2 | September 1, 2010 12:02 PM | Report abuse
"Or anything by the Percy Faith Orchestra."
You blaspheme! "Theme from A Summer Place" is one of my most favorite pop pieces of all time.
"I just can't wait to sue the h3ll out of the stores that cause permanent hearing loss."
If you're fighting, pickpocketing, or loitering long enough that you lose your hearing instead of walking through, you're breaking the law anyway so you've nullified your case right there.
Posted by: NYC123 | September 1, 2010 12:12 PM | Report abuse
matrox at 2:39a.m. has a point - what about service dogs - will this distract them from assisting their people. I'm 54 with some hearing loss, and could not hear the 17 & 18 KHz. My keen-eared husband probably would be able to hear them.
Posted by: mat00 | September 1, 2010 12:16 PM | Report abuse
I hear them all. In fact, one of the malls here installed one in the food court. I can no longer eat there, let alone order food to take anywhere else because it just *hurts*. If your businesses want to lose customers with sensitive hearing, go for it.
Posted by: ThatOneChick | September 1, 2010 12:22 PM | Report abuse
I hear them all. In fact, one of the malls here installed one in the food court. I can no longer eat there, let alone order food to take anywhere else because it just HURTS. If your businesses want to lose paying customers with sensitive hearing, go for it.
Posted by: ThatOneChick | September 1, 2010 12:23 PM | Report abuse
LiberalBasher, It's a pity you are filled with such negativity. Please find a nice tall cliff and end your suffering for all of us.
Posted by: swatkins1 | September 1, 2010 12:25 PM | Report abuse
How is this any different from hitting people with sticks?
Posted by: diveguy99 | September 1, 2010 12:27 PM | Report abuse
These links are all wrong anyway, the 15 kHz link is lower in pitch than the 11 kHz.
Posted by: agalleg1 | September 1, 2010 12:34 PM | Report abuse
Glenn Miller - that will be more than enough to keep those young rapskallions away! Where's my prune juice?
Posted by: dcunitedfan3 | September 1, 2010 12:46 PM | Report abuse
This would be a great idea if only loiterers could hear them. Why not enforce loitering laws with real human beings?
Posted by: BenFlynn | September 1, 2010 12:47 PM | Report abuse
While perhaps well-intentioned, providing these test tones as a sort-of online hearing test doesn't make a whole lot of sense.
The audio systems of most PCs (particularly laptops) are not nearly good enough to faithfully reproduce sound at frequencies higher than about 14-16KHz or so.
Posted by: Auslander1 | September 1, 2010 12:49 PM | Report abuse
I am 64 and I can hear the sound for 50 and younger. Besides, with the ipod use, and how it affects hearing, the young generation will Not be able to hear Anything when they get older.
Posted by: pbnj | September 1, 2010 1:04 PM | Report abuse
I suspect that a good proportion of the youngsters they are trying to repel have already damaged their high-frequency audio perception by listening to personal in-ear audio devices, and can't perceive the higher frequencies intended to annoy them.
Posted by: MetroUser | September 1, 2010 1:09 PM | Report abuse
People, even teen-age people, are not rodent pests to be driven away with sound.
Posted by: risandy | September 1, 2010 1:20 PM | Report abuse
I can't hear anything at and below "45 and under." For all apposed, what's your solution for the problem? I would support more police and cracking a few heads; that would do it.
Posted by: psuvo | September 1, 2010 1:21 PM | Report abuse
If it's only used on the property of the business, then it's up to them. Volume (db) may be an issue if greater than 90 db.
If it's a public area, then the users of this system can be sued for assault and battery. More importantly, by deliberately introducing a irritant to an area, the businesses become responsible for any and all disruptive behavior of the people in that area.
Posted by: mhoust | September 1, 2010 1:22 PM | Report abuse
I'm 51 and I was able to hear all but the under 25 very clearly. It's highly annoying and if I were to be subject to that noise just because I'm waiting to meet up with a friend or window shopping, I'd be very inclined to take my business elsewhere.. completely. I suspect, however, that chances are that the group for which this is intended won't be able to hear the noise -- they're usually plugged into ipods, MP3 players, etc. AND playing them at full blast -- deadens the nerve endings in the ear that allow folks to hear. Try playing Barry Manilow or Engelbert Humperdinck or Frank Sinatra or anything pre-1970 instead.
Posted by: mages_kyria | September 1, 2010 1:24 PM | Report abuse
Play opera! Even better ... simulcast from Sidney Harden Hall on the Verizon Center jumbotron on the west wall instead of last week's Redskins game!
Isn't that screen technically illegal for broadcasting copyrighted material?
Posted by: bs2004 | September 1, 2010 1:33 PM | Report abuse
Am 63, could hear all tones. The kids can just (and will) put their ipod ear plugs in.
I'd rather see a cop posted there.
Posted by: postoastie | September 1, 2010 1:46 PM | Report abuse
Oh man! I'm 31 and couldn't hear a peep until I tried the 55 years or younger. Scary. Good news--I wouldn't be subjected to the annoying noise while around the Gallery Place metro. Bad news--I think I will be deaf by 40! ;)
Posted by: anna131 | September 1, 2010 1:48 PM | Report abuse
The listed tests are backwards. The one labelec 11,000 Hz is the highest when it should be the lowest.
Posted by: edbyronadams | September 1, 2010 1:52 PM | Report abuse
I'm 69, and could hear them down to the 35 yr. level, but that one "just barely". If there were other noises in the area, I doubt I'd notice that one.
I have mixed feelings about the use of these sounds to keep teens away - especially since others ARE going to hear them. The method may backfire.
But I am sympathetic to the property owners if loitering teens (or any other age) are causing a problem.
Posted by: DESS1 | September 1, 2010 1:53 PM | Report abuse
For all this nonsense, if you people could instead find something for the teens to do, now...Wow...what an idea, yeah sometimes they are silly and loud, act foolish, now do not sit here and tell me that you were not a teen at one time, and that you never ever did anything to annoy adults, cause then you would be a liar, I must be from outer space, but darn it these are our children of the future and that is how you want to treat them, well what good for the goose is good for well you know who, What are you gonna do when they do not want YOU around anymore, they can just throw you by the wayside, come on lets get real, these are our children and nieces and nephews...treat them good and i'll bet some cash they will treat you good to...I would NEVER go near any such place who condones this practice....From one Grandmother who loves her kiddies..
Posted by: janetmramos | September 1, 2010 2:15 PM | Report abuse
I heard every last one of those sounds...and I'm 38
Posted by: cbmuzik | September 1, 2010 2:29 PM | Report abuse
If stores can repel me with Rod Stewart they should be allowed to play other electronic whines to keep youths away.
Posted by: polystyreneman | September 1, 2010 2:30 PM | Report abuse
Likes this idea best. Very future oriented thought.
Much easier fix would be to block or otherwise disable cellphone coverage within 50 ft of the metro entrance. Yes, in this country it's illegal, but that doesn't mean the laws can't change. They ought to do the same thing in theaters and other public places....
Posted by: blackbear336
Posted by: Elisa2 | September 1, 2010 2:40 PM | Report abuse
The poll questions allow no option for those who believe on principle that it's wrong to harass the young in this way.
I voted no, but not because "it's not going to stop anything". The better it works, the less I like it.
Posted by: bourassa1 | September 1, 2010 3:02 PM | Report abuse
Blends right in with my tinnitis.
Go for it.
Posted by: Geezer4 | September 1, 2010 3:08 PM | Report abuse
It's no for me, but that's because at 50 I can still hear bats. Gallery Place is my main metro stop on my commute (switch to X2 bus there), and my main area for shopping and eating. That noise will keep me away -- probably more than the teens.
Posted by: Fabrisse | September 1, 2010 3:28 PM | Report abuse
I'm sorry, but this just seems foolish to me. Teenagers are flocking to a busy, dynamic area of the city so we need technology to drive them away?
