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33 Export - VBL Tien Giang Limited (Fosters)
Displayed for educational use only; do not reuse.
Ratings: 217 | Reviews: 131 | Display Reviews Only:
Reviews by GCBrewingCo:
North Carolina
3.5/5 rDev +25.4%
The beer poured crystal clear pale golden straw. The head was white and dropped like a rock, but laced the glass.
The aroma was slightly sour, Saaz hops, and slight malt in the background.
The flavor was slightly sweet and fruity. Not as crisp as expected.
The finish was off dry and fairly neutral. The body was light.
12 ounce bottle. Very easy to drink.
02-22-2004 23:16:51 | More by GCBrewingCo
More User Reviews:
3.83/5 rDev +37.3%
I got this in a terrible sampler pack from World Market. I've been afraid to drink it because of the other beers it was bundled with. I was pleasantly surprised with it. The smell is fairly week, but dominated by sweet malts. It poured with little head, as it is lightly carbonated. There is little hops taste. It is mostly malts. It reminds me of sweeter version of Heineken Dark. It has a clean finish. The color is very similar to apple juice. I was planning on finishing it off with spicy food, but it was good enough that it outlasted the food and made me wish I had another. This would be a good session beer if it weren't so hard to find at a reasonable price.
12-24-2005 00:04:40 | More by badturtle
3.48/5 rDev +24.7%
Presentation: 12 oz slender brown bottle with no freshness date or info about the beer.
Appearance: Surprisingly well laid out white lace after a startling fizzy carbonation when first poured. Clarity is fine in the weathered golden colour.
Smell: Faint hay like aroma from a thin malty and hoppy aroma. Not much to the aroma but it is clean.
Taste: Clean, crisp and a little slick on the palate with a level carbonation. Light bodied with a grassy grain that seems to be the only major flavour other than a quick snappy hop bitterness that is proportioned to balance. Finishes clean and dry.
Notes: Well in their kind of weather would you want any other beer that you could not quaff faster than this one? Similar to every other macro beer around the world with no surprises. So if you feel inclined to try a beer from Viet Nam, go for it.
08-29-2002 18:20:33 | More by Jason
1.8/5 rDev -35.5%
I don't make a habit of sampling and reviewing such poorly rated beers, but I've always been fascinated by Vietnam, a country that only a high draft lottery number kept me from visiting, courtesy of the US government, over three decades ago. This beer pours a clear straw yellow body, with a minimal offwhite head that quickly falls into film and a few patches of lace. Aroma is ghastly, with burnt plastic, a hint of sulfuric hops, and some corn syrup. Mouthfeel is light bodied with medium carbonation. Tastes like a lower tier, adjunct lager. Biscuity maltiness has a corn syrupy sweetness and the hops are mildly "Euroskunk" sulfuric. This one was a chore to finish. Very little, if any, to recommend here and it seems to be an adjunct lager rather than a Dortmunder Export.
02-27-2005 00:51:56 | More by merlin48
2.85/5 rDev +2.2%
Poured a clear golen color with a fairly large , bubbly white head , left a moderate lace. The aroma is clean, with thin hints of malt and grassy hop. Taste is also on the thin side , very similar to most Macros , slight grain and hop , clean. Mouthfeel is clean and thin. A drinkable beer , nothing special in my book though.
09-18-2006 04:30:14 | More by Byeast
3.2/5 rDev +14.7%
A: This beer seemed like any other american light lager when poured into the glass, almost piss yellow, and barely no head after a straight pour.
S: The smell wasn't overly strong, you can tell it's a rice brewed beer.
T: The taste was actually one of my favorite parts of this beer, it started nice, the sad part is, that it ended with a very metal flavor, which isn't what I'm looking for in my beer.
M: The mouthfeel was fairly watery, but for a rice beer, it felt fairly full.
D: I'd rate this higher if it wasn't for that metal after taste.
Overall, interesting pick, I wouldn't rate it at the high end in comparison to some of the Asian beers I've tried, Cheers.
12-17-2009 02:03:53 | More by NicholasCasber
West Virginia
2.2/5 rDev -21.1%
Appears Bright straw golden with thin fizzy white head thin traces of lace. Aromat Bottle states that there is water, malt, cereal, and hps as ingredients...I guess beer has a better shelf life over there filled 10/3/08 and expires 10/3/09. Smells of rough cooked veggies, with a light rice and corn notes and a muted meallic note, not much going on other than the corn sweetness. Flavor has a clean watery sweetness with more cooked veggies and metallic traces in teh finish no real hop bitterness of course and once again rice heavy with a touch of sliced green apple tartness. Mouthfeel is much like carbonated water for sure thin tiny bubbled tickles the throat doesn't offend kind of refreshing, warm weather beer...Overall the coolest part about this beer is the neck label and cap adorned with a "thunder cat" like symbol representing, beer wise it's completely forgettable.
02-26-2009 22:09:13 | More by WVbeergeek
3/5 rDev +7.5%
12-13-2011 18:43:44 | More by valkyre65
3.28/5 rDev +17.6%
I got this beer from MABZ as part of the 2006 Great Race BIF.
This beer pours a clear light straw yellow color with a white fluffy head. The head fades slowly, leaving minimal laces. Tiny bubbles of carbonation rise from the botom of the glass.
This beer has a mild spicy aroma. It has a slight grassy hop aroma. It smells of grainy malts also. It has a light citrus aroma. To tell the truith, I am a bit surprised by the aroma. It is kind of good.
This beer tastes of grainy malts. It has a citrus flavor also. Slight spice notes are present. It is ever so slightly sweet tasting. The grainy malt flavor is a little overbearing.
This beer is a little overcarbonated. Otherwise, it is crisp and refreshing. It leaves a grainy aftertaste.
This beer might be a decent session beer. It is low in alcohol, and the flavor, with the exception of a little too much grainy flavor, is not too overbearing. I doubt I will go out of my way to have this beer in the future, but I am glad to have tried it. Thank you MABZ for this opportunity to try another country.
05-24-2006 03:27:00 | More by OStrungT
2.75/5 rDev -1.4%
12-18-2012 01:28:45 | More by stereosforgeeks
2.08/5 rDev -25.4%
A: golden color with some reddish-brown hues. Good clarity. Insubstantial head disappears quickly and leaves little lace.
S: lightly toasted wheat, vaguely floral hops, maybe the slightest alcohol presence. The aroma profile is like a very subdued American wheat ale.
T: holy shit, something bad happens as this beer goes down. Each sips starts out pleasantly enough, with a slightly sweet, bready flavor - there are even some citric notes - but it turns bitter at the end. The aftertaste oscillates between burnt toast and metal.
M: Good carbonation, appropriately light in body, but it leaves behind a pasty residue.
The 33 Export presents itself nicely enough for the most part, from bottle to color to aroma, but it fails badly in the taste category. Simply, this beer gets rotten pretty fast, and that's what I take home from this beer, especially when there's this lingering aftertaste.
09-08-2011 03:14:01 | More by rwathree
United Kingdom (England)
1/5 rDev -64.2%
Horribly thin and sweet. Probably close to the worst brew i've had, one of the few many that is isn't "humanly" possible to finish, i think my sink liked it though, coz it seemed to go down it pretty fast. Putrid fizzy yellow swill, very artificial.
08-31-2002 06:43:57 | More by rastaman
2.93/5 rDev +5%
(Served in an American pint glass)
A- This beer pours a golden clear body with a sea of big bubbles popping at the surface. There is a snow packed white head that last for a good while.
S- This beer has a light floral perfume note that is almost like dry soap but is much more pleasant. Otherwise it is pretty clean in smell.
T- This beer has a water flavor that leads to a dry sulfur note with a faint green apple hard candy quality in the finish.
M- This beer has a light mouthfeel
D- The watery flavor is strong with the supporting flavors a bit odd and the apple grows as the beer warms but no hops or malt flavors come through to cover or support it.
01-06-2010 22:03:56 | More by rhoadsrage
New Mexico
2.9/5 rDev +3.9%
Big white head floats atop a clear golden colored lager.
Very light aroma consisting of light sour almost bitter hops and a very light sweet malt background.
Taste is similar with la light sour almost bitter hops with a slight sweet malt background.
A light dry aftertaste with a slight hint of sourness but nothing bad.
Basic lager similar to about 35 or so American beers that are pretty much trying to copy each others basic lagers.
08-12-2011 22:07:07 | More by LXIXME
District of Columbia
2.75/5 rDev -1.4%
10-13-2013 00:46:41 | More by dcbeers
3.33/5 rDev +19.4%
Had a couple bottles of this tonight ice cold along with some spicy Vietnamese cuisine (a nice pairing!). Pours a typical macro lager; nice lacing and head retention for the style. Smell is faint but pleasant; lightly sweet and grassy/earthy. Taste follows the nose. Goes down very easy; extremely crisp. Not bad at all as an accompaniment to spicy food (bbq would also be excellent with this). I could also see tossing a few back on a humid day in the delta.
11-10-2011 03:37:12 | More by gregb13
3/5 rDev +7.5%
08-05-2013 02:55:45 | More by BamfBacon
2.1/5 rDev -24.7%
Tried this at Little Saigon in Springfield; my fiance had bubble tea.
A - Golden, clear, and fizzy with a sudsy soapy head that only sticks around for a minute. Nothing special.
S - Crisp rice and a light touch of hops, sort of like a Japanese rice lager.
T - Ricey and a little bit spicy on the back end. Not very assertive or flavorful, but I can appreciate some gentle fruit an crisp frice flavors.
M - Crisp, light, highly carbonated...and I mean HIGHLY carbonated, with an extremely dry finish and absolutely no aftertaste.
