Yahoos Bristle at Mayer's New QPR Ranking System and "Silent Layoffs" - <AUTHOR> http://allthingsd.com/20131108/because-marissa-said-so-yahoos-bristle-at-mayers-new-qpr-ranking-system-and-silent-layoffs <comment><USER2> I was one of those who was laid-off, or fired, or whatever you want to call it. I've been really confused over the last week because the reasons for my termination were pretty vague. But wow, after reading that, so many things make sense now.

One of the areas this type of a bell-curve system falls apart is for highly specialized and well-qualified teams, such as the one I was working on. Who knows, maybe I was a poor employee, but after all the raises, accolades, and the promotion I received (by my firing manager), I'd like to think that wasn't the case and it was just a manager put in a tough spot.

Regardless, it was a nice run and the job market is great. I'm taking a bit of time off, but if you are a company in SF and looking for someone with lots of JavaScript, Node.js, and frontend experience at startups and (of course) big companies, links are in my profile.

<comment><USER3> What it means is of your team, you were in the bottom 15% and maybe you weren't a bad employee, but you weren't even in the top half of your team.

<comment><USER4> >you weren't even in the top half of your team

That's a pretty poisonous attitude, since half the company isn't going to be in the top half of their team. And honestly, in my experience, most people have no idea whether they are at the 50% point or the 15% point.

<comment><USER3> What's poisonous about it? It's the blunt truth. In stack ranking, you don't have to be the best employee, you just can't be in the bottom 15%. If you get laid off, it means you're in the bottom 15%. There's nothing poisonous about that assertion.

It's like they say about escaping a hungry bear, you don't have the be the fastest runner to survive, you just have to be the second slowest runner.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> If you're a manager in a stack-ranking organization like this, in this market, why not take a stand? Refuse to classify team members who are not actually "occasionally misses" as such. If it's straight-up stack ranking, give everyone a tie for 3rd place or something.

What's the worst thing that happens? You get let go? What a great way to get let go from a dysfunctional company.

<comment><USER6> While I generally agree with you that stack-ranking is a terrible idea for software companies[1], my guess is that the goal here is "lay off a bunch of low performers who were hired over the last 10 years". How do you think they should handle that? Managers, generally speaking, are never going to rate their team member down if that means their team will be effected by the layoff.

\- Trying to bulk-remove low performers is doomed to failure, don't try

\- Bulk-remove on something else, like what projects you worked on instead of your rating

\- Let them rank as high as they want, then let the bottom N% go regardless of whether they were technically rated "meets expectations"

\- Some solution I'm not seeing?

This is an honest question -- I've never run (or worked for a long time) a company as big as Yahoo.

At Twitch, this isn't a problem because you don't have many layers of management and the number of people is small, so it's easier to get consensus on what acceptable performance is across the entire organization. But I really have no idea how you'd manage that somewhere like Yahoo.

If this isn't a one-time thing and Yahoo is moving to a permanent stack- ranking system...nevermind everything I said. But stack-ranking seems like a reasonable one-time way to cut deadwood in a very large company.

[1] And maybe in general, I'm just only experienced with software companies.

<comment><USER7> You are absolutely right, and that is what Jack Welch intended when he first implemented stack ranking at GE in the early 90s. At the time GE was overly large with an ossified bureaucracy and thousands, if not tens of thousands, of deadwood employes who were just coasting along occupying a chair. It was killing the company. Stack ranking was the answer to forcing managers to make the hard decisions about who was really helping and who was just collecting a paycheck. It worked very well.

This was only supposed to last as long as required to turn GE around. Like all good fads in the business world, though, it was taken too far by the MBA crowd. They now see stack ranking as a great _permanent_ solution to deadwood. They fail to recognize that: 1) all organizations have a certain minimum amount of deadwood, as a function of their size; 2) once an organization approaches its natural level of deadwood, stack ranking hurts more than it helps.

<comment><USER8> how do you apply stack ranking effectively if most of the dead weight is in the branches (middle management) but scoring heavily weights the leaves (workers) of an organization?

My feeling is that generally a group knows who sucks or is disruptive, and this is probably the most reliable data source. That's your scoring criteria. Other modifications I might make:

1\. flatten the org chart for the purposes of ranking. 2\. employees rank best and worst fellow employees, i.e. up to 10 best, up to 10 worst. 3\. ranking is two-dimensional to distinguish between "this person is terrible and should be fired" from "this person isn't a good fit/being utilized well and should be moved". 4\. Do the above and see if the results can be used to determine who should be fired. 5\. If you want to repeat this process every year don't set forced quotas.

<comment><USER9> From what I remember, Microsoft has the employees rank their peers. 360 feedback. That's part of what then poisons the atmosphere, especially since of 10, the sucker in last place often/always has to leave. People implicitly then make pacts based often on politics... But at least it's annual rather than quarterly.

<comment><USER8> yeah, no system is perfect, but the modifications I suggested I think would address these issues to large extent. For example, I suggested that employees would rank their peers on three scales (good, bad, misused) instead of with "scores". An actual score would hopefully come from aggregating the whole company and doing some analysis. Hopefully by having some smart people try to put together an algorithm that seems "fair".

Also, if I remember correctly, MS employees might have had some say in their peer's rank, but then groups scores would be merged with other groups by having managers "calibrate" with each other, which more than likely gives the manager a lot of control in the final outcome.

<comment><USER10> This is not a condemnation but people often like to invent perfect employee performance systems, as you have done here, and it is akin to people writing their own cryptography. There is evidence-based research out there - look for papers by Elaine D. Pulakos for example. My understanding is that no system works in and of itself and training managers to get the most out of their people is probably the best thing any firm can do.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER11> These types of forced ranking systems are very tough. Microsoft has had a lot of complaints about there's. GE, on the other hand, has had success with theirs. I've seen them work successfully at large firms where they were ingrained, and the companies had other cultural norms to increase teamwork. I've seen it flop at a few software firms.

What they're good for:

\- Forcing managers to make hard decisions and give real feedback. (You can't just tell everyone "You're doing fine.")

\- Highlighting who at the bottom should be let go, and who a level below should replace them. (In most firms, the top 10% at a given level outperforms the bottom 10% at the level above them)

\- Providing internal guidance for larger layoffs.

\- Encouraging constant trimming to avoid those larger layoffs.

The problems of these systems are numerous though:

\- It can discourage teams of superstars from working together on large projects. "What if only 1 or 2 out of us can be ranked high?"

\- It can encourage selfish behavior and infighting if there aren't other counterbalancing forces.

\- There is frequently disagreement for anyone not in the chosen group.

\- Much of the differentiation is based on managers ability to fight for their employees, rather than employees actual ability.

It will be interesting to see how this plays out. In Marissa's defense, she wasn't hired to continue "Business as usual".

<comment><USER12> _Providing internal guidance for larger layoffs._

Just a reminder that if corporations are people, they're sociopaths.

<comment><USER11> Indeed. But companies have to operate that way.

It's no different from a restaurant thinking, "If the economy doesn't improve, which 2 of my 20 waiters and waitresses will I let go first? I should let them know they're on the bubble."

Or perhaps more abstractly an investor saying, "I have 20 investments. If I need cash, which 2 should I sell?"

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER13> I worked at Yahoo, and quite frankly, Yahoo needs to go through a few years of culling the bottom 10% like this. After several iterations of this, it could be a great company again.

What Mayer is saying is that she is willing to sacrifice those employees that are at the lower boundaries of acceptable, in order to make more room for the top 85%

And quite frankly, the managers that are complaining about having to put people at the lower boundaries are highly likely to be underperforming as well. When I was there, it was mostly filled with bloated and lazy employees.

<comment><USER14> > in order to make more room for the top 85%

And nothing attracts top developers to an organization like news that they've got a great stack-ranking system!

<comment><USER15> Yahoo isn't exactly an attractive company to many developers now, IMHO.

