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ISO Taiwanese or Korean style "shave ice"
I have visited Hawaii numerous times, even lived there for a time. Among the foods I miss most is the shave ice I could get at Waiola Market and especially at Tropicana's at the foot of St. Louis Heights. I took a Taiwanese friend to Waiola's one time and he was not impressed; He said that the shave ice in Taiwan was better. But also what is interesting is that both Waiola and Tropicana are run by immigrant Asians, not Hawaiian locals. And I consider these places better than the more popular Matsumoto's because of the smooth texture of the ice, more like light sorbet than snow cone.
I know there are chowhounds out there who have had Taiwanese or Korean "shave ice", although I know they wouldn't necessarily call it that (Hawaiian phrase). If there are any leads where I could find these, even in the greater LA area like Ventura, I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks
There are a lot of shaved ice at Taiwanese restaurants in the San Gabriel Valley.
I believe Sin Ba La and the place Konjac right now to it serves it in Arcadia off of Duarte and Baldwin.
Shau Mei on Valley in San Gabriel also serves this. As does Shau Mei in Monterey Park on Garfield/Garvey.
The Shau Mei in the food court next to 99 Ranch in Arcadia also serves this.
re: WHills
Yep... the Shau May on Garfield/Garvey (which my wife and I call "Kentucky-fried Shau May" due to the bucket on the roof) is our usual destination for Taiwanese slush; for Korean ice (called "bing su"), we usually go to Ice Kiss, on 6th and Catalina (3 blocks from the Wilshire/Vermont stop on the Red and Purple lines)... but do be aware they serve it in a dog food bowl.
re: Das Ubergeek
Third the rec for Shau May. It is the quintissential Taiwanese shaved ice (bao bing) for me, and I've never developed a taste for konjac that some of the other places are doing now.
re: TracyS
4th the rec for shau may.
re: Das Ubergeek
5th rec on Shau Mei (which used to be a KFC, thus the bucket) -- and yes, I too prefer the one on Garfield/Valley in Alhambra. Love it with glass/grass jelly, almond tofu & "ton yuan" (glutinous rice "soup balls") and of course, the sweetened condensed milk!
re: AquaW
We go to Shau Mei on valley and garfield. Very good. Recommend the lychee, small tapioca, and pudding. Don't forget to get a lot of condensed milk on top. Interestingly, in the Hawaiian islands, from my experience, only in Kauai'i does it seem to be popular to get the condensed milk "snow cap", but it makes the shave ice so much better. Guppies in Cerritos is also delicious.
re: azibo
There's also a shau may in Rowland Heights in Hong Kong Supermarket Plaza (colima, between Fullerton & Nogales).
We went to the one at North Shore Oahu which I thought was Matsumoto - was a lot finer grain than the taiwanese shaved ice at Shau May, the texture was more pillowy soft than icy. In Hawaii they top it with fruit flavorings (even li hing mui - sour plum) and also ice cream (optional). The chinese version definitely has more chew, especially when you throw in the rice balls.
re: notmartha
I agree the one in Rowland Heights is good as well, although parking can be crazy around there for some reason. The spots are all weird sizes. I wish they did syrups here too. Li hing is delicious. The sharpness of the blade is really the trick to the texture. They are really 2 different dishes, though, the hawaiian and taiwanese. But both are good.
Not all the Shau Mei (or Shau May) are the same in the SGV.
For Taiwanese shaved ice I prefer te Shau Mei on the corner of Garfield and Valley, next to the Starbucks.
In Temple City, I lik the Taiwanese shaved ice at Won Won Kitchen, which I wrote about here: http://www.chowhound.com/topics/355692 .
Of course Sin Ba La in Arcadia and Rowland Heights is also a good stop for shaved ice.
There is also a place in the Focus Plaza (SW corner of Valley and Del Mar) that specializes in Taiwanese shaved ice, but the name completely escapes me this early in the morning ...
re: ipsedixit
I think it's called 108 Ice Cream and Cafe since it (surprise) occupies space #108 in that shopping center. Also across the street in the shopping center next to the Hilton is Pa Pa Walk, a Taiwanese snack place that has good shaved ice.
re: Chandavkl
a second for pa pa walk! their mango shaved ice is yummy...condensed milk, mangoes and a scoop of ice cream to top it off. it's pretty big too. i think they must shave down a small iceberg to make it.
re: ipsedixit
yep, tahts the one i go to when i need a shaved ice fix. doesn't hurt that you can get a double espresso in the same complex.
I love Simbala's shaved ice. It's the only place I've been to where the shaved ice is comparable to Taiwan. There's also Guppies in Cerritos, I haven't actually had their shaved ice but I've seen pictures and they're these gargantuan mounds of shaved ice covered in sweetned condensed milk and fruit
re: crystaw
Guppy is good. (I've only been to the one on South Street). Trouble is that there's so many kids hanging around there.
re: Chandavkl
I really disliked Guppy the one time I went, but it was in the winter. I could see how in the summer, with lots of fresh and good fruit around, it would be delicious. When we went, the only thing worth eating was the ice and condensed milk, which I could eat at home. The strawberries and mangos were all kind of pale and hard, and the bananas were browning around the edges. Yes, a huge mound of ice is fun to look at, but unless it tastes good too don't bother.
I like the green tea bingsoo at Gaam (upstairs at the Chapman building on 6th and Alexandria). The place doubles as a antique and art gallery/store of sorts as well.
Nicole's bingsu at Nicole's on the first floor of the Ktown Plaza is pretty good for a more traditional paht-bingsoo
re: Ogawak
ice kiss! definitely the best korean shaved ice.
mr. coffee is also good.
re: greengelato
not enough paht!
...and the one for two people is served in a DOG BOWL, for heaven's sake! (at Ice Kiss, that is)
re: PseudoNerd
Yeah, the dog bowl is a bit off-putting. More off-putting, however, are the Froot Loops.
re: Das Ubergeek
Yeah, it's Fruity Pebbles or nothing! :D
But honestly, I prefer Mr. Coffee because their fruit is fresher, staff a little more on top of things, and ambiance much more conducive to sitting and chatting.
re: Das Ubergeek
re: PseudoNerd
you can ask for extra pat at any joint and they'll give it to you. i always ask for extra dduk and pat.
i don't know about too many of the korean places, but i've been going to shau may for years and honestly, it can't even begin to compare with the shaved ice in hawaii, condensed milk or not, which (waiola if i remember correctly, although matsumoto was good too - heard it's closed) is super fine and super smooth. if there's anywhere with a real finely shaved ice like that in town i'd love to know!
re: rameniac
Since I don't live in the SGV or Koreatown, I will have to do my taste testing on weekends. I will be sure to give a report in the coming week or two.
re: rameniac
Shaved ice in February...only in LA!
I finally got to taste SinBaLe's shaved ice. I liked it for the brown sugar syrup, which gives it a caramel taste, if you like that. I think though, for toppings alone, like peanuts, red beans..etc (besides the brown sugar) the Shau Mei on Valley is better..On the other hand, toppings like the mini rice cakes, or taro balls, Sin Ba Le is very good.
As for fine-ness of the ice, Bin Bin Konjac, just next door to Sin Ba Le has the smoothest and finest texture! Even though their emphasis is on the healthful Konjac (Konyaku in Japanese) Jelly, their ice was the finest grain I've had here in LA. This place is not as busy and though had a big menu of combinations, had only 3 selections available that night.
If I had my way, I'd get the shaved ice from Bin Bin Konjac, pile it high like the Eiffel tower, top it with condensed milk and red bean from Shau Mei, and add some of that brown sugar syrup and taro balls from Sin Ba Le....
re: HLing
I usually custom order mine at Bin Bin Konjac - shaved ice with green bean and red bean, konjac, and green tea ice cream. If I smile nicely, and make conversation, they'll pile it really high...
They also offer other sweets, like the mango shaved ice, which almost always runs out by evening. They are also very generous with the warm soups, which are filled with different items like beans, herbs, etc..but it's not 'herb-tasting' at all.
re: rameniac
in jtown in downtown la try mikawaya, its actually a manju place (mochi), but they have really finely shaved ice though they won't have as many toppings as a chinese or korean place (personally im fine with that as long as there is red bean and condensed milk). Btw i've had shaved ice many times in taiwan and once in korea and mikawaya much more finely shaved 99% of places in either country
We recently had a pretty good rendition of Hawaiian shaved ice at, of all places, boba loca (the one in Westwood). It had lychee, mango, red bean, and a ton of other fruits I can't recall...topped off with vanilla ice cream and condensed milk. It was very fulfilling. :)
Tried Sinbala in Arcadia, based on many recs here. Coming from a Hawaiian Shave Ice background, I found the choices interesting. I chose the standard since I was a bit unfamilar with the options. The ice was pretty fine, but I think Waiola and Tropicana are still finer. I might have enjoyed it more if Sinbala had fruit syrup options, like passion fruit or strawberry ala Hawaiian style, but it was still a good treat.
I may try 108 or PaPa Walk on my next visit to the SGV. I come from Santa Monica.
Since I am searching for finely shaved, I may pass on Shau Mei, based on what Rameniac posted above.
re: Ogawak
just so you know what to expect, i don't recall papa walk's shaved ice being that finely shaved. but i still think it's worth trying!
I'm a huge Sinbala fan. I tried Shau Mei this weekend for the first time and wished I had driven to Arcadia. The ice was chunky and I wasn't crazy about the topping choices, although I love the mango pudding. It seems like you get more toppings at Sinbala, plus the brown sugar, for less money. I also missed the atmosphere of smiling drink pitchers and the waitstaff coming around with hot tea.
Hey all, i'm a big fan of taiwanese shaved ice but i live miles away from LA. europe to be precise. anyway, this is a pretty knowledgeable blog site here so was hoping you guys could help me out as i'd like to go about making my own shaved ice here.
first up, when i was in kaohsiung there was ba bao bing which was simple ice shaved with toppings and then there was another variety whose name i couldn't pronounce (so i just used to refer to it as ba bao bing too) which was much smoother ice. its this second one i like most. can someone tell me what its name was and did the block of ice they were shaving comprise frozen water and condensed milk together?
second, the machines used to shave these boys were industrial looking jobbies (reminded me of metal work class at high school) whereas the ones for sale on the internet are pretty plastic looking, will they do a good job?
third, thanks in advance for all your replies and have a manguo ba bao bing for me. it'll be a while til i get my next one.
re: sean89
Ba bao bing means "bing (shaved ice) with eight treasures". The ice is just water -- condensed milk is squirted on top. Here in LA you typically choose three toppings or four toppings, plus milk and sometimes sugar syrup (which I don't like).
I've had good luck with the plastic-looking jobbies... the industrial-grade ones are for constant use, and you probably (I assume) wouldn't be doing that.
re: sean89
The name for the smoother ice is either Xue3 Hua1 Bing* 雪花冰, or Mian2 Mian2 Bing1*棉棉冰. (*I'm using Chinese Ping Yin, not the Taiwanese system, the difference you can see in the way you spell "Kaohsiung" vs "Gao Shong" . So,I've included the Chinese character if you want to do a Chinese google search) I found these pictures that looked pretty wonderful. It was from a shop in Kaohsiung: http://www.wretch.cc/blog/HPCHUN&...
This kind of ice is made, either shaved, or crushed, with the ice blocks that's a mixture of water, milk and sugar. It has a different texture. You're probably not going to get that texture with a regular shaved ice machine, but here is something made by Rival for reference:http://buy.yahoo.com.tw/gdsale/gdsale...
But here's something to try if you don't want to buy a machine, http://www.chowhound.com/topics/366413
In fact I think you helped me solved my own puzzle...that when I froze the freshly whipped heavy creme, I got myself some Xue Hua Bing!
Have fun!
re: HLing
Xue Hua Bing! fantastic, thats it exactly. If i owned a company i'd offer you a job but i don't so platitudes will have to do i'm afraid ;)
I used to eat this every day for breakfast during the summer in kaohsiung (teeth aren't so good now) and the photos were spot on. Thanks for all the good work and links HLing, as well as the plug for the plastic jobbies Das.
Now i just need to perfect the mixture, will go with the 'can never have too much milk and sugar' approach. If all goes well i may even open up a little stand out here in europe. If you're all over you can have one on the house.
Thanks again,
re: sean89
Funny you should say that....I do need a job..but I guess I'll wait for that xue hua bing on the house in the future!
Shaved ice for breakfast in the summer is almost worth it for the not-so-good teeth, but there's no reason you should suffer the condition that takes away much pleasure of eating. I had sensitive teeth from falling asleep keeping a sour plum in my mouth as a child.(xuan mei) For the longest time I couldn't bite into any apples, and definitley no strawberries without suffering the soreness of the teeth.....I think using the tooth paste Elgydium is what remedied it. If you are in Europe you should be able to get Elgydium toothpaste (French) much easier than here in the States.
Keep experimenting and keep us posted!
re: sean89
wow, an old thread resurrected! and now there IS snow ice in LA indeed...
As for Sean89, who is in Europe, perhaps the thread on snow ice cream could spark ideas... http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/670108
re: Ogawak
you can but it at any asian market
re: Ogawak
Ogawak, did you ever try the shaved ice at Bin Bin Konjac? I'm curious to hear if you that's finer shaved ice to you.
re: HLing
Report: Bin Bin Kojac. I got to try it today. thanks for the tip, HLing and others. I did enjoy it a bit more than SinBala next door. I tried the red bean which included konjac (really delicious) and mochi balls. But it is different than Hawaiian shave ice. Bin Bin doesn't make me quit longing for the Hawaiian kind, but whenever I am in the Arcadia, Bin Bin will certainly be a regular stop. And Waiola and Tropicana (favorite shave ice in Honolulu) are still more fine than Bin Bin. So still searching.
You should also try the Bakery inside the supermarket at Galleria Korean Plaza. They have fresh berries and dduk (sweet rice cake). Its my favorite but you have to find a place to sit yourself since the place is really carry out... but just take it upstairs to the food court and enjoy!
There was a place that we went yesterday called Pa Pa Walk. They have several different preset shaved ice dishes and I think that you can designate what you want also like at Shau May, But they have a signature mango shaved ice with mango, condensed milk and syrup. You can also have the option to get snowy ice which is more expensive but is alot fluffier and lighter. It totally changes the consistency of the shaved ice, makes it alot better. It's in a small right connected to the Hilton Hotel off of Del Mar and Valley in San Gabriel.