D - This is pretty boring, but it serves as a perfect foil for hot Vietnamese dinners when you can't taste anything but heat anyway. Why drink a flavorful beer if your taste buds are fried? The carbonation and dryness in this one might actually make the painful spice even worse, but at least it'll cool you down a bit if downed ice cold.
03-27-2008 23:59:32 | More by pmcadamis
North Carolina
3/5 rDev +7.5%
06-07-2014 00:26:27 | More by tdm168
2.88/5 rDev +3.2%
A fresh bottle from the initial distributor. Clear, golden in color with a brass cast and a bright white head that holds well. It drops to a good collar but leaves no lace. The aroma is mainly of a sweet, grainy, and husky malt but there's an odd vegetal aroma as well - it's light, but noticeable. The body is thin with a very fine, crisp carbonation. The flavor is of a semi-sweet, grainy & husky malt that's fairly well backed by hop bitterness. It finishes crisp and dry with just a residual husky maltiness in the mouth. An average beer that's not really well brewed and seems slightly unbalanced. Still, it has some bitterness to it and it does have a refreshing quality. Overall, not worth looking for.
10-05-2002 18:37:25 | More by NeroFiddled
3.15/5 rDev +12.9%
12oz bottle poured into a pint glass. Pours a golden yellow color with a small white head. The aroma is a little skunky with some malt and a touch of grassy hops. The taste is all malt up front with a dry and spicy hop finish.Nothing special here but it is a pretty decent lager. Overall, this is a decent brew that is very drinkable.
09-04-2007 05:21:35 | More by cjgator3
2.9/5 rDev +3.9%
Appearance: It's transparent and light gold in color. Head was about a finger and dissipated very quickly. Very light coat of lace remained.
Smell: Grainy and somewhat earthy. There is a light, malty sweet aroma. Hops are not noticeable.
Taste: Very similar to the smell. It does have a surprisingly crisp taste. Decent malt base. A little on the sweet side. Grainy taste is prevalant. No hops to speak of.
Mouthfeel/Drinkability: It's light bodied and well carbonated. More crisp and refreshing than I expected. Drinkability is pretty good. Certainly would be true on a hot day. Overall, it's pretty average. But, honestly better than I expected.
01-15-2008 02:43:30 | More by prototypic
3/5 rDev +7.5%
Picked up a single from the cooler at Abe's in Bethlehem.
Pours a clear gold body with a quickly dissipating white head. Upon my first impression, I know this isn't another offensive or at least bland macro lager. 33 Export is better than that. However, it is a fairly bland export lager. An easy description of this beer is that it tastes like I imagine barley juice would. It's sweet, like fruit juice, and the flavor resembles very lightly roasted barley.
07-31-2008 00:59:01 | More by tempest
2.5/5 rDev -10.4%
02-13-2013 20:09:53 | More by jheberle
New York
2.68/5 rDev -3.9%
Served at Nha Trang restaurant, Manhattan
Typical golden lager color with typical active carbonation and not much head.
Aroma fresh and clean, not skunked, malty.
Refreshing and crisp on the palate, not a bad example of the adjunct lager style, certainly a better choice than Tsingtao for you Asian food accompaniment.
01-28-2012 19:39:17 | More by kenito799
33 Export from VBL Tien Giang Limited (Fosters)
66 out of 100 based on 217 ratings.


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Statements from the Texas: 2012 U.S. Senate's race
"6.4 million more Americans living in poverty under President Obama."
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David Dewhurst has a "record of promoting an income tax."
Says "we brought crime rate down by 30 percent" when he was mayor of Dallas.
Says Rick Perry cut taxes.
"Ballistic tests have confirmed that the death of at least one U.S. Border Patrol agent was caused by" weapons that were part of a federal arms trafficking operation.
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FINA World Junior Diving Championships
more info on the
FINA World Junior Diving Championships are held every two years, bringing together young prospects from the strongest nations in the sport to compete at world level.
The six-day competition is divided into two age groups (A and B). Group A is for divers from 16 to 18 and Group B for divers from 14 to 15 years old. There are 14 events on the programme: 1m springboard, 3m springboard and 10m platform for A and B as well as a 3m springboard synchro event mixing A and B.
Firstly held in 1977, the event welcomes about 200 divers from 30 countries at each edition. The 20th FINA World Junior Diving Championships will be organised in Penza (RUS) from September 9-14, 2014
World's best young talents step up in Tucson (USA)
The world will be introduced to some of the next generation of diving greats at the 18th edition of the FINA World Junior Diving Championships, taking place from September 1-6, 2010, in Tucson, Ari. (USA).
Some 180 divers, with a slightly higher number of female competitors, coming from 29 countries, will either make their debut or re-affirm their place among the world's best on the boards of the Hillenbrand Aquatic Center – Kasser Family Pool, University of Arizona.
Boys and girls compete in both "A" (born 1990/1991/1992) and "B" (born 1993/1994) age groups. This competition, organised in even years, comprises 14 events: 1m, 3m springboard and 10m platform for A and B as well as a 3m springboard synchro event mixing A and B.
Diving Juniors, 2010: China's young guns dominate in Tucson (USA)
The 18th edition of the FINA World Junior Diving Championships concluded on September 6, 2010, in Tucson, Arizona (USA). The six-day successful event gathered more than 180 young talents from 29 countries.
In this edition, China's divers dominated the operations once again, sweeping six out of the 14 gold at stake and collecting 18 medals in all. The United States took the second rank on the medal chart, with 3 golds, 4 silvers and 2 bronze. Mexico did also a very good job, with 1 gold, 2 silvers and 1 bronze. Other nations to medal at the Championships were Great Britain, Japan, Russia (only one gold!), Australia, Ukraine and Canada.
- FINA Calendar
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- World Cup
- World Series
- Grand Prix
- Juniors
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- Diving Rules
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- Technical Diving Committee
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text:
Reviving the local grocer, with local food
Feb 11, 2010 — Drive through almost any hamlet or four corners in the North Country, and you will likely see a shuttered family grocer. The little shops were once the hub of gossip and community activity, as well as shopping for essentials, before they were eclipsed by chains of gas station convenience stores. A man in Jefferson County is reviving his family's grocery store in Pamelia Corners. In the process, he's giving local farmers an outlet for their products in the cold months between farmers' markets. David Sommerstein reports.
Hear this
Explore this
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It's nearly impossible to find somebody who doesn't think the Pistons will select Bismack Biyombo in tonight's draft.
Draft Express has the Sixers taking Nikola Vucevic in their latest mock draft.
An excellent, detailed description of Bismack Biyombo's workout in Charlotte, which, unlike his workout Tuesday in Auburn Hills, was open to the media. The good news: his offense needs work but isn't as bad as advertised. Also, blocks and dunks were enjoyed by all. (Bonus link: DraftExpress still has Detroit taking Biyombo.)
2011 NBA Draft Prospects: Rick Jackson Of SU
This 2011 NBA Mock Draft comes with the actual NBA Draft just one day away, and things are beginning to get just a bit crazy.
The 2011 NBA Draft is just 48 hours away, which is crazy. It also means that even since Ridiculous Upside posted rumors early Tuesday morning, there are enough for another batch just 12 hours later...
Who do the Sixers take in ESPN and Draft Express' mock draft? Plus, a semi-informative interview with Sixers President Rod Torn.
The 2011 NBA Draft is just two sleeps away -- as the cool girls on my Facebook say -- which means the rumors, smokescreens and speculation regarding random trades are coming to a head.
Corey Stokes 2011 Highlights - Leave Nothing (via NovaBasketball)
The third annual version of Pimp Your Prospect is live. Who's your second round sleeper?
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This three-part video shows you how to install Cisco Nexus 1000V according to the guidelines in the Cisco Nexus 1000V Installation and Upgrade Guide, Release 4.2(1)SV1(5.2) Part 1 describes how to install and configure the Cisco Nexus 1000V VSM onto a host using an OVA file. (8:09) Part 2 describes how to install the VEMs onto a host. (3:00) Part 3 describes how to add the hosts into the Cisco Nexus 1000V DVS and configure the virtual machines for proper high availability. (9:25) Download this video (93.2 MB)


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Sparrows are rapid deployment vehicles designed to get you where you need to go at breakneck speed. Along with the custom paintjob, this exclusive, prototype version features upgraded initial acceleration and higher top speed than the standard model. To compensate for the boost, the hull has also been fitted with enhanced armor plating.
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Everything changed with the arrival of the Traveler. It sparked a Golden Age when our civilization spanned our solar system, but it didn't last. Something hit us, knocked us down. The survivors built a city beneath the Traveler, and have begun to explore our old worlds, only to find them filled with deadly foes. You are a Guardian of the last safe city on Earth, able to wield incredible power. Defend the City. Defeat our enemies. Reclaim all that we have lost. Be brave.
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Town Square
Google makes big real estate buy in south Palo Alto
Original post made on Jul 16, 2013
Read the full story here Web Link posted Tuesday, July 16, 2013, 11:57 AM
Comments (50)
on Jul 16, 2013 at 12:29 pm
I bet Google is going to want to build a bike path from this new property to their HQ on the other side of Hwy 101. Maybe the Adobe Creek bike bridge will finally get built.
on Jul 16, 2013 at 2:11 pm
Maybe they'll pay for it!!!!
on Jul 16, 2013 at 2:40 pm
Oh, now Palo Alto can heave a collective sigh of relief that even though der Google & der Facebook left, one has returned. Time to get smirky again!
on Jul 16, 2013 at 4:27 pm
Wow! Can you say traffic? I sure hope that Palo Alto figures out how to accommodate all the of the new workers and traffic on Fabian. This should be at Google's expense!
on Jul 16, 2013 at 4:32 pm
Peter Carpenter is a registered user.
