Another nice Panic-inspired office dashboard - <AUTHOR> http://jon.oxer.com.au/blog/id/360

<comment><USER2> Other than the numbers, the font size isn't terribly important: after you've seen it a few times you don't need to read the labels anymore and it's just the numbers and the size of the bars that matter. I made the numbers huge and they're very easy to read even from quite some distance away, and once you know that the top yellow bar is tasks in the "Brillianz" category you don't need to keep reading the label.

The power monitoring thing is something we created internally. It uses current clamps and Arduinos to push data into a web service. You're right that the graph is more pretty than functional, but it wasn't intended for wall-size display. Most people access it on their desktop and it's quite legible in that context, and it just seemed a handy thing to stick up on the status screen.

<comment><AUTHOR> (Aw, so cool you came to this site!) And also cool this involved Arduino.

<comment><USER2> Thanks for submitting the story!

There's some more background to the power monitoring stuff here: <http://www.practicalarduino.com/news/id/441>

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER3> You should use GridSpy for the power monitoring ;)

How much did the power monitoring cost?

Also, the background on the graph makes it practically unreadable. You should consider bright lines on a black background.

<comment><AUTHOR> I actually submitted this on behalf of the person who wrote the blog post, and do not know him personally :(.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> Two words: Bigger fonts. There is easily room for bigger fonts on those and the photo was only ten feet away and already some words are too little and the graph is nearly useless. When I was making my own dashboard I kept making the fonts bigger and bigger. Because I made it on a screen that was a foot away from my eyes it took me a little while to figure out just how big the fonts how to be to be read from far away and bigger way always better.</comment>


Moscone Effect: What Dreamforce and Big Conferences Mean for Airbnb - <AUTHOR> https://blog.beyondpricing.com/the-moscone-effect?rel=hn

<comment><USER2> I'm interested to hear how much more people in SoMa were able to charge during Oracle Open World.</comment>


Show HN: Free monitoring and notification service. (Alpha) - <AUTHOR> http://monitorthis.site <comment><USER2> Hi,

I'm asked to sign up, but there are no details about the service. I don't even know how it can monitor my site. I have zero interest to give my email address at this stage, but that's the only thing I can do. You need to entice me to sign up, maybe by explaining the features and how come is this free.

I understand the ad strategy, but the above concern plus the fact that the landing page is full of ads doesn't give me confidence to sign up.

In my opinion, page views and especially on your landing page will not give you the desired value and it'll stop some people from signing up. Maybe you can do text ads (affiliate links?) in the footer of the emails sent by the system.

<comment><AUTHOR> First off, I would like to thank you for your feedback. I do agree that both the landing page and ad-placement needs a lot of love. I'll bump that up on my list of things to do.

(Keep in mind, this site is something I've just begun throwing together after finding that alternatives either limit the # of sites, have horrible ping intervals, or simply no free option at all)

Edit: Added some basic information on the landing page. Also restricted Ads to the actual functionality pages. (Sites management / Site graphs)

<comment><USER3> If the goal is feedback, it might be better to have a link to a page that does not require login/signup because there is no technical documentation, demonstration video, or other supporting collateral.

I came to the site to learn about your product. Make it easy. Don't put barriers in my way. Don't optimize for your needs over your users'.

Good luck.

<comment><AUTHOR> Working on getting a demo video done up soon. I will also be adding some more technical information to the landing page. Thanks for the advice!

Unfortunately the login is pretty much a requirement. I've thought about having an ephemeral page or something, but it really just doesn't work.

<comment><USER3> In what way is a login a requirement?

I did not feel it was necessary when I tried the demo.

<comment><AUTHOR> Edit: my mistake. You will be able to see introduction and guides as they become available. You will only need to register to gain access to the functionality.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER2> Now it has more information, but as far as I can tell you only send pings, right?

Nowadays, just icmp doesn't cut it. People want to know if their service is running, not so much if the server is running. Also, some big hosting providers (e.g. Azure) don't even reply to ping.

My suggestion is to add http/https queries. I'm not sure what do you use in the backend, but almost every language has an http library to make this easy for you.

If you'd like to have a look, one of my side projects is a monitoring site: [https://datasnitch.co.uk](https://datasnitch.co.uk)

<comment><AUTHOR> You are correct and your suggestion was already at the top of my list. It now supports HTTP/HTTPS and will notify you once your Certificate is about to expire.

I wanted to add a note to my site that if folks are looking for other options to check out some alternatives. Can I list yours?

<comment><USER2> Sure, thanks!</comment></comment></comment>


Executive Editor of NYTimes on business models, etc - <AUTHOR> http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/30/business/media/02askthetimes.html?hp=&pagewanted=all

<comment><AUTHOR> The following quote made me decide to post to HN:

"A lot of people in the news business, myself included, don't buy as a matter of theology that information "wants to be free." Really good information, often extracted from reluctant sources, truth-tested, organized and explained — that stuff wants to be paid for."

<comment><USER2> Scan down page for heading: Should The Times Charge for Online News?</comment></comment>


Judge says prosecutors should follow the law. Prosecutors revolt. - <AUTHOR> http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-watch/wp/2014/03/07/judge-says-prosecutors-should-follow-the-law-prosecutors-revolt/?tid=pm_lifestyle_pop <comment><USER2> In situations where accusations of widespread corruption, misconduct, unethical action, etc are made, a phrase that is often trotted out in defense of the accused is _" just a few bad apples"_. It's not WhereEver Police Department that has an issue with racial bias and violent escalation, _it 's just a few bad apples_. Our school district does not have a bullying problem, _it 's just a few bad apples_. Etc.

What is interesting about this cliched defense is that it is actually a malformed statement of the _original_ cliche, "A few bad apples _spoil the barrel._ "

The original cliche refers to a phenomenon where overripe or rotten apples release ethylene gas, which is a ripening agent. This ethylene gas will accelerate the ripening/rot of nearby apples. If you are not _vigilant_ in weeding out the bad apples, the rot will rapidly spread and soon there will be _no_ good apples left to rescue.

Human "bad apples" don't release ethylene gas, but they corrupt their peers nevertheless. When a good cop backs the cover story of his corrupt cop partner, he becomes a bad cop as well. When prosecutors take up arms in defense of their corrupt prosecutor peers, they become no better than the initially targeted. If school administrators allow a bully to have his way for too long, then everybody else sees that they can get away with it too and before long you have daily fistfights behind the school at the end of the day.

Institutions that have had widespread unchallenged corruption for decades rarely need keyhole surgery, they need amputations.

<comment><USER3> Related: I don't understand how the "few bad apples" defense always seems to be used to argue for "so ignore it" rather than "and by the way, when we find a bad apple, it goes straight in the garbage disposal where it belongs". Like, all these prosecutors are going apeshit because a judge dared to say they should possibly lose their licenses -- what about the idea that they should serve time, time comparable to what they may have capriciously caused innocents to serve? "Law and order" is all well and good, but I'd like to see it go both ways once in a while.

<comment><USER4> I don't think they should lose their licenses, they should be tried for contempt and the mandatory minimum applied.

Prosecutors might be well served in these instances by the judge refusing a plea bargain as is their prerogative.

<comment><USER5> Mike Nifong is a good example of someone who abused his office. Wikipedia calls him a "rouge" prosecutor. Maybe he wasn't so rouge...

<comment><USER6> Off-topic pedantic point. Ro_gu_e is an adjective that means without guidance or lacking oversight. Ro_ug_e is a type of cosmetic, namely one for making the cheeks redder. While the image of a red-faced prosecutor screaming at his clerks is amusing, I don't think it's what you had in mind.

Sorry to distract from your otherwise valid comment.

<comment><USER7> Completely relevant point, I would say: I assumed 'rouge' meant 'red' in that context, _a.k.a._ presumed socialo-communist, _a.k.a._ a prosecutor trying to redress economic and political injustices, going after the rich and powerful and ignoring petty crimes, like several prosecutors have been accused of doing in France and Italy. That made the original common odd.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> I'm glad someone is finally standing up for the rights of common citizens. I really don't want to see the social experiment of the United States end in a failure, and every day our rights are eroded, we get closer to that. I like this country, and consider myself a patriot. I just also have to recognize that the people who participate in running this country do not always have our best interests at heart.

<comment><USER9> _I really don 't want to see the social experiment of the United States end in a failure, and every day our rights are eroded, we get closer to that._

If you watch television, you will think that the world is becoming worse. After all, news is only when rare things happen, and usually very bad things at that. Now, I am not saying that that criminal justice system is in need of a huge overhaul. It is a real human right problem that needs to be fixed.

But what you're saying is that you think that we are losing rights. Are we really? Consider that in the last 50 years or so, we are gaining more rights. Even animal gains more right. Perhaps this is not the case in the last 10 years or so. Maybe we really are losing rights.

Consider this: When somebody brings a human right problem, that is a good omen. That mean somebody acknowledges the problem. If a human right problem remains hidden from view, our perception will be wrong, because it means we think we have more right or freedom than we really have and we can't do anything about it. So the Snowden revelation is good news, but the bad news is that Snowden is necessary in the first place and the fact that it had remain hidden across two presidency.

So if the media is openly reporting abuses done by prosecutors and other agents. That is a good thing. It means that our error correction mechanism is starting to work, which will hopefully lead to a change that curb the abuse and prevent it from happening.

