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I have been browsing some of the large number of internet pages devoted to growing plants under artificial light, some commercial, others purely informational. The amount of incorrect information is astounding. A few things crop up time after time, probably copied from page to page in true urban myth fashion.
Here is my top ten myths on this topic. Feel free to add more. Or, if you're that way inclined, defend one of my myths or just trash my explanation :) 1. HID lamps give off more heat. All lamps of the same wattage give off more or less the same amount of heat. A 400W metal halide or HPS lamp gives off the same heat as ten 40W fluorescent tubes or four 100W incandescents. The HID lamps will be hotter because all the heat is being given off in such a small space, but the total heat is the same. A fluorescent tube will gently warm the whole shelf while a HID bulb will fry a few square inches of plant and hardly touch the rest. 2a. HID lamps have better "penetration"
Two ways of saying the same thing really, but both wrong. The same wattage of fluorescent light used at the same distance as a HID lamp provides equal "penetration". This myth arises because people tend to use fluorescent lights very close to plants (to compensate for having less power) and HID lights quite far away. The difference in light intensity between the top of a plant 2" from a light and the bottom maybe 12" from the light is very large, while the difference between 20" and 30" from a light is relatively small. No difference if you have the same amount of light, the fluorescents may actually perform better because the light is distributed more evenly. 3. GRO-LUX type lamps are less effective because they are less bright. GRO-LUX fluorescents appear dim to our eyes because they emit light that our eyes are not sensitive to. However the total light power emitted is basically the same as an average fluorescent tube. The light emitted at wavelengths good for plants is as much as any fluorescent and more than many. 4. Plants only use red and blue light, green light is useless. Plants use light at all wavelenghts from near ultraviolet to near infrared to convert water and carbon dioxide into sugars. They use red light near 650nm most efficiently, then blue light near 620nm, then light in between. Some plants are much less efficient at using green light, some use it almost as well as red and blue. All plants have some capacity to adapt to best utilise the available light. 5. Blue light is for growth, red light is for flowering. Plants will grow under monochromatic red light. Plants grow faster with a little blue light (with the same total light power). Plants grow slower under monochromatic blue light because the same power produces fewer photons. Approximately 25% of the power in blue light appears to be best, but probably varies for different circumstances and plants. 6. LEDs are ("ultra-bright", "extremely low power", "used by NASA", "monochromatic", or pick your own catchphrase) therefore they are the best grow lamps. LEDs look ultra-bright because they are small and emit all the light in one direction. This is great if you want to grow a single blade of grass and not much help for most anything else. LEDs are extremely low power because they are small and emit very little total light. This means you need a lot of them to grow anything useful and then they use a lot of power. NASA has experimented with LEDs because they are small, light, and nearly indestructable. None of these features are particularly valuable to the average plant grower. Many LEDs emit a very narrow range of light wavelengths, which means they can be calibrated to emit only the light most useful for plants. That's exactly what a GRO-LUX lamp does and the fluorescent GRO-LUX does it about five times more efficiently. 7. T5 fluorescents are the newest and best. The new generation of T5 fluorescent tubes is extremely efficient and compact, both desirable features for a grow light system. They are as efficient as some metal halide bulbs. Unfortunately they are mostly being sold as premium items with a premium price tag and often with expensive custom fixtures. For the same money, a good HID setup would be better and for less money you can get the same light from standard fluorescents. 8. A windowsill isn't bright enough, you have to use artificial lights. Direct sunlight through a window is far brighter than any grow lights most of us will ever see, use it when you can. The limitations are that there is very little direct sunlight in the middle of winter at temperate latitudes and there is only so much space directly in those south-facing windows. Indirect light in a south-facing window is poor, indirect light in any other direction is completely inadequate, and light more than a foot or so from a window is virtually useless to a high light plant. 9. Two fluorescent bulbs aren't enough, you need at least four. The number of fluorescent tubes you need depends completely on how much light you want. Some plants need more light than others. Lighting a larger area requires more light. It is difficult to use more than two fluorescent tubes to light a strip the width of a seed tray, so two tubes are sufficient for a single row of trays. At the other extreme, four 40W fluorescent tubes are completely inadequate for lighting twenty mature tomato plants. 10. Cool white bulbs emit blue light and warm white bulbs emit red light, so mix them if you want both red and blue. Warm white bulbs emit most of their light in the red part of the spectrum with only a small amount of green and blue light. Standard cool white (4100K) bulbs emit more blue light, but still more red than blue. "Daylight" 6500K bulbs emit roughly equal amounts blue and red light power, which still means about twice as many red photons as blue photons. So any of these tubes emit a lot of red light and some blue light, the difference is in the details. |
Follow-Up Postings:
- Posted by biology_brad z4 MN (My Page) on Thu, Mar 10, 05 at 20:41
I would take exception with statement #4. Chlorophyll A absorbs red light most effectively at 680 and 700 nm , not 650 nm. There is no blue light at 620 nm, you need to get smaller, say 500nm. this is textbook stuff, hard to see how a "myth-dispeller" could be so far off. Brad |
- Posted by shrubs_n_bulbs z8/9 UK (My Page) on Fri, Mar 11, 05 at 6:10
Sorry, that was a typo. I meant "blue light near 420nm", not 620nm :) |
Interesting. I like #5 because a few weeks ago i started growing lettuce and radishes under HID 400w HPS, and was worried about the red-spectrum thing (that i should be using blue, but am using mainly red). |
I know I'm a broken record but, I'm having outstanding results w/ a ceramic metal halide 400w. by philips. To my knowledge, It provides the best spectrum of any HID on the market right now. I don't worry about blue for growth or red for flowering...This is a white light that is as close to the sun's spectrum as your going to get in an HID light source.For you HID lovers, I've supplied a link. Look for yourself. This is truly a light that is good for all stages of plant growth! If your interested in getting one, go to bulbs.com You'll pay 62.00 including shipping for one bulb. It operates off a HPS ballast. It also states that it is intended to be used in a vertical position. Since they have been available in 400w, about 1 1/2-2 years, many people have used them in a horizontal configuration w/ no ill effect. I talked to a philips tech myself, at most you may lose 5-10% life on the bulb burning it in a horizontal position. Well worth the lose of bulb life considering it's advantages, IMO. JM... |
Here is a link that might be useful: ceramic metal halide.