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Home > Rules & Legislation > Letters from the Commissioner > Informational Letters > Letter 114
TO: Superintendents of Schools
FROM: Susan A. Gendron, Commissioner
DATE: June 8, 2007
RE: Next Steps in the Reorganization Process
The Maine Legislature has passed the two year State budget, including legislation regarding the reorganization of school administrative units. With the debate behind us and the passage of the law, now begins the hard work of implementing the reorganization law. It is, without doubt, an aggressive timetable to which we must all adhere; it is new territory and there will be unforeseen and significant challenges along the way.
I wanted to reach you as quickly as possible to give you a quick summary on what to expect next in this process.
We have been asked about maps, and I'd like to clarify that we are not planning to create new maps. The maps that were created as part of the "suggested model" several weeks ago, at the request of legislative leadership, were based on statutory criteria, which have not changed significantly. Remember that these maps are simply tools to provide a starting point for discussions among local school units; they are not proposed partnerships.
At this time, I encourage you to continue (or start, if you haven't already) conversations with nearby SAUs about the possibility of regionalizing, and to have conversations within your own community about how best to achieve savings as required in the legislation without adversely affecting our students in the classroom.
Norm and Ray continue to be available to you during the process to help answer your questions and continue your planning. They can be reached at 624-6638.
I look forward to our continued efforts as we work together to implement this new legislation.
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Posted by MUSCLEMAN, 1 ReplyI AM A 40 YEARS OLD MALE WHOS BEEN SAVED BY A BODYBUILDING LIFE STILE. I LIVE IN MANHATTAN NY. GOT THE VIRUS ON 1995 AND I FIND OUT ON 1998 THAT I GOT AIDS IN SAINT VINCENTS HOSPITAL. GOT ON THE EMERGENCY ROOM WITH NEUMONIA, FIBER,, SORE THROAT AND... Read more »
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Soma Bringer is an Action RPG for the Nintendo DS developed by Monolith Soft (of Xenosaga fame) and published by Nintendo.
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A little about me...
I grew up as the daughter of a Marine. That gave me a very different life than most people have. I love children and animals. I am a singer and love to sew and crochet. I have a very beautiful granddaughter, 4 yrs old, an adorable grandson, 8 months old, and my granddaughter's parents have recently announced that they are expecting another baby. I love to travel, although I don't get to do it much, anymore. I am starting a new career in medical transcription. I do have to admit that I have more than a few pounds I need to lose, but my son assures me that I fit the "a few extra pounds" better than "Big and Beautiful".
About the one I'm looking for...
I hope to find someone to share the rest of life with. I want to be able to have support from, and give support to, someone else. However, I would also be happy to find some friends along the way.
I'd just like to add...
I am really not into sports, but am happy to watch them with someone whose company I enjoy!
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We were booked here for one week 23.11 to 30.11 We arrived early . The receptionist said that he had rung our uk tel. 2 hours earlier to confirm our booking but had no reply .He then said do not worry i have booked you into a 4 star hotel 1.5 miles away. We asked to see the manager and... More
Location: Spain > Canary Islands > Tenerife > Los Gigantes
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As I mentioned in my column this week, Maricopa County Attorney Bill Montgomery's Islamaphobic "expert," disgraced ex-FBI agent John Guandolo, recently accused Channel 12's Brahm Resnik and Fox 10's Mia Garcia of being "media collaborators," who "defend stealth jihadis." This, because of their cover ... More >>
James Mabry Mabry is a comic with Duck in Cover Comedy. Learn more about the troupe here. When you put your key in the ignition and turn on the radio, what station would play right now? 97.3-FM, 24/7 comedy radio. What's the first album you bought? Weird Al Yankovic, Alapalooza. ... More >>
Sheriff Joe Arpaio's the Rodney Dangerfield of Sand Land politics these days. He just don't get no respect. Thing is, in his case, he deserves no respect, whereas Dangerfield's self-pity was a shtick. People actually liked him. They despise Joe. At least those with half a brain or more.Because ... More >>
There's a Rodney Dangerfield joke in here somewhere, but Scottsdale police say Dudley KwokTak Chan was going around pretending he was a Chandler police officer to "get respect."Getting "respect" for wearing a police badge is typically reserved for actual police officers, so that didn't work out too ... More >>
oliviacortes.comCortes, or whoever's writing her material, plays the race card Adding insult to injury, Olivia Cortes, the "sham" recall candidate whose paid petition gatherers admitted she was a pro-Russell Pearce plant meant to "dilute" the vote, is playing the race card in a press release publish ... More >>
www.fansoffred.comFlorida Marlins alleged loafer Hanley RamirezAfter a day or two of pissing and moaning about being taken out of the Florida Marlins' lineup against the Arizona Diamondbacks yesterday, Hanley Ramirez, the Marlins' drama-queen-of-the-week all-star shortstop -- accused by his coach ... More >>
www.zimbio.com D-backs starting pitcher Billy Buckner was decent in his season debut against the Florida Marlins.Before this afternoon, the Arizona Diamondbacks had lost eight of their last 10 games, and after this afternoon's shiteous performance from the D-backs bullpen -- as well as pro ... More >>
Pop-punkers overcome the critics with snarky/fun tunes
The last time the Phoenix Suns played a great NBA team, they lost by a point. Last night, the Suns lost to the Boston Celtics 104-87 in Bean Town. But the only reason it was that close was that the Suns' bench -- notably Lou Amundson -- played better than the Celtics' bench in garbage time. The Suns ... More >>
Governor Photo-Op was wrapping herself in the flag over the new AZ 9/11 shrine. Now, she who puts the P in politician's running for cover
Chuey and Cap'n Mike find infamy spinning Wednesday night's Wheel of Fear Factor at Giligin's
Eroticide cuts up on stage
Rival eateries play chicken
Batman's feline nemesis stretches out with her own film
For the 2004 summer season, Hollywood sticks with what it knows
A comedy "king" fills the hall with laughter
From the week of October 18, 2001
John Pinette�s humor is food for thought
On a new split double disc, the Young Fresh Fellows and the Minus 5 revive good-natured pop-rock
When C.D. Payne stopped writing ad copy, he created a revolutionary teenage hero
Only the devil could have possessed Adam Sandler to make such a bad movie, dragging half of Hollywood with him
Secrets Every Smart Traveler Should Know delights at every stop
From the week of July 8, 1999
Jim Irvin is poised to give the GOP a Corporation Commission majority for the first time in a decade. If that happens, Democratic activist Barbara Sherman and her mentor, Commission chairman Renz Jennings, will both wind up losers.


