text:
The Case for Cruiserweight
By Dave Franklin on August 2, 2009
UFC 91. Randy Couture vs. Brock Lesnar for the prestigious UFC heavyweight championship. "The Natural" has overcome many obstacles in his heralded UFC career including being the "old-man," but there was just no way he could overcome the sheer size and strength difference.
At weigh-in time, Couture weighed 220, just 14 lbs. over the lower limit for the weight class. Brock Lesnar weighed in at the heavyweight weight limit of a massive 265 lbs. By the time the fight rolled around Couture probably didn't weigh much more than his trim 220 lbs., but Lesnar was rumored to be coming in around 280. A 60 lbs. weight difference!
Sure, Royce Gracie overcame greater size differences, but the sport is different now. When Gracie ruled the Octagon, guys had no idea what this skinny Brazilian was doing. What is this Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu?
The beginning days of our sport was style vs. style. What we see now is that styles make matches and size does matter. Everyone trains in all styles, hence the name Mixed Martial Arts.
Lesnar was able to muscle his way out of Couture's clinches and takedowns and his immense size allowed him to throw a punch with enormous power behind it to finish The Natural and become the UFC heavyweight champion.
In his latest fight at UFC 100, Lesnar used his stature to control the 245 pound Frank Mir's hips, in what many thought was a game of lay-n-pray, rendering his BJJ useless.
What can be done for fighters that just aren't big enough to handle Lesnar's size but are too big to get to the 205 lbs. limit of light heavyweight? Are they stuck in a position knowing that they can never be the champion in either weight class?
At UFC 99, Rich Franklin met Wanderlei Silva at a catch weight of 195 lbs. Speculation and hope grew around the MMA community that this was the start of a new weight class, one to split the 20 pound difference between middleweight and light heavyweight. Fortunately, in this writer's opinion, it turns out that this weight was a one time agreed upon weight because Franklin wanted to stay at light heavyweight and Silva was on his way down to make a splash in the middleweight division.
In the past I have been resistant to new weight classes. I saw no reason to split the competition in the existing weight classes. 15 pounds exist between lightweight and welterweight, and the same weight repeats between welterweight and middleweight. Between middleweight and light heavyweight only 20 lbs. exist. We don't need to water the sport down with an abundance of weight classes.
The heavyweight division has a range of 59 pounds, which in the past has not had much of an impact. Now, with the massive Lesnar dropping bombs on the division, I think it may be time to introduce a new division.
In the British Navy, the second heaviest ship is referred to as the cruiser, thus giving us the name for just such a division. Cruiserweight. A division that would close the gap between light heavyweight and heavyweight. A 206-240 lbs. cruiserweight class and a 241-265 lbs. heavyweight class.
With heavyweights such as Brock Lesnar and Shane Carwin actually cutting weight to make the heavyweight cusp, this would give the smaller contenders a home where they would not have to either put a ton of muscle on their body or shorten their careers by continually drastically cutting weight.
TUF 10 is bringing in a slew of new heavyweights that could provide competition and fill up a heavyweight weight class of 240 -265 lbs. Cruiserweight would be an instant favorite with the likes of Couture, Nogueira, Mir, among others including some transplants from light heavyweight such as Forrest Griffin who is rumored to walk around at 240 pounds.
Another benefit to a cruiserweight division is another title meaning additional possible main events. UFC 103 is headlined by a rematch of a debatable split decision between Rich Franklin and Dan Henderson which will prove to be a good fight for fans. But should this be headlining a major UFC event? This fight doesn't do much to further either fighter's career.
In 2008, there were a total of 13 named UFC events. With every title being fought for twice, there was 10 title fights. With the addition of the interim heavyweight title between Mir and Nogueira the total was brought to 11. Adding a cruiserweight division and crowning a champion may just round us out with a title defense at every UFC.
Now is the time for a new division. Not at the lower weight classes. They don't need to be split. Give the cruiserweights a chance to stand out and shine not be pummeled under Lesnar's mass.
brandnewpride36 says:
well 195 lbs could be a weight class now, cuz he's not fighting dan henderson again, he's fighting vitor belfort at UFC 103 at 195 lbs.
but i like the idea of a cruiserweight class
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Lord Faust says:
With regards to the issues of weight classes, I've been wondering if there's been any hard research done on the effects of weight cutting. Head trauma has garnered a lot of attention as-of-late — and rightly so — but I think this is something we shouldn't overlook. Combat athletes already take an immense toll on their bodies; I'd like to see more work done in the medical field to ensure that after their careers, fighters have all the opportunities to lead normal, healthy lives.
On the topic of the article: I think we do need more categories for significantly gigantic fighters. The problem, however, at this point I think is the depth in the talent pool. It's taken the UFC quite some time to flesh out a decent heavyweight division. Apparently it's hard to find talented big men who don't mind taking punches to the face.
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dpk says:
I've gone back and forth on this issue numerous times. When I was in high school I was a big time boxing fan, and actually wrote into Friday night fights on ESPN asking Max Kellerman, the ESPN boxing analyst at the time if he thought there should be separate weight classes for HW, and Super HW. He agreed, and so did I at the time. Shortly there after, Chris Byrd beat Vitali Klitschko. An MMA equivalent is Randy beating up Tim Slyvia who is a 265+ guy himself. nobody was screaming for another weight class when Mir broke his arm, or when Randy dominated him for 5 rounds, it is just an argument now because Lesnar is such a good athlete and has such a good wrestling base. The biggest argument against this weight class is Fedor, all 230lbs of him. There is a fight coming up that I really want to see, before I make my final judgement, and that is the Velasquez v Carwin fight. Velasquez is a smaller HW by todays standards weighing in around 240, while Carwin is a 265+ guy when he steps in the Cage. If Velasquez can get things done against Carwin, and then potentially Brock, then this argument goes out the window, but if Carwin manhandles him, then I think it will have some serious legs. I also don't think the weight class should be 240, because then guys who walk around at 260-270 would cut down, and go into the fights weighing back up around 260 still giving them a potential 30-40 pound weight advantage. I think a better weight would be 230. Guys like Velasquez and Mir I bet could make the cut down to that weight. I think the biggest problem with a cruiser weight class is that you risk diluting multiple weight classes, such as HW, and LHW to go with cruiser weight. If UFC wants more titles to add to their main events, they should fold WEC into the mix (and I hope they do) so that Torres and Brown can headline, and they should also make the steps to start a 125lbs weight class, because the smaller guys have some of the best fights you will ever see.
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drdsanders says:
I would rather see a shuffling of weight classes (and adding another) instead simply throwing in an additional class.
It's common for a wrestler to nullify good Jits. Clay guida does it every damn fight. Fitch did it to Sanchez. Mir was beating Lesnar in the standup but did little to stop the takedown. Would you be crying for a new weightclass had Mir won?
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PlagueAngel says:
I've said the same thing about the Mir situation many times over. No one would be complaining if Mir caught Lesnar in an armbar at 100 or Randy beating Lesnar. Its the simple fact that if Randy wants to be champion, he needs to go down to 205. END OF STORY! To the next subject, the idea for another weight class from 206-240 is a good idea. Better then the super heavyweight idea that some people think is the solution. But if everything stays the same in the weight classes, big deal. What we need is 5 round fights and 7 round title fights!
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fuhr says:
I wouldn't object to a cruiser weight division but at the same time I don't want to see MMA become more like boxing and the countless weight divisions. By the way UFC 103 is no longer headlined but Hendo Franklin. Unless something has changed again.
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MegaMan says:
I think 230 is even too much. 225 so people won't cut from 255 or something crazy. When Tim Sylvia was winning the sport was different. I don't think anyone wants to see Brock Lesnar lay on top of people for the next few years, so call 265 Super Heavyweight and 225 Heavyweight. With Lesnar's "popularity" in the mainstream I don't think a division will exist (cruiserweight or whichever) for a while though.
Also, if someone gets knocked out in the first minute of a 7 round fight the pay per view time gets messed up. Same thing for a 5 round. A 5 round boring decision would not go over well either.
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shotokai_ says:
I'm with Lord Faust, the premise of this article is good, and you make your case well, however, there simply isn't the talent out there to fill two HW divisions.
TUF 10 will, at most, give the UFC 8 new heavyweight fighters, and although there are a few 265+ guys on the show – there aren't that many. It's unrealistic to think that the UFC could make a serious division of 240-265ers. We should also bare in mind that if a fighters natural weight is 260, they would probably make the cut down to your proposed division anyway.
With that being said though, the weight difference between Couture and Lesnar was just absurd. A 60lb difference in a modern MMA fight is crazy. That's about the equivalent of Frankie Edgar taking on Forrest Griffin; makes you think.
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ozz_the_powerful says:
The past few days I've been calling the 195lb idea "Cruiserweight."
I do like the way you explained it about the British Navy, but Boxing has Cruiserweight set at 200lbs. That has varied throughout the past 30 years though, fluctuating between 190 and 195 and back again.
I don't agree with adding a class between 206 – 265, b/c like Lord Faust said & dpk touched on, we run the risk of robbing Peter to pay Paul, that being taking from one class to fill another, thus the dilution explanation.