- Posted by nygardener z6 NYC (My Page) on Fri, Mar 18, 05 at 21:56
A nice list, but a few comments: 2. The same wattage of fluorescent light used at the same distance as a HID lamp provides equal "penetration". HID lamps are more efficient than most or all fluorescent lights. So even allowing for the greater width of fluorescent bulbs, you'll get more light and therefore more penetration from an HID lamp of the same wattage. 9. It is difficult to use more than two fluorescent tubes to light a strip the width of a seed tray, so two tubes are sufficient for a single row of trays. Yes, if the trays are arranged lengthwise (end-to-end). If they're side-to-side, then four bulbs will fit over them and will generally produce better results. |
Humm, I have a comment on #1. "All lamps of the same wattage give off more or less the same amount of heat." For the same amount of power input the three types of lamps discussed have wildly different amounts of visible light output. The sum of the energy of visible light, UV light and IR light are the same for the same wattage, just distributed differently. HID's have the least heat (infrared) output of the three types since most of the energy goes to visible light. Incandescents have most of their spectrum in the Near Infrared, thus give off much more heat per watt than the other two types. A long fluorescent tube gives off more heat per watt than an HID lamp but it typically is of lower wattage and that heat is spread over a much larger surface area, thus feeling cooler. A 15 W CFL is not cool to the touch. Vince |
1000w of any kind of light does not throw off the same amount of lumens. The efficiency of the bulb is a ratio of amount of power used in the generation of useable light versus the amount of heat generated. I guess you could call heat a form of light but we're growing plants in ambient temperatures so the wavelength of "light" given off as heat is waisted energy. compare PAR ratings for a 400 watt Halogen flood lamp and a 400w HPS. Better yet place each bulb (and ballast on the hps) in a 4'x4' box and place a thermometer in each box and tell us which reaches 120şf first. I'll put my money on the 400w halogen. (Caution that this could start a fire) If 400w of sodium or Halide is the same as 400w of tubes then why do commercial growers spend thousands of dollers on expensive HID ballasts and bulbs? As far as penetration; I almost agree but; 120,000 Lumens WILL not penetrate the same as 68,000 Lumens. I would agree that the same amount of lumens WILL penetrate the same no matter what the source is. Most of the info. YOU gave us IS a myth IMO. |
- Posted by shrubs_n_bulbs z8/9 UK (My Page) on Sun, Mar 20, 05 at 20:34
Its good to see that plenty of people still believe the myths and are even prepared to defend them :) #2 for nygardener. You're still confusing the total amount of light with the penetration. You said you'll get more light and therefore more penetration from an HID lamp of the same wattage. Firstly, is the 10%-20% more light really such a big deal, because that isn't what people talk about when they repeat this myth? More importantly, more light doesn't mean more penetration, they are two completely different things. Penetration is the relative amount of light reaching the bottom of a plant compared to that reaching the top of the canopy. If half of a high intensity light hitting the top of the canopy reaches the bottom of the plant, that is the same penetration as half of a low intensity light reaching the bottom of the plant. Same penetration but a different amount of light. The important factor is the inverse square law, light intensity drops very rapidly close to the light source and slowly when you are more distant. Moving a foot further away from a fluorescent tube makes a big difference, moving a foot further away from the sun is not even measurable. Penetration from sunlight is superb, only the plant shading itself makes any difference. Penetration from any bulb, fluorescent or HID, hung one inch from the top of the canopy is very poor. #9 for nygardener. Are you agreeing with the myth, or just quibbling over how to arrange seed trays? Either way, whatever arragment you make that will work with four tubes, I can show you an arrangement that won't work, just by adding more trays. And I can show you plenty of setups where two tubes is just fine. The myth is that four tubes is in some way the right number, and it simply isn't. #1 for Vince. Do you really think that a 400W HID lamp gives off significantly less heat than ten 40W fluorescents, or two 200W compact fluorescents? Alantown has proposed an experiment, and I really wish he would go and perform it. He says Better yet place each bulb (and ballast on the hps) in a 4'x4' box and place a thermometer in each box and tell us which reaches 120şf first. 400W is 400W, the box will heat up identically in each case. The only way it would be different is if some of that energy could escape. A light bulb is sending out some energy as visible light, but only about 20% of the total energy in the case of a HID bulb and about 16% for a fluorescent. Even if you allow 100% of the visible light to escape without being absorbed by anything, the difference between 400W of metal halide and 400W of fluorescents is about 16W, just about irrelevant. So, I repeat, the heating effect of all bulb types is basically the same. Alantown asks why do commercial growers spend thousands of dollers on expensive HID ballasts and bulbs? You know as well as I do why - the best metal halide bulbs are around 10% more efficient than the best fluorescents and HPS another 10% more efficient, plus they last longer and are more compact. That 20% adds up to serious money when you have thousands of square feet to light, but simply isn't the make-or-break factor for modest home growers. Commercially, it is also very tax-efficient to make capital expenditures in order to reduce ongoing expenses. And another Alantown quote: I would agree that the same amount of lumens WILL penetrate the same no matter what the source is. This shows exactly why people have so much trouble with this concept. Lumens is not the important thing, 10,000 lumens at one foot has a totally different penetration to 10,000 lumens at one inch. Light from a point source falls off inversely with the square of the distance. That means that the few inches from the top of a plant to the bottom makes a huge difference for a close light source and a small difference for a distant light source. How bright they are doesn't matter. 120,000 Lumens WILL not penetrate the same as 68,000 Lumens This totally meaningless statement compounds the problem. You need to be talking in terms of light intensity, measured in lux or foot-candles, which means you need to know the distance from the light source. 120,000 lumens at the same distance as 68,000 lumens will decrease in light intensity from top to bottom of the plant in exactly the same way, and will be nearly twice as intense at both the top and the bottom of the plant. The improved penetration becomes apparent when you place the 120,000 lumen source further away. For example, 120,000 lumens at three feet from the top of a two-foot plant produces a lower light intensity at the top of the plant and a higher light intensity at the bottom of the plant than the 68,000 lumen source place two feet from the top of the plant. Want to trample on this myth even more? A fluorescent tube is an extended light source and light intensity falls off more slowly from an extended source than from a point source like a HID bulb. This isn't usually very important because of the effects of reflectors, but it can be relevant in large-scale setups. For example, if the ceiling of a grow room was covered in fluorescent tubes, the light would have much better penetration than a single HID bulb putting out the same lumens. The HID bulb would be able to create a high light intensity if placed close to plants but the light would drop off more quickly with distance. Of course, the very use of the word "penetration" is a problem since it isn't even a term that is properly defined. However, it has come into popular use with certain macho growers, perhaps because they like the macho connotations of the word :) |
#8 ....light more than a foot or so from a window is virtually useless to a high light plant. Is this true? I've recently added a sunroom and am anxious to see how my plants grow in there. Depending upon the time of day, plants will usually be more than a foot from the source of the sunlight through the window. But since it IS a south-facing sunroom, plants will get sunlight almost all day. Also, my sunroom windows are treated. I wonder how much of the useful light spectrum will be blocked by the windows? Anyone have any information about this? John |
- Posted by shrubs_n_bulbs z8/9 UK (My Page) on Mon, Mar 21, 05 at 15:27
John, light intensity does drop off incredibly fast when you move away from a window. Larger windows are better and some form of light meter is really the only way to measure it since your own eyes adapt too well to the drop in light. If a spot is receiving direct sunlight even several feet from a window then that is OK, but indirect light will be much dimmer than right at the window. Your sunroom is presumably mostly glass? You probably wouldn't have to worry about distance from the glass. The light intensity will drop when you move to areas that are not surrounded by glass. I can post how to measure light intensity using a camera if you want to measure around your room and don't have a light meter. Normall glazing glass passes virtually all visible light with less than 20% loss, but it stops UV very effectively. Some modern glazing is coated to reflect infra-red, either to keep heat inside a room, or to minimise solar heating of a room. If the coating isn't visible then visible light shouldn't be affect. Some coatings are visible, either silver/gold, or a grey tint, to further reduce solar heating. These coatings do reduce visible light substantially. |
Since when is MH only 10% more efficient than the best flouro bulb? Flouro's are ok for rack growing or even plants as tall as a couple foot tall but; have you ever tried to cover a 6' tall tomato plant with a bank of tubes? (Good luck) Guess I'll stick with my Miniature sun for a mans size harvest and keep the cool tubes for the violets. |
- Posted by shrubs_n_bulbs z8/9 UK (My Page) on Tue, Mar 22, 05 at 11:43
Thanks for the constructive input Alantown ;) Nobody is suggesting you buy a dozen fluorescent fittings to provide largescale lighting (well actually they are, just not me, see this link), but you should at least know why you are making your decisions, not just getting caught up in the "metal halide is the brightest" hype. 1,000W Metal Halide grow lamp, typical output 110,000 lumens. Actual input power including ballast 1,100W. Efficiency 100 lumens/watt. Those sneaky vendors tend to avoid mentioning the ballast! You might be able to find a bulb with 115,000 lumens or even slightly more, but be careful that they aren't just using a higher power ballast to overdrive it! T5 or T8 HO fluorescent efficiency, including ballast, up to 104 lumens/watt, but only for fairly small tubes. More typically 90-95 lumens/watt in the higher powers. That's within 10% of the best metal halid lamps. Also remember that metal halide efficiency drops once you get below about 400W, although this is starting to improve as electronic ballasts are used. HPS, up to 130 lumens/watt, including ballast load. |
Yepper my 1000w sodium is one hell of alot brighter than my halide and I can cover much more area. I have to run it about 18" away from any growth or; it will bleach the leaves. |
