How to Become a Billionaire - <AUTHOR> http://peterdiamandis.com/post/95751083543/how-to-become-a-billionaire

<comment><USER2> Incredibly annoying - implements its own scroll bar and doesn't respond to PgDn, PgUp, space, arrows, or anything except using the mouse. Breaks my entire workflow and user experience.

Is this deliberate? Excellent way to take focus off content and onto irrelevancies. I cannot adequately express my contempt for "designers" who do this - they need to be slapped.

</rant>

<comment><USER3> I wouldn't think too much about it, it's just an off-the-shelf tumblr theme: [http://pixelrevel.com/themes/tumblr/novelist/](http://pixelrevel.com/themes/tumblr/novelist/)

\--

Personally the more important question which the post doesn't answer is: What have these companies achieved and how are their current plans coming along?

<comment><USER2>
      > ... it's just an off-the-shelf tumblr theme ...

That makes it worse - they've looked at it, chosen it, and it actively breaks the users' experience and detract from the content. The fact that it's a readily available theme just means that other people will choose it because they think it looks nice, without regard for their readers. Again.

Eurgh.

</comment></comment></comment><comment> bjelkeman-again I think it may be easier to help a billion people, in certain contexts, if you don't focus on making a billion in the process. People in my team decided that a decent salary is sufficient. Helping at least a billion people is the goal.

</comment><comment><USER4> While I think most of us can agree it's a very link-baity title, the content itself was worth the read. Some wonderful projects have come out of Singularity University, with Matternet being my personal favorite. The future benefits of Matternet on global aid and relief could be astounding.

 __Edited. Too early in the morning, thanks tomp! __

<comment><USER5> You mean Matternet?

[http://matternet.us/](http://matternet.us/)

</comment></comment><comment><USER6> Judging by the article, I'm thinking the way to become a billionaire is to manufacture cheap 3D printer and drone parts.

</comment><comment><USER7> Catchy titles but inspiring list of startup works. Good luck guys.

</comment><comment><USER8> 404</comment>


Canada's top science prize goes to Stephen Cook - <AUTHOR> http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/national/Canada+science+prize+goes+computer+math+whiz+Stephen+Cook/8020598/story.html

<comment><USER2> There are things mentioned in this article that are completely wrong. There are also comments here that show a complete misunderstanding of the P vs. NP question in general, but I won't address these.

The constraint problem here with only pairs of incompatible students is a instance of 2SAT, which is solvable in quadratic time (i.e. in P; note: the complexity here is the possible number of pairs, not just students). To make it reside in NP, it has to be at least 3SAT. Essentially, this is equivalent to also indicating triples of students that are incompatible (while the pairs of any of the students in the triple may or may not be compatible). Since the dean explicitly does not provide this information, we are all good and are in the position of solving this problem efficiently.

Also, Cook did not invent the P vs. NP problem. He is often credited as the person who first formalized it and studied it to a sufficient degree. The first mention of the P vs. NP problem I know of is in a letter from Godel to Von Neumann (<http://rjlipton.wordpress.com/about/>).

</comment><comment><USER3> Is example about finding accommodation for 100 from 400 students, given in article, well formulated? Say dean gives you an empty list, then what is so difficult in selecting 100 random students?

<comment><USER4> It is well-formulated. One could come up with instances of other NP-complete problems that have trivial solutions, like "What if there are only two cities and one road between them? Then the Traveling Salesman Problem isn't that hard!" [1]

If the dean gives you a decently sized list, figuring out such an accommodation is very difficult (it grows exponentially with the number of students).

[1] <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Travelling_salesman_problem>

<comment><USER3> Say he gives you a list of 300 students who can't go together in rooms. You say, good, I will take the remaining 100 students, and give them rooms. It even has unique solution :)

<comment><USER5> Any NP-Complete problem will have cases that are trivial. The complexity of the problems is how they grow in the worst case.

<comment><USER6> Correction: every natural NP-complete problem will have easy cases. You can construct problems for which there is no easy case, which is a shame since I thought at one point you could use this trait to seperate P and NP

<comment><USER5> Interesting. How do you need to define "easy" for this to work? Can you give an example of a problem without an easy solution? Has this class of problem been studied?

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> He's a phenomenal lecturer too, I really enjoyed taking both courses I took from him. Well deserved award!

<comment><USER8> Can't wait for CSC463 !</comment></comment>


Ask HN: Any startup working on a os for consumer routers? - <AUTHOR> It seems that this last couple of years we have seen the hardware side of the average consumer router evolve quite a bit (probably due the volume economy from smartphone).The software on the other side haven't progress as nicely  : 1 - Lot of security issues and bugs
2 - No automatic update 3 - Complex configuration 4 - Usually missing basic feature like parental control, bandwith allocation,vpns etc...
There are a lot of opensource OSes and project for router but most of them end up target at either hackers or enthusiast.
Why isn't anybody trying to build a better software platform for consumer routers ? The only real initiative we have seen lately is google's onhub. <comment><USER2> What about appliance created using open source OS like : \- [https://www.pfsense.org/products/](https://www.pfsense.org/products/) \- [https://www.clearos.com/products/hardware/clearbox- overview](https://www.clearos.com/products/hardware/clearbox-overview) \- [http://www.endian.com/products-overview/](http://www.endian.com/products- overview/) \- [https://www.untangle.com/untangle-ng- firewall/appliances/](https://www.untangle.com/untangle-ng- firewall/appliances/)

<comment><AUTHOR> Most of those initiative are not targeted at the consumer level

</comment></comment><comment><USER3> You wouldn't need to do much more than put a pretty front-end on (free|open)BSD to have a decent consumer router. You can even do this with commodity hardware: [http://rtfm.net/FreeBSD/ERL/](http://rtfm.net/FreeBSD/ERL/)

<comment><AUTHOR> I totaly agree on this. All this really need is a nice web front end and some nice apis for smarphones/plugin apps. My questions is mainly given that this shouldnt technically very challenging why is nobody giving it a shot. Why BSD vs Linux ?

<comment><USER4> I'm skeptical you could convince a mainstream homeowner to switch from the router that Verizon or Comcast supplies to them. You would have to 1) Make it wireless, the one I have from Comcast is a wireless router and I don't want to loose functionality 2) Make the new router have seamless setup with some device I can't get to work with my other router....maybe xbox, home automation, etc. 3) Make it dead simple for me to swap the $6/month I'm paying Verizon and start paying you instead...I do not want to call Verizon customer support...ever.

Because Verizon and others have conditioned people to pay a monthly fee, but they don't back that up with any updates for software or hardware, there should be an opportunity to offer a better substitute.

<comment><AUTHOR> Good points. I wouldnt think that trying to sell directly to consumer is a viable business model. As you pointed that the number of people who actually think of buying a new router is just too small. I was thinking of something like what google is doing with android of their onHub platform. Build the software, and licence it (or sell support) to booth hardware manufacture (asus,netgear) and ISPs.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> Good question, but I'd suggest a title correction:

"a os -> "an OS"

<comment><AUTHOR> Can't update the title :(</comment></comment>


Review of RStudio (new IDE for R) - <AUTHOR> http://www.stat.columbia.edu/~cook/movabletype/archives/2011/03/rstudio_first_impression.html

<comment><AUTHOR> IDE announcement generated enthusiasm on HN a few days ago: <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2271511>

</comment><comment><USER2> Isn't R GPLv2? Isn't that incompatible with AGPLv3?

<comment><USER3> I don't know anything about the details, but apparently it's mostly GPLv2 or later: <https://svn.r-project.org/R/trunk/doc/COPYRIGHTS>

<comment><USER2> Well, I'll be. That certainly paints a different picture than what's stated in <http://www.r-project.org/Licenses/>

Thanks!

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> This is confusing because R-Studio (with a hyphen) is also a file recovery utility...</comment>


Passion Does Not Cause Success - <AUTHOR> http://www.ajkesslerblog.com/passion/

<comment><USER2> I disagree. People _are_ born passionate, and passion certainly contributes mightily to success, though I wouldn't say it causes it outright.

But passion can be kindled -- on this I agree, though I think it takes some soul-searching; just trying things is unlikely to work, though you could get lucky.

<comment><AUTHOR> People are born curious, or interested, or aware. You might consider that a passion for learning or exploring, which I certainly think you could argue is stronger in some people than in others. But, nobody is born passionate about a career or profession or job. (And yes, passion contributes mightily to success. But it doesn't precede success, which was the point of the post.)

