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I think it was only 15 years ago that I meekly asked if there was a way to cycle from the train station near Giverny to the gardens. My post was greeted with much amusement. Cycle? Who in the world would do that?
That same question would be greeted very differently now, and I would get a lot of experienced responses.
As I've posted various trip reports of vacations that included a cycling tour, I've tried to keep company names out of them. I have, however, done comparative reviews of companies, and I'd like to offer an update again.
This post will cover:
Why Take a Cycling Tour--and Why Not Do It Yourself?
Cycling Tour Generalities
Companies With Which We've Toured
Why Do A Cycling Tour?: A review of various tour companies and general tips
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Post Continued: Why Take a Cycling Tour--and Why Not Do It Yourself?
Everyone has his own reasons for traveling, and everyone has his own approach to planning it. Family styles of travel differ greatly, too.
I love to plan travel, and my family (now grown) loved to travel. In the late 90s and early 2000s, we had tons of frequent flyer miles because my husband basically was on a plane 5 days a week, and that combined with a strong dollar, provided a lot of incentive to get to Europe. My husband and kids were willing to stay in any type of place as long as it was clean (well, I'm not so sure the kids even cared about that), so I had a lot of options in using our travel dollar wisely.
Overall, our vacations reflected different aspects of our family life. I was a former teacher and my husband and kids were athletes. We tended to have "museum style" trips in the winter months and very active vacations in the spring and summer. When the kids were smaller, that meant in the US we were found hiking the Bright Angel Trail in the Grand Canyon or looking for Rocky Mtn sheep or moose in national parks.
Ironically, the trips that were harder to plan were the active ones. My family could spend days in museums, believe it or not, and those types of trips allowed for more instant decision changes to allow for everyone's needs. Not so on active trips. I could find the accommodations, make sure everyone had the right gear, get all the transport details locked down, but I could NOT make everyone happy on the trail. My husband hikes too fast. My little one always felt we were not treating her right. And I was always exhausted from being Management 100% of the trip.
So when my little one had just turned 8 and my oldest was almost 13, we signed up with a now defunct active travel company to hike the Bernese Alps in Switzerland. I had felt overwhelmed by trying to match the rail transport with trails we should take, and opted to take an easy way out because this specific tour group's pricing was very comparative with what I had been planning on my own.
The hiking tour was geared towards families, and the company owner really had a feel for what kids needed. We were always back in time for all the kids to hit a pool or playground. The kids got hiking sticks to which one would attach a medallion of each village we went through. We were at a bakery at dawn so the kids could see how the bread they ate that day came to be--and THEN they were told that the baker had just rescued four men from a mountain top hours before.
A good time was had by all, and this is what I took away from it:
--All of us could hike at our own pace and have company, yet
--We were not "locked in" to a group social situation 24/7
--I did not have to plan every day's trail
--I did not have to carry medical supplies--it wasn't MY problem!
--I did not need to know "emergency" words in a foreign language
--I did not have to plan our lunch stop. I did not have to plan where we would have dinner. I did not have to decide which hotel was best.
In other words, I got a vacation in there.
After that, we tried out a hybrid cycle and/or hike tour, and that led us to thinking that we preferred cycling most of all. And as years went by, we tried to do one every year. A few weeks ago, my husband and I completed our 17th cycle tour.
Why Not Do It On Your Own?
The short answer? Bicycle quality. Having a decent bike to ride is the overall most important variable in cycling trip happiness.
Oh, I've rented bicycles frequently as part of a day or two's adventure in cities all over the US and Europe. One of us MIGHT get a decent bike; it was rare that all four of us would. I will discuss more about bike quality in the Cycling Tour Generalities section.
Secondary factors are emergency services, luggage hauling, day's ride, and overall trip timing. Just knowing that I don't have to plan how to get our luggage to another place OR have to haul it on the bike is a huge relief. Knowing that a flat tire doesn't mean a ruined afternoon is another relief. And knowing that someone has a good feel for how long it will take us to get from Point A to Point B at OUR pace is so helpful, and knowing that someone with knowledge of the local area has planned our cycling route to be both enjoyable and safe is a delight.
Another key word: pace. When my husband and I hiked, I was always angry that he needed to speed up a mountain. And it's really true: he NEEDED to speed. That's how he walks, he talks, he works. I'm slow to get going--and then I can zoom. So when we hiked or biked together, one of us was always unhappy.
With these trips, all of my family members can choose their own speed because of support services. My oldest liked to leave before any in the group got going, would do all long options (explained below), might even fit in an extra option, and would be showered by the time anyone else got back. My little one liked to bike with Daddy (fast, but with stops for berries), and I liked to bike by myself.
So as expensive as a complete active cycle tour can be, there are distinct advantages that we, and particularly I, value. -
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Cycling Tour Generalities
In this post, I'll describe qualities common to most, if not all the GUIDED cycling tours we've taken.
Bikes and Equipment Offered
Every one of the five companies with whom we've cycled has offered both upright (also termed "hybrid") and drop handled cycles. Bikes tend to be good quality, and the guides are very familiar with how to repair them on the spot.
All of the companies offer at least a roomy bike bag for the front and/or back, and all have water bottles/water bottle cages. All will provide cycling locks since these bikes are a considerable investment.
Most provide gel seat pads now, but since sometimes a gel seat can actually make seat problems worse, I bring my own (it has a depression in the middle to make my "parts" a bit more comfy) and I also bring my own seat. If you use special pedals (clips, etc), then you bring those, too.
All companies we've cycled with provide helmets. Now that helmets have dial adjustments that make fitting a snap, I wouldn't even consider bringing mine. I was on one trip, however, where a man's head was really huge and they did not have a helmet to fit. If that's a problem for you, you will have to plan ahead.
How the Day Runs
Each company runs its trips a bit differently, but there is a general similarity of operation that crosses all.
Breakfast is at the hotel, and is part of the trip cost. If it's a moving day, the company will ask that luggage be outside the door (or brought to a point) by a certain time. After breakfast, the group assembles somewhere for a "route rap". At this time, the guides indicate overall timing for the day (lunch, tours, options, etc) and go over any pitfalls in the sets of directions they hand out.
Directions are then placed by each rider in their directions sleeve on the bike, which may be on top of the bike bag or just a device between the handlebars. The directions usually have two lefthand columns showing a)running total mileage in km/miles and b) interval mileage in km/miles between direction points. Directions usually are a combination of literal (route 98, for example) and physical (turn left at the white house with two trees).
On any given day, cyclists are usually offered at least two options, a "short" day and a "long" day. It's quite common to have three options, and we've been on trips where there's a "see the guide for more" option.
For those desiring a short option, there are one or more established shuttle points.
In general, on most trips, one guide will cycle the route front to back and back to front, and another guide will sweep the route via van, making sure water and snacks are available at key turning points. Both guides are available that way to change tires, handle emergencies, and so on.
Lunches may be on your own one day and a picnic another day. It all depends on the company and the route.
Often, the group will have a meeting point for a special tour of an important site. One can almost always opt out if so desired.
Dinners are part of the trip cost, except it's common to have one night on your own. Some of the tour members can't bear to be apart by that time; others just would like some time away. Often the guides will call ahead and make reservations.
Distance and Pacing
There are some trips where cycling more than 50 miles would be hard to do. The trip just wouldn't be designed for it. And I've been on one where the minimum cycle was over 30 miles (although the van driver would take pity and do pick-ups). All companies grade their trip difficulties, with 1 usually being easiest and 4 usually being difficult, although they'll also tell you that each day can widely differ. So pay attention and choose a trip that's right for you.
You usually don't have to decide what daily option you'll take right away. I'd say it's common to decide by lunch time how far one intends to go. If you thought you'd ride all day and by 11 a.m., you're pooped, they'll rack the bike on the top of the van, and you hop in.
There are natural limitations, though. If you decide to do the long option of 60 miles, and you are only on mile 25 by 4 pm, the guides will try to talk you off the trail so you are not cycling in the dark. If rain conditions make visibility too limited and hypothermia likely, the guides will pull you from the trail. Note: Rain does not generally stop the tour. They mean it when they say, "Rain or shine".
The pace you choose, though, is largely up to you. My husband and my youngest love to speed ahead and then stop for coffee once or twice before lunch. After lunch, it's beer and ice cream stops for them. They explore all roadside berry patches. They can still do long options even with these breaks simply because they have the athletic ability to do it.
My oldest also had the athletic ability to do long options, but she was rarely seen. She'd grab the directions right after breakfast, have a chit-chat with the guides, hop on the bike, and off she went. If there was a picnic, she'd drop in, grab a handful of something, and disappear. We'd only see her when we got back to the hotel, although the guides often would report "sightings" to us.
I usually ended up seeing everyone on the trail. I started slowly and then sort of moved up the ranks. Some days I'd do short options, most of the time I did the average options, and often I'd do a long option. Now that I'm arthritic, my original pacing has altered, though. It's STILL great.
Most couples do tend to cycle together.
What's Included
In general, all breakfasts and most of the dinners, some lunches, some tour fees, all tips for hotel meals and baggage services are included. At one time, some of the companies charged a rental fee for the bicycle; I think that practice is disappearing.
One of the companies we cycled with provided oodles of alcohol on the trip; most do not do so except for a greeting the first night and a "so-long" the last night.