<comment><USER16> Yeah I'd tend to agree. Given the press about the company, I can't say legions of talented developers are beating down the Yahoo's door to get in.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER17> > In 1981, Ford's sales were falling. Between 1979 and 1982, Ford had incurred > $3 billion in losses. Ford's newly appointed Division Quality Manager, John > A. Manoogian, was charged with recruiting Deming to help jump-start a > quality movement at Ford.[19] Deming questioned the company's culture and > the way its managers operated. To Ford's surprise, Deming talked not about > quality but about management. He told Ford that _management actions were > responsible for 85% of all problems in developing better cars_. In 1986, > Ford came out with a profitable line of cars, the Taurus-Sable line. In a > letter to Autoweek Magazine, Donald Petersen, then Ford chairman, said, "We > are moving toward building a quality culture at Ford and the many changes > that have been taking place here have their roots directly in Deming's > teachings."[20] By 1986, Ford had become the most profitable American auto > company. For the first time since the 1920s, its earnings had exceeded those > of arch rival General Motors (GM). Ford had come to lead the American > automobile industry in improvements. Ford's following years' earnings > confirmed that its success was not a fluke, for its earnings continued to > exceed GM and Chrysler's.

source: [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/W._Edwards_Deming](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/W._Edwards_Deming)

<comment><USER11> I'm trying to tie this to the original article. Is the idea that performance reviews are inconsistent to systemic management improvements ala Deming? My understanding is he was against the annual review.

<comment><USER17> I think it's relevant for many reasons. But I was reminded of the information when I noticed that Yahoo seems to be blaming the 15%.

<comment><USER18> ... which is why you italicized the 85% bit? But one is a percentage of people, and the other a percentage of problems. If I'm misunderstanding, it would be helpful if you explained further.

<comment><USER17> Sorry, it's difficult to take that wikipedia article and make a soundbite out of it. Elsewhere in the source you'll see this:

> Placing blame on workforces who are only responsible for 15% of mistakes > where the system designed by management is responsible for 85% of the > unintended consequences

I didn't use that, because it doesn't have any context with it.

<comment><USER19> Does "a poor workman blames his tools" apply to management?

<comment><USER9> Sounds likely here, though it's a bit creaky :)

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER20> Not that it's quite the same, but I can't help thinking of decimation in the Roman sense.

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decimation_(Roman_army)](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decimation_\(Roman_army\))

<comment><USER21> the main difference :)

" The leadership was usually executed independently of the one in ten deaths of the rank and file"

</comment></comment><comment><USER22> I work for a company with stack ranking. and was forced to stack-rank my team.

The success of this system depends on 3 things a ) qualifications of the managers doing stack ranking b ) perception management of the employees being ranked. c ) quality (impact and sophistication) of the projects people are doing

( a ) is hard to come by in middle-management ranks (because very few talents individuals stay in those ranks -- they either move up, or move out).

      ( b ) perception management (essentially ability to blame others, to create inflated perception of your contribution) -- is a horrible thing to do for a technology company who benefits from having introverts who just love to program.

Those will often fall the victim to the 'smoke and mirror specialists'.

( c ) can simply be traced to poor up stream decisions/conditions.

\---- -

But how to actually deal with accumulated incompetency (as it happens especially in companies that must grow very fast) ?

\--- -

The answers I heard here would work but in combination

a) stack-rank projects

b) within project evaluate performance of project's stakeholders/initiators in addition to the project team

c) stack-rank all employees by using peer-and-outsider model that takes up 40% of the overall rank (so that if an employee has excellent enteprise impact, but an incompetent manager, as noted earlier, -- he/she will not be totally dependent on that manager's score)... And that also builds up better team work.

</comment><comment><USER23> This is the "sequester" approach to layoffs.

Instead of deciding which projects are not paying off and cutting them, cut employees across all projects, regardless of how well they perform. Similar to the budgetary sequester backed into by the US government.

<comment><USER24> Except apparently Yahoo has grown since she joined, so it would seem this has not been implemented in order to reduce staff size.

<comment><USER25> Dont worry, Yahoo will fire a lot of people soon. Yahoo "bought a lot of buzz" to drive its stock up so big investors can cash in, they will trim their workforce soon,

<comment><USER26> Yep.

I know this sounds harsh, and this is pure conjecture on my part, but the way I see it is that Marissa Mayer is on a 5 year contract and after that she is out of there, regardless of what state Yahoo is in.

If the company is a mess in 5 years time she can blame it on the culture which was resistant to change. She will simply jump onto the next gravy train via her big investor and board-room friends.

The WSJ and NYT say her total compensation over this period will be at least $100m+. All she has to do is sit tight, look as though she's busy, and hopefully keep the share price up to maximize her share options.

<comment><USER27> Considering that the company has burned through multiple CEOs already anyway, I think the case that the company was doomed if she didn't try some major moves is both obvious and compelling.

The thing I like is that she's trying both the carrot and the stick at the same time: trying to make Yahoo a better place to work with Google-style amenities, while also making staff more accountable and slashing poor performers.

She's also focusing the company much more heavily on mobile which is both obvious and necessary, but which wasn't taken nearly as seriously by previous execs.

I don't know whether it will work or not, but this doesn't seem like a "marking time" strategy at all.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER28> Whoa what? "Mayer, in fact, tried to address the issue yesterday morning in a Q&A, which she began by quoting her favorite children's book about the value of experience."

How do you start addressing concerns of working professionals by quoting a children's book?

<comment><USER29> I have had 2 adults, on separate occasions, quote from The Little Prince by Antoine de Saint-Exupéry they read as children. If the shoe fits, I have no problem with it.

<comment><USER19> Did Mayer quote from the _The Little Prince_ , too? That article didn't say.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER30> I worked at IBM Research for 6 years and they have absolutely the best way to achieve the best possible productivity from _all_ employees:

The secret?

"Trust Your People".

I was a contractor, working offsite, from another country. I used to come to IBM Research facility once a month and we had quick discussion: "Should we add this? Ok. Let this guy (me) do that". After that I disappear for a month or two, charge IBM hourly and then present a report of what was done.

Result: we had the best enterprise security product on the market that actually generated plenty of revenues for the company.

Hats off to IBM and to SRW, JM, JK, BA, and of course DC! Granted we were smaller team - 20 people in total or so. Lots of new people were coming in and doing their best to deliver their best.

There was something spiritual about this, but it worked like a charm.

</comment><comment><USER26> Can't believe that employees would actually complain about their work by posting "on an internal message board for anonymous feedback".

If it's anonymous, I have a bridge to sell you!

<comment><USER21> it is natural selection similar to Darwin prize - if you're stupid enough to seriously b!tch on internal _anonymous_ board ...

Reminds me about anonymous surveys in some previous BigCo where emailed links to the surveys contained unique ID.

<comment><USER31> Both of those situations seem like they would set up massive lawsuits down the line.

<comment><USER32> Only if you told them why, in a "right to work" state.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER33> This is a pretty popular thing at many large companies. Everyone somehow wants to hire the cream of the crop, yet there are only so many cream of the crop candidates.

My own experience is that after a couple of rounds of these layoffs, most of the fat is cut from a lot of teams. After that you start knocking off productive people.

I'd be more impressed by someone who invigorated their workforce and then selectively cut people after they figured out who wasn't working out. Choosing a random manager assigned number that wasn't specifically requested to be a ritual offering of headcount isn't very smart. It'll bite you in the ass eventually when productive people actually end up leaving because of the work environment.

<comment><USER34> > This is a pretty popular thing at many large companies. Everyone somehow > wants to hire the cream of the crop, yet there are only so many cream of the > crop candidates.

I think in some places it's not so much the desire to hire the cream of the crop, but a manager or managers wanting to believe that by hiring only the cream of the crop, _they_ are then the cream of their crop. As a side effect, it helps them maintain an erection.

</comment></comment><comment><USER13> If you read "Straight From the Gut" by Jack Welch, you would know that this is standard practice that is supposed to weed out the bottom 10% every year.