I am new to this forum and read your postings with great interest. I have begun to sell HO Fluorex Fluorescent Grow and Aquarium lights on eBay. Have been doing quite well by converting a HO full spectrum flood light that I purchase from Lights of America to be used for indoor use. The lights are all electronic and the bulbs draw 65 Watts while the output is equivelent to many 500 Watt lights. The lumens rating of the lights are 4550 or 70 lumens per watt consumption. I have had great personal success growing my plants with these lights and my aquariums are doing great. They the lights get to around 90 degrees hot vs. halides that can get to around 350 degrees so my aquariums stay cool and I can keep the lights directly on top of my glass tops with no ill effects to water temperture. This means no "Chiller" units required and great diffused lighting in the tanks. I have found the main difference that I can see is that a Halide is a point light source like a spot light and the HO Flourescents I use are a softer, diffused light. Frankly the spread on my lights are wider then the halides at equal distances. I have also began to offer color correction filters that are used in the motion picture and photographic industry to adjust the 6500 Kelvin lights to 10,000-12,000K or lower down to 5,000K with great success. I am not looking to sell any nor do I want this post to be considered a commercial message, but I am still learning and recently had a question about the PAR ratings of these lights. I also notice on this forum differences in opinion on the importance of those ratings and how many grow light manuf. use them for marketing purposes and that the measurements they offer have little meaning. I have found it easy to sell my lights at $65 each to marine aquarium users because of the cost, low costs of replacement bulbs ($15) that last a full 10,000 hours, low heat output, color temp adjustments through my filters, low operating costs ($25 per year, 10 hours per day every day) vs. almost $200 for a 500W Halide, etc. Am I on the right track or am I missing something here. I want to understand more about the quality of these lights so I can talk to my customers with full knowledge of the lighting and the benefits or drawbacks of each. Any help would be appreciated. I am not listing my web site or eBay auctions because again I don't want anyone to think I am trying to sell lights on this forum and hope this posting is OK. Thanks in advance for you input and knowledge. |
So much for the price. I bought mine as a LofA Worklight over a year ago at WalMart for only $24.95. I have seen the Worklight available elsewhere, but not at WalMart anymore. The 65w bulbs are available at both Lowes(for $9.99)and Home Depot(for $12.99). As for information, LoA really hypes their output. A 150w halogen bulb emits 2400 lumens(16 lm/w). A 300w halogen bulb emits 5200 lumens(17.3 lm/w). A 4550 lumen halogen bulb equivalent would consume approximately 265w, NOWHERE close to 500w! Want incandescent? A 200w incandescent bulb emits 2850 lumens(19.3 lm/w). A 300w incandescent bulb emits 6820 lumens(20.9 lm/w). A 4550 lumen incandescent bulb equivalent would consume approximately 229w, also NOWHERE close to 500w! Most of the hobbyists in this group would be much more inclined to be helping the other hobbyists in this group to find an inexpensive source for your light, not to help you sell it. Not to be mean, but that is the way we like it. You can do a search here for previous discussions on Flourex, or other keywords. They have been discussed. Zink |
- Posted by shrubs_n_bulbs z8/9 UK (My Page) on Sun, Jun 19, 05 at 19:27
I guess in one respect you are on the right track because you are making sales and presumably making some money. A product is worth what the other guy will pay, right? Personally, I think the compact fluorescent type of bulb fills a useful niche for plant lighting, but they are in no way a replacement for a metal halide because they are less efficient when you need 40,000 or so lumens. They are similarly not a useful replacement for regular fluorescents if you wish to light an area around four feet long and a foot or more wide. The only real big-win is over regular incandescents and halogens which no right-minded person would consider for plant or aquarium use. The niche for these bulbs is when up to about 10,000 lumens is needed over a fairly small area, then I can recommend this type of bulb. The claim that this lamp puts out less heat than a halide lamp is also misleading. The only reason there is less heat is because there is less light. A metal halide bulb is a very small hot bulb, the fluorex is larger and cooler, while a regular old T8 is even larger and even cooler, but the total heat output for the same light is more or less the same. The smallest metal halide bulbs designed for aquariums put out about three times as much light as the fluorex and so put out about 3 times as much heat. If you don't need that much light then maybe the compact fluorescent is the right bulb. Filters to change the spectrum are frankly an utter waste of time to any plant or aquarium hobbyist. They waste a big chunk of the precious light which is just not acceptable. Bulbs are available which produce the light in the right spectrum, or use a combination of bulbs. |
- Posted by Jumpin_Timmy z5 NE (My Page) on Fri, Jul 1, 05 at 17:13
Shrubs - the March 22 post correctly noted the substantial wattage consumed by HID ballasts, but we also need to address the HUGE lumen depreciation of metal halide (and other HID) lamps. The "typical" 110,000 lumen lamp only produces 71,000 lumens after 4,800 hours of operation... dropping the efficiency to 65 lumens per watt! (See Philips Lamp Specification & Application Guide 2004, for example, MH1000/U lamp). In other words, the metal halide lamp continues to draw full wattage but produces only 65% of "new" output after just 9 months of operation at 18 hours per day! Output continues to decline during the balance of the relatively short 12,000-hour lamp life. "Super T8" fluorescent lighting can provide 96-99 initial lumens per watt efficiency and end-of-lamp-life efficiency of 88-91 lumens/w. Average life is a whopping 30,000 hours (12 hrs. per start), and 29,580 lumens can be achieved from a 2x4 foot fixture. (Example: TCP 8-lamp Power Bay fixture with Ushio Ultra 8 F32T8/850 lamps. 3,698 lumens per lamp w. 1.2125 Ballast Factor). A 232-watt 6-lamp Super T8 fixture can more than replace the light output of a 465-watt metal halide fixture on a "one for one" basis. (Fixture efficiency - ability to direct the light where we want it - is also superior with Super T8 linear fluorescents). The energy savings are so substantial that a number of power companies in the US are offering major fixture rebates in support of this transition in business settings. |
Shrubs, I know this is an old post but I was hoping you could describe the science behind myth #1 - "All lamps of the same wattage give off more or less the same amount of heat." I recently came across an experiment that tested the heat output from a single 100 watt bulb against four 25 watt bulbs. The conclusion was that the single bulb produced much less heat. Here is a link to the details: How does this experiment differ from what you described in Myth #1? Thanks for any insight! Regards, Rokal |
I only read part of it. Didn't even bother to read it all. Because it seems to have failed to recognize that light, when absorpted by objects will turn into heat. The only time light is not converted into heat is when it's energy is used to cause a chemical change or it's converted into some form of kinetic energy and stored away (solar cell charging a battery) Otherwise, 100 watts will generate 100 watts of heat. dcarch |
- Posted by shrubs_n_bulbs z8/9 UK (My Page) on Fri, Aug 24, 07 at 16:32
First, myth #1 does not include incandescent bulbs. They are radically less efficient than any plant lighting and so they emit a lot less light than the same power of fluorescent or HID lighting. Put another way, an incandescent light system producing the same light as a fluorescent light system produces a lot more heat. I wouldn't read too much into a high school (grade school?) science project. The methodology is so full of holes you could use it as a sieve. I'll leave you the fun of tracking down why each and every part of the experiment is horribly flawed ;) The science is simple: 100W in, 100W out. In the case of all the light sources we are interested in, (ie. NOT incandescent), approximately 30% of the input energy is converted into light. The rest is converted directly to heat either warming up the ballast, warming up the bulb/tube, or being radiated directly as infra-red radiation. So within a few percent, the amount of heat produced by a fluorescent, metal halide, or HPS lamp is simply proportional to the actual power consumed. Note that the nominal power is not always the same as the actual power consumed, so a 1000W metal halide typically consumes over 1,100W of power (including the ballast), while a 32W T8 typically uses about 28W including the ballast. There are variations in the proportion radiated directly (HID lamps tend to radiate more infra-red which makes them "feel" hotter) and the temperature reached by the bulb (which is where the confusion tends to arise), but add it all up and you have to come to the same total. Its called conservation of energy and it is a fundamental rule of the universe. |
dcarch and Shrubs, Thank you both for replying and setting me straight on this topic. On to further reading of the "Conservation of Energy Principle"... Regards, Rokal |
- Posted by shrubs_n_bulbs z8/9 UK (My Page) on Tue, Aug 28, 07 at 12:35
I was just browsing through all ten myths again. Apart from the unfortunate typo in #4, most still seem fairly sound. But its interesting to see how far LEDs (myth #6) have come in the last two years. Although 90% of the marketing hype about LED grow lights is still extremely misleading and often just plain wrong, LEDs have gone from roughly five times less efficient than a fluorescent tube to almost as efficient in straight light output terms. There are LEDs in existence considerably more efficient than any fluorescent of HID lamp, but I'm not aware of any commercially available that exceed the efficiency of a good fluorescent. Other advantages do make them worth looking at if you are the experimental type and want to try something different in a small space. |
Would LED's work for growing orchids on a wall shelf? I have no south facing rooms and would like a small light so I could grow something on a shelf. Just wondered if LED's were getting that efficient. |
Nicely done shrubs_n_bulbs. My first fluoro set up was a bank of 12 twin tube strip fixtures mounted side by side. The bank is mounted on the ceiling, and my garden consists of a reinforced piece of 1/2 inch plywood, hanging by chains and hooks from the ceiling. The first time I turned on the bank and stood underneath it, it seemed as if I had just turned on the sun. I was just as if I was standing outside on a sunny day. A single fluoro is more like a line source, and a large bank of fluoros is like a plate source. |
- Posted by shrubs_n_bulbs z8/9 UK (My Page) on Sun, Sep 9, 07 at 16:18
just as if I was standing outside on a sunny day You won't get much of a tan though :) |
You won't get much of a tan though :) No, for that I would need to mount some U.V. lamps! Not so good for growing. I am planning on overdriving my fixtures 2x |
Here is a link that might be useful: Zink's thread.