But what about our freedom over the last ten years? What's the reality? One of the freedom index graph says that our freedom across the world is quite stable, maybe increasing. [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_in_the_World#Trends](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_in_the_World#Trends)

I have yet to look at other graph. But if you're going to say that we are losing our rights, maybe it's a good idea to quantify how much over what time period.

<comment><USER10> I don't disagree with your analysis, but people don't gain or lose rights based on government whims. People have inalienable rights that can be respected or violated. This may seem like a semantic point, but I think it's important that to remember that fundamental rights, like the right to to a fair trial, exist no matter whether the law and its agents honor those rights.

When governments fail to respect inalienable rights, they lose legitimacy.

<comment><USER11> Inalienable rights is verbage that sounds good, but means practically nothing.

Do you have a right to life? Well no - America is one of the only first world nations to still have the death penalty.

Liberty? The standard faire of our justice systems is to remove that.

Pursuit of happiness? This is the only one I'd argue everyone does have, that actually is inalienable. The loss of that tends to actually cause problems.

But everything else comes stamped with some big provisos about one's place and actions within society, and a discussion where we hamstring ourselves over what is and isn't a right ultimately is what erodes those we do have - worrying too much about whether something is a right, rather then if what we're doing _is_ right.

<comment><USER10> I sounds like you agree that what is right exists outside of legal definitions, which was my point. The point being that moral authority does not derive from the legal code. To the extent that governments can be blamed for failing to protect the rights to life, liberty, property, conscience, etc., they can be found to be immoral or unjust. And at a certain point, the laws of the government (or even the government itself) loses legitimacy.

This was really the thesis of the Declaration of Independence.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> I applaud this judge. I also feel like I'm not hearing the full story.

</comment><comment><USER13> Two things:

1\. I suspect the genisis of this immunity was to inoculate prosecutors from coercion by politicians - which is probably a good thing. But I would be curious to know about the logic behind it.

2\. While perhaps it might be worthwhile to have some level of immunity that logic frays somewhat when acts that would generally be considered immoral and perhaps criminal are unaddressable.

<comment><USER14> The "absolute immunity" for prosecutors was established in Imbler v. Pachtman (1976). The logic is that if prosecutors could be sued by people they accused but failed to convict, that "would cause a deflection of the prosecutor's energies from his public duties, and the possibility that he would shade his decisions instead of exercising the independence of judgment required by his public trust."

([http://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?q=Imbler+v.+Pachtman&...](http://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?q=Imbler+v.+Pachtman&hl=en&as_sdt=2,14&case=5758861728040203406&scilh=0))

<comment><USER13> interesting, thank you!

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> One problem with the Judge's statement is that it is beyond the scope of an actual case or controversy. A Judge should judge each case individually not make up general rules and policies to prospectively apply to future behaviour, since that is for the legislature and executive in a separation of powers system. If the Judge wants to issue a warning or punishment to a particular prosecutor for a particular inappropriate behavior that would be in bounds; but media statements designed to influence elections are out of bounds for american judicial behavior.

</comment><comment><USER16> In the interest of hearing both sides of the story, can someone explain what legitimate complaints prosecutors may have about these developments, if any?

<comment><USER17> They fear corrupt judges, perhaps, theoretically. Maybe the proliferation of laws that make everything illegal.

But probably, they just want immunity for their crimes.</comment></comment>


Ghost blogging move away from markdown editor - <AUTHOR> http://www.gtheme.io/community/articles/21/up-coming-ghost-publishing-platform-10 <comment><USER2> > Overall Ghost 1.0 will be promising overhaul of simple blogging engine.

It's irony, isn't it?

So they'll be going Wordpress in next major releases, I guess.

<comment><AUTHOR> Just look at their initial idea[0] of simple blogging platform, which is the main reason people support it.

[0]: [https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/johnonolan/ghost- just-a...](https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/johnonolan/ghost-just-a- blogging-platform)</comment></comment>


Show HN: GroupIt! – A modern Set game variant, made for mobile with HTML5 - <AUTHOR> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.hercules.groups <comment><AUTHOR> Excited to announce that GroupIt! is available for download on the Play store.

Had a lot of fun building this game, and already spent countless hours playing it. The web platform is very awesome, which made building this game possible.

Feedback and suggestions for future improvements are welcome. Pasting description from the Play store below. Thank you!

\</comment><comment></comment><comment></comment><comment></comment><comment></comment><comment></comment><comment></comment><comment></comment><comment></comment><comment></comment><comment>--

GroupIt! - A simple, yet very exciting card game!

Stretch your brain's pattern recognition skills to find sets of cards (aka Groups) that are on the board. They are hiding in plain sight, so obvious, yet so well concealed.

 _A Group is a set of three cards where each card feature (number, color, pattern, shape) is either common across all three cards, or different across all three cards._

Game modes

• Time trial: Go through an entire deck as quickly as possible

• 1 on 1: Compete with a friend on who can find the most Groups

Gameplay features

• Works offline

• Progress tracking, lifetime high scores

• Hints to help you when stuck

• Re-arranging cards on the board

• How-to-play instructions

• Save/resume game

• Unlock new features simply by gathering points while playing (free)

Graphics features

• Portrait/landscape mode (great for phones and tablets)

• Right/left handed mode

• Light/dark mode

• Cool arcade graphics and sounds

and many more coming soon!</comment>


2015 Trends and Predictions for Web Design - <AUTHOR> http://inside.envato.com/2015-predictions-for-web-design/

<comment><USER2> Thank you for the great list of resources and insights.</comment>


Show HN: A great alternative to Mint - <AUTHOR> http://www.everwealth.io/ <comment><USER2> I've had issues with Mint and USAA, which is a shame because the only features I want are:

\- Frequent automated syncing. \- Running balance for recent transactions.

I know when payday is. I know when I'm off track or not.

It's the surprise transactions or expenditures that are easy to skim through but vital to stay on top of finances when everything is automated or paid online.

</comment><comment><USER3> Why is it a great alternative?

<comment><AUTHOR> It's not my product, but I think it's slightly less simple than Mint; making it more powerful. Saying it's less simple might sound like a deterrent, but it should be thought of as a huge advantage, especially on the budgeting side. It's easier to create budgets that are easy to follow and make necessary changes to your budget as unexpected expenses pop up.

I'm also a huge fan of the insights/data. I think Everwealth has done a great job displaying data in a way that makes it easy to identify patterns and trends in your spending.

<comment><USER4> > _It 's not my product,_ [...]

Please read the ShowHN rules: [https://news.ycombinator.com/showhn.html](https://news.ycombinator.com/showhn.html)

> _What to Submit_

> _Show HN is for something you 've made that other people can play with. HN > users can try it out, give you feedback, and ask questions in the thread._

> [...]

> _Blog posts, sign-up pages, and fundraisers can 't be tried out, so they > can't be Show HNs._

<comment><AUTHOR> I should clarify that I didn't create it, but I've recently been helping them increase traffic (so I am involved with it now; just not the creator).

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> Is there a list of supported countries/banks? Mine is not supported.

<comment><AUTHOR> I'm going to ask about this. Definitely something that would be great to have on the site. I'll follow up with you.

</comment></comment><comment><USER6> It's hard to beat free</comment>


Glimmer – Fast and light-weight UI components - <AUTHOR> https://glimmerjs.com/ <comment><USER2> As a long time (5 years full time) Ember developer, this is quite interesting to me philosophically.

I've spent a lot of time trying to tell people that all the stuff in Ember is there for a reason; for example, you're going to need a router, you're going to need support for controllers, etc. I still feel strongly that if your app is large and serious you are going to need that stuff.

But.

A lot of people just want to jump in and start building. React's immense popularity has shown the value in creating a view layer framework without all the extra stuff. It's great for onboarding new developers since there is less surface area to familiarize yourself with, and you can add in extra stuff (work your way towards full Ember) as you go.

It also comes with the added benefit of being able to add small components to a page without running the whole thing as an application, which is a use case Ember was not so great at before.

Overall I think it's a great announcement.

<comment><USER3> I used Ember for about 2 years and thought so too.

Now I'm using React and I think it's approach is much better.

The API is tiny compared to Ember and there aren't much concepts, still it accomplishes everything Ember did.

I feel bad to say this, but in the modular, library heavy, NPM based JS world of today, React (and other component frameworks like Cyclejs or hyperapp) fits just in. While Ember feels like a anachronism of the big framework days of Rails. :/

<comment><USER4> Why would you want to build a bespoke React-based framework for every app you make? Why not simply have everything you need out of the box, plus the ability to easily integrate any npm library into your app via first-class build tooling that is miles easier to use than something clunky like Webpack?

<comment><USER3> Because in my experience the "out-of-the-box" solutions always break down the more you want to customise them.

Now I rather prefer solutions that have customisation in mind from start, so it's always easy to switch things.

<comment><USER5> I remember when that wave hit the Ruby/Python space, with things like Pyramid/Pylons. These days that seems to have gone the way of the dodo, with the big monoliths still being around and then some minimal HTTP decorators like Sinatra/Flask/Node. Problem is that the middle ground would require a level of modularity that we still haven't reached, despite all the talk of "software ICs" that came around with early OOP.

I predict that's how we're going to end up in a few years again. Some big monoliths (whatever react is morphing into currently, plus Angular and as the world is a cruel mistress, ExtJS), plus a plethora of DOM wrappers and view libraries.

And 72 build systems.

<comment><USER6> You know that pyramid powers some of the most important infrastructure for python? Like new version of PYPI ([https://pypi.org/](https://pypi.org/))? And lots of big organizations use it - like Mozilla or NASA, sites like Reddit still use pylons.