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Control Brand LS1127S26 The Ostersund Chandelier
Product Description
This Chandelier by Control Brand has a chrome finish. For use with 26 10-watt halogen bulbs.
The Ostersund Chandelier
- Made with glass vases and a chrome industrial steel base
- Partial assembly is required
- Light bulbs are included
|Light Bulb:
|(26)10w T3 G4 12v Halogen [Compare Bulbs]
|Glass / Carbon Steel
|12 volt
|41.8 Pounds
|Interior Dry, Assembly Required
Refers to the number of lights on a given fixture. Choose from a wide variety of different fixtures ranging from 1 - 6+ lights.
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|6+ Lights
Chandeliers come in a wide variety of shapes and styles. More common types include Candle-Style, Crystal, Williamsburg, and Wrought Iron among others.
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|Rectangular Chandelier
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Free Buckets at Kilwin's Chocolate's
The younger set takes on Viagra. Bob Dole would be proud.
Where ya goin'? Where ya been?
Hotties, hotties, and more hotties
One word can end it all. So can a little body hair.
OceanDance brings Puerto Rican ballet to Hollywood
A hunt for low-cost liquor in Broward County
MoCA delivers a sense of place
Victoria Place, the live gay soap, would make Jody Dallas proud
Broward deputy Linda Ashby says she was fired because she's a lesbian. And because she had an affair with a male officer's girlfriend.