As I've said before, with the UFC getting a more in depth talent pool at each class and by signing folded promotion's fighters, something has to change, or we will only see fighters fighting once or twice a year. If anything, I think we can address that by putting more fights on a card. We logically can't have more PPV's, b/c then we dilute the market, and not as many people have the money to spend 50 bucks twice a week.
I really like DPK's idea of folding the smaller weight classes from WEC into the UFC. Those are EXCITING fights.
Guys, you have said in the past, "Leave the other promotions alone, they can be a farm league." I've said that too. Why not keep the WEC as the UFC's farm league? Kinda like how MLB owns their own minor league team. Fold the smaller weight classes into the UFC, and keep fishing the market to stock the WEC. When that fighter has gotten good enough, let him come to the UFC. Repeat the process.
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Rich S. says:
I like the idea..
Obviously, I like where the UFC is right now, with the 5 traditional weight classes..
But, the Heavyweights DO seem to be half and half on "guys who can barely make 265 or come in at 260 every time" and "guys who are small heavyweights but too big to go down to lightheavyweight"
It would allow for more fair bouts.. Right now, the Heavyweight division is in this place where, no matter how much skill you have, you can't become the champion because the man on top is just too big and too strong..
But, if we cut these guys in half, and had Mir or Noguiera fighting for a title against Randy or Cro Cop, they would stand more of a chance..
Then Brock would have the bigger guys like Herring or Carwin (and any we may get from TUF or Affliction) all to himself..
It's still a bit sketchy though, because right now the Heavyweight division is barely strong enough on it's own. And although it's getting stronger, I don't think it's nearly strong enough to be cut in half yet..
But, give it a little bit of time, and allow more big AND small heavyweights to get in the mix, and I'll be all for it..
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Jak says:
It always comes back to the amount of talent for 2 HW classes, if Lesnar is too big for anyone, everyone will cut and it will be Lesnar vs Lesnar because besides Carwin most guys can probably shed enough weight to be able to drop to the lesser weight.
I suppose i am apparently one of the few Lesnar fans that stills sees a whole lot of holes in his game. Mir landed like 2 or 3 knees the whole fight and all of them almost dropped Lesnar. Couture, with a great gameplan, was an undersized HW who did excellent in the stand up for a round and half.
I just think it is very premature to think that Lesnar and his size won't have any competition when he hasn't even faced some of wrestling HW's. It's easy to count Velasquez out because he is small, or dos Santos because he is small, or Carwin for whatever reason but I always find it better to ACTUALLY see how the fights turn out than just counting all the HW's out.
Bottom line, Mir's not that good in the first place and him getting beatdown didn't really sway me that Lesnar will be unbeatable.
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Rich S. says:
Right now the person that's going to beat Lesnar, if anyone can, is Shane Carwin..
Although Lesnar doesn't have Jiu Jitsu down pat, he did exactly what he needed to do against Mir, not to defend submissions, but to totally prevent Mir from even being able to TRY one..
So, obviously he has the defense down now, at least from an offensive point of view.. if that makes sense.. Which means we need to give up hope for a submissionist beating him..
But, we did see him lose the striking to a much smaller Randy, and I thought he looked rocked when Mir caught him with that combo right out the gate in the 2nd round..
And as of right now, Lesnar, although he has a lot of power, only has one punch in his arsenal..
So, that's why it would take Carwin, a heavy handed, solid wrestler, to beat Lesnar.. But, this is all off topic
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Lord Faust says:
I think Big Nog stands a very real chance of defeating Lesnar, provided he hasn't had his "card punched" one too many times. He may have sold tomorrow to win today, so to speak, with regards to his past performances and the abuse he's endured.
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moosebaby02 says:
Interesting peace. That's something for me to think about. Lord Faust, dpk, Rich S., Jak I agree. But we should wait and see what Carwin or Velasquez have to say first before we get the ufc taking a hundred bucks out of my pocket a month witch would most likley happen in the not to soon future. Carwin is a big dude and Velasquez is no joke as he proved me wrong with Kongo. I would love to see what Mir has left as well. Why not have him fight Dos Santos providing he beats Cro Cop. Then set up a rubber match if Mir wins that one and IF it turns out that way. And I know no one wants to see that one. By then the tuff 10 boys could start dancing around the picture. There is to much that can happen and yes its all a bunch of what ifs but that's how the ufc started and got to where they are now (yeah I know I will be labeled a ufc lover) I have to say AND I am not a Lesnar fan find it hard to believe that if he can get by in his next two fights it will be hard pressed to find anyone to stop him. Especially the way he learning at the rate he is going so fast. But really all he has to do is get you down and hold you there and punch you in the face. That's all he does. How hard can it really be when you're the size and have the speed as he does? Its not like he is submitting anyone or using any great bjj. Sorry getting away from the point. The way the size of teenagers and how popular the sport is getting I can definitely see having to spit up the weight class's in about ten years. More studies into long term affects on weight cutting on the body. Great point Lord Faust. As popular as the sport of mma is, it hasn't been around long enough to determine the long affects on the body. How long has been boxing around before any one started to or cared about what happened to their fighters when there where dollars been made?? Either way it wont happen anytime soon so we better hope Carwin or Velasquez can get the job done or we will be in for a long run of boring lay and prey punch in the face HW division. Like I said its not like he is being very technical. He is a beast. Its really not fair but that's just a 5'4 small mans speaking
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notdanawhite says:
cruiser weight is a no-brainer now. next we need weigh-ins day of fight. cutting is unhealthy and provides an unfair advantage that has nothing to do with skill.
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Lord Faust says:
"next we need weigh-ins day of fight. cutting is unhealthy and provides an unfair advantage that has nothing to do with skill."
Guys will still cut weight and run the risk of serious injury, IMO. I'm not saying fighters are stupid, but considering the other personal sacrifices these guys make, this would just be another "cost of doing business".
With more research into the topic of weight cutting we'd at least be able to weigh the two notions, and elect for the lesser of two evils. Weight cutting is too engrained in North American combat sports to simply make it stop. Sadly, I don't exactly have any answers other than "we need to find out more".
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swiftyfrisko says:
I'm with some of the other commenters here in that we don't discard the idea of splitting the h/w division, but need to give the situation more time to clarify. We might be at the dawn of a new era of 'super heavyweights', or we might not. Early days.
If in a year or two, we find that we've got a h/w division with excellent fighters that can't really cut to light h/w, but are just out-muscled by the big guys, then splitting the heavyweights might be an idea whose time has come. There should be good commercial reasons for it.
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mu_shin says:
On the initial point, a cruiserweight division, I'm coming down on the negative.
The comments about Lesnar's "lay and pray" technique are just as misguided and to my mind,ill-informed as every time I've read the same criticism of Clay Guida. What some want to label lay and pray is a technical approach, a fighting tactic, for which there are strategic technical solutions. If a fighter can't counter what you want to call "lay and pray", HE LOSES, just like if he can't block a right cross or if he can't defend against an arm bar. You may not find it as exciting as a standup knockout, but the goal of professional fighting is entertaining, and WINNING.
Lesnar's size and strength are not an unfair advantage. His athletic gifts are what set him apart as a competitor, and his application of various techniques are what make him the heavyweight champion. If you don't think there are technical options to avoid the "lay and pray", then you are denying the evolution we've all witnessed in this sport. Royce Gracie submitted Remco Pardoel at a serious weight disadvantage in one of the initial UFC's, but now the rules are different; they stand guys up so the fans don't boo the ground game, and everyone studies BJJ and takedown defense as a matter of course. The game evolved.
There are "smaller" heavyweights, perhaps an accomplished wrestler like Velasquez, or an all around master like Fedor, who can, and will, surmount the "lay and pray"; they, or someone like them, will overcome the technical problem posed by a bigger, stronger fighter like Lesnar. The sport will continue to evolve, as it has done so far, and I believe we will all see that a technically superior athlete, within the parameters of the modern sport with the new rules and current level of experience, will express a level of ring awareness and cage savvy such that they won't find themselves struggling under a monster like Brock or Carwin.
No denying that there has been a paradigm shift in the heavyweight division toward bigger, stronger, faster, more athletic fighters. Lesnar is at the forefront, and as he succeeds, we'll see guys like Carwin and perhaps Bobby Lashley also compete successfully. What I don't agree with is the argument that there won't be fighters in the 205-240 range who can handle the bigger stronger heavyweights. I've made the argument in other posts that Fedor has already done it, even though none of the giants he's faced have the amazing athleticism of Lesnar. I think the answers lie in technical innovation and the evolution of MMA, rather than breaking down the heavyweight division into cruiser and heavy.
I will never argue that cutting weight is a healthy practice or benefits a fighter in terms of life-long health, but any trainer or coach will tell you that the strength-to-weight ratio achieved by cutting weight confers a fighting advantage to the athlete who cuts well, hence the history of the practice. Wrestlers have done it forever, and so have boxers, to try and add an element of physical advantage to their repertoire of skill and technique. It will always be part of the combat sports at the professional level, where the slightest advantage is often the difference between victory and defeat, between a memorable hero and a forgotten also-ran. More studies of the effects seem medically reasonable, especially to avoid extreme practices that could permanently damage an athlete's healty, but I think fighters will always seek that advantage.