IF you think it went the way of the dodo, I'd suggest doing a bit of better research before predicting the future :D Because IMO you are seriously off here.

<comment><USER5> I'm talking about the trend of build-your-own frameworks, not the software itself. Heck, there are enough sites out there still using Zope, MASON and Aolserver.

<comment><USER6> Pyramid is feature complete as a framework in my opinion - with defaults requires less thinking vs. lets say flask - the resulting applications will be more elegant and better organized (partly because it doesn't use globals eveywhere). The glue is quite good nowdays.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> _Close to the metal: Glimmer is one of the fastest DOM rendering engines, delivering exceptional performance for initial renders as well as updates. Architected like a virtual machine (VM), Glimmer compiles your templates into low-level code so it can run as fast as possible—without sacrificing ease of use._

By low-level code, they mean… JavaScript, right? In what sense is this "close to the metal"?

<comment><USER8> No, they are compiling it down to instructions which are then interpreted by the Ember/Glimmer VM: [https://youtu.be/vg5A_UOGShg?t=42m8s](https://youtu.be/vg5A_UOGShg?t=42m8s)

<comment><USER9> …which is written in JS. Everything's all relative though. JS is certainly a reasonable choice for this.

<comment><USER10> They mean that they made use of --allow_natives_syntax to identify Hidden Classes.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> Glimmer is smaller and faster than React, with TypeScript supported natively. This is a game-changer for people who are looking for a lightweight rendering library that ships with great tooling support and a larger framework ecosystem behind it.

<comment><USER11> The install parameter you provide already requires yarn and the rather large ember-cli, in addition to requiring my app to be built on top of glimmer instead of with it.

How can this possibly be considered remotely lightweight, especially compared to something like Mithril? I count at least 12 repos on your github that seem to be integral components including a dedicated CLI!

<comment><USER12> Why is the size of the CLI a concern?

<comment><USER13> What I think the GP is saying, and I agree, is that the CLI makes Glimmer the center of your world and not just another library you use. MomentJS doesn't come with a CLI tool to use it. You just use it.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER14> Whoa, good. I was worried, 12h passed without major new JS framework on the front page. But, clock started ticking again..

<comment> a-priori Maybe you should read about it a bit before you dismiss it with useless snark.

This is not a new JS framework. This is the view layer extracted from Ember as a standalone library.

<comment><USER15> Ah, thanks for explaining that ! I thought the Ember team had started an entirely new project instead of reusing something that already existed. If they extracted it, that makes much more sense to me now.

<comment><USER16> I don't understand these sorts of comments. "Heh, good thing you read and summarized TFA because I didn't and instead jumped to conclusions."

I see it on HN all the time, like a celebration for not having to read the submission. "Phew, that was a close one!"

There are maybe 8 sentences of copy on that landing page. One of them is:

        > Because Glimmer powers the components in Ember,
        > there's a battle-tested, full-stack framework
        > waiting for you—if you need it.

<comment><USER17> It's not the parent's fault. I read that landing page, clicked around a bit, and still had no idea what I was looking at. The top comment thread here on HN is about how confusing the page is.

It really would be much clearer if they deleted all the text on the landing page and added _This is the view layer extracted from Ember as a standalone library._

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER18> I cut my teeth using Ember a few years back, the whole community is amazing and does great work. Using react/redux now, and while I think it's the simplest and most pragmatic approach (the connect function changed the game), I think the api's over in clojurescript land, specifically re-frame are the best . It's conceptually the same as react/redux, but with a few more facilities for isolating side effects in actions, and a wayyyyy simpler api for querying the store in functional components.

But what I came to say is I think templating languages are sub par. Using an actual programming language that returns "html", or some variant (like clojurescripts hiccup language) is way more useful. I wouldn't use this because of that.

<comment><USER19> If you feel like giving Ember another whirl in the future, ember-redux is production-ready and has a comparable API to react-redux. (e.g. `connect`)

[https://github.com/ember-redux/ember-redux](https://github.com/ember- redux/ember-redux)

</comment></comment><comment><USER20> side point: rwjblue is an absolute beast if you look at his contribution activity [https://github.com/rwjblue](https://github.com/rwjblue), his output is amazing and much appreciated!

</comment><comment><USER21> > _Glimmer compiles your templates into low-level code so it can run as fast > as possible—without sacrificing ease of use._

What's the benefit vs just writing your templates in JavaScript in the first place?

<comment><USER22> JSX vs. templates is a common debate, with popular JSX options like React and Preact and template-based options like Vue and Glimmer. The reality is that there are hard tradeoffs to both and anyone who tells you one is obviously superior to the other is probably trying to sell you something.

For me personally, templates ever-so-slightly edge out tools like JSX. For one, I subscribe to the Rule of Least Power[0]. Having the full expressiveness of JavaScript is very nice, but it makes it harder for tools to statically analyze and optimize the rendering process. Ember has gone through three major rendering engine architectures now (string-based, DOM-based and now the Glimmer VM) and the simplicity of the templating language has made that portability much easier.

[0]: [https://www.w3.org/2001/tag/doc/leastPower.html](https://www.w3.org/2001/tag/doc/leastPower.html)

More importantly though, there are a lot of people in the world who know HTML and CSS. The fact that Glimmer templates are "just HTML" makes them accessible to people like designers who may not understand all of the fancy destructuring or array mapping happening in your JSX.

Lastly, and this is perhaps just a personal foible, but I have a really hard time mentally mapping more complicated JSX expressions into the final HTML output. It's fine when you're writing it, but reading it later, particularly to write CSS for it, is more challenging for me than Handlebars. I know some people would say that this is a code smell and that I should break that component up into smaller components, but I'd rather that decision be made by me than because I feel forced into it by the muddiness of my render() method.

<comment><USER23> "The fact that Glimmer templates are "just HTML" makes them accessible to people like designers who may not understand all of the fancy destructuring or array mapping happening in your JSX."

isn't this like, at least a little backwards? JSX is HTML and JS. templating languages are HTML with some custom DSL.

destructuring and especially mapping are pretty simple concepts. creating a new syntax to cater to people who couldn't learn _one_ in the first place seems counterintuitive?

is teaching someone a for loop really at all (let alone significantly) easier than teaching them to map an array?

edit: "creating a new syntax to cater to people who couldn't learn one in the first place seems counterintuitive?" on second read this seems thoughtless. isn't that almost the whole point of a DSL? i think you and i have convinced myself to stop hating on templates.

<comment> a-guest > JSX is HTML and JS (?)

"JSX is a preprocessor step that adds XML syntax to JavaScript." [http://buildwithreact.com/tutorial/jsx](http://buildwithreact.com/tutorial/jsx)

Whereas the templates in Glimmer are built on HTML. At the 10,000 ft view, my two cents: it looks easier to reason about what is going on with dynamic elements in the template via handlebars together with what is going with the html elements themselves in terms of rendering/appearance/css, as compared to the JSX syntax.

<comment><USER23> i'm less concerned with what "looks" easier than what's _actually_ easier.

i just can't convince myself "it looks less scary" is worthy of the technical tradeoffs (for me, at the very least).

<comment> a-guest > "looks" easier

I should have been clearer and said: it actually _is_ easier to reason about the html and the dynamic rendering with the approach Glimmer takes.

<comment><USER24> Only for someone who has never seen JSX, and for very simple cases. For anything that goes deeper you have to break the pre-made HTML conditionals and circumvent. For instance the horror an Angular uses goes through to loop an object with "pipes" which are now defined in separate files, whereas everyone else would use Object.keys and that's that. I often wonder, where are the actual benefits with templates, all i can see from using them are critical downsides.

Do this in a template for instance:

        import range from 'lodash/range'

        const Item = ({ number }) =>
{number}

        const App = () => (

                {range(0, 20, 5)
                    .map(index =>
                        <Item number={index} />
                    )
                }

        )

Templates can't even resolve <Item> because they don't know scope. The have no access to `range` either. Instead we're now hacking around with template registrations and injections. This results in a mess of functionality sprinkled all over the place for no good reason.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER25> This is the way _not_ to design a landing page.

1) Ui components for what?

2) "Attention to detail of ember" \- is that a quality comparison, or is it only for ember framework?

3) UI project without a single screenshot?

4) Doesn't mention one actual feature or component

5) GitHub link doesn't go to a repo. Instead it's a list of repos that you have to click around in to find the main project.

6) API docs link goes to a page that is blank except for another link to the actual API docs.

7) Add a few points back because at least they didn't name it CockroachUI (I still have hope the CockroachDB guys will change their name).

Just a guess - rhis was done by someone who has not agonized over bounce rates in google analytics.

<comment><USER26> This is an open source project. Probably there is nobody agonizing over anything on this site (not because they are spending all their time working on the project, but because they probably have full time jobs). It's also likely that if you are arriving here, you probably already know what this is. You probably got here through Ember.

If you want to contribute.