"all the of the new workers and traffic on Fabian."
1 - the existing uses had workers and generated traffic.
2 - the new uses will be consistent with the current zoning.
"Maybe they'll pay for it!!!!
Once again Palo Alto expects somebody else to pay, pay, pay. Most cities would welcome economic activity with open arms.
on Jul 16, 2013 at 4:40 pm
Peter Carpenter is a registered user.
"The city council approved a concept plan in February 2010 to bring high-end research and development uses to East Meadow Circle, Fabian Way and West Bayshore Drive. The uses would be tiered, with less intensity near existing single-family homes and more intensity near Highway 101."
San Jose Mercury News
on Jul 16, 2013 at 4:45 pm
This is called socialism and it's good. If Google wants to attract our brain power, they need to pay for it. Many people around here don't want to commute.
They, along with other companies and rich people already don't pay enough taxes. This is one way to make things right.
on Jul 16, 2013 at 4:56 pm
Peter Carpenter is a registered user.
"If Google wants to attract our brain power,"
The brain power that Google wants belongs to individuals and, socialistic desires aside, not to the City Of Palo Alto. And Google is having no trouble getting the brain power it wants. [Portion removed by Palo Alto Online staff.]
on Jul 16, 2013 at 5:03 pm
Peter: nice post, right up to the point you decided to be a horse's @** at the end.
I assumed he was joking about 'socialism', fwiw
on Jul 16, 2013 at 5:04 pm
Don't worry Peter, I have neither the brain power nor the inclination to work for Google. Well, sorry, but to put it bluntly: We're smarter than you guys. Period.
on Jul 16, 2013 at 5:06 pm
Peter Carpenter is a registered user.
"This is called socialism and it's good" I can assure you that no one with those views would make it past the first interview at Google.
on Jul 16, 2013 at 5:08 pm
Absolutely not joking about socialism. I stand and will always stand by that. You can take that to the bank. And don't get me started on banks! :)
on Jul 16, 2013 at 5:13 pm
Peter Carpenter is a registered user.
"Absolutely not joking about socialism"
Southbound end - your apology is accepted.
on Jul 16, 2013 at 5:43 pm
This area is already zoned for industrial and office use, and there have been office buildings there for as long as I can remember. There won't be any more traffic than before unless Google changes the office density; then the city will expect them to pay for increased usage of the city's infrastructure.
on Jul 16, 2013 at 5:58 pm
I guess that there are still plenty of folks who wish to make it beyond the first Google interview. I wish them luck and good health.
on Jul 16, 2013 at 8:13 pm
We live in one of the two townhome neighborhoods near the circle. While its great that the city is attracting high tech, I wish the city also is able to make siure that those who work there come with some driving sense. Between 7:30 and 9 am and probably in the evening too, reckless drivers in a rush to get to work, run the stop sign there or crowd pedestrians by inching toward them even as pedestrians are in the crosswalk. I can say for a fact that the traffic situation (especially in the morning and evening rush hour) wiill become bad.
on Jul 17, 2013 at 6:18 am
Yes, socialism works so well. North Korea is such a great place to live and raise your family.
on Jul 17, 2013 at 7:54 am
SteveU is a registered user.
Good for Google.
Please explain to me how (previously) tearing down those older businesses in the Meadow Circle/Fabian Way area and building Condos gives the right to now prevent Commercial use of the CURRENT commercial property?
We used to make things in Palo Alto. That provided many JOBS for not just the highly Educated or the menial (bus them in, but don't let them live here anymore...Might hurt property values)
on Jul 17, 2013 at 8:38 am
I always thought that area was on odd place for a residential development. there are a lot of school age kds in those condo complexes, I hope drivers are careful!
on Jul 17, 2013 at 10:37 am
Socialism is fantastic until you run out of other peoples money to spend.
on Jul 17, 2013 at 11:24 am
Two words: MORE TRAFFIC! The changes to Charleston Road and the work on the road in Mountain View have made it take longer to get out of south Palo Alto to 101 in the morning than my actual commute to San Carlos once I am on 101. The left turn from Charleston EB onto Fabian desperately needs its own lane and a protected left arrow.
on Jul 17, 2013 at 12:10 pm
Public financing of the new bike bridge between the Google offices in Mountain View and the new Google property on East Meadown Circle, plus public financing for extending the dark fiber newtwork to East Meadow Circle certainly benefit Google, but if Google bought these properties before those financing decisions were made they could have been asked to help fund both projects.
on Jul 17, 2013 at 2:08 pm
Several of the buildings on E. Meadow Circle are now empty, and others are underutilized. I walk around that circle several times a week. Google will fill up the neighborhood with potentially more traffic, but I think that's better than more of the cracker-box condos. When the new residences were built I went through the "Open Houses." For most of the units the master bath/closet is bigger than the childrens' bedrooms. Sad commentary on our societal values. And the schools are already full.
on Jul 17, 2013 at 2:13 pm
Peter Carpenter is a registered user.
"if Google bought these properties before those financing decisions were made they could have been asked to help fund both projects."
On what grounds? Google will use these buildings under the current zoning and pay taxes - why should they be asked to do more?
on Jul 17, 2013 at 3:23 pm
I guessing that Google really will "pay" for their new property. I'm guessing the high purchase price will establish a new taxable value and the new owner will be paying higher property taxes than the combined seperate properties were paying. That's good for our schools and those entities who rely on propery taxes.
on Jul 17, 2013 at 7:59 pm
Palo Alto needs more tech. This is great news. How exciting.
on Jul 17, 2013 at 8:08 pm
According to todays Daily News, mayor Scharf is not thrilled with this:
Web Link
I guess he would prefer the buildings remain empty, not that it is his business whom the owners sold to and I am sure Google does not care what he thinks either.
Leave it to one of PAs " movers and shakers" to be against business coming to town.
on Jul 18, 2013 at 3:56 am
Welcome, Google. It's nice to have you in Palo Alto.
on Jul 18, 2013 at 9:13 am
Great to have a profitable company back in Palo Alto again. I hope Google would continue to buy more properties in that South Palo Alto (along E. Bayshore).
on Jul 18, 2013 at 9:16 am
Google can also leverage JCC Fitness Center and child care for its employees.
on Jul 18, 2013 at 9:40 am
> Google will use these buildings under the current zoning
> and pay taxes - why should they be asked to do more?
The City only gets about 9% of the property taxes in Palo Alto. It does make some additional money via the UUT (Utility User's Tax), and other fees that disappear into the General Fund. The infrastructure backlog is nominally $550M (although it's hard to believe that James Keene is actually doing an honest accounting where the infrastructure is involved).
Google's needs will very likely exceed the dollars that they pay to the City for services, in lieu of funds, and infrastructure. So, when Google wants something "extra"then it stands to reason that they should be expected to pay for it. They have a lot of money, so why shouldn't they pay for what they want?
on Jul 18, 2013 at 10:36 am
Glad to see them buy the space
on Jul 18, 2013 at 10:43 am
Peter Carpenter is a registered user.
"Google's needs will very likely exceed the dollars that they pay to the City for services,"
Interesting opinion - do you have any facts to support it, particularly since they will be paying taxes based on their current acquisition cost while everybody else has Prop 13 protected property valuations.
"They have a lot of money, so why shouldn't they pay for what they want?"
Because their taxes are already paying for what they want and how much money they have is not the issue - unless you want to nationalize Google as part of a socialist state/city.
on Jul 18, 2013 at 10:56 am
> do you have any facts to support it, particularly since they
> will be paying taxes based on their current acquisition cost
> while everybody else has Prop 13 protected property valuations.
Of course the facts exist--at least where the past exists. As to the future, no facts exist--however, it's not hard to speculate. For instance, Google wants a shuttle bridge over Stephens Creek road to connect properties it owns in that part of town. A reasonable "want"--but who should pay for it? Presumably Google is willing to pay for it, but based on your comments, it stands to reason that the municipal jurisdiction that collects property taxes from Google should be responsible for this "want".
There are "externalities" involved with every project. With enough heads at a given site, it's likely that the City, or the Firefighters Union will start advocating for a new station, and additional headcount for the Fire Department. In this case, Google isn't "wanting" anything, but the City might well have to provide "infrastructure" to support the operational needs/existence of Google (in this case).
Mr. Carpenter--why not put your "thinking cap" on before you bellow like a bull in a china shop?
on Jul 18, 2013 at 11:10 am
Peter Carpenter is a registered user.
Joe - you provide lots of "IF" but no facts.
Since Google will be paying taxes based on their current acquisition cost while everybody else has Prop 13 protected property valuations why should Google now be asked to pay even more?
If the city is not getting enough money from all of its property taxes to cover city services then it can either cut services or seek a voter approved parcel tax - but it cannot impose a special tax of any one property owner however rich they may be.
As for the Stephens Creek bridge Google proposed to build that at its own expense because it was the primary beneficiary of the structure.
Joe - think before you type.
on Jul 18, 2013 at 1:29 pm
Hopefully Google can afford to clean up this SuperFund site prior to developing this area and putting the employees who "passed the first round of interviews" into harms way. Clean-up of the chemical contamination at the nearby Fabian SuperFund site where JCC and low income housing was built is ongoing with both sites fully occupied.
on Jul 18, 2013 at 6:03 pm
"As for the Stephens Creek bridge Google proposed to build that at its own expense because it was the primary beneficiary of the structure."