Tips for the guides (who are your tour guide, your repair person, your chauffeur, and sometimes your medic) are not included. The basic starting point: 4% of the total trip cost which will then be divided among all the guides. We usually start there and then add more to that amount as we see fit for the "above and beyond" service each guide provided us.
Next: Tour Groups We've Used--A General Overview -
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Wow! This is great. I have been on a couple of these myself and you are spot on so far. Can't wait to see the rest. Thanks for posting.
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Thanks for the encouragement, ahotpoet.
Report Continued: Cycling Tour Companies Used
We started out our cycling tour experience with a now defunct company. Since then we have used:
Backroads 11 trips
Bike Vermont (also known as Bike Ireland and Bike Scotland when in those countries) 2 trips
VBT (and although those initials stand for Vermont Bicycling Tours, this company is NOT the same as Bike Vermont) 2 trips
DuVine 1 trip
How Do We Decide Which Company?
Our most important factor is DATE. We like to get two days on the ground before the cycling trips starts and perhaps two days after. We have had to align school dates, my husband's "crunch" and "non-crunch" time at work, and family obligations to come up with windows of opportunity.
Once I have established that, I usually check out Backroads and VBT trips and dates first. I then check out their routing and their relative accommodations, plus factor in value for dollar. Backroads has usually won simply because it runs SO many trips in SO many places, but I would never automatically rule VBT out.
I chose the Bike Ireland/Bike Scotland trips from Bike Vermont because I wanted to go to those places, and their routing was simply superb.
Our Experiences
Backroads is our primary go-to company because we've had more or less reliable experiences with them. They usually make sure art or historical aspects of the area are integrated somehow into the tour. Guide quality is good; bikes are always good. And Tom Hale, the founder, stands by his product. Cost is near the top--but not quite at the top. Alcohol at dinner is not included, although the initial gathering and a farewell drink usually are. Directions are usually very readable.
Changes in the market have created changes in the company. Many longer trips have been shortened to meet the travel time needs of clientele (and to lower the $$$ of the trip). Also, to meet the competition of such companies as VBT, Backroads is offering a cheaper level of trip, termed "Casual."
Bike Vermont My Bike Ireland trip with them, one that covers the West Coast of Ireland from Ennis up to Connemara National Park, may have been one of my favorite trips ever. The pricing was excellent, and our two guides that trip were very effective. Because of the pricing (relatively low), the trip draws people without beaucoup $$$s who are so happy they can do such a trip. That quality of expectation certainly enhances everyone's experiences.
The guides know everyone locally, and they felt free to make last-minute decisions such as taking us for set dancing they had just found out about. Our hotels weren't over the top, but they were quite nice and their locations were PERFECT.
Our Bike Scotland trip wasn't as lovely, probably because of torrential rain every day. But value was quite good again.
One other thing--whoever writes Bike Vermont directions does a great job. Print is big (husband loved that), and there's a really "physical" sense to them. And whoever routed our Ireland trip did a fantastic job, too.
Initials could honestly stand for "Value Bicycling Tours". This company offers a solid bang for the buck. Guides tend to be local; there is usually a cooking lesson and a language lesson on the trip. Alcohol isn't included, but I swear they manage to pour a lot of free booze down our throats anyway!
In addition, they offer great pre- and post- trip packages for a good price, especially since those include ground transportation to/from the cycling trip. Another VBT specialty is their Air Package. We've never used that aspect because we're usually using FF miles or we may even be coming from three different cities, but the pricing is quite attractive. Problem is that often one must take one more connection to make that pricing work. Still, if it's the difference between going or not going on vacation, I think VBT air packages are a steal.
I never like my bike as much on VBT tours as I do on Backroads, but that's not a deal breaker by any means for us. The bikes are still good. And their directions are good.
We've only taken one trip with them, and that was their Burgundy trip. Positives: really good accommodations, really good food and really good wine tastings. The negatives we experienced: really bad directions (in area where getting from point A to point B is a no-brainer) and a "clump" method of cycling.
I have no clue as to whether DuVine runs all of their trips this way OR if our guides were just terrible, but basically, there was no standard safety talk (Backroads and VBT always start out the trip with a strong safety presentation; our people at Bike Vermont would STOP you on the road if they noticed a loose helmet or if you were not cycling single file).
In addition, the guide expected the 14 or so guests to sort of bike "around" him, so that he could chat about the area as we cycled. That worked for most of the guests--no one but us had ever been on one of the these types of trips before.
And speaking of "14"--DuVine brags that it limits the size of its group. We have found over time that have around 20 people on our tour is actually optimal--it allows a more fluid social atmosphere.
DuVine directions were unreadable. Print was teeny tiny, and they were written in non-parallel structure. If anyone thinks that parallel structure was just invented so your English teacher could give you a "C" instead of an "A" on your paper, try following directions--on the fly!--that are not parallel in sequence. You'll go nuts.
Long options on this trip consisted of begging one of the guides to take us out later. Again, it could have been the fault of the two guides.
Overall: Bang for our buck given the area was quite good, but the cycling value was very, very low.
Next: Two Cycling Companies We Know a Bit About But Have Not Used -
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I've changed my mind and have decided I should not talk about any company with which I've not toured. It's just not right. But I can offer a...
Resource for further information about all types of cycling (and walking) tours
This article describes not only guided but also self-guided agencies. -
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AlessandraZoe, this is an amazing post (or set of posts). Would love to get in touch with you (email@example.com) to talk more about bike trips.
Another good site is that is more updated is here:
http://reviews.biketourbuzz.com/ -
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Thanks, theduke37. I'll check that one out.
Other update: recently Bike Vermont http://discoverybicycletours.com/index.aspx
changed the company name to "Discovery Bicycle Tours". Again, although I tend to cycle mostly with Backroads, I still think their West Ireland trip may have been my best ever experience. -
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Very informative posts. I ran across your posts while searching for combination gulet and biking in Turkey ( I am still looking so I would welcome any help). My wife and I have also been on many bike tours. Butterfield and Robinson, Backroads, DuVine, Trek and we are soon going on a walking tour to Maccupichu (sp) w/ VBT that I bought at an auction. Anyway, I feel it is really hard to rate any of the companies b/c I could have a really great set of guides from one company and you could have really poor guides from the same company. I think our DuVine guides were fabulous and our Trek guides were horrible. I do think you can group them by price. B&R are always going to be the most expensive and VBT is almost always the least expensive. VBT's air packages are pretty good from a price standpoint but your flight options are very limited and the flight time choices they give you can be horrible. I always say the things that make or break a trip are weather, guests and guides and the first two no bike touring company can control TPr -
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Good points, Tnelson. And that's probably why we really DO stick with Backroads. Our worst guide with them would have been the best guide with some other companies. Their training level--plus Tom Hale's thumb on the pulse--have created a consistency.
Your points about VBT are important. I have not re-read what I wrote, but we do NOT use their packages. We have FF miles to burn OR need to earn! And with our time limitations, we usually need the most direct flight possible.
At the same time, the people I traveled with on VBT consistently were repeaters who found the company to be very cost effective, particularly because of the air packages.
No matter what, I have never felt "nickle and dimed to death" with VBT.
Agree about group. We once biked with a now defunct company. 24 people I think, ages 8 to 81. Horrible hotels, horrible guides, terrible maps. It was SO bad, however, that we all bonded and we more or less took over the trip.
Best trip EVER. Could never duplicate.
My time is limited right now, but I'll write about my Turkey Backroads trip in a little bit. -
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AlessandraZoe: I think it is a real shame that your wonderful report/info has next to no audience on this specific forum.
Maybe consider - posting it on the Europe Forum, or at least post a thread there simply directing readers to this thread here on Travel Tips & Trip Ideas. -
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Actually I linked to this thread with my last trip report about Puglia. No takers that I could see with that thread.
But I was just considering again reposting this thread link over on Europe, since that is where I tend to spend my posting life, janisj. So you have more or less given me permission, and I shall do so. -
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I just wanted to post that this was fantastic. I went on a cycling tour in Ireland in 2000 and loved it - all you do is bike and eat and take photos.. they do all the rest...
I didn't do another active tour until 2011 when I went to Norway with Backroads (hiking) and again in 2012 to Croatia (also hiking). Same thing: you just show up and do what you came to do. They take care of the rest. For active vacations, it's really nice not to have to think about the infrastructure involved in your vacation. It is not as easy as the museum kind of vacation (as you mentioned).
Thanks for such a great post! -
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You are so welcome, flygirl. And I'm so happy you get the essence of why maybe it's worth NOT to be the trip-god" for a group bike trip.
And for those who would say, "Well, I could drive a car and accomplish the same thing," it's a matter of living in the moment. You really live in the moment on a bike.
Croatia cycling is a trip I want to do.
I do have to tell you that planning museum/plop in city trips is so easy for my husband and children that I had no idea how hard it would be with my sister, with whom I shared a room, a college major, etc. She shops! I do not! She hates museums! I do not! She's willing to sleep in beds shaped like Us for a the minimal price. I do not!
Thank goodness we both love to research restaurants and we do like to spend big bucks on food. -
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Very happy to see cycling info here on Fodor's.
We look for economical trips, so Backroads, etc, are too pricey for us.
One of our favorite trips was a 10-day self-guided Danube River cycle trip. Back in 2007, it was only around 500 euros. Still a bargain today.
http://www.biketoursdirect.com/all-tours -
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I'm thrilled to see this post! I couldn't agree with you more.