[https://github.com/tomdale/glimmer- website](https://github.com/tomdale/glimmer-website)

<comment><USER27> Personally - I got here through Hacker News

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER28> Did not find easily any live example, should be required for any "UI" library. And should be displayed on the frontpage

<comment><USER22> The API docs themselves are a Glimmer app: [https://glimmerjs.com/api/](https://glimmerjs.com/api/). The source code is here: [https://github.com/glimmerjs/glimmer-api- docs](https://github.com/glimmerjs/glimmer-api-docs)

You may also enjoy the prerequisite turbo-stress-test app:

[https://glimmerjs.com/demos/uptime- boxes/](https://glimmerjs.com/demos/uptime-boxes/)

[https://github.com/glimmerjs/glimmer- demos](https://github.com/glimmerjs/glimmer-demos)

<comment><USER29> do you guys have any benchmarks where the dom tree is not mostly static?

uptime-boxes suffers from the same problems as the original dbmon - the tree is static and the diffing engine has little to do while the DOM mutations are only nodeValue/textContent and className.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER30> "fastest DOM rendering engines, delivering exceptional performance for initial renders as well as updates."

I read this every time new fw pops up. Usually those kind of claims are exceptionally exaggerated.

<comment><USER31> A big difference around that is that Glimmer is not just a new FW. It is an abstracted and consolidated version of the view/component layer that has been battle tested in Ember for years.

</comment></comment><comment><USER32> Looks like its a smaller deployment (38kb) nearly as small as Preact, much smaller than Ember, and brings TypeScript support and <angle-bracket> style components to the ember ecosystem.

<comment><USER13> 38k is not nearly as small as Preact. Preact is 4k.

</comment></comment><comment><USER33> This looks impressive and has been something the Ember community has been looking forward to for a long time, but I wonder whether Glimmer is a tool that will actually sway developers who are not already using Ember to start using it (read: choose Ember over React, Vue, Angular, etc.).

</comment><comment><USER34> For those that want to try it out, it looks like the released ember-cli version doesn't support it. To test it out, you can replace the first instruction on that page with: `yarn global add ember-cli/ember-cli`

(edited for better command)

<comment><USER35> This will do the trick:

        yarn global add ember-cli/ember-cli

<comment><USER36> I get this error when I type 'ember' in terminal "zsh: command not found: ember"

<comment><USER36> figured it out:

1\. Add the following in my .zshrc file: export PATH="$(yarn global bin):$PATH"

2\. "yarn global remove [package-name]" then "yarn global add [package-name]"

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER37> I always wondered what is the business model of a library like this. Is just someone spending hundreds of hours of his free time to create this for the community? Or is there a business model I don't see?

<comment><USER38> In theory you could hope that you find users and afterwards offer consulting and support services for your users. As well as charge for development of custom features/extensions that they need.

I guess in practice I think business models around libraries, frameworks and infrastructure software are hard. There is often lots of competition. And users in the meantime often expect that these things (including support) are for free.

</comment></comment><comment><USER39> This library has a lot of promise for prototyping your app in Glimmer and then dropping it into an Ember framework when the app gets bigger.

However, the whole landing page screams "premature release". The API docs are sparse, the landing page barely conveys what the hell is going on, and there's so many other minor nuances. Why does the GitHub link on the top right go to the website source for example? Everyone pretty much expects to be taken to the __actual __library GitHub.

</comment><comment><USER40> Coming from someone who loved writing apps with Ember, before moving on to other things, I think this is a step in the right direction. Having the UI library as its own standalone thing is a great move.

That said, it's _way_ too hard to figure out how to buy into this thing without adopting the whole ember-cli ecosystem.

Ember-cli is a fantastic achievement, but for god's sake, give me a CDN link with a global `glimmer` object so I can at least play around with the thing in one of my projects, without buying into the entire ecosystem first!

I know that Ember is the "we'll take care of your whole app" framework, but with Glimmer maybe there's a chance here to cater to folks who love libraries like React, because they can get started with about 5 lines of code bunged into an html file and grow from there.

Let me start small, and make it easy for me to grow big.

</comment><comment><USER41> Can anyone compare this to Vue?

</comment><comment><USER42> Fast and "light-weight" Ember UI components _

</comment><comment><USER6> Looking at the docs this looks a bit like Polymer 2.0, except not using ES6 but TS. I like it.

</comment><comment><USER43> Oh no, not again..

</comment><comment><USER44> Tl;dr; Ember is often overkill for a simple app. Glimmer is a lightweight framework, similar to VueJS with tiny build sizes. Being part of the Ember ecosystem, a simple Glimmer app can grow as needed to a full Ember app. "NPM your way to Ember" was the motto they used today at EmberConf. As an Ember AND Vue fanboy, this is cool.

</comment><comment><USER5> Hmm, pretty heavy use of ES6, too (async/await, decorators etc.). Is there any "modern" library left that lets you use the browser's JavaScript engine directly, without transpiling?

<comment><USER45> Neither async/await nor decorators are part of ES6 (which is more properly called ES2015).

Almost all major browsers support ES2015. A few recent versions support async/await, now that it's expected for that syntax to be a part of ES2017. None support decorators (in fact, I'd be surprised if decorators ever make it into the formal ES spec).

<comment><USER5> Compared to other Javascript libraries, it's not that bad, I was just hoping for a second that "extracted the render engine" meant something really lightweight, i.e. something you could just include as a script tag for lightweight use (like "sizzle", back in the days).

It's still going to be worth a look, as I don't mind opinionated stuff for some mid-sized SPAs and tools, I'm just missing a tool for the lower end in my belt these days.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> I can't help but think: yet another front-end library. But Ember being solid, there is probably good reason for this project.

What does Glimmer do that all of the existing view libraries couldn't do ? x-tags, vue, react, preact, etc, etc, etc.

Wouldn't an abstraction layer on top of any of those libraries have avoided the need to create an entirely new project ?

<comment><USER13> I think the abundance of view libraries is evidence that no one has really "solved" it.

</comment></comment><comment><USER29> to avoid repeating myself here: [https://www.reddit.com/r/javascript/comments/6212ym/glimmerj...](https://www.reddit.com/r/javascript/comments/6212ym/glimmerjs_the_rendering_engine_behind_emberjs_can/dfiw396/)</comment>


Ask HN: What is the best HN client? - <AUTHOR> <comment><USER2> HNCute is my personal favorite, I don't use a non-browser or mobile client.

[https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/hncute%C2%A0a-pret...](https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/hncute%C2%A0a-pretty- pink-hack/efcgbnccnagdhbdhnghlldlolfppcfia)

</comment><comment><USER3> Check this [https://hackerbits.com/hacker-news/improve-hacker-news- ui/](https://hackerbits.com/hacker-news/improve-hacker-news-ui/)

I like use [http://hackernews.betacat.io/](http://hackernews.betacat.io/) and ofc HN

</comment><comment><USER4> Use ios app LalaFeed [https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/lalafeed/id1329393379?mt=8](https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/lalafeed/id1329393379?mt=8)

it has a lot of different feeds

</comment><comment><USER5> I would love to have a way to filter out all articles originating from websites in a list that I create and manage. Not sure, but a browser extension might be a good approach.

</comment><comment><USER6> On mobile, I really enjoyed using Material hacker News.

Now, I consume all my feeds, including HN, by RSS, with the awesome project HnRSS.</comment>


Belgium watchdogs: Apple is 'deaf to demands' over consumer rights - <AUTHOR> http://www.zdnet.com/belgium-watchdogs-apple-is-deaf-to-demands-over-consumer-rights-7000009816/

<comment><USER2> I know some guy who had to live a week without his Apple laptop after the power supply broke. He went to the store immediately, then they kept his laptop for a week.

Meanwhile, I had a new component of my own built desktop PC broken, went with it to the store and said it didn't work, and they just took it and immediately gave me a new one without any questions asked or even checking the faulty one. Then I also asked if I could buy a PC speaker to hear the motherboard beeps, and they gave a tiny speaker with two wires, for free!

Both of this was in Belgium. So yes, something is wrong with Apple's warranty in Belgium, compared to other shops.

<comment><USER3> Do you mean the power connector or something internal, rather than power supply? Because the power supply on a Macbook is an external AC adapter, no reason at all for the Macbook to be kept.

<comment><USER4> In Powerbook era, the connector on the PSU cable had no stress reliever. As a result, the cable often broke (I went through three of them, until I got third party PSU with proper cable).

The thing is, that if you claim warranty on Apple product in Europe, they will take it and you have to wait until mothership ships replacement part. The guy the OP mentions might not turn in the whole computer, but what good it makes when your battery is empty and you don't have another PSU.

In related experience, I once had harddrive failure in Powerbook. I had to wait for three weeks, until replacement came, if I wanted to have it serviced under warranty. Or outright buy the replacement part and pay for the service.

Of course, I'm no longer Apple customer.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> This is the same thing they got punished for in Italy, too. In fact, Italy has fined them _twice_ for this crap.

[http://gigaom.com/2012/12/21/italy-fines-apple-again-over- ap...](http://gigaom.com/2012/12/21/italy-fines-apple-again-over-applecare/)

<comment><USER6> I think if the Belgian consumer group is successful in it's case, Apple will have to seriously consider complying with EU law, or face one lawsuit after another in each member state. It would be a public relations nightmare.

</comment></comment><comment><USER7> Offtopic; just curious if anyone knows.

Edit: apparently I wrote some unreadable stuff here :) So simple rewrite:

\- people accidentally drop liquid (bottle of water, coke, coffee, tea) on their macbooks

\- people bring the laptop to Apple (or official partners)

\- Apple says (rightfully so) that it's not covered by their warranty

\- Apple says (in all cases, over 10 i've seen) that the motherboard is gone and needs replacement, which costs E800-E1200 depending on your Macbook

\- after repair Apple (partners) refuses to return the broken motherboard to the paying client

Now, i'm saying that in the cases people found it too expensive and didn't have the macbook repaired (by Apple) that the motherboard was not broken at all and fixable within a few hours by themselves or friends (like me).

