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Mayor Bloomberg appeared on a Super Bowl-themed Meet The Press segment this morning, and sounded off on topics like increasing taxes for the wealthy, his Mayors Against Illegal Guns Super Bowl ad and the potential for an Iraq War veterans' parade in the city. Paired with Indiana Governor Mitch Danie ... More >>
WMD?As we noted yesterday, the digging into the nearly 400,000 secret documents from the Iraq war released this week by Julian Assange's WikiLeaks watchdog group is just beginning. The first nugget to earn a soundbite was the none-too-surprising claim that civilian casualties total at least 1 ... More >>
Gen. Ray Odierno announced yesterday that a new code of conduct for soldiers in Iraq which goes into effect Jan. 1 will not include a controversial rule penalizing "all United States military personnel, and... all civilians, serving with, employed by, or accompanying" the military in northern ... More >>
This shank's for you--Iraq! (Squint and it looks like a sleeping poodle.) A popular favorite in Iraq, quzi is a boiled baby lamb shank stuffed with rice, vermicelli, almonds, raisins, fresh peas, and other vegetables. You can get a bang-up version at La Kabbr, the city's only Iraqi cafe, ... More >>
As unconventional as the warfare it depicts
Female soldiers share their unique hardships
At the outset of a White House fiscal summit attended by members of both parties, President Obama reiterated that he's going to cut the deficit in half by the end of his (first) term, despite the massive spending now necessitated by the recession. He also promised that his budget processes will be r ... More >>
Let's talk about Iraq
Let's look in on our brothers-in-democracy in the Middle East. Afghanistan has postponed its elections due to "security and logistical concerns," says CNN. This isn't a short-term thing: they were scheduled for May, and will now take place in August -- though a parliamentary spokesman says they're " ... More >>
Prepare yourself for war
Where fashion meets war zone
The battle zone
Riding the Iranian New Wave
Desperately needed funds for new levees in U.S. Midwest have been diverted to flood control in Iraq. How many more floods of Biblical proportions will it take for Americans to realize what the government is not doing? The Bush regime and Congress have refused to spend money on upgrading levees in ... More >>
The news that Rep. Dennis J. Kucinich (D-Ohio) introduced articles of impeachment against President Bush sparked a spirited debate here yesterday. It's pretty clear that history will judge George W. Bush as one of the worst presidents ever—if not the worst. But how will history remember Kucin ... More >>
Working hard not to mention the Iraq war
Today's front pages are an exercise in extremes. On one end, we have the Post and its "hard-hitting" exclusive that the Yankees and the Mets are in negotiations with the city to buy the teams' old stadiums (more on that later today) so that they can sell the scraps as memorabilia. Above this story, ... More >>
While you're cleaning up the residual green vomit from St. Patty's Day and preparing to hide Easter eggs up your ass, how about doing something serious and profound? This week marks the fifth anniversary of the hideous U.S. invasion of Iraq, so this Saturday March 22 there'll be. . .a party? A danc ... More >>
Anti-war stars speak up
Though he's officially left the race for the White House John Edwards is still hoping to shape the debate, lending his name to a new "out of Iraq" movement and targeting John McCain for defeat. Edwards, the former North Carolina senator and twice-failed candidate for Democratic Party's pres ... More >>
A roundup of earmarks in the latest Defense bill
The Overwhelming and Black Watch prove that combat is hell anywhere
In the run-up to the invasion of Iraq, there was no shortage of protest songs that sought to steer the nation off a post-9/11 collision course with a country that had nothing to do with the attack. The Beastie Boys, Cat Power, Thurston Moore, John Mellencamp, R.E.M. and Zach De La Rocha were among t ... More >>
New doc looks at our other unknown soldiers: the for-hires


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As agencies throughout the federal government prepare for shrinking budgets, technology will be the key component of surviving fiscal lockdown and keeping critical operations running smoothly, according to Defense Department CIO Teri Takai.
But technology alone won't be enough – behind it there must be serious innovation that solves problems in different ways than in the past, she said.
"It's a challenge in any large setting to really get to innovation. Innovation has to make a difference – there has to be a 'so what' in terms of enhancing capability or enhancing customer service," Takai said at the ACT-IAC Excellence.gov awards luncheon in Washington March 13.
The awards recognized government agencies using technology to improve their services, whether it was better interaction with citizens, smoother operations for tasks like renewing driver's licenses, enhancing cross-agency collaboration or implementing efficiencies that save money.
Takai admitted that her own challenges at DOD tend to be a little different than other government entities, although there are plenty of similarities, she said.
One of her priorities is getting a handle on the sheer volume of technology at DOD – one area in which the department is different from most agencies.
"I'm not pushing technology; I have so much technology that it's really about, how do you manage that and get control of it? What do you do with it?" she said. "We spend $38 billion a year on technology, which is a staggering number. The challenge for us is how to bring those technologies together, how to make sure we can share information and how to make sure we can meet our increasing cybersecurity threat."
But more familiar to offices outside the Pentagon are issues in IT consolidation, another high-profile effort that's also going on at DOD.
"It's not just a technology challenge or a physical challenge; it's actually about convincing people to use a service, trust someone else to run [their] stuff and…meet customer demands," Takai said. "We need to look at ourselves as an enterprise and not 772 data centers."
Takai stressed that despite the different missions and political dynamics at various organizations, there are some key lessons everyone can use: be persistent; sell ideas by keeping things simple rather than technical and complex; think outside of individual departments; and have a champion for the cause.
For her work at DOD, taking these steps while still adequately funding national defense "means taking as many…kinds of efficiencies that we can take to make us run better, more agile and more technologically competent so we can make sure the warfighter is supported, even in the face of decreasing budgets," Takai said.
More information on the award winners can be found here.
About the Author
Amber Corrin is a former staff writer for FCW and Defense Systems.
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Nominations are now open for the 2015 Federal 100 awards. Get the details and submit your picks!
Make a nomination today
Slowly but surely, the agency's ability to handle cybersecurity has evolved -- but experts say key hurdles remain.
Department credits a fully deployed computer system with helping make a sizable dent in the department's disability claims backlog.
A key contributor to Clinger-Cohen argues that federal IT has failed to take advantage of the tools that law provided.
A new report surveys the many different approaches to launching a dedicated innovation shop in government.
Nominations for 2015 are being accepted now through Dec. 23.
The flip side of default data encryption on mobile devices is that a lost or stolen device won't yield up its secrets -- an important feature for many federal employees.
A decade after the 9/11 Commission identified agencies' reluctance to share information as a dangerous shortcoming, the government is moving in the right direction.
The latest offering is intended to help agencies speed the process of deploying authorized cloud solutions.
Cartoonist John Klossner on the telltale indicators that not everything is running through the CIO.
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subset: commoncrawl


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Please note that changing your country whilst shopping will remove all items from your basket.
Fragrance Offer Of The Week
Save up to 60% on selected fragrances
£15 worth of points when you buy 3 or more selected fragrance gift sets
Complete gift set for the price of the fragrance
3 for 2 on selected celebrity gift sets
Copyright © The Boots Company PLC. All rights reserved. Boots.com is a trading name of Boots UK Limited. Registered office: Nottingham NG2 3AA.Registered in England: company number 928555. Registered VAT number 116300129. Registered pharmacy number 1092488.


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Narrow your search
In what Yahoo called "a whole new level of violation" for users, the GCHQ collected millions of images, many of them sexually explicit.
An ambulance drone carrying a defibrillator for rapid response to heart attacks has just been unveiled in the Netherlands.
What kind of person would pay a vast sum of money for a virtual one-on-one with someone in touch with their kink? Other than a rich person, of course.
When Miss Teen USA was remotely spied on via the built-in iSight camera on her laptop, the warning light indicating the camera was in use was never triggered.
An Australian man with previous child pornography charges is believed to have been the first convicted in an operation using a CGI child to lure predators.
It's an older model, but still chock full of Air-y goodness. Plus: Three bonus deals!
It's a no-brainer. If you routinely buy stuff from iTunes, here's a little extra bang for your 10 bucks. Plus: two bonus deals!
Here you will learn how to become a game-streaming master.
Browse our list of reviewed cameras to see if do-it-yourself home security is right for you.
Whether you're conducting an interview or just want to capture a bad customer-service call for posterity, these are your options.


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My heart melted, and my faith was uplifted after watching this video on "Saving Our Imaan (faith)" by 4 year old, Fatima Saleem Kodia. Masha Allah tabarakallah!
As I listened to this, I also thought of how many of us have grown up hearing about how we must learn from our elders. Yet, time and time again, I see these youth that break the barriers of stereotypes. Size, age, experience, are not reasons for judging a person's ability to bestow wisdom. Sometimes, even ants can teach giants a lesson.
May Allah continue to guide her, keep her on a path of wisdom, happiness, righteousness, and confidence. May she be an example to the generations to come, and a reminder to parents, new and old, that potential sparks at any time, and it's important to help children shine in their own way. I pray to have a child that is happy, righteous, and driven like her, and pray the same for all of you.
Muslim or not, this video is a must-see. It's all about love, faith, and community…all from the heart and voice of the most pure and limitless of souls: a child.


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It may not be surprising to some that groups and organizations across the country that are so openly opposed to "bullying" are so adept at it. Politically correct groups advancing the same-sex agenda are pervasive in their denunciation of bullying against those who are "different" yet seem to have mastered the practice against those who don't share their beliefs. The recently announced review of the Boy Scouts of America policies, which reject avowed homosexuals from membership, provides a case study in collective bullying and intimidation of a quality organization dedicated to instilling character in its members.
Bullying, broadly defined, is the "use of force or coercion to abuse or intimidate others. It can include verbal harassment or threat, physical assault or coercion and may be directed repeatedly towards particular victims on grounds of race, religion, gender, sexuality, or ability. If done by a group, it's referred to as mobbing."