Having seen a lot of people try to find their passion, it's become pretty clear to me that it takes action. You can sit in a room for as long as you want, searching the depths of your soul, meditating, whatever you want to call it, but without actually going out and trying things, you're never going to find something you're passionate about.</comment></comment>


Live until your dying day - <AUTHOR>

Live until your dying day.
Facing death, you have nothing to lose. The last thing you'll ever wanted to lose, your life, will be taken from you.
The moment you hear you are going to die is the moment you start living. You won't lose, you'll win. Dying is a known factor, which means that it starts to matter what you do until you die. When you have nothing to lose, the only thing you can do is winning.
Unfortunately, you won't die any time soon. You have things to lose. But when will you start winning?
Life is pretty fucking long. Everybody keeps blabla-ing about life being short, but those are the people who realize life's been long until it is too late. Then, life is short. Imagine the things you can do in an hour. What do you do in a day? How much do you produce in forty hours? How many seas can you cross in a month? How many mountains can you move in eighty years? Life is long.
There's another source of blabla coming from people who have found happiness. They can't stop talking about it. It's in the path towards victory. In little things. In friendship. Fuck path's, fuck little things, fuck friendship. Happiness is a whole different thing for a whole lot of people. Don't comfort others by admitting they're happy.
Fact. You'll live eighty years. Stay optimistic. You've spent a significant amount on bullshit. Fact. You can be happy. Fact. There are things that make you happy. Find them.
Picture this. You're thirty-five. Your life sucks. You work 32 hours a week, five days. You live in the weekends, getting drunk, feeling like you have a day off. You meet friends, talking about how life could have been. Avoiding work related thoughts. You're divorced or married, but neither satisfies you. The zeroes on your account nearly fix the mortgage. Your daughter is a prepubescent princess, having more influence than you. Your boss is in charge of your career, so he yells at you on a daily basis. And what more is there? Nothing. Your life sucks.
Then you get diagnosed with a life threatening disease. You'll die in two months. You get to live for one year.
What do you do? First you resist. Then you stop complaining. You burn all your useless friendships. You'll get off Facebook. You'll chat up with a stranger. You quit working, starting to trade time for money. You make your list. The bucketlist. All the things you wanted to do. You'll get a loan to make a trip around the world. You'll play a game of chess with that guy in the pub around the corner. You'll make the world-trip. It's terrific.
You'll say your last famous words. You can't think of any. Then you die.
Has it been worthwile? Yes. You finally did what mattered. You lived. It doesn't matter what you do or how you do it. It matters that you live.
Listen to me. You will die. The only chance you get at beating death, is by living. Make your bucketlist. Make hundreds of them. Say your last famous words. Get out of your lazy chair. Start kicking ass. Quit your job. Start doing things that matter. Start living.
You've got to find what you love. Who you love. Don't look for happiness. It'll come to you.
You'll die tomorrow. So make today count.
(I wrote this a few years ago, and I've read it regularly ever since. I'm well aware that this may not work for you, but I wanted to share it because it might. Also, I do not mean to offend. Somebody's got to kick you in the balls.) <comment><USER2> I love it. This is really a good guide for all of us. I sum it up as being a powerful change engine that does what matters.

<comment><AUTHOR> Thank you!</comment></comment>


TonTon streaming over 1.1mil video hours a month, with 1.6mil registered users - <AUTHOR> http://www.greyreview.com/2011/07/31/tonton-serving-over-1-1-million-video-hours-a-month-now-with-1-6-registered-users/ <comment><USER2> <http://news.ycombinator.com/submitted?id=zhiQ> <\-- LOL

Surely, your traffic acquisition efforts are better spent elsewhere.</comment>


Cartagr.am - <AUTHOR> http://cartagr.am/#3.00/0.00/0.00

<comment><USER2> Anyone know if this is using the 'unofficial API' (documented @ <https://github.com/mislav/instagram>) or if they've been granted access to the API beta?</comment>


Maxima Computer Algebra Software Is Still in Use After 50 Years - <AUTHOR> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maxima_(software) <comment><USER2> Ship of Theseus still in use after hundreds of years!

With long-lived sofware like this, I often wonder what fraction of the old source stays untouched for that long. At my day job, we have the distant descendant of a 35+ year old software package, but I can't believe there are many files which haven't had significant maintenance within the last 5 years. On the other hand, when I go looking I can typically find source files that have become totally unused and nobody seems to have noticed...

Notable events in its history involve a semiautomatic translation from structured BASIC to to C in the late 80s, and finally getting under version control in the mid 90s.

Also, I was somehow unaware of Macsyma being available on modern Linux systems under the name of Maxima so thanks very much for that!</comment>


Feinstein-Burr: The Bill That Bans Your Browser - <AUTHOR> https://www.justsecurity.org/30740/feinstein-burr-bill-bans-browser/ <comment><USER2> Feinstein isn't stupid. She knows the bill is over the top.

They're deliberately taking an extreme position in an attempt to force a fake compromise (which will ultimately wind up being just as catastrophic to the US software industry). This is a classic tactic, and it works.

Senate Committee on Candy: "Gum is a problem. Okay, life sentences for anyone caught chewing that evil stuff in public."

The Public: "WTF?"

SCC: "Okay, you're right, that's a little harsh. Let's meet in the middle and make it only a $100,000 per stick fine."

The Public: "Whew!"

... and I'm guessing that any "compromise" would take the form of clauses along the lines of the FISA courts being able to rubberstamp people into compliance. In secrecy. In bulk.

I cannot help but wonder if one of the requirements for being on the Senate Intelligence Committee is that the spooks have dramatically compromising blackmail material on you. This would explain a lot. (On the other hand, I believe that Feinstein is a genuinely bad person, and we would be better off without her).

<comment><USER3> > I believe that Feinstein is a genuinely bad person, and we would be better > off without her

As a Californian, I am constantly ashamed at calling her "my" senator. Why the fuck can't someone reasonable run against her? I guess for the same reason that Bernie is having so much trouble: the Democratic Party is sorta like the Communist Party in USSR; you have to be an insider to get anywhere.

<comment><USER4> The two party system is decidedly broken. Primaries force us into accepting evil or awful because we've been convinced that at least it's the lesser evil and that we should be happy for that.

Bring about instant runoff voting or a similar system and you strip parties of their power and we rid ourselves of self-serving incumbents quickly.

<comment><USER5> California doesn't have party primaries.

There's a June election and the top two vote winners go on to November, even if from the same party. That's why California has a chance to prevent a second Feinstein in Kamala Harris. It will be two Democrats in November: drug prosecutor Harris and grassroots liberal Loretta Sanchez.

<comment><USER4> That's _a start_ , but until you can let people stop having to pick between voting their conscience and voting out of fear, the parties and incumbents can still wield a lot of power, IMHO. Having an election that lets people rank their preferences could remove the voting out of fear and let us actually focus on voting for our hopes and our ideals.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> It is very interesting that the richest* industry in the US cannot make their home senator bend to their will. Money can only buy advertising and campaign staff. It can't buy votes and votes are what keep folks in office.

* Apple has $38 Billion in liquid assets [1]. Facebook has $18 Billion [2]. Amazon has $20 Billion [3]. Alphabet (fka Google) has $73 Billion [4]. Microsoft has $102 Billion [5]. In the last quarter of 2015, the largest companies by market capitalization were Apple, Alphabet, and Microsoft [6].

[1] [https://ycharts.com/companies/AAPL/cash_on_hand](https://ycharts.com/companies/AAPL/cash_on_hand) [2] [https://ycharts.com/companies/FB/cash_on_hand](https://ycharts.com/companies/FB/cash_on_hand) [3] [https://ycharts.com/companies/AMZN/cash_on_hand](https://ycharts.com/companies/AMZN/cash_on_hand) [4] [https://ycharts.com/companies/GOOG/cash_on_hand](https://ycharts.com/companies/GOOG/cash_on_hand) [5] [https://ycharts.com/companies/MSFT/cash_on_hand](https://ycharts.com/companies/MSFT/cash_on_hand) [6] [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_public_corporations_by...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_public_corporations_by_market_capitalization)

<comment><USER4> Recent articles would suggest that tech firms are spending a lot of money on lobbyists: [http://www.wired.com/2015/07/google-facebook-amazon- lobbying...](http://www.wired.com/2015/07/google-facebook-amazon-lobbying/) and [http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2016/02/09/which- tech-...](http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2016/02/09/which-tech- companies-spend-the-most-on-lobbying.aspx)

And this database would suggest some tech companies fall into the 5th highest spending industry: [https://www.opensecrets.org/lobby/top.php?showYear=2015&inde...](https://www.opensecrets.org/lobby/top.php?showYear=2015&indexType=i)

So, a the question is, why, despite these efforts are we still seeing this sort of thing? A few reasons, I'd guess...

1) Lobbying efforts by other industries and groups (law enforcement has a vested interest here, for example)

2) A tendency to wanting to look tough on crime and terrorism, especially going into an election year. Moderation and wise restraint are always a tough sell in politics.

3) The Unbearable Asymmetry of Bullshit - politics edition. See [http://quillette.com/2016/02/15/the-unbearable-asymmetry- of-...](http://quillette.com/2016/02/15/the-unbearable-asymmetry-of-bullshit/) and

4) A propensity on the part of many in government to want to hold more power (closely related to point 2, but more self-serving).

<comment><USER7> A great way to increase an industry's lobbying efforts is to introduce bills like this that require a coordinated response.

<comment><USER8> Why are you so sure your interests are always aligned with big tech interests?

<comment><USER7> I don't believe that's what I implied. I was pointing out the discrepancy in the parent's argument that an increase in lobbying spending should correlate with a decrease in introductions of these types of bills. If these types of bills are viewed as extortionist policies, and lobbying efforts as akin to Mafia "protection" then these supposed discrepancies become more clear.

I'm getting too old to think anyone else has my best interests at heart. Any one but me, that is.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> Instead of complaining into the echo chamber of comments, here are some things you can do to fight back:

Donate to the EFF: [https://supporters.eff.org/donate/button](https://supporters.eff.org/donate/button)

Call your Reps: [http://TryVoices.com](http://TryVoices.com) (it takes 2 minutes)

Petition the President: [https://savecrypto.org/](https://savecrypto.org/)

<comment><USER10> Thank you for pointing me to TryVoices, it was helpful in finding the contact information for my representatives for Washington (state).

</comment></comment><comment><USER11> Feinstein is an authoritarian, anti-tech disgrace to CA. If she doesn't retire at the next election, she needs to be removed.

<comment><USER12> Given the voters in California, someone needs to mount a primary challenge because no one will beat her in the general election. That how Rep Eric Cantor got ousted.