We have just been introduced to the concept of biking while on a vacation. We go with another couple where one is VERY active (wants to do all the long rides and hardest hills) and the other is more like us, middle of the pack. Also, sometimes I just dont want to bike every day. Tours plan for that and have a host of good alternatives which I really appreciate.
Of the 2 trips we've done, we've used Backroads(Utah - Bryce/Zion) and Trek(Canadian Rockies). Both were excellent.
Trek bikes were a tad better. I'm 5'1" and need a smaller than average frame. The smallest Trek bike for women worked well for me. The Backroads bike was adequate but needed tweaks to really work.
Our Backroads guides were very thoroughly trained and knew a huge amount about the area's history, geology and almost any other thing we could think to ask. Our Trek guides were equally knowledgeable and supportive. Both sets of leaders were well tuned to the group dynamic, sensing when ppl were tired and needed a day off the bike or "perking their ears" when someone needed medicine and offering to get it during the next store run.
We're off to a Provence with Trek this June. Hope to see some of you out there! Comment has been removed by Fodor's moderators
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You make a great case for organized tours. I've done both the self service option and organized tours and both have their merits depending on what kind of adventure you are looking for. Also highly recommend signing up for local events when possible. Famous examples include La Marmotte, and Etape de Tour. For many, an overseas cycling trip is a pretty special event and topping it off with one of these races is great motivation!
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CS_tms28--Good point about a race for the competitive. It is really neat when all the timing coincides, isn't it?
I always point out, though, that we are not ever going to fly our bikes over there, and my non-tour rental experiences have not been good. So races for my husband are not feasible.
Perhaps he could enter competitive beer tasting, though.
HunyBadger--I must have missed your post, and I apologize. I think adding the info about the bike measurement is important.
More seat info:
I am limited on Backroads because I tend to need at 5' 11" type bike even though I am slightly under 5'8". I have often wished they used Trek bikes because I know I could get a "walk through" in an upright with a Trek. Instead, I have to have a male bike on Backroads.
A male bike is not that much fun now when since I developed bone spurs in my hips. I can't swing my legs easily over the bike. I have to lay the darn thing on the ground, step over, and pull up. Yes, I am a spectacle wherever I go.
In addition, sometimes the bike assignments go by height, even if you have filled out forms saying, "I take a large." I learned the hard way to lie about my height on Backroads forms (I "grew" around 4 inches between my first form and the fourth), and then I have to have a really good understanding of the basic adjustments I'll need.
SEATS! I did not bring my own bike seat or get pad on our New Zealand trip because I was trying to meet carry-on weight. Worst mistake ever.
Again, I emphasize that the WRONG type of gel seat is worse than none. My "double dip" combination of grooved seat and grooved gel pad turned out to be essential for seat comfort. A slightly smaller bike would have helped my seating because my "lean forward" angle would not be on my "parts", but I already knew that a smaller bike meant a bad angle for my really bad knees.
Knee pain=no go. Seat pain is agony, but one can still at least function. -
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Evaluation Update...
I just returned from Slovenia with DuVine. DuVine had not made my "recommended" company list from our experience eons ago (see above), but two trip companions from another cycling tour asked us to go and thus we went.
So, did my opinion of DuVine change?
Sorry. No. And you have no idea how bad I feel that I cannot change this opinion. I so wanted to do so.
On our Burgundy trip eons ago, I praised the wine, the food, and the accommodations. The guides, though, were not up to par. The "good" guide on that Burgandy trip would have been merely a mediocre guide on a VBT or Backroads tour; the other was on the lazy side.
Fast forward. On this new trip, we again had fabulous wines and fabulous food, plus a truly personal introduction to the country. The accommodations ranged from good to fabulous, so again, the company seemed to provide excellent value once more. And my bike was sized perfectly.
Poorly trained guides (great guys, loved them, just not professional in handling guests and problems of the day)
Bad directions (parallel in structure now but absolutely useless without an odometer, which they do not provide).
Again, I have to emphasize that we had a fabulous time--we came home with great memories--but this company seems not have a baseline standard for guide training or directions essential to a brand and vital to a safe (and flexible) biking trip. It's a shame. -
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Thank you for your excellent post. I recently did a Burgundy bike tour with Duvine and fortunately had 2 outstanding guides, but would like to try other bike tour companies for comparison. My plan for next year is to bike either Puglia or Piedmont with Ciclismo Classico and the following year do Napa Valley with Backroads. I know you were hesitant to offer opinions on companies you haven't travelled with, but I was hoping with your extensive cycling vacation experience you may have some insight into Ciclismo Classico. I checked the comparison website you mentioned and the reviews were very short and not very helpful.
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All I know about Ciclismo Classico is through word of mouth by true cyclist friends. They really enjoy Ciclismo--including the fact that it's run by women! They feel it's a tougher biking crowd than say, Backroads, although they have truly enjoyed Backroads.
When I had asked them about comparing the two, they said that Ciclismo is still very independent biking, as is Backroads. It's just amped up.
I think I need to compare trip styles that people may like and/or look for. Both DuVine trips I've been on have been "clump" cycling. We had to stop for group pictures all the time, which drove me nuts, too. Some people may enjoy that they promote this sort of one for all, all for one thing, but that is not MY thing. I really am pretty social--it's one of the reasons I like these trips--but if I wanted "forced fun", I'd go on a cruise.
I want to cycle fast by myself, then stop at a bakery and see what's cooking. I pull out my bird books if I see something in a tree that interests me. My husband, traveling miles ahead, wants to do a quick expresso stop in the morning and a quick beer stop in the afternoon--BY HIMSELF, not with the group.
I've ALWAYS been able to do that on a Backroads trip; I couldn't even stop to pee on this one with DuVine without checking in.
So CC, according to my buddies, will provide those same freedom-of-choice options, but since there is an expectation that you will bike faster and longer, then you have to make sure you can step up.
AGAIN I HAVE NOT CYCLED WITH CC. My buddies could be totally lying
By the way, I wanted to do Puglia again, only this time with one of my daughters. It isn't spoiled yet, and I wanted to go again sooner rather than later. So having done a trip there with Backroads, I assumed I'd go with a different company, but find just as good of routing.
Hmmm, I was surprised. I went over the routing each company offered. The Casual Inns tour of Backroads, which we took,NOT the Backroads Premiere trip, had what I considered to be the best routing.
We went in September, so we had the advantage that some of the seasonal places were just thinking about closing up shop for the year, but not quite yet; however, the crowds that flock there in the summer had vanished.
Good luck with any decision you make. -
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This information is so helpful... Thank you. I know that the Ciclismo daily routes all seem to be longer than Backroads but I'm not sure I want to be doing 30-35 miles a day for 7 days with a bunch of hard core bikers! Especially since I live in a very flat area and hill training is nearly impossible.
After your reviews, I may just decide to go with Backroads. I do totally agree with your Duvine assessment regarding the rest stops. I hated stopping every 30 minutes for snacks, foliage updates, and wine drinking. And the daily 2 hour lunches with copious amount of wine, while fun, were not my preferred way to cycle an area.
I really appreciate your insight, and am looking forward to my next cycling trip. It really was the most fun I've ever had on a vacation...and going to Burgundy and Paris without gaining a pound was an added bonus! -
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To be fair, I am going to assume that even Backroads and B&R do things a little differently on their Burgundy tours as opposed to their others. Since there are not a lot of climbs in the area and there ARE an awful lot of vineyards, Burgundy itself dictates the style, I think.
I will still give DuVine kudos for food and free wine.
But then again, I remember an amazing lunch spread on our Backroads Puglia tour for which we felt free to eat a zillion calories in 20 minutes and then get back on the road. Other guests felt just as free to spend well over an hour there.
At the end of the trip, my husband and I chilled over massive bottles of beer on the coast with the locals and took pictures of everyone in the group coming in. All of us had a great day--we all got to do it a bit differently.
One caveat about the Backroads Puglia Casual Inns--I really did not enjoy our accommodations all that much. They WERE all air-conditioned, but they were not the Ritz. But darn it, I compared the routing on that trip to their Premiere trip, and the Casual was sterling.
If I see my bike buddies that do CC, I'll quiz them a bit more for you. -
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One of the things that appealed to me about Ciclismo was the longer (7-8 nights) trips in Puglia and Piedmont. I figure if I have to pack all my bike gear, I might as well maximize its use. Just out of curiosity, have you ever done a Piedmont trip? I would really like to visit Milan and Turin so right now this is probably at the top of my list. My main concern there is the difficulty level of the cycling. The Backroads trip there is much lighter on mileage, but the Ciclismo trip (Land of Barolo and Truffles) there is their longest running trip and I think the guides would have extensive contacts in the region and perhaps provide a better overall travel experience there.
If your friends can provide any additional information, I would love to hear it. -
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We have never done a Piedmont trip. I think I would rather just visit Milan and Turin on their own, though.
I totally understand your wish for a longer trip, and that consideration was certainly one of the reasons I was looking at CC. We were so sorry to see that Backroads had started to shorten it's former "long" tours: Turkey, New Zealand South Ireland; etc.
We actually have done back-to-back trips frequently for that reason (ie, West Coast Ireland with Southwest Ireland). Once we did a Backroads/Backroads back-to-back, but we usually back up one company's trip to a different company's trip with a day or two in between to wash clothes and complete transportation to start locales.