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Bullying has occurred, and does still occur for various reasons, and should be proscribed as socially unacceptable behavior universally, at all levels. If universally applied, denunciation of the groups engaged in bullying of pro-family organizations should be as vociferous as against individuals who engage in bullying against those who are "different." But in the hypocritical and duplicitous world of political correctness, bullying is not only condoned, but encouraged against groups that advance traditional values.
To some, bullying is clearly acceptable, as long as it's politically correct. Significant corporate and non-profit sponsors and supporters of Scouting have withdrawn their support, including financial, in order to bully the BSA into complying with the radical pro-gay agenda. AT&T, Ernst and Young, Intel, Merck & Company, United Way, and others have curtailed or discontinued their support to the tune of millions of dollars. The financial component takes bullying to a whole new level.
It seems an interesting dichotomy that an organization that itself is so committed to anti-bullying within its ranks, would become the target of bullying by those who profess to support the same commitment. All the more inscrutable when we realize that less than 3% of the total U.S. population is homosexual. "Tyranny of the minority" is no longer theoretical. It is a political and social reality as verified by the bullying actions against the Boy Scouts.
A decision on the organization's ban on gay members was delayed by the 75 member executive board. The delay until May will allow the 1,400-member National Council to decide whether to continue the ban or give in to the bullying tactics, allowing local units to decide for themselves. Chief Scout Executive Wayne Brock said, "the proposal to end the ban came about as outside forces put pressure on the Scouts to address its policy on gays." Even the possibility of reversal of national policy diminishes the perception of the safety and well-being of Scouts as a top priority to the organization.
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In 2000, the Supreme Court upheld the BSA, that the constitutional right of association allows a group to exclude a person from membership when "the presence of that person affects in a significant way the group's ability to advocate public or private viewpoints." Clearly the agenda of the politically correct crowd is antithetical to Scouting's core values.
The views expressed in this opinion article are solely those of their author and are not necessarily either shared or endorsed by WesternJournalism.com.


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East African famine blame game begins
admin August 2nd, 2011
Sadly for the people suffering in the Horn of Africa, the famine there is destined to become a case history of international inaction in advance of a known disaster, a 'How not to do it' of emergency preparation and response. And all of the key players – governments, aid agencies, UN organisations – are already lining up to say that it was not their fault, even before the much-needed aid has really begun to arrive.
The first jolt to the emergency relief system was delivered by the Tsunami at Xmas 2004 when the existing systems were found wanting. In particular, too many organisations turned up to help with little or no coordination. Chaos ensued.
Some progress had been made on this front by the time the earthquake hit Haiti in January 2010, but there was still a fair amount of chaos.
- East Africa , News
- Comments Off


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I've been in this forum for over 10 years and in the last 2 months the influx of new WS's has been great...truly!
However, the statements of "judgmental people" "Attacked!" is irrational and nothing more than a means to deflect the real issue...your affair and inability to be accountable.
I know of just about every single infidelity support site on the internet and don't think I'm not a member of most of them I can promise you there is no where near close to how protected this forum is. If you think you're getting attacked in here...go out there and see what you're up against.
When we created the WS Forum, it was almost 2 years after SI launched. MH and I went up against our original Moderators because we felt so strongly that the internet needed a place just for WS's to help work through their issues. This particular forum is very close to our hearts.
We moderators spend an enormous amount of time on SI and much of it is in this forum protecting YOU. Not only do you have us Moderator...but you also have the ability to block BS replies by LEAVING THE STOP SIGN ICON ON. Its on by default, so if you clicked it off, then that's your deal.
Use this site for support but stop acting like a 7th grader.
Vent over.
My tolerance for stupid shit is getting less and less.
I know from personal experience that most moderators work on a voluntary basis, I'm assuming you do too and so, thank you for dedicating so much of your time and hard work to making this such a safe place for all of us.
Infidelity is such a hard topic to talk about, emotions will always run high but this is definitely the best site I've come across. All the members I've spoken to on here have been supportive and understanding.
[This message edited by BrokenButTrying at 3:45 PM, February 7th (Friday)]
My Ddays - 01/2010 & 12/04/14
His Dday - 23/12/13
Chin up. Unwavering. Fight. I can do this.
BS here. I've been on SI for about 6 months and it has to be the fairest, best moderated site I've seen. This at a time when emotions are running at the highest most people will experience in their lifetimes.
Just want to say thank you. It's been the difference, for me, between coping and entering the loony bin.
The truth hurts, but nowhere near as much as the lies
"Sounds harsh, but she's my wife and I'm supposed to be there when she's having sex" Sal1995
We love SI and the community here and we believe in the mission statement of healing
I'm really glad you both are here with us
As a BH I have tried to offer support on the WS forum because I never saw any remorse in my own experiences. Not just remorse but any fixing of those issues. In the case of my xww every time I have someone volunteer new information it is never good. I get no satisfaction from that. I wished (and still do wish) that she would resolve her own issues regardless of how things were left between her and I. It would be better for her, her family and most importantly her daughter (my step-daughter).
The bottom line is the purpose of SI is to help everyone heal. So thanks again.
I feel the WS's are very lucky to have you help them in here. You along with several other BS's really go above and beyond with your support, but also constructive guidance...thank you
I know of just about every single infidelity support site on the internet and don''t think I''m not a member of most of them
I don't post in the Wayward forum much, but the fact that it exists as it does really demonstrates that SI is about helping people heal after the trauma of infidelity.
Lol. You ARE everywhere.
I own the internet
That's a good point FP...I think you're right. WS's that are currently in their affair and come here I don't think are prepared to hear the hard truths from other WS's. That's when we're accused of drinking the kool-aid
My hope is for them to stick around or at least come back when they're more focused on ending their affair and looking inward towards healing.
Then I began reading some wayward threads and started seeing the hard work and dedication they displayed while they busted their heinies. To see the effort and reflection they would put in not even knowing if their BSs would still be there a day, a week, a month, even a year later. They put in actions, expressed remorse and I had rarely seen this type of effort on any other forum before in my life.
Yes, I literally hated (strong word but 100% appropriate) any and all waywards when I got here, and that hate turned into respect when I saw the earth shattering effort so many put in. To own their sh!t, find their whys, learn about themselves, and begin to fix themselves and their marriages.
Then I noticed one more thing, just how many waywards would sign up and how many would fade away once the going got tough. That alone told me that earning an F was an extremely challenging thing to do. As the saying goes; Many are called, but the chosen are few and the amazing thing is that the chosen ones made those choices to fight through the fog and earn those Fs themselves!! I realized that it takes GUTS for a wayward to look into that mirror; to recognize what has actually happened was solely their choice despite the circumstances and decide to make a change.
When one contrasts the stories of WS learning about themselves, healing past hurts and moving past their choices against some of the stories of unremorseful waywards who run from the truth from many BSs on this site, it truly blew my mind how strong remorseful waywards on their way to earning their Fs really are. I learned (and to this day am still learning) that the only way to ever earn that F, is to acknowledge that at one point in time, one was a WS by choice.
So I guess my message to any WS who may be lurking or stung by 2 x 4s in certain threads is that if the message stings, its because it hit close to home. Examine why it stung and begin to unravel the layers. The FWS and the FWS in training here are freaking amazing and wont steer you wrong. Yeah Ive been on some other sites, and I can tell you that if you think this one is bad, there are others out there where it literally feels like they level an elephant gun at you and blast away.
The only way through this sh!t sandwich is to go through it. Running from the truth only seems easier as opposed to fixing ones issues. And to quote a saying about running from the truth; If you start running, you have to keep running, and its very tiring in the long run.
I know I couldn't have come up with the solution that is now the Wayward Forum.
I too need to back up your comment to "Brandon" as I have been noticing his posts as well & thinking he was giving some very good advice, so way to go Brandon. (and the others not mentioned at this time!!!)
Sad we have to have this website at all but am so glad it is here!!!
the new WS bristling at the wayward vets all giving them similar advice, and calling them out on logical fallacies and whatnot.
To Deeply♥ and all the Mods, Admins & Guides...
Both Crazz and I thank you from the bottom of our hearts for everything you do.
I couldn't be more grateful for this site and particular the WS forum. I am certain that without the support of the members here, I would be divorced today. It's pretty incredible when you think about it. Not just the moderators and guides, but the members to take time from their day to read and offer their guidance and support. This massive group of people can come together with no other motive than to get help and then return that favor. Understandably emotions can run high, but in the long run I believe we want the same outcome... To be healthy.
Some of us can get there with minor speed bumps, others (like myself) get there kicking and screaming, not always ready to hear the hard truths. But of you keep coming back, keep reading things will start to click and eventually sink in.
I log on daily to remind myself where I have come from and what I am still working towards. I appreciate all that goes into having a place to help so many people heal from infidelity.
Former 80s Icon wishful thinking
Many seem to want to be the first to clobber the newbie in an unconscious effort to garner acceptance from the SI community, or to demonstrate how far they have come
I disagree.
My take is that there are two distinct 'styles' of advice giving in the Wayward forum.
I don't believe there is any motivation "unconscious" or otherwise except wanting to help newbies 'see the light'.
First style 'Warm & Fuzzie'. Supportive, sympathetic, empathic, concilatory, lots of words to indicate it's only an opinion in deference to the OP's sensibilities.
Second style 'Wake up & Smell The Coffee'. Blunt, to the point, this is reality, take it or leave it.
Both 'styles' have merit, neither one is right or wrong.
Both can be taken too far. (something I have been guilty of)
Of course that's just my humble opinion, as long as no one is offended, gets upset or feels judged.