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It's hard not to think of twentieth-century Russian history as you crack open 2017, Olga Slavnikova's Russian Booker Prize winning novel. The year 2017 will mark, of course, the 100th anniversary of the Russian Revolution, which culminated in the collapse of the Czarist autocracy and gave rise to the Soviet Union. It's against this backdrop that readers enter this novel: a pot brimming with precious stones, a dash of spy novel intrigue, and a raw-to-the-bone social critique bubbling and boiling in a dense, evocative stew.
Excuse the metaphor. This is not a novel of food—far from it. But 2017 is a novel that asks you to savor it slowly, bite by bite. Translator Marian Schwartz, one of the most accomplished Russian translators working today—who has translated the works of Nina Berberova, Edvard Radzinsky, and Mikhail Bulgakov, among others—has recreated Slavnikova's dense novel in a smooth, eminently enjoyable English text. Passages describing the craft of obscure trades like gemcutting or rock-hounding flow from sentence to sentence with ease, making the translation seem effortless.
At its core, 2017 is a deceptively simple novel that explores the notion of authenticity in a modern life. In the mythical region of the Riphean Mountains, a gifted gem cutter named Krylov meets a woman named Tanya who, unbeknownst to him, happens to be the wife of his rich but humorless mentor, the professor and gem trader Anfilogov. Krylov and Tanya begin a torrid affair that finds them in new beds each time they meet. Meanwhile Krylov's ex-wife, Tamara, a wealthy and powerful funeral director who still has her eyes set on Krylov, enters the picture and thinks it's about time she and Krylov get back together again. And what about that rotund spy trailing Tanya and Krylov's every move? Well, he may or may not have been hired by Tamara to keep track of their affair.
2017 is, in short, a playfully fun novel that uses farcical elements and outlandish, oversized characters to beguile you into reading further. For instance, in one particularly fun sentence, Dickens-like in its wit, we get the following description of the spy: "His mustache looked like it had been drawn on by a graffiti artist provoked by all the blank space on his face."
But behind the farce there's some serious stuff going on. In a geographically isolated northern region of the country where some of the very best deposits of precious stones are found, people, animals, and vegetation are dying because of a cyanide leak. Just why this is so—and just who is to blame for the leak—is what ultimately propels the novel's plot.
In the post-Soviet society Slavnikova envisions, it seems most everyone is out to make a quick buck. Take Professor Anfilogov, for example, who is driven to accumulate wealth despite the fact that, once he has it, he has no real use for it. Or Krylov's ex-wife Tamara, whose funeral business rakes in the dough until an environmental scandal breaks, revealing just how she got her money in the first place. (And yes, the scandal's got something to do with why everything's dying up north.) Only Krylov the gem cutter—a man with some real inertia issues—seems immune to the pull of easy wealth.
But along with wealth comes power, and this is where the novel makes its deepest cut into post-Soviet (and potentially all) structures of power. Here is Tamara lecturing Krylov:
"You and I are having a material conversation now," Tamara pulled him up sharp. "No matter how important what you're not telling me is, what I'm going to tell you now is much more important. You and your Anfilogov have a special kind of business. The issue is not whether it's legal or illegal. The problem is that you want to go it alone. I mean all your friends who used to come over when we were renting that little place on Kuznechnaya and then stopped coming over. I want you to be clear about one thing: today, everyone belongs to someone, and you're doing everything in your power not to. All people and all businesses are part of a single world molecule. This molecule is a lot simpler than the most primitive human individuality. . . . Even inside the molecule the upper levels are much more primitive than the lower ones. You can't even imagine how crude, coarse, and simple-minded the functions are at the highest stages of power, where I've only had a peek."
Though it might be too tempting to see everything here through the lens of power (of the Soviet kind), particularly when the Red Cavalry and White Cossacks engage in deadly skirmishes on the 100th anniversary of the Revolution, it's not at all a stretch to view the unfolding plot in post-Glasnost terms. The question of who is to blame for the mess up north becomes central. Was Tamara the one responsible for the environmental disaster? Or should blame be held against the authorities who, as Tamara claims, "knew about the cyanide leak . . . and did absolutely nothing!"?
But if you look closely for simple answers in 2017, you won't find them. Throughout the novel the same question of authenticity is raised by various means and by various characters, ultimately pointing to what is really at stake in the year 2017. Whether it's the transparency of rainbow quartz, or the authenticity of a well-lived human life, or even the authenticity of history itself, 2017 examines the difficult problem of achieving authenticity in a modern capitalist state. And by doing so, Slavnikova gives a dose of humanity to the characters who inhabit her fictional world. Though she can be a little heavy on description at times, Slavnikova is a gifted writer with a talent for weaving the disparate threads of her expansive narrative together, and with Schwartz's able hand bringing this novel to life in English, readers should enjoy this book as they would enjoy a fine meal: slowly and thoughtfully.
Antoine Volodine's vast project (40 plus novels) of what he calls the post-exotic remains mostly untranslated, so for many of us, understanding it remains touched with mystery, whispers from those "who know," and guesswork. That's not to say that, were. . .
It hasn't quite neared the pitch of the waiting-in-line-at-midnight Harry Potter days, but in small bookstores and reading circles of New York City, an aura has attended the novelist Elena Ferrante and her works. One part curiosity (Who is she?),. . .
From the late 1940s to the early 1950s, Egypt was going through a period of transition. The country's people were growing unhappy with the corruption of power in the government, which had been under British rule for decades. The Egyptians'. . .
Miruna is a novella written in the voice of an adult who remembers the summer he (then, seven) and his sister, Miruna (then, six) spent in the Evil Vale with their grandfather (sometimes referred to as "Grandfather," other times as. . .
Kamal Jann by the Lebanese born author Dominique Eddé is a tale of familial and political intrigue, a murky stew of byzantine alliances, betrayals, and hostilities. It is a well-told story of revenge and, what's more, a serious novel that. . .
While looking back at an episode in his life, twenty-year-old Taguchi Hiro remembers what his friend Kumamoto Akira said about poetry.
Its perfection arises precisely from its imperfection . . . . I have an image in my head. I see. . .
The central concern of Sorj Chalandon's novel Return to Killybegs appears to be explaining how a person of staunch political activism can be lead to betray his cause, his country, his people. Truth be told, the real theme of the. . .