- Posted by shrubs_n_bulbs z8/9 UK (My Page) on Mon, Sep 10, 07 at 13:03
Is it a myth that overdriving is inefficient? Fluorescent lights operate most efficiently at a particular power level, and then progressively less efficiently at higher or lower power levels. Tubes are typically manufactured for a nominal power level near the peak of the efficiency curve. High Output (HO) and Very High Output (VHO) are designed to operate at a nominal power level above the most efficient power, these are overdriven lamps by another name. That's worth remembering when you are drooling over a 54W T5HO lamp, a standard 28W T5 is considerably more efficient! The most efficient power level for a 48" T8 tube is around 35W-40W, and it operates pretty close to maximum efficiency anywhere from about 25W-50W. Note that this type of tube is generally run at 28W on power factor 0.88 ballast, as a "power saving" feature although it is in fact less efficient than running at a higher power. The power saving comes from being a direct replacement in the same fitting for an old 40W tube or a somewhat less old 36W, 34W, or 32W tube. So a T8 tube running at 54W is really not far from the peak efficiency levels and may actually be more efficient than running at the "out of the box" 28W power level. Certainly less efficient than running at the designed level around 35W-40W though. Some people have made a lot of running with this fact and tried to make out on the basis of a single case that overdriving does not reduce the efficiency of a fluorescent tube. There is also a much referred-to web article by someone who claimed to demonstrate that overdriving was in some cases more efficient and generally not much different from running a standard tube, although the experiments were actually flawed and really only proved that it is incredibly wasteful to run a single tube off a four-tube ballast :) Overdriving a 40W T12 significantly reduces the efficiency, these tubes are not generally underdriven by design and doubling the applied current takes them way beyond the most efficient part of the power curve. The same applies doubly so when you 3x or 4x overdrive, or if you were to overdrive the already overdriven T5HO tubes. You may be able to track down in the specifications of some manufacturers actual light output curves against the applied current, or lumens/W curves against current or power. You will find that peak efficiency comes at around 400mA, or a little less for thinner tubes. Off the top of my head, I think 400mA is the nominal current for T12 tubes while T8 tubes (ballasts really) in the USA run nominally at 265mA for 32W power and obviously at an even lower current (about 240mA) on a 0.88 ballast. You see that a 2x overdriven T8 could be running at only 480mA while an overdriven T12 would be more like 800mA. One is near peak efficiency, one is way off. Hope that wasn't too confusing :) |
Thanks, I think that really helps to shed a lot of light on this matter! It really makes sense to maximize the light per lamp, without getting into the inefficient range, because the alternative, of just packing in more lamps, leads to inefficiencies of the lamps blocking each others light output, and blocking the reflected light. |
- Posted by khyberkitsune Memphis, TN (My Page) on Sun, Sep 16, 07 at 3:40
With the current gen of LED the company I work for is developing, we can expect to outperform HID bulbs in terms of heat and efficiency across any board you point us to. Current tests on lettuces and tropical plants such as hibiscus show very promising results. (We've been at this for 15 years, I joined two years ago, and no, I don't work for SolarOasis.) We're already past the lumens/watt of HID bulbs. Space is an entirely different issue, on the other hand. Unless we, as of this post, can double the efficiency of LEDs, we're looking at about a 50% increase of needed overhead area to match HID lighting with it's ballast and reflector included, so right now the real issue is space. Our next project will be a flexible LED mesh that can be used to create customizable light domes for smaller plants, like violets or such. |
- Posted by shrubs_n_bulbs z8/9 UK (My Page) on Sun, Sep 16, 07 at 10:11
You mention "space". LEDs will always likely require spreading over a greater surface area than a little HID bulb, but they should also be able to be used in quite a thin sheet, possibly less than an inch thick. Provided that such sheets can produce light in excess of 2,000 lumens or so per square foot of LEDs then there shouldn't be a problem. The small size of HID bulbs is generally more of a problem than a convenience in plant lighting, requiring mounting at a distance from the plants with large reflectors. As always, availability and cost remains an issue. LEDs more efficient than HID lighting have existed for years, but so far as I know are still not available to schmucks like us, and certainly not at any sensible cost. We'd love to known where and when such high performance products are available. |
- Posted by jessicavanderhoff (My Page) on Tue, Apr 29, 08 at 14:45
All lamps of the same wattage do not give off about the same amount of heat. Those compact fluorescent bulbs were developed because they convert a larger percentage of the electricity they use into light, and a smaller percentage into heat. You can feel a clear difference if you touch the bulbs. I thought we were dispelling misinformation! http://home.howstuffworks.com/question236.htm |
Jessica, the cfl gives off less heat than an incandescent of the same lumen because it only uses one seventh of the wattage to generate the equivalent brightness, therefore the heat is only one seventh. Remember back in physics, the first law of thermodynamics: Energy is neither created nor destroyed. The light does not just disappear. A tiny part is converted to plant growth, and the rest ends up as heat. It has to. All of the points given in the diary are 100% accurate. A cfl is just more efficient. If you had 100w of cfl it would give the exact same heat as 100w of incandescent, 100w of HID, 100w of LED etc. The difference is the light efficiency, NOT the amount of heat. You would need 700w of incandescent to equal the light of 100w of cfl. I use 22 tubes of straight 48" fluorescent tubes for my grow. At 32 watts per tube, this means 704 watts total are used. My lamps feel barely warm, much cooler than a single 100 watt incandescent lamp even, much cooler than a 400 watt HPS lamp, but the total heat, for my grow is always going to be 704w. This wattage keeps my plants warm, and keeps the room in the cellar where I have my grow nice and warm. If I turned the lights off, and plugged in a 704w electric heater, the room would have the EXACT same temperature with the heater, as with the fluorescent lamps, even though you can feel the heat being given off by a heater, but can't feel anything being given off by my lamps. Cheers, Paul. |
Shrubs opines: "Plants use light at all wavelenghts from near ultraviolet (Lermer) The most efficient red light is about 670 nm. (Shrubs) Myth # "5. Blue light is for growth, red light is "Plants will grow under monochromatic red light. Plants (Lermer) Plants grown under monochromatic red will tend to |
Shrubs said: "The small size of HID bulbs is generally more of a (Lermer) Horizontal HID reflectors tend to be not large. |
Object 16 said: "It really makes sense to maximize the light per lamp, (Lermer) Lamp efficiency tends to drop off in the lower Multiple lights do not block each others' light output or |
I'm talking about packing 3 1/2 " t12 striplights together. There is a total of 3 " of transverse distance of fluorescent tube per 3 1/2" of total width of fixture, so the lamps get it the way of most of the reflected light. Instead, I now use a 6 1/2 " fixture with 2 t8's, so 2 inches transverse out of 6.5" total width of fixture, so this is only a third of the obstruction compared to the t12 3.5" striplight. Using a light meter, I get similar illumination with far less wattage, which proves my hypothesis to be correct. You keep repeating the myth that full spectrum is more efficient for growth, but it is not. Please stop repeating this over and over, because the scientific proof is that the fluorescent tube with maximum lumens is always the best for growth, compared to a full spectrum lamp of lower lumens per watt. This thread is supposed to dispel myths, not propagate them!!! |
(Lermer) In the "Ceramic Metal Halide Life-Lights" thread, Object 16 told us about his bank of t-8 fluorescents totalling 1000w. He measured foot candle readings: 6" = 3000 fc With only two t-8s, I got these readings: With a 1000w HPS, horizontal reflector with 98% reflective 6" = offscale of meter Obviously, the HPS has greater penetrating power. I'm When moving the 1000w HPS by a light-mover, the high The reason the bank of large number of fluorescents has Rather than using 1000w hps, I recommend instead multiple 1. Using multiple lower-wattage lights results in multiple 2. Multiple points of light creates several light 3. CMH has far better spectrum than HPS. I heard something yesterday. In the UK, buyers of HID BTW, Shrubs, tell us again your theory that glass barriers |
"Object 16"--did you actually read the article you posted? The article does not agree that "...plants have very nicely found a way TO USE ALL OF THE DIFFERENT SPECTRUMS EQUALLY WELL.." In fact, it showed two charts that refute what you claim. Here's another, one of many scientific references on the (Lermer) The extremes are UV and infra-red. These portions Ibid: (Lermer) Generally plants prefer a full spectrum light, For example, conventional Metal Halide, if used as the That being said, high intensity can compensate for Roughly speaking, you want a light source that is high in There are other factors, such as those relating to 4' fluorescents are a line source of light. A line is a What you want is a balance of features, between spectrum |
for sure different plants may have slightly different action spectrum for photosynthesis, but not the sharp bimodal peaks that lamp manufacturers want you to believe. Action spectrum of photosynthesis of the green alga Chlorella pyrenoidosa (quantum yield of oxygen production as a function of wave length). Please notice the drastic drop in the red part of the spectrum (R. EMERSON and LEWIS, 1943). |
Here is a link that might be useful: Notice how the green alga, even though it's green, uses green light even more efficiently than blue light for photosynthesis.