ETA: I have noticed a lot of fans of the 'Warm & Fuzzie' style passing judgement on the use of the 'Wake up & Smell The Coffee' style.
I have yet to see the opposite.
Just an observation.
[This message edited by SlowUptake at 10:18 PM, February 7th (Friday)]
"Do not say a little in many words but a great deal in a few." Pythagoras
There are two kinds of people in the world.
Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data.
I edit often because I make a lot of typos. ☺
And you know what? It didn''t make a bit of difference. I wasn''t ready. I hadn''t hit bottom yet.
Instead, we were ganging up on her and scolding her for not thinking correctly.
Personally I didn''t see that happen, but I won''t dispute your interpretation of it.
Hopefully she will return, because she is clearly a troubled soul in need of a little understanding.
ITA. So was I. And I did return. Thanks y''all.
There has been enough support caring, and truths , that have kept me from faltering. Almost like a mothers care. lol sorry if to feely or sentimental.
As a mother you have to nurture and support but you also speak truths and prepare for reality.
I think this entire forum lets this process happen. And only the ones ready to accept can see the benefit. I have, and am thankful and greatful that you all have given us this place.
Thank you,
I am not trying to be disrespectful to what the moderators are trying to do to help people and i apologize if you took it that way
However, how do you not see that you are being judgemental when your 3rd paragraph calls me out as "being irrational and not dealing with the real issues which is infidelity". And then said I was acting as a 7th grader at the end.
I am curious to know how you know this to be true. Because I didnt answer a question in a certain way, or didnt use the right words to prove to you that I want to change. Or just because I raised the issue?
Where is the objectivity in your statements? Do you not need objectivity because you have reached the other side of infidelity and know the only path to it.
If people didnt want to change they would never look for help, find this site or post their stories.
As I have said, I think this is a powerful healing community but I am concerned that many comments tend to boarder on self righteousness from waywards. When someone has reached the other side of infidelity they then become moralisticly superior and intolerant of the opinions and behavior of others.....particularly those that waver and struggle. Just as we justify our behavior in our affairs, we justify self righteousness as being ok because we are trying to "help" someone.
I am still here dealing with my issues, trying to get the point where you are at, I just dont always agree with how some people choose to employ their help.
[This message edited by Marriedman2013 at 11:51 PM, February 7th (Friday)]
I had to back off from posting when I first joined SI because I had been doing EVERYTHING wrong for two years before I found this site. Now I tend to be very blunt with newly betrayed spouses. I'm not touchy-feely, and won't blow smoke.
I have a number of friends who are former waywards, and I love and respect them deeply. Listen carefully, and take what you need. You won't find a safer place.
No longer together
"To be loyal to myself is to allow myself to grow and change, and challenge who I am and what I think."
[This message edited by Wayflost at 12:08 AM, February 9th (Sunday)]
There are newbies (such as myself) that need to hear the hard truth and others that aren't ready. I find that if you want to make a point, do it respectfully. Tough love isn't rude and it doesn't come from a place of judgement. No one on here (at least to my knowledge) is a MC or IC and you should treat advice on here like all advice on the internet.
I will continue to read and post but I certainly will be pointing posters who cross a line.
Married 8 years.
1 Child
DDay: March 2012
Perfect system? No. But you (general statement) can be damn sure we want the waywards who come here to feel safe and supported. Or at least learn the tools they need to heal and get through the shitstorm they created.
How is somebody going to heal if they only hear 'good job', or if they don't get real suggestions for a very real and destructive fuck up?
I never understand it when a wayward comes here and is told 'that was a crappy thing to do', or 'you need to cut the shit' and they get offended. Cheating IS a crappy thing to do. You DO need to cut the shit.
We're not talking about puppies and rainbows here. Sometimes it doesn't feel good, sometimes posts make us angry, make us sad, make us happy. Feel the feelings, open your ears, realize that people posting to you know what you're talking about. Everybody here has BTDT in one form or another. Of course it doesn't all apply to you, but some thing, many things that people post are going to help. I guarantee it.
Listen up, this is all good stuff here. Free therapy!
Oh, and take what you need and leave the rest.
"That's the thing about pain, it demands to be felt."
The very first sentence in my original post clarifies that this not about any on person in particular.
I am still here dealing with my issues, trying to get the point where you are at, I just dont always agree with how some people choose to employ their help.
And that's great that you're still here!! No one is saying you have to agree with everything here, all I'm saying is for you (again, general term) stop viewing things as an "attack" "bashing" etc., just because someone else has a different point of view.
[This message edited by SI Staff at 7:57 AM, February 8th (Saturday)]
As a BS, I too have gotten a few 2 x 4s, when I was dealing with my original WS who was a SA but I didn't want to see it (and I kept getting the same reaction to everything I posted...he is STILL an addict, he is STILL manipulating, WAKE UP) and I eventually did. (Thank you so much from the bottom of my heart to everyone in the "old days" who gave me the truth even when I didn't want to hear it.
And in NB when I was dating and making more bad choices (and I kept thinking, wait! I've done all the self growth I need to, ouch, and then, shoot, I obviously still have more issues to address....)
Being coddled, being gentle, being subtle....that is great for children and babies. Being told the truth and being expected to own your own issues means you are being treated like an adult. You may not want to hear it, it may not "feel good". But when you are making unhealthy choices in your life, someone needs to put it right there in front of your face. Because when we don't want to deal with our own problems, and we are in pain (especially of our own making because of stupid mistakes) people coddling us isn't going to teach us anything. AA works so well for those that are ready for it because the old-timers there can "smell" when you are lying and not being authentic. Same here. Those that BTDT can "smell" when someone else is making the same mistakes they made and will call them out on them because truth is the only thing that truly works.
And I do want to get in a THANK YOU!!! I LOVE YOU GUYS!!! to the administrators and moderators on this site. They are an amazing, dedicated group of people (as are the ones that stick around to help others).
[This message edited by NaiveAgain at 8:17 AM, February 8th (Saturday)]
It is not meant to be judgmental or an attack. More on the lines of being an ocean of cold water thrown in your face to get new and old waywards to see the damage they are doing or have done.
Some waywards come here and are remorseful and all they need is steering in what they should be doing and what to expect from their BS.
Others come here regretful, but not remorseful and still in ME,ME,ME mode. When that is pointed out, the reflex action is to become defensive.
"You don't know me"
No I don't,but I know infidelity and what comes along with it
"You're judging me"
No I'm holding the mirror up so you can see how
you have destroyed your marriage and if you don't change, you may never get it back.
If I was being judgmental, I would be calling women names like whore and slut.
I would be calling men scumbags,dirtbags and deadbeats. ( I have called OM those names..guilty, but not waywards trying to get help)
No one is here to run you off. We're all here to help.
Thanks to DS,MH and all the Mods,Guides and Administrators for their hard work and dedication.
Thanks to all the members here for making this a great place to get help.
In retrospect...no one is here to attack or judge anyone...like the motto goes...
Take what you need and leave the rest
Judgmental why? Because you (general term) feel threatened that someone isn't on "your side". If you need someone on your side, look at your AP. But then...there's a reason why you're on SI so obviously that AP isn't really "all that" otherwise you wouldn't be looking for help right? There is something deeper within, screaming for help, and you know the AP isn't the answer.
You want someone to help you? Listen to what they're saying. One would imagine that a person that's been there, done that, bears the scars, has the t-shirt, and is running that marathon juuuuuust mught know what they're doing. And yeah it's hard. I get my butt handed to me all the time. On the boards, via PM. It's tough to listen to this stuff. But I also know they've been right 100% of the time.
"Courage is being scared to death and saddling up anyway." - J. Wayne
I have a lot of compassion for WSs who are still in the early stages of wanting to deal with their issues and the fallout but aren't quite there yet. It is harder for me to muster a lot of sympathy for complaints about not liking the advice being given by other WSs. I might feel differently if I thought that BSs were treated any differently, but if you read through some of the longer threads started by BSs you quickly see that along with the care, concern, and warm fuzzies, there are plenty of warnings, admonishments, and wake up calls dished out.
I recall one time a couple of years ago I posted about something that was really bothering me. I was looking for validation for my feelings and someone to say "poor you". What I got instead was a lot of pointed questions that I admit felt a lot like judgement. But, when I stepped back and thought about it, they were right. I had not really figured out why I felt the way I did, and the comments I received pointed me in directions I hadn't considered. I figured out that my problem that time wasn't my H, but the way I was thinking. Although I didn't realize it at the time, the support I was getting was way more helpful than "poor you" ever could have been. I had to get past not getting what I hoped for in order to see that, though.
I know the intent is to help WS work through their issues, but as a BS the wayward forum has been a real gift. It encouraged me to believe that my H was worth taking another chance on. I don't think that would have been possible if I hadn't seen the pain expressed here, and the responses that contained both compassion and the occasional hard truth.
Edited for stupidautocorrect
[This message edited by cdnmommy at 9:46 AM, February 8th (Saturday)]
First of all, I will say emphatically and with very little doubt that JM and I would probably not be married today if he had not come to this forum, asked for help and followed the advice he was given. He was smacked a couple of times and those were the replies that helped him (and us) the most.
Second, there is a saying in the rooms of AA that goes something like, "My best thinking is what got me here." And that is powerful, and true. My best thinking got me into a very destructive 20 year battle with addictions, an EA and being the OW in an online A. JM's best thinking got him into several As which were successively more and more destructive. If you are here as a wayward, your best thinking is what brought you here. So it would behoove you to take a step back and listen to others when you THINK they are wrong, or judgmental, or mean. Another saying I hear a lot is "Brain broke-first thought wrong." My first thought or response is usually not coming from a healthy place in my mind. I have learned to pause, and wait for the second or third thought before I react instinctively.