I'd like a better idea of how many of them are actually causing any trouble. You mean to tell me they don't have this problem in New York or Atlanta? Are the malls and parks next? Have you ridden metro between 2:30 and 4:30? Are we going to install mosquitoes there, too? It seems like we adults are acting like cantankerous fogies about this whole thing.
Posted by: P-Funk2002 | September 1, 2010 3:52 PM | Report abuse
I'm for the "Peggy Lee solution". It is fundamentally humane and might actually brainwash a few musically astute youngsters.
When it's closing time at Gallery Place, play Barry Manilow and watch everyone head for the exits.
Posted by: wgmadden | September 1, 2010 4:52 PM | Report abuse
I have worked at the Smithsonian Gallery of Art/Portrait Gallery for the past 16 years. I love that area and can ride my bike down in 15 minutes! Business owners must make a living or they will close. How about some creative thinking? The Gallery is open until 7 pm,,, perhaps in summer, more tours could be set up for young people. The Verizon Center has lots of open space...perhaps some could be open to and for young people...say twice a month...dancing, lectures, music, etc.The MLK library is near and has lots of open space...Also, our Convention Center and old Carnegie Library are near. And, yes the Mall is near. Perhaps a summer tent where young people can enjoy different music events from area schools? Yes, who will pay for the adults/chaperones to keep an eye on the kids? Volunteers?
Posted by: judithclaire1939 | September 1, 2010 5:57 PM | Report abuse
Typical profit-obsessed mindset: if something stands in the way of your bottom line, just apply whatever quick fix works...for you. Don't give a cr@p about what might happen to anyone else passing by, or to anyone that some of the targeted people might care to bother or harm as they leave your property, appropriately annoyed.
Why not just zap them with tazers? How about enclosing those who hang out within a fenced-off area? Make that fence an electric one while you're at it. Motion-activated pellet guns? Strategically-timed smoke bombs? Arsenic in their Big Gulps? Why not?
Certainly the people who are hanging around would take the high road and refuse to retaliate, right?
I teach autistic preschoolers, some of whom are hypersensitive to sound--even sounds the rest of us cannot hear. I can assure you this sort of practice IS dangerous, cruel, and unethical.
Posted by: EdgewoodVA | September 1, 2010 6:10 PM | Report abuse
Teenagers are already losing their hearing at an alarming rate. Your paper ran a story on it less than two weeks ago. See http://voices.washingtonpost.com/checkup/2010/08/teen_hearing_loss_on_the_rise.html
The "should be audible" chart will change as hearing loss at specific frequencies occurs and those frequencies drop out of the public's audible range. How close to tinnitus is your average teenager given the hearing loss they are already experiencing from tech devices? DC wants to find out, it seems. Then the city can have a significant number of law suits filed against it, claiming hearing loss from the "teenage repellent" devices.
Stop abusing the public with experimental technologies as though at-risk youth are dogs or pests to be swatted away, and as though the "should be audible" chart is a one-size-fits-all given. I read a comment above that a 40 year old posting saying she can hear the sounds and it is very annoying. Maybe it is hitting a frequency range she has already damaged, and is it doing even more damage, then, to that not-your-average ear of hers? If I were her, I would start documenting dates and times of entering that metro station...
Posted by: rubyredshoes | September 1, 2010 6:16 PM | Report abuse
Back in the day my friends and I would have been told in a respectful way to "move on" by the local beat cop. And if we didn't move quick enough, God help us!
Posted by: JAH3 | September 1, 2010 6:31 PM | Report abuse
Hard of hearing, early 20s here. Can't hear most of them (the first two, for senior citizens, I can hear--barely).
So, um, no, won't work on anyone like me. And a lot of teens now have worse hearing than their elders, because of earbuds. My hearing loss is natural, just a disability from birth. However, it means I've spent a lot of time in audiologist offices, and it's taught me a lot about how hearing works.
Teens will either drown out the noise or use insulated earbuds. Seniors who can hear the sound will be very irritated. And it won't work for very long, because the youngest generation will simply get used to it. Hearing adapts to situations very well, so if this sound is constant where a person wants to be, then the hearing will adapt to filter it out. This is the same phenomenon that makes you hear poorly after a concert.
Surely teenagers aren't all that scary. Do adults now lack the authority to confront a teenager who has overstepped a boundary?
Posted by: whiteflame128 | September 1, 2010 7:51 PM | Report abuse
This sounds like much ado about nothing. It's not like the mall owner is spraying acid on people standing outside the doors. This is a simple, non-lethal MILDLY ANNOYING sound that goes away if you move away from the entrance doors. It seems to me that this is a great solution that peacefully moves the crowd away from this favored hang out spot.
And if I am reading the article correctly, the noise is inaudible as soon as you go inside. So the only people who will be annoyed are those who choose to remain within the sound radius and those who walk by for a few seconds.
Posted by: fezini | September 1, 2010 8:09 PM | Report abuse
I'm hoping the aforementioned shortcomings in laptop PCs' sound reproduction capabilities are true, since, at 47, the only one I could hear was the 11kHz tone.
Posted by: OttoDog | September 2, 2010 9:38 AM | Report abuse
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A combinational logic circuit is as its name suggests, a circuit which the output depends only on the "combination" of their inputs at the time we are testing the output.
Analyzing the circuit made of digital gates shown below, the output of each gate depends only on their inputs.
The output F will change if the input A or input B or both at the same time change.
Combinational logic circuits are made of basic gates: AND gate, OR gate, NOT gate.
They can also be built with NAND gates, NOR gates, XOR gates, which are a combination of the three basic gates.
To understand a combinational logic circuit we can write its boolean equations and its truth table.
The boolean equation of the above circuit is:
The truth table of the above circuit is:
Related Links Sequential circuit Logic Circuit Logic Levels Analog and Digital. What´s the difference? OR gate AND gate


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The Help for 2013 has NO reference to AcCoreMgd .DLL.
This seems weird to me because this DLL is the major
change to the API and the reason that managed code requires
a rebuild to work in AutoCAD 2013.
Has anyone seen ANY reference to AcCoreMgd in any of the help files. ?
(please don't point me to Keans blog)
I'll attach a piccy to show what I mean.
Also : Has anyone seen a 'AutoCAD Net Developers Guide' targeting 2013 ??
added: weird, I think this may be my first question in this forum
Everything will work just as you expect it to, unless your expectations are incorrect.
class keyThumper<T> : Lazy<T>; another Swamper
That is typical Autodesk's behaviour in terms of programming help document since Autodesk adopted yearly product release in 2004 (Acad2005). They must think that they have "new" products every year and clients have to go with "new" products so busily that they would not have time to study the document, or if they do, when they go through the document, it is time for moving to next version.
It is particular bad on the general AutoCAD .NET API documentation. Howeever, if you see the AutoCAD Map programming API documentation, it is even worse: it is still referring to Visual Studio 2005, and some API assemly names only available in Acad2007/8 and have been renamed since...
Documentation always seems to be lowest man on the project totem pole, regardless of industry or project. Project managers want to spend the hours on "real" work, workers want to be doing the "real" work as well. At the end of the project, there's no budget left and nobody wants to do it.
Can any ADN members comment on whether the AcCoreMgd.dll references are up-to-date with this paid-access service, or are you in the same boat?
Hi Kerry,
AcCoreMgd is mentioned in the ObjectARX SDK helpfiles - in the ObjectARX ReadMe->Release Notes. There (and the Migration guides in the helpfiles) is where we document changes to the SDK - both .NET and ObjectARX.
I've also notified our techpubs team about the outdated docs in the AutoCAD helpfiles. They tell me this was already reported as a bug. I'm sorry this happened - somehow that section of the AutoCAD help didn't get flagged as something our API techpubs team had to update.