Google will be the primary beneficiary of the new bike bridge between the Google offices in Mountain View and the new Google property on East Meadown Circle, and Google will be the primary beneficiary of the extension of the dark fiber newtwork to East Meadow Circle.
on Jul 18, 2013 at 8:18 pm
It will be interesting to see if GOOGLE is able to finesse Prop 13 savings. There are ways commercial real estate can change hands and still maintain their Prop 13 savings.
Yes, traffic will increase because GOOGLE is saying about 5,000 employees will be working at East Meadow Circle, far more than work there right now.
Time to move.
on Jul 18, 2013 at 8:35 pm
>> "everybody else has Prop 13 protected property valuations"
Even new buyers are protected by Prop 13 -- from the purchase date forward.
If history is any guide, the dollar-denominated value of that property will double a few more times.
on Jul 18, 2013 at 9:26 pm
And regarding an above reference to mayor Scharff's misgivings, his stated preference was not for empty buildings but for keeping some space available to a diversity of smaller newer companies just beginning their way to developing technological marvels undreamed of.
I'm inclined to agree that it would be more interesting to have some nanotechnology or robotics or medical device start-ups move in flush with IPO proceeds or a second round of venture capital. But, as was sung long ago, we can't always get what we want.
In any case, it was unfair to paint our mayor as being "against business coming to town."
on Jul 18, 2013 at 9:29 pm
I participated in a full day East Meadow Circle Design Charrette in fall of 2005, along with city planners, professional architects, design firms, infrastructure experts and other neighbors. It was a highly productive day and we separated into 6-7 teams and even had a friendly competition with independently built 3-D models for how East Meadow Circle should be developed. Many teams independently called for a park in that area, in addition to making so many valuable land-use recommendations. Over the years, it seems that our recommendations have not been followed, as evidenced by the establishment of many housings including those associated with JCC, and the Altaire, Vantage and Echelon that directly ate into the parcels in our Design Charrette (East Meadow Circle 928, 940, 1101, 1121 and 1010).
I bring this up to remind readers who are city planners and officials, as well as our general public to pressure our city planners and officials to re-visit the design ideas and models back in 2005. One team's recommended park is right on 1015 East Meadow Circle that Google bought. Google's purchase of these properties is not a bad thing at all, as long as the City and neighboring public collaborate with Google to fulfill the vision from Design Charrette. For example, perhaps Google could build a hotel for their remote employees commuting from around the world, which would not be inconsistent with one other team's idea for this location (more revenue, more sound barrier as a high rise near highway 101, less local traffic and less burden to local schools). I am actually hopeful that Google will be motivated to work with the City and its neighbors to make meaningful and positive impact to South Palo Alto.
on Jul 18, 2013 at 10:52 pm
I attended a couple of those Charrettes and it was obvious to me that they were a whole lot of wasted time. The land around East Meadow Circle is far to valuable to just turn it into a park or soccer fields. I recently sat on the Cubberley advisory committee and I have the same feeling that our recommendations are going to be ignored.
on Jul 20, 2013 at 5:07 am
Very brave of Google to step into the murky waters of Palo Alto development. This area has been office/industrial long before the condos were built and they are the newcomers to the area.
However, what about improving amenities to this area? We have none of the improvements from when the JCC was proposed such as public transit or even a coffee shop!
A handkerchief sized piece of grass is not a park and therefore not a public benefit to the area residents in general.
on Jul 23, 2013 at 11:13 am
I've been involved with the area for decades. For years my office was in a building on Meadow where the town houses now are. More than 15 years ago city policy was to retain offices on Meadow and E. Meadow, but that was changed to allow housing. Considering the demand for offices in Palo Alto and the minimal vacancy rate the likely reason some buildings are vacant is the owner was negotiating with Google and both of them wanted space Google could occupy fast.
One thing that may have triggered the deal was Mountain View's refusing since January to approve the bridge over Stevens Creek to Moffett that Google insisted they need to connect the proposed new Moffett campus to their existing offices across the creek.
Traffic may not be as bad as feared since Google transports many workers via bus from all over the Bay Area, plus the company bikes.
However it can have a big impact on SS/L if Google forces them out of their buldings on E. Meadow Circle. Depends on the leases SS/L has if and when that will happen, but long term it's almost certain.
In addititon to the new higher assessed value of the buildings there probably will be added assessments on equipment, furniture & fixtues that Google buys and installs in there. Probably positive overall if SS/L isn't hurt by being forced to move out of E. Meadow.
on Jun 19, 2014 at 1:50 pm
"then the city will expect them to pay for increased usage of the city's infrastructure."
No they won't, because ABAG will make us put in more dense housing as a result of having more jobs here.
If the City would stop trying to remake Palo Alto in the image of San Jose, I think most of us wouldn't have issues with this. The problem comes in the form of the neighborhood(s) that will be completely wrecked because we're supposed to add more dense housing as a result of the commercial building.
on Jun 19, 2014 at 1:52 pm
"The land around East Meadow Circle is far to valuable to just turn it into a park or soccer fields."
And yet, the City code promises us open space along with new development. Where is that, really? it's long overdue, and citizens should really rise in the defense of open space. The development impact fees should be paying for that, and if not, the fees aren't enough. Developers are making out handsomely, and if they are discouraged to go elsewhere because of it, good!
on Jun 19, 2014 at 6:48 pm
Suffering from Google fatigue, as well as all the fatigue from their status symbol products. Tired of their traffic, their overpaid Brat Pack, and their pushiness.
Go away already!
on Jun 19, 2014 at 8:40 pm
Loral SSL used to be Ford Aerospace and Communications Corp - it used to have a 6 story building where the JCC is now and many buildings on East Meadow Circle. That is as high tech as you can get. Top of the line. Loral SSL builds communication satellites. Google is just the young guys on the block. SSL is getting more buildings in Mountain View. The buildings on East Meadow are ancient and should probably be torn down and replaced.
Possibly we can get some Google people to run for city council so we have good representation on the south side of the city.
Glad that Adobe Creek got fixed up - one flood really hurt Building 21 on the circle.
on Jun 20, 2014 at 10:02 pm
Speaking of satellites, you realize that Google plans an orbiting surveillance network?
on Jun 21, 2014 at 7:59 am
Yes - that is why they have a new building in Stanford Research Park near Lockheed Martin. Between LMC - government and SSL - commercial - the latest 4G capability - along with Boeing, Space-X it is a big business.
You can go to the web sites of all the companies to see what great products they are producing. What a fantastic history of technical achievement.
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text:
reviews for: listing #65518 - Ocean Isle Beach, North Carolina House rental
- bedrooms 4
- pool yes
- type House
- baths 3
- hot tub no
- community Island Park
- sleeps 11
- pets allowed no
rates (USD)
$500 - $1,850 /wk
$1,200 - $5,000 /mth
You'll be happy, happy, happy
Review submitted: September 7, 2013 Date of arrival: August 16, 2013
When I rented this home, I was looking for something I could rent for a partial week that could accommodate a family of 7-one with special needs. The owner was very flexible and straight forward. And this home was perfect; it was more than I asked for and was also very affordable.
Its location to the beach was perfect: you can hear the ocean from the deck, it takes all of 2 minutes to walk to the beach, and the home is nestled inside a gated community with very little traffic. Someone with autism or a sensory disorder can be comfortable here; the decor is beautifully understated and cozy. I would not recommend this home for someone with physical disabilities or joint problems as there are many stairs.
As picture perfect this home was, there were a few minor things that could put a hiccup into someone's plans. If you are planning on spending a day in bed watching TV, avoid the room with the bunk beds. The TV turns on for 10 seconds before turning off. If you are planning on working on your laptop or tablet, the Wi-Fi can be troublesome. IF you can connect, it will only work for around 15 minutes before you have to reconnect. But who plans on staying inside when you can relax on the beach, right?
If you plan on eating al fresco; use the bar height table and chairs. All other outside table and chairs were broken, at the time of our visit. The bench swing and rocking chairs are usable, but are also broken. Despite pest control, you must expect to see critters along the coast in a warm and humid climate. We saw VERY few pests, but a couple of roaches were found. However, it was nothing to worry about; they weren't crawling on everything and died in the home due to the pest control the owner uses.
Despite any negative things I may have said above, this home is worth every penny you will spend. Get outside, enjoy the beach and the lovely town. Plenty of shopping, homemade ice cream and restaurants nearby.
My family and I plan on returning to this home as often as we can. If you rent here, please take care of it! The memories you will take home are priceless.
Recommended for: adventure seekers, age 55+, families with young children, families with teenagers, girls getaway, romantic getaway
Do you find this review helpful? Yes No
Helpful votes: 0 / 0
AWESOME- Location,clean,amenities
Review submitted: April 23, 2013 Date of arrival: April 13, 2013
Great vacation... perfect house and location for my family. Maybe 100 yards from ocean. House has everything and all the extras... bikes, basketball goal, beach wagon and other stuff, digital cable, etc. Close to sound and community docks are perfect for launching kayaks, fishing, crabbing,etc. My wife said this was the cleanest vacation house she had ever stayed in and loved the kitchen. Cannot wait to come back.
Recommended for: adventure seekers, age 55+, families with young children, families with teenagers, girls getaway, romantic getaway
Do you find this review helpful? Yes No
Helpful votes: 0 / 0
Buyer Beware
Review submitted: April 2, 2013 Date of arrival: March 8, 2013
What a disappointment this house turned out to be.
In my original inquiry I stated I was looking for a 3-4 bedroom house for 6 adults and 1 child for the week-end of March 8-10. I explained that we would be flying in from out of state. The owner replied to my inquiry, and we agreed on a price. Because we were flying, the price was to include cleaning, linens and towels. All are listed on my contract.