I will pump my friends for -
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Thank you so much for your very informative posts! My husband and I are planning our first bike vacation. We are looking at the Pyrenees to Costa Brava trip with Backroads in late Sept or early Oct 2014. Have you done this trip or a similar trip with another company? We would appreciate any information, tips or suggestions you may have. Thank you!!
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We have not done this trip yet, but we plan to do so this upcoming fall. I'll let you know how it goes.
As to tips, hmm. Well I guess three things come to mind:
Training--take a look at the longest option mileage on the longest day BEFORE you go and make sure you are COMFORTABLE riding at least ONE HALF of that distance with some type of elevation gain at home.
Here's what I mean... For a trip where the longest option mileage is 60 miles, I know I really only have to be able to pound in 30 miles on hills comfortably at home before I go to make the trip feasible for me.
To train for that, we have a really tough five mile loop around a lake nearby with significant climbs that range from really steep short climbs to a solid two-mile climb. I simply work up to six times around that, trying to decrease the time it takes to complete the loop.
Then when I'm on the actual trip where the bike is supported with fresh water and snacks with a nice lunch in between, I can easily do 45 to 60 miles over the course of a day.
Packing--We are big believers in keeping our packing light, and we carry blow-up hangers,a stretchy drying line and powdered Tide for washing everything in the hotel room sink. Your suitcase has to handle your biking gloves, your pedals or seat or whatever equipment you are adding to the mix, plus rain gear, so at least you can limit the clothing to lighten to load.
Example: For a six-day cycle trip in hot weather, we pack three short-sleeve cycling tops that we simply wash out at night, plus three to four biking shorts (it takes time for those puppies to dry out). For evenings at dinner, a good pair of black washable slacks and interchangeable tops with sweater suit all occasions.
Easy daily carry method: I always carry a waterproof fold-up daypack and spare bungee cords that I break out of the luggage as soon as we get our bikes. Before I leave for breakfast in the morning, I pack my needs in there--credit cards, cash, maybe rain gear, tissue paper, camera--and I can then just push the bag into the biking bag or bungee it onto the back rack on the bike. That way, when we lock our bikes up in a town to explore, I simply just pull my pack out of the bag or off the rack. -
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Thank you so much for this very helpful information! If you don't mind, I have a few questions about your upcoming Spain trip. Are you using Backroads? If so, did you choose to stay in casual inns or premiere inns? Why did you make that decision? What week are you going? Is there a reason you choose this week (weather, crowds, ect)? We are really looking forward to a review of your trip! Have a wonderful time!
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This specific Spain trip is Premiere, but we've done Casual a elsewhere. I thought the Puglia Casual and Provence Casual (at the time we took them)had better routing than the Premiere.
We are going end of Sept, beginning of Oct.
We chose this general time frame because a)that is the next time my husband can take off and b) I do not want to do Spain in July.
But for the precise trip, it's a matter of which days can I use my miles/airline status to get two Business Class seats for the price of coach. I'm not kidding. If I can make that seat availability work with a Backroads trip, great. If I have to go with VBT, fine.
With my husband's requesting we limit ourselves to one "rest" day before we start the tour and one "rest" day after we end the tour now, you can see why I have to be flexible about the type of trip and the company. Comment has been removed by Fodor's moderators
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We are anxiously awaiting a review of your Spain trip. When you have time, please share your thoughts. Thanks!!
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I'm happy you posted. I totally forgot I did not update.
This Pyrenees to Costa Brava Backroads trip was certainly in our top five of all time.
First, there were no hard connections. Fly to Barcelona; fly out of Barcelona. Shuttle to beginning of trip; shuttle at the end of the trip.
Second, the accommodations were really nice. Yeah, because Europe doesn't really do cookie-cutter rooms, you have no idea ahead of time whether or not you'll draw the straw for the Presidential Suite or the Attic Access Suite, but the last stop at the Mas Torrent Spa gives you uniform nice rooms in a great setting.
Third, there were two (2) two-night stays in the five nights. That sequencing adds so much to relaxation when you have time to wash out your smelly bike clothes.
Fourth, there was a great mixture of scenery and culture. Everyone on the trip fell in love with Catalonia. And while we may not have fallen in love with Dali, we all got to know him.
Fifth, the biking routes were endlessly beautiful. No endless stretches of sun; no hills for hills' sake. Varied; interesting.
Sixth, hidden places for sudden coffee and beer stops on the route.
Things we can't guarantee but loved:
--Our Backroads guides are always good; this trip, they were great. I wanted to take them home with me.
--Our guests were seasoned. They either biked well or KNEW THEY DID NOT BIKE WELL. That helps the guides serve the long-distance riders better.
I liked this trip so much that I immediately emailed past trip members who enjoy long routes. One emailed back immediately that she seconded our rec. She considered this trip to be Top Five also.
I hope this helps. I posted our Barcelona before and after here:
http://www.fodors.com/community/europe/hit-and-run-our-quick-view-of-barcelona.cfm -
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Thank you! A few questions...We loved reading your post about Barcelona. Have you posted details of the biking portion of the trip somewhere? How would you rate the difficulty of the Spain trip? We live on the plains of MN and have very limited opportunity to climb hills, let alone mountains. We get plenty of miles in from April to October but are concerned about the climbing demands of this trip. What are your top 5 bike trips??
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The details I listed above are as much as I normally share about any trip for good reasons.
First, there are companies that have stolen routes--we're talking EXACT biking directions--from Backroads, VBT and other companies, and I've made sure over the years I've not been party to that theft in any manner. Most, if not all, of my cycling trip write-ups have concentrated only on the pre- and post-trip portions because those portions are the only parts where I have been the responsible planner, and therefore, that information is not proprietary.
That does not mean you can't find out information about any offered trip. You can go to www.backroads.com (or www.vbt.com etc) read the extensive information they offer there for any of their trips (including cycling difficulty), and you can also request an emailed itinerary. Most of these companies list their accommodations in their itineraries, and you can research, as I do, all of those via Trip Advisor before you book.
Second, the details are flat-out boring if you are not on the trip. What I did each day will vary markedly from what my husband did each day. My coffee at mile 12 after my struggle up a hill was being drunk while my husband was in a local bar drinking beer after mile 30. In other words, for the most part, my daily details would be useless. And I hate being around people who measure their lives in how many miles they cycled per hour at what grade.
I do hear you about the hill concern. A lot of the people on this past trip do not have much opportunity for hill climbing, and I'd say most people did quite well. There are several ways to compensate. Two possibles:
1) There usually is SOME hill somewhere, even in flat areas, and going up and down it repeatedly for an hour or so on a regular basis is quite helpful. For example, we needed to train our children for hills when young, and we did not want to have them on the road until they were confident. We have an industrial park with one 1/4 mile steep grade. At least once a weekend, we'd do a loop in the relatively flat park, go up and down that hill twice, do another loop, do up and down that hill twice, do another loop, go up and down that hill twice... You get the drift. We all did hills fine on trips as a result.
2) If you bike in areas where there's likely to be headwinds (a problem in flat areas), regularly cycling INTO the wind is fabulous training.
Otherwise, your choices are to look for flat terrain trips or tell yourself, "I'm willing to ride in the van" or "I'm good at walking my bike up a hill". I now excel at both.
Our top five trips...Hmm. We have arguments about what were the best cycling trips, and often, weather or group make-up plays a parts in how one views it. So a trip that could have been great could be ruined by 24/7 rain* or a whiney group.
* For example, Backroads Provence Casual would have been great--the routing was wonderful and the group was fun--but the combination of an out-of-season mistral (try doing THAT headwind UP a hill) and the nearly 100-degree heat 24/7 with no shade for miles pretty much took the fun out of it.
So without order, our generally agreed upon top favorites are...
-Backroads Pyrenees to Costa Brava Premiere
-Bike Ireland (now Discovery Tours) West Coast Ireland
-Backroads New Zealand South Island Premiere (note--still ranks high even WITH torrential rain for most of the trip)
Those were outstanding ones. In the next grouping without ranking...
-Backroads Puglia Casual
-Backroads Cork and Kerry Premiere (would have been in the top grouping except that fellow cyclists were especially demanding and whiney--they nearly drove bike guides nuts)
-Backroads Brittany and Normandy Premiere(took it when it was a 10-day trip, and the itinerary was very different than it is now).
One other tip: The people who do best on these trips are people who understand there are no guarantees of happiness. This past trip, one of the guides was almost overcome by emotion because he heard over and over again, "Aren't we lucky to be able to see this?" and "Well, I made it halfway up the hill, and I'm calling that a victory" and "That's not rain--it's just filtered sun". In other words, most of the people on the trip--most of whom had done almost as many trips as we had--went out of their way to find positives. -
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Great writing- you seem to have a great attitude about bike travel. I've been guiding cycling trips for over 30 years including 18 yrs for B&R. I started Great Explorations 15 years ago, and still enjoy guiding 5-7 trips each year (this year Catalonia, Piemonte, Tuscany, Puglia, Croatia & Canadian Rockies). Here are my current favourite trips: Piemonte; Provence; Croatia; Morocco; Vietnam. It's great to hear you have had so many positive experiences. I agree it's the people that make the trip!