BTW Why don't you consider Kean's blog posts to be a valid source of information? Kean is a member of the AutoCAD Architects team, and has a *very* popular blog (read by pretty much every AutoCAD .NET developer out there). Because of that, he and I agreed that he would post migration information on his blog this year rather than the ADN team running our usual migration webcast.
BTWBTW These videos may be helpful to anyone who wants to quickly see the 2013 migration basics for AutoCAD .NET and ObjectARX plug-ins - http://adndevblog.typepad.com/autocad/2012/04/migr
Hello Stephan.
Thanks for the update.
I'd seen the references in the SDK and on Keans Blog and more recently on the new ADN DevBlog, but I noticed the omission from the Help files after I told someone to have a look at them to resolve Reference issues ... Embarrassing for me .
As I think you are aware, I believe that the help files should be complete and accessible without internet access ( but that's a discussion for another time ).
I have NO issue with Kean or his blog. In fact I'm quietly one of his ardent supporters. Without the information published there the development community would be still scratching it's collective head.
My comment was to stay anyone from pointing me to references I knew about and keep the focus on the Help Files.
Everything will work just as you expect it to, unless your expectations are incorrect.
class keyThumper<T> : Lazy<T>; another Swamper
I apologise for misspelling your name
Everything will work just as you expect it to, unless your expectations are incorrect.
class keyThumper<T> : Lazy<T>; another Swamper
Hello Every one,
I need a clarification very urgently...Please do me favour...
Currently we are using AutoCAD 2011 with Visual Studio 2008. I want to upgrade AutoCAD to AutoCAD 2013. Please let me know will AutoCAD 2013 supports Visual Studio 2008?
Thanks & Regards,
Prakash P V K
prakashpvk wrote:
...Please let me know will AutoCAD 2013 supports Visual Studio 2008?...
NO. From ObjectARX 2013 Readme -> Release Notes:
Microsoft Visual Studio 2010 with Service Pack 1 should be used when compiling projects for use with AutoCAD 2013.
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10:47 pm
Tue January 14, 2014
NC Grocery Store Owners Look For Reprieve From Local Tax
The legislative committee that reviews North Carolina's tax laws debated on Monday a tax that cities and towns levy on businesses to allow them to operate within their municipality limits.
The tax, which state lawmakers have tried to change at least five times in the last 10 years, allows local governments to charge companies a flat rate or a percentage of their revenues. It includes retailers but exempts businesses such as insurance and law offices.
The heads of two grocery chains, Dunn-based Carlie- C's and Raleigh-based Ford's Produce, complained to legislators that each locality has a discretion over how much to charge and that some disproportionately tax them. For instance, in 2012, the city of Raleigh charged $8,000 to Ford's Produce for a license but charged $2,000 to the utility company Progress Energy, which had more than $5 billion in revenues that year, said Ford's President Lynn Ford.
"It doesn't make any sense," Ford said.
Paul Meyer, government affairs director of the North Carolina League of Municipalities, said cities and towns can only collect from businesses through the privilege license tax or through property taxes. Some cities simply interpret the statute written for the tax and have come to rely on it, he said.
"The league knows there are a number of problems with this statute," Meyer said. "Everyone's got a different perspective on how to fix that, but cities haven't done anything wrong."
Several members of the revenue committee, including co-chair Sen. Bill Rabon (R-New Hanover), expressed interest in revamping the tax. It could be formally discussed for a possible bill at the next committee meeting, Feb. 11.
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Spiritual Guidance: Benediction
I've had a lot of requests recently from readers who want a leg up on gearing out their soon to be level 80, or fresh level 80 priest for raiding. This is certainly a worthwhile topic, one I intend to get to, but not this week.
We get a lot of mail at WoW.com and this past week we got an e-mail from a player named Nemikahn who wrote a WoW version of the song Sunscreen. The various staffers read through the e-mail, groaned in realization at how old they were (the original song came out in 1998) before the e-mail got lost in the jumble of BlizzCon 2010 news. I really enjoyed the rewrite though, and thought it rather timely given we are nearing the end of this expansion. Cataclysm is coming, and it's supposed to change everything we've become familiar with. So, this week my fellow priests, my guidance is this: stop and smell the flowers. WoW operates at such a hurried pace these days. Don't feel like you always have to rush off to the next raid or complete another alt. Take more screen shots, visit your favorite zones, make sure you can contact your closest friends in the game outside of it, and most of all: create Benediction. I will, of course, help you with that last part.
Filed under: Priest, (Priest) Spiritual Guidance, Cataclysm


text:
Follow-Up Postings:
sochi I can't see your pics! :( |
oh dear, I'll look into it. Another poster just had a similar problem, I wonder if its me or the site? Thanks for letting me know! |
I can see them now! Beautiful beautiful cabinetry. I love the Heath tile- maybe you could use it as a focal and do it just behind the cooktop? Or, maybe you could repeat your circle motif behind the cooktop as well. I like the chartreuse as a small but bold accent in the tile design. Do you want something generally horizontally oriented to nod to the rest of the wall, or do you want to break the horizontal lines up a bit? |
I am a dud with backsplash advice...But oh. my. gosh. What a cool space! I really love the repeated circles, and the jog in the design of the fridge wall. Wonderful. And I am drooling over your integrated apron front sink and counter. |
- Posted by remodelfla (My Page) on Sat, Mar 27, 10 at 18:30
This is kinda cool. I just choose one of the colors: From thetilestoreonline.com . It's the round bubble glass collection |
remodelfla, that's a great one for sochi's kitchen! Love it! |
- Posted by staceyneil (My Page) on Sat, Mar 27, 10 at 18:34
I second plate glass... that is what I was going to suggest. Either that or a slab of your quartzite. I'm not sure I'd want to add anything too busy or colorful, because the elements you already have there are So.... Freaking.... Gorgeous.... |
I can't find the link for your inspiration for the heath ceramic tile. I'm not sure if I would continue the "circle" motif. I like the way you have it repeating in the window and the railing, but maybe in the backsplash it would be too much? I think on the sink run I'd do the backsplash all the way up to the bottom of the cabinets. If you only do it to the window, would it look like you ran out? There's not that much wall space left. On the range wall I think I'd do it to the bottom of the shelves. Love the wallpaper in your powder room!! |
I'm telling ya, Studio Moderne is what you need. |
oooh yeah, marcolo! |
Love, love, love that studio modern!! |
Thanks for the suggestions everyone! Keep 'em coming. sabjimata - glass plate is definitely an option. We did it in our last kitchen six years ago and we loved it (see picture below). We may go this route again, but I'm think I might want something a little 'warmer' this time, if that makes any sense. Remodelfla - love that, especially the range of colours they offer. The smaller circles might get a bit busy, but I came across a similar tile (see picture below) I also like very much - a little warmer, a little less busy, but still the same vibe I think: Malhgold - I think I'm with you on the tile placement, up to shelf on cooking run, below cabs on sink run. I hoped I could get away with less, thus allowing me to spend more on the Heath Ceramic tile! Here is the inspiration picture with the Heath Ceramic tile, showing more tile behind the cook top and a single row of tile along the rest of the counter: |