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|30 Jul 2009
Win 7 64 bit Home Premium (desktop), Win 7 32 bit Home Premium(Notebook) (3user pack).
How to install 7 on Acer 5620Z notebook?
Hi Forum-ers.
I'm having problems getting my Notebook to boot from the 7 image. I want to load 7 over Vista, which runs like a dog with one leg. I used this DVD to load 32bit 7 on my desktop, so I know it is OK, but the Acer won't "see" the boot disk at start-up.
I have set the bios to CD/DVD drive, 1st boot position and "Unlocked" the Acer eLock Management tool for the DVD drive in Vista, but Vista loads as if no DVD is in the drive.
I spoke to the shop where I purchased the Acer, but they said use f10 on start-up, but it just sends me to Edit Boot Options for Vista.
Does anyone have a solution, please?
Computer Specs: Acer Extensa 5620Z Intel Pentium Dual Core T2310 1.46MHz, 1 Gb DDR2 Ram, 80Gb HDD, Super Multi DL DVD drive. OS: Vista.
|My System Specs
|30 Jul 2009
Win 7
No need to boot from the dvd just run the setup from within windows, and if it still does not see the dvd then extract the contents of the disc and run the setup.
|My System Specs
|30 Jul 2009
Windows 7 Ultimate RC 1 x86
YupYup is right, if the drive does recognize the dvd, just run the setup using Vista, and the installation will start without a problem.
|My System Specs
|31 Jul 2009
Win 7 64 bit Home Premium (desktop), Win 7 32 bit Home Premium(Notebook) (3user pack).
Acer 5620 notebook Non-boot
|My System Specs
|01 Aug 2009
Win 7 64 bit Home Premium (desktop), Win 7 32 bit Home Premium(Notebook) (3user pack).
Solution found- Thank you
|My System Specs
|20 Oct 2009
Any luck with 7 on Acer 5620Z?
How did it work out with Windows 7 on the Acer 5620Z? I have one and am interested in upgrading.
Did all the integrated components work? How about the Acer special software? I have the Atheros network chipset.
|My System Specs
|21 Oct 2009
Win 7 64 bit Home Premium (desktop), Win 7 32 bit Home Premium(Notebook) (3user pack).
Hi technonaut, everything worked fine after the install, but the native Acer Crystal Eye inbuilt webcam software was snotted and I could not re-install it from "windows old' file. I found a free software prog called CaptureFlux 5.2.3 by Paul Glagla online, and the webcam now works with every IM system I've used, as well as being a great movie capture from my Digital Sony DCR-HC28E Handycam in WMV format, (better than before). I opened up the back case after seeing a vid online, and bought another 2 Gigs of RAM (now 3) and now have my desktop (64 bit) and notebook (32 bit) set up basically the same (cannot network them-they must be same bit), but I use my external 1Terr USB HDD to transfer files between them. The extra RAM increased speed by about 2X and WIN 7 by about 8X over vista. Now it works as you would want. Acer still has a hard drive area reserved for re-installs hidden. All other parts work-network, Wi-fi, video, sound and bluetooth all work under Win 7. Nothing else I need. Good upgrade to you.
|My System Specs
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Return Rate: 0.00%
Lifespan: 12/09/2003~05/20/2004
Reebok S. Carter Low
Smooth and stylish, the limited edition Reebok S. Carter delivers a tight, clean look for all of your offcourt moves for one affordable price tag.
By a Sneakerhead.com customer via post-transaction survey
There were alot of different styles to choose from the brand name I was looking for! Item arrived as planned.
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Design: 404
Alien Invasion Personalized Favor Box
Personalized Favor Box
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Fill these Alien Invasion Personalized Favor Box with fun outer space favors!
Our Alien Invasion Personalized Favor Box is printed with your custom text on our grid map of outer space design. Each Alien Invasion Personalized Favor Box measures 6 inches wide x 6 3/4 inches high x 3 inches deep and are printed on card-stock. Fill the Alien Invasion Personalized Favor Box with alien and outer space themed favors for all your guests to enjoy. Easy assembly.
Please allow ample time for delivery. Our ship date for this product is noted in your shopping cart. Many items are shipped separately, so please allow extra time for these items to arrive. Shipping charges are based on the value of the merchandise and not the number of shipments. For additional shipping information, contact our Customer Service Department at (firstname.lastname@example.com or 1-800-314-8794).
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Angry Ham's Octane Bar & GrillTraditional American, Burgers, American (New)
2 Beacon St
(508) 620-8888
BigArm K.
This place smells like vomit. Lots of TVs and bar games, etc if you can stand the smell.read more
Patty K.
My husband had been dying to visit as he is an avid Bar Rescue fan and we had been in the area two other times without being able to stop. I am not a big...read more
Olivia S.
Russ from The Verve, Crowne Plaza Natick sent us here. I trust Russ and he was raving about this place so we made a visit on our last night before heading...read more
Tina B.
Finger Cuff at Angry Hams Famingham, MA Saturday, May 12, 2012read more
Nicole F.
$8 lunch special soup, salad or fries and full sandwich!read more
Tina B.
Must See Finger Cuff on Thursday Nights. Karaoke with a Live Band.read more
Joe G.
Eggs Benny is delish! And the spicy home fries are a must.read more
Joe G.
Mavericks are recruiting for the next Semi-Pro football season. Don't just watch - live it!read more
Bill C.
Seriously bound for glory at angry hams? This is not New Jersey ... Not waiting for snookie and jwowread more
Shannon D.
The fried pickles are incredibly delicious. Unfortunately, they only come with a sandwich order.read more
Mark E.
The Turkey Tips are simply unbelievable...a must have.read more
Excellent service --- French onion soup is one if the best I ever had!read more
Try the Carnivore Pizza and spot it on Foodspotting!read more
Alyssa H.
Fried cheese curd with gravy - yumread more
Michelle E.
$1 coors light draftsread more
Paul F.
Hotty mayor alert!!read more
Chris B.
As seen on TV!read more
Peter G.
Try their 20" pizzas. So good. Mmmmmread more
Kyle K.
Consistently delicious! It's that simple.read more
Try the Meat Lollipops and spot it on Foodspotting!read more
Tina B.
Finger Cuff Live Band Karoke Every Thursday Night.read more
John B.
You can ask for a side order of frickles - yumread more
Gary N.
Beer and burger or near gourmet. Excellentread more
Jason R.
Best eggrollsread more
deals for Framingham, MA
$7 for $14
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$15 for $30
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Have you started your holiday shopping yet? Look no further than here at Willis Music in Lexington, KY. We are Lexington's "One-Stop Music Shop" with everything from Pianos/Keyboards to Band & Orchestra instruments. Drums to Sheet Music. And Guitars to … Continue reading
November Schedule of Events
Oh the weather outside is frightful! But here at Willis Music the world is so delightful! And since there's no place to go! Come and play, come and play, come and play! HIGHLIGHTS FOR OCTOBER NOW THROUGH NOVEMBER 30: KID'S … Continue reading
Halloween Weekend Sales Event
Candy, Costumes, and Music all in one place! Come celebrate your Halloween weekend with Willis Music in Lexington, KY! We promise that we have no Tricks….and just treats, for our SPOOKTACULAR Sales Event taking place Thursday, October 30 through Sunday, … Continue reading
Guitar Lessons In Just Eight Sessions
WANNA PLAY GUITAR? WILLIS MUSIC IS THE PLACE TO LEARN! This Thursday, October 23 David McLean begins an 8-week session of group classes here at Willis Music in Lexington, KY. Group classes are a great way to learn if you … Continue reading
Find Your Fender Here!
In addition to being Lexington's One Stop Music Shop, Willis Music (Lexington, KY) is proud to be a dealer of Fender guitars! Plus, we have the largest selection of American made Fender's in town! Thinking of purchasing a guitar for … Continue reading
October 2014 Calendar of Events
October is here!! Don't miss out on a great month of events here at Willis Music, Lexington's One-Stop Music Shop. HIGHLIGHTS FOR OCTOBER OCT 1 – NOV 30: KID'S GOT TALENT Post a video of your child performing music on … Continue reading
Piano Sale: September 26-28
Looking to purchase a piano? Look no further than our Willis Music Piano Sale this weekend, September 26-28, in Lexington, KY. We will take 10% OFF our everyday low price on all acoustic and digital pianos! Take a look at … Continue reading
Pro Audio Sale Weekend
This weekend, Sept. 20-21, is our "Turn Up The Sound" Sale Weekend on all Pro Audio equipment at Willis Music in Lexington. Save 10% on new microphones, speakers, mixers, studio headphones, cables, mic stands, and more! Plus save an extra … Continue reading
Guitar Clinic by SIMO
Come to a Guitar Clinic featuring one of the best guitarists around, this Wednesday, September 17th, 6 p.m., at Willis Music in Lexington, KY. This is a Guitar Clinic for ANY Musician! J.D. Simo is a part of the Nashville … Continue reading
Diana Chittester's CD Release Tour
Today, September 7, 2014 at 3p.m. Diana Chittester brings her CD Release Tour to Willis Music in Lexington, KY. Admission is free. Chittester's new album "Find My Way Home" and her latest t-shirt will be available for purchase. Check out … Continue reading


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Alex Gregg, bar manager at the upcoming Goro & Gun, is reviving his popular Commercial Free Cocktail series -- initially hosted at Grand Prize Bar -- for a limited, three-night run at Ambrosia. And this time, he's bringing along guest bartender Chris Frankel to help. Both bartenders got their start ... More >>
Too much of a good thing threatens the oysters in Galveston Bay
Beneath the muddy waters of Galveston Bay lies one of the greatest seafood treasure troves on earth


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The credit crunch claims Lehman Brothers but Bank of America offers a reprieve for Merrill Lynch
NEW YORK – One of the world's largest investment banks, Lehman Brothers, has announced that it is filing for bankruptcy protection. A weekend of crisis talks, led by the US Treasury secretary Henry Paulson, at the investment bank failed to find a buyer for the troubled bank. Previous efforts by Lehman's chief executive Richard Fuld to rescue the bank by selling off many of its operations failed to stem a fall in market confidence, after the bank predicted record losses in the third quarter of this year.
Merrill Lynch was rescued from a similar fate by Bank of America, which abandoned talks to buy Lehman Brothers to agree to a $50 billion takeover of Merrill Lynch. Although Merrill's large retail brokerage business is extremely attractive to Bank of America, the bank will need to clean up Merrill's trading books, which have already cost $52 billion in writedowns. The takeover, however, will create the world's largest financial services company.
Other global banks have reacted quickly to make available a $70 billion liquidity pool to help support other vulnerable institutions. More firms are expected to fail in the coming months, with signs already beginning to show in some quarters. Global insurance firm American International Group has announced its plans to radically restructure its business, including the sale of its aircraft-leasing arm.
In preparation of more failures, the Federal Reserve has eased terms on emergency borrowings facilities and it has also suspended rules that prohibit banks from using deposits to fund their investment banking subsidiaries. That said, the US Treasury was not forthcoming in committing taxpayer's funds to bail out Lehman, marking a turnaround in its approach to combating the fallout from the credit crisis.
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I received this recipe from one of my sisters when we had a family reunion quite some years ago. I have had many comments on it, and I am always printing out copies of it for people. This recipe gives you a new way to use those Ramen Noodles!
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Serving Size: 1 (207 g)
Servings Per Recipe: 6
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Every recipe, menu, tip and how-to is right here, at your service.