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I wanted to update this thread because I did have opportunity to talk about Ciclismo Classico with a few cyclists shortly before Xmas. They enjoy Backroads, but because they consider themselves "real" cyclists, they prefer Ciclismo Classico. Points they made:
--They love their Ciclismo Classico bikes; however, they also really like the new Backroads bikes (I hate them--but then again, I'm not a "real" cyclist).
--They feel they get more bang for their buck in terms of cycling on Ciclismo Classico. Their point (well taken) is that if one has paid $$$$ to get to the destination, then the extra day(s)and part of a day Ciclismo Classico is of great value.
--They like being with people who are interested in challenges 24/7. Both of the Ciclismo Classico guests I talked to seem to enjoy any of us in the wimp wagon, but they really did want to talk about the hard parts of the day over their beers.
Here's a disclaimer--I HAVE NOT BEEN ON A Ciclismo Classico trip! These generalizations may be true or untrue. But I'd say that the other people that I know who travel with Ciclismo Classico would fall into that "real cyclist" category.
Another update:
--Backroads has increased the number of support staff/vans over time. It used to be ONE van and two guides was the rule. I'd say two guides, one driver, and at least two vans is the newer rule. On our last trip, because of the difficult routing, they even pulled in another van one day.
--Backroads will be adding e-bikes (motor for a "push" up a hill). I have mixed feelings about that, so if I'm ever on a trip with these things, I'll report back.
I hope this is helpful. -
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We took a bicycle tour along the wonderful Canal Du Midi in the south of France this past summer. We booked our tour with Eurobike.at but the actual tour was done by another company, Ruckenwind (http://www.rueckenwind.de/en ) from Germany. The scenery was beautiful and the daily distances travelled were good, neither too far nor not far enough. The path was level with no hills to climb. We cycled in a group but without tour guide. This is not a guided tour, but we knew that before we started. What we did not know is that everybody in our group spoke German and little English. Upon closer reflection, we should have known that German was going to be the language of choice as both Eurobike.at and Ruckenwind are from German speaking countries (Austria and Germany). Unfortunally, the guidebook given to us was also in German. But since we were in a group, we just followed behind the others and thus really had no need for any guidebook or map. However, it also did not allow us to set our own pace or schedule. The Germans like to wake up early, probably due to fact that they did not suffer from jet-lag. A lovely Swiss couple helped us translate parts of the guidebook that talked about history, which was very nice of them to do.
We were, however, more dissapointed in the bikes we were rented (note: the tour prices on their website do not include an actual bike; they assume you bring your own). The bikes were not comfortable for the towpaths along the Canal Du Midi. The towpaths were not paved in most parts, and the bikes had neither a suspension fork nor seat suspension to help smooth out the ride. We were quite sore for the entire trip! Everybody on the trip had the same problem. I took some pictures of the bikes, so you can see what we rode. Pictures link: http://s1314.photobucket.com/user/jimmy_davids/media/lesomailruckenwind3_zpsa7c83945.jpg.html The ruckenwind website shows in fact the same bikes. They were not in the best condition, and they looked like they were stored outside all year.
Another problem we had about Ruckenwind was that their website claimed that their entire route was sign posted with their own private signs. Maybe they are in their other routes in Germany, but we did not see any signs during our trip. We asked the Ruckenwind representative about this when we returned the bicycles, and he actually told us that their website was indeed wrong and that there are no Ruckenwind signs along the route. He said it was something that the webmaster had to correct, but as of this date no changes have been made to their website… We certainly felt deceived by this false claim. The van support was also not true. We never saw the van, only during the first and last days of our trip. When we got a flat tire, we had to change it ourselves.
The hotels were very good for the first three nights, but quickly become less attractive as the trip progressed. After getting back home I went on booking.com and found that we could have easily booked the same hotels ourselves and saved several 100 dollars / euros by doing so.
In summary we think the trip was great with beautiful scenery and nice weather. The problems were with the bicycles (poor quality, uncomfortable, noisy), the false claim of route being sign-posted (no signs anywhere), lack of van-support (no van seen) and the high price (cheaper to book own hotels online). Would I recommend trip to friend? Yes, mainly due to scenery and climate. -
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Thank you so much, Jimmy, for adding to this thread with such a complete description. I have often looked at Eurobike, and I have specifically looked at the Canal du Midi. It is so helpful to know the actualities.
As I have indicated above, we probably would have done many self-guided tours in earlier years because we knew we did not tax guides with our needs. What always caused us to hesitate was the doubt about the actual bike we would get. Whenever we'd to a day or two days rental locally in Ireland and France, our bike quality was usually rather awful.
Again, kudos for adding in so much detail! -
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Thank you AlessandraZoe for such a thorough series of posts regarding guided bike tours. As you're probably well aware, there is rarely a good spot to review multi-day, guided bike tours on the top travel review sites, such as Fodor's and Tripadvisor. It's nice to see that you've taken the initiative to not only review several companies and trips, but to follow up with specific examples and honest opinions. This post is a great resource for people wanting to understand how bike tours function day to day and what things to consider before choosing a company with which to travel. Justifiably, your post is right near the top of Google for the term, "bike tour reviews". Thank you again for your reviews. The industry needs more guests sharing their experiences in the public forum.
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How kind of you to comment, InSituTravel.
And I had no clue that Google was listing me. I went back to look at all that I said, worried that I had made some inflammatory remarks. Some of my comments were outdated, but I do think I can live with it. -
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Your comments didn't seem inflammatory at all, but rather an honest opinion of your experiences. That's what makes them so helpful for others looking for insight into bike tours.
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I have not done so yet, travelgirl2, but I am very interested in VBT's new " Lake Constance: Germany, Austria & Switzerland" tour.
I hope someone tells us more.
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Antiplatelet Therapy Guided by Thrombelastography in Patients With Acute Coronary Syndromes (TEGCOR Study)
This study is currently recruiting participants.
Verified April 2013 by Indiana University
Indiana University
Information provided by (Responsible Party):
Indiana University
ClinicalTrials.gov Identifier:
First received: June 4, 2012
Last updated: April 2, 2013
Last verified: April 2013
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Personalized treatment approaches and antiplatelet drug choice have been proposed to optimize safety of coronary stenting by reducing heart attacks and repeat interventions while simultaneously minimizing adverse bleeding events. This study compares the efficacy of two laboratory guided treatment algorithms to personalize antiplatelet medication choice after coronary stenting
Condition | Intervention | Phase |
Thrombosis Coronary Artery Disease |
Drug: Prasugrel Drug: Clopidogrel |
Phase 4 |
Study Type: | Interventional |
Study Design: | Allocation: Randomized Endpoint Classification: Pharmacodynamics Study Intervention Model: Parallel Assignment Masking: Open Label Primary Purpose: Treatment |
Official Title: | Antiplatelet Therapy Guided by Thrombelastography in Patients With Acute Coronary Syndromes (TEGCOR Study) |
Resource links provided by NLM:
Further study details as provided by Indiana University:
Primary Outcome Measures:
- Thrombelastography (TEG) MA [ Time Frame: 1 day ] [ Designated as safety issue: No ]Persistence of high tensile clot strength measured by TEG 16-24 hours after reloading of either clopidogrel or prasugrel
Secondary Outcome Measures:
- Ischemic events [ Time Frame: 6 months ] [ Designated as safety issue: Yes ]Death, recurrent myocardial infarction, recurrent unstable angina, repeat coronary intervention
- Bleeding events [ Time Frame: 6 months ] [ Designated as safety issue: Yes ]
Estimated Enrollment: | 100 |
Study Start Date: | August 2011 |
Estimated Study Completion Date: | July 2014 |
Estimated Primary Completion Date: | July 2014 (Final data collection date for primary outcome measure) |
Arms | Assigned Interventions |
Clopidogrel non-response defined as MA≥69 Clopidogrel response defined as MA<69
Drug: Prasugrel
Prasugrel 60mg loading dose at time of PCI if clopidogrel non-responder
Drug: Clopidogrel
Clopidogrel 300mg loading dose at time of PCI if clopidogrel responder
Light transmittance aggregometry
Clopidogrel non-response defined as MPA ADP >42.9% Clopidogrel response defined as MPA ADP <42.9%
Drug: Prasugrel
Prasugrel 60mg loading dose at time of PCI if clopidogrel non-responder
Drug: Clopidogrel
Clopidogrel 300mg loading dose at time of PCI if clopidogrel responder
Ages Eligible for Study: | 21 Years to 75 Years |
Genders Eligible for Study: | Both |
Accepts Healthy Volunteers: | No |
Inclusion Criteria:
- Patients admitted with acute coronary syndrome (unstable angina, non-ST elevation myocardial infarction) and referred for coronary angiography.
- Current therapy with clopidogrel (at least 300mg loading dose, or 75mg po daily for >5 days)
- Age range 21-75 years.