So my question: why do they _refuse_ to return the old, broken motherboard to someone who owns the macbook and is paying to have it fixed?

<comment><USER8> Dear Tycho, I'm well versed in English and Dutch, but I have no clue what you're trying to say.

As for dropping quantities of liquid on your Mac: don't do it, or at least get yourself some proper computer insurance. Apple's standard warranty doesn't cover accidents, AppleCare doesn't cover them either. If you bring your water damaged computer to an Apple Store (try Amsterdam), they might take pity on you and replace your computer on the spot, but they're in no way obligated to do so.

<comment><USER7> I guess I shouldn't write HN comments and have a meeting at the same time :) Rewrote it; hope it's clearer now. I'm just curious if anyone saw this behavior.

An official Apple partner repair shop close to Utrecht actually repaired my macbook which got over drenched because of a cat jumping in a bucket accident :) No questions asked and within the Apple care warranty, but they too refused to return the motherboard upon request.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> "within the European Union, two years' warranty must be provided for products free of charge"

There is no such thing, the law refers to something else. Check this: <http://www.apple.com/uk/legal/statutory-warranty/>

<comment><USER10> There is some such thing - that page lists an EU-mandated free warranty period of two years for some defects.

<comment><USER11> vacri is correct.

However, there is more than sufficient misleading ambiguity on that page which contradicts EU law (and likely EU Member State consumer or contract law).

EU law [1] states that a minimum period of 6 months is always available wherein defects that arise after delivery are assumed to have existed at or before delivery unless proven otherwise.

EU law provides for a Member State optional notification obligation on consumers that they have to inform the seller of a fault within 2 months. The UK has chosen not to exercise this notification. Belgium, for example, allows for contracts to specify the existence, length of the notification period (not less than 2 months) and consequences of lack of notification [2].

Similarly, in the case of the UK, "claim period" is ambiguous because under UK Sale of Goods Act 1979, consumers have 6 years to take a claim to court for faulty goods in England, Wales and Northern Ireland (5 years in Scotland) [3].

[1] - [http://eur- lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=CELEX:...](http://eur- lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=CELEX:31999L0044:en:HTML)

[2] - [http://ec.europa.eu/consumers/cons_int/safe_shop/guarantees/...](http://ec.europa.eu/consumers/cons_int/safe_shop/guarantees/CSD_2007_EN_final.pdf)

[3] - [http://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/sale-of- goods/underst...](http://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/sale-of- goods/understanding-the-sale-of-goods-act/your-rights/)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> It's a good thing they are looking into this.

I always figured that these are not "official" stores thus having limited stock and resupply makes them willing to fight consumers over every small repair, replacement and warranty issue.

When these Apple Stores are charging money for repairs that should have been under warranty or pushing their Apple Care products by stating you only have 1 year warranty they are basically taking advantage of uneducated consumers.

Apple stores in Belgium are an extremely negative experience to say the least, I hope this will change eventually.

Until then you should buy your Apple products through the online apple store, no problems there. ( if you happen to be Belgian )

<comment><USER13> > Apple stores in Belgium are an extremely negative experience to say the > least, I hope this will change eventually.

There are no Apple stores in Belgium yet, only resellers working on scary thin margins. They've been consolidating in preparation for the arrival of Apple's own stores, but I doubt it will be enough for them to last very much longer.

</comment></comment><comment><USER14> Although they are absolutely right, it should also be said that Apple is far from unique. Many electronics shops and manufactures have warranty policies and try to sell extra warranty whilst EU consumer laws already mandate minimal warranty standards. As a consumer you almost always have to explicitly assert your rights or you'll get screwed.

Apple has just made itself a high profile target with it's AppleCare Protection Plan, and it doesn't help that Apple is being systematically uncooperative when consumers claim their warranty rights.

<comment><USER10> It doesn't help either that Apple markets itself as premium quality hardware rather than cheap junk. If you were buying cheap chinese knock-offs, you wouldn't gain much sympathy when they didn't honour the two-year minimum, but when you buy 'the premium brand', it's a different story.

</comment></comment><comment><USER15> I do hope they eventually turn their attention to Google's complete opacity. I still find it absurd that it is impossible to call Google about a problem with nearly any of their services.

<comment><USER7> I came here to say this; it's completely weird that Google escapes this; even if you make money for them or pay for their services. Probably because the 'buy X' => 'support X' is not as clear with Google, but their practices are somewhat weird. I had good and bad experiences with adwords, adsense, apps, gmail, analytics and youtube. Mostly bad and all have in common that you actually cannot contact someone who will help you. Vague answers why you have been shot down and no-one seems to care unless they have been affected themselves.

Seems worse than Apple to me, at least I can walk into a shop and just get an answer or get annoyed until they fix it (and they do, no complaints here).

</comment></comment><comment><USER16> Doesn't AppleCare cover a bit more than simple warranty?

<comment><USER17> It does indeed, it gets you additional support, coverage for repairs arising after delivery and so on. Apple even has a handy chart: <http://www.apple.com/uk/legal/statutory-warranty/>

<comment><USER18> Well for example, the first point ("Defects arising after customer takes delivery") is not quite right.

At least in Germany, if the defect is not the fault of the consumer (dropped tablet/iphone), producer has to repair. And that up to two years.

So Apple is intentionally misleading consumers here, to trick them, to buy this care-product.

But on the other hand - it is a tax on peoples stupidity. If you do not know your basic rights as a consumer, my empathy for you being tricked into such a deal is actually on the same level as my sympathy for apple, attempting such a trick: Next to zero.

<comment><USER17> Interesting, I thought it was only for specific cases (failed components etc).

But it's still not a tax on stupidity, it does give you more outside of the hardware repair situation.</comment></comment></comment></comment>


Alex Albon to Join Max, Gasly to Toro Rosso - <AUTHOR> https://redbullracing.redbull.com/article/alex-joins-team <comment><USER2> Kvyat still waiting for his turn...

<comment><USER3> Huh?

He had his turn in 2015-2016. You mean still waiting for another turn?

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniil_Kvyat#Red_Bull_(2015%E2...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniil_Kvyat#Red_Bull_\(2015%E2%80%932016\))</comment></comment>


Let's Encrypt: TLS for NGINX - <AUTHOR> https://www.nginx.com/blog/lets-encrypt-tls-nginx/ <comment><USER2> The default Let's Encrypt client used too much magic and too much sudo for my tastes, so here are my notes for setting up Let's Encrypt with acme.sh without running external code as root: [https://gist.github.com/lachesis/943769f3fac740d5848352752ac...](https://gist.github.com/lachesis/943769f3fac740d5848352752ac08741)

<comment><USER3> I agree. It was comical to me, actually; I tried it as soon as it came out and the first thing it was asking for was my password. This from a group that was supposed to be security conscious? Yeah, no, I'm not sudoing for some "random" script without even being told what was about to happen.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> Why does it show the cert as invalid and when will they fix that?</comment>


FBI Exploits Tor Browser Bundle to Target Child Pornographers - <AUTHOR> http://www.wired.com/2014/08/operation_torpedo/

<comment><USER2> FBI exploits vulnerabilities in old versions of TorBrowser. Solution: only run latest version of TorBrowser.

Did I parse the article correctly?

<comment><USER3> FBI has, in one case where the exploit was spotted and made public (and they probably knew it would be, since it was deployed so widely), exploited an out- of-date version of TorBrowser. No guarantee that they don't use zero-days elsewhere or won't in the future.

This is why I think TorBrowser should switch to Chromium. Whatever you have to say about Google, Chromium is unambiguously more secure than Firefox.

<comment><USER4> If you actually care about security and privacy, then there are plenty of Firefox extensions that go far beyond what can be done with Chromium. Even just adding NoScript to Firefox closes whatever gap still exists.

(Aside from the process-per-tab model, what's Chromium got out of the box that Firefox still lacks?)

<comment><USER5> NoScript equivalent for Chrome is "HTTP Switchboard"

<comment><USER4> Only superficially, and even then, they're not really equivalent. HTTP Switchboard has some blocking features that NoScript users need to use things like AdBlock Plus and RequestPolicy to get. NoScript's features aside from script and plugin blocking are completely beyond the scope of HTTP Switchboard, and some of them are completely unique to NoScript.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> "all computers that access the website" seems the polar opposite of "particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized".

<comment><USER7> Except, these agencies are quick to retroactively redefine terms. Maybe data isn't "seized" until you classify it as evidence.

And if all else fails, "think of the children" usually works.

<comment><USER8> That argument should never hold in a Court. I'm still hoping one of these surveillance cases goes to the Supreme Court.

<comment><USER9> The trick is to shop around for the most loathsome defendants you can find until you get a precedent established, then you can expand the technique's use more broadly.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> That's not all exactly true.

Let me name it: the name of that exploit is EGOTISTICALGIRAFFE.

Sound familiar?

They actually infected everything on that service provider, including Tormail. That was deliberate and part of an NSA op. They didn't hack the server, the hosting provider gave them root. Data seized is being secretly used in various Tormail operations (not covered by warrant), and in "parallel construction" in several drug-bust cases and one related to another leaker. I'm not saying this is a cover, but it is awfully convenient.

</comment><comment><USER11> What's with editorialized title?

