More Americans report near-constant cannabis use - <AUTHOR> https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2018/08/americas-invisible-pot-addicts/567886/?single_page=true <comment><USER2> In the past I was addicted to pot. I was addicted in the sense that pretty much everything felt better when I was high. I was more relaxed and had less anxiety. Sex was better. Food tasted better. I was more creative. I thought about much deeper things. I spent less time online and in front of screens.

The biggest downside for me--and the reason I ended up quitting--was that my sober life just sucked in comparison. I was just waiting until the end of the day when I could go home and light up.

The other downsides were that I wasn't as sharp mentally when I was sober. I wasn't as ambitious. I was less social. In other words, it made me feel fine just hanging out in my apartment doing nothing. On the balance that made pot a negative for me.

Quitting wasn't that hard. And I still think about how great I felt when I smoked. I may smoke again in the future but for now, I appreciate operating in the real world without any crutches.

<comment><USER3> I was always curious about the mental sharpness / memory portion. I know the short-term memory impairment is well documented but in regards to mental sharpness, that's a bit more nebulous and hard to hone in on. Is there any evidence that the use of cannabis effects cognitive ability while not under the effects or "high" of the drug?

<comment><USER4> I think the worst change I made after I began regularly smoking was ceasing my regular workouts. I felt that I was making more intellectual and emotional progress with regular meditation while high than I was with my body during workouts, which I struggled with at the time for various reasons. My life has become much busier since I began smoking (much of which I positively attribute to the creativity I felt while smoking), and I haven't been able to get back into a regular workout schedule, despite not smoking often anymore. I am thinking now that the biggest detrimental impact on my memory and happiness came from losing my exercise routine more than the marijuana itself.

<comment><USER5> the pot doesn't have anything to do with you ceasing your workouts. the brasilian jiu-jitsu community has an incredible high # of regular users, while high.

<comment><USER4> It didn't make me stop exercising, no. I was dealing with some undiagnosed health issues that made my workouts exceptionally unproductive and chose to spend more time writing poetry, painting, and journaling while high instead of continuing my workouts. I felt I was making more personal progress with those than with exercise, and that being creative and productive was a better use of my time and energy.

After ending my five year exercise habit it became a lot harder to start exercising again, and brain fog and laziness began setting in. The highs also got a lot duller and less productive, and I subsequently began seeking the highs I knew from when I was in good health which led me down the wrong path for a while. I'm not blaming marijuana for this in any way, just acknowledging that I stopped exercising when I started smoking, and that some physical/mental health issues I've had since then most likely exist because I haven't been exercising.

In other words, putting psychoactive chemicals in your brain is a big deal and you should try to establish strong personal health and wellness routines before you begin doing it, and then prioritize those routines above the chemical habit.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> I have been smoking pot since I was 14 years old, I am 51 now. I would stop smoking from time to time, sometimes to prepare for football, sometimes because society wanted me too. I am not a lazy person, I smoke a sativa strain to get me motivated, it acts like a stimulant that can help me focus.. laser like focus to drown out daily distractions. I'll smoke an indica strain to sleep well at night. I have been a highly successful software developer, approaching my later days of my career. I can unequivocally tell you that pot has made a huge difference in my life. I am better on it, than when I am not. I can function perfectly, pot does not make me veg- out and I am quite active with many hobbies. Yes, I tend to be happier, more relaxed, and less stressed out when on pot... but the same is true for Prozac recipients. Am I evil and a loser because of this? F. No!

The reality is quite simple, different stains of pot affect people differently. Everyone is affected differently with only a few common effects. Pot can help some people while hindering others. I detest anybody who calls a pot head a loser because they smoke pot. It's just a bad stereotype. Contrary to what Jeff Sessions might believe, I am a good person, well respected, extremely intelligent, and a contributor to society. Most everyone who meets me or knows me wouldn't believe I smoke pot, but I smoke more than most pot heads could even imagine. Pot has been a miracle drug to me, much like Prozac is to others, without the liver damage. F those who diss pot smokers, there are many more of us than you can imagine.

<comment><USER7> This isn't directed at you but all heavy decade-plus smokers I know say similar things. This makes me wonder, if you've smoked for 30+ years with minor breaks due to football/society how do you really know what your baseline is sober for a long period of time if you started as a young adult?

<comment><USER6> I have taken many jobs where I had to stop for long periods of time so that I may pass a drug test. Do you really think that in 30 years I was never sober enough to make this determination? This attitude stems from the 'you're a pot smoker, you probably don't know what you're talking about' camp. If the subject was about the effects of tea, we wouldn't see comments like this. For the record, is a person who is on prozac sober?

<comment><USER8> A lot of people seem to be willing to kowtow to the current dogma of the medical / psychiatric community with regards to mental illnesses (depression, ADHD, etc.) Once you categorize these things as objective "chemical imbalances / medical issues", the next logical step is to treat these with "medicine", like Prozac or other SSRIs, or amphetamines in the case of ADD.

Many people don't seem to have the same respect for self medication, however. I personally think trying alternative treatment options, be it drug based or experience based, is always a better option than slavishly following your doctor who himself is often slavishly following some established medical dogma du jour or his own financial incentives. That is not to say that standard medication is not effective in some or many cases, moreso that there are very many people who think they "need their medicine" because a doctor or psychiatrist has diagnosed them with something that is at best an educated guess (with high error margin) along a multidimensional space of possible psychological profiles that we don't fully understand. My point is that by breaking down psychological issues into various abstract "disorders", it makes questioning a Prozac users choices tantamount to begrudging a diabetic for taking his insulin.

<comment><USER9> I wouldn't describe those as "slavish". Unless we're in a negative feedback loop, we should probably follow established principles and improve them constructively. I have seen some conspiracy videos where authors refer to psychiatry as an educated guess. I have never seen a lucid individual diminish science like that. Can you elaborate on what you see as "dogma" in this respect?

Disclosure: I smoke more than most.

<comment><USER10> Psychiatry is not robust. We don't know how the brain works. We're not even close to understanding how parts of the brain interact, we rely on coarse tools and irreplicable neuroscience to try to guess out the intersection of biology, chemistry, neuroscience, etc.

When we consistently see that studies are designed poorly (in many cases by selecting poor metrics, think self-assessed productivity on adderall or amortizing results of SSRIs over multiple severity levels of depression) and mechanisms are poorly understood, what do you think that it is?

Science is in many cases filled with perverse incentives that only complicate this relationship -- do you want citations, a popular publication, tenure, influence on policy decisions? Does your hypothesis align with the ideas which are popular enough to get funding?

The fact of the matter is that science is political, psychiatry is in its infancy, and results are not great in a lot of cases. We treat everything like we couldn't possibly be developing our generations' version of phrenology and it's hubris.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER11> Alternative headline: citizens of deeply broken society turn to least harmful drug available to them to dull the pain of their shitty lives.

<comment><USER12> Exactly that. I strongly believe that those who /do/ use drugs like this are self-medicating to escape the seemingly/maybe actually intractable social issues for which there is no single easy answer or method of escape.

Compared to /trying/ to get a good job somewhere and trying to find housing that isn't outrageously over-priced and trying to more or less win the lottery game that is presently life in western society... it's so much easier to "treat" the issue with a "magic pill"/bottle (or other form of ingesting the drugs).

I strongly feel that if this particular drug weren't an option they'd drink alcohol or smoke...

<comment><USER13> There is an easy answer though. You do what successful humans have done for thousands of years: \- educate yourself \- join or form a community that supports each other \- fight for your survival like every ancestor in your genetic tree did before you.

Life isn't easy. But you also aren't naturally weak. Unfortunately, once you start doing drugs, you risk corrupting the source code of the machine you rely on.

<comment><USER14> Man who has never experienced extreme poverty or the absolute depths of American society attempts to provide easy answer to something he's never been through.

<comment><USER13> I speak from experience

<comment><USER11> You are being haplessly Bayesian.

Good for you, you made it.

Go ahead and draw your statistically insignificant conclusion if you must, but keep it to yourself.

Do you also tell depressed people to just not be sad?

<comment><USER13> lol. Just to recap, my advice was:

\- dont do drugs

\- educate yourself

\- find a support group

\- fight for yourself

How is this controversial?

> _keep it to yourself_

But then who would speak out against fools like you?

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> I cannot help but think the Federal government is fully at fault for this one. So much time and effort spent to misinform, lie, and skew the truth on the consequences of cannabis (including extraordinarily disproportionate legal consequences) that the _actual_ consequences in comparison seem much more benign and subtle. Its sad that South Park had to properly describe the true negative effects of cannabis before any reputable organization would touch it.

If there is a true concern for "public safety" then the only choice is to remove it as a schedule I, educate the populace on the _true_ consequences, regulate as any other consumable substance, and provide assistance and help for those looking to quit.

</comment><comment><USER16> I think it's a mistake to legalize cannabis and continue to treat it like any other consumer product, opening the floodgates to gratuitous advertisements and dubious health claims. Instead, the sale of cannabis (and perhaps other drugs) should be treated as a public health issue, where the sale is permitted as long as it isn't advertised and proper information is given about the product.

The Netherlands partly has this system, where cannabis sale is 'tolerated' for shops with permits, and where advertisements are forbidden. The system is far from ideal, but I think better than complete (de)criminalization. Additionally, the discussion about drugs is very open thanks to a number of publicly funded organizations. They do not hesitate to also note the positive sides of certain drugs, which all the more encourages a conversation about the responsible use of drugs.

Portugal has gone even further in decriminalizing other (more addictive) substances [1] with fairly good results.