I can't find Object16's earlier link to the complete article. In the link you now post, the sharp drop-off is really in the infra-red, not red. What labels we apply to the various spectra have a subject element. This 1943 article does not conform to the verbal color labels that most other plant growth curves use. Most lamp manufacturers don't even talk about plant growth |
- Posted by mistascott 7A (My Page) on Wed, Feb 22, 12 at 4:00
This should be the bible of the Growing Under Lights section. Only change is that T5HO are becoming more and more affordable as an alternative to metal halide these days. |
- Posted by TheMasterGardener1 none (My Page) on Fri, Feb 24, 12 at 23:33
" For the same money, a good HID setup would be better and for less money you can get the same light from standard fluorescents. " I do not understand this at all? Let me break it down. "For the same money, a good HID setup would be better " AGREE "and for less money you can get the same light from standard fluorescents" Did I read this wrong??????? HPS= the most highest lumens per watt. HID is more economical then T5's. DO NOT BELIEVE ME LOOK IT UP. |
Still I keep looking any useful information for container gardening and I found this thread, I consider it is useful for me. Thank you all the forum members who were participated on this discussion and making this forum more valuable. Due to lack of knowledge of gardening I cannot share anything else here. I do not have any grow light, I use table florescent lamps for my baby plants :( After I read this thread I started to use Phillips Energy Lights HF3308. I am expecting positive result. Regards, |
I am running a 4' x 4' garden with T8. Total of 14 lamps. The lamps are overdriven x 2, the usual way (4 lamp ballast runs 2 lamps) I am using 5000K Litetronics T8 lamps, which have extra high lumen rating, and cost 3.50 per lamp. I measure light with a PAR meter. At 6" from the lamps, the PAR is 500 - which will easily grow any high light requirement plant. My Daylight-integral (total photons) for a 16 hour day is 30, and a DLI of 20 is actually sufficient to grow high quality tomato, so this is actually excessive light, by 50%. The total power for this garden is roughly 700W. Right now, I am growing peppers, tomato, and rosa rugosa Hansa. The stems on the plants are very thick and sturdy, the internodes are extremely close, and the roses are sending out additional canes from almost all of the bud-eyes. This is using standard shoplights, reballasted with used easy to get cheap ballasts from ebay. The complete set-up costs around $200, which is completely cheaper than any other available - and totally superior to HID in terms of uniform light coverage, and being able to grow the plant to within an inch of the lights. totally superior to LED due to cost and reliability. I am anticipating that I can grow 2-3 foot plants with this garden. - paul mozarowski. |
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Key's to the Game: How the Washington Redskins Can Upset the New Orleans Saints
September 7, 2012 in NFL, Uncategorized
Check Out Fanspeaks Redskins Blog for additional Skins content!
Here are my keys to the game for the Washington Redskins to go into New Orleans and upset Drew Brees and the Saints Week 1:
1. Keep It Simple for Robert Griffin:
It's Robert Griffin's first regular season start, and it occurs on the road in a very tough stadium to play in. The Washington Redskins would be wise to keep their offense simple to help Griffin transition to the NFL game. They should utilize a lot of quick screens and slants when he's asked to stand in the pocket. On other plays they need to focus on moving the pocket with simple one or two read bootlegs and rollouts. Though simplifying the offense will make it easier for the Saints Defense to take away certain things, it's worth doing if Griffin is his most comfortable and by extension effective.
2. Keep Griffin Upright:
The New Orleans Saints aren't known to have a great pass rush, but still do a solid job at getting pressure on the quarterback. With questions throughout the Washington dRedskins offensive line, this is going to be a crucial battle that will determine the success of the Redskins on Sunday. Pressure is an absolute killer for quarterbacks, and Robert Griffin has enough things to worry about already. Scheme wise hopefully a quicker passing game and moving the pocket more will help relieve some of the pressure, but it is hardly a guarantee. The Washington Redskins need to use their tight ends and backs more to stay in and block, or at least chip defenders on their way out on routes. It limits their offense some, but a limited offense with a quarterback standing is perferable to a more expansive offense with a quarterback running for his life or on the ground.
3. Run, Run, Run:
The only way to "Stop" the Saints offense is to keep them off the field as much as possible. The Redskins need to milk the clock with sustained 10-12 play drives, that neutralize Jimmy Graham and company. A stronger rushing attack also makes Robert Griffin's life quite a bit easier. Not only does he not have to do everything himself, but if the Saints need to stop the run, it could open some things up in the passing game. How successful Evan Royster, Roy Helu, and Alfred Morris are, will have a direct correlation to the Redskins chances of winning.
4. Bottle up New Orleans Rushing Attack:
There is really not a lot the Redskins can do to stop Drew Brees and the passing offense when they are on the field, but they can try to take away the Saints running game. It's not an easy task as the Saints were a top 5 unit (in yards per carry) last season. They maintain quality backs and a good offensive line, but if the Redskins Defense can find a way to stop them it could be enough to keep the Saints score manageable. The one caveat for the Washington Redskins Defense, is that they not only have to stop the Saints rushing attack, but they have to do so without bringing in any extra guys in the box. The can't afford to give Drew Brees any additional space in the defensive backfield, meaning the Redskins front seven will be on their own.
5. Don't Leave Points on the Field:
– You can't beat a team like the Saints on the road by settling for field goals and not finishing drives. When the Redskins get inside the red zone they have to make sure that they are finishing the drive in the end zone. The Redskins offense last year stalled out far too often last season as they got close to the end zone, but that simply can't happen if they want to win this game. Also, when they do go to attempt longer field goals in this game, new Washington Redskins kicker Billy Cundiff has to connect. He has no excuses to miss anything while playing inside a dome.
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SUPRA NYC Presents The Photography of Mike Miller
The second in a series of three exhibits of Mike Miller's photography opened last night at SUPRA NYC. A small collection of Mike's iconic hip hop imagery from the last two decades was on display upon the walls at 4 Prince Street. There was a large turn out of people from all over the city who took respite from the bad weather and enjoyed Miller's images of Easy E, Tupac, Snoop Dogg, and so many more. It was a memorable evening. Thank you to all who attended.
Mike will be appearing again in store for the Saturday Session (November 10, 3-5pm) with DJ Prince Paul signing copies of his book Michael Miller Photography, West Coast Hip Hop: A Story In Pictures for fans.
Limited edition t-shirts featuring the work of Mike Miller (including one shirt you can only get at the store) are available at SUPRA NYC. Mike Miller shirts are also available at suprafootwear.com.
The Mike Miller photography exhibition at SUPRA NYC runs until November 28.
Prodigy (Mobb Deep), Mike Miller, and Chris Vidal.
Raphie Aronowitz, Nigel Sylvestor, Hawaii Mike Salman, and Dante Ross.
Griffin Lotz (RollingStone) and friends.
Ryan Lyons (Respect Mag) and Mike.
Spencer Fujimoto and Chris.
Allen Ying (43 Magazine).
Jolina Hoang (MTV).
Mike and Shannon Miller.
Eli Reed and Dante Ross.
Alex Corporan (Rad Collector) and friend.
Mike Livingston and friend.
Mike and Prodigy.
Alison Schroeppel and Josh Fishel (10 Deep).
Mike Miller "Snacks" t-shirt.
See more of Mike Miller's Work at:
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"They saying he pointed the gun at the cop. He was running. I don't know about the law in that state. But let me explain for those reading. I'm from NYC and I live in P.A. two totally different states. In NY the only people that can have…"
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FIGHT? The French? Crikey, this must have been serious. Furious French students, farmers and unionists revolted as one in violence across the nation last week.
Protesters shut Orly airport and disrupted flights across the country, truck drivers blocked roads, all 12 oil refineries were paralysed by industrial action cutting off petrol to consumers, and a million people took to the streets throwing rocks, letting off flares, smashing windows, overturning cars, and injuring up to 100 police officers, who in turn fired back with tear gas.