text: Laurier Residence Floorwear View full-size image < previous next > Is this photo a winner? "in residence each floor tends to produce floorwear with members of their floor" - Kyle (Oct 25, 2008) Share this photo on: Twitter Facebook Pinterest Similar Photos: student group | laurier residence floorwear | american apparel zip hoody Feeling inspired? Visit the CustomInk Design Lab to start your own group order. Design Your Own


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A public information meeting on the diverging diamond project at Interstate 69 and Dupont Road that was postponed due to weather has been rescheduled.
The meeting will be from 6 to 7 p.m. Monday in the Carroll High School auditorium, 3701 Carroll Road.
The meeting will consist of a presentation and a question and answer session.
After the meeting, the public will have time to interact with the design consultant, contractor and Indiana Department of Transportation personnel.
The $3.5 million project is expected to begin in April and be complete by October. A diverging diamond interchange uses traffic signals at each end to have traffic cross over to driving on the left side of the road through the intersection. That allows left turns to be made without interference from cross-traffic.
The interchange is one of the most congested in the region, with long delays caused by traffic trying to turn left off I-69 onto Dupont Road or Indiana 1 and drivers on Dupont trying to turn left onto I-69.
The new configuration is expected to eliminate those problems, officials said.


text: NORTH FORT MYERS, Fla. - Deputies from the Lee County Sheriff's office are actively investigating a string of car break ins at the Moody River subdivision in North Fort Myers. Thieves got away with everything from bowling balls to cash and electronics. Many of the cars involved were left unloked by their owners making them easy targets. Law enforcement recommends removing all valuables from the passenger compartment and always lock your car doors.


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Quoth - "The important thing is to have a play in which one can feel the author's shaping idea. In the contemporary plays that I have read there is no author; th...
1 day ago
While Downward Bound: Hope in a Darkening Age... news, comment, arts, ecology, wisdom, obsessions, the future... "THE END OF ALL INTELLIGENT ANALYSIS IS TO CLEAR THE WAY FOR SYNTHESIS."--H.G. Wells. "It's not dark yet, but it's getting there."--Bob Dylan.
|art by Anthony McCall


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Results 1 - 1 of 1
byTomsite, June 19, 2013
But (of course there is a but) the shop/cart solution is basic, to say the least. I have to agree there with some of the other reviews. You can set one price and that is it. It is always for the original picture. No chance to select different sizes. So Mr. Datso, it would be just marvellous to have the option to set different prices for a) commercial and non-commercial use and b) have the option to select different sizes and calculate different prices for these picture. Some field for displaying license information according to the selected type and size of the image would be great too.
The gallery being slow, hmmm i display 36 images per page and it loads quickly enough. Sorry, but if one can't wait a few seconds before a page loads then this is not a problem with the loading speed but rather with impatience. I can't really verify this issue on my site (having already imported about two thousand images, all with 12MP Resolution original size). Even the import of about 700 images in one go into one category does work smoothly enough. Surely it takes some time, but with that amount it is expected.
The hard coded sizes i don't see as a problem at all, they are the most common used resolutions. Why would i want to differ from them?
Out of the box, yes certainly. No complaint there. It is not the components fault that some templates are just lousy coded. I use now a T3-Framework template, grid based and it works. Now i only need to recreate the other template i had as it really has a very nice design. Other solutions like Phoca etc. are not so easy, especially if you want to sell a few images. I seriously didn't want to install a subscription package and then try to integrate one gallery with something like Docman. It would have been a nightmare.
And a workaround to the resolutions and different pricing issue. If one doesn't have too many picture that are worth selling one can create different categories. Change the resolution locally on a PC and upload these images then into the different categories and assign for each a different price. Not the nicest way, but it's doable.
If you don't expect a full blown stock photo solution that will handle millions of pictures and gives you all the pricing, download and licensing options one can certainly be happy with Datso Gallery. If the pricing for different usage types and resolutions is added it would be, at least in my opinion, a very good extension for photo enthusiasts that want to make a few quid with some of the pictures they have.


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text: Jesse Jackson: Phil Robertson Worse Than Rosa Parks' Bus Driver Print article Send a Tip by AWR Hawkins 25 Dec 2013 post a comment Rev. Jesse Jackson weighed in on the raging Duck Dynasty controversy over star Phil Robertson's opinion on homosexuality, claiming, "the statements uttered by Robertson are more offensive than the... driver" of civil rights icon Rosa Parks' bus. According to the Daily Mail, Jackson added: "At least the bus driver, who ordered Rosa Parks to surrender her seat to a white person, was following state law." But Robertson said what he said "without cover of the law." And Jackson said the statements Robertson made in answering a GQ reporter's question were given "in a context of... 'white privilege.'" As Breitbart News reported on December 18, the central component of Robertson's answer to the reporter was a recitation of 1 Corinthians 6:9-10. One would think a reverend would embrace the use of Scripture instead of condemning the man who recited it. Instead, Jackson is demanding that Robertson's "indefinite" suspension be upheld and he also wants a meeting "within 72 hours with A&E executives and Cracker Barrel's CEO to discuss the future of Duck Dynasty memorabilia." I wonder if this will be a classic Jackson "shakedown" where memorabilia can continue to be sold as long as Jackson or his Rainbow PUSH Coalition get a little kickback. Follow AWR Hawkins on Twitter @AWRHawkins.


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Customer Reviews
Severe Allergic Reaction!!!
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Purchased at iHerb
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This is a wonderful product!! I've used henna and it was such a messy and time-consuming process that I never wanted to use it again. Herbatint not only leaves my hair shiny and soft, but it's also really easy to use! Plus, it's cheaper and better for your hair than most store-bought hair dyes. I definitely recommend it!!!!
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I'm a black woman with long dredlocks (6-years old) that had begun to turn brown and golden brown at the ends because of the sun. I decided to use this product because I prefer the look of rich, black dredlocks, and my original hair color is closer to black than brown. I saw that someone (a black woman with very long and beautiful dredlocks) on youtube had used this product, and recommended it because it is mostly natural. For this reason, I decided to try it. I'd used black henna in the past, and though it looked great a week or two after I died it, I found that henna (months later) left this nasty, dirty looking residue in my locks. So, I just wanted to try something else, but more natural than regular hair dye. The application was easy, but if you have long dredlocks (mine are to the middle of my back, and i have a LOT of hair), I recommend getting two packages, as the amount in one box didn't fully cover my hair. I have a handful of strands I couldn't fully cover, BUT the rich black color of all my other locks just makes the brown ones look like highlights. Perfect!
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nice smells and good color hair. Holds no worse than usual ammonium paint, but does not burn your hair. I am very pleased with the product!