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mac wilson says:
I think the UFC will introduce the new division once it has been proven that we have reached the era of the real heavyweights…..I'm talking about when the division resembles the 155 division in the sence that every single guy is shredded, cutting down to 265, super talented especially in the grappling side of things. Once it is clear that we reach that point…..it's time to open up a Cruiserweight division.
I thought we might find out the answer to this question when Fedor would face Brock….I don't think I need to remind you what happened there….. But once guys like Randy, Velasquez and anyone else are just physically outmatched…..it's time to make the move….there will be a tipping point when strength counts for more than talent……there is a 60lb weight range, I mean common…..thats a lot of weight when you are matched with a guy who is 260 and yer 210, and you both theoretically match out in talent and everything else.
I have no idea when to expect this to happen but I don't see it happening anytime too soon…..maybe like 2 years from now…..but who knows….I think there will be some heavyweights coming out of the woodwork here as the sport grows…..And I can't wait to meet em.
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mac wilson says:
I want to clarify that clearly a guy wont fight heavyweight if he's 210 but even 230 or 220…..common
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dpk says:
I would love to see day of weigh-ins. Fighters would still cut weight, but not to the extreme that they do, now. The effect is that probably 75% of the fighters would be fighting at the next weight class up. There is no way a guy like Alves would fight at WW if he only had a few hours to re-hydrate and get his body ready to got 3-5 rounds. Anyone who has cut weight before knows that it takes a lot of your endurance if you don't do it right. The way the system is set up now, I worry that UFC will see a fighter die in a sauna cutting weight, before it see one die in the cage from injuries.
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mac wilson says:
Well they could just do the weigh-ins the same day as the fights….that would level the playing feild for sure as you can't sleep off that carb cram. If you eat a whole pizza or something ….. you gotta fight with that in your gut…..better not take any shots to the stomach.
It can be potentially a problem though because highschool kids are cutting weight. It has happened for awhile now, but you know, with the explosion of the sport, kids will try to exploit every possible advantage.
It's just not a healthy thing to do especially for growing bodies….I wont encourage my kid to cut weight. I'll just make him do technique drills all night for my affection ……………………..KIDDING!!
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metalmulisha says:
You people who're suggesting that they do weigh-ins the day of the fights for fighter safety because of weight cutting need to get a clue.
It would be MORE harmful to fighters that cut a lot of weight to have weigh-ins the day of the fight because it wouldn't give them the proper time to rehydrate their bodies. And don't give me it'll discourage guys from cutting weight. NO it won't.
Not only would it be unhealthier for guys to cut weight and not be given the proper amount of time to rehydrate but it would lead to a lot of lackluster performances from fighters.
Fight fans make a much bigger deal about the weight fighters cut than they really should. It's not nearly as big a deal to the fighters.
Also as far as adding more weight classes. I'm totally against it.
The last thing this sport needs to do is get like boxing and have a different weight class every five pounds. It's one of the things I dislike about boxing.
This is the Brock Lesnar syndrome. People think he and Shane Carwin are to big for everyone else. It's a knee jerk reaction.
The smaller heavyweights have the option of cutting weight and fighting as 205 like Randy's done before and guys like Mike Whitehead and Jake O'Brian do now.
Honestly I thought it was best in Pride when they had 4 weight classes. Lightweight 160lbs. & under, Welterweight 183lbs. & under, Middleweight 205lbs. and under, and Heavyweight over 205lbs. That was perfect.
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s00nertp says:
good points, thanks for the comments, I enjoyed reading them.
As far as the Pride weight divisions… to be honest I was always confused about it. It seemed like they just put together fighters that would make great matchups. Whatever they did though, it worked awesomely.
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PlagueAngel says:
Good god, weigh ins on fight day? Again, I see this topic come up and it hurts my head. Its amazing how many people don't understand the body of a natural athlete. People like Lesnar, GSP, Alves, train hard to make that weight cut. When I recently cut weight for the military, I cut all the water in my body to make weight because of my muscle. I cut ten pounds of water to make weight but killed on my PT test. The big picture is this…
185-205 is 20 ibs.
206-265 is 59 ibs.
If there is another division that needs a weight class, it would obviously be the 206-240 "Cruiserweight" class. There is just a huge weight difference in the heavyweight class. But honestly I don't see it as a problem because people are just pissed of Lesnars domination. If Mir would have got Lesnar in an armbar at 100, WE WOULD NOT BE HAVING THIS CONVERSATION.
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PlagueAngel says:
You a black metal guy Faust? Isn't that the Emperior drummer?
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Rich S. says:
mu_shin: "If a fighter can't counter what you want to call "lay and pray", HE LOSES, just like if he can't block a right cross or if he can't defend against an arm bar. You may not find it as exciting as a standup knockout, but the goal of professional fighting is entertaining, and WINNING."
Thanks for that.. Seriously.. It actually changed my outlook on lay'n'pray.. I'm not quite sure why I never thought of it thought way..
It's certainly boring (BTW: I don't find Lesnar OR Guida boring), but if the other guy can't stop it from happening, he loses, just as if he fails to keep his hands up, or is unable to defend a submission..
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ozz_the_powerful says:
You said exactly what I was going to. You can't have these guys weigh in on the night of the fight. Rehydrating the body takes around 24 hours. You'd be putting guys in the cage that would not only be at risk of heat exhaustion, but also risk of the fighter not being able to properly defend himself due to sever cramping from inadequate supply of water and electrolytes.
I completely understand the Pride weight class comment. It made things a lot simpler. I really wish they would bring back the card system like they had in Bushido though. No action, ref pulls a card, you lost 10% of your purse. That would encourage action. You can't say anything bad about brock though. Look what he's done. Its not like he is stalling when he's on the grond.
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ozz_the_powerful says:
I still don't agree with the definition they are using for Cruiserweight. Cruiserweight should be the 195lb class. Chop the top off heavyweight to put the limit at 235 or 240. Anything above that, call super heavyweight.
I get the british navy idea, but thus isn't britain, and boxing has been using cruiserweight for 30 years now.
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Lord Faust says:
"You a black metal guy Faust? Isn't that the Emperior drummer?"
The name is much older than that. I stole it long before I heard Anthems for the Welkin at Dusk.
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egad81 says:
I have being saying this all along…. 206 to 265 is just to big of a jump
186 – 205 cruiserweight
206 – 230 Ligt Heavyweight
231 – 265 Heavy Weight
265+ Super Heavy
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fanoftna33 says:
I personally like the weight classes the way they are, no matter what they do there will always be some guys cutting a lot of weight to make it down to the lower wt class. Guys will have to cut down a bit just like all the other weight classes. I like having one weight class where most of the fighters get to go at it at there natural weight and bulk up as they see fit.
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ozz_the_powerful says:
Let me just throw this out there-
Randy would make a better LHW than a HW.
Two fights I would like to see with Machida would have to be Machida vs Couture, and a re-match with Tito, a healthy 100% Tito.
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hindsightufuk says:
personally i'm down with hope and evolution.
remember the days when Mark Coleman, Tito Ortiz and Chuck Lidell looked unbeatable? Dominated the sport for years? Admittedly Chuck was hella entertaining so no one cared. But Tito & Coleman often used to bore me to tears. When they won fights by brutal stoppage they looked awesome, when it went to decision they were boring as fuck. Same with Kevin Randleman, for a while in the UFC i thought no one would be able to stop him, the size, strength and speed of him, and he was fucking boring to watch too.
But they all got beat eventually, fighters evolved to a point where the opponents became better than, and figured out how to beat Coleman, Liddell, Ortiz & Randleman. It'll happen to Brock too. He's a great wrestler and will always get wins, but eventually someone will come along with more talent who he cant beat, who he cant take down and keep down. And thank fuck for when that day comes.
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hindsightufuk says:
and yes i would love to see Randy finish his career as a LHW, straight shot against Lyoto.
I was just saying the other day i reckon Randy will wear the LHW belt once more before he retires
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fanoftna33 says:
Randy vs Lyoto would be great, I think if randy looks good against big nog this month they might let it happen after Shogun(if Machida wins).
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fanoftna33 says:
Speaking of great fights who is pulling for Florian this weekend?
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hindsightufuk says:
i reckon Kenny might be able to pull it off. he wont be as dumb as Sean Sherk and stand in front of BJ trying to box with him. i think he could pick BJ apart over a few rounds then get a tko late in the fight.
I'll be routing for BJ myself, but i wouldnt begrudge Kenny if he won
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ozz_the_powerful says:
Yeah, I just can't see him being effective at HW anymore. Let's be honest, the heavyweights now are all starting to come in at the +240 mark. Randy has cut to 205 before and was a title holer at that weight.
Spot on, hindsightufuk, as I too see LHW gold before he retires. Not at HW though.
The sport evolves, as do the weight classes, to a point. Everyone pushes the limits now. Weigh-ins are right at the line. The only exception to this rule is Heavyweight.
I really don't see anything wrong with coming in at 265, as everyone else in their respective class comes in at 155, 170, and 185, maybe a pound under. You don't see a middleweight weigh in at 176.
Why the ridicule at heavyweight? If you weigh 225, cut to 205.
Agree or Disagree: 0 0
fanoftna33 says:
I love this type of title fight, both guys could legitimatly win, without any lucky punch crap. I think a motivated Penn might be a bit to much for Florian, but he is a true student of the sport, I see him winning a very tough foght here.