If only these people had shown such ticker when the Nazis turned up in 1940. With the future of the free world at stake, the French surrendered.
If it weren't for the Anzacs and their mates, they'd be speaking German and collaborating with them to export Sparkling Rhinegold.
So what's upset them more than the threat of Adolf Hitler and National Socialism? The threat of work. You know - employment, toil, effort, labour. We call it yakka.
Put aside for the moment that many regard the French as untrustworthy, conceited and unreliable - unlikely as it sounds, last week they taught us a lesson.
We are all going to work well beyond the age at which our parents retired, and there will be real pain as we make the adjustment.
The French economy is most often characterised by its inefficient and recklessly subsidised farmers.
But can you believe that the friction last week was over their President, Nicolas Sarkozy, insisting the legal retirement age be raised from 60 to 62?
They already have the earliest retirement age, and over-generous pensions - so much so that the country was headed to bankruptcy. Indeed, economists say it has arrived and that there are too few taxpayers in France today to afford the pensions of those who no longer wish to work.
Early this year Greeks rioted in the streets - and people were killed - as they digested the news that they'd be working until at least 63.
Greece has other problems: not only are its pensions absurdly generous, it is still a corrupt society, and it spends too much on defence in case it need go to war with its NATO ally, and ancient foe, Turkey. That it will never be allowed to is beside the point.
Australia is not impeded by such security concerns, and we have already agreed - without so much as a rotten egg being lobbed - with the decision taken at the last Budget to ratchet up the age at which we qualify for the pension by six months every two years starting in 2017. In 2023, Australian men and women will need to be 67 to get a state pension.
No one has the courage to tell you yet, but that's just the start. An almost perfect storm of unimaginably expensive demographics is headed our way. The baby boomers - those born in the fertile years following World War II - start retiring next year.
As youngsters, they bought The Beatles' Sgt Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band album and were charmed by Paul McCartney's whimsical When I'm 64.
This year they are 64.
So there are a lot of them. Well, OK, us. But that's not the problem.
The problem is the years they can expect to live from here on.
The boomers were undoubtedly the foot soldiers who built the economies of the West over the past 40 years, but now they are a demographic time bomb whose persistent ticking should be keeping our politicians awake at night.
When aged pensions were introduced to Australia more than a century ago they were pegged at those aged over 65. Few lived to that age. Back then, the average life expectancy for men was 55 years and two months. For women it was 58 years and eight months.
Today, the average life expectancy for men is 78 years and seven months, and for women 83 years and five months.
The bad news for our economic planners is that, should you make 65, you are likely to live another 20 years.
When the Business Council of Australia suggested last year that the retirement age may need to be raised to 73, it was ridiculed, and quickly took some well-judged backward steps.
But the BCA was right, even if it got the number wrong. And it probably didn't.
Living as long are we do today means that many more of us fall victim to the main neurological disorders of old age - Alzheimer's and Parkinson's diseases.
They are incurable, degenerative and terminal. Patients will live on for years, but will spend many of them in states of high dependency - possibly at first with loving children or partners, but later in professional care.
That will be 24 hours a day, seven days a week, and every day of the year.
Boomers will, quite rightly, point out that they have spent a lifetime paying taxes and medical insurance, and that this is now their hour of need. But it won't be an hour. It won't be a week or a month. It will be uncounted years.
So to pay those bills we'll have to access much of the unused productive capacity sitting dormant in our economies; that is the fit, employable, would-be taxpayers who these days enjoy what we'll soon see as early retirement. We have no choice.
Australia's leading demographer, KPMG partner Bernard Salt agrees: "In 80 years we have extended life expectancy by 20 years.
"If you save a kid from measles that person then becomes an adult and pays 40 years of tax back into the system.
"When we extend the life expectancy of someone in their 80s or 90s, you're extending them so they can continue to draw down services from the state.
"I'm not saying its wrong. That's the economic fact."
Salt understands that a greater debate has begun to open up. All Australians may be equal, but is it right that 95-year-old has a right to use a $1 million piece of hospital equipment for six months to extend their life by that time? Or should we spend that money on a 25-year-old?
Salt says the 4.5 million Australian soon-to-retire boomers were born of a generation that lived through the Depression who valued "bizarre concepts like sacrifice and going without. Not the baby boomer".
"We as a society are very happy to pay you a pension from the age of 65. But you've got to promise to drop dead 10 years later. We haven't been keeping our side of the bargain!"
Salt sees older workers doing fewer hours and being taxed.
Talk about a game-changer; the baby boomers might deliver the baby bust.
Not only will all this fundamentally realign our economy, it will influence our thinking on what is a productive working life, migration, what incentives there should be for larger families, our attitudes to euthanasia, and will be the key driver of the debate about just how many people this country handle.
Kevin Rudd wanted a big Australia; Julia Gillard doesn't. But a small Australia won't pay the bills.
*Article by: Alan Howe, published in the 'Heraldsun' 25th October, 2010


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GAAFR Supplement (e-book format and softcover: 94 pages)
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GAAFR Supplement (softcover: 94 pages)
This set includes the GAAFR hardcover (2012. 1,121 pp.), GAAFR e-book (2012. 902 pp.), GAAFR Supplement e-book (2014. 76 pp.), and GAAFR Supplement softcover (2014. 94 pages)
The GAAFR (e-book) incorporates all of the guidance of the Governmental Accounting Standards Board (GASB) through GASB Statement No. 66.
The "GAAFR Supplement" updates the "Blue Book" for recent changes resulting from four new GASB pronouncements and the March 20133 release of a significantly revised and expanded version of COSO's "Internal Control-Integrated Framework."
An ideal guide for public managers seeking the practical guidance they need to assume a leadership role in the design, implementation, and maintenance of a comprehensive framework of internal controls.
This booklet provides a concise yet comprehensive overview of internal controls and fraud prevention in the public sector.
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There is probably no single number in a typical state or local governments financial statements that attracts more attention and discussion than fund balance.
This set includes the GAAFR hardcover (2012. 1,121 pages), GAAFR Supplement e-book (2014. 76 pages.), and GAAFR Supplement softcover (2014. 94 pages)


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Truth About Cellulite By Joey Atlas- Poison Your Life
Truth About Cellulite can poison your life, not only in the summer months. That should tell about it about truth about cellulite by Joey atlas Rather spare words and try to do something about this problem, because now is the best time when the fight against cellulite start to the summer again beautiful and charming!
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I guess everyone has one particular city with which they identify. For some, it's as easy as picking their hometown but for others, like me, the city that stole our heart is just around the corner. I love London. I love it fiercely and this article is an attempt to translate these feelings into words. My first visit to London dates back to 1998. I didn't get another chance to go back until ten years later, in February of 2008 and 2009. Last year in September marks my most recent trip to this fabulous city. I'm hoping I might be able to go Christmas shopping on Oxford Street this year, but nothing's set just yet. So without further ado, here's a breakdown of Why I Love London.
Public transport is a hugely important part of the urban machine. London's public transport is more than just a means of getting from point A to B. It has almost become a tourist attraction in its own right. There's those bright red doubledecker buses above ground and on some lines, such as Line 15, the famous Routemasters still remain in service. However, the Underground, or the Tube as Londoners affectionately call it, is the real jewel in the crown of Transport for London. Barring signal failures and delays, you can't imagine a better way to explore London. Navigating the Tube map only requires a bit of practice – the stations themselves and the attentative staff will do the rest but I promise, moving through the Underground as if you've always been a part of it is a feeling everyone should come to experience at some point. I look at all of these commuters and tourists, and I immediately know on whose side I'd rather be. As of late, it has become possible to buy a tourist version (that is, a lite version) of those rechargable Oyster cards, which makes travelling around even easier, since there's no more need to buy another card whenever you cross into another travel zone. Another novelty is WiFi in every station and train so now you can tweet or read your mail free of charge until that annoying signal failure is finally solved. Yes, I am quite in love with the Underground and its various lines and stations. Earl's Court and I share a special bond since that's the area where I usually stay when I go to London. I am not ashamed to admit that I might travel to a station just because of its name, location or cultural significance (Angel, Baker Street, Piccadilly Circus, St. Paul's, Covent Garden, Seven Sisters, Embankment, Camden Town, Nothing Hill Gate, South Kensington) and last but not least, whether or not it is an Art Deco jewel designed by Charles Holden (Southgate, Arnos Grove, East Finchley and Highgate, amongst others).