Lastly, I have been doing a lot of study this week on the difference between judgment and discernment. My church has been going through a long situation of drama and hurt feelings and wrong behavior. At the core of it was infidelity. Whether it was the appearance of infidelity, rumors and lies that had no basis in fact, or true infidelity only the people involved know for sure. But there was some very wrong behavior on the part of our pastor, our deacons and the members which needs to be corrected. And those of us who are striving for things to be made right have been accused of being judgmental and unforgiving. Well, there is a HUGE difference between being judgmental or passing judgment, and using discernment.
If you feel that someone (or a bunch of someones) is being judgmental, it may be that they are discerning something wrong in your attitude, your statements or your behavior that they need to challenge. You are here because you need help. (That's not directed at any one person, just a general statement.) If something pisses you off, that's probably an area that you really need to focus on.
While some see that as a failure of SI, I personally see that as a strength of the site. If the older wiser members of SI had not called me out from my very first post, I might never have gotten past the foggy side. Having my words analysed and poured over, my motives questioned and my thoughts judged were the very things that lead to my self-understanding. MissesJai, Maia, beach, UnexpectedSong, chasingpavements, Waywardson, authenticnow, Listeningclosely, ThoughtIKnewYa, Edie, Card, Fallen and BaxtersBFF are all on the list of WS's who called me out at various times. I am thankful that for them, providing support did not mean just agreeing to my every thought but it also meant calling a spade a spade and yes, that was often said in a very honest and blunt manner. Sometimes it was hurtful but I could see that even the critical judgmental remarks gave something to my self-healing.
I always understood and readily accepted that each member here, including the mods, were here on SI as a result of adultery being as much of a part in their lives as it was in mine. From day one, I clearly knew that the members were not professional therapists, psychotherapists and psychiatrists but rather, they were people just like me, either a WS or a BS in their own right. Depending on who relied to my posts, I could see that everyone had their own style. But in general, the community as a whole showed a uncanny ability to understand what I was going through, make concrete suggestions for healing and at times, swing the 2x4.
Each of us are individuals, unique and different but there a common thread that binds us all. the act of adultery. And with that core experience uniting us, all of us here have some BTDT experience to share. That shared experience is what binds us here. The truth is that if you dont see things the way that the crowd does, then thats your prerogative. Just as I am entitled to disagree with anything you said. That is why the adage of 'take what you need and leave the rest" is mentioned here time after time.
SI is not a touchy feelie place by its very institutional structure. This is not a place of detached, analytic and clinical discourse. This is a moderated forum for the lay WS to express their own personal issues. To give and receive support. And while you (in general) may control what support you offer and how that is offered including what words you use and how you present them, the truth is that you cannot control what the other members think, feel and offer up. Thats just not how this forum works.
Moderators do and will take steps including warnings, PM messages and locking threads where appropriate but they are not our mothers and they cannot police each and every message. The filtering of messages, helpful and harmful is left to ourselves. The phrase, put your big girl panties on, applies to all of us here regardless of our sex.
Again it cannot be said often enough, we are not a professional counselling service and so, the quality of advice that we offer is very much conditional on where each member is in their own self-growth, the emotional connection of the subject matter and the pain and hurt being reflected back.
Edited for spelling
[This message edited by HUFI-PUFI at 10:55 AM, February 8th (Saturday)]
Going back to Cornbread''s example. Every single Wayward who posted on Disastergirl''s thread was a "New Member" with fewer than 50 posts. Don''t get me wrong, the member with 45 posts is just as valuable to SI as one with 4500. But when we''re first facing our demons, it''s easier to project and displace onto others, than to look at ourselves. Thus the heightened sensitivity to being judged or attacked. Speaking from my anecdotal observations, and personal experience because I was *totally* this way...it''s quite often the New Member who can dish it out, but can''t take it. Totally normal, possibly unavoidable, part of the healing process IMO.
There wouldn''t be an SI without the contributions of new and veteran members, and SI doesn''t, and shouldn''t, depend upon the presence of any individual to thrive. I''m sad that we lost some members whose advice was instrumental to me in my early days, and I miss them. Without their (and many, many others''!) judgmental attacks I wouldn''t be where I am today.
As far as how the newbies sometimes get whacked (both BS and WS alike), I think it really depends on the situation and the 'tone' of the original poster in a particular thread. If the new WS has lurked long enough to spit out all the 'right' words, but still has that vague whiff of entitlement, affair-specialness, and "I-was-driven-to-this-by-a-loveless-marriage", then I think 2x4s are merited and are frequently given...becaue what that attitude calls for is not hugs, but hammers. given. People feel "ganged up on", because the people we have here that have BTDT have mostly arrived to similar viewpoints with the benefit of hindsight, and so the advice sounds similar. That's not a cult, or drinking kool-aid...that's just the collected wisdom of people who have lived in your situation, KWIM?
And it happens on the BS side as well. We see people arrive like weeks to a month after DDAY saying that their WS is 'doing all the right things' and 'showing remorse', and that they are reconciling and have forgiven their WS....only to let slip some info (once they get more comfortable here) that makes it sound like they are not reconciling, but rugsweeping. These people are in some serious hurt and fear, but supressing it and not seeing their situation clearly...those people need 2x4s, too, but it just takes a more gentle form, methinks.
Disastergirl''s thread was a "New Member" with fewer than 50 posts. Don''t get me wrong, the member with 45 posts is just as valuable to SI as one with 4500.
There is no single path to healing and if people took the time to actually stop, take a breathe, remember where this person is and then approach them...they might get a lot more success. There is not particular timeline or path to healing. No everyone has the same issues and not ever solution that worked for you is appropriate for someone else.
There is no single path to healing and if people took the time to actually stop, take a breathe, remember where this person is and then approach them...they might get a lot more success.
I guess my question is why should the person offering the advice be the one stopping and taking that breath? If someone comes here for advice it is hopefully because they acknowledge they need help. When I have needed the most help has typically been when I was thinking the least clearly, and that was when that deep breath, pause, and the question of "why am I reacting this way to what is being said?" has been the most beneficial.
That is why I made the comment about validation. Because I''ve been there, on this site, looking to have my feelings validated without even realizing that is what I was wanting. It was the other BSs who pushed me to look at myself. They didn''t lack compassion or understanding quite the opposite they were blunt with me because they understood exactly where I was coming from.
[This message edited by cdnmommy at 12:24 PM, February 8th, 2014 (Saturday)]
You SHOULD...isn't the same as Have you thought about x.
You SHOULDN'T do x isn't the same as How is x helping you forward...
You NEED to do x...
It's all about phrasing. No one is saying don't give advice...it's how you give it.
There are some older vet's that really do a great job of dispensing hard to hear advice in a way that isn't off putting.
Edited to say that HUFI-PUFI is an excellent example of how to give advice. Never one to hold back the truth but does it in a respectful manner!
[This message edited by smez at 12:49 PM, February 8th (Saturday)]
I have been told on my threads what I should do. Doesn't mean I have to do it. Phrasing doesn't bother me. If it bothers you then maybe its something to look at.
I can only control myself, no one else. I do not have that kind of power.
When prominent members leave, you're right, there is a void for a time being...but just like anything else that door continues to revolve and others, like you, step up It's a very natural progression of an online community.
Newbie or veteran member...everyone holds value and adds service to SI
I'm really enjoying this thread everyone!! Thank you to all of you that have taken the time to share
Yes, I can tell you why it annoys me rather than bothers me. I am rape crisis counselor for both the state of California and New York. I help rape survivors through the process of a hospital visit and I also help man a helpline. In our training we spend a lot of time talking about keeping our own bias and judgements out of our responses. I hear judgement from doctors/police ALL the freaking time. They all think they KNOW what the best advice/path is but often they don't. I apply those principal here. Listen first, think about what is going to productively get through to a person, respect someone who isn't ready to x or y and keep your own issues out of it.
I hope that explains where I am coming from. There are times when I'm dealing with certain clients (domestic abuse victims are a good example) that I don't agree with their choices but me yelling/berating or giving them "tough love" at a point they aren't willing to hear is neither productive or helpful to the process. Sometimes you have to watch people make mistakes and not support them but to be a voice of reason at the bottom.
PS: And I do ignore the advice that isn't helpful and take the parts that are good.
[This message edited by smez at 1:28 PM, February 8th (Saturday)]
If you're from the heart of Cali, do you go to Boston and tell the whole town on megaphone that they need to find a speech therapist to work on their whack accent? No. Does a Georgian go to Canada and tell them they cain't tawlk prawper Englesh? No. Does a Brit come to Kentucky and bash the country folk because Dahling, you are a lowly peasant and therefore cannot possibly know of which you speak? No.
We're all different. Sure we all have different accents and quirks about our speech patterns. Bottom line, it's the same dang language.
You SHOULD...isn't the same as Have you thought about x.
You SHOULDN'T do x isn't the same as How is x helping you forward...
You NEED to do x...
You NEED to do x...
Problem solved.
I'm not telling anyone how what advice they should give...Give away. Understand that if you can't EFFECTIVELY communicate that message, you are as good as shouting in the wind.
I'm am amused that everyone is up in arms that I suggested that you keep saying your message...just maybe do it a little politer.
For someone that is a counselor, you sure seem to like to argue alot
I'm not reading that anyone is 'up in arms' about your message, I think you've conveyed it just fine
I'm a big mouth. I have heard allllllll my life to lower the volume, shut up, "Are you deaf or something?!". Even when I think I'm quite, someone in the family is still whining about how loud I am.
But you know know what? That's who I am and how I was wired. I cannot change that about me. So they can accept that I'm noisy, or butt out.
Same applies here. Deal with the advice. Read between the lines you deem "impolite" and move on.