Agree or Disagree: 0 0
ozz_the_powerful says:
As dr. Phil would say, I'm pulling for Florini.
Agree or Disagree: 0 0
ozz_the_powerful says:
By the way fan, where the hell were you yesterday?
Agree or Disagree: 0 0
fanoftna33 says:
I take pelligrino over neer in the fight of the night for sure.
Agree or Disagree: 0 0
Jstew3785 says:
LOL @ Ozz with Florini. That was hilarious when Dr Phil said that. I think the worst name butchering I heard was Michael Buffer announcing Fedor at the Affliction weigh in. "Fedor Emelnencho"
Agree or Disagree: 0 0
Sergio Hernandez says:
I don't see the need to split up the HW division until the Brock Lesnars and Shane Carwins are the standard, rather than the exception.
When the HW division is THOROUGHLY being dominated by guys who cut to 265, then I would see a need to set up a 206-230 division.
Until then, you dilute the talent pool.
Agree or Disagree: 0 0
mr thickfingers says:
Im iffy on this one. First off, alot of guys in the HW division would have to cut to get to 230 or 240 lbs. This division works better to bring guys up to 220 or so from 205. Noone wants that. But guys like Vera and Jardine, and Evans would probably jump, as they are nowhere near the top at LHW. Most of the big names at HW like Mir, Nog, Gonzaga and Kongo come in around 250 fighting weight. Only a few guys like Couture would really benefit. Old guys, who cant handle the bulk with their reflexes and cant muscle big men. On paper its great, so the giants can have their division. But why? All of these guys have holes in their game. MMA is about exploiting those holes and winning. If they want to fix the HW division, make guys forfeit their check if they dont finish their opponent. This means you Kongo, Herring.
Agree or Disagree: 0 0
FightTrends.com says:
It is a huge jump but I think the problem is there just isn't enough talent in the HW division to split it up. It is such a thin division already. 135-145-155 works fine because those division are stacked with talent. Hell, they could damn near do 145 150 155 because there is just so much talent. But at the HW division I just dont think it would work. Instead of having one thing HW divison, we would have 2 water thin divisons.
Agree or Disagree: 0 0
JollyDV says:
I agree whole hardheadedly with the weight classes egad81 proposed. The HW division will continue to grow. The TUF 11 series is focusing on the heavy's. So there are some extras right there. As with all parts of the UFC, Dana will take his time and develop it at a slow rate and wait until the time is ripe before announcing.
Agree or Disagree: 0 0
ozz_the_powerful says:
TUF 11 is about the Heavyweights too?
I'm not being a smartass, I swear, LOL, I just hadn't heard anything yet.
Agree or Disagree: 0 0
bbond30 says:
Your article is right on the money! A 60 pound weight difference is ridiculous! I can't believe anyone could even try to make an argument that there shouldn't be a Cruiserweight division. About time someone noticed!
Agree or Disagree: 0 0
webeougher says:
Alright, so here's some thoughts:
-I wrestled from the time I was five until I was 19 or so (I wasn't on the varsity squad in college, but I was on the club team and wrestled in a few open tournaments), and I started cutting weight when I was twelve, so I'm familiar with the concept. I'm 29 now, and I can honestly say I haven't experienced any long-term effects from weight cutting. If anything, I find that I can still lose weight much more easily than other people I know that are my age. When I don't work out, I hover around 260 pounds (I'm 6'3″), but when I do weight training and cardio, my weight stays in the 215-220 pound range, and I can drop the 40+ pounds in three to four weeks. I haven't actually tried, but I'm willing to bet with a month to get down to 220, I could easily make the cut to 205.
In terms of splitting up the divisions, I can see both sides of the arguments, but I'm firmly for keeping things the way they are.
Agree or Disagree: 0 0
antone3x7 says:
The current weight classes, starting from Flyweight:
125 lbs Flyweight
135 lbs (+10) Bantamweight
145 lbs (+10) Featherweight
155 lbs (+10) Lightweight
170 lbs (+15) Welterweight
185 lbs (+15) Middleweight
205 lbs (+20) Light Heavyweight
265 lbs (+60) Heavyweight
265+ lbs Super Heavyweight
If I had to add a cruiserweight class at 195 lbs, I would propose the following re-alignment:
155 lbs (+10) Lightweight
165 lbs (+10) Welterweight
180 lbs (+15) Middleweight
195 lbs (+15) Cruiserweight
220 lbs (+25) Light Heavyweight
265 lbs (+45) Heavyweight
265+ lbs Super Heavyweight
I think the gap between LW and WW is too large as it is now. The HW division, shallow as it is now, would get even shallower with a heavier starting range of 221 lbs, but at least it'll keep it as a league of big boys.
Agree or Disagree: 0 0
edub says:
Antone those are great weight classes IMO. The only thing is LHW is usually below cruiser. No biggie.
One bad thing with those classes that would make things suck is a lot of fighters would be changing classes. No way GSP, Alves, Fitch, Johnson could make 165. It would be cool to see who would go down to 195 and who would co up to 220 though.
Agree or Disagree: 0 0
Fedor/gr8stFytronplanit says:
This seems like such a no brainer. Of course there should be new weight classes created. If not, let's do it the Pride way. Open weight fights all the time. Why should Fedor have to fight a near three hundred pound man when he weighs 230-235? With this line of reasoning a lightweight should battle a middleweight. It is idiotic to have such a discrepancy occurring. That's it. End of story. If Fedor loses to Brock then to me it really doesn't prove that much other than a guy that weighs 50-60 lbs. more than Fedor beat him….so what? Although I absolutely want to see them fight and will pay good coin to see it go down. Dana, make it happen. I don't care what you have to do up to and including giving him manual release to close the deal.
Agree or Disagree: 0 0
submit662266 says:
After seeing Brock v Randy and Brock v Mir, I think they need to split the weight classes. One post above (maybe several: I didn't read ALL of them) pointed out that the game has changed: most fighters are versed in all facets of the sport. In the early days, it was based on the premise of one discipline fighting another to see which discipline was superior.
It's not fun to watch Brock bully smaller guys. Every other weight class has about 10-15 pounds to play with except HW.
As far as Randy fighting Machida, that would end terribly for the natural. Honestly, ANYBODY who steps in the cage with Machida right now is going to have an awful night.
Agree or Disagree: 0 0
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Discover the new, enhanced ribbon and interface. Create slideshows; incorporate graphic images, clip art, graphs, tables and organization charts. Change background designs and add cool transitions to your presentation. Create speaker notes and run a slide show.
Prerequisite: Windows.
Prerequisite: Experience with Windows or Windows 8 - Beginning class.
Learning Objectives:
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Some Title


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In today's green news, a glimpse into ancient forest management and bad news for the big fish and the small fish.
- Warmer seas are causing species of fish to mature earlier, stunting their maximum length by up to 29% in the North Sea (The Guardian)
- Indigenous peoples have been carefully managed the rainforests of Asia for 11,000 years by seamlessly clearing pockets of vegetation for agriculture, new findings reveal. (Mongabay)
- A large shark was killed off the coast of Western Australia, the first to be connected to a new shark cull that was put into place to prevent human fatalities. (CNN)
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Donate to The Nature Conservancy and give back to nature.
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Trouble with technology? We can help!
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A Family Portrait
By B I A N C A L E A M O R R A
This book is an archive and tribute to my family. It investigates connections and narratives through juxtaposition of the past and present. Digital photography, home video stills, and writings were used to piece together the story of this family.
About the Author
Publish Date April 05, 2012
Dimensions Large Format Landscape 196 pgs
Premium Paper, lustre finish
Category Arts & Photography
Tags documentary, history, home, brother, sister, dad, mom, family, digital photography, past and present, fine art, home video stills
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Food trucks are growing in popularity their first summer in Traverse City, and more of them keep popping up throughout the area.
Traverse City passed an ordinance earlier this year allowing food trucks in public areas of the city.
Now, just four months later, they seem to be a success.
9&10's Vanessa Fayz and photojournalist Jeremy Erickson spoke with a couple of food truck vendors, and show us what business is like for them.


text:
A championship in which to paddle to the end
A sea of troubled waters, a tournament where the irregularity has been the norm … But the last boats are paddling to get to where they give them strength. Costa Rica
Some envision and earth, as Santos and Saprissa, with its victories in this day and circulate calmer seas and just need a more positive result to qualify.
Saprissa used his house as seldom made in the tournament. His victory and the four goals against Carthaginian give calm.
The purple can breathe even more quiet, as his next opponent, Orion, is nearly three points of office for the rival.
And Saprissa, the Saints can relax a little, since his victory on Saturday against Bethlehem gives a post almost certain. They will have a difficult visit to Carthage, but then will play Orion.
While guapileños tibaseños and floated to the surface, another team collapses in the final of the tournament.
Fourth. A blue and white boat was in position classification from the date four of the tournament, all seemed quiet and without fog. But the Carthaginian became irregular and his loss to Saprissa may have signed his death warrant.
The misty let go fourth with Alajuelense, and now need the Liguistas have stumbled forward.