text:
By being fairly self reliant, rather than maximizing the benefits of national and international divisions of labor, they choose to be less efficient and to perform activities that subtract from the time they can devote to what they do best. By shunning modern labor-saving devices and technologies — such as electricity, hay bailers, power equipment, and modern milking facilities — they choose to live with less of everything. Many fall within the modern definition of poverty. Nearly all use child labor. They would starve without it. Yes, they are fully employed but to what end? FULL ARTICLE
Economic Lessons from the Amish
{ 25 comments }
- June 21, 2007 at 9:23 am
If the Amish way of life is acetic and non-maximal it seems to make them happy. For some people tradition is affirming. More power to 'em. It is a positive that they, as far as I have ever seen, don't seek to push their views on others by force.
There are whole quadrants of people who think they have a master plan and are very willing to use force and aggression against others to make sure that they follow "liberating" acetic behaviors. What's worse, these champions of mass "simplicity" always exempt themselves.
So I may find the Amish odd, and find that they have an odd combination of traditional ways and compromises with moderninity, but they basically keep to themselves, don't condemn others (at least to their face) and don't seek the corridors of power to have everyone follow their particular philosophic outlook.
- June 21, 2007 at 9:48 am
I don't know but maybe there's a hint of Luddite talk underlying this article. If one person operating a tractor puts a lot of people into work then removing tractors from society would create lotsa jobs for unemployed folk, QED. Whilst certainly this article makes for a good point as why it's better to be decent to other and not go around bashing and robbing people and stuff, there is a but . . .
I'd say the real reason for the well roundness of Amish society is their low-techness. Jobs there are probably kinda mostly low skilled. Not to mention the products of their labour is probably rather homogenous.
Therefore, because of this combination of homogenous products with low technology and low skills (and low population density?), I propose, creates low entry costs, low exit costs, straightforward competition and all the other stuff that makes one bad player or cartel to be uprooted quickly.
Compare this to modern society where you can have both job shortages in one area and unemployment in another. Rather than automatically blame the guvmint, what of the fact that many jobs and technology cannnot just be done by anyone off the street? What if CPU manufacturers form a cartel? How does the average schmoe with a roll of copper, lumps of silicon, a soldering iron and superglue supposed to compete? To get new whizbang skills for another job takes some time (more so than others) can mean moving between different industries amounts to high transaction costs, no? Similarly what of someone with hi-tech invention (even without patents) invariably creates a temporary monopoly on an object as other inventors try to figure how the darn thing works.
I'd still reckon that happy A.C. Libertarianism would invariably work best in Amish-ish setting which just happens to similar to the time period when the (U.S.) 'Founding Fathers' lived in.
- June 21, 2007 at 10:18 am
Are the Amish subject to taxation? If yes, how do they earn money?
- June 21, 2007 at 10:42 am
They're mostly subject to taxation. The only real break they get is on social security. You can read more here:
It's also worth noting that the Amish barter as much (if not more) than they use money. That frees them from a substantial amount of taxation by itself.
- June 21, 2007 at 11:15 am
TLWP Sam,
I really wish you would carefully examine and/or edit what you write. It is extremely difficult to follow the arguments you make. For example, what does the following mean?
Compare this to modern society where you can have both job shortages in one area and unemployment in another
Job shortages and unemployment seem like the same thing to me.
And there is this:
If one person operating a tractor puts a lot of people into work then removing tractors from society would create lotsa jobs for unemployed folk, QED
I can only guess that you meant to write that tractors puts a lot of people out of work.
I would suggest a rewrite, and actually make an argument. What is the "Luddite talk" you wrote of? Are you implying that the solution for today's umemployment is the living of an Amish lifestyle, or are you implying that this is blog entry's author's point, a point that you are supporting or criticizing?
I thought it was clear that the author was showing a primitive economic system that has achieved an equilibrium on a near subsistence level. At the same time, I thought it clear that trying to achieve full employment is a fool's game since change itself is the cause of some unemployment.
- June 21, 2007 at 1:01 pm
If you think the Amish are something, check out the Freegans. They pretty much think they have all of life figured out, but all I see is abysmal ignorance of economics.
- June 21, 2007 at 1:37 pm
The tenor of this post seems almost to contradict Ludwig von Mises himself, quoted directly opposite your piece: "Nobody is called upon to determine what could make another man happier or less unhappy." I understand that the Amish give their adolescents the opportunity to taste the outside world for themselves, and to decide whether they wish to return. Perhaps they feel they have the right mix of material and other forms of wealth.
- June 21, 2007 at 3:43 pm
In contrast to the Amish are the Hutterite colonies which are numerous where I live.They embrace modern technology as it applies to farming.They reject the modern worlds consumer goods.They are prosperous enough to be continually
branching off to form new colonies,recognizing that farms can only get so large before becoming inefficient.I believe the key here is extremely
low consumption vs extremely high investment in
more and better capital goods.
- June 21, 2007 at 4:00 pm
Whatever one thinks of the Amish, you have to admire their self-reliance and very strong work ethic. I'll take a million Amish over a dozen socialists any day.
- June 21, 2007 at 4:30 pm
"Work Ethic" is not an ideal to strive for.
That was the motto of communism.
Progress only happens when people look for ways to work less.
- June 21, 2007 at 7:26 pm
Socialism/communism can work when it is an unintended consequense of a more important principle or goal.
- June 21, 2007 at 10:10 pm
- June 21, 2007 at 11:19 pm
The Amish aren't doing this in order to achieve full employment – that's a side-effect. Also, they don't much value what they are foregoing (remember, they let their young people choose freely which lifestyle to follow as adults, exposing them to both on purpose). The discussion only makes a sound case against people who are into that lifestyle to get the best out of secular values – but that's the empty set.
Oh, and saying that the Amish get a "break" on Social Security sounds like they are actually getting something, the way governments claim that cutting taxes is "giving" taxpayers something. It's just that the Amish aren't being made to roll over under the logic of clawbacks and drawbacks, just this one time. Nobody should be forced under by this system – the Amish are simply getting what we all deserve in this area (see my post in the recent Social Security thread).
- June 22, 2007 at 1:10 am
Yeah yeah you're right, I crashed and burned there Yancy Ward. Nonetheless I was trying to make a point that pure competition is considerably more likely in an Amish-ish environment. Or alternatively pure competition is less likely in a high-tech environment. Nevertheless if someone is one or two paychecks from living on the street then I'd regard that person as being close to subsistence. Whereas how do we know for sure that Amish people are close to subsistence just because what they produce is ho-hum basic and generic?
- June 22, 2007 at 1:32 am
While this is an insightful article of Amish economics, I don't agree with one point of the article, that is, that the Amish-type lifestyle is necessary to reach full employment within an economy.
Mises himself has argued repeatedly that any free market has all the incentives to move to full employment, and this was due to Say's law of markets. It was not the issue of how dynamic, closed, or technology driven the society and the economy was, but only the issue of the free movement of prices and wages. Even the classical economists agreed.
So if the entire US was stripped of the entire welfare state and other economic regulations, taxes, etc, and everyone over the age of ten sought employment to work full time, you would not see a surge of unemployment. Granted, you may see a drop in nominal wages, but followed a larger drop in the general price of goods (because society's production possibilities rapidly expanded). It wouldn't matter how much technology, cultural attitudes toward child labor, or modern convenience is in the economy, full employment can and would be reached. It's the hallmark of Say's law.
I think it might be more accurate to speculate that, because of their traditional old order culture, the Amish economy has a demand for labor that consistently far outstrips their supply of labor.
- June 22, 2007 at 4:49 am
Som, there are at least three catches with that:-
(1.) The labour market isn't free enough, because of taxes, minimum wage laws, and other artificially created on costs of labour.
(2.) Even without those, there would be no guarantee that the levels of competition and productivity would give a real market clearing wage enough for everybody to live on – merely enough for people at the margins of productivity to live on. So, for instance, people in the USA might end up being offered real wages matching those of people in tropical countries with lower heating costs and some private sources of food. Or real wages matching the real costs of machines, come to that (see Nassau Senior's 19th century work on Wages, particularly his special case when machine fuel is drawn from the same resources as food – we are getting into that with renewable energy).