[This message edited by Aubrie at 1:53 PM, February 8th (Saturday)]
When I first started posting, I asked when do I come first. I was struggling with the daily realizations that WH was always choosing OW. I wanted validation. Didn't get it. I was told it stops when you say it does. Was it what I wanted to hear? No but it was what I needed to hear. Took me awhile to understand that.
[This message edited by isadora at 1:58 PM, February 8th (Saturday)]
You seem to contradict yourself. You say;
There is no single path to healing..There is not particular timeline or path to healing. No everyone has the same issues and not ever solution that worked for you is appropriate for someone else.
Then you proceed to tell some that they should to be more polite and ask more questions. Just because you respond to a certain style, doesn't mean that everyone does. You said yourself that "there is no single path to healing." So why do you want to change or inhibit other's path to healing?
..and if people took the time to actually stop, take a breathe, remember where this person is and then approach them...they might get a lot more success.
And lastly, I find it curious that you draw a parallel between how rape victims should be treated and how waywards should treat each other in an infidelity forum. Do you feel, as a wayward, that you are the victim here?
Would you however use the same approach with the rapist?
Do you feel, as a wayward, that you are the victim here?
Even if we all exercise proper decorum and politeness, I would hazard to guess that some posters will claim they are being attacked because they don't want to hear the message.
So true! This can apply to every type of member we have. I'm vehemently in agreement with this, I think due in large part to realizing that I'm totally guilty of this from time to time. Oh man.
Would you however use the same approach with the rapist?
Meaning, the wayward forum is about (in my observation, anyway) being a wayward spouse first and foremost, and discussing all the other stuff second. So when a WS strolls in saying "I know my BS had nothing to do with my affair..." and then jumps straight into marriage problems A, B, and C, some of the wayward vets redirect their focus...some newbies are more receptive than others, and some display significant pushback, to which the vets respond accordingly.
I read the other thread that was discussed upthread, and that person had a ONS previously, and then an online EA, and refused to tell her husband about either, assuming I'm not mistaken.
Hell, you can lurk here for one hour and be able to know that refusing to tell your BS about your affair(s) is going to be a non-starter for most people, resulting in a flurry of 2x4s at the very least. I mean, honesty with your spouse is the bare minimum for living in a healthy marriage, and if newbies can't (or refuse) to even meet that low, low bar for entry into a serious discussion with most everyone here, I don't know how they would expect to move forward with seeking out help here, you know? That's not saying that they shouldn't stick around, because they should, because maybe some of it will absorb eventually....but I don't know how a person could expect to go against the advice of nearly all of a forum of their peers and not get some pushback, you know?
Would you however use the same approach with the rapist?
Depends on the goal. One should use the same approach with the rapist if empathy and understanding is the goal.
One should use the same approach with the rapist if empathy and understanding is the goal.
Understand that if you can't EFFECTIVELY communicate that message, you are as good as shouting in the wind.
But what is effective for one person is not necessarily so for another. I have seen posters have their asses handed to them and respond that they were grateful for the blunt delivery.
Isadora - Why is phrasing so important?
Smez - Yes, I can tell you why it annoys me rather than bothers me.
At a certain level, I agree with Smez that phrasing is important.
Quite often, we are guilty of assuming that the language we speak is the same language that others hear. In fact, in the study of linguistics, its apparent that language is elastic and its structure and meaning relies on a complex web of social convention and learning. When I studied labour law, one of the earliest lessons was to learn and understand the difference between the words should, could, must, shall etc. as they all have very specific definitions of duty and responsibility even though in day to day speech, most people use them interchangeably.
Words can be used to be very precise and exact and the same words can be used to express only generalities.
Everyone understands that the statement of can you pass the salt during a dinner conversation is not really a question of ability (have you the physical capacity to lift and move the salt shaker) but in fact, in normal conversation, everyone understands that its the same as using more proper statement of would you please pass the salt to me.
Maybe at one time, teachers would fuss over the misuse of that phrase but IRL, nobody really worries about things like that in their day to day talks unless of course, youre a lawyer or linguist. LOL
However, depending on who you talk to and their very unique and particular relationship to language, you will find that syntax, grammar and phrasing will make a world a difference in communicating ideas or information. In fact, depending on the complexity of the information being communicated, the misuse of language, grammar etc. will either make or break the effectiveness of the communication.
Same words, totally different meaning.
End of T/J
[This message edited by HUFI-PUFI at 5:54 PM, February 8th (Saturday)]
Demanding to mince words sounds like another deflection tactic sometimes. You're not speaking my language so you're attacking or bullying me in an ignorant way.
I also feel working with sensitive populations of people do not make you more knowledgeable or less deserving of criticism. I could be wrong but throwing out working with rape victims is an attempt at making posters retreat.
^^ basically the same request phrased 3 different ways.
IMHO, all are judgments (labeling as immature); though some are easier on the ears.
Can I-- in my mind-- rephrase "grow the fuck up" to "a little maturity, please"? ... sure I can ... as soon as you quit acting like a 7th grader.
I had a runin with my BH yesterday, He posted a comment in FB and I took offense to it as to how it came across, we've had this discussion before, both ways. I will say something or as he did type something, and it was read heard wrong.
I think sometimes that's how some of we may type does. SOMETIMES. Most of the time. I think its our own defenses that cause the response. I try to even say to my self "it might have better , instead of I should have done...." They really do give you a different thinking directions.
However. I am really surprised that once again we have so many pages discussing how any of us are treated on the WS forum. The only words should be thanks for having this page. Not discussing the sementics of how a newbie decides to leave because THEIR not ready to face the truths.
. I think the last time a thread was started it went on forever. Sorry to all you moderators and guides.
I am just thank ful for the care the advice the support and the 2x4's
Now I'm headed back into the forum to see who I can practice my wording on. Sorry had to say it lol
I've been in this forum for over 10 years and in the last 2 months the influx of new WS's has been great...truly!
Well the cynical mind I have read that and had to remember where I was (SI) and who wrote it (DS). I am glad those who need it are coming here. Sad why they are here (as I know you are). Guess thats the same way to feel about a friend in the hospital.
Ive seen people attacked here. Sometimes I would take a softer approach but thats me. And usually I think the attacked is nail on the head stuff. Its not just in WS either. I think its not a bad idea to try and remember everyone is different and we all respond to different approaches. Like I did when reading what DS started this with, remember there is a real person on the other end of that statement and trying to understand who they are/where there at is pretty useful stuff if we are trying to communicate. Thats as applicable to the newbie as it is the vet IMO. I dont think the newbies necessarily think about that. The mods are pretty fair IMO and I think they help people out when the responses are not helping. Sometimes they just gotta ask. Ive found them pretty receptive to PMs.
Nothing is perfect. In some ways it is better that way. Ive disagreed with the Mods decisions at times, but its not my job to juggle the needs of the many. So I get to disagree, I just dont get to be disrespectful. There are a few vets that are gone that I sorely miss. I hated it when it happened. Wish they could have behaved themselves in public so they could still be here.
BTW SamathaBaker do you like beef jerky? the old stuff is kind of tough just sayin
[This message edited by foundoutlater at 6:45 PM, February 8th (Saturday)]
I'm only going to comment on one thing, and that is that I would NOT be surprised to find that DS and MH are the true "owners" of the internet.
Here is the problem to me:
It's implicit that WS come to this site seeking guidance, yeah? I think that's safe to assume.
So, complaining that said guidance wasn't provided in a 'nice' enough manner is like saying that you're not going to use that drill that you received for Christmas and *really* needed...because the box and/or wrapping paper wasn't *shiny* enough. It's missing the point of what's being offered.
I will wholeheartedly agree that language is ridiculously important. I am a reader, and I enjoy writing and language in all it's forms and nuances...but this is not a creative writing circle, KWIM? We're not workshopping our drafts around to the group to be dissected for style points and creativity.
If, in life, you fail (or refuse; choose your own adventure) to accept the meaning and spirit behind what is being said in favor of the wrapping that it's enveloped in....then you might as well grab a Capri Sun and some orange slices and hit the sidelines, 'cuz it's going to be a loooooooong fútbol game (of life) for you.
I'd advocate this approach for the new WS poster who doesn't like the tone of the advice: just deal with it and accept it. I don't mean that in a snarky way either, like the preceding paragraph. I mean accept it in the same way that the WS has to choke down other parts of the shit sandwich of infidelity, like being checked-up on, or not trusted, or attending IC and/or reading...consider it a cool, new coping mechanism with which to go out and tackle the world and interpret new language and experiences. Give it a try for a little bit; if you don't like it, you can always go back.
ETA: This doesn't just apply to WS. I know a ton of BH/BW and other people in life who could afford a paradigm shift as well.
[This message edited by FacePunched at 7:02 PM, February 8th (Saturday)]
Yes, I can tell you why it annoys me rather than bothers me. I am rape crisis counselor for both the state of California and New York. I help rape survivors through the process of a hospital visit and I also help man a helpline. In our training we spend a lot of time talking about keeping our own bias and judgements out of our responses. I hear judgement from doctors/police ALL the freaking time. They all think they KNOW what the best advice/path is but often they don't. I apply those principal here. Listen first, think about what is going to productively get through to a person, respect someone who isn't ready to x or y and keep your own issues out of it.
I'm in school for counseling and have done a bit on my own so far also. And what I understand is that this is not a site for professional counseling for your issues. This is a site for regular people who may or may not be trained in communication. There is tremendous diversity on this site and what works for one person may not work for another. So isn't it wonderful that there are so many different ways and communication styles that each member can add to the different threads so there is a greater chance that at least ONE of them will be something that the poster can draw from?