The manudos have saved six straight wins and a campaign of disaster, in which there was a moment that only had 5% chance of qualifying.
His archrival provided him the task, the goal to fill Carthage few times when tibaseños have helped both Liguistas.
Herediano now depends on what you do the Alajuela. The free date not hurt much by the defeat of the misty, but the main obstacle to the red and yellow will be his visit on the last date the Ricardo Saprissa stadium difficult.
Another team that had a bad day is Perez Zeledon. A win over San Carlos kept him firmly in the lead, but the loss to the northern does falter at first since it holds for six dates.
The Saints can reach them, because they lack the two sets guapileños and generaleños just a tough game to the League.
Only two dates and subtract from first to fourth place, yet none are defined.


text:
Gift Premium Subscription To loki791
Join Date:12-19-2008
Last Activity:12-19-2008 9:05 PM
- home repair
- Bill
Posted in thread: Asbestos Concerns on 12-19-2008 at 08:48 PM
According to Accurate Inspections, tiny particulate fibers of asbestos can float through the
air on lodge themselves in the furniture or the carpet. I wouldn't mess around with this stuff.
Though we h...
Posted in thread: A house made of straw on 12-19-2008 at 08:43 PM
Can someone explain how straw is less flammable than wood?
Posted in thread: Christmas Lights on 12-19-2008 at 08:41 PM
Here's a good tip -- don't buy a live tree. Trees are important storehouses for carbon. The
more trees we cut down, the more carbon goes into the atmosphere, the more global warming. Try
a fake tree, ...
Posted in thread: lightbulb goes pop on 12-19-2008 at 08:39 PM
Neither wattage or wiring is the problem -- the bulbs are simply being screwed in too tightly.
Posted in thread: Plaster Ceiling on 12-19-2008 at 08:35 PM
Use a poultice-type paint remover called "Peel Away"
Posted in thread: Paint Color For Bedroom on 12-19-2008 at 08:29 PM
I agree with your idea for muted gold -- think master bedroom on a yacht or even the
presidential Oval Office!
Posted in thread: Mirror question on 12-19-2008 at 08:27 PM
If there is damage to the backing, a mirror can appear cloudy. If this is case, then cleaning
won't help. If the backing is fine, then perhaps the cloudiness is due to the fact that it was
once cleane...
Posted in thread: Paint Color Advice? on 12-19-2008 at 08:24 PM
Have you thought about a red tint?
Posted in thread: Mounting a 50" plasma TV on drywall on 12-19-2008 at 08:23 PM
What is the best way to mount a 50" plasma TV on drywall? I think it's drywall. (how can I
Posted in thread: Storing stuff on top of the refrigerator on 12-19-2008 at 08:21 PM
I just noticed something written on the inside of my fridge that says that nothing should be
put on top of it. Why is that? What harm could that do? I have had stuff on top of it for years
and didn't ...


text:
Loss Prevention Detective Jobs
1 Loss Prevention Detective jobs found on Monster.Jobs 1 to 1 of 1
Overview: Bloomingdale's is seeking a security professional to join our team. As a Bloomingdale's Loss Prevention Officer / Store Detective you are responsible for protecting the assets and people of your location. Our Loss Prevention training program will provide you with the knowledge and tools to do the job while you grow in responsibility. Each detective is charged with maintaining a high deg...
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Source: Bureau of Labor Statistics, May 2006
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Action Oriented
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Achieves loss prevention operational objectives by contributing loss prevention information and analysis to functional strategic plans and reviews; preparing and completing action plans; implementing productivity, quality, and customer-service standards; identifying and resolving problems; completing audits; determining loss prevention system improvements; implementing change; directing loss prevention information development and training programs; designing and implementing employee and visitor checkpoints; directing security checks of purses, bags, briefcases, coats, etc.
Maintains and improves security precautions by conducting system and personnel tests and audits; tracking and implementing state-of-the-art techniques.


text:
Amy Rodriguez is one of the quickest and most adorable players in the world. I am Tumblr's resident grumpy A-Rod fan.
NWSL: 14 goals
What's with this, Canada?
Yeah, what's this all aboot, eh?
Blonde on blonde on blonde crime right there…cryin' shame.
If you want to take her shirt off just ask..


text:
IMF team to arrive in Bucharest on January 21
The mission will discuss with the Romanian authorities the recent economic developments and reforms priorities.
A mission of the International Monetary Fund /IMF/ will visit Bucharest from January 21 to February 5, 2014, for discussions on the first and the second evaluation of the precautionary agreement with Romania, which was approved on September 27, 2013 said, on Thursday, the IMF Resident Representative in Romania and Bulgaria, Guillermo Tolosa, Agerpres reports. The IMF mission will discuss with the Romanian authorities the recent economic developments and priorities in economic reforms. Also discussed will be the measures to offset the deficit in revenues following the postponement by three months of the increase in excise duty on fuels, so as to ensure the budget deficit target of 2.2 percent of GDP, he said.
According to an IMF press release, the Fund's mission, headed by Andrea Schaechter, will take place jointly with the expert teams of the European Union and of the World Bank. In addition to meeting the authorities, they will also meet representatives of political parties, trade unions, business owners' associations, banks and civil society organizations. The conclusions will be revealed at the end of the mission, underscored Tolosa.
President Traian Basescu told a December 19 press conference that he had signed into law the 2014 state budget as the Government had agreed to postpone by three months the provisions on increasing the excise duty on diesel oil and petrol. In early December, Traian Basescu showed that had decided not to approve the memorandum on the negotiations with the IMF, the World Bank and the European Commission because the Government had assumed the increase in excise duty on fuels by 7 eurocents per litre. Also, Minister Delegate for Budget, Liviu Voinea said on December 29 that the exact solution to offset the budget loss from postponing the increase in excise duties on fuels is not yet agreed on, but it would be part of the next letter of intent with the IMF and European Commission (EC).
The Ministry of Public Finance /MPF/ announced on December 24 that it was not considering, under any circumstances, the introduction of new fees and taxes or increasing the existing ones. The MFP made that announced because the media wrote that the revenues not recorded following the postponement of the introduction of the 7-eurocent excise duty on fuels would be ensured by the introduction of additional taxes and fees.
Guillermo Tolosa said that the authorities in Bucharest must take measures to offset the decrease in revenues due to the postponement by three months of the increase in the excise duty on fuels, in view of meeting the deficit target of 2.2 percent of GDP.


text:
No spittin', no swearin'...
Skip to content
Return to FBC Salary Cap
Moderators: silentjim, RedHopeful, Fenris-77, DVauthrin, dasein
by scully19 » Tue Jun 14, 2011 12:09 am
by silentjim » Tue Jun 14, 2011 3:29 am
by Fenris-77 » Tue Jun 14, 2011 9:01 pm
by RedHopeful » Wed Jun 15, 2011 6:13 am
by Fenris-77 » Wed Jun 15, 2011 2:36 pm
by silentjim » Wed Jun 15, 2011 3:31 pm
RedHopeful wrote:Out of your blind bidding options, I feel your first one makes the most sense Fenris. However, I don't feel we should run the free agent draft this way. How does one know how much to bid on choices B, C, etc that are currently on the clock when they're unsure whether they'll land choice A. Seeing the bids helps one figure out the best possible gameplan for his team since financials are finite.
by Fenris-77 » Wed Jun 15, 2011 4:18 pm
by silentjim » Wed Jun 15, 2011 5:18 pm
by Fenris-77 » Wed Jun 15, 2011 5:46 pm
by silentjim » Wed Jun 15, 2011 8:15 pm
Fenris-77 wrote: If what you meant is that you want people to be able use their cap space on more than on bid at a time, provided they bow out of the bidding once that cap space gets used on an actual contract, then I don't have a problem with your position. We'd need to set it up right, but I don't have an issue with the basic idea.
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text:
Mother wants a joyful holiday for daughter who survived brain injury
ANDERSON - Rebecca has already received her Christmas present this year.
She and her 2-year-old daughter, Ella Grace, will be able to spend the holiday together. Earlier this year, Rebecca did not know if that was going to happen. In April, Ella Grace was in the hospital, suffering from a severe brain injury that left her in a coma.
Police reports said Ella Grace was brought to the hospital with a knot on her forehead and bruising around her right eye. She was in the hospital for weeks and is still undergoing therapy.
Her stepgrandmother, who was caring for her when she suffered the injury, was charged with inflicting great bodily injury upon a child. She has been indicted by a state grand jury and is awaiting trial.
In the meantime, Ella Grace's mother, Rebecca, has had to quit her job so that she can take Ella Grace back and forth to the doctor's office. Rebecca's mother, Sandra, has taken them in for now. So now, Rebecca, her mother, her daughter and her 15-year-old brother are all living under the same roof.
This Christmas, Rebecca wants to place a few items under the Christmas tree for Ella Grace and for her brother.
Those who would like to help a family like Rebecca's can send donations to the Sun Trust Bank in Anderson.
Each day from now until Christmas, the Independent Mail will tell the story of a family that needs help. Fictitious names are used to protect the families' identities.
All the money raised this year will be used for those who apply for help in the 2013 holiday season.
Subscribe to the Independent Mail
Need Help? Call us at 1-864-260-1284.