The targets are those who downloaded the porn, those who hosted the porn, but - as far as the article discussed - not the pornographers producing the content [1]

[1]Pornographer - one who produces pornography -- [http://www.merriam- webster.com/dictionary/pornographer](http://www.merriam- webster.com/dictionary/pornographer)

<comment><USER12> Interesting... I would tend to think that the highest priority target is the one creating such material and harming minors in the process.

</comment></comment><comment><USER13> Regardless of the legality issue, a privacy bundle subject to these vulnerabilities is not really a privacy bundle.

TOR should stand on its own. If its security is dependent on legal framework than it's insecure.

In my opinion, nothing can ever be considered completely safe. All you can do is make sure the attacker's effort is bigger than the value of what you are protecting is in his view.

</comment><comment><USER14> _But hidden services are also a mainstay of the nefarious activities carried out on the so-called Dark Net: the home of drug markets, child porn, murder for hire, and a site that does nothing but stream pirated My Little Pony episodes._

My God. Those pony-pirating monsters.

</comment><comment><USER15> So let me get this straight: Breaking into other's computer systems to gain unauthorised access is only illegal/unethical for the little people - is that right?

<comment><USER16> Not exactly... it's kind of like asking whether peeping into someone else's home at night is only illegal for the little people. For you and me, it's stalking. For a police force that has presented probable cause, evidence, etc to a judge and been awarded a search warrant or wiretap, it's normal investigative technique.

<comment><USER15> The problem I have with this technique specifically is that it takes advantage of software vulnerabilities that arguably should be reported to the vendor and fixed.

If we accept that it's just fine for government agencies (and remember, it might not be a government in your own country) to find exploits, not report them in order to protect people who use that software, and keep those to themselves for their own benefit, then I have a problem with that. It leaves people at risk of being infiltrated not just by (some government agency) but by criminals e.g. looking for their credit card information.

Put another way, let's suppose you find a vulnerability in Chrome. Do you:

1) Report it to Google, wait until a patch is available, and then discuss it publicly (aka responsible disclosure)

2) Keep it for yourself, or sell to a government agency (possibly that of a country not friendly to your own) to take advantage of

The thing I really have a major beef with is that so many people think that option 2 is just fine. Software should be secure - everyone in the industry has a responsibility to protect users, not leave them vulnerable.

<comment><USER17> I would agree, but then consider what happens after that - the FBI and similar in other countries have no other options left, and the path of least resistance for them is now to go to politicians and ask for Tor itself to be banned.

Though I hate to say it, a system that (accidentally) allows police forces to deanonymise select individuals whilst other actors cannot do so, and even the police cannot do so in bulk all the time, is not a terrible tradeoff. Snowden has made similar remarks, I believe. Of course the supply of zero-days is presumably not infinite. As pointed out, if Tor had more manpower they'd maybe switch to Chrome which is much harder to exploit. So this situation whilst it may not seem ideal is perhaps the frying pan, and as endpoint security improves we may find ourselves in the fire.

I recently proposed on tor-dev that individual relays be able to stop acting as introduction points for specific hidden services, with exactly this scenario in mind. They ignored me of course. They seem to feel invincible.

<comment><USER18> Great comment.

Can you give a brief explanation about why Chrome would be harder to exploit than Firefox is when used with Tor?</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment>


Would you trade your digital privacy for free pizza? - <AUTHOR> https://medium.com/datascan-digest/would-you-trade-your-digital-privacy-for-free-pizza-945abb9e98a7 <comment><USER2> diabetes, high cholesterol, cardiovascular health, stroke risk...we give up much more than that for the same food products why would you be surprised?

</comment><comment><USER3> I'm not precisely a pizza fan, so no, but

Devil's advocate, literally ALL of my personal info is online and (sadly) very easily searchable, so at this point...

might as well get some free food out of it...</comment>


Is it Ballmer's fault? - <AUTHOR> http://news.cnet.com/8301-13505_3-10419508-16.html?part=rss&subj=news&tag=2547-1_3-0-20

<comment><USER2> Pretty hard to say.

I'd say it's just MS's size that has done them in. When you get that big, it's just too hard to change your dominant technology and business cultures.

Plus, I'd say there's a general lack of elegance about the whole MS empire. It's more "hack it until it works," at all levels of their software stacks. Not that there aren't a whole bunch of brilliant folks laboring there, nor that there isn't good software in their stable, but I think they're laboring without people at the top who have some clear sense of "taste" as well as some clear sense of long-term technical vision.

Or maybe they do have those people, and their vision is just out of date or wrong-headed.

Windows Mobile is probably the best example of this. Who in their right minds would think that just subsetting Windows itself would be a good idea on a mobile device? Including assuming a little mouse-like pointing device, so the whole WIMP stack could be used unchanged? People who are blindly convinced that the Windows API is the best and doesn't need to adapt or change or grow to move with changing environments, I guess.

</comment><comment><USER3> three (or two-point-something) words:

"management by managers"</comment>


It's a software free-for-all: Apple puts pressure on MS and Surface - <AUTHOR> http://virtualpants.com/post/64869188068/its-a-software-free-for-all

<comment><AUTHOR> Can Microsoft shift strategies fast enough to combat free software from Apple and Google? It'll be tough, but they have enough market share that they might have plenty of time.

<comment><USER2> It's not free, it's gratis.

<comment><AUTHOR> What's the difference?

<comment><USER2> audio-video.gnu.org/video/2013-08-05--rms--new-york--new-york-city- university.ogv

also rest of gnu.org, fsf.org etc.

(is this a trolling question?)</comment></comment></comment></comment>


Teach our kids to code - <AUTHOR> http://blog.jgc.org/2011/09/teach-our-kids-to-code.html <comment><USER2> Somewhat related: Chris Smith is teaching kids programming using a tiny subset of Haskell, the Gloss graphics library, and a web framework that he built around Gloss, using the SafeHaskell extension.

His experiences can be followed through his blog. Previous posts:

[http://cdsmith.wordpress.com/2011/08/16/haskell-for-kids- wee...](http://cdsmith.wordpress.com/2011/08/16/haskell-for-kids-week-1/)

[http://cdsmith.wordpress.com/2011/08/23/haskell-for-kids- wee...](http://cdsmith.wordpress.com/2011/08/23/haskell-for-kids-week-2/)

[http://cdsmith.wordpress.com/2011/09/03/haskell-for-kids- wee...](http://cdsmith.wordpress.com/2011/09/03/haskell-for-kids-week-3/)

[http://cdsmith.wordpress.com/2011/09/10/haskell-for-kids- wee...](http://cdsmith.wordpress.com/2011/09/10/haskell-for-kids-week-4/)

Well worth the read, and a good example of how programming can be taught to children.

</comment><comment><USER3> You could also mention the Ruby-based Hackety Hack, a tutorial environment built on top of the Shoes GUI toolkit, targeted at tweens. You don't have to use toy languages.

Once they are proficient with the tutorials, students should be able to develop full-fledged Shoes apps which can be packaged as stand-alone executables. Shoes makes it extremely easy (and fun) to create and share games and other graphical programs.

<http://hackety-hack.com/>

<http://shoesrb.com/>

<comment><USER4> Yeah, or they could not. HH is a great idea, but with a tutorial that most people it's targeted at can't follow.

It's the kind of thing programmers love, "look, it teaches people to code using my favorite language!", but doesn't actually do anything to teach kids to program.

If you want to teach someone to code, start them off with Scratch (or something similar), then pick a language to start with based on their intentions. If they want to learn gamedev, for example, give them C++.

Yes, I fully expect this to be downvoted to hell and back because of all the _why worshipping on HN. I'm fine with that.

<comment><USER3> _> HH is a great idea, but with a tutorial that most people it's targeted at can't follow._

Do you have any real life experience about this?

<comment><USER4> Yes. I recommended it to a few people squarely in it's target market and not a single one could understand HH, and not one even wanted to use it. The same people then learned various languages through different means and had no problems. To me that is pretty damning.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> > What we don't need is to teach a specific language. Any language will do.

Except BASIC. Anything but BASIC.

If I had to pick a language to teach 9-10 year olds, I'd probably go with Python. Of the 'real languages' (by which I mean languages substantially used in industry/academia for real applications), I think python has the least overhead to get your head around before you can write functioning code.

<comment><USER6> Python sure. Moving into... Ruby possibly, or potentially PHP (if you combine it with one of the better/easier frameworks) and then HTML.

The latter ones because you can start to get them to deploy/work on websites. Being able to write websites is a generally useful skill nowadays (even if you don't go into programming.. all my family need/want websites, for example).

I teach an after school IT club and a project to maintain/develop a site on the school intranet has consistently been the favourite :) Because it's something functional and visible!

(and also a good opportunity to teach about security issues what with the trial-by-fire environment a school brings :D)

EDIT: the other good thing about web-dev is that it needs a few different skills - design, back-end coding, infrastructure/sysops and databases which a) gives them a taster of all the career opportunities and b) lets different people "shine" in different areas, and contribute their strongest skill to the final project.

<comment><USER7> When you get to know Python, you don't need to "move into" Ruby or ( _shudder_ ) PHP. It's much easier to learn a web programming framework in Python and how to deploy it, rather than to learn how your second programming language differs from Python.

The sad state of client-side programming is that you need to learn a lot about the messy world of HTML, CSS and JavaScript. Come to think of it, CoffeeScript might be a good language to start with today?

<comment><USER6> _shrug_

In my experience PHP or Ruby is generally a better/easier web programming experience (I tried Python but it never really clicked with the kids).