The directions were good, but we arrived to find a door off on the hall closet, the handle off a toilet (making it inoperable and it was the only bathroom on the main floor), dirt so thick we could write our names on the glass top nightstands, some unknown brown stain splashed above the microwave, and a dead roach in the middle of the living room. The unit was not clean!
All of the sheets were randomly stuffed in a closet with no labeling as to which size/bed they belonged to. The towels we paid for consisted of 3 bath towels, 2 hand towels and 2 washcloths (for 7 people!)
I immediately contacted the owner and conveyed my disappointment. He said his wife had visited earlier in the day, and found the house clean (no mention was made of the broken toilet, door, or layer of grit. When I asked about towels, his response was that I should go buy some and he would reimburse me (why should I have believed him?).
Previously, we have rented through a realty. I had hoped that by renting from an owner directly, things would be in better condition. Never again!
Owners response: This review is not at all representative of the feedback we can get from any guests and why we have so many return visitors. But, it is consistent with her prior communication and demands. First, we provided sheets and towels completely free as a courtesy, and there was a whole basket of brand new sheets and towels purchased for them and placed in the owners closet for them, as I directed.... very nice. Second, the house had not yet received its spring cleaning or carpet, which it gets every April. They arrived at the house early .... our handyman was scheduled to fix the broken toilet handle that aftenoon and before our Cleaning crew could do a general clean. They arrived early because they felt entitled but did not tell me. Thus, we could not address the toilet handle and general clean. However, the house was very clean except for some dusting. There was dead "roach" because we pay for the highest level of of pest control and these water begs do not live in our house like they do many beach houses. Anytime, someone needs something at our house (waffle maker, blender, iron... basically anything that is broken or needed by special request) we reimburse the guest 100% immediately. I also offered to completely refund this lady all of her money, but they preferred to stay and just complain. Not surprised she would write a complaint based on all of her previous conversations.
Do you find this review helpful? Yes No
Helpful votes: 1 / 1
Wonderful Vacation
Review submitted: September 15, 2011 Date of arrival: September 1, 2011
This was a fantastic rental and we had a great time. Four adults and a toddler fit with room to spare and all the kid-gear was available to make life easier. We have rented elsewhere on the southern NC coast and found both the house and the location to be at the top of our experiences. Can't beat the proximity to the beach, easy walk even for an older generation. Owners were great to work with and we really appreciated their local suggestions as this was our first time to OIB. Only downside was the grill is not in the greatest (usable) condition. Otherwise, everything was wonderful and we hope to return next year.
Recommended for: adventure seekers, families with young children, families with teenagers, girls getaway
Do you find this review helpful? Yes No
Helpful votes: 3 / 4
Ocean Isle vacation
Review submitted: June 24, 2011 Date of arrival: June 11, 2011
My family (husband, daughter, 2 grandkids) enjoyed the stay. The layout was very good and it was great to have both bedrooms upstairs with private baths. The kitchen was big enough to accomadate several "cooks" in the kitchen at one time. The turtles were a pleasant surprise and we feed them constantly.
Recommended for: families with young children, girls getaway
Do you find this review helpful? Yes No
Helpful votes: 2 / 2
Fantastic Week! Family Friendly! Great for Kids!
Review submitted: June 20, 2011 Date of arrival: June 4, 2011
Our family vacationed for the first time at Ocean Isle. A return to the beach will be a definite and we plan on renting the same house again. The house was very roomy, clean, had plenty of cookware, and lots of extras to make our vacation perfect.
While the house exceeded our expectations, our favorite thing was the location and the kid friendly neighborhood. The beach house was very close walk to the pool and the ocean. The neighborhood was very family friendly with several families having children. Our kids were never bored and enjoyed riding bikes, walks, feeding the turtles, and socializing with other families. We felt that the price was extremely reasonable and we'll definitely be returning!
Recommended for: families with young children, families with teenagers, girls getaway
Do you find this review helpful? Yes No
Helpful votes: 3 / 4
Prime family rental
Review submitted: June 18, 2011 Date of arrival: May 8, 2011
Ideal vacation spot for families with young children. Proximity to the beach and neighborhood pool was key to keeping our3 and 4 year old entertained. We forgot all of our beach toys, but this was no problem as the house was stocked for any recreation we could have needed (bikes, bocce, shovels/buckets, etc.). Additionally, we did not have to bring bulky items like a pack-n-play or high chairs as these were all provided. We have rented on the West end of Ocean Isle for years now, and we found this property to be better maintained and more updated than any other house where we have stayed for the last seven years. We have already booked for 2012.
Recommended for: adventure seekers, families with young children, families with teenagers
Do you find this review helpful? Yes No
Helpful votes: 0 / 0
Great Location, But House Needs Some TLC
Review submitted: June 12, 2011 Date of arrival: May 14, 2011
Based on the information provided through vacationrentals.com regarding this property, my husband & I chose Carter's Crib at Ocean Isle Beach, NC as the place to celebrate our first wedding anniversary. The owner was very easy to work with and made sure we had ample information about the area before our arrival. The cost for the total week of R&R was very reasonable as well. It was very quiet & we enjoyed the swing, hammock & grill. We did find, however, that there were several items missing that were indicated to be available on the property information page. There were supposed to be beach chairs and bikes (because of this, we did not bring our own)...but we could not locate them. Also, we realized that the pipe to the outside shower was busted when we attempted to use it on the first day, so this feature of the property did us no good. The deadbolt to the front door was broken (wouldn't lock) and the frontmost bedroom had a ripped window screen. Although it was very convenient to have a washer & dryer at the house, the dryer was very noisy (squeaky) and must have been on too hot of a setting because it actually left burn stains on several clothing items of mine & my husbands. We didn't use it again after that for fear of it being a fire hazzard. We also found that the filter for the air conditioning system was extremely dirty & definitely needed to be changed. Overall, the house is very spacious, well stocked w/furniture & kitchen supplies & in a superb location (within easy walking distance of the ocean), but needs a bit of maintenance & upkeep. We would recommend the house to families with children (the turtles & birds on the sound were so fun to feed in the morning!), but not for a formal gathering like a wedding, etc. We would consider returning to this house in the future only after speaking with the owner before our next stay to ensure that the basic maintenance issues had been taken care of.
Recommended for: families with young children, families with teenagers
Owners response: This family was our first guest of the spring and we had not been to the house since Thanksgiving. All all of these items have been addressed. Shower had a busted pipe and was fixed within 1 hour from when I learned of it. The deadbolts rusted and were also fixed. The bikes, baby strollers, beach chairs were in the owners closet and available for their use. We usually leave them out during the spring and summer months. It is disappointing that that this guest did not mention these issues, because all of these items would have been available to them. We have a great handyman and all these items would have been fixed within a couple hours of their arrival. We provide guests all of our contact information and ask to let us know if they need anything. We have even made kayaks, skim boards, rafts, baby items, and even golf clubs available.
Do you find this review helpful? Yes No
Helpful votes: 4 / 4
great vacation rental
Review submitted: June 10, 2011 Date of arrival: May 30, 2011
this was a great place to stay on vacation ,we enjoyed it very much we had 9 adults ,a 2yr old and 4month old there was plenty of room and it was nice when taking children along not to have to drag everything with you almost everything you would need was there down even to toys the house was clean and well taken care of .The only thing we found not to be exactly perfect from the description I thought we would have access to the sound which we didn't or we did not find it and the beach seemed to be further a way you had to cross 2 roads to get to it so we had to load up in the car when ever we wanted to go to the beach ,The pool access was great never found it crowded going up and down the step was not so great but we would gladly stay again and plan on making a yearly trip the owner was easy to work with and friendly
Recommended for: families with young children, families with teenagers, girls getaway, sight seeing, romantic getaway
Do you find this review helpful? Yes No
Helpful votes: 1 / 1
Love this every time!
Review submitted: November 3, 2010 Date of arrival: June 7, 2010
Always our choice when visiting Ocean Isle Beach. Very spacious vacation home great for a large family or when going with friends. Love being so close to the beach, and this beach is clean and quieter than most. Pond is fun for the kids to feed the turtles while mom and dad relax on the swing. Island has great pier, miniature golf, museum, video game room, to name a few activities available. I would highly recommend this property to anyone who is looking for a great vacation at the beach.
Recommended for: families with young children, families with teenagers, tourists without a car
Do you find this review helpful? Yes No
Helpful votes: 2 / 2
We really loved it!
Review submitted: October 10, 2010 Date of arrival: August 26, 2010
My son, 9 years old, my husband and elderly mom stayed at Carter's Crib. We really liked it. The house is nicer than the pictures portray. My son so loved the pond in the back. It is a great house and the owners are very nice to work with. Overall, we loved it and want to come back. Great community too! We do recommend renting a golf cart, we did and had lots of fun driving it to the pools and beach.
Recommended for: families with young children, girls getaway
Do you find this review helpful? Yes No
Helpful votes: 2 / 2
Wonderful Vacation Rental
Review submitted: August 26, 2010 Date of arrival: August 7, 2010
Four Adults and 6 children had a really fabulous week. Comfortable beds, lovely fridge, dishwasher and huge washer and dryer made this a very easy week. Beach is a short walk, local pools are lovely and feeding the turtles and seagulls was great daily entertainment. Myrtle Beach attractions an easy drive away. Lowes Food store was a pleasant suprise. Spacious nicely furnished well stocked house.
We will definitely return.