The "GE Way" was to keep pruning from the bottom, and yes, it would mean that sometimes decent performers would get cut. In the book, there's an anecdote about how at some point, groups would take on crappy workers, just so that they could fire them for the yearly purge.

<comment><USER35> > The "GE Way" was to keep pruning from the bottom, and yes, it would mean > that sometimes decent performers would get cut. In the book, there's an > anecdote about how at some point, groups would take on crappy workers, just > so that they could fire them for the yearly purge.

How is that something that should be emulated? Seems like a tremendous waste of resources to me.

<comment><USER30> Stupidity of top management justifies the response

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER36> In theory, a system like this could work much better if those "bell" rankings were only forced on teams which aren't performing well (as a team). This would both encourage teamwork and lower the risk to let very good people go only because they're in an exceptional team.

</comment><comment><USER37> In the documentary 'Enron: The Smartest Guys in the Room', it mentioned that the company had a "rank-and-yank" system, whereby annually everyone would rank everyone else. Those ranked in the top 10% would be promoted, and those in the bottom 10% would be let go. One guy commented "I don't know a successful company that fires 10% of its employees every year".

</comment><comment><USER38> Isn't this the system Microsoft is using that has created such huge problems for the company? There was that Vanity Fair article recently that talked about what a mess the product teams are at Microsoft. It blamed the stack rankings in part for creating a hostile environment where nothing could get done. Nobody collaborates because they want to come out on top of those rankings, and some even go so far as to sabotage their co-workers to stay atop the rankings.

I seem to recall the article suggesting that the only place stack ranking ever worked was GE.

Sounds to me like a recipe for disaster.

</comment><comment> at-fates-hands Here's the deal. As an employee with boots on the ground, you're usually the first to see this sort of stuff coming a hundred miles away. Why anybody would put up with this BS is completely beyond me. If you can get a job at Yahoo, I'm pretty sure you shouldn't have any problem getting another well paying job.

I was in a pretty large corporation and they started doing this and a ton of their top developers started leaving in droves. I'm talking 10 a week, and not entry level guys. We're talking senior BA's, developers and engineers when it was at its worst. They had a turn over rate in the 90% range. After 6 months of not being able to do anything because they were in a constant training mode, a bunch of directors and middle managers got axed and they took a different approach. It takes a lot to move the needle, but when it does, it will make a difference.

</comment><comment><USER39> Meh stack ranking sucks. Bad move.

[http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2013/08/23/stack_ran...](http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2013/08/23/stack_ranking_steve_ballmer_s_employee_evaluation_system_and_microsoft_s.html)

</comment><comment><USER40> So stacked ranking - why do companies not understand that the granularity level can't be too low (i.e., teams of 5 or so)?

Or is it just the case that stacked ranking works in theory but doesn't scale to real organizations (kind of like communism)?

</comment><comment><USER41> This discussions are always so outstanding. Has anyone ever actually seen a large organization where more than 85% of the people are high achieving?

</comment><comment><USER42> Kara Swisher: She's clearly in the monkey quadrant.

On the topic of the chart: why would you ever work for a place why 85% are structually constrained to underperform or be average? If 100% of the empolyees start out the 15% "Target Hires", in a single generatino they have 6/7 failure rate of performing to their potential? Makes no sense if you're actually any good.

<comment><USER42> _"Because Marissa Said So"_

Glad to see HN dropped the pejoritive title

</comment></comment><comment><USER43> Can anyone explain how this differs from Microsoft's ranking system? I doubt Marissa is not aware of that practice.

</comment><comment><USER44> C'mon. Right or wrong, everyone knows the "no working from home" policy was a way for Y! to do a mass layoff without having it look like one to the street. This is merely an extension of the same policy. Mayer can afford to make a lot of mistakes. It's not her dime after all. So she will make them.

</comment><comment><USER45> This suggests there's a major problem in the mid-level management that's communicating the message. Telling a front-line manager to put someone in a bucket to meet the quota results in bad feelings, poor decisions that lead to loss of talent and bad publicity.

The alternative doesn't have to be abolishing stack ranking. The manager's manager should instead ask for justification and help the manager raise standards if they are too low. If not, he should repeat the same process with his manager. The +-3% variance indicates that the executive team expected this to happen. Since the feedback indicates that it's not happening in some (many) cases, hopefully this has triggered top-down conversations on the right way to implement.

</comment><comment><USER46> When it comes to employee ratings, absolute vs. relative is a red herring. Both lead to adverse outcomes. With the more common absolute ratings, managers have an incentive to rate everyone highly, so people who work for honest managers get screwed. With relative ratings, the weakest members of the strongest teams get screwed. Rating employees just doesn't work unless the departments are also rated. If you know the relative strength of each department then you can adjust the ratings of its members accordingly. There's still a serious question of what you do with that information, but at least then it won't be totally distorted by the differences between teams and managers.

</comment><comment><USER47> It would be interesting to look at companies with stack ranking and see if any objective performance measure is a significantly better predictor of a layoff than: 1) A random number generator; 2) the personality of your boss.

</comment><comment><USER48> It seems to me there are two problems with this system. One is that you are grading on the curve so a "less good" but still good employee is getting fired. The other is that the only person doing the evaluating is the employee's manager.

I would propose a system where there is an absolute, not relative, scoring method. Pick 10 criteria and score them with 1 - 10 points. Set a minimum score for continued employment, say 70 points.

I would also crowd-source the reviews. Not just the manager, but peers and people that report to the employee would all give a review. Then take the average review score.

</comment><comment><USER49> What difference does it make? If your committed to reducing an organisation by X%, then a certain number of people are going to be fired. And it makes sense they are the lowest performing percentile.

So maybe some people were rated as "misses" when they weren't, but they were still the lowest ranked employee in their unit. Would this argument be mute if they were ranked "least effective" instead?

<comment><USER50> > If your committed to reducing an organisation by X%, then a certain number > of people are going to be fired. And it makes sense they are the lowest > performing percentile.

It may make sense to reduce the number of employees. If you chose to do so, it'd be great if you could keep your (relatively) "best" and fire your "worst". The _problem_ is that it's really, really hard to _measure_ how good your employees are. It's even hard to define what a "good" employee _is_. Especially, perhaps, in a large company.

Take YUI, for instance. How much does someone working in localization of YUI contribute to quarterly revenue? Is he or she more valuable than the person responsible for selling ads? How about the community manager for the Traffic Webserver? How much revenue does he or she contribute? Are the these roles even comparable?

I wonder how things would look if they went by seniority, and simply fired the last 10% to join (maybe with the exception of certain "specialists", like the CEO... ).

<comment><USER49> > The problem is that it's really, really hard to measure how good your > employees are. It's even hard to define what a "good" employee is. > Especially, perhaps, in a large company.

At a company level that is absolutely correct. I think it supports the notion of firing by team - if anyone can measure the worth of an employee, it is their direct line manager, who is responsible for giving them work and judging the timeliness and quality of the outcome. However, as this "measure" is essentially incomparable between teams, it can't be effectively extrapolated to form a company wide view of the "bottom 10%". Asking each manager to get rid of their least effective employee both spreads the cuts evenly across skill sets, while ensuring that the measure of employee worth is being made by the most qualified person to do so.

> I wonder how things would look if they went by seniority, and simply fired > the last 10% to join

Well, like firing by team, it is just another arbitrary measure. But I think I would rather an arbitrary measure that at least tries to take into account employee worth rather than when they joined.

<comment><USER12> _while ensuring that the measure of employee worth is being made by the most qualified person to do so._

This implicitly assumes that the line manager is competent and not spread too thin.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER51> Wouldn't this encourage cross-department collaboration? My logic goes like this: Collaborating makes one succeed. But, you don't want your team to succeed, because then you might be laid off. But, people on other teams aren't in competition with you. So, if you collaborate with them, you can really kick the ass of that jerk next to you that you used to be friends with.

I'm joking...mostly.