Python is a good general purpose language though.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> Best way to learn kids to code is Scratch imho. My 4 year old daughter loves it <http://scratch.mit.edu/>

<comment><USER9> Your 4yo knows scratch? I'm trying to get my son interested in programming but it's been frustrating for both of us. He is a lefty in house of righties so the mouse never works the way he wants it to.

If he doesn't make a good programmer he'll be a master mechanic. I've given him a precision screw driver set and he's gotten quite good at taking things apart.

I'll give scratch another try in a year or so.

<comment><USER8> The interface is really a bit too hard, generally she have to explain to me when she want to do something more complicated, but she can drag and drop stuff from the sidebar to the active area and rearrange the stuff there, also entering numbers is fun generally she wants all numbers to be at 100.

I would really want to have a scratch version for the ipad. The graphical visualization of programming is excellent, but it's really too complicated with a mouse. Also, painting with a mouse really sucks when compared to painting with a touchscreen.

Looking at her with the ipad, the mouse really feels like a legacy device.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> _The petition itself is marred by a rather confused statement of its aims which seem to cover teaching children to code and doing something about the gender gap in IT._

This was my first thought too. A noble aim to be sure, but it would be nice to see it cast with broader aims!

<comment><USER10> I agree, although that didn't stop me from signing the petition. When I was at school I was told, "I.T. isn't a real subject", and was prevented from taking it. It was seen as a drop-out's subject.

That kind of attitude has to change, and although I think the wording of the petition could be better, I'll sign anything in the hope of getting this issue noticed.

<comment><USER5> But I.T. _isn't_ a real subject, at least not how I was taught it. The mandatory course I took at school was essentially a certificate that says "This person can work the basics of the Microsoft Office software suite". No- one in the class didn't know everything already, since we already used Word, Powerpoint and Excel for our other work. If they taught some actual Computer Science rather than just computer use, it would be a real subject in my opinion.

<comment><USER6> I think the former has value to people with no aspirations in CS (a lot of value, really, everyone needs basic IT skills in the modern world).

But you're right... they need to divide them - so teach "Basic IT Skills" (or w/e) and Computer Science as separate courses. A lot of the kids I teach are really put off by their IT classes because it is all about competency and not creativity.

<comment><USER11> "I think the former has value to people with no aspirations in CS (a lot of value, really, everyone needs basic IT skills in the modern world)."

Well yes, but let me tell you a little story.

One of the things that I get to notice, as a woman, which my male colleagues don't, is just how repetitive womens' work often is in the office. I have a lot of female friends that are secretaries, receptionists, assistants etc, which I don't think is true of most men working in IT. And I see how much of the daily grind of what those women do could be automated, if only they knew how to put together macros, or even just how to make use of tools like Automator on the Mac. I have tried teaching macro programming to a couple of them, but they get stuck on the simplest of programming concepts. What's a variable? How can I expresss a complex algorithm given a small set of primitives? Flow control, what's that?!?!

I can't help thinking that if they had learned these very simple basic concepts when they were back learning about how to set tabs in Word, that they would be many times more effective in their office jobs today. So even if someone has no interest in CS as a career, the reality is that these days many, if not a majority, of jobs could be helped by it - running a small business, office work, etc. But if you leave it until the person is an adult out in the workforce, they often won't want to learn.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> I think that there should be good classes that kids can opt into, but personally I don't think that it should be compulsory. There is a tendency for adults to want their children to be like them (but better of course). Probably every fire fighter wants their kids to follow in their footsteps.

On a personal note, whilst I sit as both 'coder' and 'business' person I enjoy my children learning about what I do without pushing them. What I love to do with my kids is to take them out into the world so that they experience different cultures, discover nature, learn to kayak, ride bikes and.... well, be kids. If they develop an interest in something then I will support them, but I'll not be a pushy parent. I would be delighted if my children followed in my footsteps, but as long as they do their very best in whatever path they choose to follow that will make me the proudest

<comment><USER13> Lack of exposure to activities like coding is a problem in society beyond HN- types. These activities should be something children are exposed to in school because their home environments will not provide this exposure.

</comment></comment><comment><USER14> I have some hazy memories of them trying to teach us Logo in the mid 80s but little beyond that.

I think it's a good idea because it's so cross-discipline _and_ can be made 'fun' (doing mostly simplified graphics programming, etc). Things like teamwork, math, music, art, logic, English, and even the scientific method can all combine into a project that's both productive and fun.

Maybe times have changed but I was at school, subjects were strongly compartmentalized and rarely combined (other than the occasional bit of math in a physics class), yet in the real world, combining disciplines makes up most of the work day.

</comment><comment><USER15> This is a fascinating topic that is always debated. There's always arguments about how young, which language (BASIC, Logo, Scratch, Python, Haskell (yikes!)), which paradigm (functional, OOP, imperative/procedural, logic, etc). I think the point that Eric Schmidt made in the article is that the only wrong move is not to teach anything :) As long as something is being taught about how computer hardware and software works, it's a move in the right direction! His concern is that students are taught only oversimplified computer skills like using a word processor and a spreadsheet rather than understanding some basics about computer science and engineering.

I'm currently teaching introductory programming to non-engineering majors at a major university in C (yes I know uggh, I would have gone with Python). I've noticed what seems to be the biggest problem is that the computer education that was given to these kids earlier in school didn't teach any independent, critical thought. They struggle when things aren't EXACTLY as they were taught to them (e.g. if the Microsoft Word icon is on a different part of the desktop). I've been trying to teach them to use their brains and to try to understand how to solve a problem without asking me for help. I try to make it clear that I do not have the answers to every question regarding computers...neither does any other person on the planet. It requires deduction, inference, experimenting, lots of Google searches, forum posts, and infinite patience. Turns out they can handle it! You just have to let them believe in themselves and let them struggle with it for a bit. In the end, they appreciate it and enjoy it more! I even show them a lot of things that people feel might be too advanced, such as the command line and interfacing with external libraries. They can get it if you can break it down for them. I think often the problem is that the teachers themselves are not experts in programming and have difficult conveying info to students.

</comment><comment><USER16> I taught my kids Scratch from MIT. I think that is sufficient for the _average_ 9/10 year old. Then the girl went on to learn more on her own and is now programming electronics.

If LOGO is no longer being taught in schools as it seems, then we have a problem. LOGO is what made me love programming. That fucking turtle/pixel. Goddamn.

<comment><USER17> Try 'import turtle' at the Python REPL some day. :)

<comment><USER16> AWESOME

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER18> The problem, I feel, with my generation is that we're too often called 'Digital Natives'. We lull ourselves into believing that we are 'good with computers' when in reality we haven't a clue as to whats going on beneath the surface. To make a comparison, its like being able to operate a microwave oven versus understanding how a microwave oven works. We press a few buttons and four minutes later that frozen lasagne is piping hot. But from a purely academic point of view, wouldn't it be fantastic if everyone had an understanding of the process in between?

Oh, and list 10 distinct careers where an in-depth knowledge of the Haber process is required, as that is one of the areas taught in GCSE Science for a disproportionate length of time.

Just my 2 cents \- J

</comment><comment><USER19> This leads to another question, do we teach our kids imperative programming, or functional programming?

<comment><USER20> It's valuable to be able to know how to approach problems from different angles and be able to work with different constraints. So why not both?

</comment></comment><comment><USER21> Even better, teach your kids to code. Cut out the middleman.

<comment><USER22> A+.

I have my 7-year-old using Scratch and she loves it. It's a great intro to analytical thinking & problem solving. Even if she doesn't carry on programming it is a valuable thing to learn for life in general.

<comment><USER23> Your 7 year old should be playing outside.

Don't take their childhood away so they can live by your standards.

<comment><USER22> First, that is a remark with extraordinarily sexist undertones. What makes you think that she doesn't love it? Have you ever used Scratch, or even looked at it? It's a huge cartoon-and-legos playground. It's great for kids. But moreover, she likes problem solving. But I guess to you, that's not the domain of women or girls.

"He must be thrusting this upon her, because little girls don't love problem solving!"

Give me a break. Judging from your other posts in this thread you sound like a very judgmental, smug & condescending person, exactly the characteristics I point out the folly of to my kid. Plus, you're just way off-base, factually.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER24> python/pygame

</comment><comment><USER23> No no no no please no. Don't teach them to code. Teach them to think first.

If you give someone a hammer without telling them how to use it, they are going to hit some fingers and get frustrated.

I think we should teach children to understand mathematics at an algorithmic level and let them see that programming is a tool/hammer for executing those algorithms. Unfortunately current educators tend to concentrate on the pure mechanical aspects of mathematics such as arithmetic and punching numbers into off-the-shelf formulae which is the real problem.

Personally, they should just throw in valid use cases that map to reality like calculating GCDs or Newton's method and let them knock up the programs in TI- BASIC on their standard issue TI-84's.

That's enough for school, even to A-level.

Footnote: For reference I was brought up at school in the UK on LOGO, BBC BASIC (6502 and ARM), LEGO Dacta and TI BASIC. Life was good for me, but I know that my peers found it frustrating when they just wanted to solve a problem and go home.

<comment><USER25> I completely disagree with this, programming is a fundamental skill in a variety of careers and can be used as a tool to teach how to think.

It isn't an either-or proposition, incorporating programming exercises into any science oriented class can not only be illustrative, it like any sort of hands on lab does teach students to think like a scientist and helps to create a more realistic microcosm of how science is actually done these days, with programming forming a bridge between theory and experiment and heavily relied on in analysis.