Exclusion Criteria:
- Unable to give consent
- Age younger than 21 years, greater than 75 years
- History of stroke
- Body weight <60 kg
- Acute STEMI,
- Thrombocytopenia<100'000,
- requirement for chronic warfarin therapy
Contacts and Locations
Please refer to this study by its ClinicalTrials.gov identifier: NCT01612884
Contact: Rolf Kreutz, MD | 3179620561 | firstname.lastname@example.com |
United States, Indiana | |
Wishard Memorial Hospital | Recruiting |
Indianapolis, Indiana, United States, 46202 | |
Contact: Rolf Kreutz, MD 317-962-0561 firstname.lastname@example.com | |
Principal Investigator: Rolf Kreutz, MD | |
Indiana University Health Methodist Hospital | Recruiting |
Indianapolis, Indiana, United States, 46202 | |
Contact: Rolf Kreutz, MD 317-962-0561 email@example.com |
Sponsors and Collaborators
Indiana University
More Information
No publications provided
Additional relevant MeSH terms:
ClinicalTrials.gov processed this record on March 06, 2014
No publications provided
Responsible Party: | Indiana University |
ClinicalTrials.gov Identifier: | NCT01612884 History of Changes |
Other Study ID Numbers: | 1106005745 |
Study First Received: | June 4, 2012 |
Last Updated: | April 2, 2013 |
Health Authority: | United States: Institutional Review Board |
Additional relevant MeSH terms:
Coronary Artery Disease Myocardial Ischemia Coronary Disease Thrombosis Acute Coronary Syndrome Heart Diseases Cardiovascular Diseases Arteriosclerosis Arterial Occlusive Diseases Vascular Diseases Embolism and Thrombosis Angina Pectoris Chest Pain Pain |
Signs and Symptoms Clopidogrel Prasugrel Platelet Aggregation Inhibitors Hematologic Agents Therapeutic Uses Pharmacologic Actions Purinergic P2Y Receptor Antagonists Purinergic P2 Receptor Antagonists Purinergic Antagonists Purinergic Agents Neurotransmitter Agents Molecular Mechanisms of Pharmacological Action Physiological Effects of Drugs |
ClinicalTrials.gov processed this record on March 06, 2014


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The Indian Air Force (IAF) has decided French aircraft maker Dassault Aviation's Rafale fighter jet is best suited for it.
The Rafale bid was less than the price quoted by four-nation European consortium EADS Cassidian's Eurofighter Typhoon.
In a race that has lasted five years and tantalised not only India's military establishment but also first-world countries and half-a-dozen of the globe's largest companies, the sleek twin-engined Rafale with its ergonomic looks has beaten the Typhoon. Both aircraft were last year seen in action over Libya.
This will be India's costliest defence contract — totalling close to $20 billion (Rs 1 lakh crore) — and is currently the single largest international military aircraft deal in the world, big enough to inject millions of euros into France.
The Financial Times reported that the deal has "the potential to reshape the European defence industry at a time companies are suffering from cutbacks in their traditional developed markets".
Not to be faulted for passion, President Nicolas Sarkozy with Carla Bruni kept up a persistent and intensive diplomatic engagement with Prime Minister Manmohan Singh at both Rajpath and on the Champs Elysees. France's refusal to impose sanctions on India after the 1998 nuclear tests and the Indian Air Force's familiarity with the French-built Mirage 2000 aircraft would have shaped New Delhi's choice.
Sarkozy, who lost no time in formally welcoming the developments although the final deal is yet to be sealed, is certain to flog the breakthrough as a coup, which should come in handy as he heads to elections. The conservative President is now trailing a socialist rival in opinion polls.
"The realisation of the Rafale project will illustrate the depth and scale of the strategic partnership between France and India," the French embassy in New Delhi said.
For France and Rafale-maker Dassault Aviation, this is a huge boost because they have not been able to secure a single customer for the fighter plane apart from the Armee de 'air (the French air force).
The share price of Dassault Aviation — Sarkozy is said to be close to the industrial group that also owns the pro-government Le Figaro newspaper — jumped almost 20 per cent in Paris today after the Indian news broke.
Dassault Aviation said the company and its partners "are honoured and grateful to the government and the people of India…."
For the (IAF), there was also the desperation to replace its ageing fleet of MiG 21 fighter aircraft with jets capable of matching up to Chinese and Pakistani capabilities and also the price.
The Rafale will not come cheap. The cost has not been announced by the companies or the government. But an approximate figure can be gauged by a Swiss competition in which the Rafale lost to the Swedish Gripen aircraft two months back. France had offered to sell 18 Rafale aircraft for $2.9 billion or $162 million (or about Rs 800 crore) each.
But the IAF would be buying 126 aircraft and the economies of scale would bring the price down a couple of notches. India proposes to buy the aircraft over 10 years — 18 in 'fly away' condition over three years after the contract is signed and the rest to be assembled with Hindustan Aeronautics possibly at the defence firm's Bangalore establishment.
When India sent out the request for proposals (or tender) to six firms in 2008, the cost of the deal was pegged at $10.4 billion (Rs 42,000 crore). The final figure could be close to twice that amount.
"Next fiscal," defence minister A.K. Antony replied this morning, asked when a contract for the aircraft could be signed. Sources said later that the Rafale has emerged as "L1" — jargon for lowest bidder.
The India representatives of the two competing companies had been informed. Price negotiations leading to the signing of a contract would begin in the next 10 days.
"It is a long process. The file has not come to my table," Antony said. The final contract would come only after the approval of the Cabinet Committee on Security headed by the Prime Minister.
The IAF has the option of ordering an additional 63 aircraft but that will be at a re-negotiated price.
The Typhoon and the Rafale were shortlisted after 643-point technical and flight evaluation tests by the IAF through 2009 and 2010.
They edged out four other competitors — the F-16 Super Viper (made by Lockheed Martin, US), the F/A-18 E/F Super Hornet (Boeing, US), Saab's Gripen (Swedish) and the Russian MiG 35 — to be shortlisted for the final leg.
The Eurofighter, built by companies from the UK, Germany, Italy and Spain — has now been beaten by the Rafale for the Indian order.
Endre Lunde, a consultant with IHS Jane's Defence Weekly, described the deal as a "major win for France, and a major loss for the UK".
What do you think? Do not forget the final contract has not been signed yet. Is this a major loss for the UK and EADS?
Source: The India Telegraph
Gravity always wins!


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2631 52nd Avenue Court Greeley, Colorado 80634 tel:(970)339-2405 fax:(970)339-2452 M-F 6:30am to 3:30pm view map
Our Mission
To provide a program of community forestry that enhances the quality of life for all citizens by promoting proper tree care on both public and private property resulting in a safe, healthy, urban forest. To enhance green spaces with floral displays.
2014 Greeley Winter Tree Care WorkshopFebruary 21st, 2014Island Grove Community Events Center
Firewood - Elm, pine, spruce and walnut wood is not allowed to be stored (either indoors or outdoors) or used for firewood within Greeley's city limits unless or until it is completely de-barked. This will go a long way in protecting our urban forest, including your own trees, from harmful and often deadly insect/disease issues.
Tree Care - We maintain all trees and shrubs in all of Greeley's parks and public grounds.
We monitor Greeley's urban forest for damaging insect and disease issues. Current insect issues include: Ips Engraver Beetles, Lilac/Ash Borer (also known as a clearwing borer), Thousand Cankers Disease and Mountain Pine Beetles. These links will lead you to Colorado State University Cooperative Extension fact sheets. The articles below in our "Current Events" section detail what we are seeing in Greeley.
Monitor Tree Trimming Services - We test, license and monitor shade tree contractors. Companies or individuals offering tree trimming or removals in Greeley MUST be licensed by the City of Greeley.
A licensed tree trimming company must pass written and field examinations to show basic knowledge and competence in industry skills. They must also provide proof of insurance and bond to protect the customer and themselves. Pesticide applicators are required to maintain a current State of Colorado Applicator's License.
Manage the Urban Forest through Code Enforcement - The Forestry Program provides enforcement of City codes relating to tree maintenance and planting.
Manage the Memorial Tree and Tree Donation Program - The Forestry Program offers a program in which select unwanted trees can be donated to the Parks system. This is done at no cost to the donor. Additionally, we can help you commemorate a loved one by planting a tree in a park of your choice.
When a tree on your property is no longer growing in a desirable location, or if that tree is beginning to crowd out more important plants, you may want to consider donating that tree to a park. We inspect each plant to determine quality and chances for successful survival. Once the plant is deemed a suitable candidate, you may choose the park into which it is placed. This is done at no cost to you. You may even wish to use this as a commemorative tree planting!
Plan, Implement, and Maintain the Public Floral Displays - We design, implement, install and maintain all floral displays in parks and public grounds. The annual floral program is a year round task.
Provide Consultations - The Forestry Program also provides horticultural consultations for citizens as time allows and has access to large quantities of information on local tree and shrub diseases, insects and environmental conditions. Please feel free to email us if we can help you obtain the answers you are looking for. Our eConsult page will give you valuable information on common tree insect and disease issues. Complete help for all your landscape questions is readily available to you!
Information on forest management, wildfire mitigation, conservation seedlings, and insect or disease problems
Trees are amazing creations that do much to enhance and benefit our daily lives. They provide the aesthetic qualities of beauty, color and form, especially in our urbanized landscapes. They provide resources for food and shelter for people and animals. More importantly, they function to improve our environment. Trees shade us from direct sunlight and protect us from strong winds. They absorb carbon dioxide and provide us with oxygen we need to breathe. Trees are one of the most important things we can provide in our efforts to reduce air pollution.
Feel free to contact us regarding the information provided above or drop us an email with your questions, comments, or concerns to: Greeley Forestry Program Office Administrator


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Stathi Paxinos
Stathi Paxinos covers rugby league, rugby union, boxing, swimming and Australian Rules football for The Age. He has covered numerous major sporting events including the Sydney Olympic Games (boxing), the 2003 Rugby World Cup, state of origin contests and NRL finals, world title fights and national swimming championships. Stathi also covered boxing and aquatics at the Melbourne 2006 Commonwealth Games.