[1] [https://www.theguardian.com/news/2017/dec/05/portugals- radic...](https://www.theguardian.com/news/2017/dec/05/portugals-radical- drugs-policy-is-working-why-hasnt-the-world-copied-it)

<comment><USER17> Is advertising cannabis legal in anywhere in the US? I haven't spent much time in the states where pot is legal but I certainly haven't seen any. Contrast this to traveling in Germany where the cigarette ads shocked me as an American - it felt so backwards.

<comment><USER18> > Is advertising cannabis legal in anywhere in the US?

I see cannabis dispensery ads pretty much everywhere here in San Francisco, on Buses, bus stands, billboards, even on the taxi cab top cone thingys....

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER19> The types of problems described in the article related to near-constant cannabis use:

> Users or former users I spoke with described lost jobs, lost marriages, lost > houses, lost money, lost time. Foreclosures and divorces. Weight gain and > mental-health problems. And one other thing: the problem of convincing other > people that what they were experiencing was real. A few mentioned jokes > about Doritos, and comments implying that the real issue was that they were > lazy stoners.

With users themselves describing problems that result from smoking marijuana like impaired concentration, short-term memory, motivation, and neglecting responsibilities. These are serious pit falls of failing to moderate. But I also feel that legalizing marijuana is a better alternative than putting users in jail. Incarceration seems like it would cause a lot of the problems described by marijuana users (lost jobs, lost marriages, lost houses, lost money, lost time).

</comment><comment><USER20> For those seeking the anti-anxiety benefits of a daily dose of high grade medicinal cannabis without the cognitive impairment associated with THC (notably impairment of short term memory, which is crucial for maintaining flow state while doing complex tasks like coding or chess) - may I recommend looking into high CBD, low THC flower.

You want THC <1% and CBD > 10%. I recently switched over to a high CBD strain and it has been a godsend for productivity. Another nice benefit of minimizing daily THC intake is I have started dreaming and remembering dreams again. THC tends to suppress dreaming activity.

In the Bay Area, you can find high CBD flower at most reputable dispensaries. I've tried a few products and the best one by far I've experienced is a strain called C3P0, sold under the Marley Naturals Red/Jellyfish brand.

(Shameless plug notwithstanding, I'm not affiliated with that brand in any way, just a very happy customer wanting to share a quality product with others who might appreciate it)

<comment><USER21> > Another nice benefit of minimizing daily THC intake is I have started > dreaming and remembering dreams again. THC tends to suppress dreaming > activity.

I had the same experience with increased dreams but they were just all anxiety dreams for a month or so, it was very unpleasant.

<comment><USER22> I took a 2.5 week break about a month or more ago after 3 years of continuous use, and my dreams are WILD in a good way.

<comment><USER20> I've also experienced this. Intense dreams are a common withdrawal symptom, apparently.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER23> I recall last year, I spent every evening eating something like 10mg - 30mg. It was awesome at night to sit down, eat a little bit of cannabutter and finally sleep.

I've had constant insomnia since I was probably 8. I only sleep 4 - 5 hours a night. I feel rested typically and energetic mentally, but physically it would flair up my allergies, eczema, etc. When I moved to california, it was the first time in my life I consistently was getting 6 - 8 hours of sleep.

During that time, I held a full-time job, was promoted to tech lead, delivered a major project, and was working on a side business. I honestly think it helped me achieve those things to the extent it helped me sleep.

Then this year I moved to a new state (where it isn't legal). I stopped smoking without any side effects, had a kid, and now I am sleeping 4 - 6 hours again. Allergies are bad, eczema, etc. and I'd love to start smoking or eating it again; as it definitely helped. However, here we are where it's not legal, and I'm trying to abide by the societal rules (even if I disagree).

Often, society doesn't really know what's best.

<comment><USER24> Honestly, try CBD pills. They have done wonders for my anxiety and you can order them online since they are made from Hemp. There is a sub reddit with lots of helpful information on Vendors.

</comment></comment><comment><USER25> When things got stressful at work I started smoking cannabis daily. It was really detrimental to my overall productivity. It was great for the stress, and made me feel wonderful, but it's severely dulled the sharp edges of my mind.

<comment><USER26> When things got stressful at work I started smoking cannabis occasionally. It was really helpful to my overall mental well-being. It was great for stress, and made me feel wonderful, and it severely enhanced the creative part of my mind.

<comment><USER27> You realise this type of parroting only works for logical arguments right? It's pretty pointless to flip the meaning of everything in an anecdote, you can't refute an anecdote by disproving it logically.

<comment><USER28> When things got stressful at college, I started smoking cannabis occasionally. It was really liberating to my overall mental well-being. It was great for stress, and made me feel wonderful, and it severely dulled the anxiety I felt in creatively expressing large technical concepts - both in class assignments and at a college job.

Then I went to the mall high with a sober friend - and had to keep him from getting distracted in stores and keep him on track to buy the item we needed. That's when I realized I was High-functioning. (True stories.)

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER29> I'll take these "findings" seriously when they show that pot smokers are getting divorced and fired at statistically significantly greater rates than the general population. In a country where a huge percentage of marriages end in divorce and many fields are grinds with high turnover, it's naive to just nod our heads and accept self reports of "ruined marriages" at face value.

In our highly regimented, low paid holiday, socially isolated, pedestrian hostile society, doesn't every leisurely outlet result in a fairly large percentage of heavy/habitual users? And yet some will never stop looking for a convenient bogeyman to pin all of our ills on, whether it's addictive videogames or internet porn or pinball machines or weed.

<comment><USER30> Isn't it still a problem if people identify as users with a problem, users who would like to quit but struggle to do so? I believe it's the same with video games or porn or other "non-toxic" addictions. Even if it's healthy and useful for some, and not dangerous to anyone, if it's a negative habit that's hard to shake, public health should pay attention and study, and perhaps employ a policy nudge.

<comment><USER31> A personality type exists that can be addicted to literally anything. I have this type. It feels like an OCD and is triggered by high stress. My theory is that for some people, it will manifest as pharmaceutical addiction, others sex or videogame addiction. This doesn't imply that sex, drugs, or videogames are bad.

<comment><USER32> Is this personality / propensity towards addiction well studied enough that you can test for it, or are you just relying on your previous experiences? Previous experiences would suggest that I have this but I'd be interested in a test or DSM-like diagnostic assessment

<comment><USER31> Anecdotal. History of alcoholism and other fun stuff in the family, so maybe I'm trying to gussy up the truth.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER33> I use marijuana every single day, either via a vape pen, a dab pen, or drinking it. I don't really count topical use but you can if you like.

Something I see many people fall into is expecting the high to be something, or, to do something for them. This expectation will lead to resentment and feeling let down by the high (possibly much worse when you go seeking a "stronger" high) when the user really went in with no intention in mind. With no intention in mind you will end up doing nothing, much like having no intention in mind and going into a social network only to emerge 2 hours later not feeling satisfied.

Unlike several of the comments here I found that I was more social, more active, and more willing to take risks in all aspects of life than I would when I was sober. It has led to a sustained and growing yoga practice, which also led to something of a "spiritual" side I had never noticed. Projects I had dropped over the years have been picked up and completed without the fear or failure or ridicule that comes from an incredibly high anxiety while sober.

</comment><comment><USER34> Why can't they be drunk all the time like normal people?

Or constantly drink coffee, or smoke tobacco, or chew tobacco.

<comment><USER35> Is this sarcasm? I sure hope so...

</comment></comment><comment><USER36> I knew a lot of people that were addicted to weed because they were bored without it and because their social lives are completely dependant on smoking weed -- without weed they would just sit awkwardly. Some of them went more than a decade like this and didn't develop many important areas of their mind because of it.

</comment><comment><USER37> Posting with a throwaway for obvious reasons.

I started smoking weed in College. Since then, I've developed a habit of smoking almost daily. Not all day, but usually a few tokes from a vape at the end of the night.

When people ask, I usually reflect that weed has been a very positive addition in my life.

I became VP of Eng. for a well known software company within 3 years of graduating. We did a lot of things right and the company eventually exited with unicorn status. I then left, bootstrapped my own startup w/ a small team, and after 2 years were acquired by a major software company which cemented financial independence. These days, I spent most of my time doing advisory/consulting/investing roles.

I achieved all of this within 10 years after graduating, AND essentially consuming weed daily(usually took breaks when traveling, etc.).

For me, it helps with relaxing as well as creative thinking. The way I describe it is that it removes mental filters and allows you to appreciate something in a new way (that "mind blown" feeling). Sometimes the insights can be superficial, but sometimes they are not.

Nowadays, I am generally pretty open about my use when people ask. What I've found is that it is a lot more common then I used to think. So many founders, executives and otherwise "smart" people use it frequently for mostly the same reasons. I'd have never guessed.

For anyone who might be interested, I'd suggest reading Carl Sagan's essay on it in which he talks about his experiences and insights while high. He actually wrote it under a pseudonym (Mr. X) but revealed his identity through a friend after he passed. [http://marijuana-uses.com/mr-x/](http://marijuana- uses.com/mr-x/)

This is also just my own opinion - but from my own experience what I've found is that people tend to want to blame someone (or something) else for their problems in life. And generally, marijuana is a pretty good scapegoat to point a finger at.

<comment><USER38> > Posting with a throwaway for obvious reasons.

Not obvious to me at all. Weed is already legal in several states in the US; weed use is far from taboo on HN; you have FU money. So why the throwaway? (Of course you have right to your privacy, I just wonder what are the "obvious" reasons ...)