Monday-Friday: 6am-4:30pm / Saturday: 7am-11am / Sunday: 7am-2pm


text:
Regional Vice President
Hi my name is Angel Olvera. I grew up in the streets of Los Angeles, CA. I don't come from money but I've always wanted to live a lifestyle people dream about. Not graduating from high school, I had to find something. I started a career in custom wood working. During that stage in my life a co-worker introduced me to Network Marketing and it changed my life.
I devoted a lot of time and dedication into that business. At the age of 23, I hit the 2nd highest position with that organization. I accomplished this in 6 months and decided to go full-time and have been full-time ever since.
In August 2007, one of my good friends introduced me to Kyani. I was a bit skeptical, but I had to see what she was doing. I was open-minded. I looked at the company overview and honestly, I got excited. I found out that the Health & Wellness Industry is projected to be the next Trillion Dollar Industry by 2011 and I truly believe it due to a more health conscious society. I know one thing in business and that's timing and positioning and Kyani is at that point. I had to make a move.
I was excited about making that move and thanks to that decision; I now live an amazing Lifestyle with Freedom. In the last 3 years, I've helped thousands of team members walk away from their jobs and experience a Lifestyle with Freedom. The Kyani product line has been able to help a lot of people improve their health and live a healthier lifestyle.
So now, I have questions for you,"How many more tomorrows is their going to be? Are you ready for change?" You also can do the same for others by joining us and it would be my honor to coach and mentor you in this wonderful Kyani journey.


text:
Raw Chocolate Orange Blossom Mousse Cake
Makes one 6 inch cake
2/3 cup sprouted buckwheat, dried in the dehydrator (or additional coconut)
1/3 cup ground flaxseed
10-12 soft medjool dates, pitted and chopped
Chocolate Mousse Filling:
2 cups diced ripe avocados (about 3 medium)
1/4 cup plus 1 Tbsp raw coconut nectar, or your choice of raw liquid sweetener
1/4 tsp sea salt
1/2 Tbsp pure vanilla extract
1/2 cup plus 2 Tbsp raw cacao powder
3 Tbsp coconut butter, liquefied
Orange Blossom Mousse Filling:
2 cups young coconut meat*
1 Tbsp orange zest
1 tsp orange flower water
natural orange food coloring (I used a small chunk of red beet and 1/2 tsp turmeric) optional
3/4 cup dried apricots, soaked
1/4 cup pitted medjool dates, soaked
3/4 cup orange juice
3/4 cup lemon juice
1 tsp pure vanilla extract
a pinch sea salt
To make the orange filling, in a food processor, combine coconut meat, orange juice, coconut nectar, sea salt, orange flower water, and vanilla in a food processor and blend until smooth and creamy. With the processor running, add the coconut butter, and food coloring and process for a minute until blended. Set aside.
To make the swirl, in a high speed blender, combine all ingredients and blend until smooth. Set aside (you will have extra for another use as well. If you do not want extra you can cut the recipe in half).
When the cake is ready, garnish the top with dried flowers and pistachios before serving.


text:
Larry Page: A slightly soiled box of business cards, found in a Dumpster outside Facebook's Palo Alto headquarters, featuring the phrase "I'm CEO, bitch." Just in case some people forget.
Eric Schmidt: A boxed collection of all 145 issues of Creepy Comics so that he understands how other people feel when he says things like, "Most people don't want Google to answer their questions... They want Google to tell them what they should be doing next," and "If you have something that you don't want anyone to know, maybe you shouldn't be doing it in the first place."
Michael Dell: Yet another Dell-branded tablet PC, in case he feels an uncontrollable urge to kill something.
James Balsillie and Mike Lazaridis: RIM's dueling CEOs get two one-way tickets to Palookaville, near the Land of the Lost, just south of the dustbins of history.
Sean Parker: Justin Timberlake's personal cell number so that he can convince chicks that, yes, Justin really did play him in "The Social Network," despite the disparity in looks.
Anonymous. Bus fare, hairnets, and name tags for all. Time to go out and get a real job, boys and girls.
Tim Cook: A very large pair of New Balance 991s and a lot of luck.
What are you getting your favorite geeks this year? More important, what are you getting me? Grace us with your presents below or email them: firstname.lastname@example.com.
This article, "Santa Cringe is coming to town," was originally published at InfoWorld.com. Follow the crazy twists and turns of the tech industry with Robert X. Cringely's Notes from the Field blog, and subscribe to Cringely's Notes from the Underground newsletter.


text:
Sure, environmentalists say global warming could be catastrophic, but the shipping industry is pysched that melting sea ice has opened the long-sought Northwest Passage.
But What About the Good News?
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Tennessee Unveils New 'Smokey' Gray Uniform
Updated: August 15, 2013
The University of Tennessee and Adidas revealed a new alternate uniform for the Volunteers to potentially wear this season. At this point no decision seems to have been made as to when the team will wear the new uniforms.
All photos courtesy of Adidas Football.


text:
Farmall Cub Forum -- Questions and answers to all of your Cub related issues.
Moderator: Team Cub
Forum rules
Notice: For sale and wanted posts are not allowed in this forum. Please use our free classifieds or one of our site sponsors for your tractor and parts needs.
Tranny 101 for a Dummy!
K guys
Class is starting and this dummy needs help
Had the fork (part #22) welded and it is now ready for insertion. My problem is, I haven't got a clue how to put this back together I know that the retainer screw has to align with the last detent which would be the fourth one. I am assuming that the first detent is reverse, 2nd is neutral and 3rd is first, correct?
Also, now I know why I did not have a problem with the poppet ball.... ain't there and neither is the spring P/O musta lost em?? Question, how does the rod go in? Insert spring, then poppet and then rod whilst pushing down on the poppet ball? How do I tell how to line it all up and whilst looking down on the gears, holding the poppet ball in, sliding the rod and fork into position - ALL WITH ONE HAND mind you cause me meat hooks are a little large getting two in there at once
Got new gasket, new poppet and spring this afternoon. Would like to get Granny shifting again.... any and all help would be appreciated...
I am learning - slowly, but I am learning
Thanks guys.
Confusion breeds Discussion which breeds Knowledge which breeds Confidence which breeds Friendship
Rudi, the job will go much easier if you can find an extra set of small hands. Perhaps a chance to get Em involved????
If you can't fix it with a hammer, you've got an electrical problem.
My wife says I don't listen to her. - - - - - - - - Or something like that!
the three detents in one end of the shaft are reverse/neutral/1st, or second/ neutral/third, depending on which shaft you have in your hand. those three detents are to mate with the poppet ball on each side of the trans. the other end of the shaft has the detent for the shifter fork #22. i don't see how you could run a trans without the poppets, as they keep the unused shifter fork in neutral and help to hold the transmission in whatever gear is selected.
putting it together is fairly straightforward. compress the spring and ball with a drift punch so that you can slide the shaft in. one goes in from the front, and one from the rear, as i recall. if you don't remove the plug.
while you are there, look to be sure the oil lube hole is open at the rear of the trans for the top rear bearing.
'If they're tappin', they're not burnin'
Nice try, she already said NO
K, will try to do that. I know that the poppet balls should be there, but for the life of me I can't find them in the bores...... will keep looking, but just in case, my dealer had a ball and spring, so I gots me 1 each. The udder ones is on order!
Confusion breeds Discussion which breeds Knowledge which breeds Confidence which breeds Friendship
Rudi, make sure the poppet ball didn't fall into the tranny case? Get one of those magnets that looks like a pen and slide it into the place where the shifter rail slides forward into the tranny case? Follow me? My ball would always go into there when I was trying to get the ball/shifter rail back in? I was able to push the ball down with a screwdriver and slide the rail in far enough to hold the ball in place and then slide the screwdriver in. I will see if I can get some pics email to you?
Yup, the poppet keeps goin in there. I have one of the Snap-On points screwdrivers with a magnetic end. Helps get it out. Didn't find the original, but I think I may have an idea where that one is..
Granny's tranny has been real noisy since she came home to roost here, and I haven't been able to figure it out yet. I think I did tonight though. The original poppet did not fly out (had me finger over the bore) when I took the rod out. As I sort of alluded to before, it seems to be missing.
Got cold tonight - about 33 degrees F right now, going down below freezing (yeah already! and the lettuce just got big enough to harvest ) so we rolled her into the shop. Lots of noise on the bottom end of the gears. Got me a feeling the poppet ball is under one of the gears and is causing the grinding. If so, and if I cannot get it out, Granny is going to get tarped up and she will have to wait until spring.
Got way too many things to do to start splitting her this fall. Still gotta split Ellie and rotate the TOB so I can grease it..... P/O installed it upside down.....
oh, the pics are great By any chance do you have one that shows how the forks are supposed to look when they are installed correctly???? I am still a newbie here The fork that you have still installed which I think is 1st and reverse? correct? is the one that I am trying to install now. The other fork is still in it's original place.
Confusion breeds Discussion which breeds Knowledge which breeds Confidence which breeds Friendship
As you proceed with Granny's tranny repairs, you need to write a narrative and post it on your server!
Ya got me
I should have thought of that before I had the fork welded. Hmmmmffph Maybe I still can.. although it will not be as good as your Carb articles.