Despite it being a big city, London has lots of neat green areas. The biggest of them all is Hyde Park but that doesn't necessarily mean it's the best. There's nearby Holland Park, which, whilst being less volumous, has a ton of charm all by itself, not coincidentally due to the squirrel population that has come to call the park home. On the other hand, squirrels now live in just about every park and square in London so if you like these adorable rodents you needn't run too far to cross their path. My personal favourite square is St. James's Square off of Jermyn Street. There's plenty of shade here beneath the trees as well as benches in case grass isn't your kind of thing. In the vicinity of St. James's Square is my favourite park, the wonderfully spacious Green Park. At the top of the park is the similarly-named Underground station that services the Piccadilly, Victoria, and Jubilee Line. One evening last September I had lunch on one of the benches in Green Park, enjoying the sunset and the endless stream of Londoners crossing the park on their way home. At the other end of Green Park is Constitution Hill and beyond that, Buckingham Palace. But that, I grudgingly admit, is a sightseeing staple I have yet to discover.
To recap, I tend to want to look at London from a Londoner's point of view rather than through the tourist's shortsighted goggles. I don't need to hop from the Tower to Madame Tussaud's or the London Eye and Westminster in order to have a great day. Sure, I enjoy strolling up and down Oxford Street, or the Southbank near Big Ben to hear its famous chime, or join the curious crowd of hipsters at Camden Lock and attend a musical in the West End thanks to an internet friend who now lives in London. However, I am just as comfortable with the road less travelled. After I saw Tim Burton's Sweeney Todd I absolutely had to walk the length of Fleet Street and find out where the barber shop had allegedly been – fictional or not. I might travel down to Ravenscourt Park or Clapham Common to ogle Art Deco buildings (an architectural obsession inspired by the BioShock games). Similarly, I will gladly spend half an afternoon exploring the Natural History and other museums, or travel half across the city in search of a certain store, or, giving in to my inner sweet tooth, feel compelled to try out every Hummingbird Bakery I might find. Yes, as far as I'm concerned, this is the kind of city I would love to call home one day. For the time being, however, I have plenty of discoveries waiting to be made and I'm hellbent on picking up that thread as soon as possible.


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Anna Fitzgerald tells her history about all the eventsthat have happened in her life with her old sister, Kate Fitzgerald. She starts by telling her parents that she doesn't want to keep giving her body's organs to Kate. Shesues them, by getting a lawyer whose represents her in court. She has one more brother, but almost no one pays attention to him; because of the cancer of Kate. Kate wasdiagnosed of leukemia at three years. Kate has been the center of all the attentions in family.
Their mother does everything she can for Kate; she thinks even death can't go throughher. She fights against her daughter. Sara was the mother's name. Sara says that she has to handle with the family wellness and Anna has to think about her sister's health.That is the most important thing she has. But Anna never gave up. It seems weird in the whole movie, until her brother in the middle of the court tells the truth to everyone.The judge wants to meet Kate for her final decision. Kate wanted to be free. Fight against cancer is tired, is devastated. So, she decides to die and tells her sister thatis the only one who ever could help her. And Kate plans everything. At the end, after some happy moments, Kate dies and the family gets the happiness they wanted.
The mainpersonage is Anna. She is the one who tells the story and always saves Kate and she is who set her free.
I liked it because is something that can happen in real life andis a good romantic movie. Everyone can note the support between siblings. The brother, even when no one paid attention to him, he always was there for his sisters.
END! [continua]
Cite este ensayo
(2010, 02). Resumen de película my sister's keeper. BuenasTareas.com. Recuperado 02, 2010, de http://www.buenastareas.com/ensayos/Resumen-De-Pel%C3%ADcula-My-Sister%27s-Keeper/112807.html
"Resumen de película my sister's keeper" BuenasTareas.com. 02 2010. 2010. 02 2010 <http://www.buenastareas.com/ensayos/Resumen-De-Pel%C3%ADcula-My-Sister%27s-Keeper/112807.html>.
"Resumen de película my sister's keeper." BuenasTareas.com. BuenasTareas.com, 02 2010. Web. 02 2010. <http://www.buenastareas.com/ensayos/Resumen-De-Pel%C3%ADcula-My-Sister%27s-Keeper/112807.html>.
"Resumen de película my sister's keeper." BuenasTareas.com. 02, 2010. consultado el 02, 2010. http://www.buenastareas.com/ensayos/Resumen-De-Pel%C3%ADcula-My-Sister%27s-Keeper/112807.html.


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Browsing articles in Lee Harrington
Dog's Life: Humane Tuned In
Many of us have experienced this conundrum: We love animals and want to help them— especially our local shelter animals, many of whom experience trauma, confusion, pain and fear. And yet, the very thing that drives us to help—their suffering—can also be the thing that prevents us from actually going into the shelters to help. It's hard to witness suffering, plain and simple. It's hard to stand in...
Culture: Stories & Lit Letting Sleeping Dogs Lie
For the past few years, my dog Chloe and I have been going south for the winter, staying in rentals ranging from cottages at artists' colonies in Florida to cabins at spiritual retreat centers in South Carolina. I don't pack lightly for these annual trips. Thus, I always hire someone to help me load my van.
"Just how many dogs do you have?" asked my most recent moving man as he maneuvered yet...
Culture: DogPatch Manhattan's Vet On the Go.
Jeffrey Levy, a Manhattan-based DVM and Certified Veterinary Acupuncturist, is one of only a handful of veterinarians who makes house calls in New York City. And, as the lead singer and founder of Pet Rox, an animalcentric band, he's also one of the more unusual. A specialist in canine rehabilitation, Dr. Jeff (as he likes to be called) offers both conventional and alternative medical treatments...
Culture: Reviews Lyrical Poetry
The Pulitzer Prize-winning poet Mary Oliver is arguably one of the most beloved living poets in the English language. She is certainly, according to the New York Times, "America's best-selling poet," and the reasons for that are numerable. Renowned for her love of nature, Ms. Oliver writes exquisite, lyrical poems that not only capture the beauty of, say, a rushing waterfall or a blade of grass...
Culture: Stories & Lit Chloe has an encounter with a marrowbone, Lee expands her tool chest.
Lately—because it's a new year—I've been considering canceling my health insurance. I know it sounds crazy, but I never—and I mean never— go to the doctor, at least not allopathic doctors. Whenever I have some ailment I'll visit an acupuncturist or a homeopathic practitioner or the like, and those visits often cost less than the co-pay for a Western doctor. Plus, there's the fact that most...
Culture: Stories & Lit Part VIII: Scarf the Herald Angels Sing
Holiday season is known—in the abundant countries at least—as a season of excess eating. There are the countless office parties with their vegetable-and-dip/cheese-and-cracker crudité tables and heaping buffets. There are the more intimate family celebrations, with traditional dishes such as the Christmas goose, Christmas ham, the Hanukkah brisket or, in my crowd, the Tofurkey. All of these...
Culture: Stories & Lit
All of my life, i have dreamed of having at least two dogs, but always knew I would have to wait for the right situation. For me, the "right situation" involved living in the country rather than in New York City, in a house surrounded by lots of land and with all the time in the world on my hands. Or at least, enough time to train my second dog and help him adjust to his life with Chloe and me (...
Culture: Stories & Lit Getting the Dog You Need
Those of us with exuberant dogs (herding dogs, hunting dogs, tracking dogs … well, just about any dog, really) truly appreciate their exuberance. We even appreciate their excessive need for entertainment and exercise; it helps get us up and moving, after all. But admit it, my fellow exuberant-dog caretakers: don't you sometimes just want to sit down and relax? Especially during the lazy days of...
Culture: Stories & Lit Part V: Springer Has Sprung
Like many people with rescued dogs, i do not know the exact age or birth date of my French Spaniel mix, Chloe. When I adopted her in the fall of 2004, I was told she was between six months and one year old — which is a wide margin, considering how much a dog grows in that first year. And while part of me wanted to believe she was at least a year old (because she weighed 55 pounds at the time and...
Culture: Stories & Lit Sight Unseen
It's not unusual these days for perfect matches — between humans and humans, animals and humans, even animals and animals — to be made online. Typically (in the Match.com department, at least), the humans actually meet before agreeing to make a full-time/ lifelong commitment. So is it crazy to adopt a dog you've never actually met face-to-face?
I did exactly that. I adopted my dog Chloe before I...
Pages |
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Cat5 & 6 Structured Cabling
SAS-Norsat Communicationsspecializes in the design and installation of structured cabling systems with an emphasis on the resource sector.