<comment><USER13> California doesn't have party primaries any longer. All candidates run in a single primary, and the two highest vote-getters go on the ballot for November. When she's up for re-election, her opponent on the November ballot will almost certainly be a Democrat.

<comment><USER12> I guess that's one way to make sure an incumbent is on the ticket and lock out any hope of a 3rd party messing with your election.

<comment><USER13> No, it was actually intended to shake up the two-party system. The Republican party is very weak in many parts of the state, so it's entirely possible (likely even) that that second candidate could be another Democrat, or even a third-party Green or Libertarian candidate. The point is that it encourages the non-majority party to field candidates that appeal to the overall populace, instead of to a narrow interest group (like conservative Republicans in Berkeley).

<comment><USER12> Shaking up the two party system by likely replacing it with a one party system sounds really bad. It also hurts 3rd parties badly by requiring a shorter time frame and a lot more money to be any influence on the election. This sounds like a way to cement the power of the current ruling party.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER14> What an incredible blend of "isn't feasible" with "terrible idea" and just a dash of "wildly illegal".

</comment><comment><USER15> Rather than dealing with these cockamamie laws piecemeal, lets attack the root of the problem: term limits and age caps.

That way instead of waiting for these half senile and all corrupt politicians to meet their maker, we introduce new blood into the system that hopefully understands the modern American people and modern technology.

<comment><USER16> I've always thought this. Limit all representatives, especially the president, to one term. That way they have no motivation to waste their time and our money on getting reelected. You don't even need to touch age then. If you then make it illegal for all representatives, especially the president, to accept donations and maybe give each candidate a set sum to spend we might actually bring democracy back. I'm certainly not holding my breath though. It's basically asking Congress and the president to commit permanent political suicide.

<comment><USER17> Consider 3 groups: elected officials, their staffers, and lobbyists. Strict term limits would remove office-holders and any expertise accumulated in whatever term they served, while the other two groups would tend to conserve accumulated expertise, relationships, etc. Persistent incumbency may be bad, but strict term limits seem worse.

<comment><USER16> Worse how? How can it be worse than a government that isn't run by the people? I'd rather the government doesn't get anything done than the current situation where the government doesn't get anything done and the only focus is on getting re-elected and raising money. Considering that representatives in Congress spend more time raising money for re-election than anything else by far, I can't see how it could be worse to have the actually do the jobs they were elected to do and swore an oath to do.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER18> Is Feinstein just plain ignorant, or willfully ignorant?

<comment><USER19> Willfully ignorant. She has been a staunch opponent of "gun rights" (where you & I stand on it matters little for this post), with a very long train of making staggeringly ignorant comments about the subject - long enough, with enough intense involvement by both sides, to show she can't possibly be "plain ignorant" as at some point you have to absorb some objective facts about the matter and show some competent basis for your stance (say, when debating a subject you _should_ know enough about the opposing view to be able to present a competent argument on their behalf). With that kind of precedent in place, it's safe to conclude she knows little - and literally _wants_ to know little - about the objective facts of the encryption issue.

</comment></comment><comment><USER20> Eventually we will be reduced to smoke signals in the sky. Unless its over Washington DC where the hot air is moving fast.

</comment><comment><USER21> Feinstein is a disgrace. It continues to confound me that the home of the US technology industry is represented by someone so diametrically opposed to technical interests.

If firms actually care about issues (and their international markets), they should be donating substantial sums to get rid of her.

</comment><comment><USER22> Why is Feinsteins name attached to every piece of shit legislation that comes out. Does she just really hate freedom or something? Literally every bill that had the internet up in arms over the past 4 years had her name on it.

<comment><USER23> She's more of an equality of outcome person than a equality of opportunity person. It leads to drastically different definitions of what a free society looks like.

Most people aren't interested in capitalist striving, they want to live an average life free from any real danger.

</comment></comment><comment><USER16> "As a practical matter, the (lawful) production of secure software in the United States becomes the exclusive domain of corporate entities large and rich enough to support (and at least attempt to secure) some kind of key- escrow and law enforcement compliance infrastructure."

That's assuming that anyone still wants to do business with them. Most companies will just wither and die because consumers and especially the enterprise will move on to their competitors outside the US. I really can't think of a better way to destroy the US technology sector than bills like this.

</comment><comment><USER24> How would this effect hashing algorithms? You can't reverse a password hash for example. Probably the least of the many many problems this bill would cause.

<comment><USER25> You can always reverse a password hash. It just takes fucking forever. ;)

<comment><USER26> But you're not reversing it, you're only brute-forcing a collision. It won't tell you if you've found the original password or a different string that coincidentally hashes the same with that particular algorithm.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> Gives a whole new meaning to the padlock icon on the address bar.

</comment><comment><USER27> Stupid law. Most will ignore it. There will be little enforcement. But that is what makes it truly dangerous - selective enforcement.

As this law can't be applied to open source software, I'm curious if it will result in the accelerated adoption of OSS.

<comment><USER28> What makes you think that? Anyone who worked on non-compliant software who lives in the US (or in a US-friendly jurisdiction) would likely be found liable, and fined and/or jailed.

<comment><USER27> Not a chance

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER29> She must totally ignorant of the matter, or have hired poor technical staff around her, or pure as the driven snow, since this will only pave the way for more breaches and dissemination of government and governing persons data on the internet, not just private citizens. I don't understand how they think there is a way to meet their aims without knocking down the whole house of cards. Perhaps when her data is hacked, and all of her personal and financial dealings are made public? I can see this becoming an Anonymous headline soon.

</comment><comment><USER30> Yeah, this is bordering on ridiculous. But, if any of this is contemplated, you can bet it's also being contemplated in China, Russia and everywhere else.

The standard response should be: "would you want us to do the same for foreign governments?"

<comment><USER31> >>would you want us to do the same for foreign governments?

Well ofcourse the wizards making magic... err software would have to ensure no other government ever will be able to access the data..

Only the Good Guys (American Government Agents) are the only that should possess the magic to unlock the wizard's text...

<comment><USER30> But what makes the "would have to" follow, let alone be enforceable?

 _ANY_ sovereign government can pass a bill saying the same thing about any maker of any software, and they might even have long-arm statutes via agreements between them. It's not like Google doesn't have subsidiaries in China, and it's not like they're not restricted in China.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER32> [https://act.eff.org/action/tell-congress-stop-the-burr- feins...](https://act.eff.org/action/tell-congress-stop-the-burr-feinstein- backdoor-proposal)

</comment><comment><USER33> Would this bill allow USA residents to use sane browsers, mandating backdoors in USA-made browsers but permitting import of crypto software from the free world? Or is the "loophole" closed by other bills?

</comment><comment><USER34> I think it is possible to create a movement against Feinstein. But it would be most powerful to turn the party against her.

I don't think she would hold her position if other Democrats came to her and said she was hurting fundraising.

</comment><comment><USER35> You had me at Feinstein.

Some software is approved. Others, including open source is banned: dangerous.

Feinstein!

(unrelated Feinstein [http://youtube.com/watch?v=HVOuK_KB9ew](http://youtube.com/watch?v=HVOuK_KB9ew) )

</comment><comment><USER36> I think the solution to all of this starts with the creating alternative computer networks to the internet. You should be able to ping your neighbor without paying Comcast for the privilege. Once communities own our own local networks, and once our neighboring communities are linked, private networks will blossom and this nonsense will fade away.

I don't think the layman associates computer network traffic with speech. But if you make private networks associated with localities, I think they'll righly start to see federal regulation as overbearing.

(Aside: if you're in favor of federally mandated net neutrality, I think you owe it to yourself to think about what kind of effect it could have on that type of local network development.)

<comment><USER37> Here's some 'Truth' for you: your post is indicative of the exact kind of thinking that leads people to demand back doors on encryption in the first place.

"I think the solution to all of this starts with creating alternative means to access encrypted networks. You should be able to key into the someone's computer without doing any crypto work for the privilege. Once crypto comes with back doors, and the keys our in our hands, freedom will blossom and terrorist protections will fade away."

Maybe if your solution were in any way practical or realistic, or if you -- the layman -- knew the difference between how to actually solve a problem and merely proposing fantastical solutions, we wouldn't need this discussion in the first place.

<comment><USER36> You can fuck right off with the personal attacks, mate. You're wrong, too.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athens_Wireless_Metropolitan_N...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athens_Wireless_Metropolitan_Network)

[https://guifi.net/en](https://guifi.net/en)

[http://www.gowasabi.net/](http://www.gowasabi.net/)

[https://networkbogota.org/](https://networkbogota.org/)

[https://wlan-si.net/en/](https://wlan-si.net/en/)

[https://freifunk.net//en/](https://freifunk.net//en/)

And that's not even mentioning telecom cooperatives and municipal ISPs that are popping up.

> Maybe if your solution were in any way practical or realistic

> fantastical solutions

The broader point was about the idea that the average American doesn't see computer networks as something that _can_ be local, and how that might affect how they interpret computer communication in the context of the first amendment. And (I think, at least) that would be an interesting point in its own right.

But it doesn't have to be, because this is reality, and it's a recent development due to new software and hardware developments. And it's growing.

So fuck off.

<comment><USER37> New networks popping up in no way protects anyone from having their network regulated by the government, particularly if they start interfacing with and replacing the existing networks.

<comment><USER36> I'm not suggesting it prevents regulation in-and-of itself, but that it will make federal regulation untenable by breaking down the misconception that computer networking is necessarily geospatially agnostic.

If local communities have their own physical networks running internal services, and if average people start using them, I think they'll start seeing computer networks as able to be more than one homogenous _cyberspace_. Federal regulation doesn't seem so out-of-place when your connections are presumably going all over the world. But if you drop that assumption, I think smaller governments will want autonomy.