[This message edited by NaiveAgain at 7:23 PM, February 8th (Saturday)]
The BS hired a PI and oh how wonderful it was to show the evidence. The OM dumped her to go back to his BW and threw her under the bus. Their relationship was built on lies and smoke. Nothing special. Fantasy gone. The BW divorced him due to the lies and got lots of money and assets in the divorce due to the PI's evidence of cheating. Good for her!
Listen to the people here. Their words are worth the weight in gold.
I think you make a really great point and that it sums it up perfectly .
If not for the wayward form I would be D'd or living in the pre-d-day hell of hurting and not knowing why. KBFF found this site and here found the courage, support and knowledge she needed to tell me of her affair and to become a new beautiful person inside.
But it was not easy. I don't know about the rest of you (generalized ) but when I'm hurting or mad I'm very narrow minded and short sighted. I never cuss but sometimes the only thing that gets through is
Grow the fuck up
I am an advocate of respectful language but I also believe in the plain truth and sometimes I think the only way to reach someone in the fog is through blunt tough love. It has worked for KBFF and I am forever grateful.
Always be yourself, but always be your better self. - Karl G. Maeser
- - - - - - -
Dyslexic...please ignore my spelling.
There is no doubt in my mind that the tough love I got from my coach was critical to my success. Politely telling me to try harder and to please give it 110% would not do it. But when coach yells at you "is that all you've got!?" "You gonna quit!?" Yeah, that's when I find my fight and last bit of strength.
I firmly believe I wouldn't be here (recovered) if I hadn't learned how to fight to the end and not to throw in the towel.
I realize not everyone responds to the coach shouting in their ear. But some do and that's who I can help.
[This message edited by Mrs Panda at 9:05 PM, February 8th (Saturday)]
I'm a huge John Wooden fan.
"Whatever you do in life, surround yourself with smart people who'll argue with you."
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be."
John Wooden
[This message edited by SlowUptake at 9:39 PM, February 8th (Saturday)]
On this or other forums, words are just words. Exaggeration for effect can be lost in translation. Holden Caulfield is bored to death, so should we hold a funeral? I think it's important to really consider what you post and how it may be interpreted. Nowadays, I try to stay on point when posting, rather than using hyperbolic verbiage to try to force a point. Not sure I'm successful, but I'm mindful.
Also, thank you for this WS forum and the safety here. You guys are the best.
DS and MH implemented changes over the following year or so to prevent attacks on the WSes who came to SI to work on themselves. Something interesting began to happen then. WSes who were trying to help each other were frequently shouted down by hurting and angry BSes before. After the forum was protected and more heavily moderated, WSes filled that "get a grip" void. I know my posting style was sometimes blunt and sometimes not. As a FWS, it didn't come from a place of judgment or feeling superior. It came from not wanting another hurting person to make the same wrong and painful choices I did.
That's the thing... we don't say this stuff to be mean or to judge. We say it because we know your pain and we hurt for you. I said it because I don't want another soul to be as stupid as I was. I desperately wanted you to GET IT so you could get on with your healing.
Wishing peace and healing for all of you- and saying thanks once again to DS and MH for being such a huge part of my recovery. Love you guys!
"There would be no grand absolution, only forgiveness meted out in these precious sips. It would well up from his heart in spoonfuls, and he would feed it to me. And it would be enough."
1. Rape victims...I was making an analogy about my experiences in communicating. I agree that this isn't a professional therapy site. And for those that think I was deflecting...I wasn't, I was trying to explain where I was coming from.
2. No one is arguing against the content. The content is good. I like the content.
I occasionally think the style that the content is delivered in could be improved upon. That is all.
THE STYLE. No one is stopping you from being rude but don't grasp your pearls and drag out the "You just don't like what I am saying" defense when you get called out on it.
Let me post several threads in case you missed me.
I'd be interested to see the posts in which "shredding" takes place. I'm here volunteering as often as I can, and I must have just missed those.
That's the thing... we don't say this stuff to be mean or to judge. We say it because we know your pain and we hurt for you. I said it because I don't want another soul to be as stupid as I was. I desperately wanted you to GET IT so you could get on with your healing.
I feel like I've said this in just about every one of these off-angle discussions. 99.9% of the members aren't here looking for puppies to kick. They messed up, got help, and want to pass it along. Whether it's a FWS who saw the light of day, or a BA who found the strength to cut their codependent ties and make their own path. The harshness, the "judgment" that so many perceive as nasty is in truth just projection from someone who is trying to help you. Like Fallen said, they're begging you not to make the same mistakes that you did. Maybe they don't GET you. Maybe they don't know what you go through day in and day out and all the subtle differences that make your situation unique. That's why, you may recall, most of these sycophantic Kool-Aid drinking assholes who spend time away from their families and leisure activities to type words online to others in pain keep saying over and over, "TAKE WHAT YOU NEED. LEAVE THE REST."
ETA: I realize my tone is a bit ironic here. I'll admit, my feelings are hurt at being called a sycophant, and I know too many good souls here who donate their time to keep guns out of people's mouths. Despite some hurtful things being said here, I'm still glad for the thread. Taking what I need. Leaving the rest.
[This message edited by Jrazz at 1:38 AM, February 9th (Sunday)]
The fact you made my post an attack on you and went off the rails with it is odd. Why personalize? I've read a phrase on here very often stated. If something makes you angry probably should look at it. Good suggestion. Here's another one. Just calm down. I'm leaving and you can go back to being safe. Relax.
I'm leaving and you can go back to being safe. Relax.
OK own up, who divided by zero?
Armageddon is upon us.
Ragnorok is here.
Chaos will now reign.
in other news:
The few members that were not in line were certainly not supported or even debated.
ETA: Clarification of 'opinions' and debating.
verb: debate; 3rd person present: debates; past tense: debated; past participle: debated; gerund or present participle: debating
argue about (a subject), especially in a formal manner.
"MPs debated the issue in the Commons"
synonyms: discuss, confer about, talk over, talk through, talk about, exchange views on, exchange views about, thrash out, argue, argue about, argue the pros and cons of, dispute, wrangle over, bandy words concerning, contend over, contest, controvert, moot;
[This message edited by SlowUptake at 7:56 AM, February 9th (Sunday)]
I'd like to take a stab at addressing this post by FacePunched because I think it is very important.
If, in life, you fail (or refuse; choose your own adventure) to accept the meaning and spirit behind what is being said in favor of the wrapping that it's enveloped in....then you might as well grab a Capri Sun and some orange slices and hit the sidelines, 'cuz it's going to be a loooooooong fútbol game (of life) for you.
If any of you have read some Stephen Covey, you might be familiar with this visual.
We, as human beings, have much more success and get greater results when we focus on our circle of influence. If we work on things that we can actually influence, we not only find we get results, but we find that the circle of influence grows to encompass more of our area of concern.
For the purposes of this thread, our circle of influence is "the message". And our area of concern is "the delivery".
Folks are saying "focus on the message". Others are saying "deliver it more nicely". I'd suggest that the part the receiver of the message has influence over is what they choose to focus on. If you participate in this forum focusing on what you can influence, actually looking for the meaning in the message, you are likely to be more successful. You can be concerned about about how that message is delivered, but it is unproductive. It isn't where the leverage lies.
Best luck to all that are trying to heal. It's hard work.
[This message edited by WarpSpeed at 7:30 AM, February 9th (Sunday)]
When I am working (I am an HR manager) I have one tone. Its my job to be as impartial as possible.
On SI I offer my opinion, I don't get offended when a poster disagrees with me, I don't clutch my pearls and stomp off. I either continue to debate my point or I walk away. (I recognize when I am wasting my time because the OP won't hear me no matter what my tone or how many times I repeat myself).
In my sitch I do not get offended when a poster says I should do something. I am not wired that way. When I have been offered blunt advice I listened because it works for me. I might not have heard it otherwise.
don''t grasp your pearls and drag out the "You just don''t like what I am saying" defense when you get called out on it.
OTOH, the "your message is good, but your delivery sucks" argument is completely valid.
the most you end up with is a sycophantic club
If adhering to SI tenets such as..."No matter how crappy your M was, cheating was wrong! Seriously, even for you, no matter how special or unique you think your sitch was, cheating was selfish and shitty."...is sycophantic? Pass the MF''ing Kool-Aid.
The idea is the same: I require that thing (you have).
This is not your friends living room. We''re not kicking it. This is the ER. There''s been an accident, and your soul or marriage is at risk of death...and so the tone is urgent and frenzied, because the longer the injury goes untreated, the higher the risk of mortality.
This is not your friends living room. We're not kicking it. This is the ER. There's been an accident, and your soul or marriage is at risk of death...and so the tone is urgent and frenzied, because the longer the injury goes untreated, the higher the risk of mortality.
Damn skippy, FacePunched.
Made the quote thread.
Perfect system? No. But you (general statement) can be damn sure we want the waywards who come here to feel safe and supported. Or at least learn the tools they need to heal and get through the shitstorm they created.
Today I can honestly agree with the forgoing quote and I'm glad the guides, mods and admins are here. It kept me in line when I first joined SI.
The benefit I get from the WS forum is realizing my own short comings and being able to face them. In challenging myself I have come to realize that I have no control over anything or anyone in my life. Its been a long journey but today I'm happy to say I have women in my life that I can call friends and know that is all they will ever be. I'm still not a trusting person but a little at a time Im getting better.
I have not read all the threads in here but the ones I remember I am grateful to see the growth in. It gives me hope that no matter how messed up somebodys life is, there is always the potential for growth and change. The ones that have chosen to work threw the crap, Excellent job keep going!!
Great stuff, FP. An affair is, objectively, bad behavior. Behavior that is just as destructive to the offender as to the victim, if not more so. Anyone who gives a rip about you would be highly motivated to help you avoid repeating the behavior that has put your marriage in crisis mode.