</comment></comment><comment><USER39> If you manage to utilize cannabis to enhance your life, hats off to you. We can all admit to pursuing that, regardless of the substance of choice (mine being coffee and occasionally, nicotine). That being said, while cannabis use is more or less one of the safer addictions a person can develop, I think it is important to note its potential as a 'reverse gateway' drug. It normalizes smoking and has been found to increase the risk of future nicotine dependency in young adults who had not been exposed to either beforehand. [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16185213](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16185213) Contradictory to this, some people claim that cannabis has helped them quit nicotine by providing a somewhat safer alternative. The studies investigating this are mostly looking into the motives for smoking cigarettes and pot. A friend of mine has been smoking cigarettes for over a decade and has been slowly replacing the tobacco with weed, now only smoking joints rather than spliffs.

</comment><comment><USER40> I don't like that the article conflates "nearly daily" use with "constant" use.

I'm not endorsing "nearly daily" use, but there is a huge difference between someone getting high several times a week in the evening after a full day sober and someone spending all of their waking life high.

</comment><comment><USER41> After legalizing it in Vegas I've noticed a constant lingering smell from a couple neighbors in my neighborhood. Its gotten to the point where its getting to be annoying cause most of them don't want to make their own house smell bad so they smoke outside. I'm for pot legalization and thought it was a fair idea, but like with regular smoking if your doing it within 20 ft of someone who's not and doesn't want to smell your acrid smoke your just being an asshole.Kids don't want to swim cause it smells gross outside all the time. I can't even grill in my backyard anymore cause the smoke from my bbq mixes with the pot smoke and just ruins it.

<comment><USER42> I wonder if your neighbours think the same about your grilling habits? ;-)

</comment></comment><comment><USER43> I've been a pretty consistent pot smoker since 2014-15, which was when Oregon legalized it. Prices have dropped considerably so it's not uncommon to get a pre-roll of pretty strong stuff (20+ % THC) for $5. I have not noticed any health effects although I have built up a slight tolerance. Using a vape pen got me the biggest high but I decided to get rid of it.

I find that when I'm high I can really think deeply about things, smoking once in a while kinds of recharges my mental state. More than once I've realized "Damn, I'm human, I can do whatever I want.. that's kind of crazy". Seems kind of loosey goosey but its a cool feeling.

</comment><comment><USER44> I know people that have kicked opiates and tobacco cold turkey - but who could not give up using cannabis if their lives depended on it. This is a legitimate concern in the current tide of de-criminalization / legalization.

<comment><USER45> That's more than a little bit anecdotal, physical and psychological dependence on cannabis ranks well below opiates, tobacco, even alcohol. Not to mention the fact that people's lives literally do depend on quitting opiates and tobacco, while cannabis not at all.

<comment><USER44> Totally anecdotal. My point is that I think that addiction in general runs deeper than we currently understand and that we shouldn't underestimate the potential for people to become dependent on something newly available just because it is broadly conceived as harmless.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER25> IMO: Cannabis rewards you for doing nothing.

<comment><USER46> I don't understand this. Me and everyone I know that smoke pot regularly don't sit around doing nothing. The people I know who do nothing don't smoke pot. They finish their days and sit around in front of the TV drinking booze until they passout. Or wake up when they don't work and start drinking.

The people I know who regularly smoke pot are motivated, usually have good jobs or run successful businesses, have hobbies and good social lives that don't revolve around smoking pot.

Don't get me wrong I've certainly met the 'lazy unmotivated stoner' types. But at least in my experience, those tend to be more rare than the 'smokes weed and does pretty well at life' people.

I smoke a lot of weed regularly and have no problem maintaining a job I work six days a week, several productive hobbies, a long term relationship, and friendships even with people that don't smoke weed or who are even opposed to it. Honestly, if you met me and you don't smoke weed there's a good chance you'd never know. I don't talk about it with people that aren't interested, I don't sit around smoking in public, I don't go around wearing or buying weed leaf clothes and paraphernalia and things like that. I've surprised more than one person when they find out I smoke weed after knowing me for a long time.

<comment><USER35> But do you smoke very day? Do you look forward to pot more than anything else? If not, then good for you! Like alcohol, some people take weed to extremes, and others are able to drink one glass every now and again without going overboard.

<comment><USER46> I do smoke weed every day. I don't necessarily wake up in the morning and look forward to only that. Ya if I finish work after a hard stressful day sometimes I do look forward to it. But, I look forward to getting home, showering and eating dinner too. If I'm busy doing things where I can't I don't really mind and I don't really think about it or anything.

I would say my usage would qualify as habitual but in the end if I can't get some weed or smoke or whatever in a day or for a bit it's all good. Ya I know I rely on it for stress relief, helping with sleep and I honestly just find it enjoyable. I mean I also rely on coffee to wake me up in the morning, food and water to survive and generally many other things that either make my life better or act as a crutch.

But in the end, compared to other crutches people rely on, the impact of weed in my life is fairly minimal.

I know a guy last year who was addicted to coke who's mom ended up dying in the night because instead of taking her to the hospital when she asked him he wanted to get high and jerk off.

I've got a 25 year old cousin with pancreatitis because of his alcohol problem.

My brother's just finished rehab for his drinking.

I have a friend who came close to death last year.because.of her coke and crack addiction and basically fucked her life. She lost her job, her home for a while, didn't see her kid for months and it basically took ending up in the hospital for close to the tenth time last year, near death with the threat of permanently losing custody of her kid to finally quit after years.

I've got another friend who was recently prescribed seroquil and a couple anti-depressants for his anxiety over maybe one day having thoughts about walking into traffic. Last time I seen him he was bragging about the thousands of dollars he was making by double or triple depositing his disability cheques into multiple banks, both his short and long term memory seemed totally messed up he couldn't keep the flow of a conversation, had no idea what had happened only 10-15 minutes previous and he stayed at my house and spent all night awake staring at a wall hallucinating that he'd been watching tron 2 all night. When I got up the TV was off, the internet had been unplugged sometime hours before and he didn't have the TV remote. He had a job interview that day he did not make it to.

I dunno i've seen a lot of people abuse substances or even just need something to get by. In the course of my life, pot is pretty much the most harmless thing i've seen. I've watched people going crazy over lack of coffee, cigarettes and booze plenty. Never once seen someone doing that over weed.

<comment><USER47> i don't mean to condescend (i smoke weed often myself), but please be careful when you compare your habit to others'. if you know a lot of unhealthy people, it can be hard to recognize your own issues.

<comment><USER24> I don't mean to condescend, but I would be careful about making assumptions about other people's health, or your understanding of it unless you are willing to list some kind of qualifications that enable you to make that judgement.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER48> It was strange how the article kept talking about the downsides, and the downsides were just anecdotes, and nothing else. Did I miss something in the article, or was I just supposed to know the downsides before I read this? Risks like "budtenders providing medical advice" have zero to do with near- constant cannabis use.

<comment><USER15> I get that the article is supposed to be a counter-point to the rapid legalization, but you are absolutely right.

Being almost impossible to overdose on means they can't use scary death statistics, and it might be too early to have any meaningful studies done on productivity/motivation/etc. That being said, this article is really as useful as your anti-cannabis family member at Thanksgiving telling you stories about the consequences of cannabis.

</comment></comment><comment><USER49> I have been smoking marijuana for just over a decade straight (about 2/5 of my life), withholding various times of abstinence due to lack of access or finances, looking for a new job, or trying to lower my tolerance. I grew up in a very poor and dysfunctional household, and narrowly managed to a) get into college, b) successfully pursue a STEM degree, and c) find a job that's well above anything the rest of my family has done.

AMA, if you'd like.

<comment><USER50> Sure!

Why smoke, with the known health impact? Why not edibles? They last a lot longer, and it doesn't harm your lungs.

<comment><USER49> > Why smoke, with the known health impact? Why not edibles? They last a lot > longer, and it doesn't harm your lungs.

I'm aware of a handful of reasonable significant health impacts due to smoking, and as you say, the harm against the lungs is something I'm concerned about, along with the harm against my teeth/gums.

I've recently (last few weeks) decided to cut back on smoking flower, in favor of using an oil pen. It's still not ideal, but I believe it will help in this regard.

I actually don't really like edibles, to be honest. The potency is too unpredictable for me, and they last way too long. At the same time, the come- up takes longer than I like to wait for the effects. I'd appreciate an edible more if there was an extended period of time that I was intending on being high, but my life isn't usually that available. At the same time, edibles are much more difficult to come by, and also more expensive. Also, it's difficult finding an edible that isn't produced with something highly suggary/fatty, of which I don't usually eat.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER51> Prozac and related make me violent, and it's been prescribed to me.

Claritin-D might as well be Meth to me, but it's the only thing that clears my sinuses. This is OTC.

I live in a legal state. I vape a heavy indica strain near nightly, and a gram lasts me almost two months. I'm a one-hitter, MAYBE two if it's a weekend evening. ALL this does is keep me from aching (52, athletics and a few car crashes have me a mess of broken bones and torn stuff), and allow me to sleep better.

I was the most anti-weed person ever when in my teens and 20s, I destroyed several relationships because of it. Decades of traditional painkillers, and current doctors who want me on opiods gave me the idea. Why not? The last three years I've felt better than any time in the past 20.

</comment><comment><USER52> I think when it comes to marijuana there is a real difference between using it every day and being truly addicted.

I think the difference comes down to if you use it as medicine and thus medicate each and every day or if you use it as a drug and just want to get high and party every day.

In any way - there is no use of punishing addicts, and even less use in preventing people from medicating - legalize!

</comment><comment><USER53> Has anyone else taken notes while they were high?