<comment><USER33> The other team will take the accolades for your work, your team will be mad at you for mot pulling your weight.

</comment></comment><comment><USER52> I had put down this comment in reply to one of the thread's below...however its better that i put it as a separate comment too..for a larger audience...and in appreciation of true leaders..

management is one shit where the board's decision or the management's decision is responsible for a company's failure..what these guys were doing when they were hiring or buying companies...is employees responsible for the failures...

In any company's failure, the first one to blame is the management because they failed and that's why a lay off has to be done..I had always felt that layoff is an easy way for a CEO or the management to wash off their hands rather than trying to solve the problem at hand..

A leader is someone who leads his team and makes other perform...

In management, I have found most people just licking the bosses above them...and i hate these bunch...in such a management structure, one actually creates a bunch of followers who are unfortunately called managers..

There are exceptions...and they are very few...and these are actual leaders who have the power to turn things around..

</comment><comment><USER53> For now, all the yahoo services I use stink as much as they always have. It will take years for these sweeping cultural changes to pay off, if the do. Definitely a heroic effort on Mayer's part, considering the shelf life of Yahoo CEOs is so low.

</comment><comment><USER54> This is silly in my opinion. If she wanted to prune the comoany to make room for more (acqui-)hires do it in stages. First let the managers feel like they can more easily fire the most underperforming people. Donmt force them to do so.

</comment><comment><USER55> I mean at this point Yahoo is an anachronism, they might as well go all the way with it. Perhaps this will accelerate the inevitable and we can all just be done with it.

</comment><comment><USER56> Am I the only one wondering why Yahoo! is still around? I struggle to even comprehend what the hell they even do today after jumping out of the search engine race.

</comment><comment><USER30> Every "good" girl secretly fantasy to have a dominatrix whip in her hands.

"Welcome to the real world!" \--Morpheous

</comment><comment><USER57> If you want to make an omelette, you've gotta break some eggs.

</comment><comment><USER58> _> I feel so uncomfortable because in order to meet the bell curve, I have to tell the employee that they missed when I truly don't believe it to be the case. [...] More often than I'd like I'm told we are executing a certain way 'because Marissa said so.'_

If you have an underproductive department with overprotective management, layoffs (and negative performance reviews) won't happen as frequently as they should.

Maybe members of management just want to protect their respective fiefdoms. Maybe they have their empathy makes it difficult to lay people off. Maybe they genuinely believe their teams are doing well. _Maybe their teams actually are doing well_ , and exceptionally few layoffs (if any) need to happen.

Regardless, "because Marissa said so" is a perfectly valid answer. There will be collateral damage, but it's likely that she's dealing with some extremely protective, entrenched management who won't negatively review anyone on their teams unless they're forced to.

<comment><USER59> If you've got an underproductive department with overprotective management, I've got a suggestion for where you could trim some fat.

I have difficulty comprehending the logic that trusts someone to monitor, assess, and organize a team's work, but doesn't trust them to take responsibility for the performance of the whole team and micromanages their staffing from above.

<comment><USER58> _> I have difficulty comprehending the logic that trusts someone to monitor, assess, and organize a team's work, but doesn't trust them to take responsibility for the performance of the whole team and micromanages their staffing from above._

I hear you.

I imagine Mayer would like to fire those overprotective members of management, but I can't imagine how she could know exactly who they are at this point. This review processes should hopefully help shine a light on some of them.</comment></comment></comment>


Show HN: Usersnap Redesign - <AUTHOR> http://thecapcan.com/portfolio_page/usersnap-case-study/ <comment><USER2> This seems more like a blog post than a "Show HN" where there is something that HN'ers can try out and play with.</comment>


Betraying Salinger - <AUTHOR> http://nymag.com/arts/books/features/65210/

<comment><USER2> A review of the story in question, for those who are curious:

<http://www.thesatirist.com/books/HAPWORTH.html>

I also tracked down a copy of the full text, but in the interests of some kind of vague respect for copyright I'll leave you to figure out how to obtain it for yourself.

<comment><USER3> It's also available on the Complete New Yorker DVDs, and in most public libraries, if you still believe in the world outside of the internet.

<comment><USER4> Well, for most of us (say, about 6 billion or so), it's NOT available in the local public libraries (yes, I know you were saying the US public libraries, but the WWW / Internet is so much more useful!).

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> I think this publishing attempt was doomed from the outset. There was no way that the attempt could ever escape notice for long; and any notice made of it would have upset Salinger. At best, Salinger would have felt duped, if contracts etc. had proceeded to the point that publishing could no longer be aborted.

</comment><comment><USER6> An interesting tale. Salinger wanted the book published but also wanted nobody to know that it had been published.

<comment><USER2> Alternatively, he was bored and felt like dicking with a publisher for a while at great expense to them.

</comment></comment><comment><USER7> The real problem here is the length of copyright terms, which now stand at pretty much forever. If we had more reasonable laws then anyone who damn well pleased could published it.

<comment><USER3> ...without paying the author of the work. Are you sure that's what you want?

How long do you think the copyright terms should be? In the case discussed here, we're talking about a work from 1965. You think that everything published before then should be up for grabs?

<comment><USER7> > ...without paying the author of the work. Are you sure that's what you want?

That is exactly what I want.

> How long do you think the copyright terms should be?

Personally I think 20 years is a reasonable number. The original Copyright Act of 1790 established a term of 14 years with the option of one renewal. Remember that this was in the age of manual printing presses and horse-drawn wagons. In this age of on-demand printing and digital distribution 20 years is more than enough.

The copyright system isn't a right in the sense of speech or assembly, it's a temporary monopoly granted to an author in order to "..promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts..". Any aspect of copyright law which fails to promote those goals fails to uphold the constitutional foundation and ultimate purpose of the copyright system.

Copyright law exists in order to encourage authors to create by allowing them to benefit from their creation, but how does allowing a person to collect royalties on something they made 50 years ago promote creativity?

<comment><USER3> It promotes creativity by enlarging the possible payout one can receive for one's labors. Writing a book may take several years, and it's not always the first book that succeeds. Capping the potential upside is definitely going to discourage writing works that will take a large investment of time and research.

And let's not even talk about all of the books that only became popular more than twenty years after initial publication. Imagine Tolkien in retirement on a modest pension while his books are suddenly bestsellers...

<comment><USER8> In the XVII century, copyright in Spain was a period of _ten years_ long, since the first edition, not renewable. I'm talking of a country notorious for its steep geography and bad communications, at a period of both dangerous colonisation, wars and abject poverty. That century is now known as the Spanish Golden Age of Literature.

History has proven that, past a point, money does not seem to translate into creativeness. Cultures almost always have their most creative periods at times of social and intellectual changes (say, XIX-XX century Germany) and when intellectual work is regarded as prestigious and respected by the public (physics on America post-Einstein/WW2).

<comment><USER2> The economics of copyright in 17th-century Spain aren't really translatable to the modern world, though.

If you were a publisher, how much would you be willing to pay an author for the rights to publish a book if you knew you'd be able to publish your own edition of it in ten years anyway? Why would you bother buying rights to new publications at all, if there was more money to be made printing up new editions of the earlier Harry Potter books?

All that authors have to sell is the right to publish their works for the maximum copyright period. If you drastically reduce the maximum copyright period you'll drastically reduce the value of what they're selling, and the effort-to-reward ratio for most authors (even good ones) is, I think, already quite high enough.

<comment><USER8> I read somewhere that most content ceases to be profitable at about 10, 15 years past release. I'm sorry, I'm not able to find it now, but _if that's true_ , it would mean that publishers would indeed have an incentive. The benefits from printing new editions of old books wouldn't be much in comparison, being more competition. I do, indeed, think it's true.

I somewhat feel sorry for the authors, but I think they'll manage. Being a writer is already a respected and highly-sought status, even though the pay is poor. Either way, I wouldn't claim copyright durations of ten years. But we can't stay like this eternally.