This is my opinion only... but most people make the mistake of putting too many things in the house when they are pulling it together. The less is really more stunning in many instances. Whatever you do, I would be extremely careful that you are not doing too much. Right now, the kitchen and the house look great because each element is not competing with other things. Because the stained windows are so dramatic, any type of busy back splash on the cooktop wall will compete with the window. I would do something very simple, like SS, since you already use quite a bit of SS in the kitchen. Another options is to do the same quartzite as a sheet behind the cooktop only. I would not use tile because you will compete with the shapes in the windows. I would not add another dramatic color to the kitchen. You already have blue, chartruese and walnut. There is enough. The chartreuse between the blue stained glass window won't look that good, IMHO. So one option is to match/augment the blue in the window. I think this will be hard since the windows will look very different throughout the day depending on the time. If you are painting the walls another color, you can get very simple horizontally oritented tiles that have absolute color match with the wall paint. The scale of the tiles should repeat the scale of the drawers. I love this type of look. That would be stunning but very difficult to get the color right since you have to pull all the colors in the kitchen together. Another option... I like the look of white walls that matches the whites of cabinets. I think if you paint the walls another color, you will loose the drama of walnut contrasting the whites of the cabinets. Not only that the white cabinets may look a bit stark. The walnut is contrasting all the whites in the room; the ceiling, walls, cabinets etc. Obviously, you have taken great care in picking the items. The door knobs are just right for that house. If you keep the white walls, I would get the white countertop stone match behind the cooptop and simple horizontal tiles that repeats the scale of the drawers on the sink side that complements the blue of the stained glass window. |
Marcolo - you had me at the first mention of Studio Moderne! I LOVE that large green tile, love it. I'd love to have a whole wall of it. The look immediately takes me to Dean Martin, a glamourous mid-century modern pad and 1962. And that isn't a bad thing - I was completely in love with Dean Martin as a young child in the late '70s. My mother still has a letter I wrote to him (I guess he never got it) begging him to marry me. My mother kept telling me that he was about 60 years to old for me, but that didn't matter to me. Anyway, here I am, not married to Dean Martin, but willing to marry that tile. But, back to the present - how could it work? That tile is too big for a backsplash isn't it? Or are you thinking of one of the other Studio Moderne tiles? |
Kaismom - thank you for the thoughtful suggestion. I agree with you completely and I really don't want to overdo the backsplash. One point though - the stained glass actually doesn't have any blue in it at all. It is entirely clear glass with different movement in different pieces, only the circle has some colour and it is a creamy white. Some of those pictures were taken at night, I guess that is why the windows came off looking so blue?? The only permanent colour in the kitchen right now is the walnut and the white cabs, plus the grey/white counter. The 'lime zest' green in the railing is in an adjoining room and is actually quite subtle in person, less so in the picture I posted. That said, it certainly influences the kitchen. Your points, however, illustrate perfectly why I'm so nervous picking a backsplash. Everything has turned out so well so far, I'm terrified of messing things up with a backsplash that isn't exactly right. While I love the Studio Moderne tile and the circles, I am fearful that they would overpower everything. You suggest that the scale of the tiles should repeat the scale of the drawers - do you mean exactly? Are you aware of any examples of this look on the internet? I don't think I can do a stone match backsplash - that quartzite has variable colours from slab to slab and within one slab, I'd be afraid that the colour wouldn't match. That said, I'll go down and think about it. As it happens, due to a fabrication error I'm going to end up with an extra piece of the quartzite. I was going to save it for a future bathroom reno, but it may just fit the area behind the cooktop. Thanks again for the advice. |
Resist the temptation. Go without a backsplash. Waterproof the hell out of the junction at the wall and invest in very good paint that is very scrubbable. Don't dilute the wonderful authority of that wood. |
I agree with holding off for a while on the backsplash. I really love the simplicity of the whole kitchen the way it is now. By the way, what is the paint color and manufacturer used on the kitchen walls? It is soft and beautiful. |
I think I'm with kaismom and florantha -- go without. The kitchen is so cohesive as it is, with a lot of interest on the walls in the floating shelves, windows and art. The backsplash is by necesity a "vertical" entry into the landscape. Since your kitchen is very much horizontal, it will be difficult to find a backsplash that maintains the direction. Of course, feel free to disregard me. We just put 35 square feet of mosaic tile in our modern kitchen. But our layout really demanded it, and yours does not. |
I have a sample of the below glass tile. I think the browns and the stainless might work for your kitchen. Love your faucet, I have the same faucet in a box somewhere waiting to be installed. |
Here is a link that might be useful: brown and stainless tile
Absolutely LOVE your cabinetry! Carrera marble would look beautiful behind your cooking range/hood wall all the way to the ceiling, as long as it would go with your countertop, which appears to be white/grey. |
THinking a little of Plllog's tile, and loving those tiles Remodelfla posted, but understanding they'd be too much...I would love to see a very simple backsplash...maybe large format plain rectangular tiles with just a few circles scattered in. It'd probably be a tall order (or impossible), but in my mind it looks cool! |
- Posted by remodelfla (My Page) on Sun, Mar 28, 10 at 9:42
OH Boxer... what is that second one? |
Shame on me for not listing the sources. The one you love is from the below link. Trikeenan. It is the same tile with different lighting and direction. I love it too! ~boxer |
Here is a link that might be useful: Trikeenan
Boxerpups-will you PLEASE stop posting so many beautiful backsplashes?!?!? I will NEVER decide. BTW....what is the source for the 4th and 5th photos? |
Same question as malhgold boxerpups - I LOVE every single tile you posted, especially the second, but the last one might work beautifully on my cooking run. Hmm, I know that second one is busy, but what about a single row of it along my clean up / sink run? Love these ideas everyone, thank you. |
- Posted by swspitfire (My Page) on Sun, Mar 28, 10 at 12:15
I do not have any suggestions but I love everything you have done so far, including your last kitchen. |
Repeating the scale of drawers: Everything in your kitchen emphasizes the horizontal. The rectangle of the drawers are about 2:1 to 4:1 (width to height). The rectangle of the entire cabinet run is about the same scale. The rectangle of the white uppers outlines by the walnut is about the same. For example, there are no square shapes in that kitchen. If you use square shaped tiles, there is no relationship to that to anything else in the kitchen. If you chose to use circles again, then I suggest you mute the colors and let only the shape come through. If you do that on the cooktop wall, the circles will compete with the stained glass, which will distract from the window, not augment the shapes (IMHO). But hard to know what the final outcome will be without trying first. The last tile picture (the whitish ones with ovalish shapes) that Boxerpup posted works in that kitchen because the shapes are repeated in the backs of the chairs and in the light fixtures. Also they did not introduce another color to that kitchen. The tile color is matched to the cabinet color. Even so, it is a relatively "ornate" or "rococo" kitchen, IMHO... You have already introduced that type of design in the bathroom wallpaper, and furnitures pieces that I see in the picture, and the variation of wood color in the flooring, so you can take it to that direction as well. Good luck whatever the choice. I think either will look great. Just for curiosity sake... Why did you chose natural wood window trim in the living room and white trim in the kitchen? Did you do that so you can bring in walnut into the kitchen? |
You can find these on the web. I wish I knew how to do a direct link. ~boxer Hartmeier 0115 Stone Impressions Archiexpo Contemporary solid wood kitchen http://img.archiexpo.com/images_ae/photo-g/contemporary-solid-wood-kitchen-oak-163667.jpg |