Speaking of which, did you get those things done over the summer???? by any chance????
Looking forward to the governor rebuild article
Confusion breeds Discussion which breeds Knowledge which breeds Confidence which breeds Friendship
Poppet Ball
As you may recall, I had a poppet ball that had migrated to the drain plug in the rear drive unit.
If all else fails, and your tranny is somewhat dry, you might want to try putting the magnet into the drain hole of the rear drive unit and carefully using compressed air to blow it around/back toward the magnet.
Searchable Cub Parts Database and Manual Galleries at www.farmallcub.info - Computerized Carving at www.bitcarving.com
Granny's tranny is much like Granny's Trunk! Full of dirt and all kinds of surprises along with a fair amount of water. Put compressed air in there and there will be a gawdawful mess, most likely all over me
Not sure how I am going to figure it out. She is in the shop tonight, and in the morning I am going to drain the tranny again. I have already run kero through 3 or 4 times to loosen the gunk up. I think I might be able to get it reasonably clean and then with a mirror and light have a boo and see what can be seen.
Will keep apprised. Will also take pics and stuff for that Tech Article on Granny's Tranny
Confusion breeds Discussion which breeds Knowledge which breeds Confidence which breeds Friendship
Jack up the left side of the tractor. The ball should roll to the right side where you can see it with the shifter rail removed. Then use that magnet. Worked great for me and don't ask how I know. I'll see about those photos, returned the camera to the FIL tonight!? I have to get one of those digitals!
Too wide
Is anyone else having to scroll this topic way to the right to be able to read it?
Searchable Cub Parts Database and Manual Galleries at www.farmallcub.info - Computerized Carving at www.bitcarving.com
Re: Too wide
YES. It's due to Rudi's first post of 1275 pixel width. I believe an 800 pixel width will fit nicely.............
Rudi, it requires a little dexterity and a varied vocabulary, but you can rotate the bearing with out splitting the cub. disconnect the clutch rod and remove the pivot shaft the hanger pivots on. This will give a little play to allow you to remove the bolt that holds the yoke together. Come to think of it, splitting the tractor may be easier.
"The Constitution is not an instrument for the government
to restrain the people, it is an instrument for the people to restrain the
government lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." Patrick Henry
Hey Rudi,
My grease gun has a flexible extension. Don't know if you could reach the top of the TOB to grease it or not. ???
What about drilling out and tapping the seep hole on the bottom of the TOB for a second zerk fitting. ??? Working through the hand hole is still the challenge. I know, been adjusting the clutch!
John's right, splitting the tractor would probably be easier my freind!
Ken, Annie the '48 Cub & 1282 Cub Cadet.
I think we gotter if'n she don't kick, Andy Griffith.
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Fifteen animals from the county animal shelter in Downey found new homes during an adoption event hosted by the Helpful Honda Guys last Saturday.
Helpful Honda offered discounted adoption rates, pet matchmaking services, food trucks benefiting charity, face painting and more.
All adopted pets were sent home with a new leash and collar, and a donation was made to the shelter.
Published: March 28, 2013 – Volume 11 – Issue 50


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Articles from RotoWire's fantasy archives that mention Steven Hauschka's name.
August 24, 2014
Weekly Rankings: Week 1 Value Meter
Wes Welker's concussion Saturday night was the first big shakeup in our Weekly Rankings. See where his potential replacements rate in Jeff Erickson's Week 1 rankings.
June 23, 2014
NFL Draft Kit: Experts Standard Mock Draft
Jimmy Graham clocks in at No. 8
January 19, 2014
Weekly Rankings: Week 20 Value Meter
The AFC Championship should provide the higher scoring fantasy players this week.
January 8, 2014
Weekly Rankings: Divisional Round Value Meter
Russell Wilson and the Seahawks get things started this weekend with a home game against the Saints.
King for a Day: Manning Up
Can Peyton Manning's record-setting production carryover into the postseason? Jerry Donabedian believes so, as he builds out his DraftKings roster around the superstar quarterback.
January 1, 2014
Playoff Cheat Sheet - Updated: Rankings By Position
Andy Dalton Clocks in at No. 4 among QBs thanks to the Bengals' favorable draw.
December 30, 2013
Playoff Cheat Sheet: Rankings By Position
Knowshon Moreno clocks in as the No. 2 back
December 25, 2013
Weekly Rankings: Week 17 Value Meter
Drew Brees is one of the many leading fantasy players still left with something to play for in Week 17.
December 17, 2013
Weekly Rankings: Week 16 Value Meter
Jamaal Charles is coming off one of the all-time great fantasy games and tops our flex rankings this week with another great matchup against the Colts.
December 10, 2013
Weekly Rankings: Week 15 Value Meter
Neither rain, nor snow, nor the Detroit Lions can stop Shady McCoy, who draws Minnesota, Chicago and Dallas to finish the season.
December 3, 2013
Weekly Rankings: Week 14 Value Meter
Is Josh Gordon truly quarterback-proof? We might just find out this week.
November 26, 2013
Weekly Rankings: Week 13 Value Meter
With A.J. Green and the Bengals returning this week, bye weeks are all over, so our threshhold for what qualifies as a starter is higher again.
November 12, 2013
Weekly Rankings: Week 11 Value Meter
It should be Beast Mode time in Seattle this week, with the Seahawks and Marshawn Lynch feasting on the Vikings' defense.
November 5, 2013
Weekly Rankings: Week 10 Value Meter
It's a big WR week, as Calvin Johnson leads four receivers at the top of the flex rankings.
October 29, 2013
Weekly Rankings: Week 9 Value Meter
The wide receivers get really thin really quick this week - with the likes of Megatron, the Denver trio, Fitzgerald and Victor Cruz all on bye. Does Harry Douglas merit a top 10 spot, even with a bad matchup?
October 22, 2013
Weekly Rankings: Week 8 Value Meter
With six teams on bye, it's going to get really ugly this week at RB. You will be thrilled to start the likes of Le'Veon Bell in deeper leagues.
October 15, 2013
Weekly Rankings: Week 7 Value Meter
A frequent debate when discussing wide receivers is the effect of one top wideout when the team loses another one to injury. This week Jordy Nelson's owners face that dilemma - more targets vs. more attention.
October 10, 2013
Four-Down Duel: Greener Pastures?
Kevin Payne thinks this is the week AJ Green breaks out of his funk, making him a great target in 50/50 and Heads-Up contests on FanDuel.
October 8, 2013
Weekly Rankings: Week 6 Value Meter
Is this the week that Gronk returns? Right now we have a cautious ranking of him, given the uncertainty all around.
October 1, 2013
Weekly Rankings: Week 5 Value Meter
We fell just short of putting Jimmy Graham first overall in our flex rankings, but he's not that far off. It's hard to have a bad team if you spent an early pick on him in your leagues.
September 24, 2013
Weekly Rankings: Week 4 Value Meter
Alfred Morris has a potentially juicy matchup against the Raiders in Week 4.
September 17, 2013
Weekly Rankings: Week 3 Value Meter
Colin Kaepernick should bounce back with a far better matchup at home against the Colts this week.
September 10, 2013
Weekly Rankings: Week 2 Value Meter
LeSean McCoy thrived in Week 1 in the retooled Eagles offense. He has another favorable matchup this week against the Chargers.
September 1, 2013
Our first set of weekly rankings are now up. Tony Romo and the Cowboys should be in a shootout with the Giants in Week 1.
August 23, 2013
RotoWire Steak League: The Staff's Annual 16-Team Auction
Chris Liss held his nose and bought Matt Ryan for $32 out of a $200 budget.
January 10, 2013
Eric Decker seeks to burnish his fantasy resume against the Ravens, a team he torched during the regular season.
Four-Down Duel: Target Moreno
Knowshon Moreno and Stevan Ridley are two running backs on the cheap to target this weekend.
January 3, 2013
Weekly Rankings: Wild Card Round Value Meter
Ray Rice and the Ravens have what appears to be a juicy home matchup against the Colts.
December 30, 2012
Playoff Cheat Sheet: By-Position Rankings
Tom Brady clocks in at No. 3 among quarterbacks.
December 26, 2012
Should you sit your Falcons, Bengals and Colts this week, with those teams having clinched their respective playoff seeds?