(I also want to apoligize for my tone above. Not necessary and not conducive to conversation.)

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER38> This bill should be named as Feinstein's Monster

</comment><comment><USER39> The nett result of this will be US business will be less and less trusted by the rest of the world and bypassed wherever possible.

</comment><comment><USER40> Odd didn't Feinstein previously try to pass a bill requiring companies to encrypt customer data like ssn and what not?

<comment><USER41> She seems to be pro-encryption as long as it comes with a backdoor.

</comment></comment><comment><USER42> first they take your high capacity mags. Then they take your certs.

</comment><comment><USER43> Herp derp unicorn...

</comment><comment><USER44> Ppl should koi force to throw these "law maker" out before they do greater damage to the rights of the citizens.</comment>


Professor Calls for Taking Unabomber's Tech Critique Seriously - <AUTHOR> http://chronicle.com/article/The-Unabombers-Pen-Pal/131892/ The Unabomber continues to write manifestos from prison calling for end of tech. Should we be listening? <comment><USER2> From my blog, "But this doesn't pass muster. Firstly, Kaczynski's ideas aren't original; richer arguments are found in Jacque Ellul and Lewis Mumford, both influential philosophers of technology. And secondly, as Skrbina rightly claims, Kaczynski's arguments are independent and self-sufficient, so teaching them as "the Unabomber's" is superfluous and unnecessary. Skrbina is feeding off Kaczynski's cult of personality for the sake of melodrama and controversy."

(source: <http://rustcan.com/post/studying-the-unabomber>)</comment>


Ask HN: Isnt Politics the most easiest field to be replaced with AI? - <AUTHOR> <comment><USER2> I think Obama said it best:

 _The final thing I'll say is that government will never run the way Silicon Valley runs because, by definition, democracy is messy. This is a big, diverse country with a lot of interests and a lot of disparate points of view. And part of government's job, by the way, is dealing with problems that nobody else wants to deal with.

So sometimes I talk to CEOs, they come in and they start telling me about leadership, and here's how we do things. And I say, well, if all I was doing was making a widget or producing an app, and I didn't have to worry about whether poor people could afford the widget, or I didn't have to worry about whether the app had some unintended consequences -- setting aside my Syria and Yemen portfolio -- then I think those suggestions are terrific. (Laughter and applause.) That's not, by the way, to say that there aren't huge efficiencies and improvements that have to be made.

But the reason I say this is sometimes we get, I think, in the scientific community, the tech community, the entrepreneurial community, the sense of we just have to blow up the system, or create this parallel society and culture because government is inherently wrecked. No, it's not inherently wrecked; it's just government has to care for, for example, veterans who come home. That's not on your balance sheet, that's on our collective balance sheet, because we have a sacred duty to take care of those veterans. And that's hard and it's messy, and we're building up legacy systems that we can't just blow up._

<comment><USER3> It's not inherently wrecked, but it's often wrecked anyway.

For example, the BART extension to south Fremont cost around $150 million per mile and took 3 years longer than planned. CA can't seem to maintain roads, and when it does it costs bazillions of dollars.

<comment><USER4> Differentiate between a wreck and a bug. Bugs may be big, common, and expensive, but they don't invalidate the system as a whole. Bugs need fixing, a wreck requires a reimplementation. But seductive as reimplementations may be, they are usually a lot more expensive and difficult than one thought, and at the end they're still going to have bugs.

Wrecks require reimplementation. In politics, as in software development, one should think very carefully indeed before declaring something a wreck.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> No, absolutely and emphatically not! Underlying this question is an assumption very common in tech circles, but nonetheless fundamentally flawed: that social problems can be solved by technological advances.

Sure, technology can help implement solutions to social problems, but it will not arrive at these solutions of its own accord. That is because technology only ever magnifies our inherent human capabilities, it doesn't give us new ones. A case in point: Internet and the social media have made communication and the exchange of information as easy as never before. We can use this power to keep in touch with distant friends or take free classes from a university on another continent. We can also use it to spread fake news and organize terrorist plots. But it is not "the Internet" doing all this, it is the humans sitting at either end of the data cable. Technology is not of itself good, nor is it evil. It is merely an enabler and an amplifier.

Technology is about optimizing metrics. (Say, time spent doing a certain task, or money invested to achieve a given aim.) Politics is about finding out what the problem is, agreeing that it is a problem worth solving and then discussing what a suitable metric is to tackle this problem. (For example: high housing prices may be considered a problem. But do you tackle this by raising the spending power of your citizens or by lowering the average rent?)

Politics is about humans, and that is something technology in itself can never be.

</comment><comment><USER5> Not at all, politics is often a question of values as much as one of logistics, even assuming AI can handle logistics.

For example, consider homelessness. No one has any clue what, if anything, is the best solution, because there are tradeoffs of values.

One possible solution (these are examples, if your personal pet solution is not included or is misrepresented, I apologize) is you ignore the homeless and just let them be, and allow individual communities and cities to address charity and enforcement. Another is for states to house all non-mentally ill homeless for free, for, say, a year, and, in mental health instutitions, house the repeat homeless, the mentally ill homeless, and those that after some period of time cannot or will not find work.

AI can help you diagnose the problem, and make predictions about it, but those two solutions above have VERY different outcomes, have very different pricetags, and accomplish very different goals. An AI can't think about the high level moral tradeoffs of questions like "is 100% getting homeless off the streets worth a fraction of the population being held at significant cost to taxpayers and against its own will?"

Somebody, at the end of the day, must decide which, if either, of those plans people will use, and that somebody is a politician you elect. AI is not going to replace that.

</comment><comment><USER6> No, politics is in part about what is right, in part about what is possible, in part about what you convince people to do. AI is useless for all of that.

</comment><comment><USER7> Seems like with ten thousand years of time to learn about the stuff, we humans haven't understood politics at all yet.

So I'll go with "No, politics is complex and _hard_ ".

</comment><comment><USER8> This remindminds me the old Paranoia RPG [https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paranoia_(role- playing_game)](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paranoia_\(role-playing_game\))

An AI will try to achieve its goals by any means. I believe it coud be useful as a helper, assistant, etc.

Anyway no politician would allow to loose powers because a machine took his/her job...

</comment><comment><USER9> Yes maybe. We have that because we lack of strong theories about how group of people work. Ants don't do politics, they know what they have to do. No politics in Star Trek excepting with aggressive species like Klingons.

</comment><comment><AUTHOR> Should i have better phrased it by replacing politics with government.

Isn't government all about asking one yes or no question and collecting a response from every citizen and going forward with the majority answer.

Isn't scenarios where we go ahead with minority decisions where the issues arise?

<comment><USER4> > Isn't government all about asking one yes or no question and collecting a > response from every citizen and going forward with the majority answer.

No, it's not. In our modern representative democracies, government is about asking as many people as possible for their input and then going forward with what seems wisest to you. Modern societies face problems that are much too complicated for the simple majority to be a good indicator of the best course of action.

We vote for our politicians because we agree with their set of values, and by electing them give them the responsibility of taking decisions for us, based on those values. In effect, we ask them to do the hard work of thinking through problems thoroughly enough to arrive at a good solution.

(Of course, that doesn't mean that what we think becomes unimportant, or that the "average citizen" is unable to form valid opinions on social matters. And one of the defining factors of a good politician is and always will be that he listens to the people. But his responsibility is to take the decisions that he believes are best for the people, not necessarily the ones the people want.)

Brexit is a prime example for what happens when politicians shirk their responsibilities and hand the decision-making back to an uninformed majority. (This is an almost literal quote from a friend of mine who voted Leave!)

<comment><AUTHOR> >> No, it's not. In our modern representative democracies, government is about asking as many people as possible for their input and then going forward with what seems wisest to you. Modern societies face problems that are much too complicated for the simple majority to be a good indicator of the best course of action.

It is just this mindset that is ruining the whole world. One persons so called wise choice which goes around creating discomfort for majority is what creates imbalance and intolerance across community and ruins every ones peaceful life.

>> We vote for our politicians because we agree with their set of values, and by electing them give them the responsibility of taking decisions for us, based on those values. In effect, we ask them to do the hard work of thinking through problems thoroughly enough to arrive at a good solution.

No politician will ever be skilled enough to make a decision. A politician is just a servant. I don't let my servant decide what to cook or what to do with their time.

I decide what menu i want and they just prepare the logistics and production.

Today i tell them to pick what majority wants and tomo i tell them to make what rest of them wants so that everyone is taken care. Each individual cannot or need not think and execute on how to clear the trash in their apartment. That's where a politician comes in i tell him daily we will keep trash outside home n u get some people to come and collect and dispose it using this technique and he just serves that task.

It should be the common people the actual customers who are making the decision not the service providers like politicians.

Or we can have multiple governments running simultaneously and i can just switch to the government of my choice and live by that rule. Something like changing from Verizon to Tmobile.</comment></comment></comment>


Why Twitter didn't delete anti-Muslim tweets - <AUTHOR> http://money.cnn.com/2017/11/30/technology/twitter-trump-retweet-anti-muslim-hate/index.html?sr=twCNN113017twitter-trump-retweet-anti-muslim-hate0619PMStory <comment><AUTHOR> Twitter statement: "To help ensure people have an opportunity to see every side of an issue, there may be the rare occasion when we allow controversial content or behavior which may otherwise violate our rules to remain on our service because we believe there is a legitimate public interest in its availability."

Tech people are the absolute worst when it comes to ownership of their social responsibility.

<comment><USER2> Bad on twitter forsure, but do you really think a 'Tech person' gets to make that decision?</comment></comment>


More Early Facebook IMs And Emails Surface: "A Sucker Born Every Day" - <AUTHOR> http://techcrunch.com/2010/09/21/facebook-im-sucker/

<comment><USER2> Yuck. That's a really crap attention-whoring headline from techcrunch. The "sucker born every day" quote is actually from some random anonymous friend of Zuckerman about paying for servers. The quote doesn't even warrant inclusion in the article (the opinion of some nameless person outside the organization is of no significance whatsoever) and the cynical decision to stick it in the headline is an outright insult to the reader.</comment>


Steve Jobs Resigns as Apple CEO (Official Letter) - <AUTHOR> http://blogs.wsj.com/deals/2011/08/24/steve-jobs-resigns-as-apple-ceo/ <comment><USER2> "I have always said if there ever came a day when I could no longer meet my duties and expectations as Apple's CEO, I would be the first to let you know. Unfortunately, that day has come."

This makes it sound like it does have to do with his health unfortunately, and not that he just feels that it's the right time to do it. (like Bill Gates did with Microsoft)

On another note, even though in reality it's not just for the Board but, as put in the letter, for "the Apple community", it feels odd to imagine that he would need to write a formal letter of resignation.

<comment><USER3> Interestingly, he still seems interested in serving on the board of directors. This would make me think he is just tired of being CEO and it this play doesn't have to do with his health.

<comment><USER4> No one really 'beats' pancreatic cancer.

[http://www.pancreatic.org/site/c.htJYJ8MPIwE/b.891917/k.5123...](http://www.pancreatic.org/site/c.htJYJ8MPIwE/b.891917/k.5123/Prognosis_of_Pancreatic_Cancer.htm)

<comment><USER5> As cancer survivors tend to say, the only way you know if you've beaten cancer is when you die of something else.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> Here's to the crazy ones, the misfits, the rebels, the troublemakers, the round pegs in square holes. The ones who see things differently.

<comment><USER7> Are you talking about the sort of people Apple likes to litigate against?

<comment><USER8> He is referring to the Apple Ad.

<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USn5t5nQWU8>

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> "Beyond the products, beyond the profits, Jobs' greater gift was to inspire untold numbers of current & future entrepreneurs to be the next Steve Jobs" - Hunter Walk

</comment><comment><USER10> $76 billion dollars in the bank.

If Apple had announced they were going to spend it all to make Steve well again, would would have protested?

Somewhere in here is a lesson on the price of immortality.

<comment><USER11> No amount of riches would have saved the life of Prince Leopold, Duke of Albany. At the time we didn't have the medical technology to treat hemophilia. Likewise, if the technology existed to make Steve Jobs healthy, it would have been used by now.

<comment><USER12> $76 billion dollars can buy a lot of R&D time.

</comment></comment></comment><comment> ac-slater I'm grateful that Steve managed to sell America on tablets and smart phones after so many failed attempts by others.

But as someone who likes to take things apart and tinker, I've haven't been a big fan of Apple in recent years.

</comment><comment><USER13> Fuck all those WSJ assholes with their "SELL SELL SELL" comments.

<comment><USER14> The market will fuck them just fine. Give it a week or two.

<comment><USER15> Exactly. Given that Apple has performed well while Jobs was out on medical leave for significant parts of the last three years, it seems as though Apple can do well without him at the helm. And building an organization that can survive after the leader departs is a real accomplishment.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER16> Never thought I could be so saddened by a Big Corp. CEO's resignation.

</comment><comment><USER17> The way he worded his reasoning, makes it sounds like a health issue. I honestly hope that this is not the case.

<comment><USER18> It's unfortunate but I don't think there can be any other reason. It takes a lot to leave behind one of the most important things you've done in your life.

</comment></comment><comment><USER19> A true pioneer of the computing industry - farewell.

His Standford graduation talk, always inspiring: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D1R-jKKp3NA>

</comment><comment><USER20> I really, and I mean REALLY, hope that his biography coming out on November 21 this year and his resignation today have nothing to do with his health.

In any way, thank you very much Steve, I guess you can leave your company quite happy and satisfied. :)

</comment><comment><USER21> The Walt Disney of technology. I will miss him. Get well Steve.

</comment><comment><USER22> The true test of Steve's legacy will be whether Apple can continue in the image he molded for it well beyond his departure. Great CEO's are felt for a long time after they leave.

<comment><USER23> That's a nice sentiment, but I think Steve Jobs has already done more than enough to establish himself as the Greatest Business Leader of All Time. No hyperbole, I mean that quite literally and seriously.

</comment></comment><comment><USER24> who knew that he would take that LDAP bug so seriously?

</comment><comment><USER25> I'll be interested to see if 10 years from now Apple has stayed true in hardware quality or if they sink to EMachines-like quality levels.

<comment><USER2> It's true that the first time Steve Jobs left Apple, it didn't take long for things to go badly for the company, but I feel that this time around (that is, since 1997 when he came back as CEO), Steve Jobs surrounded himself with a great team, making sure that this wouldn't happen again. The fact that Tim Cook is taking over is a good example of that: someone from inside Apple who has been around and key to Apple's success for many years.

I'm sure that all the people at the top are very conscious of his legacy and would most likely often think "what would Steve do?".

<comment><USER26> Things were going downhill before Steve left the first time. This is a very different scenario where they're at the top of their game.

<comment><USER2> True. To be honest, I know of that part of Apple's history from what I've read years after the facts. I still have the impression that, though it wasn't going great when he left, his leaving accelerated the descent.

But my main point is that I feel that it was an important lesson for Steve Jobs. In the 80s, he had picked an _experienced_ CEO that didn't know anything about Apple. The current team is all about Apple and I would think Steve Jobs learned that it's more beneficial to groom internal people to take the helm.

<comment><USER27> A large part of Apple's success is the NeXT heritage in the form of NextStep that was the sapling that has grown into Tiger, Leopard, Snow Leopard and now Lion.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER28> Steve Jobs is leaving at a good time. Apple is the best company in the world. I hope he has his health and can enjoy being with his family and taking a backseat role with Apple.

Enjoy the ride Steve. Thanks for being such an inspiration.

</comment><comment><USER29> I certainly hope this doesn't mean Steve's health is declining, but rather that he and Apple feel the time is right to make a smooth transition towards assigning Tim Cook as the new CEO. It definitely feels like Steve is sincere in his belief that now is the right time for him to step down. I just hope he still has the capacity to creatively inspire Apple in his new role as Chairman as much as he always has.

</comment><comment><USER30> Whatever happens next, this is the end of a great era for Apple.

<comment><USER31> Quite the opposite. It is only just the beginning...

<comment><USER20> Jobs is an era himself, the moment he leaves Apple defines the end of that era, no matter if the years coming turn out to be better for the company.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER32> I think the biggest thing is that everyone in Apple has a question they can ask themselves, "What would Steve Jobs do?". And if they can honestly answer the question and take decisions based on that, Apple with its lead and its teams and its products will stay ahead for a while to come. [cross posted from another thread]

</comment><comment><USER33> If he looks back on his company career, he will definitely feel satisfied. 4 products (mac, iPhone, iPod, iPad) that not only changed the world but also became multi-billion dollar businesses. Not to mention countless other products (iTunes, App Store, Safari, Final Cut Pro, Apple ][ etc. :)

<comment><USER34> Everyone will remember the industry pioneer, the man who saved a giant corporation, and the man who revolutionized consumer electronics.

How many people will remember the guy who ran a software company with under 100 employees, who flew around the country hard-selling small engineering teams on his developer tools? At any time, he could have retired himself to pasture. But he never did.

</comment></comment><comment><USER35> You know how the news people run the wonderful stories about people's lives AFTER they are gone? Well I sure wish they'd do it while they are still around.

As much as I am not an Apple (or Jobs) fan, I still recognize great achievement when I see it.

Best wishes to him and his family.

</comment><comment><USER36> One silver lining to this: he's going out on top.

<comment><USER37> He never did strike me as a bottom.

</comment></comment><comment><USER38> Steve really has a deep-seated need to one-up HP.</comment>


Comscore: iPad is 97.2% of Internet tablet traffic - <AUTHOR> http://www.comscore.com/Press_Events/Press_Releases/2011/10/Smartphones_and_Tablets_Drive_Nearly_7_Percent_of_Total_U.S._Digital_Traffic

<comment><USER2> What do the low end android tablet users in India, china and Asia do? Just watch YouTube, native apps and games

Edit: 58.5% for web and 43% overall share, not 97% as title suggest</comment>


Argentina Submarine: ARA San Juan Found - <AUTHOR> https://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-46245686 <comment><USER2> Non APM version [https://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin- america-46245686](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-46245686)

<comment><USER3> Updated from [https://www.google.com.ar/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/world-l...](https://www.google.com.ar/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/world- latin-america-46245686). Thanks!

</comment></comment><comment><AUTHOR> nytimes story: Mystery of Lost Argentine Submarine Ends a Year Later, Deep at Sea [https://nyti.ms/2DrCpDR](https://nyti.ms/2DrCpDR)</comment>


Ask HN: Why readability is ignored? - <AUTHOR>

There are lots of researches on what is the ideal line length is but sites like wikipedia or HN still let the lines be too long. <comment><USER2> There's a lot of research on the optimal line length _for reading_ but there are a number of other considerations that go into website design. For example:

Many sites (including both Wikipedia and HN) practice responsive design, where the width & layout of screen elements adapts to the size of your window. There's a good argument that providing the user control of their own situation outweighs the consensus research on the "average user". After all, you're trying to make _each_ user happy, you aren't trying to make a hypothetical average user happy.

Most of the time, users skim sites, they don't read them. Optimizing for reading is counterproductive when the user just wants to find a sentence or two and go away.

Sites can become aesthetically unpleasant if they have a small column of text and a gigantic amount of whitespace. Nobody reads the site when the user bounces.

Sometimes sites are set up to use indentation to convey hierarchy, eg. in comment threads. These can also look awkward if the right margin keeps shifting over with each new comment. (Although personally, I prefer that to having tiny little comments that are 2-3 words wide.)

There's a meta-point here: oftentimes, academic research into one specific area is not relevant to a larger product, because there are other trade-offs that have to be made. When I first went into software, I wondered why all this cool academic research into programming language design was being totally ignored. It turns out that oftentimes the really cool language features like macros, type inference, predicate dispatch, tail-call optimization, etc. have side-effects that make them impractical for use in a real software system.

</comment><comment><USER3> Because ultimately we can control it?

Unlike printed text that is _finished_ finished, text on the web changes per device, time of day, etc.

You might be very interested in [https://www.readability.com/](https://www.readability.com/) which allows a person to instantly morph the majority of articles to their set reading standards with a plugin or bookmark.</comment>


LLDB debugger is coming to Windows - <AUTHOR> http://blog.llvm.org/2015/01/lldb-is-coming-to-windows.html

<comment><USER2> I am looking forward to the day when I can have a full Clang/LLVM environment on my Windows machines without relying on MinGW. Hopefully this year!

<comment><USER3> ..and integrated in VS so you can just select Toolset = Clang :P

<comment><USER2> Especially with the Community Edition of VS making it really easy for pretty much anyone to get access to VS.

I like GCC and everything but I will be happy to leave it behind if I am honest. The politics are just too damn much for me these days. GCC should be about building a great compiler collection for the world but politics plays too big a part in it as seen with the whole AST debate going on again because of RMS. I just want a good compiler and standard library implementation. Between Clang/LLVM and VS Community I don't know if GCC will really have a huge place in the future for me.

<comment><USER4> for you and people like you of course . people whos care about software freedom of course choosing GCC.

<comment><USER5> Except the ones who want to do things that are 'forbidden' by RMS. Those people have no choice but to use LLVM. For example, a lot of academic work on compilers and languages can't easily use GCC, neither can people wanting to make more sophisticated tooling.

<comment><USER6> _a lot of academic work on compilers and languages can 't easily use GCC_

Could you explain why not? GPL-incompatible release requirements on the code produced? Admittedly it's not a very accessible codebase either.

<comment><USER7> I think it has to do with their plugins API, or lack thereof.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> I think this is awesome. Looking forward to libc++ being made to work on Windows. Then I will have a fully conformant c++ compiler and standard library across all the major platforms.

<comment><USER9> Isn't Linux support in libc++ still not 100%? I'm using libc++/c++14 on a new project and I love it! Much better than my last experience with c++ (c++98).

I was worried about using libc++, but I recently found a great VPS provider which lets you install from an ISO so I can run FreeBSD in production. I no longer have any need for Linux. Develop on OSX, deploy on FreeBSD.

<comment><USER10> It's not quite 100%. There are still a few outstanding faults, mostly due to different localization assumptions made by the underlying libc. [http://libcxx.llvm.org/results.Linux.html](http://libcxx.llvm.org/results.Linux.html)

<comment><USER9> Thanks for the link!

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><AUTHOR> For the curious, this will eventually integrate with Visual Studio.

<comment><USER11> I realize this is difficult, but if you're working with Microsoft to make this happen, having a version of LLVM that generated PDBs would be amazing for interoperability, there's a _lot_ of stuff in WinDbg (open the help file, it's actually a giant book of Windows-specific knowledge) and redoing it is definitely non-trivial (and in many cases only can be done by Microsoft because it relies on internal data structures)

</comment></comment><comment><USER12> As a MinGW user, I'm pretty excited for this. Using GDB on Windows isn't even a perfect solution for MinGW programs, since they depend on Windows DLLs that use Microsoft format debug information. If LLDB supported both DWARF and PDB files, I'd finally be able to get a full stack trace with proper symbols for all frames.

</comment><comment><USER13> By the way, radare2 (from git) currently can be built for/under Windows and supports both PDB and WinDbg, as well as DWARF.

</comment><comment><USER14> It faces tough competition from the excellent Visual Studio debugger, but I hope they succeed. A compiler monoculture is bad.

</comment><comment><USER15> Does this have any implications for Rust on windows?

<comment><USER16> Minor implications, perhaps. Much of what was done to reach this point was just making LLDB not fall over miserably on Windows. Like, to compile.. Or to not crash on startup for example :)

Anyone who decides they're interested in making Rust programs debuggable with LLDB will be able to benefit from this work by not having to do it. Also a core debug loop is going to be the same on Windows no matter what programming language is being debugged. I don't know what Rust's generated code looks like, but presumably it will be able to reuse the core debug loop and symbol reading code to some extent, although it will need to deal with ABI specific differences, put in its own expression evaluator, and things like that.

TL;DR - Someone from the Rust community will still have their work cut out for them, but if they're so motivated then they at least some of the work done here will benefit them.

</comment></comment><comment><USER17> While mingw is the king in windows, it is beneficial if other c-compiler projects provide alternatives. One day, clang will come as a complete alternative (modulo winapi headers) combined with libc++ eventual implementation. Personally I would like to see other dbg projects like mago materialize for dlang native debugging. From what I see, LLDB could be useful for LDC2.

But I do not know if LLDB debugs only MSVC debugger format or also Dwarf on windows? Is it only specific to clang-cl?

</comment><comment><USER18> PDB support is very sweet to have.

</comment><comment><USER19> Not to be cynical, but what's in it for Apple?

Obviously someone at Apple decided this makes business sense. What's the thinking?

<comment><USER20> I believe it's mostly people at Google pushing this feature. I don't think Apple had much of a say in it.

<comment><USER19> Oh sorry. I was under the impression that Apple was in charge of the LLVM project

<comment><AUTHOR> No. The LLVM foundation is. By numbers, Apple probably isn't even the largest contributor anymore (but this is just a guess based on mailing list traffic)

<comment><USER21> They probably would be if swift was open-source.

<comment><AUTHOR> Probably not, actually.

But it also depends on what you count. Google definitely has more people working directly on LLVM itself than Apple (At Google, they almost all work for me, and I know the numbers for Apple).

If you start to include related open source projects (like clang, etc), the numbers get closer, but then you have things like all of the Android related open source stuff that gets worked on (Renderscript), etc.

In any case, i'm not sure what the goal of any corporate measuring contest would be here. We are all friendly and working on the same open source projects. It's not about what "Google is doing" or "Apple is doing" but "what is getting done in the LLVM project".

<comment><USER22> Google and Apple used to be friendly and working on the same open source project named WebKit. Looking at the precedent, it is not unreasonable to consider such things, even if everything is okay in LLVM at the moment.

<comment><AUTHOR> These projects have very different means and goals. They also have very different governance, etc.

In any case, i'm still not sure what we are "considering" here.</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment>


Try Python, Ruby, Lua, Scheme, QBasic, Forth ... - <AUTHOR> http://repl.it/ Everything is open source at http://github.com/replit/ <comment><USER3> amasad: After a 5 minute play my first impressions are 'awesome!'. Some feedback:

I selected QBasic then changed my mind but couldn't immediately figure out how to get back to the list of the languages. Clicking the logo of a website usually takes you back to the 'home page', which in this case I consider to be the list of languages. You have buttons at the top right, with the lambda taking me back to the language chooser. Maybe button labels, even tooltips would help. But I would definitely make the logo the 'home' button. Even refreshing the page didn't take me back.

Anyway, a minor complaint. A super-cool effort. I will now go play with it some more.

<comment><AUTHOR> We thought the lambda button would be obvious! Will add labels/tooltips soon, thanks.

<comment><USER4> Same comment as the GP. I felt like you're breaking a convention by not having the logo go back to the chooser page, and by not returning to the chooser on refresh/revisit.

<comment><AUTHOR> Website conventions? We think of repl.it as a webapp, not a website. Once you load a language the app remembers your language and loads it for you on next page load, and if you want to change your language you click the language selector button (which I agree is not that clear at the moment).

<comment><USER5> Then it should also load the last program you were working on -- and, if possible, the output from the interpreter as well.

Cool app!

<comment><USER6> Currently you can save a replayable session and get a unique link, but this is public. We do have plans to remember history locally (either just as command history or a full-blown session) in the future. The initial relevant issue is at <https://github.com/replit/repl.it/issues/15>.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> Oops:

      > import subprocess
      Traceback (most recent call last):
        File "<stdin>", line 1, in <module>
        File "/lib/python2.7/subprocess.py", line 429, in <module>
          import select
      ImportError: No module named select

Also:

      > os.name
      => 'posix'
      > os.uname()
      => ('Emscripten', 'emscripten', '1.0', '#1', 'x86-JS')
      > os.environ
      => {'LANG': 'en_US.UTF-8', 'PYTHONHOME': '/:/', 'PWD': '/',
      'USER': 'root', 'HOME': '/', 'PATH': '/', '_': './this.program'}
      > os.getcwd()
      => '/sandbox'
      > os.chdir('/')
      > os.getcwd()
      => '/'
      > os.popen2('ls -l')
      Traceback (most recent call last):
        File "<stdin>", line 1, in <module>
        File "/lib/python2.7/os.py", line 667, in popen2
          import subprocess
        File "/lib/python2.7/subprocess.py", line 429, in <module>
          import select
      ImportError: No module named select
      > os.popen('ls -l')
      Traceback (most recent call last):
        File "<stdin>", line 1, in <module>
      OSError: [Errno 24] Too many open files

* I liked the 'x86-JS' as the architecture.

* I know about os.listdir() but I wanted the permissions.

* I automatically did a ^W to delete a word and closed the tab. I don't feel like opening it again or I would probably have more.

* I realize that since this is a CPython -> JS converter that the REPL is running in my browser and no on a server (AFAIK) so it's not like this attempting to hack someone's server, but I found it interesting to probe the environment.

<comment><USER6> Thanks for trying it out.

* The ^W is fixable, but I'm not sure how I personally feel about hijacking fundamental browser shortcuts. We'll look into it though.

* Regarding the environment, in general, multi-threading and multi-processing (and anything that depends on them) are not supported, since Emscripten translates the code to JS rather than emulating a machine.

* The Emscripten virtual filesystem has a simple single-user permission model and the libc functions for accessing/modifying the permissions are supported. So technically you could get the permissions through os.access. Not as convenient as ls, of course, but doable.

<comment><USER7> I will note that when copying the text out of the interpreter, the prompt (>) doesn't copy (I assume that you may be using a CSS :after or :before decorator, though I didn't look). Sometimes even the newline itself didn't copy. For that post I had to cleanup all of the text so that it would display properly. This may be an issue you want to look at if you want to support people copy/pasting stuff that they are working on out of the console (or you may just want to add a button that generates a Github gist or pastebin entry and displays a link to it).

<comment><USER6> The prompt label is an image, hence it's not copyable. We experimented a bit with various copy-friendly approaches, but couldn't find anything that was cross-browser and did not damage the look/layout we were going for. To share a session, click the save button on the top right - it'll generate a shareable link with the editor content and the whole REPL session in replayable form.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> Doesn't work too well with my Swedish keyboard layout. If I want to use "[" or "]" I'd normally use Alt Gr+8 or Alt Gr+9, that doesn't work. This makes it almost impossible to code.

<comment><USER6> Thanks for the report. We're handling input as raw keystrokes for flexibility, so the more advanced features are sometimes not supported. I've opened an issue for it (<https://github.com/replit/jq-console/issues/19>) in the appropriate repository. Feel free to watch that for updates.

</comment></comment><comment><USER9> Love it. This site is hella-fast and responsive compared to the other "Try [x]" web apps I've used before. Love the addition of LOLCODE. Personally, it took me a second to figure out the lambda and eg buttons, but I didn't find it frustrating or difficult. Pretty smart if you ask me.

</comment><comment><USER10> Wonderful, Nice to see QBasic there. These days its easier to write for modern High Level languages, as they are easily installed and available everywhere. But the classic and beautiful languages are hard to find and even talked about.

Good and nostalgic memories of Programming with the Basic.

:)

<comment><USER11> "Beautiful"?!

</comment></comment><comment><USER12> I'm unsure about the Scheme that is included. It claims to be R6RS which requires support for exact numerical operations including big integers and rationals. Currently it seems to use only double precision floating point instead of exact integer values!

<comment><AUTHOR> Thanks, will look into this.

</comment></comment><comment><USER13> It's fun by itself, but what I believe could make it really useful would be to include interactive tutorials for each language. That's what I was expecting when I clicked the link.

<comment><AUTHOR> We have put lots of time and effort into getting all of these languages to run smoothly in the browser, we thought we would showcase this project before continuing on with our plans (more languages, tutorials, etc..).

<comment><USER13> Sorry I realize my comment sounded a bit negative, which wasn't at all my intention. You've done a fantastic job already and it's great to know tutorials are on your todo list.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER14> In Python:

Importing urllib hangs zlib imports, but the compress and compressobj methods fail

> import zlib

> zlib.compress("askldas")

Internal error: ReferenceError: _deflateInit_ is not defined

</comment><comment><USER15> This is awesome! I see this replacing my normal pastebin/ideone workflows ...

One comment: in python, technically tabs are equivalent to 8 spaces, but in your REPL it is equivalent to 4 spaces. Is that a modification to the version of python you are using, or did you make a decision to match 4 spaces (BTW: I really like this, but it breaks some older code)

<comment><USER16> In python you can use tabs or spaces (however many) as long as it is consistent. Don't mix tabs and spaces. 4 spaces recommended.

Style Guide: <http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0008/> Indentation Myths: <http://www.secnetix.de/olli/Python/block_indentation.hawk>

<comment><USER15> It's not really discussed in the PEP but in fact python treats the tab at the same indentation level as 8 spaces. You can mix tabs and 8 spaces without impunity

Check <http://ideone.com/VIwf4> for an example. Basically, it shows that python treats 8 spaces at the same indent level as a tab

<comment><USER6> I think ideone and/or your editor converts tabs to 8 spaces. Trying a tab indent followed by an 8-space one raises an error in native IPython for me. In any case, we're using normal CPython compiled to JavaScript, so it's unlikely to change finer points of the behaviour like this.

<comment><USER15> in CPython (at least, on my mac) mixing tabs and 8 spaces works perfectly fine. try it out!

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER17> Great site. A trivial gripe: you should get rid of the text shadow on the "Select a Language" title. Grey CSS text shadows on grey backgrounds tend to look blurry, and this is no exception. Or, better yet, make it a white 1px shadow with no blur: <http://goo.gl/BU0Hu>

</comment><comment><USER18> Would it be possible to implement user input via the REPL instead of the current javascript prompts? Would be much less clunky.

Also, at the moment something like this doesn't work at all (Python):

      while True:
          user_input = raw_input()
          if user_input is 'q':
              break
          else:
              print user_input

<comment><AUTHOR> This problem happens with Python/Lua/Ruby because they're compiled from their original lower-level implementations using Emscripten. Which means everything have to work synchronously and there is no way to stop execution in order to get the user's input, unless we transform the code into CPS, which will probably make it much slower.

</comment></comment><comment><USER19> I'm getting a 330 ERR_CONTENT_DECODING_FAILED when I try to load up the site. If no one else is getting this then chances are it's my company's firewall interfering. If its rule set detects either "fun" and/or "potentially useful" the site is immediately banned.

<comment><USER20> Getting the same error here.

Error 330 (net::ERR_CONTENT_DECODING_FAILED): Unknown error.

<comment><AUTHOR> Is this chrome? Did you try it on other browsers?

<comment><USER20> Chrome 14.0.835.186 m Windows 7, I get the above error.

Firefox 6.02 I get:

The page you are trying to view cannot be shown because it uses an invalid or unsupported form of compression.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER21> I wonder whether Haskell is on their todo list. GHC's LLVM backend [1] might be helpful.

[1] [http://hackage.haskell.org/trac/ghc/wiki/Commentary/Compiler...](http://hackage.haskell.org/trac/ghc/wiki/Commentary/Compiler/Backends/LLVM)

<comment><USER6> I've spoken a little about the reason we couldn't use GHC among other things, at <https://github.com/replit/repl.it/issues/43>. In short, we need an interpreter rather than a compiler or a JIT, and we need the interpreter itself to run in the browser.

<comment><USER21> Thanks for a quick reply. So having GHCi - the GHC's REPL - <USER2> emscripted could make adding Haskell support possible, right?

<comment><USER6> If it uses a JIT internally, it will produce x86 machine code, which is meaningless to us since we aren't emulating the whole machine. If it doesn't, then emscripting it should work.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER22> Hitting that QBasic button was like Hot Tub Time Machine... and just as bad as the movie.

</comment><comment><USER23> Hmm... Chrome gives me:

The webpage at <http://repl.it/> might be temporarily down or it may have moved permanently to a new web address. Error 330 (net::ERR_CONTENT_DECODING_FAILED): Unknown error.

:(

</comment><comment><USER24> I am amazed, more so by the fact that you made the source code available (and also since it's made with node.js).

I will have a lot of fun either with the app itself _or_ the source code. Thanks!

<comment><AUTHOR> Everything happens on client-side the server is just for saving sessions and file serving. So technically its not written in node.js. Node is only a dependency for the development tools we use (coffee-script, mini-server for development). However the server running repl.it is written in Node, its nothing fancy but it makes us run cheap and it will be open-sourced soon.

</comment></comment><comment><USER25> Ouch! Awesome apps like this are totally humbling. Congratulations, guys.

If you're still following this thread, amasad and max99x, I have a simple question: how many hours did you two put into this?

<comment><USER6> Really hard to say. We started experimenting with the idea back in March, but didn't start putting fulltime nights into it until August. I'd say a little over a thousand man-hours over the span of 6 months, but I may be well off the mark.

<comment><AUTHOR> It was a fruitful experience and if we want to count in the hours of reading and studying that this project has spawned, it would be much more than that.

Anyways, the real question is "how much did it cost?": $1600+ in sushi dinners! :)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER26> Wow, really nice. I was looking for a tool to try out some code when working away from my workstation. This fits the bill, its fast and agreable to use. Thanks!

</comment><comment><USER27> Scheme runs nicely on an iPhone 3GS. The Emscripten-compiled stuff crashes before you get to a prompt. Still, good stuff!

EDIT: I take that back. Lua runs, Python and Ruby do not.

<comment><AUTHOR> Yeah we are working on that. We didn't have a physical iOS device and the simulator cheated us into thinking that it actually works!

</comment></comment><comment><USER28> Nice stuff... What about some SCALA ? mixed paradigm functional + object oriented with a lot of mojo !

<comment><AUTHOR> Scala is great and we would love to have it. But the core philosophy behind repl.it is that everything has to be client-side. We're not very experienced with the JVM languages, but we are planning to experiment in loading them inside a Java Applet. Not sure how doable is this, would appreciate some feedback.

<comment><USER29> ClojureScript?

<comment><AUTHOR> ClojureScript is compiled to JS using Clojure which needs the JVM to run.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER30> This is great stuff. A really good way to play with some languages without needing to install it.

</comment><comment><USER31> Why isn't the print function working in Qbasic? What restrictions are there in the compiler?

<comment><USER6> You might be hitting the fact that QBasic actually requires keywords to be in capitals. The original IDE did the conversion for you, but repl.it doesn't. We should really be more lenient about those. For now, check the existing examples and use your trusty caps lock.

<comment><USER32> The actual QuickBASIC compiler allowed any case for keywords.

The lack of line numbers was a bit confusing too - my first inclination when seeing a BASIC prompt is to type

      10 PRINT "hello"
      20 GOTO 10

Aside from that, it seems to work as expected (at least in the quick tests I tried).

<comment><USER33> Numeric labels also don't work:

      10: PRINT "hello"
      GOTO 10

This works though:

      label: PRINT "hello"
      GOTO label

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER34> Awesome work guys! Keep at it and I would love to play around with tutorials in the future.

<comment><AUTHOR> Thanks, we'll keep you posted for new features.

</comment></comment><comment><USER35> the QBasic support actually makes me want to try to add Canvas support to it so that

      SCREEN 13
      CIRCLE (4, 3), 4, 4

and all the other stuff I used to have fun with years ago will actually work.

<comment><USER6> Actually Steve Hanov's implementation which we're using does have canvas support. You can find it at <http://stevehanov.ca/blog/index.php?id=92>. We stripped the graphical parts since they make little sense in our UI. At some point we may add graphics support, but if we do it will be to all (or at least the majority of) the languages.

</comment></comment><comment><USER36> try any language online (asymptotically speaking

[http://joel.franusic.com/w/page/26128430/Online-REPs-and- REP...](http://joel.franusic.com/w/page/26128430/Online-REPs-and-REPLs)

</comment><comment><USER37> What is Javascript.next?

<comment><AUTHOR> Traceur (<http://code.google.com/p/traceur-compiler/>): Its basically JavaScript with proposed language features for ECMAScript Harmony (<http://wiki.ecmascript.org/doku.php?id=harmony:proposals>).

<comment><USER6> To add to this, each language has an about link and an engine link (shown at the bottom when you select a language). These will take you to a page describing the language and the interpreter we're using, respectively.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER38> This is KILLER!

</comment><comment><USER39> Every time I try Python or Ruby, the interpreter loads almost fully and then freezes.

Lua and Scheme work fine. Also, good job on allowing me to close the tab after I managed to get QBasic locked in an infinite loop. :-) (Dual-core likely helped.)

Firefox 7.0, x86 (32-bit), running on Ubuntu 11.04, x86-64.

<comment><AUTHOR> Yes this is a regression with firefox 7+ browsers, the creator of emscripten (@kripken) has already opened a bug in it <https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=687951> .

And ya, we try to sandbox most of our languages inside a Web Worker, which leaves the main thread intact incase of infinite loops and such.</comment></comment>


Docker 0.6: Events API, registry improvements, expert mode, security updates. - <AUTHOR> http://blog.docker.io/2013/08/websockets-dockerfile-upgrade-better-registry-support-expert-mode-and-more/

<comment><USER2> When is the AUFS requirement going to be removed?

Ubuntu is going to drop it in the near future. So the idea of rebooting all servers to install a custom kernel with AUFS makes me not even want to try it.

<comment><USER3> Any references on why they are dropping it and what they are replacing it with?

<comment><USER4> I assume they are dropping it to allow much wider adoption. Docker makes use of AUFS for many of its cool features, like quickly spinning up containers, snapshots, diffs, etc. Ubuntu is dropping AUFS support in its stock kernels [1], and RHEL (CentOS, SL, etc) does not have support for AUFS in their stock kernels [2], and it is a major pain to try and add it (i.e. not even a simple recompile, you need custom patches, etc). So, given these two issues, you run the risk of alienating your user base pretty quickly.

[1] [http://ubuntu.5.x6.nabble.com/RFC-AUFS-disabled- for-12-04-td...](http://ubuntu.5.x6.nabble.com/RFC-AUFS-disabled- for-12-04-td4532153.html)

[2] [https://github.com/dotcloud/docker/issues/172](https://github.com/dotcloud/docker/issues/172)

<comment><USER3> I was talking about why Ubuntu was dropping AUFS, not why docker was. I've been following the UnionFS area in Linux for awhile now and AUFS still seems to be the only viable option. So I was asking to find out if Ubuntu expects one of the alternatives to be ready soon.

<comment><USER5> Speaking as a dotCloud employee: yes, it's also our opinion that aufs is still the most viable option in a production setting. Finding a permanent solution to the clusterfuck of union filesystems in linux seems as likely as peace in the middle-east: those with a viable solution are powerless to impose it; those who could change the status quo seem paralyzed by bias, personal feuds or simply having other fish to fry. Meanwhile the rest of the World has thrown their hands up and stopped waiting. Aufs works in production, moving on.

Speaking as a Docker maintainer: we'll add support for whatever our users want most, and makes it easy to run docker everywhere.

<comment><USER6> Perhaps something like btrfs could work.

By creating your base image in a subvol or individual file you can then snapshot that and mount the snapshot into the container?

additionally it lets you piggy back on the stuff that inktank and openstack are doing with ceph and btrfs

distributed storage with cow images for VMs for your container servers

<comment><USER5> btrfs is one of the alternatives we plan on supporting. In fact there is already an experimental branch with btrfs support.

However, wearing my user / operator hat, if I had to choose I would stick to aufs in production. If I had to switch (and the apparently stupid move by ubuntu to drop it might indeed force me to), I would first try to use more proven code, like lvm or raid/dm.

btrfs and overlayfs are neat, promising technology for the future - that place where our production deployments can't go :)

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> Hi everybody, this is quite a monster of a release: 378 commits by 40 different people :)

Here's the full release pull request if you're interested: [https://github.com/dotcloud/docker/pull/1628](https://github.com/dotcloud/docker/pull/1628)

<comment><USER7> I've been meaning to try this for a while now but the release of your new Ubuntu repo (as opposed to PPA, details here for other Ubuntu users: [http://docs.docker.io/en/latest/installation/ubuntulinux/](http://docs.docker.io/en/latest/installation/ubuntulinux/) ) has convinced me to finally install.

Congrats on the release. Love how fast the docker team is updating.

<comment><USER5> Thanks!

Out of curiosity, what's your reasoning for preferring a custom repo instead of a PPA?

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> Can anyone point to an evaluation of the various orchestration/wiring tools mentioned in the post, e.g. "Orchestra, Shipper, Deis, Pipeworks, etc"?

<comment><AUTHOR> I haven't seen one, Tim, but I'd love to see it. Will you volunteer? :)

<comment><USER8> Added to weekend projects list. ETA mid-October.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> It's worth pointing out that there's now a digitalocean pre-configured image with Docker.

<comment><AUTHOR> This is so cool. I'll be picking one up.

</comment></comment><comment><USER10> Given the recent thread I'm interested in what the security updates were given that the word security doesn't occur in the changelog. Can someone closer to the source please explain?

<comment><AUTHOR> From the blog post:

> We have tightened Docker's default access control configuration, to make it > more suitable for use on a host machine shared with untrusted applications. > Running docker commands now requires either root privileges, or a user > account included in the "docker" group.

> This means that after upgrading to 0.6, you will need sudo to run docker > commands.

> Don't worry, you can revert your configuration with the "-H" flag. Just make > sure you understand the security implications!</comment></comment>


How green is the Internet? - <AUTHOR> http://googleblog.blogspot.in/2013/06/how-green-is-internet.html <comment><USER2> Doesn't really say that much does it?

Email and calendar apps can't be that demanding resource wise. The indexing might be. File servers and email can be kept on a low power set-up on the LAN. I can understand the reticence about putting these up in the cloud.

I've never had a connection that I'd be happy enough to rely on to go all out to the cloud, but like the low power client, shared server model.

I'd have thought though that if people were serious about saving energy, they could do a few simple things (I've seen so many places squandering energy):

People could use heating systems more efficiently - not heat the building with the windows open!

People leave their computers on all night long even with modern OSs that can suspend or hibernate easily or even cold boot quickly. They don't even set them up to sleep - the default energy management policies under their OSs could be better. People don't change them, they use high calory screen savers and eschew sleeping them. It just doesn't seem to be a concern.

Most in house servers and workstations probably could just be turned off for 14hrs each day with no consequence. A community building that hosted many charities I worked in proposed pulling the electric to the offices at night as an energy saving exercise but met a lot of resistance. Why?

Web browser tabs could be closed, or fully backgrounded by using bookmarks. Or apps could be managed better.

Monitors could be turned off.

Phone chargers and transformers could be switched off fully while not used.

Less water in kettles, and or insulated kettles.

No disposable cups, or plastic packaging in the canteens that just gets dumped.

There's a lot of hot wind. Some people want to be green, but don't take any ownership themselves - I do a little recycling, drive a Prius and use Gmail - isn't really going green.

It's nice to finally see some inroads in some OSs like Windows 8 regarding energy management, why has this taken so long though?

I'd love to see more people remote working, particpating in online meetings etc, at least it would lighten the load off the roads.

Watching Al Gore jet setting all over the globe with his green message doesn't exactly fill me with confidence.</comment>