Thanks again Boxerpup. I think I have to find a place somewhere for that Trikeenan tile. I just love it. I bet my dh will find it too retro though. Fingers crossed. Padola - thanks, I love the colours in that glass mosaic. Which faucet do you have? The Karbon? It rocks. I love the other main sink faucet too, it is the Kalia Elito Diver. Florantha - I'm leaning towards going without, at least for a while. Sound advice. Do you think I should leave the clean up / main sink run without backsplash as well? Kaismom - thanks for the explanation, I see what you mean. And yes, the two stained glass windows in the kitchen look a little funny don't they? The simple answer is it was a mistake - the one that has the wood trim wasn't supposed to have wood trim. We just haven't gotten around to dealing with that yet - our place is still a work in progress. The window in the kitchen doesn't have any trim at wall, it is a drywall return. I'd like to have the same done with that far window. At a minimum when we get to painting we will paint the far kitchen window trim white to fade into the wall and appear more like the other kitchen window. |
- Posted by vampiressrn (My Page) on Sun, Mar 28, 10 at 18:28
Love your MCM sochi and gorgeous mix of materials in your kitchen. All the modern tiles folks have posted here are great and I also like terrazzo. |
Here is a link that might be useful: terrazzo
- Posted by palimpsest (My Page) on Sun, Mar 28, 10 at 18:41
I vote for nothing, back painted Starfire glass panels, or more of the countertop material. Don't dilute the overall imppact with too many materials. |
Sochi, Your kitchen is beautiful. I agree with plimpsest. BTW, Where are those big circle tiles from. |
I agree with those who say that you need to simplify the backsplash to make sure you don't compete with the quartzite and the walnut. Either more quartzite or a simple off-white tile that disappears a bit (the large-format porcelain does that, I think, especially the matte choices.) i think even back-painted glass would be too hard and glittery and distract from the texture you have there already. Just so frigging gorgeous. Stunning. |
- Posted by onelady1dog2girls (My Page) on Sun, Mar 28, 10 at 23:28
I also love all the beautiful choices you've made. The clean lines, but there are also such warm touches here - love the photos you've incorporated. I wanted to ask you about the quartzite. Does quartzite more or less absorbent than granite? What do you use to seal and how often? I am considering it for a bathroom remodel. Thank you for sharing. |
wow. I really love it! And i would love to be able to pick any of the gorgeous tiles that people have posted. However.......I need one of those windows!!!! Where did you get them? |
I don't have any backsplash suggestions, just wanted to say your kitchen is awesome! I love the walnut cabinets. Looking forward to pictures when you are finished. |
Thanks everyone. This forum is fantastic - there is no substitute for lots of different eyes and tastes offering suggestions. It is incredibly valuable. At the moment I'm thinking of doing nothing - scrubbable paint and leave it for a few months. At least that option can be easily changed if I'm not happy with it! That would allow us the time to think about it, plus finish off all the other elements waiting for our attention in the house. I will certainly try to find a way to incorporate at least one of those awesome modern tiles somewhere in the house! Perhaps the fireplace?? tarnator - the windows were done about 20 years ago, so I'm not sure, but any local stained/leaded glass artist should be able to do one for you. We added a transom in our new powder room and asked a local glass artisan to do a replica of our big windows for the transom - they did a great job. The same local company will be removing all our glass panels (there are eight of them throughout the house) and doing some repairs while we replace the exterior window. onelady - I think that the quartzite is similarly absorbent as granite, but I'm not sure. It is sealed, as you would seal a marble or light coloured granite I think. Certainly this particular quartzite seems to hold up well, no staining or etching at any rate. There are several stone experts on the forum who should know about absorbency. |
Sochi, I am so glad you are going to wait. I actually prefer no backsplash. But I have had so much fun searching. If I find some cool backsplash. Can I still post it? ~boxer |
- Posted by lzydogrnch (My Page) on Mon, Mar 29, 10 at 9:17
what kind of cabinets were in your old kitchen? It all looks great! |
WOW - your kitchen is amazing. Love the railing. Lots of great choices posted above. Very hard to choose I would say. I really like the one remodelfla posted. Can you tell me about your bathroom wallpaper and fixtures. Love them. |
I don't have any back splash suggestions, although I'd be really tempted to either paint it or go with the large format glass tile that davidtay suggested. I'd hate to see anything compete with the gorgeous cabinets!! Your cabinet guy did a remarkable job handling the grain that runs down the entire length of the cabinets. What amazing quality! |
Boxerpups - "If I find some cool backsplash. Can I still post it?" Do you have to even ask the question??? OF COURSE! Please, please keep posting the fabulous tiles, I love them. I'm sure I speak for everyone - we all love them. Don't stop! lzydog - my old cabinets are Cherry stained quite dark, expresso perhaps. ccboombs1 - thanks very much, I'll pass your comments along to my cabinet maker! He'll be thrilled. prill - I'm blanking right now on the name of the wallpaper in the powderoom, I will post details tonight. I got advice on that selection from the decorating forum, the thread might still be there. |
Prill - the wallpaper is Hula Green by Graham and Browne. I'm not sure about the sink, I remember that it was made in Brazil - we got it on sale at a local store. It certainly wasn't a recognizable brand name. The toilet is a Toto Aquia dual flush. Here is a link to the wallpaper: |
Here is a link that might be useful: Hula Green
Because this kitchen is so different from most, I've looked at it a lot. The reason I was so taken with your stove wall is that it is also a gallery of art pieces. Without them, the space would have a very different "feel." The sink area has that other feel--it lacks that same spare elegance and seems to need another element. I'm with Sabjamata--glass plate! It would give the above-sink space some strong personality if you echoed one of the blues or the green from the room divider in a rectangle under the window. (see the page listed below, suggested by sabiata). A backsplash of glass would provide that same reflective and smooth texture as some of the tiles others suggested above, but there would be no grout or lines. Essentially you would have paint with a glass coating. Am also wondering if the sink window needs a walnut frame around it. OR would that wall's need be addressed if it gets a strong dose of color all the way to the ceiling, perhaps in a sink-wide stripe of shiny paint without the glass? And with a portion of a hollow circle overlaid in a second paint color along the perimeter? This would counteract the rectangular regularity of many of the other lines in the kitchen and echo your roundish pots and the cutouts in the room divider and the clock and the stained glass. You could even echo a motif from the stained glass, but pare it down. My inlaws had lots of undecorated walnut in their 1960s-modern architect-designed house in the "University Grove" area of St. Paul and I always felt it needed colors to complement the dark stark wood in the living room and hall. But the place was a fabulous space, as is yours. Colors--turquoise and your other blues and raspberry and your greens? |
Here is a link that might be useful: glass backsplash
Sochi, If there is a Porcelainosa dealer in you aerea, pay them a visit. Because you have a pretty modern kitchen with horizontal strip pattern, you can try "Silk" collection. It's a big tile, pretty & subtle that makes your cabinetry focus point. They have Blanco (white), Beige & Verde (green) with small brown strip that match your walnut. I saw in their a new catalog a bathroom with walnut vanity & Silk Blanco wall. It's so beautiful & classy. But if you want your backsplash a focus point, go with something else http://porcelanosa.ribernet.es/cattile3.asp?id=99 |
- Posted by pricklypearcactus (My Page) on Tue, Mar 30, 10 at 16:42
I just love your kitchen sochi! I think it looks perfect right now and I love the idea of going without a backsplash. Let your beautiful walnut cabinetry and stunning quartzite countertops be the star of the show. If you do decide to go with a backsplash, what about something like these? They echo the circles of your railing, but shouldn't compete with your quartzite. |
I'm liking the suggestion of prickley pear. Something that doesn't compete with countertop would be great in white or gray. |