As a Licensed Master Cabler, SAS-Norsat Communications is able to provide a range of data and phone wiring services for commercial and domestic applications. Our licensed cablers are fully endorsed to provide telephone, networking, Category 5e, Category 6, and many other structured cabling systems, tailored to your needs.
data technicians are licensed cablers are also endorsed to install and modify fibre optic cabling systems. Fibre optic links can be very useful when data transmission over a long distance is required. Fibre optic cable has large bandwidth, and is therefore suitable to carry large amounts of data.
Most office and warehouse facilities are now being specified with at least two Cat5e or Cat6 data sockets for each workstation. These systems are very flexible, and by using a network cable patch panel, which is often located in the server rack, sockets can quickly be connected, disconnected, or swapped by IT staff. This makes it easy when you need to move staff or workstations around.
Cat 5e provides suitable bandwidth for high-speed internet. Cat 5e solutions are generally well suited to environments where interference issues exist. For example; Server Rooms often have adjacent telecommunications and electrical systems. Cat 5E cable has good immunity to noise, and cable runs do not normally require any specialised protection or shielding. Cat6 features more stringent specifications for crosstalk and system noise, and is suited to Gigabit Ethernet.
Contact SAS-Norsat Communications today to find out more.


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Sun, Jan 23, 11 at 14:57
We have just re-painted our living room and parlor a gold color (overjoy) seems to have just a sense of green in it in certain light. We are looking to put in ceiling molding in. The ceiling is a swirl popcorn white and trying to decide on the color. We have thought of going a shade darker than the walls or maybe white or stained wood. Any suggestions rooms are @ 10'x12'each. They are sort of adjoining separated by the staircase. |
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A pair of executive MACs lead eastbound loads.
Loaded iron ore train U-KEEMAD storms up to single track at Winona. I'm sure glad they had the right unit leading!
Loaded Coal train heads east through Igloo,SD at 207 PM
BNSF 9670 hits sunlight and fresh air as it exits the Mullan Tunnel and crests the Continental Divide. Behind them, black clouds of exhaust begin emit from the tunnel. Although this smoke show is ... (more)
It took a total of 10 locomotives to get this coal train across the continental divide. With Helena as the backdrop, BNSF 9670 is knuckled down against the grade. 71 cars back the mid-train helper... (more)
A southbound coal drag rides the rollercoaster that is Northern Texas with a tumbleweed caught in the plow.
A coal drag slowly moving into the BNSF Northtown Yard
Empty Unit coal Train from Columbia Power Plant near Portage, WI heads north towards St. Paul, MN. (Canon EOS20D, 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM)


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Herb Pharm Receives Herbal Industry Leader Award
American Herbal Products Association Honors Herb Pharm for Outstanding Business Practices
Located in rural southern Oregon, Herb Pharm is a certified organic grower of medicinal herbs, and produces a line of herbal extracts and herbal healthcare products which are distributed under the Herb Pharm brand. We grow most of our herbs on our 85-acre Oregon Tilth certified organic farm and also do practical research on the propagation and cultivation of endangered wild medicinal plants. More information is available at www.herb-pharm.com.
April 24, 2008 /Natural Newswire/ - Herb Pharm, manufacturer of America's number one selling brand of liquid herbal extracts, recently received the Herbal Industry Leader Award from the American Herbal Products Association (AHPA). Herb Pharm founders and owners, Ed Smith and Sara Katz, received the award during AHPA's membership meeting at the Natural Products Expo in Anaheim, CA. The award is presented to a company who consistently demonstrates outstanding business practices.
AHPA's president, Michael McGuffin, stated that "For the third year, we are honored to recognize top-notch representatives of the herbal industry with AHPA awards. In particular, Herb Pharm is being recognized for its commitment to quality, rigorous standards, and heartfelt authenticity throughout its nearly 30 years of existence. Ed and Sara are as high quality as their herbal extracts and tonics, and AHPA commends them on their exemplary leadership."
Ed Smith, Herb Pharm co-founder and Chairman, responded by saying "While it's always nice to be recognized for your life's work, it's especially nice to be recognized by our friends and colleagues in the herb industry."


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NEW YORK–Swarovski will unveil its star for the Rockefeller Center Christmas Tree on Tuesday, Nov. 20.
"The elements of design and craftsmanship of the 2012 Swarovski Star are timeless, and we know that visitors from around the world will enjoy its incredible sparkle," said Wayne Page, senior vice president of Swarovski North America Limited's consumer goods business. "This is the ninth year the Swarovski Star will top the Rockefeller Center Christmas Tree, we are thrilled to be part of this tradition once again."
The 2012 Swarovski Star is comprised of 25,000 crystals, with 1,000,000 facets, and it measures 9 ½ feet in diameter and 1 ½ feet deep. The Star weighs 550 pounds, including 300 pounds of crystal panels, and is composed of six outer rays and six smaller inner rays. A replica of the Swarovski Star will also be on display in Rockefeller Center to allow visitors the opportunity to get a closer view of the detailing.


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i have a vented 3" line that i would like to combine with a vented 4" under a basement floor. i would add a toilet, tub & shower into the 3" as it travels to the 4" (all short runs) and use an AAV on the lavs. seems like i remember you telling others that this type of wet venting was fine. my original post is down about one page titled "basement venting" with a link to a sketch. thank you, oldnortskie |
Follow-Up Postings:
- Posted by manhattan42 (My Page) on Mon, Feb 21, 11 at 21:49
'Wet Venting' is fine for bathroom groups located on the same horizontal branch, but an AAV is not 'wet venting'. In fact, I highly doubt LazyPup would recommend any AAV since AAVs are not permitted under his Uniform Plumbing Code (if my merory serves me). That said, you drainage arrangement is fine, but I would still look to dry vent all fixtures in the bathroom group by connecting them to the existing vent system before it exits the roof, and avoid wet venting under all circumstances and whenever possible. |
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Eliška & Sarah
This photo was shot on film. Taken by emkei with a Canon A-1 loaded with Kodak Elitechrome EBX film (available in our Online Shop) in Lúka nad Váhom, Slovakia. These tags describe this photo: portrait, summer, luka nad vahom, 35mm, emkei, sarah, eliska, cross process, x-pro, xpro, elitechrome, kodak, kodak elitechrome 100 xpro, a1, canon, and canon a1. Date: 2012-05-08. Time: Afternoon. This photo can also be found in the album canon a1 / ebx 100 xpro.Please login to get more out of this site
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Obama's sense of 'fairness' is unfair to minorities
President Obama's policies have been devastating to minority communities and to the most vulnerable in our society. America is suffering through the longest period of high unemployment since the Great Depression: Unemployment has been stuck over 8 percent for almost three-and-a-half years under Obama, after averaging only 5.3 percent under President George W. Bush. Minority communities have been hit much harder: African-American unemployment is 14.4 percent, and black youth unemployment is an obscene 44.2 percent. Latino unemployment is 11 percent. I recited these figures recently to a gathering of Pacific Islanders in Nevada, which is being crushed by the highest unemployment rate and worst housing crisis in the country. They didn't need to hear these numbers to know that their community is hurting. If you had tried to tell these folks, three-and-a-half years into the Obama presidency, that their ongoing misery was President Bush's fault, they would rightly have considered that to be an insult to their intelligence.


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Ford Fusion Overview
The stylish Fusion is a delight to drive. All versions feel solid and upscale, with a supple ride, agile handling, and a quiet cabin. The main engines are a 1.5- and 2.0-liter turbo four-cylinders, both mated to a six-speed automatic. We averaged 24 and 22 mpg overall, respectively, which isn't stellar. The 1.5-liter does the job, but the 2.0-liter is punchier. We measured 39 mpg overall in the Hybrid, which is excellent, but far from the EPA's 47 mpg rating. All versions have a nicely finished cabin with comfortable seats, but the rear is somewhat snug. Reliability has been average for all versions as of late.
A subscription to ConsumerReports.org includes Consumer Reports road test reports (based on over 50 different tests).
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As I surveyed real friends, Facebook friends, Twitter friends, and total strangers about having sex on the first date, the unfortunate cow comparison came up no fewer than five times in my first twelve interviews. Everybody complained about it, bemoaning the lack of nuance, the icky imagery, and the overt transactional implications. And yet, it kept rearing it's ugly little antiquated head. Are there kernels of truth buried there? Is first-date sex a relationship nonstarter? Are we, as we often claim to be, past the era of plastering A's on each other's chests? Keep reading »
Zergnet: Simply Irresistible
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