I started taking notes when smoking around 10 years ago and it's probably the single thing that's most dramatically increased my intellectual development. The simple act of writing down my ideas helped solidify them and turned them into a foundation for future evolution of the idea. I now have 5500 notes on my computer and 2000 on my phone and you could effectively trace my intellectual history with them.

Just curious if other people have similar success with smoking weed and taking notes?

<comment><USER54> You're in good company.

[http://marijuana-uses.com/mr-x/](http://marijuana-uses.com/mr-x/)

<comment><USER53> wow, thanks for the link! Found this incredible quote from Carl Sagan that describes it perfectly:

> "There is a myth about such highs: the user has an illusion of great > insight, but it does not survive scrutiny in the morning. I am convinced > that this is an error, and that the devastating insights achieved when high > are real insights; the main problem is putting these insights in a form > acceptable to the quite different self that we are when we're down the next > day. Some of the hardest work I've ever done has been to put such insights > down on tape or in writing. The problem is that ten even more interesting > ideas or images have to be lost in the effort of recording one. It is easy > to understand why someone might think it's a waste of effort going to all > that trouble to set the thought down, a kind of intrusion of the Protestant > Ethic. But since I live almost all my life down I've made the effort – > successfully, I think. Incidentally, I find that reasonably good insights > can be remembered the next day, but only if some effort has been made to set > them down another way. If I write the insight down or tell it to someone, > then I can remember it with no assistance the following morning; but if I > merely say to myself that I must make an effort to remember, I never do."

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER55> Soma is a key component in keeping people happy when they shouldn't be.

<comment><USER56> soma ?

<comment><USER57> It's a Brave New World (by Aldous Huxley) reference. It's worth reading if you haven't.

EDIT: In the book Huxley imagines a new society. One of the hallmarks of the society is there is no pain or suffering. This is accomplished in part by Soma, a fictional drug perhaps best described as a no negative side effect tranquilizer or opiate.

EDIT EDIT: The society also removes almost all major sources of pain. A person is chemically engineered (was written before the discovery of DNA) to be happy with their job and position in life since conception. There are no parents. There is sex but no romantic love. In avoiding pain almost all the happiness in the society is superficial, coming from sex, drugs and movies. They might be happy, in the most shallow meaning of the word, but there is clearly no joy.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER58> Best quote in the story: "Nine percent of anybody will do something stupid."

</comment><comment><USER59> This is probably overall a healthy counter reaction to the counter reaction to the ridiculous decades-long federal position on the stuff. Marijuana is an intoxicant of sorts, although I use the word loosely here, not the cure for all ills. Like the other primary intoxicant it can sometimes have health and wellness benefits, but it is also easily abused. Like anything that changes your mental state in a way that you find pleasurable it can easily become a psychological dependence, whether or not it's physically addictive. Back in the day, when my friends and I discussed the possibility of marijuana legalization (and this was the 70's when it was not at all possible) the concept in our minds involved treating it like liquor: something adults have the right to enjoy, but which is treated with cautious suspicion and care by society at large. I still think that's where we'll end up, and it's been somewhat fascinating to watch the whole system trying to digest this change.

</comment><comment><USER60> I know three people from a previous job that was stressful, boring and mechanical. They are all from great schools, in good health and well paid. They smoke regularly and I've known them for at least 4-7 years now. Initially, they treated it as a ritual of sorts, but ever since vapes become a thing, I think they've become extremely addicted to it. It seems to me like they plan their day around smoking pot now. Everything they read and share on social media is also only about pot. On multiple occasions i've noticed they tell me the same story over n over. It's a bit worrisome to see this.

I also have a neighbor who's 20 something and used to be in the army 4 years ago. He's been smoking regularly for medical reasons. He's completely different and actually seems more focused than my bored friends.

</comment><comment><USER61> The number of users reporting regular use doesn't necessarily mean more people are using

I feel much more comfortable talking about useage now that it's legal & more socially accepted, but legality did not influence the frequency of useage for me or the friends i knew who smoke weed

</comment><comment><USER62> Rather than criminalizing a _relatively_ harmless substance, the US should look into treating marijuana like alcohol. Carefully regulated quality for the stuff in stores; home brew is your problem and your friends' problem.

WA has this song and dance to buy legal pot and heavily regulates the entire sector with taxes on top: that should be substantially simplified, in my opinion.

Medical research _should_ be freely doable without any more grief than other substances.

I have rather the same opinion about other, less harmful, drugs (MDMA, LSD, etc). The paranoia from the 70s and 80s hasn't done much for us - the drugs are still with us, and prohibition has produced enormous violence and organized crime. Time to practically equate these drugs with alcohol.

</comment><comment><USER9> I find a little pot "here and there" is great, but I've seen horrific results of near-constant use. Strains differ in effect, and being hooked on smoking weed instead of aiming for a desired outcome can get the majority of people in a tight spot. It doesn't help that cannabis comes in so many different flavours, particularly where it's is illegal, and any kind of weed will do. While last week's package made everything click, next week's shipment can help a person end up neglecting their self-interests.

</comment><comment><USER63> I've tried pot a few times and my subjective experience was vastly different from all the comments here. It must affect people very differently, because I couldn't fathom being high "near constantly". I had trouble doing basic things like remembering to keep chewing the snack that I was eating or keeping track of the sentence I was in the process of speaking.

Each time I come away thinking, "well, that was an awful experience". I've thought I was getting too high, but I've either under shot and felt nothing, or had the same high experience, never managing to just "be relaxed" or "think more deeply" or be "more creative" or all these things in the comments here. I'm not sure there _is_ such a state for me on marijuana, so I just don't try anymore.

I've always felt a little duped by the pro-pot messaging I hear, which makes it sound like no big deal and tons safer and better than, say, alcohol or cigarettes. Alcohol impairs me with a noticeable dose effect, so it's fairly easy to moderate, and the _way_ it impairs me kind of twists or stretches my reality, while I haven't noticed a dose effect with marijuana and it just utterly breaks my reality.

<comment><USER22> You eventually learn how to control and mold your high, how to be productive and creative on it, and live a normal life. You need to experiment with what your dose should be and how it effects you, and then you have a baseline. If you're forgetting how to chew and 'breaking your reality', you're getting way too high. I always recommend beginners start with a cannabis vaporizer and stay under 370F/188C.

It's not for everyone though, and that's perfectly fine.

</comment></comment><comment><USER64> Overdosing on marijuana was probably the worst thing I've ever experienced in my life. Certainly by far the worst experience I've ever had on a recreational drug.

People always frame the discussion of drug overdoses around lethality, and on that scale marijuana compares very favorably to every other drug, and advocates tend to end the discussion there.

But on the scale of how horrific the experience is as the person overdosing, I don't think there's anything worse than marijuana. A large overdose on marijuana causes an absolutely torturous and sanity-questioning 12-hour episode where you feel like your insides are dying and like your brain's basic function has been impaired on a fundamental level, and those 12 hours feel like 3 days and it feels like it's never going to end.

It's like Being John Malkovich, but you've transported into the brain of a severely afflicted mental patient.

Enjoy your marijuana and all, but this current popular narrative that it's like skittles or something is taking things a little too far. It's safe in moderation, but it's also true that using it to excess is mentally and socially harmful and you can have a truly horrific time on it.

<comment><USER65> Dude. What? The worst case I've had to assist was a couple that ate a huge space cake (oblivious to its cannabis content) and, even if they got high by mistake (which is the worst case of bad trip) it was nowhere near close to your experience. Lots of fainting involved, but not much John Malkovich. And it didn't last 12h.

How much did you eat/smoke? Maybe you're especially sensitive to cannabis? (Genuinely curious here, not trying to discredit your story).

Your case sounds closer to a panic attack than cannabis overdose. Maybe the bad trip triggered a panic attack, which in turn fed the bad trip back.

> But on the scale of how horrific the experience is as the person overdosing, > I don't think there's anything worse than marijuana.

Psylocibin bad trips beg to disagree. Or any psychedelic, for that matter.

<comment><USER64> > How much did you eat/smoke? Maybe you're especially sensitive to cannabis? > (Genuinely curious here, not trying to discredit your story).

Yeah of course, no worries.

It wasn't with edibles, it was smoking. I was doing a form of inhaling that I've never done before, where I exhale very deeply until my lungs are completely empty, and then do a deep inhale. I repeated that many times.

This was about the third time I smoked, and I was doing that because I hadn't really felt much of an effect the first two times, so I was trying to correct that. I guess I overcompensated.

It was absolutely horrific. One thing I remember is I started having really intense auditory pseudohallucinations that kept repeating themselves over and over again. And I kept compulsively repeating them myself in my head over and over again. And I couldn't make either of those things stop no matter how hard I tried. They weren't words, they were just a bunch of different noises stacked on top of each other, like how playing 10 songs at the same time it just gets very noisy, and you can listen to 1 of the songs but only if you focus on it and ignore the other 9. But I wasn't hearing songs, just stacked noises like a glass breaking or a videogame sound or a car horn or a chair sliding etc.

Ten of those sounds all stacked on top of each other, rhythmically like a beat, while feeling an unwavering compulsion to reproduce the sound with my voice in my own head, over and over again for hours, wanting to stop and sleep the entire time and being completely unable to.

I felt like I was descending into psychosis or becoming schizophrenic like Howard Hughes.

And yeah I do tend to be more sensitive to alcohol/drugs than others. My doctors have said so with prescription doses, and I always feel tipsy halfway through my first drink.

I've used it a little bit since and not had the same problem (though at much lower doses of course). Mostly though I don't do anything, other than maybe one drink if I'm around other people who happen to be drinking.