florantha - thank you for taking the time to really consider this. I agree that the sink area needs something more, whereas the cooktop run may be just fine as it is. I am tempted to go with glass and paint. I love the strong colours in the link you included. I am a little intimidated by the 'lime zest' colour from the dining room railing on a large wall, but the actual amount of wall in that area is limited. I considered not having uppers on that wall at all, which would have allowed for more interest perhaps, but practicality won out. It is very handy having that one upper cabinet above the dishwasher and to the right of the sink. It is difficult to tell from the pictures I posted, but that sink area almost disappears in the kitchen. I intended this to happen and am pleased with it - the consequence is that I could probably do something quite strong on that wall and get away with it. Essentially I tried to have my cake and eat it too with the sink run (open concept yet hide the mess). I left a partial wall on the left hand side of the run - this ensures that the sink area is invisible from the dr and lr. Also, when one enters the kitchen from the front of the house, you are facing the main cooking run. It is draws you in, dazzles you, and you don't see anything else. I suppose there are two arguments re: backsplash in the sink area - use bold colour or pattern as it isn't that visible, or go plain and let the area serve its less showy but very practical and important purpose. I agree, the walnut needs some colour. In part that is why I've asked my dh to print up some pictures in colour, as apposed to the black and white there now. I need more colour. I've introduced it so far with accessories, which may or may not stay. I'm particularly taken with turquoise, and I love your suggestion of raspberry too. The room is lacking in red IMO. If I'm honest, I wish I had done the white cabinets in colour. I love some of the blue and green cabinets in your quirky kitchen thread. That said, having the pantry wall in white helps that large, tall wall recede a little. But a cool blue or green would have been awesome. According to my cabinet maker taking those doors off and spraying them another colour would not be a big or expensive undertaking. Perhaps in a few years. It would almost create a whole new kitchen. Anny-2009 - I really like the silk tile - it does look a lot like wallpaper. I will definitely consider that option. Prickleypear - those are very cool tiles. I think I've been persuaded not to do too much on the cooking run, but those might work on the clean-up run. Definitely fun tile! Thank you! |
I also feel that plate glass, backpainted white would feel the cleanest and most practical with that gorgeous walnut kitchen. I must admit, I've done this myself and really adore it. I used Glasskote and was delighted with the product and their support in supplying it. I don't think that a no backsplash is very practical having tried it myself. I had planned and executed a wall-mounted glass splash behind the cooktop alone but found that the sink splashing was bothering the paint and also that drywall or paint or both don't really like getting splashed and wiped up too often. My wall was getting quite dirty after a few months of the no backsplash look. The glass splash is fantastic solution, very easy to maintain and I think that the minimalist feel of it is fantastic. |
I love the tiles everyone is posting, especially Boxerpups' choices...martini tile stole my heart. But I do think that big run where your cooktop is looks so perfect right now that glass plate would do the trick...maybe in a very pal, washed out teal? The sink area is smaller and if you wanted to have some fun there, I would make that the main application of bold tile. Whatever you do, it's going to be lush. Obviously you have awesome taste and (please forgive me...don't mean to sound gauche) some leeway with your budget. |
Sochi, Some years after the building of their house, my inlaws in their walnut kitchen received a fabulous rough-woven wallhanging made by my sister-in-law, the fiber artist. It was blues--heavily turquoise--with the raspberry. It got mounted on the walnut paneled wall right by the dining table, just outside the kitchen and set the tone for the room. No one remembers that room without the piece now. Facing it in the living room was a painting by an artist friend, of a swamp done in browns with lots of turquoise and other blues. That picture and that wallhanging facing one another were the making of this long room. When my father in law died, we "staged" the place for sale and I hauled in more of those colors--placemats, etc. I found an area rug at Home Depot with spirals of the colors for under the dining table and the new buyer wrote it into the purchase agreement! __ The thinking that you have put into the angles of approach to the kitchen is a mini-lesson for readers in this forum. That aspect is often forgotten when we plan for a quick correction to meet an immediate need. Remodel in haste, repent at leisure. |
....wise. |
Don't listen to me, my taste is all in my mouth :-). I think if you put any pattern on the wall it will create too many competing focal points. I'd put in turquoise back painted glass or more of the quartzite. I love that Studio Moderne but it would require a very plain counter. If you really want to pick a tile that Heath ceramic would look nice or maybe a very plain, matte, stacked rectangle about the same size as the Heath ceramic or maybe more narrow (2x8). I would love to go for that modern European look however I have to be more conservative to protect my resale potential. |
- Posted by flwrs_n_co (My Page) on Fri, Apr 2, 10 at 22:53
Hi, I'm new to this forum--been lurking for a month or so trying to get some ideas for an upcoming kitchen re-do. If you want something subtle, how about an etched glass? You could design a simple motif with circles etched into frosted or clear glass. I googled and there seem to be quite a few sites and they all seem to be willing to tailor their work to their customers' desires. Just another idea . . . |
- Posted by firsthouse_mp (My Page) on Fri, Apr 2, 10 at 23:00
I was away for a week for Easter Break and missed the whole Sochi's Backsplash thread! LOVE all the new choices by Boxerpups, especially the last one. You know I love your kitchen...anything you pick will look great since you already have such great taste--it's evident in all your other choices and what you have already created. If you have a "gut" feeling", go with it....your inner design compass is spot on--it is fabulous and has served you well!!! And we all can only hope to have such an amazing inner design sense too :) |
Thanks sandca, great advice! I think I will leave the cooking run without a backsplash for the time being, eventually I will probably put in a glass backsplash. I'm not sure about colour on that run, BUT, I'm considering using colour (or maybe pattern) on the sink/clean up run with the SS counter. Perhaps turquoise, or florantha brought up raspberry and I'm leaning that way. There isn't as much going on with the clean up run, perhaps I can get away with a strong colour or tile there? florantha - thanks for the stories about your in-laws house, I have a complete visual of it in my mind's eye, I feel like I know it! I've been considering the raspberry suggestion seriously and re-reading your 'red' thread as well. I've ordered at marimekko unikko fabric in red (and other colours) for my dr table. Do you think I should limit it to accents, so should I try it for the wall colour on the clean-up run? My cabinet-maker is currently making some cabinets for our family room as well, which is just off the kitchen. The cabinets will be 'wrapped' in walnut, but I want multi-coloured cabinet doors - I'm leaning towards green, blue and raspberry and/or white. Something like the look of the blu dot cabs in the link. Anyway, I'm really considering colour this weekend and am appreciating all the links and leads in your threads, thanks again. sabjimata - thanks again and I hear you, that is the direction I'm moving in (I think!). Re: budget - this wasn't a low budget reno, but we're not rich and frankly we're just about out of flexibility right now, which is why a lower-cost backsplash would be ideal! We were able to get a few floor model appliances which kept some cost down, and I must admit that the fact that my awesome cabinet maker is also my brother-in-law saved us thousands (no mark-up for the wood, hardware, quartzite counter, etc). |
Here is a link that might be useful: colourful blu dot storage
firsthouse -that is a really lovely thing to say, thank you! I still doubt my "inner design compass" and the only reason I think I've done as well as I have is due to help from people like you on this site and thanks to the hundreds of magazines I've poured over for the last two years! And I've seen pictures of your kitchen - your inner compass is obviously bang on! By the way - does your drywall really say HI? Was that intentional? I love it. |
- Posted by firsthouse_mp (My Page) on Fri, Apr 2, 10 at 23:30
Andy Blick Discus in matte white? It's a bit graphic and probably expensive but another cool idea.