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- Hong Kong Hong Kong teacher pioneers a school food waste management programme Oct 30, 2013|2:51
- Fashion Turning food waste into fashion Jan 3, 2013|1:59
Search results
Comment - Blogs - FOOD SCANDAL
It's a shame to let a China food scandal go to waste
Posted Aug 11th 2014, 06:21pm by Jonathan Woetzel and Jeffrey Towson
... Jeffrey Towson and Jonathan Woetzel Every month there's another food scandal in China. Sewer oil. Lamb seasoned with rat. Exploding melons. And now tainted Western hamburgers and fast food is the latest. In our view, this is all to be expected. If you are in the food or restaurant business in China, you are almost certainly going to have a scandal. It's practically inevitable. And it's ...http://www.scmp.com/comment/blogs/article/1571442/its-shame-let-china-food-scandal-go-waste
News - Hong Kong - ENVIRONMENT
HK$1.53b food waste treatment plant cleared for final approval
Posted Apr 08th 2014, 04:28pm by NG KANG-CHUNG
... Ng Kang-chung email@example.com Food waste treatment plant through to final hurdle Plans to build the city's first organic waste treatment plant on northern Lantau received a boost ... a final vote at Legco's finance committee in June. Scheduled for completion in late 2016, the HK$1.53 billion facility in Siu Ho Wan would handle up to 200 tonnes of food waste daily, turning ...http://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/article/1469253/hk153b-food-waste-treatment-plant-cleared-final-approval
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Costs triple for planned plant in North Lantau to treat food waste
Posted Mar 13th 2014, 03:15am by CHEUNG CHI-FAI
... Cheung Chi-fai email@example.com Proposed recycling facility at North Lantau now expected to cost HK$1.53b to build Cost of city's first plant to recycle food waste triples The cost of the war against food waste looks set to balloon after officials yesterday tripled estimates for the city's first organic-waste treatment plant. The proposed plant in Siu Ho Wan, ...http://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/article/1447275/costs-triple-planned-plant-north-lantau-treat-food-waste
News - Hong Kong - ENVIRONMENT
Funding proposal for food waste treatment plant passes first hurdle in Legco
Posted Mar 13th 2014, 12:07pm by CHEUNG CHI-FAI
... treatment works for sewage and for drinking water. The new plant, slated to open in 2016, will handle up to 200 tonnes of food waste daily, cutting by about five per cent the 3,600 tonnes of organic ... for "professional kitchens" to sort out food waste, undersecretary for the environment Christine Loh Kung-wai said. She said officials would look at how best to collect and transport rubbish ...http://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/article/1447674/funding-proposal-food-waste-treatment-plant-passes-first-hurdle-legco
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University 'o-camps' need to cut back on waste, Friends of the Earth says
Posted Jul 30th 2014, 04:38am by VICTORIA ANN DUTHIE
... Victoria Ann Duthie firstname.lastname@example.com University 'o-camps' told to cut back on waste Orientation camps for students entering higher education in Hong Kong may be a fun introduction to university, but they're also wasteful, a green group says. Resources squandered during the so-called o-camps- which are run over several days by universities to help students make ...http://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/article/1562115/university-o-camps-need-cut-back-waste-friends-earth-says
Comment - Letters
Hong Kong needs a sustainable disposal solution to tackle mounting waste
Posted Jul 26th 2014, 05:01am by LETTERS
... on this issue. The Food and Environmental Hygiene Department is responsible for collecting and transporting waste to landfills, and the Housing Department oversees public housing where half of Hong ... Sustainable disposal solution needed to tackle mounting waste Michael Chugani (" Let landfill opponents drown in their own waste," July 16) reveals his lack of understanding ...http://www.scmp.com/comment/letters/article/1559409/hong-kong-needs-sustainable-disposal-solution-tackle-mounting-waste
News - Hong Kong - ENVIRONMENT
Hong Kong government to propose cutting food waste by 40 per cent by 2022
Posted Feb 19th 2014, 11:37pm by CHEUNG CHI-FAI
... Cheung Chi-fai email@example.com Use of organic treatment centres to ease burden on landfills, but education will play a vital role Food waste to be slashed by 40pc over nine years A plan to slash food waste by up to 40 per cent in the next nine years will be set out in a paper to be released today. The scheme will emphasise cutting waste at source and building treatment ...http://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/article/1431357/hong-kong-government-propose-cutting-food-waste-40-cent-2022
News - Hong Kong - ENVIRONMENT
Five new treatment plants needed to achieve food waste reduction target
Posted Feb 20th 2014, 07:39pm by CHEUNG CHI-FAI
... benefit from war on waste Businesses may be able to save on rubbish disposal fees from 2016 when the first of two food-waste treatment centres dedicated for their use opens as part of a nine-year war on food waste. The plan of action will also target food waste at source and sets the "aggressive" goal of reducing the amount of food thrown away by 40 per cent- more than 1,440 ...http://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/article/1432052/five-new-treatment-plants-needed-achieve-food-waste-reduction-target
Lifestyle - Technology - SCIENCE FOCUS
The bad science in city's incineration plan for househould waste
Posted Jul 20th 2014, 03:54am by Martin Williams
... with waste include putting food waste through the Stonecutters sewage treatment facility. But science can also help take a broader view of the situation. With resources like oil and rare metals ... to waste There has been considerable brouhaha over Hong Kong's waste strategy, particularly plans to expand three landfills and build an incinerator on an artificial island by Shek Kwu Chau- ...http://www.scmp.com/lifestyle/technology/article/1556646/bad-science-citys-incineration-plan-househould-waste
News - Hong Kong
Hong Kong researchers developing 'biorefinery' to transform food waste
Posted Aug 26th 2012, 12:00am by Adrian Wan
... scientists say they have found a way to transform food waste into laundry detergent, plastic ingredients, and a host of everyday products, in a discovery that may ease pressure on the city's ... blending food waste with a mixture of fungi that excrete enzymes to break down carbohydrates into simple sugars. The blend is fermented in a vat where bacteria convert the sugars into succinic ...http://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/article/1022807/hong-kong-researchers-developing-biorefinery-transform-food-waste
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What was referee Darren Deadman doing during Southend United's game at Fleetwood Town? (From Echo)
Get involved: send your pictures, video, news and views by texting ECHONEWS to 80360, or email us »
What was referee Darren Deadman doing during Southend United's game at Fleetwood Town?
2:25pm Monday 10th December 2012 in Sport By Chris Phillips
SOUTHEND United fans were left pointing the finger at referee Darren Deadman after he appeared to aim an obscene gesture in their direction during Saturday's 0-0 draw at Fleetwood Town.
Disgruntled supporters complained to nearby stewards and gave statements to the police claiming Deadman raised two fingers towards them in the 28th minute of the match at the Highbury Stadium.
And Blues supporter Chris Bent was among those on the terrace stunned by what he saw.
"It happened right in front me and it came after someone shouted out 'Deadman, you're s**t as always'," said Bent, 40, from Pitsea.
"He had his back to the Blues fans and with his left hand rubbed the back of his head with two fingers to give the crowd the V sign.
"He then turned and smirked at us and he knew full well what he'd done.
"His guard slipped and he had a human reaction.
"The abuse wasn't that bad but I've never seen an official do that before and many of the supporters around me were quite put out by it."
That included Rayleigh-based Ian Holmes, who revealed the incident happened after a Blues fan had earlier been ejected from the ground for swearing after Anthony Straker had had an early goal ruled out for Paul Sturrock's side.
"I'm sure the referee will say he was scratching his head but there should be an investigation in to this," said Holmes, 49.
"He needs to explain his actions and it was hard to take after a Southend fan had been thrown out for swearing."
Lifelong Blues fan Dan Clark, 34 from Stockport, added: "Deadman should be suspended while the incident is looked into, because what he did was absolutely appalling.
"What he did was inciting the crowd and he 110 per cent meant it, I'm sure."
The Echo also understands that members of the Southend coaching staff complained to the fourth official at half-time about how Deadman (pictured above) was talking to the players.
Blues were not willing to comment on the matter while both Fleetwood Town and Lancashire Police were unavailable for comment.
Comments (7)
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4:12pm Mon 10 Dec 12
JoeBlogs2 says...
Mr Deadman was having a bad Game ... maybe he was saying to the Southend fans you should be 2 Nil up now ..lol
4:15pm Mon 10 Dec 12
JoeBlogs2 says...
JoeBlogs2 wrote:Well looking at the highlights of the game Mr Deadman was having a bad Game ...
Will looking at the highlights of the game Mr Deadman was having a bad Game ... maybe he was saying to the Southend fans you should be 2 Nil up now ..lol
maybe he was saying to the Southend fans you should be 2 Nil up now.. ..lol
Sadly this is Divsion 2 Footie and Mr Deadman will get away with it
4:22pm Mon 10 Dec 12
supershrimper says...
More to the point, why was the second goal disallowed? I watched it on the Football League Show and couldn't even work out which pass was offside,
5:53pm Mon 10 Dec 12
Doughnut says...
6:43pm Mon 10 Dec 12
sufc.dodger says...
1:49pm Tue 11 Dec 12
Mister_C says...
Typical of today's society.
Reality check time - grow up, and move on.
8:40pm Tue 11 Dec 12
EssexPerson says...


text:
Mankato West junior Tanner Sonnek helped lead the Scarlet swimming and diving team to an undefeated dual season.
"Tanner's been with the team ever since his 8th grader year, says coach Andy Viker. "In 8th grade he thought he was a diver, then he decided to switch over to swimming and it's paid off pretty good."
"The first time I actually swam was my 9th grade year, so this is my 3rd season but it's been working out pretty well for me."
"Over the last year he's put in a ton of work. He's gotten noticeably stronger. He came back at the beginning of this season and was right at our pool record, even though we don't swim meets here."
"This very beginning of the season I was already better than last year, so, I was really excited about that." "I was seeded 1st in the state for most of the season and now I'm second... being 2nd I think is probably ideal just because there's something to chase. You can always be faster, you can always be better, and hopefully we can do well as a team this year too."
The Scarlet's performance during the regular season as well as Tanner's drive and determination entering the post season is why he's our KEYC Scheels all sports boys prep-athlete of the week.