<comment><USER2> So we're agreed that ten years is too short? Personally I have no problem with it lasting for the author's entire life, I think we gain more than we lose by that. And perhaps ten years beyond the death of the author (not to be confused with the Death of the Author) just so there isn't an unseemly orgy of cut-rate new editions every time an author dies.

I do agree, though, that the copyright term should be set sensibly and never changed, and not regularly extended at the behest of Disney. That's a real problem.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> Wow. If he had actually finished producing the book it would quickly become a bestseller once someone discovered its existence. I think the old man would have had a chuckle buying the plain-looking book at some small, non-chain bookstore.

</comment><comment><USER10> While I understand where J D Salinger is coming from, this reminds me of a couple customers that I've dealt with over the years. They come up with some ridiculous request, and you smile and agree because they're the customer and you want the deal, then the whole thing turns out to be a lot more trouble than it's worth.

</comment><comment><USER11> guy sounds like a first class self-obsessed jerk. World's full of 'em.

<comment><USER12> Yes, but a self-obsessed jerk who created truly great work. I will forgive nearly every personal flaw in the face of great work.

Also, thanks for reminding me. I haven't been doing much truly great work lately...it's time to step it up a notch. I sure aint gonna be winning any politeness contests, so the body of work is what matters.

<comment><USER13> The artist is separate from the art.</comment></comment></comment>


An email from Airbnb - <AUTHOR> Dear ,
We're emailing you because the state legislature sent the anti-home sharing bill -- the result of a backroom deal -- to Governor Cuomo's desk yesterday. That means he must take action on the bill in the next ten days.
The Governor has a choice: veto this bill, which would be a victory for middle class New Yorkers and a rejection of Albany backroom deals. Or, sign the bill and leave tens of thousands of New Yorkers vulnerable to huge fines. (Cuomo could also do nothing, which would mean it still becomes law.) Governor Cuomo needs to hear from as many of us as possible, right now, to stop this backroom deal from becoming law.
<link> Tweet and Call the Governor <link>
In June, the state legislature passed an anti-home sharing bill that would fine everyday New Yorkers who advertise their home on sites like Airbnb up to $7,500. As we've waited to hear whether or not Governor Cuomo would sign the bill into law or veto it, you've been by our side, taking action when it counted most to send a message to the Governor about the impact of this bad bill. Thousands of Airbnb hosts and travelers tweeted, called, and sent emails.
Now we need you to take action again. We must ensure the Governor stands with seniors, students, small businesses, and communities that rely on home sharing for economic opportunity, and not with the big hotel special interests pushing this anti-tenant, anti-homeowner, anti-innovation bill. Take action right now and tell Governor Cuomo why home sharing is important to you. There isn't much time!
We're in this together,
The Airbnb Team <comment><USER2> I stayed in an airbnb. I provided photo evidence that the airbnb was unsafe. They didn't pull the listing and told me to work it out with the owner.

It was really interesting because they told me that they tried contact the owner and he didn't respond -- which the employee remarked was pretty common. Still, they continued to list his property.

I support more regulation.

<comment><USER3> "unsafe" is a bit ambiguous.

If the place didn't meet building codes so you were likely to fall off of stairs without a railing, file a complaint with the city.

If you actually fell off the stairs and hurt yourself, file a lawsuit against the owner. He'll make a claim against his insurance, and probably will have higher premiums.

If it was a shared unit and there were other dangerous tenants(ex-felons or sex offenders), then maybe Airbnb could screen people better or at least make it an option on the listing. I think somebody is required to disclose this fact to you(either the felon or the owner), or else they're liable.

If it was unsafe in a way that wasn't illegal, then there's not really an Airbnb-specific problem. You wouldn't sue the local newspaper for listing an apartment that ended up unsafe, you would sue the landlord. It's unclear why the rental being short-term would or the choice of listing venue would change that. And it's not like Airbnb loses legal rights just because they're larger than the local newspaper, or incorporated, or accepted VC money.

<comment><USER4> A newspaper and Airbnb aren't exactly the same thing. One difference is a newspaper recognizes it can't show reviews of its listings, so it doesn't.

<comment><USER3> Why is showing reviews relevant? Amazon doesn't take down reviews because they'd be prosecuted or sued for publishing the opinions of its members if they didn't; they take them down as a product decision.

It's not at all obvious to me that companies should be liable for the contents of reviews from their customers, even those that they have reason to believe are false.</comment></comment></comment></comment>


Show HN: Bash script to check if any Git repo has uncommitted changes - <AUTHOR> https://gist.github.com/madprops/a94a977e32ba7602f4cdef46e67bf8a8 <comment><USER2> Hi :) I guess your script will grow over time because soon you'll want to detect also unpushed and stashed changes.

Before you reinvent this wheel, there is already a tool doing exactly that: [https://github.com/brandon-rhodes/uncommitted](https://github.com/brandon- rhodes/uncommitted)

(Disclaimer: I wrote a large part of it)</comment>


Show HN: API Testing for Developers - <AUTHOR> http://bluebook.run <comment><AUTHOR> Hi! I'm the author of bluebook. I'd love to hear your thoughts on this idea, and any suggestions or improvements you may have.</comment>


The Dream Stack - Is This A Joke? - <AUTHOR> http://dobbscodetalk.com/index.php?option=com_myblog&show=The-Dream-Stack-For-Developing-And-Deploying-Web-Applications.html&Itemid=29

<comment><USER3> Can anyone please tell me what the dream transportation mode is? Here are my requirements:

* It must be really fast

* It must be really safe

* It must be really cheap

* I must be able to do other activities while using it

* It must be ecological - no pollution whatsoever!

I can't tell you where I'm going (next door or to the other side of the world), but I certainly intend to move from my chair at some point, so I think it's really important that I do so in the best way possible. I might take some other people with me as well, please bear that in mind in your recommendation.

So? Anyone? Hello?

<comment><USER4> This isn't a literal request for advice. It's "suggest your favourite web stack and how it performs along particular criteria".

For instance: Hybrid car

\- Pretty fast relative to other transport

\- Not bad safety but not the best

\- Pretty affordable relatively

\- Has a radio etc.

\- It does better ecologically than most.

It's not going to be a perfect answer, but having those 5 questions you just posted lets me know a) what's important to you (I might not care about ecological qualities for instance) and b) lets me evaluate why I might choose a particular method.

</comment></comment><comment><USER5> I think of this kind of tool wank as "Guitar Center development" - <USER2> conviction that choosing the perfect combination of web framework, revision control system, programming language, data store, templating engine and web server is a prerequisite to building an awesome app.

It's exactly analagous to the idea that you can't truly shred until you've assembled the right set of effects pedals, preamps, niobium-plated strings, vintage depleted-uranium core wound pickups and ocelot-tooth guitar pick.

Just play the damn thing.

<comment><USER6> This is one of the few times I wish I could upvote someone more than once.

The painful truth about web services is that it doesn't matter what tools you use; at least initially. If it does something useful and you are getting revenue you can and will rearchitect and rework the solution as it grows. And as a system grows it tends to become heterogeneous, an all php shop will suddenly sprout a java based search engine, an ASP.NET shop will throw a linux box in front of it's app servers to act as a reverse-proxy filter/load balancer, and so on. The really good thing about the current state of the art is that you have a multitude of tools available to solve any given problem. The issue is you need to have people who have experience with more than one toolset to make sensible decisions and be able to pick the right solution for the task at hand.

<comment><USER7> yep spot on. Pick the technology that you have the available skills for right now. As the problems present themselves (and you normally can't predict them because you don't know how your service is going to be used and what strange usage patterns the users will come up with) then solve them.

Its better being adaptable and rolling with the demands than being stuck with a problem you didn't predict that you can't solve without major surgery because everything else is so strictly defined.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> Note the byline: "Senior Analyst, Forrester Research".

To non-programmers like the author, this sort of article is reasonable. Programming is not a creative art, it's just about buying some tools that you read about in the trade magazine.