Rugby League
Match reviewers clear Slater over kicking Dog
Brad Walter and Stathi Paxinos The NRL match review committee has ruled that Melbourne fullback Billy Slater's kick to the head of Canterbury forward David Klemmer was accidental contact.
Rugby League
Slater charge dims victory as Storm flies high
Stathi Paxinos Melbourne remains undefeated after holding off Canterbury in a worthy grand final replay.
Rugby League
It's back to basics for Storm
Stathi Paxinos Melbourne Storm playmaker Cooper Cronk says no magic remedy for form slump.
Rugby League
Panthers stay wary
Stathi Paxinos Penrith forward Clint Newton insists that there has not been, and would not be, any use of the words 'form slump' in relation to Melbourne Storm ahead of their clash.
Storm surge back to form as hapless Panthers roll over
Stathi Paxinos THERE was a feeling that hung around Melbourne Storm's game against Penrith yesterday. It was one of ''surely not''.
Rugby League
Under radar and over moon
Stathi Paxinos Gareth Widdop is grateful he has had the opportunity to live his life in relative obscurity outside the closeted rugby league ranks.
Rugby League
Gold Coast taken by Storm - and history
Stathi Paxinos The story of the night was the unveiling of the Storm's first true-blue Victorian talent.
Storm have a true-blue local to call their own
Stathi Paxinos THE Melbourne Storm made history last night and it had nothing to do with their 24-16 win over Gold Coast at AAMI Park.
Fierce Storm lashes Sea Eagles
Stathi Paxinos It has taken far less time than many had thought but Storm now has the chance it has been craving.
Rugby League
Grand final week 'fun' for Cronk
Stathi Paxinos Cooper Cronk reckons grand final week is an atmosphere to be taken in and enjoyed. But he hasn't always looked on it that way.
Rugby League
Storm wary of Hasler factor
Stathi Paxinos MELBOURNE Storm coach Craig Bellamy has said that he does not know, or had not really thought about, what sorts of tricks Canterbury counterpart Des Hasler could pull in Sunday's grand final.
Rugby League
Full-backs' duel crucial
Stathi Paxinos The battle between Billy Slater and Ben Barba in today's NRL grand final has the fans excited.
Rugby League
Storm clouds gone as stars celebrate win
Stathi Paxinos It seems fairytale endings do happen. Two years after Melbourne was locked in the darkest days of the club's history, the Storm proved too strong for Canterbury in the grand final.
Rugby League
Slater cops an earful from Bulldog
Stathi Paxinos In the end, no one was talking about James Graham's Mike Tyson-moment after the Storm's 14-4 grand final win.
High five for Smith
Stathi Paxinos Melbourne Storm captain crowned the club's player of the year for a fifth time.
Bennett backs Bellamy to stick with Storm
Stathi Paxinos Wayne Bennett could not see any reason why Melbourne Storm coach Craig Bellamy would want to leave this year's NRL premier when his contract was up next year, the seven-time premiership coach said...
Rugby League
Injured Storm trio likely to miss England trip
Stathi Paxinos Storm facing world club challenge clash against Leeds in England without three top players.
Storm receive unwelcome send-off before leaving to Britain
Stathi Paxinos THE Melbourne Storm will head to Britain for their world club challenge clash against Leeds on the back of not only a poor loss to Canberra in Friday's night's trial game but possibly without three...
Storm 'fan' re-signs as coach
Stathi Paxinos Coaching supremo Craig Bellamy has announced he is staying with NRL premiers Melbourne Storm until at least the end of 2016.
Rugby League
Youngsters storm up the ranks
Stathi Paxinos Mahe Fonua did not have the best of NRL debuts for the Storm last season.


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Small single mattress size: L 190, W 75, D 20 cm.
Standard single mattress size: L 190, W 90, D 20 cm.
Colours: Blue, Pink. -
Airsprung Kids Stars and Butterflies Single Mattress
From £1.04 per week
- Was
- Was £95.00
- Now
- Now £79.00
- Save £16.00
- Low stock, selling fast
- Delivery
22 reviewsAirsprung Kids Single Mattress with Stars or Butterflies pattern.
This single kids mattress from Airsprung is specially designed to help promote good posture in growing children.
It features the Airsrpung Trizone system, which places a greater number of springs in the middle portion of the mattress.
This gives your child more support where they need it most - in the hip and lumbar region.
Choose a kids single mattress with either a butterflies pattern or a stars pattern to suit your child.
Useful info:
- Airsprung Kids Single mattress
- Single mattress
- Trizone spring system for better support of the lower back
- Butterflies and stars pattern available
Airsprung Bright Night Kids Mattress
From £1.09 per week
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- Save £20.00
- Low stock, selling fast
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31 reviewsBright Night Kids Mattress in pink and blue colours.
This mattress gives your child's bed colour as well as comfort.
The three-phase Trizone spring system places a greater number of springs in the middle section of the mattress. This results in more support for your child in the lumbar region (where bodyweight is greater).
An insulator pad provides a layer of comfort between the springs and your child, while deep quilting offers extra indulgence.
Finished with a smooth damask fabric.
Key info:- Bright Night Kids Mattress
- Three-phase Trizone spring system
- Insulator pad
- Deep quilting for added comfort
- Damask fabric finish
- Dimensions: Depth 20, W 90, Length 190 cm
- Colours: Blue, Pink
- See more kids mattresses, below
Airsprung Stars and Butterflies Small Single Kids Mattress
From £1.04 per week
- Was
- Was £95.00
- Now
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- Save £16.00
- Low stock, selling fast
- Delivery
3 reviewsAirsprung Stars and Butterflies Small Single Kids Mattress.
Airsprung have created this mattress especially for kids - the comfortable mattress providing superb levels of support for still-growing bodies.
The small single mattress features Airpsrung's Trizone spring system that places a larger number of springs in the middle portion, offering more support in the hip and lumbar region.
Available in either a star or butterfly pattern.
Length 175, W 75, D 17.7 cmUseful info:
- Airsprung small single kids mattress
- Stars or butterflies design
- Trizone spring system offers support where kids need it most


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Mother's Day is May 12 and we want to hear why your mother is special. E-mail us in 100 words or less what your mother means to you. You may also send us a picture. Email: firstname.lastname@example.com or post it on our Facebook page. You may also mail us your story to PO Box 690577, Mint Hill, NC 28227. The best story will receive a gift card and will run in our Mother's Day issue May 9.
The deadline for submissions is May 6, 12 noon.


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BodyRock Sport Dim Your Headlights Ruby Sports Bra BR5RThis product is no longer available. Please consider one of the Customer-Recommended Replacements above, or try a new search.
This sexy sports bra features a compression front with encased contour pads so you don't "flash your headlights." Wide elastic underband gives stability, and front princess seams shape you beautifully.
Try these keyword searches with similar features:


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Founded in 1946, TTU has a passion for challenging students
academically and encouraging them to grow in their faith.
Dr. Kimmitt Authors Book
Tennessee Temple University congratulates Dr. Francis Kimmitt on his new book that he coauthored:
Word Studies Made Simple: How to Study the Bible in the Original Languages.
Dr. Kimmitt and co-author Dr. Norris Grubbs, worked diligently on this ten year project. Greek and Hebrew word studies are an intricate necessity in studying the Bible. A book like this one was hard to come across ten years ago. As professors of the Old Testament and New Testament, they wanted a book to contain more information than its predecessors. The book aims to help those who haven't been exposed to biblical languages. Both authors also hope for a re-kindled passion in the studies of pastors and Bible teachers. The publication has been released and is available on Amazon.com. Dr. Kimmitt plans to contribute to a new book The Psalms: Language for All Seasons of the Soul (Andrew J. Schmutzer, David M. Howard, Jr., eds.).
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Lessons | Outdoor Pools | Indoor Pools | Swimming Pools History | Swimming Prescriptions
San Antonians looking for a rewarding job with great pay are invited to apply to serve their community as lifeguards for the San Antonio Parks and Recreation Department. The department is making the process easy by hosting several lifeguard recruitment round-up events in hopes that local teens, college students, and adults 16 and over, will attend and apply. The events will be held on the following Saturdays: Feb. 1 and 22, March 8 and 29 and April 5 and 19, from 2 to 4 p.m. at the San Antonio Natatorium, 1430 W. Cesar E. Chavez Blvd. Refreshments will be served.
At the event, applicants will have access to a computer to complete the on-line application and they are encouraged to take the required prerequisite skills test. To complete the test, applicants should bring their swimsuits and be prepared to swim 300 yards freestyle and breaststroke, tread water without using their arms for two minutes, as well as retrieve a 10-pound weight from the 13 foot depth and swim across the pool within the allotted time. Practice time and instruction will be available. The skills test can also be scheduled for a later date.
The department provides CPR and lifesaving training to prepare applicants for their lifeguarding responsibilities. Applicants who have passed the prerequisite test will be scheduled for training classes.
The starting salary is $9.02 per hour.