Recommended for: families with young children, families with teenagers, girls getaway, sight seeing, romantic getaway
Do you find this review helpful? Yes No
Helpful votes: 3 / 3
Carter's Crib
Review submitted: June 28, 2010 Date of arrival: June 19, 2010
Nice place to stay. Very convenient to beach. Enjoyed having tv's in every room. My grandchildren enjoyed the pond; my grandson caught a bass and several bream. Would stay here again.
Recommended for: families with young children
Do you find this review helpful? Yes No
Helpful votes: 4 / 4
Reviews are the subjective opinions of VacationRentals.com travelers and not of VacationRentals.com, Inc.


text:
The best time to visit Lord Howe Island is... anytime!
Even temperatures year-round make Lord Howe Island a perfect all seasons' holiday destination. Due to its isolated, subtropical location and warm sea currents Lord Howe Island has its own microclimate.
During summer, the maximum temperature averages 26°C (82°F) whilst minimums reach 20°C (70°F) overnight. The average winter temperature is a mild 18°C (66°F), falling to 12 to 14°C ( 51 to 58°F) overnight.
Pack a light waterproof jacket, hat and comfortable walking shoes, and a warmer jumper for those cool winter evenings.


text:
By Will Willems
Sports Editor
Dover — It has been a tough end of the season for the Western Boone boys soccer team.
After losing 10-0 to Tri-West Tuesday, the Stars dominated Southmont for most of the game Thursday, only to fall 2-0.
"We said one of the keys to the game was going to be finishing," Western Boone head coach Mike Schlemmer said. "And we couldn't get it done tonight."
Western Boone outshot Southmont 22-7 in the game, but couldn't get the key shot into the net.
The Stars were all around, and over the net, and even hit the post, but none went in.
Western Boone has scored three goals in the previous five games.
"Sometimes we need to have a sense of urgency when we play," Schlemmer said. "Sometimes we need to have one more pass. I don't think you can point to any one particular thing that we are doing, just a lot of little things."
Southmont struck for two quick goals early in the first half and were content to play defense the rest of the game.
For more of this story, read Friday's Lebanon Reporter.


text:
Sloan Piva
Sloan Piva is a sports writer, editor and freelance journalist from southeastern New England. He covers the Boston Celtics for Yahoo! Sports and various blogs and websites.Read More »
Sloan received his undergraduate and graduate degrees from the University of Massachusetts. His bachelor's is in Journalism, and his Master's is in Professional Writing.
Catch him tweeting up a storm @SloanPiva.
Sloan received his undergraduate and graduate degrees from the University of Massachusetts. His bachelor's is in Journalism, and his Master's is in Professional Writing.
Catch him tweeting up a storm @SloanPiva.
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Boston Celtics: Rajon Rondo Trade Would Complete the RebuildThe Boston Celtics do not plan to go after free agents this summer. However, Danny Ainge's phone line has been hot, and Rajon Rondo has even become a trade target for more competitive teams. Here's how a deal could actually work.
San Antonio Spurs Assistant Coach Brett Brown May Be the Best Option for Boston CelticsNow that Doc Rivers is gone, the Celtics must determine their next move. Longtime Spurs coach Brett Brown could very well be the man for the job.
2013 NBA Draft: Who the Boston Celtics Should TakeThe Boston Celtics have a lot of holes going into the draft this Thursday, June 27. Here's a short wish list of players they should be looking at going into the big day.
Boston Celtics: Doc Rivers Won't Make Decision Until Danny Ainge Makes MovesThere's a lot riding on Boston Celtics president of basketball operations Danny Ainge's offseason agenda, including the commitment of his nine-year head coach, Doc Rivers. Reports recently indicated that Rivers will not return if Ainge blows up the team.
Mark Blount: The Biggest 'Goat' in Boston Celtics HistoryEvery team has its share of heroes, including the Boston Celtics. But who takes the award for biggest "Goat" in the history of the Celtics?
Boston Celtics Must Waive Jason Terry This OffseasonMany people wonder which options the Celtics have this offseason-- unless they waive failures of their system like Jason Terry and even Brandon Bass, the future of the organization could be in jeopardy.
My Bonnaroo Addiction: Why I Like Attending Music FestivalsFor those unfamiliar with or ambivalent about music festivals, here's a firsthand account of why I love them. Even as a college instructor in my late 20s, I still look forward to my next Bonnaroo Music Festival and the amazing experience it will offer.
NBA: Rumored Boston Celtics Trade Only Absurd for the Los Angeles ClippersESPN analyst Stephen A. Smith sent Twitter ablaze when he reported a potential blockbuster was in the works between the Celtics and the Clippers. Celtics sources allegedly called the rumors "absurd," which they are--if you're the GM of the Clippers.
2013 NBA Mock Draft: Early Targets for the Boston CelticsNow that the Boston Celtics' season has officially concluded, it's time for Danny Ainge and management to start focusing on the NBA Draft. These players highlight Boston's potential early targets.Also published on:
NBA Playoffs: Boston Celtics Should Release Jordan Crawford NowBoston Celtics guard Jordan Crawford has been polarizing since Boston acquired him in a February trade from the Washington Wizards. But after the Celtics' Game 5 victory, Crawford's actions solidified what his stats already showed: He should be released.


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168 pages | 6x9
In the report, the committee concluded that there is inadequate information available to sufficiently describe behavioral and social science curriculum content, teaching techniques, and assessment methodologies in U.S. medical schools and recommends development of a new national behavioral and social science database. The committee also recommended that the National Board of Medical Examiners ensure that the U.S. Medical Licensing Examination adequately cover the behavioral and social science subject matter recommended in this report.
National Research Council. Improving Medical Education: Enhancing the Behavioral and Social Science Content of Medical School Curricula. Washington, DC: The National Academies Press, 2004.
Import this citation to:


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Changes related to "2003-01-18 Fernando Montiel w co 2 Roy Doliguez, Baseball Auditorium, Los Mochis, Mexico - WBO"
From Barry Hugman's History of World Championship Boxing
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Atlanta Police are warning motorists about a series of carjackings, where the robbers are bumping vehicles in traffic.
Atlanta Police have seen at least three carjackings like that this week. Investigators say a driver will intentionally bump another vehicle from behind. When the driver steps out to check the damage, they are robbed at gunpoint.
South Georgia law enforcers say there are ways to protect yourself if you feel threatened.
Dougherty County Sheriff Kevin Sproul said "I would urge the citizens to stay in their vehicle, and dial the police. Dial the local police authorities and have them come out and investigate the accident. Keep your vehicle locked while you are in your vehicle."
No South Georgia law enforcement agencies we talked to Friday have investigated any similar carjackings.
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About the Author
Dan Parr
Associate editor
Recent posts by Dan Parr
Related Stories
The Broncos are hoping OLT Ryan Clady will be ready to play by the time the regular season opens, but some estimates have him missing three months and then needing an additional month before he's ready to play in a game. Clady suffered a partial tear of a patellar tendon while playing basketball in late April and underwent surgery. If everything goes according to plan, he'll be prepared by the time the Sept. 12 opener rolls around.
If he encounters a setback or takes longer than expected to recover, Denver's top options include moving ORT Ryan Harris, who is recovering from a toe injury, to the left side, giving Tyler Polumbus a chance to start, or turning to second-round pick Zane Beadles. Polumbus did a decent job in eight starts at right tackle while Harris was out last season, and Beadles, a swingman on the O-line, played left tackle in college. Starting Polumbus or Beadles, however, isn't a scenario the Broncos would like to find themselves in.
For the most authoritative NFL draft news and free-agency analysis, visit ProFootballWeekly.com.


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There's more to television than just debates
By Martha M. Hamilton, Louis Jacobson
Published on Friday, November 11th, 2011 at 4:00 p.m.
Fact-checking the Nov. 9 Republican presidential debate in Michigan kept us busy -- but not too busy to watch The Daily Show with Jon Stewart. The show often has politicians as guests, and this week they included former president Bill Clinton and House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif.
Clinton caught our attention when he said that solar and wind power are "both cheaper than nuclear right now." When we compared that with information from the U.S. Department of Energy, we found that he was right about land-based wind power but wrong about solar power, so we gave him a Half True.
Pelosi, meanwhile, was contrasting the standing of Congress from the years she was speaker of the then Democrat-controlled House with now, when Republicans are in control. "The last time I was here in April of 2009 ... the Democrats were in control, and the congressional (approval) rating was 40 percent. Do you remember that?" she asked Stewart.
The rating never reached that high in April 2009. Polls taken that month averaged just under 32 percent. But polls taken during the months of March, April and May, 2009 did hit that benchmark twice. So, we rated her claim Half True.
See individual items.
Researchers: Louis Jacobson
Names in this article: Bill Clinton, Nancy Pelosi, Jon Stewart
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Fazio's Mountain Masterpiece Turns 25 at Champion Hills
Hendersonville, NC (April 2, 2014) – Throughout his 40 years in golf course design, Tom Fazio has been recognized for creating award-winning courses around the world. No living designer has more credits on Golf Digest's list of America's 100 Greatest Golf Courses. Fazio has witnessed firsthand the ebbs and flows of the golf industry.
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With Thursday's 16 second round games in the books, we can began to look ahead to the third round of the 2011 NCAA Bracket, and perhaps more importantly, the complete television schedule and channel lineup.
As will be the case throughout the NCAA Tournament, every game will be aired live and in its entirety on one of the four March Madness networks: CBS, TNT, TBS and truTV. And of course, the NCAA's March Madness On Demand site will be live-streaming all the games online (and on your iPad and iPhone ... being alive in 2011 is pretty great).
Saturday's games start at 12:15 p.m. EDT, just like Thursday and Friday, but with just eight games, the schedule is a bit more spread out. No. 4 Kentucky and No. 5 West Virginia get things started in the East Region, playing for a spot in the Sweet 16.