And yeah I imagine bad trips on psychedelics have much more potential to be horrible. I've never done one though.

<comment><USER65> Amazing (and terrifying at the same time).

That sounds an awful lot like a bad trip on psychedelics. Never had one, but the sound stacking seems to be a common occurrence (along with time dilation/loops, feeling of uncontrollable descent into psychosis, etc.)

Glad you survived the experience with no long-term damage. Sounds scary.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER66> The few times I've tried it I experienced paranoia lasting several hours, and when I became aware of it I additionally experienced anxiety because I couldn't tell whether I was voicing these thoughts about people around me or keeping them inside my mind. I would then proceed to develop violent scenarios in which I had to attack and fight the people who were making me feel paranoid; the anxiety increased because I suspected they could hear me muttering such thoughts, so I was trying to clamp my mouth shut, deliberately painfully so I could remain aware of it being shut. Last time, I thought I was being very clever and quick to see all these paranoid connections, but when I happened to pay attention to a clock I realized that each sentence/proposition took me about 2 minutes to "think", examine word by word, and self-approvingly re-think.

Further, when someone was speaking near me or to me, I felt that I could catch at best one word per sentence; relatedly, their motions appeared disjointed, jumping from position to position in space, a hand would be open then closed without intermediary steps.

So, no thanks.

</comment><comment><USER67> The title is clickbait bullshit. Here's the money quote:

> Public-health experts worry about the increasingly potent options available, > and the striking number of constant users. "Cannabis is potentially a real > public-health problem," said Mark A. R. Kleiman, a professor of public > policy at New York University. "It wasn't obvious to me 25 years ago, when 9 > percent of self-reported cannabis users over the last month reported daily > or near-daily use. I always was prepared to say, 'No, it's not a very > abusable drug. Nine percent of anybody will do something stupid.' But that > number is now [something like] 40 percent."

I mean, "daily" is not "constant". And the quote only claims "daily or near- daily use". I have, on occasion in Mexico or Amsterdam, smoked constantly, except while asleep. And that's a very different trip than a few hits before sex and sleep.

And perhaps worse, there's not much to the article than anecdotes, which have obviously been selected for negative experiences.

</comment><comment><USER68> Surprised I haven't seen this yet, so I'll leave my experience.

Daily (ab)user for ~4 years. No (observed) adverse mental, social effects.

Yesterday was 1 month clean, and I quit for mainly 1 reason: my mucus buildup was becoming near unbearable. I'd wake up every single morning and pretty much vomit straight mucus first thing after getting out of bed. When I would smoke, it would clear the mucus right out (by blowing my nose, etc), but it's almost like mucus drained down my throat while I was sleeping and would fill my stomach to the point of becoming sick in the morning.

Within 2 weeks of quitting the mucus issue was completely gone and my body back to normal - no more morning vomiting.

I have had other friends mention intensified mucus building from smoking cannabis, but it is not discussed often. Wondering if others have experienced something similar.

Anyways I much prefer cannabis to alcohol for evening relaxation, so my goal is to quit a bit longer and then form a more healthy, casual relationship with weed as I have with drinking.

<comment><USER69> I concur, and had almost this exact same problem. I'd be congested all the time and it caused me a lot of problems. Out of curiosity, have you ever tried edibles instead of smoking? That solved my mucus issue almost instantly.

<comment><USER68> Definitely, I figure the mucus issue had less to do with cannabis itself and more to do with smoking/inhaling/etc and the throat lining itself in a defensive response to the heat.

My personal issue w/ edibles is that I was unable to control dosage, timing, level of my high as well as w/ smoking in my experience. To get to a level of satisfactory stoned, I would have to ingest 75-100mg of THC at one time, but then that is lasting several hours, coming in waves, etc.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER70> Slightly off topic: Do cannabis have any significant advantage to health?

<comment><USER71> There have been very positive studies regarding cannabis use to treat epilepsy.[1][2]

[1] [https://www.newscientist.com/article/2172683-first- cannabis-...](https://www.newscientist.com/article/2172683-first-cannabis- based-drug-approved-in-the-us-to-treat-epilepsy/)

[2] [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4157067/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4157067/)

<comment><USER72> It turns out these are basically the only conditions for which medicinal use is roundly supported by the data. Everything else is basically "Well, weed makes lots of people feel good, couldn't hurt to use it for [pain/nausea/anxiety/whatedver]."

<comment><USER73> True as it is, the limited data is mostly due to criminalization in the US preventing comprehensive analysis. This is especially true for the less severe conditions (of which you mentioned several) where well studied alternative remedies are effective and plentiful. The severity of suffering assosiated with epilepsy, the limited effectiveness and heavy side effects of previously available treatments and the peculiar effectiveness of cannibus eventually resulted in conscientious objection and civil disobedience which resulted in much more of that data becoming available.

I'm not disagreeing, just noting that opium made lots of people feel good long before the why was well understood (and well capitalized...). I look forward to reading more about it years from now, once we get past the Rumspringa phase of gummy bear concentrates at the gas station and drizzled over you're starbucks latte :-<

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER74> I think the headline should probably read "More Americans admit near-constant cannabis use"

</comment><comment><USER75> I think a lot of people get too heavy into cannabis when they first start. I did. It took me a while of over indulging to look at my life and realize that there are lot's of things I wanted to be doing and accomplishing that I wasnt because I was spending too much time high on my sofa watching TV. I'm sure there are people who can be productive on weed but I am certainly not one of them.

I still use cannabis but I treat it like alcohol and only indulge once or twice a week. It's really helped a lot with my motivation and getting rid of the, "mental fog" that I felt.

</comment><comment><USER76> Great article. I've struggled with the good vs. bad when it comes to cannabis.

I'm usually wildly productive, I'll clean my entire house and get a bunch of other things done when I smoke cannabis. I'm much more balanced and my wife says I'm friendlier and more considerate. Otherwise, I tend to have a negative outlook on things and am apt to have emotional outbursts such as anger. I don't know. I want it to be the miracle drug so I hate to think of it in a negative light even though I am a firm believer in scientific findings and would be disappointed if it were anything less.

</comment><comment><USER77> Is there anyone else here for whom cannabis does zilch? I have tried smoking pot on two different occasions and it did not have any effect on me aside from disgusting smell. To answer usual questions: it was real pot - everyone else was high as a kite, and I followed the advice on proper inhaling technique.

Similar things with opioids. I have been prescribed percocet and hydromorphone for strong (but non-chronic) pain. Pills took away the pain, but I never got a sense of high or euphoria that would make me want to take them again.

Alcohol works just fine though.

<comment><USER78> Usually it's temporary to a users first few times. Very common. Keep taking a few hits on different occasions. If you don't feel anything past the 8th attempt I would be very surprised.

</comment></comment><comment><USER79> Article mentions the availability of more potent strains. What people fail to realize is that skunk has more THC than CBD, and the ratio is way out of whack. If more people chose hash there would be less mental health issues as CBD is a known, well researched anti-psychotic, and counteracts the often frenzied high of skunk (or the leafy high-potency plant material known as skunk).

The hashish high is very different, as the CBD gives you a body high and as I said, can ease the nerves and frenzied energy of a skunk high.

</comment><comment><USER80> Been hit on the freeway on my motercycle and was a long time smoker before.

Legitimately wake up with pain, especially now that I've had to stop for a job..

Just my anecdote.. as other people has said i am less social but that also lets me be less distracted feeling like I'm not missing out.

Tomuch and obviously you can get distracted etc

</comment><comment><USER81> Everything we consume, we need to consume in moderation. Just like other foods if you can control your self and not be carried away by anything you can feel happiness. We shouldnt blame some of our problems on pot. But pot makes us become aware of our problem.

</comment><comment><USER82> Here is my take on cannabis. I live in a state that is still under prohibition. I mostly stopped smoking cannabis after I got out of college in the early 2000s. I would occasionally smoke here and there, but I didn't really know anyone who sold it and wasn't interested in finding a weed house to risk arrest. I have social anxiety, and general anxiety at night where I cannot shut my mind off. Normally I can control this with exercise, and occasional alcohol or melatonin use. Ive tried other things like ambien, lunesta, or ativan for severe bouts. I don't really like benzos, and I feel groggy and pushed towards depression when I take them.

Then I went to colorado this summer. I went to a dispensary, and I told them what is going on with me and they suggested a few things.(and I also learned a few things) I initially thought that I needed a strain of indica to make me sleep and calm my mind. I found that to be a bad call and it really made me go into a nasty head trip where I would analyze every bad decision Ive made in my life in great detail, then get a mild panic attack. I adjusted dose and it still made me feel that way, or didn't have enough of an affect to help.

I tried a hybrid strain of sativa/indica and found that a bit better, but the indica high is not fun for me. soooo.

I know sativa is the "wide awake and nootropic" high, but for me, it works perfectly. I can dose to ~2 hits from a vape pen and Im in the perfect mental state to sleep. I don't feel hung over or groggy. I sleep better and wake up refreshed.

As for motivation and pot. Im sure my experience is somewhat personal to me, but If you want to be unmotivated and lazy, pot can help you get there. However, if you just want to take the edge off, and still go about your business pot can facilitate that as long as you manage your dosage and strain.

I almost hate to invoke the name of Joe Rogan, but I think he has it about right when he says that its a problem of discipline. I think cannabis is unique (compared to benzo, opiates, and some other drugs at least) in this area because there is not a huge physical addiction with cannabis. This really puts the problem squarely on your mental state. If you are smoking pot every day, and not accomplishing much, you're probably depressed or want to be in that state.