Complaining about the tone in which a helpful and loving message is delivered on an infidelity website makes about as much sense as complaining about the brusque attitude of the doctor who tells you that unless you immediately start taking medication to control your high blood pressure and bad cholesterol, you'll likely be dead within a year.
The doc is your friend. The medicine is your friend. It's the cigarettes, booze, and greasy food that are not your friends, even if they give you lots of warm-and-fuzzies the whole time they are killing you.
Is your AP your friend? Friends don't destroy friends' marriages. Friends don't assist friends in the destruction of a two-parent home, or commit acts that cause children to suffer. Friends don't make friends feel horrible about themselves.
Friends don't let friends continue to engage in destructive, hurtful behavior or to carry on with mindsets that make that behavior likely to be repeated.
From my perspective, I see a lot of friends on SI. There's a reason I and so many BS's are drawn to the wayward forum. It's not just morbid fascination - there are a lot of wise, caring people here. It gives us hope.
I sincerely hope those that feel threatened by the perceived tone on this site, particularly this forum, tough it out and give it a chance. Or find similar help delivered in a way that you find digestible. Because there's a lot at stake.
NativeAgain summed up the way that I feel:
This is a site for regular people who may or may not be trained in communication. There is tremendous diversity on this site and what works for one person may not work for another. So isn't it wonderful that there are so many different ways and communication styles that each member can add to the different threads so there is a greater chance that at least ONE of them will be something that the poster can draw from?
It helps me immeasurably that this forum is diverse. I see people with DDays around mine that are making the same discoveries that I am. Then I see vets who give me perspective, remind me that I am not getting the whole picture yet. I read people who talk like my therapists, asking questions. I read others who are direct. They remind me that my actions can have a raw, emotional response. Some people say things in ten words that I need 50 to express. They are all part of the spectrum that I have to understand.
As a newbie, I do have to admit that the first time someone disagreed with something I did or said, it gnawed at me for a while. I know it's nothing personal. They are just trying to help in the best way that they know how. Maybe it was right, maybe wrong. It's still a valid thought or emotion that I am better off for considering.
Thanks for this forum. Personally, its a great tool to make me a better person.
If you are going to the doctor for a yearly physical and you want to be real specific about male or female doctor, cheerful, young, old, quick, fatherly, then go for it. In the course of your health, its probably not going to matter much. If you have Stage 4 cancer and your prognosis is that you need immediate surgery or to pick out your casket, you better concentrate on finding the best darned surgeon that you can no matter what sex, nationality, personality, or other type that they are, and get down to the business of saving your life.
What I appreciate on this forum, is that there IS such a diverse group of people who can deliver the exact same message in a multitude of ways. If you stick with it, you will almost always find someone who can "talk your talk." You can find your own little sub-group for support and PMs, while learning from a whole host of folks with different life experiences and different ways of communicating their understanding. There''s a whole lot of knowledge here and I truly do believe that 99% of the people on this forum don''t wake up in the morning determined to drive new people away. As a BS, I actually find it reassuring that this forum IS here, and that people here care SO much about trying to support each other towards a path to healthy relationships. Frankly, some people need a 2x4 upside the head to get their attention. If that gets their attention, then great, you can get through in other ways/words. If not, then realistically they probably aren''t ready to face the truth. If they aren''t ready or open, then IMO best they leave as quickly as possible so as to not take up the precious time that all of the volunteers on this site are offering.
And now I''m going to sit back with a beer and leave you to figure out who the 1% might be.
D-Day, June 10, 2012
Don't remember who called me out, now, but I'm glad for it because it helped me learn
This forum used to irk me when I lurked. Then after some time had passed and I was not as raw, it helped me see how the WS can be in pain too. That as a BS I did not have carte blanc to be an a$$hole. I saw WS who helped each other and other BS. I saw respect and empathy. It made me look at my own issues and in a lot of ways has helped me be a better person than I would have been if I was only reading BS opinions that mirrored my own.
Thanks to all of you, really. And I mean that you in the personal sense, not the general you.
If I don't like your tone or delivery or word choices? Tough effing tookies. You don't like mine? Sorry. Same answer.
This is an ANONYMOUS forum. If I can't handle an invisible stranger trying to help, or pants me, or whatever, then I'm doomed for epic failing out there in the flesh and bone world.
Thanks SI team. Thanks truth tellers, both gentle and blunt. To those who lurk or leave...SI will likely be here when you're ready.
[This message edited by JustDesserts at 1:00 PM, February 11th (Tuesday)]
I try not to come across as judgemental when I post to a newbie. Who am I to judge anyway? I f*cked up just as badly as they had. I have however gone off on a member. Fairly recently too. He'd had an A, his W doesn't know and he was questioning the wisdom of immediate, hard NC. The tone of his posts were straight out of the fog, even though his A was (supposedly) over for 7 years. It was quite clear that he thought he, his A and his AP are "special." After half a dozen of this type of post, I let loose. I apologized to the OP since this was a t/j of her thread and I let DS know what I'd done through PM. It's that type of post that I get "judgemental" on. Otherwise I'll be straight with the poster in a way that shows (I hpoe) that I know where they're coming from. Read it, heard it, used it, whatever.
All affairs are variations on a theme. No one has 'Beethoven's 5th' to everyone else's 'Chopsticks'.


text:
While taking a study break today at the DP Library I wandered down an isle adjacent to my little desk, reading the spines of books as I went. A few titles caught my eye but I only came to a stop to face the shelf when I saw a black-spined book with gold writing. Cities of Words it was called. For whatever reason I felt compelled to look at it further, so I pulled it off the shelf and began to skim the first few pages.
I like when the universe throws synchronicities at me.
As far as I could tell the book was about the collective effect of our individual actions and how as individuals we rarely see our actions having such an effect. There were several interesting quotes that I don't remember anymore but I want to read them again because they were startlingly relevant to some things I have been thinking about recently.
Next time I'm there I am going back up to the 6th floor to read it that book.
Do books ever get lonely up there on the floors of the library? Listening to students come and go, packed between their fellows, never getting touched, let alone read. If they could, would they ever shed a forlorn tear for their fate?
Sometimes it is easy to feel lost in university, like one book among thousands, barely getting noticed except when people glance at your cover, only to pass quick judgement on it. I find that if I take the time to pull a book from the shelf that I at first thought was nondescript, it turns out to not be what I expected; sometimes it is something entirely different and delightful that I am glad I took the time to get to know.
I love books. :)


text:
Each week during the official PGA Tour season, CBSSports.com's Kyle Porter will give his best shot at pegging the winner and seeing what other golfers will have a good week. The picks are based on a combination of homework, guesswork and just plain instinct.
Want to make your picks? Tweet your Winner, Top 10 finisher and sleeper to @EyeOnGolf
Odds provided by Bovada.lv
Field | Course Guide | Previous Champions | Schedule | Rankings, FedEx Points
East Lake Golf Club -- Atlanta, Ga.
Purse: $8 million
Defending Champion: Brandt Snedeker
TV Schedule
Thursday: GOLF -- 1-6 p.m.
Friday: GOLF -- 1-6 p.m.
Saturday: GOLF -- 10 a.m.-Noon., NBC -- Noon-3:30 p.m.
Sunday: NBC -- 1-6 p.m.
|Pick to win
|Lock for Top-10 finish


text:
Did Margaret Thatcher give full support over Golden Temple raid?
Former British Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher reportedly gave her Indian counterpart Indira Gandhi Britain's full support in the immediate aftermath of the 1984 Golden Temple raid.
Thatcher sent a personal letter, saying that Britain supported India's unity in the face of demands for a separate Sikh homeland.
She also disclosed that police were investigating threats against the safety of Indian diplomats.
According to the Guardian, the letter will cause further debate about Britain's role in the raid among the worldwide Sikh community.
The Indian government had made an apparent request for advice from the SAS in the months leading up to the raid.
The Indian government said about 400 people were killed when Gandhi sent troops into the temple complex in June 1984 in the six-day Operation Blue Star.
Sikh groups, which have called for an inquiry into the British role in the raid, put the death toll in the thousands, including many pilgrims.
The letter, which is in response to two sent by Gandhi on 9 and 14 June, appears to show that she had expressed worries that Sikh 'extremists' could use Britain as a base.
Thatcher also reassured Gandhi that British police were 'devoting considerable resources' to safeguarding Indian government personnel in Britain.
A few months after the letter was sent, Gandhi was gunned down by her own Sikh bodyguards in an act of revenge.
This triggered communal violence, which led to the deaths of thousands of Sikhs across India.
(Posted on 16-01-2014)
Information on States of India:
Andaman Nicobar | Andhra Pradesh | Arunachal Pradesh | Assam | Bihar | Chandigarh | Chhattisgarh | Dadar Nagar Haveli | Daman Diu | Delhi | Goa | Gujarat | Haryana | Himachal Pradesh | Jammu Kashmir | Jharkhand | Karnataka | Kerala | Lakshadweep | Madhya Pradesh | Maharashtra | Manipur | Meghalaya | Mizoram | Nagaland | Orissa | Pondicherry | Punjab | Rajasthan | Sikkim | Tamil Nadu | Tripura | Uttar Pradesh | Uttaranchal | West Bengal
Andhra Pradesh Travel Map | Bihar Travel Map | Goa Travel Map | Gujarat Travel Map | Haryana Travel Map | Himachal Pradesh Map | Karnataka Travel Map | Kerala Travel Map | Maharashtra Travel Map | Punjab Travel Map | Rajasthan Travel Map | Sikkim Travel Map | Tamil Nadu Travel Map | Uttar Pradesh Travel Map | West Bengal Travel Map |
Alappuzha | Ernakulam | Idukki | Kannur | Kasaragod | Kollam | Kottayam | Kozhikode | Malappuram | Palakkad | Pathanamthitta | Thiruvananthapuram | Thrissur | Wayanad |
Airports of India | Districts of India | India Pilgrim Centers | Tourism Map of India | National Highways in India | India Railway Routes |
Ahmadabad | Bangalore | Chennai | Coimbatore | Delhi | Hyderabad/Secunderabad | Kochi | Kolkata | Mumbai | Pondicherry | Pune | Surat |


text:
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NTSB Identification:
14 CFR Part 91: General Aviation
Accident occurred Saturday, July 14, 2012 in Salina, UT
Aircraft: CIRRUS DESIGN CORP SR22, registration: N86AA
Injuries: 2 Fatal.