<comment><USER4> While I agree with your sentiment I'm not sure if that's definitely the case.

First, when you have an average level of programmer (as the sort of corporations that would hire a senior analyst tend to), selecting the right tools is where you can innovate against your competition.

Second, if this wasn't written by a non-programmer, but instead was an Ask-YC "What stack would you use to build the next Google/Facebook/Amazon etc." I don't think this same criticism would be levelled at the author.

<comment><USER8> Wouldn't you want to hire a senior programmer to make programming decisions?

<comment><USER4> I'm not sure I get your point in relation to mine, can you elaborate?

<comment><USER8> I thought you were suggesting hiring analysts to fix the problems that the amateur programmers created. But now that I re-read your post, it seems like you are just observing how the industry works.

Honestly, I think we should feed "analysts" as much bad data as possible so that the companies that rely on analysts are killed off. The analysts will then die too :) (Have you ever poisoned someone to cure their cold? This would be like that. Kill the host, then the virus dies :)

<comment><USER4> I have to admit I've never poisoned someone to cure their cold.

<comment><USER8> It's 100% effective!

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><AUTHOR> _I want to develop a Web application - a really good Web app. The kind of Web app that will make me so rich that I can buy an $9.4 million co-op over looking Central Park, a Yacht registered in Monaco, and hire an architect to build my dream-house west of Boston that is a combo of Buckminster Fuller, FLW, and MTV cribs. Throw in a vintage sweet ride like Don Draper's Cadillac and lifetime membership to the Boston Sports Club. I'm set._

I had to re-read the article (and the above paragraph) several times, and check other articles on the site to make sure I wasn't reading a parody site.

</comment><comment><USER9> I stopped reading after he mentioned "pwn-some Web app". Jesus wept.

</comment><comment><USER10> Is anyone else tempted to start giving them some ridiculous suggestions, give plausible-to-non-coder explanations and see if they can successfully refute them?

</comment><comment><USER11> No; it's just written in a language that an enterprise dev's VP would understand.

</comment><comment><USER12> yeah seriously...it totally depends on the app...how can you define the perfect tools for the job when you explicitly state you don't know what the job is yet?

<comment><USER4> They give requirements.

<comment><USER6> Requirements that are uselessly vague. "Architected to never go down"? That's not a requirement, that's wishful thinking. It's as useful a requirement as "Must be attractive to Unicorns."

Engineering a web scale service for robustness is a series of tradeoffs, increasingly expensive tradeoffs as you make the system proof against bigger threats. Geographical redundancy alone more than doubles your costs, and (if you're doing it right) only adds a third or fourth 9 to your availability numbers.

But "Architected to never go down." does not guide the implementer, it doesn't communicate anything they need to know about what the limits of system are; and most importantly it ignores the reality principle.

<comment><USER4> You're missing the point. This isn't a job ad, it's a question about what would you pick to use if you had to develop a web app. "Architected to never go down" should be read as "Stability is important". No web stack will satisfy everything the author asks for, but they are bringing up all the different factors (or at least most of the broad ones) that need to be considered when making an architecture decision. How would your favourite web stack match up against the different evaluative dimensions?

The fact that you are already bringing up all your expertise on redundancy shows that you can think about this better than others and probably give an answer that fits this requirement well.

<comment><USER13> _The fact that you are already bringing up all your expertise on redundancy shows that you can think about this better than others and probably give an answer that fits this requirement well._

Unless we completely reinterpret the requirements (as per your suggestion), (s)he really can't. It is impossible to meet the requirement "Architected never to go down."

What actually confuses me more than anything is how wildly the strength of the writer's connection to reality varies. I mean, two of the "requirements" are:

      # Architected to never go down

and

      # Employs security features

The first is impossible. The second is trivial. All software employs some sort of security feature - the alternative is for the software to be _perfectly insecure_.

Eh, I dunno.

<comment><USER4> I think that you are taking this as a programmer (i.e. too literally).

If I asked you to recommend a car that is fast and safe you wouldn't reply "all cars are fast" and "no car can be perfectly safe", you would suggest a car that maximises those requirements.

Similarly, the author is looking for what frameworks/stacks maximise (among other things) reliability and security.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> How is this a joke? The author has given a set of requirements and asked what _you_ think are the best choices to meet those requirements. If you are ever considering a web startup this is a perfect question to ask and one you should know the answer to.

Incidentally I'm a fan of the ASP.NET MVC stack (using MS SQL) for web development, but I don't think it's the most scalable and is unlikely to have a large pool of good developers to source from (you would probably want a good C# or non-MS-hating RoR developer).

<comment><USER14> Scalability shouldn't be a problem. Stack Overflow uses ASP.NET MVC with a SQL server backend, and they're doing over a million hits a day.

<comment><USER4> Yeah that is true and plentyoffish.com uses ASP.NET too. I'm just thinking like Amazon/Google/Facebook big and whether that would become an issue.

<comment><USER8> _I'm just thinking like Amazon/Google/Facebook big and whether that would become an issue._

Yeah, why solve problems that you actually have when you can fantasize about solving problems you don't have instead?

<comment><USER4> Good point.

However, the whole topic of this thread is fantasising about the perfect stack for that massive site. Besides which, 30 seconds now could save one year in the future (just think if Netscape had thought ahead).</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment>


Nanobox - <AUTHOR> https://nanobox.io/ <comment><AUTHOR> FYI, I've been digging around and the internals seem to be mostly Open Source, hosted here: [https://github.com/nanopack](https://github.com/nanopack)</comment>


Alone in interstellar space, Voyager 2 soon to lose contact With Earth - <AUTHOR> https://www.sciencealert.com/voyager-2-already-isolated-in-interstellar-space-is-about-to-become-even-more-alone <comment><AUTHOR> Signals will be lost, like tears... in rain. Time to fly.</comment>


Stop the great firewall of America - <AUTHOR> http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/16/opinion/firewall-law-could-infringe-on-free-speech.html

<comment><AUTHOR> We've seen a number of articles on this topic today, but this is probably the best written and will reach a greater audience than any tech blogger ever could.

Being from Australia, I'm not going to be writing to any politicians, but I sure as hell hope this bill or others like it do not come to pass.</comment>


CBOR – A new object encoding format - <AUTHOR> http://grimpen.org/blog/4.html

<comment><USER2> Gah, that was almost unreadable due to the many typos and inconsistencies. First:

 _For example, the number 10 is encoded as 0x10._

As an example, that is _fantastically_ opaque. It tells me nothing sensible at all, there could just be a magic look-up table that you're assumed to know, for all I know. I can't draw any conclusions that lead me to believe that CBOR is "simple" from that example.

Then, it contradicts the above in the table, where it claims:

        10    0x0a

It also shows bit numbers numbered from 1 to 8, left to right, which is very different from how bits are typically numbered (from 0 to 7, right to left) and thus makes me even _more_ confused.

</comment><comment><USER3> I have my own implementation very quickly hacked together for Python3 without tagging support. [https://github.com/michaelmior/pycbor](https://github.com/michaelmior/pycbor)

The one thing that Flynn seems to be missing is tests. Right now I run tests by parsing the examples from the RFC, so I consider the test suite pretty complete (for the features I have implemented). Glad this got posted since perhaps my test suite could be useful for Flynn.

</comment><comment><USER4> I also have a nearly complete implementation of this in Haskell. [https://github.com/orclev/CBOR](https://github.com/orclev/CBOR)

The main problem it currently faces is that the encoding/decoding support for half-width floats is currently wrong, but so long as you avoid half-width floats it works perfectly.

Eventually I want to add support for encoding indefinite lists by way of one of the streaming libraries like conduit or pipes, but before I do that I need to refactor to the code to break the Binary instances out from the types.

<comment><AUTHOR> Just take a look at the Appendix D of RFC7049, where they present reference implementations in C and Python for half-width float decoding: [http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc7049#appendix-D](http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc7049#appendix-D)

</comment></comment><comment><USER5> Magic delimiter constants for indefinite lists. Doesn't seem like a great implementation when you need hacks like that. Plus the size of individual data elements is restricted by the type/length information struct size. JSON is nice because it doesn't try to be very efficient, yet it's wholly better than XML. This is a binary format, not really comparable considering how restricted this is.

</comment><comment><USER6> Prior thread -- [https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6632576](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6632576)

Not sure why yet another binary encoding method is needed (per editor comments on the original ietf mailing list).

<comment><AUTHOR> Inofficially CBOR was designed as a protocol base for CoRE-related protocols. CoRE stands for Constrained RESTful Environments and is an alternative for HTTP in restricted environments like micro controllers. See also [https://ietf.org/wg/core/charter/](https://ietf.org/wg/core/charter/)

</comment></comment><comment><USER7> This is cool. Are there any numbers on how it compares size/speed on some test data structures to msgpack/json/etc?

</comment><comment><USER8> Obligatory [http://xkcd.com/927/](http://xkcd.com/927/)</comment>


Interconnection of previously separated networks in Boeing 737 airplanes - <AUTHOR> https://federalregister.gov/a/2014-13244

<comment><AUTHOR> DO-178/C permits virtual machine separation of function on shared computer hardware; this ("Special Conditions") is the first time _all three_ networks have been allowed to share a single network bus. Previously, networks were separated (primarily for historical reasons; the three network domains came aboard years apart; it made retrofitting features like seatback video screens easier on old aircraft) but that separation gave obvious safety benefits as well. Now, when building new airframes, Boeing quite rightly wants to avoid running three wires where one will serve, saving kilograms of mass.

But if we believe VM separation suffices for safety critical _software_ , do we believe it as strongly for network traffic?</comment>


Blekko Review - <AUTHOR> http://techcrunch.com/2010/07/19/techcrunch-review-the-blekko-search-engine-prepares-to-launch/

<comment><USER2> I'm really excited about having a new search engine to try. More competition isn't just good for consumers, it's also good for the field of IR.

I work in search quality at Google, and it's really exciting for me to see a result that another search engine returns that I don't understand. It inspires me to think of all the ways they might have returned it, and leads to a lot of neat ideas. For the same reason, I enjoy reading the reaction in the SEO community to major changes to Google's rankings. Sometimes we're too close to a change to see what it does effectively instead of in principle. What the SEOs conclude often ends up being a really good first-order approximation of an unintended side-effect.

If you believe that your competitors are doing incredible things, it's a great inspiration to try doing incredible things yourself, regardless of whether you're right about what they're doing.

<comment><USER3> _I'm really excited about having a new search engine to try._

Give DuckDuckGo a try for a couple of weeks, you probably won't go back to whichever search engine you are using currently :-)

<comment><USER4> It doesn't work very well in Finland. I guess I'll be using google for a while, since internationalization usually isn't much of a concern for smaller startups.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> I liked the idea of "unprecedented level of access to the algorithms and data that Blekko uses to determine relevancy".

This is a great differentiator from Google. Google can copy features like slashtags easier, but I can't imagine a large company known for its secrecy suddenly exposing their algorithms.

<comment><USER6> Yes, I wonder how involved they will be with Open Source. Could really shift things a bit if a startup like Blekko shoved Google further to the center by being more 'Open' (whatever that word has come to mean) than them in the eyes of the media.

</comment></comment><comment><USER7> The Slashtags concept looks _awesome_ , and as buzzwordy as it sounds, adding a social aspect to search by allowing Slashtag sharing could really take off. For example, a lecturer could put make a /thiscourseonly Slashtag, searching only hand picked sources.

What would be especially great is a smart form of autocomplete. Eg once you typed /date you would get dd/mm/yy or dd monthname year or similar ghosting in front of the cursor.

The only concern would be that Google and Bing could copy it fairly quickly, so hopefully their other features are strong enough.

<comment><USER8> As they VC query used to go: "is this a feature or a company?" So far Blekko looks like a feature, but I will reserve judgement until I can actually play with it a bit. I really hope that this slashtags bit is not the only interesting thing they have to show after several years of work. OTOH, this does fit what seems to be a pattern for Rich Skrenta and his team: find an already occupied niche and crank out something that has 60-70% of the polish of the leader with a few new features and then flip the whole thing to someone who is desperate to get in or stay in the game.

</comment></comment><comment><USER9> DuckDuckGo provides some of this now as I understand it.

<http://duckduckgo.com/bang.html> and <http://duckduckgo.com/goodies.html>

<comment><USER10> Kindof, I think that DDG's bang searches take you to the respective website's search API. This one seems like it shows results in blekko's website simply filtered any way you create.

</comment></comment><comment><USER11> The screencast: [http://techcrunch.com/2010/07/19/blekko-screencast-and- found...](http://techcrunch.com/2010/07/19/blekko-screencast-and-founder- interview/)

</comment><comment><USER12> This is wonderful news. In addition to the slashtags, I'm excited about all the ranking data they're showing off.

Right now your only source of ranking data straight from a search engine is Yahoo's Site Explorer, and even that data is quite limited and its future availability uncertain. I've never seen duplicate content exposed so openly.

And as ora600 said, that level of transparency is something Google exceedingly unlikely to copy.

<comment><USER8> The problem with making ranking data a "feature" is that the only ones who care about this information only care about what the ranking data is on Google. What the rank is for your site on Blekko is of no value whatsoever.

</comment></comment><comment><USER13> Google could combine its search engine with its app engine to allow third party developers to implement custom searches.

Third party developers could even get paid via ads that appear whenever their algorithms are used in the search results.

<comment><USER14> Actually, you just have described Yahoo BOSS ("Build your own search engine") program :)

</comment></comment><comment><AUTHOR> Slashtags are a neat idea, can't wait to try it out.

</comment><comment><USER15> Anybody here from Blekko? I'd love a special HN invite :-)

<comment><USER16> Yes, being an HN reader is definitely a plus. :-)

The best way to get an invite is hit us on twitter or facebook (see links from blekko.com). Then we can DM you an invite when we have them ready.

<comment><USER17> Oh man why does everything have to be via facebook, twitter et al? I only do email...

<comment><USER18> Why don't you try an email address on the contact page? <http://blekko.com/contact.html>

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER19> _"alternatives are a prerequisite to the illusion of choice"_ \-- just made it up 2010</comment>


Ask HN: Submitted security flaw. Was pressed for employer. - <AUTHOR>

Recently I submitted a security hole to the creators of a large piece of medical software. This software provides access to sensitive information about patients, as well as privileges such as ordering prescriptions.
The flaw I found, and reported, related to password storage. The passwords use a reversible algorithm which I wrote about on my blog [1].
After submitting the hole I was contacted by the SEO of the company saying that they would push my report to the developers and that they would be in contact with me. Two weeks following the last communication I reached back out to the CEO to see if there was a status update, and informed them that I would be publishing all of my findings, including the name of the software and code, on April 1, 2013 barring assurance that the issue was actually being fixed.
Today I received an email from the CEO as well as an individual who identified themselves as a member of the development team stating that the issue was being worked on and should be patched in 4 weeks. I was satisfied with the response and decided to wait before posting anything further. However, before I could reply to the emails, I received a phone call (I provided my phone number to discuss the issue).
During the conversation, with the individual who identified themselves as a developer for the software, the caller assured me that the issue would be fixed. I thanked them and asked to be informed when it was patched so that I update and secure my companies system as needed. After assuring me the issue would be fixed the caller went on for about 10 minutes pressuring me to tell him who my employer was. The whole time I refused, stating the issue was not uncovered due to any business operations, and that I was reporting the issues as an individual, not as a member of the company.
So, my question is: Do I ever have to disclose any personal information when reporting a security flaw.
[1]http://www.jcurcio.com/posts/obscurity-is-not-security/ <comment><USER2> Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer, certainly not your lawyer.

Are there any contracts between any of the parties: you, your employer, the software company - that might require you to provide or disclose any information?

Does HIPAA apply? Did you view any protected patient info?

If I were you, I would not post further publicly until after you consult with a local attorney who understands both the potential HIPAA issues and your personal exposure regarding your employer.

Best case - the software company fixes the issue, thanks you publicly, deals appropriately with whoever signed off on the metamorphosi code, encourages your employer to give you a raise, a promotion, a 4 week vacation somewhere pleasant, a personal zeppelin to commute in, and a pet unicorn.

Worst case - the software company portrays you as a hacker (in the worst connotation), accuses you and your employer of industrial espionage and violation of patient privacy, sues you and them for significant damages, encourages the Feds to look into the situation, and your career in programming takes a very messy turn into legal limbo for a few years. No unicorn, either.

tl;dr: Stop posting details. Get legal advice. Great catch. Good luck.

</comment><comment><USER3> _> Do I ever have to disclose any personal information when reporting a security flaw._

No, of course not.

And in this case, I think it would be to your detriment to reveal such information.

</comment><comment><USER4> This is exactly the reason why some choose to notify sec problems anonymously.

You may find that this comes back to bite you badly especially if they consider your communiqué to be a blackmail-ish threat, even if you did not intend it to be.

</comment><comment><AUTHOR> tl;dr: After reporting a security flaw I was pressed to divulge information that did not affect the security flaw reported. Do I, for any purpose or reason, have to give the creators of the software in question this (or any other identifying) information about myself?

Also, clickable link: <http://www.jcurcio.com/posts/obscurity-is-not- security/>

</comment><comment><USER5> Is there supposed to be a link for [1] ?

<comment><AUTHOR> Sorry, yes there was. Edited it to place it in the post.</comment></comment>


How Facebook bullied an independent developer into shutting down his viral app - <AUTHOR> http://thenextweb.com/facebook/2015/07/31/heres-how-facebook-bullied-an-independent-developer-into-shutting-down-his-viral-app/ <comment><USER2> Hardly bullied. He wrote an app in knowing violation of the terms of use and they kicked him off their platform.

Lawyers got involved and made things slightly worse.</comment>


Ask HN: Is your startup being turned around by Microsoft? - <AUTHOR>

Are you starting to consider using Microsoft tools or services as a result of their recent moves to be more focused on providing what people actually want?
Would you consider using Windows 10?
Would you consider doing open source development on Visual Studio?
Would you consider using Linux running on the Azure platform?
I'm curious (and not in any way connected with Microsoft) to know if Microsoft's efforts are working.
For me, I have bought a PC and will install Windows again for the first time in 10 years.  Maybe it will be a good experience although I'm pretty meh on the fact that the registry remains.
I'm also going to give Visual Studio a try.
I'm also definitely going to have a dig around Azure and see how it stacks up against AWS, Google and the others. <comment><USER2> AWS is the leader in Cloud Services, checkout their full portfolio against Azure and see the diference. Azure doesn't have enough IPv4 and it has been constantly been using international IPv4, since they came in late in the ball game.

Checkout Developing in Ubuntu againt developing in Windows 10 to see the difference, if you like it then try a MacOS, it's certainly the best performance and stability in any Dev's work OS.

Best of luck in Windows dough :), been there.

<comment><AUTHOR> >>checkout their full portfolio against Azure

I don't need 99% of what AWS does. The critical things needed are virtual machines, device block storage and object storage. All the rest is nice to have.

I already use a Mac and I'd rather drink motor oil than use Linux as a desktop. I do use Linux however as a server.</comment></comment>


Ask HN: How do you stop an app's email getting flagged as spam? - <AUTHOR>

Just saw Reddit's state of the servers report which included information on how sending email via Amazon EC2 causes it to get flagged as spam thanks to Trend Micro.
Regardless of whether you are using EC2 or not - how do you try to stop your app's email getting flagged as spam?
What can you do to run tests on your existing email to make sure it is getting through? <comment><USER2> Send it through AuthSMTP to avoid any EC2 related problems: <http://www.authsmtp.com/> (and set SPF correctly). It does cost money though.

You can also send an email to this address and get a report on basic spam and deliverability issues: email@example.com

</comment><comment><USER3> Checkout these two guides from MailChimp:

[http://resources.mailchimp.com/tips/email-delivery-for-it- pr...](http://resources.mailchimp.com/tips/email-delivery-for-it- professionals)

[http://resources.mailchimp.com/getting-started/how-to- avoid-...](http://resources.mailchimp.com/getting-started/how-to-avoid-spam- filters)

</comment><comment><USER4> SPF + DomainKeys

<comment><USER5> \+ ReverseDNS</comment></comment>


Ask HN: Use cases for embedding a scripting language - <AUTHOR> I've recently become interested in embedded scripting languages and their usage, but it doesn't seem very applicable in the Java services world. It seems that by allowing scripting of a platform, you lose the ability to track changes to the system (do you store user defined scripts in a DB, file system, Git?). How have you used embedded scripting languages? What benefits did it provide? What costs? <comment><USER2> I think embedding a scripting language can be very useful for allowing users of your software to write extensions/plugins. Usually they are stored on the file system, if the user wants to manage their custom extensions another with Git or something else then they are free to do so. You could also include a package manager (like Sublime Text).</comment>


US labor organization urges game developers to unionize in open letter - <AUTHOR> http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/336812/US_labor_organization_urges_game_developers_to_unionize_in_open_letter.php <comment><USER2> How does a group form an industry wide union? The level of coordination required seems very very high.</comment>


Ask HN - Where to find startup advisors / mentors? - <AUTHOR>

##TL;DR
I'm a long time programmer but a newbie entrepreneur. I'm unsure how to get started with this startup thing. Where can I find advise, advisors, mentors, references?
## The Long Story
I saw the possibility of simplifying and redoing enterprise collaboration specifically in the decision making space.
So I did the easy part.
I've put together a minimum product -- Review19.com -- which BTW got not so much traction when I shared it on a "Show HN" thread :-( Anyway, I want to now solve the next part of the puzzle.
I've done a basic market survey, I know the big guys I'm up against (the SAPs and the IBMs). I know what's good about their offerings, and what sucks.
From the team perspective, I'm the engineering / technical founder and I have marketing co-founder in the wings. While the product can be used by individual users, I fully understand the major market will be the enterprise users.
I acknowledge that a majority effort will be marketing, selling, pilot tests, gathering feedback etc. and I concede that engineering may have to play a limited role.
My next milestone is to attract some seed funding so that I can put together the team, prepare resources and reach out to potential customer. The problem?
I don't know how to go about this.
Where can I find advise, advisors, mentors or any other kind of references?
How should I go about this?
Thanks, Sri <comment><USER2> It helps if you're in a city that has a large base of startup entrepreneurs like San Francisco, Austin, Seattle, etc. If you're not, I suggest moving to one.

Check your city to see if they have any meetups (Meetup.com and Google). If you live in any of the cities that have active startup communities there are definitely meetups. Or just check if there are any upcoming networking events in the local area.

Go to the meetups and meet everyone and anyone you can. Try to make real relationships with these people. Become completely ingrained within your city's startup community.

You'll be surprised where a little bit of networking goes.

Another tip: Apply to an incubator/accelerator. If you don't think you're good enough to get into Ycombinator, then apply to the lower-tier ones. Even the worst incubators can be immensely helpful for someone who isn't plugged in to the community.</comment>


At Manhattan densities, San Francisco could house 100M people - <AUTHOR> https://boingboing.net/2017/10/24/build-housing.html <comment><USER2> I don't think people comprehend how dense Manhattan is until they have experienced it.

I find West Coast Cities to be more like a big suburb outside of Seattle and San Francisco. LA is just one smallish center city with hundreds of miles of homes. [http://i0.wp.com/metrocosm.com/wp- content/uploads/2015/09/CO...](http://i0.wp.com/metrocosm.com/wp- content/uploads/2015/09/COqUSY3UAAAbA8-.jpg)</comment>