Angela Adams Manfred Deco
Sochi, I think I've said all I can. As far as color goes, you're on your own. Everyone thinks I have always had a heavily red kitchen, but except for the previous red vinyl floor (gone for almost two decades now) and the famous red sink, all the rest of the color was portable stuff--an enamel teapot that burned up years ago, three consecutive sets of large print roman shades, flower pots or vases in season, a red dishrack, ruby red glass dishes and bowls which get put away after drying, rag rugs, and most recently, a Sears red microwave. My point is that you can do a lot with decorative stuff and unlike permanent pieces (expensive stoves, cupboards, floors, and permanent backsplashes), you're not married to these loose items and don't have to wait until you renovate again to add or subtract them. Paint may be your friend in this economy and I suspect you are clever enough and gutsy enough to find a good way to use it. As you heard above, they say that using paint and glass skillfully you can make a wonderful mod backsplash. Other posters have made very intriguing suggestions as well--what amazing choices are out there for us! and like me they're enjoying the trip through the spare yet rich landscape you have created. Your kitchen has a lot of thin rectangular lines and many artistic touches already, from the lighting to those leaded glass windows and the view beyond the sink. The countertop adds texture and movement. The dark brown and white have a tension. The rooms and halls beyond add depth and complexity. Add some dirty dishes, utensils, kid stuff, a couple weeks' worth of magazines and newspapers, library books, and unmatched potholders and handtowels to your kitchen. Even the writing you anticipate on the blackboard door will introduce another element. You may want to have some large stretches of gentle color to counteract the particulate flotsam of our everyday lives and rest your eyes. |
Sochi --- WOW! Your kitchen is coming together so beautifully - you must be thrilled to bits to be this close. I have to be honest - I haven't carefully read every post (so I may be repetitive or redundant), but think I have the gist and I would second (or third or fourth or fifth) the notion of waiting to put in a backsplash. So many of the choices that have been posted could be absolutely spectacular - or could take away from the wonderful vibe you alreday have going on. Whatever you decide, I am sure it will be perfect. You have made so many fantastic design decisions already. Your home is simply stunning! Eliz |
- Posted by midwifekim (My Page) on Sat, May 22, 10 at 15:57
This is such an amazing forum!! I love your kitchen, sochi- AND everyone's thoughtful suggestions. i feel a kinship to your design (those heath ovals!... maybe for the fireplace instead... less is more- but not too little). we're also doing white uppers and wood below (natural cherry). oh and that green! go with your compass- as firsthouse said- it serves you well ( and i'm biased, since mine is set in the same direction as yours!). i can't wait to send out my questions here and see what we get! |
bump |
I too have been trying to source some quartzite bianca - and I'd love to know where you found it sochi (I too live in Ottawa). Your pictures are gorgeous - really fabulous. I've been in contact with Emerald Tile - they don't have any - and have also driven to Ciot in Montreal twice - with no luck. The last "batches" have been pretty awful looking, with huge iron/rust stains and green patching. Would you mind sharing where you found it?? I've currently got a "beautiful" temporary MDF countertop while we search... Many thanks in advance, |
- Posted by rococogurl (My Page) on Wed, Jul 14, 10 at 15:32
Going with the circles is obvious but I feel it's way too "Pierre Cardin" for me. As it happens, I found some beautiful glass mosaic backsplashes over the past week that might provoke some ideas. For a pow cmid-c olor the blue or green tiles would be amazing and the vertical configuration of the white Artistic Stilato tile would pick up elements from your window and play it in another way. |
macfrodge - I used Marble Unlimited for the fabricator here in Ottawa, but sourced my Quartzite from Ciot in Mtl. Ciot Toronto has some as well. Ciot advertised the quartzite heavily (LCBO magazine), they may be out - did they give you any indication of when more might be in? If Toronto has some nice slabs I'm sure they ship back and forth between TOR and Mtl regularly. Vesta marble here in Ottawa also had some quartzite bianca in their showroom, but I know they sourced from Ciot (and their quote was several thousands more expensive than Marble Unlimted). Any "exotic" stone in Ottawa almost certainly comes from Ciot. My slabs did/do have some small rust spots (as do others I've seen), and I have one greenish-blue patch (which works with my colours so no big deal). Thanks rcocogurl, great suggestions. That vertical configuration is a GW kitchen, one of my favourites. I think glass tile is my answer, either small as you linked to, or large. I hesitate because I don't want anything too "sleek" or shiny looking. To be honest I'm paralysed on the backsplash choice - I've gone without for four months or so and have decided that I do want something, no heavy patten, but ideally something with texture and a matte finish. My DH keeps pushing for glass and I'm sure that is where we'll end up, but I'm still searching. I need to put up new pictures, we've finished up a few more things since I posted this message. Better find the camera! |
- Posted by rococogurl (My Page) on Wed, Jul 14, 10 at 17:29
sochi, indeed it is a GW kitchen -- it's catmom's. That Opera Glass comes in 2 finishes. Not sure glass is ever completely matte unless sandblasted but a vertical pattern would be a natural on your big wall. Scale really is the issue -- no idea of measurements but your space almost seems loft-like. Depending on the tile collection, I could see one size around the sink and something bigger on the long wall -- same tile or reversing in some way. There's so much product out there it shouldn't be a problem finding something just right. Backsplashes are my favorite part of the kitchen to design. Tile junkie. |
Thanks sochi - very informative reply. It seems as though the last "batch" from the quarry in Brazil has huge occlusions and everyone I'm speaking with (tile/stone distributors) are either very unhappy, or are not accepting delivery. Natural products with natural flaws - comes with the territory. I can wait. And I'd love to chime in with a tile recommendation but I opted to put in a long, low backsplash window instead of tile. Sorta 60s looking, and it meant I didn't have to choose a tile (which I tend to hem and haw over quite a bit). But it looks good with my new Karbon faucet (great taste btw!). Thanks again, cheers. |
- Posted by firsthouse_mp (My Page) on Wed, Jul 14, 10 at 22:34
Any decision yet on the backsplash??? Your kitchen is still drop dead gorgeous even without any backsplash! :) |
macfrodge- long, low window backsplash - that sounds amazing! Don't suppose you have any pictures to share? And a Karbon too - I have a feeling I'm going to love your kitchen. Just had a friend over tonight about to buy a Karbon, they were test driving mine. Apparently Preston Hardware carries them now - no one had them in Ottawa last fall when I was buying, I had to rely on the recommendations of the garden web folks. They didn't steer me wrong. Do you love yours? Re: the bianca, you sound very patience, a virtue I'm sadly not known for - but I'm sure your MDF is spectacular in the meantime. Have you considered marble? rococo - I've always loved catmom's kitchen and been tempted by her backsplash. My fear of a "too sleek" kitchen is probably silly. I'll get some samples. Glad to hear that you're a backsplash junkie - I'll call on your help! I'll probably re-post next week with my updated mostly finished (save backsplash and island) kitchen and see what people think. Thanks again. firsthouse - still no decision - so embarrassing! I wanted to live with nothing for a few months and see how I felt about the space. I think I need more than nothing, but probably not the fabulous patterned tiles I was originally considering. Summer has me spending more time in the garden than the kitchen, but I really want to figure out the backsplash over the next month or so. Fingers crossed. |
Okay, I have no idea how I managed to not post on this thread when it first came out (unless I did and missed it when I just scrolled through!). Your kitchen is just fab (short for fabulous)! That's the word that popped into my mind when I first saw it, so fab it is! Thank you for the compliments on my kitchen (shout out to rococogurl--you rock!). I think glass tile or a glass and stone tile combo/mosaic would look right at home in your kitchen (your fab kitchen). Either vertical strips or the circles would look nice. Besides the Opera Glass Stilato pattern that we used (and still love BTW), we recently saw a number of other all glass and glass/stone mosaics while searching for tile for our bathrooms, and many of those came in either strips/sticks or circles: Artistic Tile, Akdo, Porcelanosa, Glass Tile (?), etc. You could go with the White Thassos marble tile we just put up in our MB; Porcelanosa's Moon Saturn Blanco (solid and open circles). They have a few other variations of circle mosaics as well, incl all glass, carrara (?) marble (all solid circles), and I think glass and marble combination. Lots of terrific options out there--good luck choosing! |