This is preliminary information, subject to change, and may contain errors. Any errors in this report will be corrected when the final report has been completed. NTSB investigators either traveled in support of this investigation or conducted a significant amount of investigative work without any travel, and used data obtained from various sources to prepare this aircraft accident report.
On July 14, 2012, about 1130 mountain daylight time (MDT), a Cirrus Design Corp SR22, N86AA, impacted terrain near Salina, Utah. Springhill Aviation LLC, was operating the airplane under the provisions of 14 Code of Federal Regulations (CFR) Part 91. The private pilot and one passenger were fatally injured; the airplane sustained substantial damage from impact forces. The local cross-country personal flight departed Concord, California, with a planned destination of Aspen, Colorado. Visual and instrument meteorological conditions prevailed along the route of flight, and no flight plan had been filed.
The airplane was a subject of an ALNOT following the loss of radar contact. Local law enforcement and the Civil Air Patrol initiated a search for the airplane. The airplane was located by personnel from the Sevier County Sheriff's department flying in a civilian provided helicopter about 1800, on July 15, 2012.
The radar track for the flight was reviewed by the National Transportation Safety Board investigator-in-charge (IIC). It indicated that while traversing from west to east at a Mode C reported altitude of 13,700 feet mean sea level (msl), and during the last 2 minutes of recoded radar data, the target climbed to an altitude of 14,200 feet msl. The last radar return was at 11:28:54, at 13,500 feet msl. The accident site was located 1.5 nautical miles (nm) southeast of the last radar return.
The preliminary review of weather in the area of the accident indicated that the cloud base was at 9,000 feet msl, and the cloud top was at 27,000 feet msl with light rain.
Investigators examined the wreckage at the accident scene. The accident site was located on the northern slope of a ridgeline in the Fish Lake National Forest. The debris field was roughly 100 feet wide by 425 feet long running parallel to the crest of the ridge from east to west, with a debris path along a 263-degree magnetic heading. The first point of impact was a pine tree; the trunk was broken approximately 17 feet from the base of the tree. A ground scar was noted 30 feet beyond the broken pine tree. The ground scar was roughly 3-4 feet wide and continued for 15 feet ending in a crater that was approximately 2 to 3 feet deep with the engine, firewall, and some of the center console structure buried at the end of the crater.
The accident site was documented and the airplane and engine were recovered for further examination.
Index for Jul2012
Index of months


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Vivendo Nesse Absurdo - Charlie Brown Jr...
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15 Actors Who Made Extreme Weight Changes for Movies
Kaley Cuoco Shows Off Her Tennis Skills
7 Things You Didn't Know About 'The Big Bang Theory'
10 Infuriatingly Bad Endings to Good Movies
10 Movies We'd Recommend to Friends
27 Fascinating Movie Facts You Never Knew
The Real Lorde Sings South Park's Lorde Parody Song and I's Amazing
Is Johnny Depp Holding Up The Next "Pirates" Production?
A New Batman and New Batmobile for 2016 Movie
The 10 Worst Superhero Movie Supporting Characters
Stunning New Facts About Heath Ledger's Biggest Role
15 Horror Movies Only Adults Will Understand
First Official Photos from Avengers: Age of Ultron
What Record Is Avengers: Age of Ultron Breaking?
Your Favorite Horror Stars Before They Were Famous!
11 Songs That Break Barriers
The X-Men Movie Franchise's Most Embarrassing Plot Holes
Action Packed New Video From Batman VS. Superman
The First Official Look at the Villainous Ultron
What Happens When You Take a Testosterone Supplement
10 Movie Franchises We Don't Want Anymore
The Sweetest Romance Move You Will See All Year
12 Now-Famous People You Didn't Know Were in Movies You've Seen
Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice Photos Revealed
Angry Doctors Call For "Steroid Alternative" Ban
Adrianne Palicki joins S.H.I.E.L.D. as Mockingbird
Plans for Captain America 3 Teased
The Ring Turns 10! Where Are The Stars Now?
Christopher Nolan Just Keeps On Raising Our 'Interstellar' Expectations, Doesn't He?
Is 'Sleepy Hollow' in Danger of Being Cancelled?


text:
McKinsey & Company
McKinsey & Company Senior Associate Interview Questions
Interview Experience
Interview Experience
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Getting an Interview
Interview Difficulty
Interviews for Top Jobs at McKinsey & Company
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7 Candidate Interview Reviews Back to all interviewsSort: Popular Date Difficulty
Senior Associate Interview
interviewed at McKinsey & Company in October 2012.
Very professional process, McKinsey is very supportive of the entire process.
- Tell us how you had to convince someone to accept your opinion Answer Question
Other Interview Reviews for McKinsey & Company
Senior Associate InterviewApplication Details
I applied through an employee referral. The process took 5+ weeks – interviewed at McKinsey & Company in May 2007.Interview Details
These guys are professionals. They were 100% on top of things throughout the whole process - nothing ever slipped through the cracks. As for the interviews themselves, they were difficult b/c McKinsey gives a case interview and a fit/experience interview in which they are looking for certain evidence that you'll fit in the firm. The cases were too bad, but they definitely had a lot of numbers - dexterity with math is a must. And they push on the fit/experience part just as hard for evidence of accomplishment and leadership.Interview Questions
Negotiation DetailsNo - there is really no negotiating b/c their compensation is set at offer time and then varies to peers only after performance is assessed.Accepted OfferPositive ExperienceDifficult Interview
- It was a question about offer rates and close rates for a sales force in dealing with customers View Answer
Senior Associate InterviewApplication Details
The process took a day – interviewed at McKinsey & Company in January 2007.Interview Details
Flew to Chicago to have the interview the following day. The interview was scheduled for 7 am and I was 5 hours jet lagged. Still was made to wait for 3+ in the building lobby until it was my turn.
The interview itself consisted the typical McKinsey case studies with two guys. The first guy was more senior and laid back, while the other was very arrogant and seemed to get done asap.
Overall the experience was very negative, humiliating actually.Interview Questions
No OfferNegative ExperienceDifficult Interview
- Estimate size of vehicles fleet in a large city View Answers (3)
Senior Associate InterviewApplication Details
I applied online – interviewed at McKinsey & Company in October 2014.Interview Details
Entered the interview process with BTO via one of their workshop events. Very nice evening dinner and get to know before the interview day. Two one hour interview in the morning: introduction, 20min personal experience, 20min business case. No surprises here. Advanced to the afternoon with overall positive feedback. Two more interview of the same structure, a bit tougher style of asking. In principle I had a good feeling, but was not good enough unfortunately.Interview Questions
No OfferPositive ExperienceDifficult Interview
- How would working at McKinsey affect your marriage? View Answer
1 person found this helpful
Senior Associate InterviewApplication Details
The process took 4+ weeks – interviewed at McKinsey & Company in June 2012.Interview Details
was brought in through a headhunter as an experienced hire. went for a full day interview. although I had only 4 days to prepare (knew nothing about the process beforehand), managed to pass the PST test and morning interviews(3) and get to the partner interviews(2). Didn't work out in the end, feedback was that I wasn't strong enough on quant, analysis and math.Interview Questions
No OfferNeutral ExperienceDifficult Interview
- An insurance company has $500k clients who pay a premium of $2000.
Find out the number of employees of the company. View Answer
- A Telecom company wants to increase its profits Answer Question
- An insurance company has $500k clients who pay a premium of $2000.
Senior Associate InterviewApplication Details
I applied in-person. The process took 3 weeks – interviewed at McKinsey & Company in June 2009.Interview Details
Post MBA active recruiting from Mckinsey - Invited to apply to the test Easy test +. 2+ 4 interviews; first 2 interviews run by 2 EM (+/- 4 years in the firm) very structured interview with case interview section and behavior (past experience) section. If well prepared the difficulty level is medium to high. second round of 4 interviews with junior and senior partners. not so structured mix of case and behavior questions, targets the more natural parts of the interviewed.Interview Questions
Negotiation DetailsNo negotioation really. Only on the begining date !Accepted OfferPositive ExperienceDifficult Interview
- 1- what is the thing that you most regret on your professional life and why? 2- Particular case question about the expected profitability of a specific loan strategy on retail banking (still what is valuable is that you have a MECE approach to the case questions) Answer Question
1 person found this helpful
Senior Associate InterviewApplication Details
The process took a day – interviewed at McKinsey & Company in September 2008.Interview Details
As I was already working in consultancy, I was contacted by a headhunter who did all the preparatory work from handing in my CV to arranging the interview date and briefing me about what was going to happen on that day. I had a series of 4 interviews in a row, including classic case studies (2), one "personal fit" interview, and a mixture of both. The interviewers were rather senior members of the firm with a no-nonsense attitude, however, the atmosphere was very friendly and laid back. Each of the IVs lasted around an hour, followed by ~5-10 break. I was informed about the firm's decision immediately after the 4th IV and then was invited for the final IV which took place 1 week later and was mainly about starting date, office choice, etc. Overall, the setting was highly professional but not unfriendly at any time.Interview Questions
Accepted OfferPositive ExperienceAverage Interview
- What else what you like to be asked? Answer Question
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