During Spring Break, March 11-16, the Parks and Recreation Department will open four regional pools. These pools are Heritage, 1423 Ellison Dr.; Lady Bird Johnson, 10700 Nacogdoches; South Side Lions, 3100 Hiawatha; and Woodlawn, 221 Alexander Ave. Lap swimming will be offered Tuesday through Thursday from 11 a.m. to 1 p.m. and open swimming Tuesday through Sunday from 1 to 7 p.m.
These four pools will resume operations starting on Saturday, May 3, until the regular outdoor pool season that includes all 24 outdoor pools begins on June 14.
The regular 2014 outdoor pool season runs June 14 through Aug. 16. Hours of operation at the majority of the department's 24 outdoor pools during the summer are Tuesday through Sunday from 1 to 7 p.m. Morning Lap Swim will be offered from 7:30 to 9:30 a.m. on Tuesday, Wednesday, and Thursday at the four regional pools.
For more information on the recruitment round-up events, lifeguard positions or pool hours of operation, please call 207-3299.
2014 Regular Summer Season Dates: | June 14 - Aug. 17 |
Time: | 1 - 7 p.m. for open swim for most pools; 2 - 8 for 5 selected pools: Fairchild, Kennedy, San Pedro, Spring Time & Sunset Hills |
Days: | Tuesday – Sunday, closed Mondays |
Admission: | Free general admission |
Fees for classes | |
Contact | 207-3299 |
The department provides CPR and lifesaving training to prepare applicants for their lifeguarding responsibilities. Applicants who have passed the test will be scheduled for training classes.
For more information, call the Natatorium at 207-3299.


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March 10, 2014
News 3 Sports would like to congratulate our latest Classroom Champion, Clayton Hudson. The Bryan High School senior has a 4.3 GPA and is currently ranked thirteenth in his class.
Clayton is a member of the Viking Golf Team. He has been named 1st Team All-District for the past two seasons. And last year, Clayton was 12-5A District Champion. Clayton is also involved in the school choir, 4H, and his church's youth group. Academically, Clayton won the award for the Most Outstanding Chemistry Student.
"Clayton's an outstanding student! Great work habits! I've got him in AP Chemistry….He's got the ability to think like a scientist; but he's also got the work habits that allow him to be successful. Well you know there are some kids some students that I don't want to say perfectionist. But they strive to be the best they can be. I think the same thing that leads Clayton to success on the golf course leads to success in the classroom.
"I don't know whether you call him an achiever of whatever, but he has that drive to do a good job at everything he does. There was a time earlier in his golf career when he wasn't real sure whether he wanted to play baseball or whether he wanted to play golf. Last year things kind of turned around for him. He got excited about golf and he began to work real hard at it. And now he's one of our most consistent workers. Really is the leader of the team in that area."
"It's definitely a challenge…Taking three AP classes it can be difficult trying to squeeze the academics with the golf and everything else. I mean you manage, you manage time, it's all about time management and being able to get things done ahead of time. And really striving through that…
After high school, Clayton plans on attending college and majoring in business.
Congratulations to Clayton Hudson of Bryan High School. This week's News 3 Sports Classroom Champion!
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Had the day off today, so went for a 85km ride. I was riding along the Freeway bike path, south of Armadale rd, in to a slight head wind, so it was head down bum up. I had a clear path ahead of me and I was moving at a good pace when I noticed a stick on the right side of the path about 30mts in front, that 30mts went by quite fast and that stick move from the right hand side to right in front of me. By the time I realized it was a snake, it was to late. I went strait over it, felt something slap my left ankle just above my shoe, man, I nearly fell of the bike looking down to see if there was any fang marks, the heart was pumping madly, It took a couple of seconds to click it was only it's tail, but by gees it gave me a startle.
Just a warning guy's, watch out for those moving sticks on the paths, they can be scary!!


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Baked Chicken Pot Pie RecipeLearn how to cook a beautiful chicken pot pie. |
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Hello all. I agree with the understanding of not rushing Pete, but could we at least get a projected release date for v.5?
Long live BB!
Edit: I guess disregard. I see it's also asked here: Bugless Beast V0.5 FWIW, I think this is an honest question. Why can't the people have a general idea of release timeline?


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Free Speech DayInteresting to make the acquaintance of Mike67. If you want to do this every day I am sure that there are a lot of online places to meet more Mike67s. One that I hang out on occasionally is http://www.city-data.com/forum/2008-pre ... -election/
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What About Mystery Auctions?
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06-20-2012, 10:25 AMWhat About Mystery Auctions?
Maybe there needs to be a review of the whole Mystery Auction concept and process. For some time, bidders just wander into these auctions and start plowing away with absurd bids. Well, that's my opinion.
I guess Luxury Link does fine from a revenue standpoint with the strange bidding patterns and ultimately, that's why they are in business.
On the other hand, if Luxury Link were to cap each individual bid at $1.00 or maybe $5.00, then I feel the web site would actually benefit. Those of us who were interested would be forced to visit on a more frequent basis, if the numbers began to escalate and we were still a player.
As it stands right now, someone or maybe two individuals just come in and starting bombing away at large increments. I don't see too many regulars bothering to do more than look at the Mystery Auctions, possibly place a token bid, then watch others bomb away.
Just an opinion and a thought.
Anyone else have an idea or an opinion on the subject?
These types of auctions always seem to lure folks in with the low price and then I find they always end up getting close to what the price would have been if it was on a regular auction - does not matter if it is LL, EBAY, etc. I have noticed they all seem to go this way. I usually never bid on these types of auctions unless I really want it and then I make sure I knwo what the deal is really worth
Roam if you want to, roam around the world...........
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06-21-2012, 03:59 AMI've considered Mystery Auction bidding, but as you have pointed out, jsattapr2, over the past year or so, the huge incremental bidding by so many people really take the fun out of participation.
I don't think there's anything wrong with someone "plowing away with absurd bids," but it's strange to see an auction that's going up $1 or $2 at a time jump up by several hundred dollars. I was involved in the Northern Italy auction last week. The price of the package was going up very slowly until it hit $75, then someone bid $350 for it. Huh?
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06-21-2012, 03:40 PMj-s-2, think back over the past few years, I have purchased two mystery auctions. Both of the destinations were somewhat off the beaten path and really didn't generate much in the way of competitive bidding.
I still look at mystery auctions, but I haven't place a bid in a while.
Maybe it is time for Luxury Link to either consider another approach. I won't lose any sleep one way or the other.
If Luxury Link is pleased with the result from the present system, then I guess it works for me.
Price not right - I don't bid!
I always felt since on a Mystery Auction you (supposedly) don't know where the property is located, you ought to be able to get a great deal on such a Mystery Auction. Certainly, a deal for less than you can buy the property on Auction for. Many times, I have seen a property sell for more than you can actually buy it on Auction or on Buy Now.
This thinking of getting a good deal stands to reason since it is a Dollar Auction. There is nothing to be gained to bid in $100 or $200 bid increments right at the beginning. The real bidding to win a Mystery Auction occurs at the very end at closing time. If someone is really interested in this Mystery property, then at closing time is the time to bid $100 or $200 to win the Mystery Auction. Anything more than $1 in the beginning IMO is only unnecessarily driving up the price. Especially, if the high bidder is not following through with his intention of winning the bid in the end.
Of course, as pointed out by some of the contributors, you can do with your money as you please. I for myself do my homework, know where the property is located, know for how much it sells on Auction, and if I think this Mystery Auction might work for me, and I can get it for 30% less than on Auction, I bid at the very end. Beyond that, I will drop my bidding.
That is my view, and my two cents worth on Mystery Auctions. Of course, you do as you please!


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Lenny Kravitz - I'll Be Waiting [Released 1-18-08]Description: Check out the new video for I'll Be Waiting, released on the 3rd March. The single is taken from Lenny Kravitz new album, It Is Time For A Love Revolution, released 4th February. Lenny Kravitz's new album release is the first in over three years and is a thunderous rock 'n roll call-to-arms, featuring a universal blend of soul, funk, and jazz grooves and the undeniable anthemic lyricism that's been his trademark from day one. |
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Ian's Shoelace Site - Bringing you the fun, fashion & science of shoelaces
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Hi, everyone. My name is Ian Fieggen (although I'm sometimes known as "Professor Shoelace"), I'm 51 years old, and I currently live in Melbourne, Australia with my long-time partner, Inge. Despite what this extensive Shoelace Site may lead you to believe, I'm really Not a Knotting Nut. I'm just a friendly Aussie guy trying to contribute to the Internet.
To sum up my life in one paragraph: My
are Dutch, I was born in Wellington, New Zealand, and have lived in
since the age of one year old. I breezed through
, having a real aptitude for science and mathematics. I'm somewhat
, but more technical skill than creativity. My real forte has been in
computer graphics
, which I've experimented with since the very
early days of computers
. I was most recently employed in a multi-skilled role at the head office of a chain of retail jewellers for whom I did both technical work such as IT,
and web site development, as well as producing all
and catalogues.
If you browse the rest of my
personal site
, you'll find out a lot more about me and what I have to share. I guess the main aspect of my character that comes through as a common theme is that I'm passionate about efficiency. Much of my web site deals with different forms of efficiency, and having efficient ways of
tying shoelaces
is just one area that I figure most people could benefit from. I'm pretty easy-going, so if you figure this stuff is not for you, then that's cool too.
See my extensive
Ian Fieggen's Site
if you'd like to know any more details.
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