That said, its not a magic bullet drug, and I don't advocate for everyone to consume cannabis all the time. I also would like to advise caution to those new to or long removed from cannabis. These crazy weed scientists have made it crazy potent. MIND YOUR DOSAGE!

</comment><comment><USER83> The new business model of the big tobacco and a ground breaking solution to poverty and unemployment, the handicapped junkie citizen willing to throw away liberty for pot or smokes. I smell a new Nobel in economics.

<comment><USER84> Pretty soon we'll get a Jule (sounds like jewel, not sure on spelling) combined with weed and we can get the handicapped junkie citizen on pot AND smokes.

<comment><USER85> PAX (maker of the juul) already makes the Era line of pods for weed, too late.

</comment></comment></comment><comment> ephemeral-999 As someone who doesn't like smoking but would like to try pot, is the end effect of smoking pot the same as eating pot cookies? I dont seen cookies mentioned any of the comments so far. Why is that?

<comment><USER78> End result can be very different. I feel many more people have bad experiences with edibles. Recommend smoking or vaping

</comment></comment><comment><USER86> As someone who is running a cannabis company [1], this is concerning, but it ignores the fact that a majority of the members we service (we operate like Costco with a membership model) are in severe chronic pain. They use it as an alternative to opioids and that cannot be overlooked. Having lost multiple people close to me due to opioids, that needs to be dealt with first before we roll back the progress we've made with cannabis.

That's not to say we should be aware of the potential downsides, but there seems to be plenty of higher priorities that we should be focusing efforts first.

[https://flowercompany.com](https://flowercompany.com)

</comment><comment><USER87> I don't know what it is but I rarely have a good experience with weed when I use it (which is very rarely). I usually just get very paranoid and/or sick.

</comment><comment><USER88> It is a very seductive but also very aggressive looking plant. (Nature puts the warning signs on all the creatures and leaves the choice to you.)

</comment><comment><USER89> Unfortunately this discussion is full of pot cliche and neo liberal bias that only leads to "sobriety" and fear of taint on your "career" .. marijuana is just like coffee and really you can vilify that but honestly the sidewalk leads to other things like more/less vice its up to you and you're self knowing. mj can be had by the smartest/dumbest but its not a thing in itself that has a direct correlation to you're "success" so lets all pull our pants up.

<comment><USER90> Wot?

</comment></comment><comment><USER91> Definitely an interesting article. I feel that some of the criticism about the negatives of the emerging market and effects of cannabis use is valid, but a lot of it sounds left over from the 80s and 90s. The drug treatment/law enforcement complex (DARE and rehab) acted as if cannabis was a major public health and addiction threat and a truly dangerous drug for decades. Witness Jeff Sessions saying, in 2018, with no supporting evidence, that cannabis is as dangerous as heroin - such claims went almost unquestioned in the past. People who built a trade on that sort of thinking now need to redefine their businesses.

I have operated socially and professionally in circles with rather high cannabis consumption and have certainly seen people over consume to he point that it is pointless or unenjoyable. Those times are certainly far less harmful than such instances are with alcohol, to a degree where comparison seems absurd. Nobody fights, gets violent, spills anything (maybe breaks a piece of glass), vomits, falls, passes out, wrecks their car, or engages in unhealthy sexual activity. We simply grow quiet and awkward and don't effectively conduct our social or commercial business.

I haven't witnessed anyone have a great struggle quitting cannabis. I do know many people who have moved on from daily usage as they reached their 30s and 40s, and many who have not.

Most of the negatives I've seen and experienced come from attitudes and beliefs of others, including the law and police. Often parents or non- consuming wives/girlfriends have a belief that cannabis consumption is harmful, probably from decades of continuing propaganda and lack of firsthand experience and accurate information. By trying to pressure people to stop a habit that is enjoyable, possibly beneficial and probably not harmful, they create interpersonal problems. Imagine if your spouse became convinced that all of your personal problems were because you drank 3 beers a week, or a daily coffee, and wanted you to seek counseling. It would seem absurd and sort of intrusive.

As far as the emerging legal market, it is an odd mishmash of recreational, fake medical-recreational and least of all now, legitimate medical. Places that specialize in helping ill people who can especially benefit from symptom relief and antioxidants found in cannabis have been overshadowed by recreational use. I have a medical cannabis card in New Mexico, suffer from various ailments that qualify in various states, and I don't feel like the stores that sell cannabis in NM are medical facilities, or the employees are qualified to dispense medical advice. The system seems like a bizarre compromise between recreational stores and medical facilities and it is poor for both groups. It would be nice if they were medically aware, because as I've been rather ill for 1-2 years cannabis is the only medication I have for symptom relief and quality of life. Aspirin is way too little, anything swallowed is a bad idea, and any opiates are out of the question.

In the emerging market there are certainly companies who I don't trust to make good decisions. I feel like the processes and semi-synthetic products created from cannabis are likely to be less healthy than current whole plant preparations. There seems to be an emerging disparity between cannabis sold like coffee or tea as a whole plant, natural extracts, chemical extracts, and prefilled vaporizer cartridges.

There is a bewildering profusion of products on the marketplace now, both consumables and hardware, that have not been evaluated for any sort of safety with the rigor most consumer products would be. Whenever government regulatory officials take an eye to this, it will be a tremendous upheaval for the industry.

</comment><comment><USER22> Prior to around a month ago, I was constantly high on cannabis. I'm talking about nearly 24/7 except when at work. It took the terrible aspects of life away, and made me think deeply about certain situations/relationships/work issues. It kept me pretty sane and calm with panic disorder, and I was able to create lasting good quality friendships while on it since it calmed down my social anxiety. I took up biking (not while high, but I'd bike to places, get high, and then chill) and did 1500 miles in a year, and lost a good amount of weight. I got hired full time at a great corporate job, and secured my very first brand new apartment that I would live in alone. It took me off of 3 years of prescribed Klonopin.

Last month I took a break for 2.5 weeks to lower my tolerance and get a feel for sobriety again. I went through 2-3 days of feeling slightly sick, but after that I was back to normal. I made it through the 2 weeks, but picked it up more responsibly, only using it some nights after work, and only flower. I rarely ever smoke it, only vaporize.

It's been about a month, everything is fine, but I've noticed how much it really helped me cope with the realities of life, and allowed me to really think things out and keep my brain less scattered. Three years of everyday use, and I haven't really noticed any downsides to being high on cannabis nearly 24/7 other than wanting to sit alone at home and do nothing.

I have never tried any other drugs, unless prescribed.

</comment><comment><USER92> It's unconventional given the liberal/libertarian aspects of the current movement, but this is a problem. I know at least two people very well, and a few more less well who smoke - all - the - time. They vape it like tobacco. They are basically permanently 'kind of high' \- completely functional, you'd never really know it to meet them ... but this is more than a little distressing. One is in finance, the other a healthcare practitioner, the others stay at home parents.

It's a kind of new phenom that we need to grapple with because the 'bad effects' are not going to be so much chemical etc., they're going to be psychological and we're in kind of new territory.

<comment><USER93> One in six Americans takes psychiatric prescription drugs, mostly antidepressants. Weed is basically an antidepressant and pain killer.

I think the bigger question is, why are Americans self-medicating so much?

<comment><USER30> Chemically, cannabinoids are not really antidepressants (which mostly affect the serotonin system) or pain killers (opioids affect the opioid receptors). Cannabinoids have a variety of effects due to the endocannabinoid system, which is naturally occurring in the human physiology and does affect mood, memory, etc. However, it's simply not chemically accurate to call them pain killers or antidepressants, cannabis lies in a separate category.

<comment><USER94> The point is that it is how many people use it (and alcohol, and other drugs).

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER95> I smoked a lot in college and it caused a lot of personal issues. I think it stunted my early career development. I was sober for about 1.5 years, but I've gone back to it recently. It's probably not a good idea, because I feel the grips of addiction after just one use. But I've had my partner lock up my supply for only occasional use, and I limit my habit when I do light up. This feels extreme, and I might have to go back to abstinence, but so far I haven't experienced depression or strong insomnia like I have withdrawing in the past.

</comment><comment><USER96> I have found CBD with terpenes helps to ease the edge.

</comment><comment><USER97> Not to long ago, back when cannabis was illegal... you couldn't even say negative things about it. Now this whole thread is negative.</comment>


Ask HN: How do you determine leadership qualities in an interview? - <AUTHOR> Usually, in behavioural questions, a candidate is asked about a time that x happened and how they reacted in order, or when they led a project in order to quantify leadership qualities.
Unless the candidate is really unprepared, most people would have read about these sort of questions  and come up with some template answers. Now, it's up to the interviewer to ask further questions to get a better understanding but I'm wondering if people approach this in a different way.
As a side note, leadership qualities in my mind have nothing to do with seniority. <comment><USER3> Work Rules by Lazlo Bock may give you some good insights. It references a rigorous study by Frank Schmidt and John Hunter. The gist of it is that the 3 best indicators of on-the-job performance is a work sample test, general cognitive ability tests and structured interviews.

If leadership quality is something you wanna test for, you just have to design the questions in that manner - for example ask about how she handled professional failure in the past, ask her to give you some tips to motivate subordinates, to teach you something you dont know, even its a fun fact, like turtles breath through their bottoms.