<comment><USER26> List 10 distinct careers where programming is a fundamental skill.

<comment><USER27> Pretty much anywhere people use Excel. Any job where people use spreadsheets and their output is quantified and measured against their peers is ripe for automation by enterprising individuals. Why not be the fastest, most accurate analyst on your team?

From pg: _"To get rich you need to get yourself in a situation with two things, measurement and leverage. You need to be in a position where your performance can be measured, or there is no way to get paid more by doing more. And you have to have leverage, in the sense that the decisions you make have a big effect."_

And also from Zed Shaw: _"Programming as a profession is only moderately interesting. It can be a good job, but you could make about the same money and be happier running a fast food joint. You're much better off using code as your secret weapon in another profession.

People who can code in the world of technology companies are a dime a dozen and get no respect. People who can code in biology, medicine, government, sociology, physics, history, and mathematics are respected and can do amazing things to advance those disciplines."_

[1] <http://www.paulgraham.com/wealth.html>

[2] <http://learnpythonthehardway.org/book/advice.html>

<comment><USER23> Reminder: pg and zed are not deities. They have an opinion.</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment>


Engine Yard Buys OpDemand, Maker of Deis, a PaaS Built on Containers - <AUTHOR> http://thenewstack.io/engine-yard-buys-opdemand-maker-of-deis-a-paas-built-on-containers/

<comment><USER2> I work at EY, and while I wasn't directly involved in this acquisition, if anyone has any questions or concerns about what this means for Engine Yard customers or Deis users, I am happy to attempt to answer.</comment>


Zynga Confirms Xbox Head Don Mattrick As New CEO - <AUTHOR> http://allthingsd.com/20130701/in-major-hire-zynga-confirms-xbox-head-mattrick-as-new-ceo-replacing-founder/?mod=tweet

<comment><USER2> One thing that has gotten lost in the noise of Xbox One's marketing mishap and the targeting of Mattrick is perhaps his history as a true entrepreneur.

While it hasn't shown so lately, Don does come from a grassroots background in gaming as a former 17 year old co-founder and programmer of Distinctive Software in 1982. His company was acquired by EA which likely put him on the path to executive level success. A kind of exit that some founders dream about.

It's easy to make a judgement and discredit or target him but I do believe he has genuine passion for gaming and hopefully he can infuse some of that in a place like Zynga.

<comment><USER3> Passion for gaming is great. He has a /lot/ of that.

However: Not a very good technical leader, extremely isolated from the troops (even the principal ones who are designing the new products) which badly affected direction and morale, and very bad at messaging (which I suspect is the /real/ reason he's going).

Of course, what replaces him could be worse.

<comment><USER4> > and very bad at messaging (which I suspect is the /real/ reason he's going).

Was not he the guy who pushed for Kinect? I am not aware much about MS's internal politics but the timeline seems to match.

If so, then the real reason, in my humble opinion, is this: Microsoft is now about to fight for the 8th generation with an underpowered yet $100 more expensive console.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> With what little info we have, this seems actually like a good move. Part of Zynga's core problem is that their games are frequently more psycological tweakery than legitimately rewarding or fun.

Importing someone who comes from "real" gaming seems like a good move in this regard. Hopefully this means Zynga intends to move towards "fun games with microtransactions" and away from "pretty one-armed bandits with microtransactions".

<comment><USER6> Xbox One, _real_ gaming? A machine that was going to lock all your gaming purchases down, so you couldn't even share your physical discs with friends? A company that charged $10,000 for patches—even trivial ones fixing serious, game-breaking bugs?

Microsoft's gaming division has become the definition a "pretty one-armed bandit with microtransactions", and no doubt thanks to Mattrick.

<comment><USER7> >so you couldn't even share your physical discs with friends?

Yeah, what assholes, instead they made it so you don't have to screw around with physical media and can instead share your games with 10 of your friends around the world without having to deal with a disc.

Also, they just removed that update fee.

Besides, bitching about the Xbox One's distribution model is kinda overdone at this point.

<comment><USER8> _Yeah, what assholes, instead they made it so you don 't have to screw around with physical media and can instead share your games with 10 of your friends around the world without having to deal with a disc._

Well, to be fair, there was nothing really concrete about their plans. And now that they've changed their minds they can talk big about how awesome it would have been. But I seriously doubt the end result would have amazing as everyone claimed it would have been.

<comment><USER7> Those details (that I mentioned) were fully disclosed before they changed their policies, obviously.

It's not Microsoft's fault that reddit blew up in a circle-jerk of misinformation. Granted, they could have marketed it better and made that story clearer.

<comment><USER9> _fully disclosed_

 _reddit circle-jerk of misinformation_

I'll post this again, from an interview taken on June 10th.

 _[Phil] Spencer: But we 're also trying to launch and we understand feature sets. We've got partners and publishers [we] want to talk to about how lending is going to work. We don't dictate pricing to our partners on our platform. We want to give them capabilities to support content and business models that they want to support with their content. It sounds like Sony is trying to do the same thing. How do we support what our partners want to do? We want to have the conversations with them and land on a plan.

We understand lending and the benefits of lending, so, funny videos aside, we get it. We want to make sure we land on the right solution that fits a digital ecosystem moving forward.

If you think about lending in digital ecosystems, it's not something a lot of other people have supported. We're going to commit... gifting, we said we're going to support that, secondary market we're going to support that even though the license is digital and it's not as trivial as just handing a disc to someone else. Lending, we want to do it, we want to work with our partners to make it possible.

Kotaku: You understand, obviously, that because these things exist on discs, it's why it seems so odd that—you're not launching until November—since I would think I can lend you this notebook and discs, surely I could do the same, but you guys are saying that you won't have the lending solution.

Spencer: We don't have a lending solution today.

Kotaku: You might have one?

Spencer: We don't have a path... I don't want to make a commitment to somebody without a plan of record on how that lands. I could over-promise, under- deliver on the features. I don't want to do that. I want to make sure. I understand how gifting is going to work. I understand how the secondary market is going to work._

From Phil Spencer's own mouth, sharing was never an actual feature of the XBox One.

[http://kotaku.com/the-xbox-one-believers-513819282](http://kotaku.com/the- xbox-one-believers-513819282)

<comment><USER7> That _whole article_ that you link to is about the Share with 10 Family Members feature, leading me to conclude that "lending" in that sentence is explicitly physical lending and... you know... from the context directly around it, reselling used games.

>Xbox One will enable new forms of access for families. Up to ten members of your family can log in and play from your shared games library on any Xbox One.

That's a concrete statement from MS and one they made numerous times. And they more or less say "yes, we don't care who the 10 people actually are".

I mean, come on, did we both read the same block of text? It is extremely explicit at the end about being physical lending.

<comment><USER9> Saying "we don't care who the 10 people are" is a world of difference from "there are _no restrictions_ on the 10 people you can share with." It is not implementation details that are defined in a contract. It is not information.

And again, Spencer was talking about "lending in a digital ecosystem." The thing Microsoft did not have concrete plans for. Yes, he mentioned they have a plan for _gifting_ games, they have a plan for _reselling_ games, but he contrasted this with the difficulty of, and their lack of plan for _lending_ games.

Yeah I guess it's moot now, but at this point I _always_ interpret a lack of specifics when talking about a product as marketing speak. We have fact sheets, we have plenty of discreet, unambiguous information of other features; when somebody goes out of the way to hype up a feature of a product while painstakingly avoiding concrete, verifiable information about said feature, and verifiable information about said feature doesn't appear in the previously mentioned fact sheets, I assume the feature doesn't actually exist yet. Especially when an executive goes on to literally say the feature doesn't exist.

<comment><USER7> I took the references to the "notebook and disks" in the critical section of that interview to be implication of physical disc trading/lending but I understand what you're saying.

Still. I mean, this is what they published to the world as their official feature list: [http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:s-KgYAn...](http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:s-KgYAnQDlEJ:news.xbox.com/2013/06/license+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us) before they published the update in response to the butthurt backlash.

"Give your family access to your entire games library anytime, anywhere: Xbox One will enable new forms of access for families. Up to ten members of your family can log in and play from your shared games library on any Xbox One. Just like today, a family member can play your copy of Forza Motorsport at a friend's house. Only now, they will see not just Forza, but all of your shared games. You can always play your games, and any one of your family members can be playing from your shared library at a given time."

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> Great hire for Zynga. Don is hugely respected at Microsoft and was actually tipeed to be a potential Ballmer successor. Big loss for Microsoft.

<comment><USER11> Interesting. It seems a lot of "potential Ballmer successors" have been let go from Microsoft in the past few years, from Ray Ozzie to Sinofsky, and now this one, too.

I wonder what this means for Zynga - more DRM?

<comment><USER10> I don't this in the same vein. I think Don was well-liked all around.

<comment><USER12> Did that hold up after the One debacle that lead to a total about face? And he was at least part of it, with comments like "if you can't take advantage of the xbox one, we have a solution for you. The xbox 360" (not exact wording but you get the point).

I could very much imagine the whole mess costing him a lot within MS and leading to him looking to go somewhere else and start over.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER13> Looks like Pincus is staying around though, which seems odd. If the board is unhappy with his performance (and rightfully so), wouldn't starting fresh be a better move?

<comment><USER14> Did you read the part where it stated Mark Pincus has a 61% voting control in Zynga?</comment></comment>