The times for Sunday's third-round games will be announced Friday night, after the conclusion of the day's games.
12:15 p.m., CBS, Tampa -- No. 4 Kentucky vs. No. 5 West Virginia (Ian Eagle/Jim Spanarkel//David Aldridge)
2:45 p.m., CBS, Tampa -- No. 2 Florida vs. No. 7 UCLA (Ian Eagle/Jim Spanarkel//David Aldridge)
5:15 p.m., CBS, Denver -- No. 12 Richmond vs. No. 13 Morehead St. (Verne Lundquist/Bill Raftery//Lesley Visser)
6:10 p.m., TNT, Tucson -- No. 2 San Diego St. vs. No. 7 Temple (Kevin Harlan/Reggie Miller/Dan Bonner//Sam Ryan)
7:10 p.m., TBS, Wash. DC -- No. 1 Pittsburgh vs. No. 8 Butler (Tim Brando/Mike Gminski//Lewis Johnson)
7:45 p.m., CBS, Denver -- No. 3 BYU vs. No. 11 Gonzaga (Verne Lundquist/Bill Raftery//Lesley Visser)
8:40 p.m., TNT, Tucson -- No. 4 Wisconsin vs. No. 5 Kansas St. (Kevin Harlan/Reggie Miller/Dan Bonner//Sam Ryan)
9:40 p.m., TBS, Wash. DC -- No. 3 Connecticut vs. No. 6 Cincinnati (Tim Brando/Mike Gminski//Lewis Johnson)
Visit our our NCAA hoops hub for the rest of your March Madness needs, including a 2011 NCAA Tournament Printable Bracket that's updated after each round.
Other March Madness resources:
-- 2011 Women's NCAA Tournament bracket


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Owen Jones ReviewsOwen JonesAgent/Partner/Marketing Expert
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02/11/2013 - user0648445
Bought a Single Family home in 2013 for approximately $100K in Wausau, WI.
Owen was instrumental in helping us purchase a foreclosure home to "flip." Owen has always been happy to show us homes and provided us with valued information to help with our decisions. We were so happy with his professional service that we recently had him list our current home. We value his opinion and appreciate his patience. We have referred Owen to friends and would highly recommend him.
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02/11/2013 - KarriCollier
Bought a Single Family home in 2013 for approximately $75K in Wausau, WI.
I happened to stumble across Owen on Zillow and I just knew he would be the right fit for me and I was not disappointed. Working with and getting to know Owen was such an enjoyable experience. Youcan feel that he really cares about finding the right home for you and your needs. Very personable, charismatic, professional and knowledgable. I would recommend Owen to anyone looking for a home. I personally was a first time homebuyer who had no idea what I was doing and Owen guided me the whole way and was constantly available for all my questions and concerns. Wonderful person and realtor!! A+++++++++++++
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01/04/2013 - user363619
Bought a Single Family home in 2012 in Wausau, WI.
Owen was very knowledgable and made us feel comfortable taking our time and helping us find exactly what we were looking for. I would definately recommend first time and veteran home buyers to work with Owen!
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09/07/2012 - user724090
Bought a home in 2012.
This guy is just pure amazing! He grew up here but lived in Houston a few years (which is funny because I grew up in Houston also and just moved back here with my husband a few months ago) and he has been helping us find out dream home, and like I said pure amazing! He has a way with knowing exactly what it is your looking for and provides you with many options. I would personally recommend him to anyone I know who is looking for a new home. We are still in the buying process, but this kid deserves a good review from me already.
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08/15/2012 - user1566046
Sold a home in 2012.
This kid is tenacious, we needed to find a home before our lease ended (which was only a few weeks), he was with us every step of the way, great service and always made himself available for questions. I highly recommend him!
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11/08/2013 - heatherklein77
Bought a Single Family home in 2013 for approximately $100K in Wausau, WI.
Owen was easy to get along with right off the bat. It didn't take us long to start joking around! He was knowledgeable about all the houses we looked at and caught on pretty quickly to what we wanted and didn't want. He made the whole process very easy for us (first time homebuyers) and explained every step of the way. He was always professional but fun at the same time which made the process fun as well. We closed on time with no set backs along the way. He did a GREAT job and we will definitely recommend him to anyone looking for an agent. We also hope to use him in the future when we are ready for house # 2. THANKS OWEN!!!
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10/31/2013 - mharf800
Bought a Single Family home in 2013 for approximately $100K in Wausau, WI.
When my fiancé and I were looking for a home, we just happened to find Owen on Zillow. He really helped answer all our questions, especially since we were first time home buyers. He had our back through the entire process. Even when things got a little rocky toward the end, Owen had it covered and stayed on our side 100%. Owen got to know both of us and helped narrow down our choices within our time constraint to completely suit our needs. We are fully moved into our house and couldn't be happier. There's not a doubt that when we ever come to the decision of selling this house, we will go to Owen. I have already recommended Owen to a couple friends of ours and will continue to do so.
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10/28/2013 - joetrebz
Bought a Single Family home in 2013 for approximately $125K in Wausau, WI.
Owen helped me find my first house and made it fun to look at houses I was interested in. He was very helpful and helped me out through the entire home purchasing process and answered all of my questions diligently. Owen is a true professional, highly recommending him to anybody in the home buying market.
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10/20/2013 - user1305590
Bought a home in 2013.
It's refreshing to be able to turn over the reigns to a professional and feel confident that things will be right. This was my third home that I've bought, and I can say it was the simplest one ever! I attribute this to the hard work of Owens, who without hesitation or a minute of wasting my time, zoned in and only presented me with properties he knew I would want. Owens showed that even if the deal seemed complicated( As mine was) he wouldn't backdown making it work for all parties involved.
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10/18/2013 - jhoppe2
Bought a home in 2013.
Being a first time home buyer I was very particular about my agent. After multiple attempts with other agents I came across Owen. I cant say enough about this young man. Truly special. Very knowledgeable, super personality, very patient with a first time home buyer. He knows his stuff and I was very fortunate to have had him as my agent.
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Boardwalk Empire 33: The Milkmaid's Lot
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Summary: Reeling from Gyp's most recent attack, Nucky vows to eliminate his nemesis through a coalition of familiar partners. In Washington, the arrest of a high-profile bootlegger puts Daugherty and Jess Smith on the hot seat. Emily gets a scaled-down birthday party; Gillian blames an absent Harrow for Tommy's latest misadventure; Gyp decides to buy a town's silence; Broadway mourns a fallen star. (TVMA) ()
CAST : Steve Buscemi,Kelly Macdonald,Michael Shannon,Gretchen Mol,Shea Whigham,Jack Huston,Charlie Cox,Paul Sparks,Stephen Graham,Vincent Piazza,Anthony Laciura,Michael Stuhlbarg,Anatol Yusef,Bobby Cannavale,Michael Kenneth Williams
PRODUCER : Joseph E. Iberti,Rick Yorn,Terence Winter,Martin Scorsese,Mark Wahlberg,Stephen Levinson,Tim Van Patten
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DIRECTOR : Ed Bianchi
CREATOR : Terence Winter
Genre : Drama
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assalmualaikum, my question is not quite related to islam, its a general question where you might help me with some islamic advices. So here's the thing, before the semester started i gave a commitment to my friend that i will become his room-mate for the next semester. i am ready to become his room-mate , but the thing is that all of my friends want to shift to a different hostel, whereas he is reluctant to go there. the reason that i want to shift to a new hostel block is that, a majority of my friends are opting to stay there, and it would be easy for me to offer my prayers in congregation. if i stay in the same block, i need to go to the masjid to offer prayers in congregation , which is not possible everyday as the mosque is too far from the hostel.one more reason why i need to shift to a new hostel is that it has good sports facilities, and also the food would be better there. my parents scold me when they meet me in the holidays for becoming thin, and they insist me to eat food at a different place. Especially my mother, she is really very concerned regarding my deteriorating health. Now the friend of mine who is about to become my roommate for the next semester, is not interested in sports activities , he has a very limited no of friends, so he wants to stay in the same hostel , just because it's a bit nearer to our college. If I don't get to stay with my friends I wouls start feeling homesick. Pls advice me , what should I do in such a situation. jazakallah
asked Apr 07 '13 at 05:49 aatef 10●1
It's always good to be around the people that you care about. But at the same time it's better to do what makes you the most comfortable. And anything that is going to help you make the congregational salat is the best thing for you in my opinion. Hope I helped
answered Apr 08 '13 at 10:26 Muttawakkil 53●1●4
It is always good to be where Salat will be performed at its normal time.also is the person who asked you to stay a Mumin,if he is tell him to consider salat.but if not Stay away from him because in the Gloriots Qur'an,HE SAID WE SHOULD NOT BE friends with unbelievers.and one of the PROPHET HADITH is that we should not follow the command of the created to disobey the COMMAND OF THE CREATOR.
answered Apr 08 '13 at 18:48 abdulrasaqtoheeb11 259●3●12


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I'm going to be taking a week off from lifting, and want to change my routine around (slightly) when I come back.
I've been doing this:
Monday: chest/triceps
Tuesday: back/biceps
Wednesday: off
Thursday: shoulders/traps/abs
Friday: legs
Saturday: off
Sunday: off
These are the 2 splits I've come up with, and I'm just trying to pick one.
Monday: shoulders/traps/abs
Tuesday: legs
Wednesday: off
Thursday: chest/triceps
Friday: back/biceps
Saturday: off
Sunday: off
Monday: shoulders/triceps/biceps
Tuesday: legs
Wednesday: off
Thursday: chest/abs
Friday: back/traps
Saturday: off
Sunday: off
I realize either one is perfectly fine, I just need to pick one. Any thoughts?
I don't like any of them.
I'd much rather see you go with an upper/lower/upper/lower split (if you are absolutely regulated to m-t-t-f) or better yet, a full body routine 3x a week and maybe 1-2 days of conditioning/skill/sport work.
Really? Have you tried Anthony's suggestion for any period of time? How long have you been training? What are your goals?
Squats work better than supplements.
"You know, if I thought like that, I'd never put more than one plate on the bar for anything, I'd never use bands or chains, I'd never squat to parallel or below, and I'd never let out the slightest grunt when I lift. At some point in your lifting career (assuming you're planning on getting reasonably strong and big), you're going to have to accept that most people think you are some kind of freak." -Sensei
"You're wrong, and I have a completely irrelevant pubmed abstract that may or may not say so." - Belial
I has a blog.
I has a facebook.
Because any routine that is divided by muscle groups makes about as much sense as a routine divided by tan lines. Your body works as a unit - train it like one. Start thinking about movements instead of muscle groups.
And it has been scientifically proven that higher frequency benefits strength and size.
I spent most of the beginning (a year or 2) with an each muscle twice a week split. It was when I switched to a once a week split soon after that I actually felt like I was getting good results.
I started at 120lbs (5'10.5). I'm 170lbs now doing a slow cut probably down to about 160ish.
I'd like to be a lean 180lbs.
From what I've seen, BGB covers most of the important movements with good frequency.
No, bgb hits different muscle groups a few times a week by using compound exercises.
You have a whole day dedicated to shoulders and abs... why? The shoulder is one of the smallest muscle groups, and abs can be done whenever.
Day 1 Horizontal push pull
Day 2 Quad dominant
Day 3 Vertical push pull
Day 4 Hamstring dominant
A quick skim of that looks like each muscle is hit once a week... unless I'm missing something else?
Yeah you would be hitting the smaller muscle groups 1+/wk but the larger only once.
Current Stats --------------- Training Goals: Improve athletic conditioning.
Squat - 305lbs - 1/23/06 ----- 335
Deadlift - 415lbs - 2/4/06 ---- 435
Bench - 90s*7 ----------------- 100s*5
Weight - 208 ------------------ 190
Height - 5'10"
My Journal|My Routine|My FitDay
WBBB|"Many of life's failures are people who did not realize how close they were to success when they gave up" - Thomas Edison
Monday: shoulders/triceps/biceps
Tuesday: legs (quads, hams, calves)
Wednesday: off
Thursday: chest/abs
Friday: back/traps
Saturday: off
Sunday: off
Monday: shoulders/triceps/calves
Tuesday: quads/hams/biceps
Wednesday: off
Thursday: chest/abs
Friday: back/traps
Saturday: off
Sunday: off
With maybe calves again on Friday. Then bis, tris and calves would get hit twice during the week, with back, chest, legs and shoulders getting hit once? (Actually, shoulders get some indirect work on chest day, so they get hit twice as well)
Last edited by unstop; 12-13-2006 at 12:00 PM.
The same things that were wrong the first time you posted it.
We don't know the movements you plan to use.
Your frequency is low.
You said you don't like the splits I mentioned above because the frequency is low, but you like BGB and said it's a good frequency. I've been reading all about BGB over the last hour or so, and the above splits I mentioned don't seem THAT far off.
For example, horizontal back, vertical back, chest and vertical shoulders are all hit just once per week on BGB. Unless I'm wayyyy dumber than I think I am, isn't the same true for the splits I just mentioned in my previous post?
(And about movements, bench press, squats, overhead press, SLDL, pull ups, barbell rows, cable rows, barbell/dumbell curls, skull crushers, press downs, lateral raises, etc.)
Last edited by unstop; 12-13-2006 at 12:21 PM.
Yeah, you're comparing apples and oranges.
Horizontal pull on one day and Vertical pull on another day use different MOVEMENTS but the same MUSCLES. So the same muscles get hit at least twice a week.
Your routines are divided by muscles, so they get hit once a week. There is some overlap between exercises like you mentioned, but it's for the small stuff like biceps. You have low frequency for all the important stuff.
Ok, I'm getting closer to understanding. A few more questions...
For legs, it's a full quad workout once a week, a full ham workout once a week, and then a lesser version of each (BGB shows leg extensions for quads, leg curls for hams) one other time during the week. So they get hit twice, but too a much lesser and lighter extent the second time. Is that correct?
And chest appears to only get hit (directly or indirectly) just once really. Is that correct?
Biceps and triceps are getting hit one way or another 3 times per week. Correct?
Shoulders once directly, once indirectly with chest, so twice total. Correct?
If this is all correct, would you agree that a routine that consists of sort of variation of BGB where, for the most part, each muscle gets hit the same amount of times as BGB hits them, would be good?
I'm not an expert on BGB, I think its design is a little more complicated than necessary and it excludes a couple of pieces I feel are important.
However, my understanding from looking at it is that everything gets hit at least twice. There were discussions about chest, and that's easily resolved (add dips in some where or whatever).
Bottom line, essentially it's an upper/lower/upper/lower split. They work because they increase your frequency (scientifically proven to work), and because of time constraints, they force you to focus on big compound movements.
Anthony, get off your lazy ass, climb up the table with your midget ladder, and write up some decent "official" splits!
The journal / I live here.
If I were to start from scratch as a young 13 year old again, I would do every press, squat, and perhaps deadlifts, for my entire career with chains. -- Dan John
Hahah, YOU do it and I'll get Daniel to post them!


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Hale Ohana: ask about winter rates(As low as 2k a night) in Sunset Beach
- bedrooms 5
- baths 4½
- sleeps 10
- pool yes
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vacation rental description
Experience the beauty and charm of Hale Ohana O Kekai (Family House by the Sea)- The North Shore of Oahu's newest private Luxury Villa. This hidden gem sits on one acre of amazing ocean front land. It is filled with many unique accents from the islands and around the world. For those who appreciate architectural significance, luxurious surroundings and natural beauty this is a place for you.
The home sits directly on the beach, with ample lawn space and the pool facing the ocean. It features breathtaking ocean views and private beach access. Each room is furnished with luxury decorations and furniture, and the shared spaces are large and inviting. As one of the most luxurious villas on the North Shore, this is an experience you won't forget.
villa rental amenities
Home amenities include:
-Personal check in and tour with the property manager
-Indoor aromatherapy spa and Ofuro jacuzzi
-Surfboards, boogie boards, and beach towels
-Entertainment center including 64in" Plasma TV; 1000's of Channels and free On-Demand movies; Video Games- Nintendo Wii; High-Speed Wireless Internet
-Optional Services at extra charge: Airport Pickup Daily; Maid Services; Personal Chef Services; Photography and Videography, Surf Lessons, etc. Tours Avaliable- Kualoa Ranch, Polynesian Cultural Center, Kayaking, Helicopter Tours, Shark Diving, etc.
activities and attractions in Sunset Beach Oahu
- Conveniently situated among the island's most sought after sites, Hale Ohana O Kekai is an excellent home base for a relaxing holiday or for an Oahu exploration vacation. The setting is beautiful and serene, only a few minutes from the world famous beaches and surf spots, such as Sunset Beach, Bonzi Pipeline and Waimea Bay, to name a few. Just a short drive away you'll find some pretty amazing attractions such the world famous Turtle Bay Resort, Golf Course, and the Polynesian Cultural Center ( Hawaii's # 1 paid attraction) as well as the breathtaking Laie Temple. Just 25 minutes down the road you'll drive into Historical Haleiwa Town which is full of life and music that attracts many to their front, stores and restaurants line the streets that give this town significances to the North Shores name.
- While Hale Ohana O Kekai is modern in design, most of the materials used in its construction are traditional. In this way, the house unifies its modern aspects with the natural surroundings. This use of earthy materials such as rich teak and stone marry the building with the landscape's lush flora and transcendent views. The villa boasts a gorgeous open-air living space with three dining areas, breakfast area, infinity pool, large entertainment room and five bedrooms. The terrace and pool area provide an additional lounge area and outdoor bale (covered seating). There is also a grass garden near the villa's entrance and a whirlpool at the front, which appears to float over the rice terraces. The building is single-story and open-air, inspiring a natural ambiance while accentuating the breath-taking view.
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Town Square
Who planned this (bars and ice cream shops)
Original post made by Bernie Brightman on Jun 25, 2007
Why were these things permitted to be so close together? Why aren't bars forced to stay on El Camino Real where they have traditionally skulked?
on Jun 25, 2007 at 5:18 pm
It seems that the hours of operations of the two establishments don't overlap too much. Young children are not hanging out at the Gelato shop at 2am when the worst bar traffic is leaving. These businesses should be able to happily co-exist. I have young children, and we went for gelato on a Sunday afternoon not long ago. I recall the adjacent bars being either empty or closed. If the gelato shop is open past 9 or 10pm, then I could see some issues with older teens mixing with the bar patrons. But that could happen just as easily on El Camino or any other area bar.
I don't really see a problem with these businesses located side by side. When I was a boy I used to deliver newspapers, and my route included a bar. It was the most interesting part of my route.
on Jun 26, 2007 at 8:06 am
Mmmmm, and the gelato after a couple of beers? That's probably some of their best business! :-)
on Jun 26, 2007 at 2:48 pm
One of the businesses that was first to inject some needed energy into dt. Mtn View years ago was... a bar. The Tied House was, at the time, the biggest thing to happen to MV in a long time. Same could be said about Gordon Bierch in PA.