As for your concern that "most people would have read about these sort of questions and come up with some template answers". You could flush their prepared answers by asking the candidate to give you a 10 second summary of their answer first, then ask them to give another example in a 10 second summary. After they have exhausted their "template answers", ask them to take their time to give you an example other than these 2. Give them ample time. Don't bully them or put them under pressure, work with them to elicit another example and dive deep in a collaborative manner. for example with "why did you think at that time, this was the right approach", "I messed up recently by doing xxx, how do you think I could have handled it better". (Don't do this for all your Behavioral Questions. Pick the last question especially if the candidate is performing well)

End of the day most interviews are a waste of time because 99.4 percent of the time is spent trying to confirm whatever impression the interviewer formed in the first ten seconds. ([https://www.researchgate.net/publication/313878823_The_impor...](https://www.researchgate.net/publication/313878823_The_importance_of_first_impressions_in_a_job_interview)). I cant find the reference for my life, but I think it was Google (or Amazon) that found out that given the same structured interview process, some people were better than others in selecting great teammates that performed well on- the-job. The key is to encourage these type of interviewers to do more interviews.

</comment><comment><USER4> I think I do a good job, but coming up with a nice story is difficult.

Success stories are short: you intervened early, spoke to the parties involved, made a plan everyone could agree on and moved on.

The interesting stories often only have OK-ish endings: You are facing extreme issues that are not under your direct control and you somehow keep things working (bad hires, dis-functioning external teams, legacy code falling apart from all ends, bad higher management).

And than there are non-issues you tackled early enough. E.g.: Newly established workflows and documentation between departments, getting you a compliment once and there might be less conflicts and pressure now, but it's hard to quantify.

Maybe good questions would be (answers I'd like to hear in brackets):

How and when do you...

\- criticize (reviewing work, in a constructive manner)

\- praise (frequent and honest praise, but no participation trophies)

\- get involved in a grudge between team members (pro-actively, in private)

\- escalate to higher ups (as a last resort and for serious violations)

\- talk to individuals about work related, but not directly task-related things (one on ones, actively checking on those you don't communicate with often)

\- encourage autonomy (take risks, keep pushing, give feedback)

\- Do you approach different people in different ways? If so, make 1-2 examples. (adjusted level of politeness and formality when communication with other cultures (I'm German, we really have to change gears depending on who's on the other line), adjust how much guidance is needed when giving tasks, don't be racist/sexist/etc.)

\- And to include something less people focused: When and how do decide to get a 2nd opinion? (acknowledge when you are out of your depth, do research, learn and ask others)

<comment><USER5> I think it's just absurd to believe you can get to know someone within 60 - <USER2> minutes. A good liar/imposter can fool people for years. That's why you always ask for references and cross check stories.

<comment><USER4> On the other hand a bad gut feeling proves to be right often too. And I'm relatively sure it's not just confirmation bias :)

<comment><USER6> What we call gut feeling is often a subconscious interpretation of the person's body language, physical appearance and tone of voice. It's always good to try to explicit why you had that feeling before basing your decision on it.

I often think that shy people are assholes at first. Now that I'm aware of that I try to test the shyness hypothesis first when I have that feeling.

So exploit it, it's something humans developed for good reasons. Just be aware of the biais and use it as a good starting point for a behavioral interview.

<comment><USER4> I'm totally with you here. One should not try to get rid of these quick form of prejudices, because they exist anyways and they might be useful.

To make them less "dangerous" it's good to be aware of them and stay doubtful about them to give anyone a chance to proof you better.

Reminds me of how I handed my phone to a couple once and wasn't sure if they'd scam me, but I willingly took the risk of loosing my phone to be able to help people when they ask.

They where honestly quite sketchy... I still wonder if they maybe just spontaneously decided not to scam me because they felt I was prepared for it.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> Amazon literally lists out the leadership qualities they look for and asks people to prepare for them. You prepare for them, tell the story, and they don't bother with follow-up questions most of the time.

I find behavioral questions to be bs anyway, since how someone presents themselves during an interview and their day to day behavior can be very different. Atleast here, you do your preparation, spit out your story, and you're done. Slightly less bs way to interview for personality qualities.

<comment><AUTHOR> Interesting, are the leadership qualities list public to have a look?

<comment><USER4> I guess it's this one: [https://www.amazon.jobs/en/principles](https://www.amazon.jobs/en/principles)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> I ask directly - I ask them what their leadership style is, how they handle conflict, and how they build consensus in a team.

I find that anyone with leadership experience can readily talk about how they approach such things. Anyone with skills, but lacking experience can at least talk around the subjects, and give you some insights into where they are. And people without skills or experience flounder completely.

</comment><comment><USER9> The Leadership Sort Deck identifies 20 characteristics reflecting leadership priorities for the job.

It's an invaluable tool to assess and interview candidates. Really helps cut through the BS.

> [https://www.amazon.com/Leadership-Architect-Sort-Cards- > Lomba...](https://www.amazon.com/Leadership-Architect-Sort-Cards- > Lombardo/dp/B00P2HDOVS)

</comment><comment><USER10> I've never tried this, and it probably would not work. I don't think I'd even attempt it. However! A trick to detect a lie or fabrication is to have someone go through something in reverse chronological order. People usually have trouble constructing a false narrative in reverse.

<comment><USER11> Common police tactic to test the authenticity of a witness/suspect's story. Another tactic is to leave the topic for a while - go completely off course - and then ask the candidate to write it down in front of them. The act of writing, instead of speaking, adds to the difficulty if the story is false.

</comment></comment><comment><USER12> Difficult. Probably I would fail your interview but on the job I've been told I'm a natural leader.

I have a very deep understanding of my domain. Maybe that helps.

</comment><comment><USER13> What are leadership qualities? Asking for a friend.

<comment><USER9> Think Organization Agility / Political Savvy / Motivating Others, etc...

The Gold Standard in identifying Leadership Characteristics > [https://www.amazon.com/Leadership-Architect-Sort-Cards- Lomba...](https://www.amazon.com/Leadership-Architect-Sort-Cards- Lombardo/dp/B00P2HDOVS)

<comment><USER13> How are leadership qualities measured?

<comment><USER9> Great question --

Every organization/industry follow key performance indicators. Relative to an individuals leadership mandate, what actions did they take? What were the outcomes/results?

To be fair, there's always an element of situational subjectivity. Ultimately, you're looking for a leaders impact on the bottom-line.</comment></comment></comment></comment>


GeekTyper – hacking simulator ;-) - <AUTHOR> http://geektyper.com/scp/ <comment><USER2> Hahahahahaha, this is awesome. I'm gonna share it with everyone I know on FB. How do I turn off the alert sound (without muting the tab)?

</comment><comment><USER3> This is the funniest thing I've seen all day. Awesome!</comment>


Issue for Express 5 re-opened by maintainer - <AUTHOR> https://github.com/expressjs/express/pull/2237#event-570232650 <comment><AUTHOR> For those unfamiliar with GitHub issues, you can just scroll up to see what preceded the event in this link - note that this issue was closed[0] by the maintainer 2 days ago, along with a comment from the maintainer saying "I am closing down Express 5.0". The reopening of this issue is great news for the Express community, and Node in general (as Express is #2 on the list of "packages people 'npm install' a lot"[1]).

For more context, you can look at some comments about this event on reddit[2].

[0] [https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11185009](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11185009)

[1] [https://www.npmjs.com/#explicit](https://www.npmjs.com/#explicit)

[2] [https://www.reddit.com/r/javascript/comments/47s9o8/im_closi...](https://www.reddit.com/r/javascript/comments/47s9o8/im_closing_down_express_50/d0fdm5m)</comment>


Greplin opensources Lucene Utils and Bloom Filters - <AUTHOR> http://tech.blog.greplin.com/lucene-utilities-and-bloom-filters

<comment><USER2> _A query that matches phrase prefixes - for example "Epic w" will match both "Epic win" and "Epic wonder". This is particularly useful for implementing Google Instant style searches_

This is _really_ useful and painfully lacking from Lucene. Great stuff.

<comment><USER3> I was curious how they implemented prefix matching, so I went and looked at the code [1]. Unfortunately, this is just a simple linear scan that calls .startswith(). It is possible to do fast (log N) prefix matching with radix / critbit trees.

[1] [https://github.com/Greplin/greplin-lucene- utils/blob/master/...](https://github.com/Greplin/greplin-lucene- utils/blob/master/src/main/java/com/greplin/lucene/query/PhrasePrefixQuery.java)

<comment><USER4> Radix trees are O(k), where k is the length of the query string.

Anyway, for prefix matching, you want to take careful note of the size and shape of your data, because it matters for which algorithm is fastest. If your data all fits in RAM (or better yet, all fits in L2 cache), then I've had very good results with binary search (O(log N)) to find the first matching result, and then linear scan to find all possible suffixes. This is a lot more cache- friendly than radix trees, which have better theoretical performance but often touch memory that's all over the place.

<comment><USER3> > Radix trees are O(k)

Yes, thank you.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> I really don't mean to sound unpleasant, but does anyone else think that the primary goal of Greplin is to exit via Google or Facebook? From a consumer point of view, can it ever be anything more than a niche product? I'm genuinely curious...these patches are somewhat superficial, and while a nice gesture, the cynical part of me sees it as a ploy to gain cred with the people most likely to influence buyouts.

<comment><USER6> you say that like it's a bad thing. why is "1. build something that would be useful to a large company, 2. prove by acquiring users that the product has real value, 3. get acquired" a bad business model? from a consumer point of view, they'll benefit when google or facebook or whoever integrates greplin's techniques.

<comment><USER7> This is completely irrelevant to the discussion, please feel free to downvote me for it:

2 things: Your account is exactly "1337" days old today, happy leet day :). Also, are you the same zem that posted on newslily a while ago? If so, you posted some really awesome stuff, thanks :)

(Sorry if I've recognized you and asked this question before, I have a terrible memory)

<comment><USER6> thanks, would never have noticed l337 day on my own :) and yeah, same zem! dropped off newslily due to having too many social networks to keep up with; nice to see it still going strong.