I wish I could show pictures - first of all I'm a horrible photographer and secondly it's still in construction mode. Kinda looks like this one http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3071/3104107274_f799704e4c.jpg with the frosted cabinets above. I did read about gardenweb users' experiences with Environmental Lights down in the States and decided to get dimmable LEDs - was very pleased with that. Karbon - I spoke with the people at Preston Hardware as well, but unfortunately their pricing was much higher than online. So I went with faucetdirect.com. Takes a bit of getting used to - I've only had it installed for the last week or so. But ultimately happy with it. I'll try and post some pictures when we're out of construction mode. And I'm now starting to call around for the quartzite - even out of the country. The slabs I saw last week at Ciot were way too "stained" with rust - even the salesman apologized when he saw them - he said he wouldn't have asked us to come if he'd known it looked like that. This has been quite the roller coaster experience, trying to find this quartzite. So the hunt is on! Good luck with the backsplash. cheers |
- Posted by flwrs_n_co (My Page) on Fri, Jul 16, 10 at 12:27
Sochi, I ran across some stainless tiles with circles and thought of this thread so thought I would post them in case you might want to consider them. They're by Crossville. Here is a link: Crossville MT270 Circles MT 270 Circles Backsplash Another Pic of Circles HTH! |
Incredibly beautiful! I would NOT do a backsplash. I second (or third?) the "just paint" idea. If compelled to protect the walls, I would go with matte glass. |
- Posted by rookie_2010 (My Page) on Wed, Jul 21, 10 at 18:46
Your kitchen is so perfect! I'm not trying to stress you out but, I'd be paralyzed by the pressure to put the finishing touch on a space like that! There's something so balanced about it, I'm afraid to even make a suggestion!!!!!! But I can't resist anyway........ Looks like your instincts serve you VERY well and I agree that you could get away with something busier on the sink run. And the turquoise with that walnut.....makes me totally weak in the knees. It's all just so fabulous! |
- Posted by cherise0025 (My Page) on Wed, Jul 24, 13 at 19:28
Your kitchen is one of the most beautiful I have ever seen! I love the clean lines and the contemporary mix of white cabinetry with walnut. I would be tempted to maintain the simplicity of your design by not adding anything too distracting to the backsplash area. Keep it simple, perhaps a back painted solid glass backsplash, or a simple textured white tile of some sort. Can I ask who made your cabinetry and what colour and finishes you chose? I live on Vancouver Island and will soon be constructing a new home. Lastly, what kind of floors do you have? I look forward to your reply. Thanks! |
Hi Cherise, Thank you for your kind words! Nice to see this old thread back. I'm ashamed to say that three years later I still don't have a backsplash. Sigh. My brother-in-law is a local cabinet maker here in Ottawa, he is very talented. I don't think his website is up yet or I would share it. The cabinets are book matched natural walnut, no stain. The floors are reclaimed birch pulled up fom the Ottawa River. I just love them, they are from Logs End here in Ottawa. I do have a final reveal thread somewhere in the ether if you're interested in more details. Or I can answer here. Good luck! |
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Former Goldman Sachs trader Deeb Salem was awarded $8.25 million in 2010. He wanted $13 million and continues to fight for the extra 5 mill four years later because 1) While at Goldman, he was the Michael Jordan of investment professionals in the mortgage industry and had to fend off highly appealing offers from other firms on a near daily basis and 2) He had told his mother to expect 13.
Salem said in an arbitration hearing that he was led to believe that his 2010 bonus would be $13 million, down from a $15 million award for 2009 when he was paid more than Chief Executive Officer Lloyd C. Blankfein. Instead, Salem said his bonus was unfairly docked because of a written warning he received about his 2007 self-evaluation. Salem, 35, said the $8.25 million bonus for 2010 didn't reflect his contributions, while Goldman Sachs argued he was aware that the firm could pay him whatever it wished and that the company considered his conduct in determining compensation. Salem said promises from executives kept him around for another year before a $3 million bonus led him to jump to a hedge fund. "Let's be very clear: I was one of the most sought-after investment professionals in the mortgage industry," Salem said during the Feb. 25 hearing. "I had the opportunity throughout the course of my career and throughout — from that day, from almost every month that I was at Goldman, to leave for other opportunities." […]
In January 2011, Salem told his mother, who was staying with him because her house had burned down on Christmas, that he expected at least $13 million for 2010, according to the transcript. That was based on the fact that his mortgage-trading desk generated about the same amount of revenue in 2010 as it did the previous year and that Justin Gmelich, a credit trading executive, told him at a cocktail hour that he was a "steal" at $15 million, Salem said. Salem received an $8.25 million bonus after getting the warning for "extremely poor judgment" in discussing a short squeeze in his self-evaluation. Goldman Sachs executives told him the firm would make it up to him and encouraged him to stay, he said. That came after President Gary Cohn persuaded him to remain in 2008 rather than leave with colleague Josh Birnbaum to start a hedge fund, Salem said. No promises were made, Andrew Frackman, a lawyer at O'Melveny & Myers LLP who represented Goldman Sachs, said at the hearing.
Ex-Goldman Trader Says Bonus Cut to $8.25 Million Unfair [Bloomberg]
Earlier: Bonus Watch '10-12: The Self-Described Michael Jordan Of Goldman Sachs
Comments (16)
at 8 mil he was totally f#cked
I would pay to read the self eval.
pretty sure the conclusion went something like:
"So that is why I am better than everyone in the world. Kiss my ass and suck my dick…everyone."
Hey Shazar (fart fart fart) I'm that chick from last (fart fart fart) you were grinding on me and feeling my back fat (fart fart fart)! Then we started to French kiss (fart fart fart) and that chick you said was your boss saw (fart fart fart) and she puked (fart fart fart). You told me you loved my curves and the way I smell (fart fart fart). Call me sometime (fart fart farrrrrrrrrrt)
Where is Deeb now? Is he making it rain for some other firm?
Goldman took 4.75mm in hush money from him to keep it sealed.
He short squeezed to make his millions? Go on……
Why did his mom's house burn down?
per the bberg article, he's at a hedge fund.
take a lap.
I'd tell people my mom's house burned down if she still lived with me
tough but fair.
…think I would prefer the fat chick ( see above)….bit more weight to her story than his!…BUT, NO, absolutely NO bonus.
Guest -
Government Motors
I got my pitch back!


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Beats Music is temporarily suspending new users from signing up
Beats Music, the new streaming audio service that launched this week in the US, has temporarily suspended new users from signing up. The reason why?
Beats Music launches in the US
After months (actually, years) of rumors, Beats Audio has finally launched its own streaming music service. With simultaneous launches on Android and iOS, and a
Poll: Would you use Google's Mobile Meter app in exchange for some kind of compensation?
According to Engadget, Google looks to be readying a new "Mobile Meter" app that users can install on their Android and iOS devices, essentially giving
InstaLauncher is a nice new way to launch apps on jailbroken iOS devices
With iOS 7 being the massive disappointment it is, it's become clear to me that the only UI innovation on iOS in the foreseeable future
Sprinkle Islands is an evolutionary successor to the first Sprinkle game for iOS and Android
It's been a year and a half since I wrote about the first Sprinkle game, and now, the successor has been released on iOS and
The AppCrayon Deluxe Kickstarter project is a kid friendly smart stylus for the iPad
Crayon-shaped styluses for the iPad have been around for years, even in a (at least semi) smart capacity, but the AppCrayon Deluxe that's on Kickstarter
Geocaching is perfect for mobile tech, but is handicapped by outdated rules
Several years ago, I started doing something called Geocaching. In a nutshell, you use a GPS receiver to track down hidden "caches" that other geocachers
Taposé, the great iPad app idea that never became a great iPad app
The story of the iPad app Taposé is one I first covered back in the days of Nothing but Tablets, one of the sites that
Make Minecraft PE look better with texture packs
Texture packs is a huge thing for the standard version of Minecraft, with higher resolution texture packs that change the look of the game. A
XCOM: Enemy Unknown is a $20 iOS port of a current generation console/PC game
Mobile gaming has changed a lot in recent years, with improved hardware opening up for more and more advanced games. Ports of console and PC


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Spherion is currently hiring for an amazing direct hire opportunity with a leading employer in New Carlisle, IN. This is a fantastic role with ... more about senior process engineer
Medical Biller-CPC will maximize the compliance and profitability of the Medical Practice through claims follow up, payer expertise, accurate and ... more about medical biller - cpc
Spherion, Friday, January 16, 2015


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3040 Columbus Center Columbus, IN 46203 Telephone: (812) 376-7848 Email: firstname.lastname@example.com.
Columbus, Indiana