I have heard that the 19th century railway builders compared the productivity and food consumption of Irish and Italian workers, only to find that while two (larger) Irishmen could do the work of three (smaller) Italians, they also ate the same. If either sort had been more useful in that respect, they would have been hired preferentially so as to reduce the logistics problems of moving food along a railway while it was still incomplete – and, we would see a Darwinian selection if they ever had to compete for subsistence.
Colonial and European history shows that at first, outsiders have to offer high real wages to subsistence locals, to give them an incentive. That's because they want enough for luxuries. Later on, whether through Malthusian problems or artificial resource shortages like hut or poll taxes or land seizure, they have to work for a top up cash wage – but a low one, since they don't need much but they really do need it, so the Iron Law of Wages brings it down. Later on still, real wages rise since everybody needs more – but not everybody gets more because of the market clearing problem described above. That means high involuntary unemployment, with "Vagrancy Costs" – an externality. Technically speaking, the vagrants have found work – scavenging, scrounging, stealing, emigrating, serving prison time, or whatever.
(3.) Even when things can be sorted out – and there are a lot of ways to do that, at least technically – there are transitional issues. People can die and actually have died during transitions like the Highland Clearances, and what's more transitional situations can be sustained indefinitely for so long as outside sources of change continue. Whether they eventually end or not, they can easily outlast individuals caught in them.
- June 22, 2007 at 8:31 am
To my way of thinking, there is a difference between moving towards full employment and reaching full employment. The Amish more or less reach full employment because they must raise their own food. While there is some small amount of division of labor and, thus, trade, it appears that the Amish have stopped advancing and changing. Equilibrium has been established and full employment has been reached. Contrast this with a society that is constantly advancing and/or changing. Jobs are lost continually while others are created. As long as change happens, there will never be full employment even though Mises and Say were completely correct.
- June 22, 2007 at 10:13 am
I have to say that you painted an admirable picture of the Amish in the beginning of your article. They are closer to sustainable, each person adds value and they're not in hock. Your arguement for progress and capitalism is pretty weak. It sounds like capitalism is people that do not add value making the big bucks. The problem in other countries with their agrarian ways is not the lack of capitalism, but from their capitalistic countrymen who want to gain without adding value.
The Amish won't go hungry if deliveries to their local supermarket don't come…..
- June 22, 2007 at 12:28 pm
Dan, I'm sorry, but your conclusion that as for the Amish, "rejection of modern capitalism is full employment in poverty and hardship, not the rich fruits of progress" is essentially an empty tautology that really tells us nothing about either the Amish or modern society.
The Amish hold themselves apart from modern capitalism and society, so don't share fully the material benefits that modern capitalism offers? And their lives are full of shared hard work?Earthshaking news. But is Amish society nevertheless immensely wealthy in meeting human needs for satisfying human relationships and intimate contact with the good earth?
And I don't find your premises either insightful or supported. Is full employment really the primary goal of Amish society, or merely a side effect? And why do you discount Amish success by claiming that they really rely on modern society? Of course they are happy to have markets and some material benefits that trade brings, but trade is voluntary on both sides, and the Amish are relatively quite independent. Yes, they ask that others and the state leave them alone and do not steal their land or property, but are you arguing that this is a subsidy by modern society?
Readers can find a more interesting analysis by well-known free market enviro/Austrian John Baden with respect to a similar religious group, the Hutterites, here:
- June 22, 2007 at 10:06 pm
So does that mean you both kinda agree with me Alex Kasak and TokyoTom? My main point was that the type of living the Amish have is the type of lifestyle that is empowering of the individual and Capitalism. Their lifestyle has low entry costs, low exit costs, relatively easy to create, homogenous products with near-perfect substitutes mean they are closer to pure Capitalism than modern society.
Or to put it another way, the path where pure Capitalism would equal a quaint happy society is one where if someone tries to use force or fraud to stifle competition then there are immediate painful kickbacks. Hence for the Amish if someone tries to do the wrong thing and tries to be a mini-monopolist people could quite easily go elsewhere whereas the complexity that is modern society that is not necessarily possible.
- June 25, 2007 at 10:58 am
This is an odd article for this website. Why would it never occur to an Austrian economist that some people might exercise a subjective preference for things other than "the rich fruits of progress?"
- June 25, 2007 at 11:45 am
TLWP Sam, sorry, but I don't know enough to tell how well your analysis works with the Amish. Rather than having alot of individual freedom and competition, it seems they have sublimated competitive drives in favor of cooperation and rules dividing tasks.
- June 25, 2007 at 9:09 pm
I beg to differ T.T. I hear there are four criteria to denote perfect competition (hence idyllic Capitalism):
1. Perfect substitutes – each business product has an close or identical substitute that if one business try to manipulate the price then buyers will take the competitors' products.
2. Zero exit or entry costs – if a player is manipulating the market yet it costs way too much to compete then the rogue will a temporary monopoly until someone can justify the cost of a start-up.
3. Perfect information – everyone knows what the product is and how much it should cost because they know what competitors are charging.
4. Small market share – there are enough operators within a local area such that cost of going elsewhere doesn't negate the extra charge on a product lest the operater enjoys a localised monopoly.
And, oops, it been long said that farming goes closest to perfect competition. Therefore the Amish, I'd speculate, come far closer to meeting the four points than modern society. I'll even say this will still be true even if the government could be all but taken out of the picture.
- June 25, 2007 at 10:13 pm
It's also worth noting that the Amish barter as much (if not more) than they use money. That frees them from a substantial amount of taxation by itself.
Oh no it doesn't. You're supposed to pay taxes on the "market value" of barter transactions.
- January 29, 2010 at 5:09 pm
http://roostershamblin.wordpress.com/ would you please spend a few minutes and read my blog. I have been raising 50 breeds of chickens for 40 years.
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November 26, 2014
The City Board in Owen has approved the resignation of Police Chief Randall Poirier during a special common council meeting Thursday evening. Chief Poirier accepted and signed the resignation documents on November 6.
The chief has been on leave for more than two weeks, and no one has said why.
According to a news release from Mayor Stephen Heggemeier, the City of Owen, in conjunction with outside investigators, conducted a thorough investigation of alleged off-duty misconduct said to have occurred in early September 2012.
That investigation did not produce any significant evidence of misconduct related to Chief Poirier's employment with the City of Owen, and Chief Poirier cooperated fully throughout the investigation.
Following the completion of the investigation, Chief Poirier agreed his resignation was in the best interest of himself, his family, and the entire Owen community.
According to their most recent budget, Owen's Police Department has one Sergeant and one Officer, in addition to the Chief.
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Photos and Description of this 2 bedroom holiday home in Cabanas de Tavira - CASA ALGARVIO
5 Persons, Comfortably Furnished, Central to Restaurants, Bars & Shops
CASA ALGAVRIO is a modern 4 storey, 2 bedroom townhouse situated in the quaint fishing village of Cabanas de Tavira, perfect for a family or 2 couples seeking reasonably priced, good quality accommodation. The ground floor is open plan in design with lounge, sofa bed (if required), TV, DVD player, dining table and kitchen with dishwasher, washing machine, hob, oven and fridge/freezer. Going upwards by stairs, the first floor has a twin bedroom with bathroom, the second floor a double bedroom, with own shower room. Patio doors lead from the double bedroom to a balcony/terrace with sea views and dining table and chairs. From here, an external spiral staircase leads to a 4th floor terrace suitable for sun bathing and which has amazing views of the Cabanas Village & Beach. The beach island of Cabanas is reached by small boat from the riverfront which is just a 2 minute walk away. Great holiday home for guests wishing to be close to amenities and beach. Internet Access available (pay per hour) and Air Conditioning recently installed.
- Suitability:
- Long-term Renters Welcome
- children welcome
- non smoking only
- pets considered
- wheelchair inaccessible


text:
How you Tackle your ENEMIES ?II2e
Tags: relationships, enemies, news & events
Asked by anantharaman, 03 Dec '13 11:50 pm
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Answers (5)
We must develop and maintain the capacity to forgive. He who is devoid of the power to forgive is devoid of the power to love. There is some good in the worst of us and some evil in the best of us. When we discover this, we are less prone to hate our enemies.Answered by Sunil Kumar, 03 Dec '13 11:51 pm
By respecting thmAnswered by Manju Sikri, 06 Dec '13 09:47 am
With love and careAnswered by Quest, 05 Dec '13 07:53 pm
No enemiesAnswered by iqbal seth, 04 Dec '13 07:21 am
Leave them aloneAnswered by anil garg, 04 Dec '13 01:13 am