<comment><USER7> o/ well long-distance high five to you :).

I wouldn't really say it's still going _strong_ , haha. Unfortunately, we never really got the traction on that that we needed to allow it to keep running by itself (Cody and I were submitting a _lot_ of the content, which was fine, but it would have been really awesome if we didn't have to).

<sarcasm>Big surprise there, though, we were trying to compete against HN and reddit</sarcasm>

Back in November, we both started working a new project: <http://thingist.com>, which has been taking a lot of my time lately, so I haven't been submitting as much.

Anyway, good to see you around here, man :)

<comment><USER6> where is the "help->about" page for thingist? i can't make out whether it's competing with tumblr, twitter, or something new entirely.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> There are some good opensource implementations in python (and I am sure other languages).

<https://github.com/jaybaird/python-bloomfilter> \- offers scalable bloom filters

<https://github.com/axiak/pybloomfiltermmap> \- uses mmap

<comment><AUTHOR> We originally used mmap too - but it didn't work very well. First, Java has some rather serious mmap limitations, (<http://bugs.sun.com/view_bug.do?bug_id=4724038>) - and for some reason, we saw occcasional data corruption (which we haven't seen since we moved to the current system).

<comment><USER9> Have those mmap limitations really impacted you? And the corruption — I'm assuming that was with read/write mappings that you wrote to?

I'm asking, because we're getting great mileage out of mmap in Clojure, albeit for read-only mappings. And that's in a search engine :-) Using mmap for large data is great, because you avoid enlarging your heap and the garbage collector doesn't even have to care about your data.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> my question is why they didn't use solr instead?

<comment><AUTHOR> The first version of Greplin was actually built on Solr!

Eventually, we needed more flexibility than Solr easily offered though. For example, we've added far more efficient sharding, document modifications (updates and deletions), flushing, and near real time search than either Lucene or Solr support out of the box (and they were much easier to add to Lucene than Solr, since Lucene makes fewer assumptions about your dataset/use).

I think Solr is a great tool if your needs happen to fit into their model - but if they diverge a lot, it sometimes makes more sense to build your own custom framework on top of Lucene.

<comment><USER11> Did you consider the distributed, real-time, and faceted extensions to Lucene we (LinkedIn) built? Sensei, Zoie, and Bobo respectively. Get em at <http://sna-projects.com/sna/>

<comment><AUTHOR> We're huge fans! Our real time search technology copied its architecture from Zoie, and our faceting/caching took some ideas from Bobo!

We didn't use them outright since we have fairly different requirements/constraints (our data has some pleasant properties that makes it easier to shard and facet than the general case) and we wanted something a bit simpler.

Shoot me an email sometime though (email in profile)! I'd love to buy you lunch and pick your brain ;-) You guys clearly know what you're doing!

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> I know the verb "open-sources" is not well defined, but...

Publishing 2 github repositories, each with several classes which are mostly trivial, is not "opensourcing".

Much like the fact that a weekend project is not a "startup".

<comment><USER13> From Wikipedia: "The term open source describes practices in production and development that promote access to the end product's source materials."

I'd imagine this falls in to that category. The takeaway for me is that the code _is_ useful, regardless of the size, and they took the time to let other folks enjoy it.

<comment><USER12> Don't get me wrong, I think highly of Greplin, and appreciate every line of open code. The process itself it to be highly appraised.

But I've seen much larger open source patches - that are no less important - that have received much less publicity that this.

<comment><USER14> They might be getting a disproportional amount of publicity compared to much larger more complex projects, in your opinion, but that doesn't negate the fact that it is still open source.</comment></comment></comment></comment>


Ask HN: Do I need to secure (SSL) my login page? - <AUTHOR>

I'm creating a real site for the first time, and I'm considering forgoing getting an SSL cert for financial reasons.
Money is tight, and I'm even considering paying monthly for a shared host rather than paying less per month on a longer contract so I can pull the site early if it fails hard. With the hosting itself being only about $10/mo, I'm having a hard time justifying to myself that I should pay 50% more to get a dedicated IP, in addition to the cost of the cert.
This isn't e-commerce, so the only thing being secured are the user login. The data will initially be entirely public, though I do have plans for private-unless-you-want-it-public features.
HN doesn't secure its logins, nor does reddit, TheDailyWTF, or any number of other forums, so how guilty should I feel about not providing secured logins? The site is aimed at developers, in case the users are an important part of this equation. <comment><USER2> I'd say it depends on the level of security your users would expect from your site. If it's merely information you're offering than I wouldn't use an SSL certification. If there's financial data involved (mind you: payments through paypal or some other payment broker are SSL certified) it's a whole different story. Also: an upgrade to your site is easier to sell your users ('now even more secure') than a downgrade.

<comment><AUTHOR> _I'd say it depends on the level of security your users would expect from your site._

About the same level of security as posting on reddit or HN, which is why I used them as examples. Submit this, vote for the best that, etc. A closer example might be StackOverflow, but I honestly have no idea what goes into logging in over there, since it's all done behind the scenes with OpenID (though there was nothing https-y shown in HTTPFox when I tried it).

 _If there's financial data involved_

Nope. Monetization, initially, will be provided via affiliate links. If you buy something you saw on my site, you wouldn't be buying it from me.

 _Also: an upgrade to your site is easier to sell your users ('now even more secure') than a downgrade._

This is my thinking. If the site ever gets to the point where it's nicely paying for itself and I can justify the cost of the static IP and the cert, I will.

</comment></comment><comment><USER3> You could also delegate the login to Facebook, Twitter, Google, OpenID, etc which are all supposed to be secure. It also reduces the friction of the signup/login process. However, I do hate it when sites don't let you signup directly and force you to use OpenID.

<comment><AUTHOR> _You could also delegate the login to Facebook..._

I _refuse_ to use FacebookConnect (or whatever it's called), since it's my real identity being used. I imagine a lot of people are the same.

 _...Twitter..._

I also don't have a twitter account, since I don't really see the point of it.

 _...Google..._

Can you elaborate here? I'm not quite sure what you're referring to, though I feel like I should.

 _...OpenID_

This is definitely a consideration, and has been brought up elsewhere in this thread. I'm definitely going to check it out, and see what's _actually_ involved in it, since it seems a bit involved for something I'm not even sure will work.

 _However, I do hate it when sites don't let you signup directly and force you to use OpenID._

Same here. When StackOverflow launched, I didn't understand what they asking me to do to log in. I understand it now, but I've never had a reason to use my OpenID outside of the StackExchange network, so to me it's pretty much the same as having a single account for that purpose.

<comment><USER4> Google accounts act like an openid/oauth account. Lots of sites have a "log in with your google account" option.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> Short answer: No.

Slightly longer answer: If you use SSL on the login page, how do you maintain state between requests over non-SSL sessions? If you just SSL encrypt the logon you're given a cookie. If you send that cookie over HTTP, the end user is susceptible to more or less the same issues as before, only instead of the account being compromised, it's the session (until it expires).

The user can mitigate this by logging out, in which case compromise is limited to the session, assuming that the adversary doesn't have the ability to intercept and block the logout request (which they most likely would in an intercept situation).

</comment><comment><USER6> You don't _need_ to, just make sure your users are aware. I don't think users would disregard your service - as long as it doesn't deal with some heavily private stuff - just because you don't have an SSL cert.

<comment><AUTHOR> _as long as it doesn't deal with some heavily private stuff_

Nothing private. The only things that wouldn't get made public by default are intended to be things that I'd like you to opt into making public anyway, and none of these features would be in the 1.0.

 _just make sure your users are aware_

Any suggestions for this? A popup saying "hey, this is pretty insecure.. are you sure you want to bother?" seems like a good way to get people to leave your site alone.

<comment><USER7> Nah, leave the users alone. If they are developers they should check that it does not say https anyway. I mean, hacker news does not scare people by saying, hey man this data is not secured. But then hacker news asks for a username which you make up on the spot and a password for which you do the same.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> You may also try using Janrain Engage (formerly RPX) <http://www.janrain.com/janrain-products-overview>

</comment><comment><USER9> What about using something like OpenID, Google Accounts or Facebook accounts and not doing the login yourself?

<comment><AUTHOR> Honestly? Because it looks like entirely too much work. I'll admit that I haven't looked into it as thoroughly as I should have, but just a quick check of StackOverflows login screen shows 12 different providers they accept with a field to allow any other you want. That sort of scared me off.

Now, thinking about this logically, the fact that they provide a field for "just throw your OpenID here" probably means that there's a singular path to follow, and that the other 12 are just shortcuts so that you don't have to remember the full URL for your credentials.

I'll look into it a bit further now, but if you have any suggestions on documentation or tutorials you've found helpful, I'd appreciate it if you could pass them along (I'll be using PHP).

Thanks.

<comment><USER9> I have not needed to use any yet, but next time I need a login, I'll be investigating the three I mentioned. As for stackoverflow, I've never used the butons they provide, I've always just typed my openid url into the box. Probably they went a bit crazy witht he whole thing, I doubt you really need to go to the same extent that they did.

Sorry I don't have anything more helpful to add. If you do look into this more, would you mind reporting back on any findings? I'd love to hear about your experiences.

<comment><AUTHOR> I can make a note to let you know how this works out, since I sincerely doubt you'd notice a reply here.

If you'd prefer, I'm also blogging about my experience of writing a site from scratch for the first time. You can check it out at <http://www.appscanadian.ca> in case I don't remember to contact you when I start working on the login functionality.

<comment><USER9> Bookmarked, thanks.</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment>