Modern Weather Forecasts Are Stunningly Accurate - <AUTHOR> https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2019/01/polar-vortex-weather-forecasting-good-now/581605/ <comment><USER2> Just a little knowledge to drop, as a bachelor degree meteorologist and also coder / HN'er.

Dont use your built in phone app for forecasts. Dont expect hour by hour precision (maybe for the next few hours sure, but not 2,3,4,5 days out). Trust nobody expect the trained professionals at NWS. These people look at ALL the models, they watch things like a hawk. I work with some of these nerds and it's crazy. They are like 'oh jimbob did you see the latest GFS kicking out the low up into canada? oh yeah doug that is crazy, but the euro says blah blah and NAM says blahblah... Their job is to literally make a forecast, for the same area, every day. Some people do it for years and years! Think of the experience, wisdom, little tricks and tips etc. Just go to weather.gov, look at it for 2 minutes. Read the foreacst discussion if you want to get your details.

<comment><USER3> I find Dark Sky to be the best forecasting tool for weather within the hour. It's almost always ahead of all the other apps in terms of the latest forecast.

<comment><USER4> I bought the app because of its hyperlocal forecasting, but it's been known to predict precipitation where there's none, and vice versa.

I wonder if it does better in some geographies than others (e.g. high pressure system areas where things are more stable)

<comment><USER2> hyperlocal is a joke, sorry to say it. Just because you can downscale your grid to a very small number doesnt mean good data. It just means you can do statistics and mathy stuff to interpolate. Everyone forecasts better in stable times such as a strong high pressure ridge. The tricky part is the edge areas between air masses, the transition zones. This is where all the juicy weather actually happens and it is the hardest to model

<comment><USER5> Totally agreed on it being a marketing term, not a real prediction improvement - it's essentially the same as any other app in terms of "will it rain" / etc.

But they do a _much_ better job of notifying about changes based on where I physically am, instead of for the city / region as a whole. Other weather apps I've used don't differentiate between "rain falling now 50 miles away" and "rain falling on my head", even though the radar map clearly gives them that info at a much finer level of detail.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> Many folks, when hearing forecasts have improved, will disagree. They can think of many times when the forecast was wrong, perhaps hilariously or disruptively so.

This is textbook availability bias. You overestimate the failure rate because the failures were memorable, especially the major failures. But the far more frequent accurate predictions are not recalled, because they don't leave as much of an emotional impression. For the same reason folks regularly overestimate crime rates, deaths from terrorism or rare diseases.

Meteorology has an _entire subfield_ devoted to studying the quality of forecasts[0]. Before you bandy about numbers and anecdotes, stop and tell me what measure you are using. Is it percentage of degrees centigrade? Well you can't, degrees centigrade is an interval measure, not a ratio measure. If you use Kelvins, which has a mathematically meaningful zero, the percentage accuracy is suddenly very good. How do you count near misses of very intense weather? Direct hits by systems that were less intense than expected? How do you account for systems with very gradual gradients over very wide areas? How do you account for being early by an hour or late by an hour, but nailing the storm surge? How do you score for confidence? What's your rule for weighting false alarms? How important is mean error vs absolute error vs variance, and why?

Solve these and dozens of other problems of describing "accuracy" and weather forecasters might take you seriously. But until then it's probably worth accepting that they are the most effective profession of their kind and that we have a lot we can learn from them.

[0] [http://www.cawcr.gov.au/projects/verification/](http://www.cawcr.gov.au/projects/verification/)

<comment><USER7> I worked outside every day for 4 years at least. Weather forecasts are so unreliable I stopped listening. I had better luck trying to figure out if i'd need rain gear in a day by just waking up and looking out the window in the morning than looking up or listening to a weather forecast.

You really start to notice how wrong they are when you spend every day outside. I don't notice any more working inside again. But when you rely on weather forecasts everyday to figure out how miserable you're going to be in a day...you really notice..they might as well just be making things up half the time.

<comment><USER2> Hmmm. If you are needing down to the minute accurate timing of when rain is going to start & stop, sure nobody can predict that, for every location in the USA, all the time. I have to question where you are getting your weather forecast information??? I am a bachelor degree meteorologist, I dont use any apps that try to be 'hyper local' (omg i hate that word, it is the weather version of AI/ML hype). Just go to the government site www.weather.gov

We can't predict exactly when it will rain, but we can get daily trends pretty good for 3-5 days out. This means you are five days ahead of the weather. You cant know "it will rain from 5:00am to 9:30am on february 4th, 2019". But you can know if we have a synoptic scale system that is moving through your area on that day, and know if there is a probability of rain.

Where do you work everyday outside? i would be happy to give you a 5 - 10 day forecast right now actually and can tell you it will be good. I am supposed to be writing some tests and documentation but i can drop some WX knowledge if you need.

<comment><USER8> I get the feeling that this "hyper-local" mentality contributed to NYC and surrounding areas being caught flat-footed by the first-of-season snowfall at the end of last year. I have little understanding of meteorology, but it was clear, just from the forecast maps, that a small change in the location and timing of the rain/snow line would make a big difference to the outcome, and that something more than was forecast was a distinct possibility.

As with many things, having a little understanding of the big picture can help you get more out of weather forecasts.

<comment><USER2> Your last statement is the so true. An amateur forecaster can spend ten minutes looking at the some big picture (synoptic scale) weather and know regional trends (this part of country is dry, these guys are wet, humid etc). This would be a pressure & wind map, showing location of high/lows, maybe some 850mb moisture charts too... But you are painting broad strokes. All of these dumbos on HN want to know exactly when the rain is going to hit your exact location, or you have to be within 3 degrees C modeling the surface temperature of my street so i can either ride my bike or not. We just cant do that with the current science & computational landscape!

After you have the synoptic scale picture, then you zoom in on your target area and get specific if you want to. This local expertise is where you NWS office comes into play. You want the local forecast from these guys!

<comment><USER9> It's not that, it's selective memory. Everyone remembers the blown forecasts. Even I do. Three or four years back NWS predicted a big Christmas storm in SoCal, but the damn cut-off didn't come on shore, and the resulting offshore flow made the day nice and warm.

And, Americans only: if you forecast temperatures of 99°F and the observed temperature is 97°, good job. But if the observed temperature is 100°, then you made a huge mistake. People need to know when you hit the century mark!

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> As an amateur astronomer/astrophotographer for the past 25+ years I've relied on long to short term forecasts. Will it be clear for an event I want to see? I can certainly agree the models have improved and are pretty good. Much to my dislike on occasion such as the recent lunar eclipse. I was clouded out, that looked likely days ahead of time.

One has to appreciate the complexity of modeling such a large and dynamic system that the atmosphere is! There are cases where forecasting is more difficult. Certainly getting the temperature correct within a degree or two is one case.

Another issue is geography. I'm in middle of of USA and there is significant amount of data collected over the continental US as systems approach me. For those on the west coast I can see where forecasting is more challenging since there is far less data available to input into models (current atmosphere state 100s of kilometers out over the ocean). I'd suspect some European countries experience same situation, those further inland benefit from increased modelling data.

Reading the comments here I'm a bit surprised at how many quibble over slight details. The improvements over the past decades in forecasting models and the supercomputers that crunch the data has been significant. In most cases, like recent cold temperatures and snow fall amounts, models converge on a good solution as the event nears. This is consistent with idea that better data input yields better data out.

<comment><USER2> The system is complex beyond our comprehension. If we really wanted to model weather and climate better we need to know more things. Things like how much cow farts are there? I would be happy to build a system to ingest cow fart obs and feed them into the numerical models. FPS farts per sec yo

</comment></comment><comment><USER11> > Meteorologists are increasingly uniting weather models and climate models, > allowing them to project the general contours of a season as it begins.

Weather and climate models are gradually converging and both are getting incredibly good.

They work even in astronomy. You take a climate model, set the parameters for Mars or some exoplanets and what you get is relatively good Mars climate model or good principled guess of of what the climate in tidal locked planet around ultra-cool red dwarf star is (TRAPPIST-1).

</comment><comment><USER12> > In 2009, a back-of-the-envelope study estimated that U.S. adults check the > weather forecast about 300 billion times per year.

That's every single adult in the United States checking the weather _four times a day_. A bit more than I would have expected…

<comment><USER13> This number probably includes things like swiping to the leftmost home screen on your phone to see the weather widget at the top. When it's that easy you can often check the weather unintentionally.

<comment><USER14> That's a 2009 study, so more like every time you open your flip phone.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> Anyone who is a weather buff should try meteogram ([https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.cloud3squa...](https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.cloud3squared.meteogram)). You can plot a huge host of parameters (temperature, dew point, pressure, humidity, precipitation, wind speed/direction, sun/moon azimuth/elevation, etc.) over time, and the insights are very revealing. You can also choose multiple data sources, and it even has options to display METAR data.

</comment><comment><USER16> Just follow few models for a couple of weeks and you will notice how inaccurate the weather forecast is.*

I do follow ECMWF and ICON and a bit of OpenWeather forecast and the differences in forecasted temperatures are often 2-3 degrees C. And everything with a horizon over 72 hours is just numerology. (OpenWeather showed -19C in early days of Feb just 2 days ago, today it is -2C).

Now a model is just a model (I had some experience with industrial and financial models) so they are good at this and not so good at that. And they are recalculated and self-adjusted over time. I can understand.

But from the user perspective there is huge difference between +1C tomorrow and -3C.

Windy app is using 4 models and has nice graphical comparision of forecasts.

* - What I mean here is that meteorologists have good understanding of processes but the numbers that we are getting could be as well random.

<comment><USER17> _But from the user perspective there is huge difference between +1C tomorrow and -3C._

Really? I'd read those both as "near freezing, going to need a decent coat".

<comment><USER18> +1 means that the packed snow is going to melt on top and then probably re- freeze, making everything super slippery. So I need to remove as much snow from the paths as possible and spread sand, and remind the kids to be careful.

-3 means relax.

<comment><USER19> The temperatures given are usually air temperatures. If the ground is warm enough -- which it is usually is in the cities -- then it doesn't really matter, the snow will melt in both cases.

<comment><USER18> Not here mate, not in one day that's for sure.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER20> I'm sure it's easier to predict weather in some places versus others, but in San Francisco I find the weather forecast to be wrong more often than not. I'm often told it's currently sunny or raining when it's the opposite. And forget about accurate high temperature predictions for tomorrow. At this point I don't know why I even bother checking.

</comment><comment><USER21> If you're looking for a graph that shows more than a projected minimum/maximum for every day, take a look at Foreca's 15-day forecast page [0]. It shows percentile lines for the forecasted minimum and maximum, which give a much better idea of what to expect. It also forecasts global vs. local precipitation. Unfortunately it is only available in Finnish.

[0] [https://www.foreca.fi/Canada/Vancouver/15vrk](https://www.foreca.fi/Canada/Vancouver/15vrk)

Disclaimer: I used to worked for MSN Weather, where we used Foreca's feed as the source for our weather data.

</comment><comment><USER22> Back in the seventies and eighties there were four sources of impetus for improvement in highly parallel supercomputing. Military/Nuclear, high energy physics, oil and gas exploration (seismic analysis) and weather.

The weather people were the nicest. They could talk to almost anyone about their work!

I remember somebody in csiro talking to me about models getting accurate at the 1km square granular scale for a day. I think we're well beyond that for both cell size and duration now.

Everyone loves to talk about the weather and Bob Dylan was wrong about not needing a weatherman to know which way the wind blows

</comment><comment><USER23> This is an interesting example of an article that talks about gradual improvements in our lives that we take for granted at this point. It's strange because most articles are about dramatic deterioration. For example, it's unlikely we will read articles about the increase in % children who are vaccinated against basic diseases. It was 22% in 1980, 88% in 2016. Far more likely is reading reams of text devoted to the (for now) niche anti-vaxxer movement.

<comment><USER24> I don't think using outbreaks of a preventable disease due to stupid people thinking they know more than they do and causing harm to society as a whole is overly dramatic. If anything, there should be more coverage about it so we can get laws passed to deny non medical exemptions.

<comment><USER23> What's the impact in terms of affected people. Hundreds of millions of children being vaccinated, millions of them not dying young, dramatically changing the dynamics of societies where women can now choose not to have multiple children.... or a few hundred people getting measles. I'm not saying the anti-vax thing isn't a problem. I'm saying that the improvements and advancements have a higher impact on society than what a few idiots choose to do. And yet we read much more about the latter.

<comment><USER24> The issue of people not vaccinating is specifically one which can spiral out of control very easily, as the tools we have to fight the disease don't work once herd immunity is lost, hence sounding the alarm bells is warranted.

Actually, now that I think about it, perhaps if the history of vaccines and the success had been more widely disseminated, then we may not have had this anti vaccine problem. I agree that it would be nice to read more about successes.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER25> I skimmed this article and the linked sciencemag article and they seem to talk about wide scale weather events (eg. hurricanes), rather than the typical things that people look for in forecasts (yes/no rain, min/max temperature). A freakonomics article from 2008 found that at least for precipitation forecasts, weather forecasts don't fare much better than a simple probabilistic model. Has forecasts like these improved in accuracy?

</comment><comment><USER26> The actual research this is based on is: "The Quiet Revolution of Numerical Weather Prediction" Bauer, Thorpe, Brunet, 2005.

"Stunningly Accurate" means that 7-day forecasts are now at the lower boundary of being considered "useful" so the bar is not being set very high here.

Still not a lot to quell the skepticism that some reasonable people have about the ability of scientists to accurately predict weather decades in the future.

<comment><USER27> Weather ≠ climate.

<comment><USER28> right. climate is a more complex system. more variables. more unknowns. exponentially larger prediction area. unknown base states. so it should be much easier to predict right?

<comment><USER29> > so it should be much easier to predict right?

Yes, because the goals of the forecast are different. A weather forecast seeks to predict a future position within the phase space of the system; a climate forecast seeks to predict the overall shape of that phase space.

"It will be 1C warmer in February on average" is a useless prediction if I'm deciding whether or not to wear a heavy coat tomorrow, since day-by-day variability swamps that average. But it is a very useful prediction if I'm designing infrastructure that needs to last 50 years.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER30> I only see forecast errors for hurricanes listed as the cited data. Maybe I missed the other cited sources for data measuring forecast accuracy, but hurricane forecast accuracy, which is a storm that covers hundreds of square kilometers, doesn't seem like enough data to justify making the general claim 'modern weather forecasts' are stunningly accurate.

</comment><comment><USER31> Shout out to Climendo.

I use the android app and it gives me a simple comparison of 4-5 weather forecasts, an "average" forecast, and a "certainty" (a measure of consensus).

Obviously the average of the ensemble averages isn't as good as having the underlying ensembles themselves, but it's nice to see days when the forecasts agree and days when they have no idea!

</comment><comment><USER32> Best forecasts that I know (accurate enough to people come and ask me): [https://www.windguru.cz/](https://www.windguru.cz/)

Notes:

\- Only the GFS27KM is reliable on free version and within next 48-72h.

\- Temperatures are always conservative on extremes. When it says 37C, expect 40C. When 2C expect 0C.

</comment><comment> T3OU-736 Intriguing. Barely a mention (buried and oblique) that there are different weather models, and almost no discussion about relative accuracy or the reasons for the difference. Especially contrasting with the last paragraph being explicitly "Rah rah America" with the fact that the US NWS' weather models are less accurate than the European ones (hurricane Sandy was a huge wake-up call)

<comment><USER2> They also dont even reference any USA models in the article. The GFS was also showing this big cold snap, not just the euro!

</comment></comment><comment><USER33> What's missing in most of the weather services is the recent history forecast vs observation.

</comment><comment><USER34> why is my weatherman always wrong? :(

<comment><USER35> Because we tend to remember the few times where they get it very wrong (which is always going to happen because of the chaotic nature of weather) and ignore the large percentage of the time when they're right.

</comment></comment><comment><USER36>
      I use the forecast put out by weather.gov that's supposedly tailored

to the square mile because it gets the 12 hour forecast right about 40% of the time. The others are worse.

      Of course, when they say "chance of precipitation is 80%, less than an
      inch possible" and it doesn't rain, the forecast is semantically
      "correct."

      Like the El Nino impact on the SE US, where they forecast a 50% chance

of drier colder weather and a 50% chance of warmer wetter weather, it's nearly impossible to be wrong.

      Maybe this is the sort of obfuscatory probabilistic forecast Mr. Meyer

is counting as "accurate."

<comment><USER37> > _it gets the 12 hour forecast right about 40% of the time_

Where are these figures from? Your emotions, or something scientifically rigid? If the former, having this discussion is meaningless.

<comment><USER36> "chance of precipitation is 80%, less than an inch possible"

How would you determine, in a scientifically rigid manner, the limits on conditions which would validate that forecast as "right?" Or the inverse. What conditions would invalidate it as "not right?"

<comment><AUTHOR> In a top-level comment upthread, jacques_chester posted a link to an overview of forecast verification methods: [http://www.cawcr.gov.au/projects/verification/](http://www.cawcr.gov.au/projects/verification/)

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER38> The recent snow storm in my area, 4 days in advance they were predicting 30cm of snow. 3.5 days in advance were 25cm of now. 3 days in advanced 15cm of snow. 2 days in advanced 5-10cm of snow. 1 day in advance 15cm of snow. We got about 10cm of snow.

Sorry but that's stunningly inaccurate.

<comment><USER39> 4 days in advance they correctly predicted you would get snow and that it would be on the order of tens of centimeters thick. That's really good. Over the intervening days they revised their estimate down and the snowfall was eventually lower than the initial estimate so the accuracy improved. Their final estimate was again correct that you did get snow, which is the key prediction, and they even got the depth at your precise location right to within 33%. That's fantastic, and far better than was possible for the vast majority of my lifetime.

Also, the fact that their predictions were all rounded to the nearest 5cm should give you a clue at the expected accuracy and granularity of the final prediction. Missing the target by only one 'unit' of measure is pretty decent.

<comment><AUTHOR> There's also the fact that predicting amount of snow is particularly difficult because the same amount of water will yield vastly different snowfalls with single-degree deviations of the temperature.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER40> No, both our weather forecasting and climate model forecasting are still very very weak and poorly understood. Predicting the future is still hard for us humans.

<comment><USER41> Sources?</comment></comment>


Free Online Classes Are Little Help in Job Hunt - <AUTHOR> http://www.businessweek.com/printer/articles/66500-free-online-classes-are-little-help-in-job-hunt

<comment><AUTHOR> But at the end:

"...That doesn't mean edX and Coursera are not game-changing initiatives that may someday change the face of higher education, says Rob Rutenbar, head of the computer science department at the University of Illinois at Urbana- Champaign. Far from it.

"The idea of being able to take videos of classes, to put them out in the cloud, to let millions download them, to use sophisticated technology to grade them—that genie is out of the bottle," Rutenbar says. "We don't know where it's going to go, but it's not going to go away..."</comment>


China Is Building a "Social Credit" System. So Is the United States - <AUTHOR> https://arcdigital.media/china-is-building-a-social-credit-system-so-is-the-united-states-a9facbc6f832 <comment><AUTHOR> I do feel a bit uneasy about the type of arguments that reminds me of Putin's rhetoric in Russia: yes, X is bad, but look at Y!

Russia was correctly called out for using this logic in domestic and international propaganda, and now we see this spreading to Western media as well.</comment>


Why I'm Renaming a Gem - <AUTHOR> http://findingscience.com/ruby/2014/11/17/why-im-renaming-a-gem.html

<comment><USER2> I'm honestly getting quite sick of these kinds of things in open-source.

Names like 'upskirt' and 'pantyshot'[0] are inappropriate names that are offensive and unwelcoming to a particular gender, but when we reach the point where we are complaining about a wholly gender neutral name that only offends people offended by the word "sex" we're reaching the point of inanity, especially when the package in question is a black box where you give it a first name and it tells you the likelihood that the name is male or female. If someone is offended by that name, then they should also be offended by the entire raison d'etre of the package in question since it further reinforces the notion of a gender binary.

Gender identity exists on a spectrum, so getting offended by the name of an open source project that guesses gender identity based on a name but not being offended by the fact that the project reinforces the gender binary is supremely ironic.

As an open source developer, these kinds of discussions bother me immensely because it elevates some topic of discussion as being more important than the code and technical decisions. Any discussion that is not about code, technical decisions, API design, algorithms, abstraction boundaries, accurate documentation, etc. can generally be categorized as bikeshedding. I don't value bikeshedding. I don't want open source to be welcoming of bikeshedding where bikeshedding discussions of any kind are given the time of day.

A certain amount of discussion around of appropriate naming is warranted, but there is a line that you cross where making software welcoming to easily offended people starts making the process fraught for people just trying to make technical decisions because they now have overly sensitive people in their midsts that they must cater for. Making technical discussions fraught hurts open source a lot more than the gain you get from being welcoming to people who are easily offended.

The Ben Noordhuis debacle [3] springs to mind. libuv is a project where Ben is the #1 committer to the project with 1071 commits (35.6% of the total) and his commits are likely to be the overwhelming majority of new features and non- trivial code changes. Ben's sin was simply one of not allowing commits with no technical value. If the change had come in as part of a larger pull request where actual code was changed, I'm sure there would have been no controversy at all. Instead Alex Gaynor did a drive-by single commit to libuv (his only commit to date) and the whole thing blew up and Ben was made out to be the bad guy by many people who probably never made a commit to libuv and probably never will.

This resignation letter from a Debian TC member[1] is what I think of every time we leave room for discussion about anything but technical issues. Open source used to be about code first and foremost and we all lose when (code < people's feelings) evaluates to true.

I'm honestly at the point where I apply the follow heuristic to the opinions of people when it comes to bikeshedding about open source:

        function validOpinion(person, opinion) {
            if (hasPublishedOpenSourceCode(person)) {
                return opinion;
            } else {
                throw new Error('Invalid opinion');
            }
        }

If you don't publish open source code, your opinion does not matter.

[0] [http://www.zdnet.com/blog/violetblue/when-software- offends-t...](http://www.zdnet.com/blog/violetblue/when-software-offends-the- pantyshot-package-controversy/509)

[1] [https://lists.debian.org/debian- ctte/2014/11/msg00071.html](https://lists.debian.org/debian- ctte/2014/11/msg00071.html)

[2] [http://marc.info/?l=linux- kernel&m=137392506516022&w=2](http://marc.info/?l=linux- kernel&m=137392506516022&w=2)

[3] [https://github.com/joyent/libuv/pull/1015#issuecomment-29538...](https://github.com/joyent/libuv/pull/1015#issuecomment-29538615)

<comment><AUTHOR> I didn't submit this as a means to spark yet another debate on HN about gender dynamics or political correctness, but an example of a well-handled controversy by an open-source maintainer.

Let's ignore the details of the controversy. What we have here is someone who has made a useful gem and, after a couple of years, is told out of the blue that it's somewhat offensive. Someone else then submits a pull-request that "fixes" the problem. Meanwhile, the Github issues section has been basically vote-brigaded into a trollfest, to the point where many people would've just shut down the repo or not attempted any rational thinking because of how offensive and standoffish the debate had become.

But instead, the OP accepts the pull request and writes a very level-headed post about why he both agrees and disagrees with the sexism complaint. Even though such a complaint is one that he could've taken personally, he doesn't, and instead, he applies empathy and rationality when making his decision.

Whether you like the outcome or not, I think this is a prime example of civil discourse and action in OSS: a level-headed maintainer, and someone who makes a pull-request as proof of concept.

<comment><USER2> Totally agree. I think the maintainer here did a stellar job. The only thing that I don't think was considered in his response, and is the reason I came here to comment, is that I don't think we're fully thinking through the __unintended consequences __of placating everyone who is offended by something no matter how minor.

A environment that is overly sensitive and where people are easily offended is an environment that is not welcoming of people on the aspie-autistic end of the spectrum, especially on the internet where you don't know whether someone is neurotypical or not. People who are neurotypical tend to assume that everyone else is neurotypical as well. Open-source was and has always been a place where those on the aspie-autistic end of the spectrum can and do excel. Elevating feelings over code and being technically correct creates and environment that is fraught for those people who generally have less empathy and don't really get offended themselves.

Between making open source welcoming to people who are neurotypical and making it welcome to people on the aspie-autistic end of the spectrum, we all lose by favoring the former. The overwhelming majority of truly valuable contributions in our field are done by people who are neurologically aspie-autistic.

<comment><USER3> > The overwhelming majority of truly valuable contributions in our field are > done by people who are neurologically aspie-autistic.

Well, let's assume for a sec that you're right about this (I personally don't think so). I don't know how many neurotypical people we lose by favouring aspies. If we assume a prevalence rate of 1% or 2%, or even 5%, it may mean losing a good chunk of the neurotypical 95% – we _are_, after all, chasing away a good number of developers (check for example the stats for women in opensource, but I'm sure we chase away quite a number of men as well who prefer to stay away from toxic environments). Are you saying that these 1-5% provide more contributions then that huge chunk of the 95% that are, in your words, "overly sensitive"?

<comment><USER2> > Are you saying that these 1-5% provide more contributions then that huge > chunk of the 95% that are, in your words, "overly sensitive"?

Not at all. The 1-5% are usually the ones working by themselves creating a project from scratch and then maintaining those projects as others join the project. The capacity to remain highly focused on solitary tasks (like starting and building an open source project until it is useful enough for others to get involved) is more common in people on the aspie side of the spectrum.

The other 95% are not overly sensitive. Maybe just 1-5% are overly sensitive and lack the capacity to function with abrasive and insensitive people. The middle 90-98% plus the 1-5% that are the linchpins of any open source project are responsible for most of the open-source world.

We basically only lose the overly-sensitive ones (men and women), which is an acceptable loss until we start seeing open-source projects of significant technical importance written largely by people who are overly sensitive. I don't see that happening because overly-sensitive people are generally pre- occupied with being overly sensitive instead of getting things done. When I read complaints by someone being overly sensitive, I check their github profile and look for other technical contributions. Typically there isn't much to look at. Technical contributions entitle you to your opinions.

Lastly, I honestly have nothing against people who are overly sensitive so long as they either stop being overly sensitive or at least keep their overly sensitive thoughts to themselves and focus on the technical issues of the task at hand. I just exhausted of people derailing technical discussions because they are overly sensitive.

Anyways, I'm being overly sensitive about overly sensitive people in open- source, which is a massive waste of my time. Back to coding.

<comment><USER3> I suspect you vastly underestimate the number of what you call "overly- sensitive" people – I'd call them the norm. For example, there's only 2-5% women in Debian or Ubuntu. Where did the other 48% disappear to? Certain cultures are severely underrepresented too.

It's open source, meaning mostly volunteers: why would anyone want to put up with "abrasive and insensitive" people for fun?</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment>


SimpleGeo customers: Move your data to Geoloqi with one command - <AUTHOR> https://github.com/geoloqi/geoloqi-simplegeo-import

<comment><USER2> Why does it always upset me when services like this (Geoloqi) don't have pricing clearly available on their website?

All that great marketing doesn't make me want to sign in and create an account if I can't see quickly how much this service is going to cost me.

<comment><USER3> I totally agree. We have pricing information coming out next week! We weren't expecting the SimpleGeo news so soon.

<comment><USER2> 'Next week' being Monday? In the time it took you to post this response, you could have gotten pricing info up on your homepage. Well, ok, maybe another 30 minutes, but you get my point.

Something doesn't smell right here, I'm getting more and more dubious. It is clear you are just taking advantage of the failure of SimpleGeo to pimp your service on HN before your service is even ready to be pimped.

<comment><USER4> Geoloqi was a dedicated SimpleGeo customer, and when we heard SimpleGeo would be shutting down their service, we had to build our own to replace what would be shut down. We figured others might also have the same issue, so offered a simple importer.

As for pricing: there's more to putting pricing up on a website. We have to calculate our own people and server costs, as well as build and integrate a billing system into the site. In addition, developers need a way of knowing how many API calls they've used, and a way to pay for the service.

In conclusion, simply putting pricing up and then having to change it later because we rushed to put it up in the first place would be worse than just waiting until the date we planned on releasing the site. I hope this makes sense, and we really appreciate your comments and concerns.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> If you just want to dump your data to CSV to later decide what to do with it, here there is a script <https://gist.github.com/1610866>

</comment><comment><USER6> Does your API have context data, such as neighborhood, urbran area and county given a specific lat, lng.

<comment><USER3> Unfortunately we were using SimpleGeo for that kind of data as well. We are now looking at alternatives or building it in to our own API.

For now, check out the Open MapQuest API (based on OpenStreetMap data) for similar functionality. The example you're looking for is at the bottom of this page: <http://open.mapquestapi.com/nominatim/#reverse>

Here is a sample API query: [http://open.mapquestapi.com/nominatim/v1/reverse?format=json...](http://open.mapquestapi.com/nominatim/v1/reverse?format=json&lat=45.5246&lon=-122.6843)</comment></comment>


5-year project to improve your wardrobe - <AUTHOR> http://5yearproject.wordpress.com/2012/04/23/introducing-5-year-project/

<comment><USER2> A great idea, but the blog entry linked is from April 2012. Go to the site, click on the site title and then navigate around from there. It would be helpful if this link had gone to a page that gave a summary or a list of links to the material. It just seemed a dead end at first.

<comment><AUTHOR> hmm, I can't change it. is it not possible at all or do I just not have sufficient karma?

<comment><USER2> Not sure. I know you can edit comments for up to an hour after posting, but I don't know about top level stories. People with moderator privs can change things. Perhaps one will see it and change it.

Or you could just post a new top level story with a better URL.

Either way, I'd hate to see this story get no traction. Good on you.

<comment><AUTHOR> posted again with a URL to the blog's About page. It's not getting much attention anyway it seems :) It's not my blog but I thought that people here may find it useful</comment></comment></comment></comment>


Alan Kay was wrong about him being wrong - <AUTHOR> http://www.yegor256.com/2017/12/12/alan-kay-was-wrong.html <comment><AUTHOR> Read The discussion with Alan Kay in the comments</comment>


Video: Neo4j's Engineering Evolution: Graph Layer on RDBMS – Native Graph DB - <AUTHOR> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=687-Em4wONs <comment><USER2> My startup Wizely has built its API on top of a Neo4j graph database. I've been working with it and the Cypher query language for over a year now and it's simply phenomenal. I've been using databases for decades and having used relational, nosql, hierarchical (old school), and now a graph database, it just adds another tool in my toolbox for solving problems effectively.

<comment><USER3> Is there a particular problem that you were able to solve with a graph database that would have been more difficult using a different database?</comment></comment>


To Catch a Mosquito - <AUTHOR> http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2016/09/19/to-catch-a-mosquito?mbid=social_twitter&currentPage=all <comment><USER2> I've heard that mosquitoes are attracted to some people more than others, so I've often wondered whether it would be possible to make devices that are more attractive than any human. Once you know how to attract mosquitoes, you've got them cornered.

I think it wouldn't even be all that difficult to experiment with new things that attract them. In any place where there's a substantial number of mosquitoes, you could set up a camera and some CV software and run it like a split test. (Old method of attraction v new method of attraction)

<comment><USER3> i hardly ever get bit but i know people who are bitten all the time. i'm sure there is something here, unless i am getting bitten and don't have a physical reaction.

<comment> et-al What's your blood type and how's your metabolism? Supposedly mosquitos are more attracted to people with Type O blood.

[http://www.smithsonianmag.com/ist/?next=/science- nature/why-...](http://www.smithsonianmag.com/ist/?next=/science-nature/why- do-mosquitoes-bite-some-people-more-than-others-10255934/)

<comment><USER4> Oh joy; thanks for that vital bit of info, will come in handy if Zika advances into the US. I've already got DEET purchases lined up for this fall to get ahead of the likely rush.</comment></comment></comment></comment>


Ask HN: Is speeding up to pass the Yellow traffic light an "optimum" strategy?  - <AUTHOR>

I think I am good driver just like any average driver but I always stop at the yellow light if I can. I in fact enjoy red lights because it helps me to relax , be in the now and get out of autopilot mode. But I see many people speed up at the yellow light to be on the "other side" and avoid the fate of waiting for a minute or more at the red light. Many times my friends complain that I don't speed up at the yellow lights.<p>So the question is, is it possible that speeding up yellow lights does not gain any time savings? that it is not the optimum strategy ? Its just our brain's impulse to prematurely optimize the task at hand ? Can it be proved mathematically if its true or false? <comment><USER2>
      Did you see the light turn yellow?
      How long does this light stay yellow?
      Is this the first of a sequence of timed lights?
      Is the intersection photo-enforced?
      Can you enter the intersection before the light turns red?
      Will speeding up get you into the intersection
      before the light turns red, or after?
      Do you carry comprehensive insurance?
      If a collision ensues, will you be at fault?

I doubt you will find a mathematical proof that is usable in actual traffic, but a statistical approach might be usefully informative.

Have you measured the total possible minimum and maximum wait times for all light combinations over some of your usual trips? (Hint: get your friends to do the field work.) How do the "all red" and "all green" times compare proportional to the total trip time? What are the chances that waiting for one yellow light will increase the typical total trip time?

If none of that convinces you to wait for traffic lights, then take the MSF (Motorcycle Safety Foundation) course, buy a small motorcycle, and report back after a year of riding in traffic. The experience may give you a different perspective.

<comment><AUTHOR> You probably didn't read my whole post. I don't speed up at yellow light like most people do and I don't ever intend to. What I am interested in is a theoretical insight into proving using graphs/probability theories with most simplified assumptions. I don't intend to do the field work, it could be better done with computer simulation but I am not sure if thats the better way to approach the problem. This is a theoretical question only, no MSF involvement necessary.

</comment></comment><comment><USER3> > So the question is, is it possible that speeding up yellow lights does not > gain any time savings?

You're asking the wrong question. A better question would be, "is the risk of a collision worth the time saved?"

There's an aspect of this scenario you're not considering. If you speed into the intersection before the light turns red, you're legal, but other drivers may not realize that the fact their light is now green doesn't mean it's safe to proceed. Other aggressive drivers might jump into the intersection as soon as their light is green and collide with you. It happens regularly, whenever two aggressive drivers meet.

Driver A sees the yellow light and speeds up instead of stopping. He gets into the intersection just as the light turns red. He's legal.

Driver B sees the green and jumps into the intersection, before noticing that you're only halfway through. He's also legal.

Both drivers have acted legally, are "in the right", but both might be dead right.

<comment><AUTHOR> I understand practical implications of all of that, but here I am interested in proving that speeding at yellow lights is not optimal strategy even in ideal (no traffic) situations in terms of reaching your destination faster.

<comment><USER3> I don't think it is, considering you might not arrive at all. The possibility of not getting there should be included in the list of outcomes. :)</comment></comment></comment>


Snow Fall: The Avalanche at Tunnel Creek (2012) - <AUTHOR> http://www.nytimes.com/projects/2012/snow-fall/index.html#/ <comment><USER2> Discussed at the time: [https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4950054](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4950054)

(Reposts are fine after a year or so: [https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html](https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html))</comment>


At this rate, my kids probably aren't getting into college - <AUTHOR> http://blog.tutorspree.com/at-this-rate-my-kids-arent-getting-into-colle

<comment><USER2> This blog post reads like a thinly veiled anti-immigration rant to me.

The reason why most American kids won't be attending Ivy League schools (which the author focuses on) despite having the appropriate grades is because their parents don't have the financial means to pay for the high tuition fees. Not because some foreign student beat them to a place.

The post reads as if the "American dream" is being denied to these kids because of 'internationalism' when really its because of good ol' American capitalism.

 _written by a foreigner living in US who never went to university anyway_

<comment><AUTHOR> Wow, really? - I am sorry if that's how you interpreted my post. That's unbelievably far and away from anything I meant. I am the child and grandchild of immigrants. I am simply pointing out how much harder it is to getting to get into college, and drawing out one of the reasons.

<comment><USER2> I read your comment here. I read your entire post again. I read your comment for a second time.

I'm sorry, I still have the same conclusion.

If international students competing for places is a factor, it certainly isn't the major one. I would still assert ability to pay is a much bigger factor.

But then in my second glance at your post I also notice it is a puff-piece to cross-promote your tutor search business.

Well, isn't that self-serving?

Whip up some FUD around competition from foreign students to make guilty- ridden parents pick up the phone and open their wallets for private tuition for Junior. Overly highlight a need and then jump right in with the solution, how helpful of you.

And of course, you are not going to comment on the fact that the exorbitant fees for Ivy Leagues are keeping smart kids out because your whole business is built around serving the affluent privileged few who can afford to provide tutoring for their children _(and thus probably those fees too)._ Most of America can't.

If it wasn't for the fact I don't have kids and I'm an example of why a university education isn't vital, I'd be upset I'd just given your company undue attention from this thread.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER3> Are the two parts of this post really connected? Yes, there are more international students applying to U.S. universities, and admissions rates are going down at Ivy Leagues, but is that primarily due to the international students? An alternate hypothesis is that it's mainly due to more domestic students applying--- a much larger percentage of American high school grads now apply to college than did in, say, 1970.

<comment><USER4> Also note that high schoolers who apply to college are applying to more colleges. Ever since the Common App made it convenient there's an arms race to apply to more schools every year.

</comment></comment><comment><USER5> Depending on what your kids want to do, it may not really matter. It is especially likely that they can find a path to a good career without going to any of these ivy league schools. Regardless, if there is a demand for more schools, and likely more specialized schools, they will pop up.</comment>


Hash49.COM: Explore Instagram like never before - <AUTHOR> http://www.hash49.com/insta/#/list <comment><AUTHOR> Something I wrote using Grails, AngularJS and Redis. Let me know what you think. Btw, looking to Junior Java / grails dev opportunities here - pass the word around :)</comment>


Be Kind (2015) - <AUTHOR> http://boz.com/articles/be-kind.html <comment><USER2> > Being kind is fundamentally about taking responsibility for your impact on > the people around you. It requires you be mindful of their feelings and > considerate of the way your presence affects them.

I found this a few years ago when looking at the top HN articles of all time. I've put this quote as a monthly calendar reminder and have been striving to accomplish it ever since.

> Boz is one of the better engineers at Facebook" one read, and then the next > "I would have a hard time working with him."

kinda sums up why kind is helpful</comment>


Show HN: Snibox – Self-hosted snippets manager - <AUTHOR> https://github.com/snibox/snibox <comment><USER2> Looks good! Unfortunately the problem with the self-hosted apps is lack of maintenance, so after a couple of years, when the author doesn't push any updates to it you will be forced to move on to an alternative. And at that point you will lose all your data (in this case, gists) and links, let alone time.

<comment><USER3> I would argue that the opposite is true:

> Unfortunately the problem with the SaaS is lack of control, so after a > couple of years, when the company shuts down you will be forced to move on > to an alternative. And at that point you will lose all your data (in this > case, gists) and links, let alone time.

Even if the author stops posting updates, you can keep using the application for as long as you like. Since it's open source, you can even update it yourself if you really need it.

Also, all your data is stored on a database that you control, so you'll never lose them (unless you delete the database). In this case, gists might even be stored as a git repository, so it might not be that hard to import them to another self-hosted snippets app.

<comment><USER4> > _Also, all your data is stored on a database that you control, so you 'll > never lose them (unless you delete the database)._

The opposite is true as well:

> _Also, all your data is stored on a database that you control, so you 'll > eventually lose them (unless you apply the same rigor in system > administration, backups and security that large companies would)._

I used to always host everything myself. I knew the risks, and I knew they would bite me some day, but I wanted to learn. I don't regret this choice.

But the day I lost my 10 years of IRC chat history was the day I subscribed to IRCCloud instead.

The day I lost all the photos I took with my mom on some trip was the day I started heavily using Google Photos.

Even long before that, the day I lost my only physical copy of my favourite game was the day I bought it back on GOG.

Life's too short to care about this stuff for more than the learning experience. Using cloud services is a fucking _immense_ productivity gain. Of course I still encourage people to run their own stuff, and I 100% back self- hosted alternatives (they're _important_ ).

The best services in my experience provide self-hosted + paid hosted service. Those are the ones you can really trust. You choose your trade-off based on your use case, and you are very likely to get the advantage of data portability. Paying money for it also ensures you're less likely to get screwed by their whims.

<comment><USER5> It just sounds like all of the self-hosted services you were using were crap to be honest. They still are more or less.

IRC and photos should have a one-click button to set up encrypted backups to a location of your choosing, local, remote, cloud. Ideally, of course, you'd configure this location once and then all apps would automatically use it.

As for physical games, this is not a comparable example (physical self-managed vs virtual self-managed). In this case, you'd virtually back up the disk, and if you can't because of DRM or something, then you don't really own it.

Your comment on self-hosted + paid-hosted I especially agree with and is one that I've quite recently also came to the conclusion of.

<comment><USER4> > _It just sounds like all of the self-hosted services you were using were > crap to be honest._

No... they just match up with expectations of what I said: You need backup solutions. Those backup solutions need to work, need to be recoverable. And when a disaster happens, let's say there's a fire at my house, the last thing I want to be doing is spending hours recovering backup. That's a sysadmin's job, not mine.

I don't know why you say IRC "should have a one-click button to set up encrypted backups to a location of your choosing" \-- that's not the case of any existing service to my knowledge, possibly not even for photos. And I also wouldn't expect every single self-hosted service developer out there to have to set up something like that, especially given that the development of such a thing requires pretty extensive sysadmin knowledge and self-hosted projects tend to be open-source-volunteer ones.

I'd love to have more things work like git though. Easy mirroring. Decentralized truth. In some way, IPFS, but not for like the entire internet; just for select projects.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> Really well done, I like the tags and organization.

Here's a low-tech alternative for .bashrc:

        snipc() {
        	local fpath=$HOME/workspace/snippets.c
        	if [ "$1" == "vim" ]; then
        		gvim $fpath
        	else
        		less $fpath
        	fi
        }

Replace vim with your favorite editor. I also have functions for python (snippy), Make (snipmake), etc.

<comment><USER7> Try using `$EDITOR` instead of an argument as that's a more standard env variable to specify preferred editor!

</comment></comment><comment><USER8> Nice work. Happy to see a competitor in the space.

For a fully-managed option with desktop clients and integrations with VSCode, Atom and Sublime, check out Cacher: [https://www.cacher.io](https://www.cacher.io)

</comment><comment><USER9> Great to see stuff like this built but having an app this simple require a full RoR backend seems overkill - either I'm stuck running it in Docker (which isn't too bad) or manually getting the right Ruby environment up (horrifying).

</comment><comment><USER10> I really like this and have been looking for something like Snibox for quite some time. Thanks for sharing!

</comment><comment><AUTHOR> correct link to the repository: [https://github.com/snibox/snibox](https://github.com/snibox/snibox)

</comment><comment><USER11> Looking good !</comment>


Ask HN: Matrix vs. XMPP vs. IRCv3 - <AUTHOR> Which do you think is most promising?  What are issues that face federated messaging protocols adoption? <comment><USER2> XMPP is more than promising, its proven.

The major messaging (and notification, if you believe the rumours) networks are all based on xmpp.

The issues are basically: big vendors want lock-in so they disable federation and spam. I remember seeing an XEP that aimed to solve the spam issue for federated xmpp.

</comment><comment><USER3> XMPP - Didn't use it in a long time. OTR wasn't a good experience.

Matrix - Works well, but UX is too techy for my non technical friends.

IRCv3 - never tried.

Currently, I am using Tox P2P, so far it's working best.

I am looking for a web client because native clients don't provide me Telegram like feel.

So, if I find some time, I'll be writing my own web front end.

I am also looking to hire people to work on my Tox web p2p frontend.

<comment><USER4> How would someone contact you about this hypothetical job? I notice you don't have an email address in your profile.</comment></comment>


GitTorrent: collaborative git repository distribution across the Internet - <AUTHOR> http://www.advogato.org/article/994.html

<comment><USER2> This is technically interesting, but I like the friction (small as it is) of forcing a software project to maintain a Web site. It may encourage people to think before forking, and a well-maintained Web site shows that someone somewhere is at least minimally committed to the project.

<comment><USER3> I think making forking cheap and easy is a good idea. Sure, bad forks will be made but, Git would make it easy to merge the fork's changes into a trusted stream.

<comment><USER2> IMO a trusted stream should have more than PGP signatures behind it; it should have some commitment. It seems like GitTorrent is trying to eliminate that part.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> I was wondering when this would happen. Hopefully it will work ;)

Hopefully this could be used to make an alternate, resource-less, internet. If the gpg signing can ensure enough security, web developers won't need host servers (to an extent) any more. Certainly not if they are just serving static pages.</comment>


Show HN: DerivePass – Password Manager that doesn't store passwords in the cloud - <AUTHOR> https://derivepass.com/ <comment><USER2> I'd always viewed password tools like this as less secure than 1Password etc.

With 1Password an attacker needs my encrypted vault and my master password to get my email password.

With this, they just need the master password (since they can guess the domain and revision number presumably?)

<comment><AUTHOR> That's true, and should be viewed as a possible risk. However, there is still more implicit trust in 1Password and similar companies that is often not mentioned:

* They run mostly closed source system. Thus one has no idea what happens on backend, and what data is actually sent

* The encrypted vault already belongs to them. In fact, all encrypted vaults live in the same place, which makes it very attractive for hacker attacks

So effectively, leaking Master Password for 1Password might have just as bad effect as leaking it for DerivePass. Depending on how much you trust both entities.</comment></comment>


Parse Dashboard on Heroku in 3 steps - <AUTHOR> https://www.codementor.io/nodejs/tutorial/deploy-parse-dashboard-on-heroku <comment><USER2> very helpful! parse has been a nightmare being down all the time and we were forced to accelerate our migration away from it and couldn't find any resources on the heroku dashboard</comment>


Ask HN: How do I improve my professional communication skills? - <AUTHOR> <comment><USER2> Ironic - you haven't given us any context, you haven't told us what kinds of audiences of colleagues you need to communicate with, what topics you need to talk about. Nothing.

The main point in communication is to determine who you are talking to, what information they need, what they already know, and then determine what you'll say.

Then you work out how to say it, and practise the delivery.

It's non-trivial, requires work, and doesn't come for free.</comment>


Microsoft's new browser and the Windows 10 January preview build - <AUTHOR> http://blogs.msdn.com/b/ie/archive/2015/01/22/project-spartan-and-the-windows-10-january-preview-build.aspx

<comment><USER2> An OS-bound browser is a non-starter for me. I like Safari too, but having to use a different browser between different OSs is too much of a hassle.

That alone is enough to keep me from giving Spartan a real chance.

</comment><comment><USER3> It's interesting that they decided to start from scratch with a new rendering engine. (I imagine the UI itself could have been updated without a lot of trouble.)

They probably looked at the thousands of special cases in the old spaghetti code, maybe took a gander at the Blink/Webkit sources ;-), and then decided, "Hang it, we can do this ourselves, and do it right." Likely a pretty fun project, betting against the "never start from scratch" common wisdom of the crowd.

<comment><AUTHOR> Curious that they're calling it a 'new' rendering engine at all. I could have sworn they said somewhere that it was still the same Trident engine, but without the legacy IE bits. Also, according to Paul Thurrott [1], the browser team was considering WebKit/Blink and ultimately decided to stick with Trident – apparently because of Google's control over Blink.

[1]: [https://www.thurrott.com/windows/windows-10/470/maybe- window...](https://www.thurrott.com/windows/windows-10/470/maybe- windows-10s-spartan-isnt-going-suck#.VL5onjELVEw.reddit)

<comment><USER4> Well, I for one am glad that Microsoft decided against WebKit/Blink.

Because of its popularity as a rendering engine, being used by Safari, Chrome and Opera, both on the desktop and on mobile phones, it is quickly becoming a monoculture. Even if we are talking about an open-source project, to me it smells too much like the lock-in that IExplorer once had on the market and people might not remember, but IExplorer was at some point very innovative and the best browser available. And many people also don't remember what happened after that.

So even though I'm very grateful about WebKit/Blink, we really must avoid repeating mistakes of the past. Multiple implementations of a standard are very healthy, monocultures are not.

However, I also think that given this overhaul, Microsoft should open-source this rendering engine. I really hope they do it and it would be in their interest to do so.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> The bottom bars of the mobile IE10 look really awkward. That button distribution and mis-alignment...

</comment><comment><USER6> It feels like browsers in general has become to commoditized for people to even bother. How much does it really matter these days if you use chrome, firefox,opera etc. It used to be that it DID matter that you used IE because they were so hopefully after (after they were before netscape) but these days it more of a popularity contest.

Every browser pretty much presents webpages correctly according to modern CSS standards.

Every browser is fast enough that the difference is negligible

Not many people use any major add-on features of browsers, except like adblocker and stuff like that.

I really don't understand why this is an area that's worth competing in anymore, except providing an browser for your mobile ecosystem (chrome for android, spartan for windows phone, safari for apple, whatever). Webpages are still needed but apps are sweeping the field and providing better UX for the webpages that people use the most.

And downvote me as you might but firefox days are sadly counted

<comment><AUTHOR> I think Microsoft feels it needs to provide a better browser because the popular alternative is controlled by their competitor. Chrome itself does its best to make sure you get pulled into the Google ecosystem - you need a Google account just to use the sync feature. On top of that, when you switch Chrome to its full-screen Windows 8 app mode (for touch screen support, etc.) it basically turns into a clone of Chrome OS:

[http://i.imgur.com/YJ1OJqi.png](http://i.imgur.com/YJ1OJqi.png)

<comment><USER6> Yeah, I think Chrome is the browser to beat right now... but does most people really use the sync feature? I might be wrong but my guess would be no, and that's true for a lot of the other "additional value" features that browsers add

<comment><USER7> It would be interesting to see those metrics on sync adoption.

I can tell you from my own personal, anecdotal experience, it's one of those things as soon as someone knows about (and fully understands) they typically become Chrome users everywhere because of it. I found this to be the case for our Apps domain users at work and even friends & family who just have personal Google accounts and maybe even use iPhones, etc. It's powerful to show someone that your history, bookmarks, and even open tabs across devices stay in sync. I find that if one isn't "creeped out" by that, they usually think it's extremely convenient.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> Great, now I have to support IE 7 AND Spartan...

<comment><USER9> Can you explain what circumstances require that you support IE7?

<comment><USER10> I work for a company that has a "managing" application that runs on windows. This application has a browser plugin that runs in an equivalent IE7 environment which must be supported.

Unfortunately that is what you get with proprietary sometimes.

<comment><USER11> I always hear about these applications but I've never actually seen one.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> Spartan is based on an improved version IE11's trident engine. The browser window is a WinRuntime app.

It's still unclear if it will support WebGL 2, WebRTC, CSS 3D transformations.

<comment><USER13> [https://status.modern.ie](https://status.modern.ie) says WebRTC is in development and CSS 3D transforms are part of a IE preview release.

<comment><USER12> There are three incompatible proposed web real-time communication standards.

Google, Mozilla and Opera - "WebRTC":

[http://caniuse.com/#search=WebRTC](http://caniuse.com/#search=WebRTC) and [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WebRTC](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WebRTC)

Microsoft proposed another draft "CU-RTC-WEB" based on Skype details: [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CU-RTC-WEB](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CU-RTC- WEB) and later "ORTC": [http://www.infoq.com/news/2014/08/ortc- webrtc](http://www.infoq.com/news/2014/08/ortc-webrtc)

Hangout vs. Skype vs. iOS messages is the deal breaker why WebRTC isn't suppored in Safari and IE. That's sad as it already works in ~1.7B devices.

<comment><USER14> We're implementing ORTC (which actually gets its origins from outside Microsoft: [http://ortc.org/history/](http://ortc.org/history/)). ORTC is essentially WebRTC "1.1" and there's active standardization work going on (in both WebRTC 1.0 and ORTC specs) to make them have a high level of compatibility. ORTC enables more scalable video and simplifies the way the data is exchanged by using a vanilla JS object style (eliminates SCP Offer/Answer).

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> Really looking forward to this.

Great new design.

Trident without the legacy bits.

And free upgrades to get people onto the latest software as quickly as possible.

I'm liking this new Microsoft.</comment>


[Python] Automatization of the Tesseract (OCR engine) training process - <AUTHOR> http://isbullsh.it/2012/06/Automatic-tesseract-training/

<comment><USER2> Just to note that this was done by our intern for our AI platform, its a nice little library that automates a badly documented training process (Python).</comment>


Mark Zuckerberg set to face leadership vote at Annual Meet. Will he step Down? - <AUTHOR> https://gimtae.com/mark-zuckerberg-set-to-face-leadership-vote-at-facebooks-annual-meet/ <comment><USER2> > Reports say Zuckerberg is unlikely to lose the vote because he owns 60 per > cent of the company's shares.

So...no.</comment>


Coronavirus: The tide was not turned – now what? - <AUTHOR> https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-54194158 <comment><AUTHOR> I am not submitting this for anything about covid or politics - but just for this quote in the middle of the article

"""

Ruthless and effective is one thing. Brutal and incompetent quite another.

"""

It had quite a lot of resonance with me - a quick throw away sentence that says a great deal about modern day organisations</comment>


Ask HN: tcfast.com domain expired? - <AUTHOR>

Anyone know details on tcfast.com domain name registration?  Are they planning on renewing or is this shutting down?<p>It's definitely a site I took for granted as I enjoyed being able to read TC sans the recent design changes. <comment><USER2> loved tcfast.com - I'd like to see it back online as well</comment>


Share stuff from Dropbox in your Facebook Groups - <AUTHOR> https://blog.dropbox.com/index.php/share-stuff-from-dropbox-in-your-facebook-groups/

<comment><USER2> Now people can finally reveal their illegal downloads to the world through Facebook.

</comment><comment><USER3> Getting comfy with Facebook makes me leery of Dropbox's commitment to privacy.

</comment><comment><USER4> Looks like a huge partnership for Dropbox -- congrats guys.

</comment><comment><USER5> Very useful. I didn't think it was possible to make Dropbox better but... they did.

</comment><comment><USER6> I'm not sure how useful this is [for me]. All the computers I access Facebook from I already have a synced dropbox set of directories so choosing one of those is just as much effort as choosing the from the Dropbox picker menu.

I can see that it could be useful for people accessing facebook from public computers or other temporary devices.

When I first read it I assumed you got a directory in Dropbox that when you posted a document to it, it added it automatically to the linked facebook group.

</comment><comment><USER7> I wonder what this means for <http://filepicker.io> It's validation of the market but they're not part of the deal.

<comment><USER8> We're working on it :D

To me, this is a big win for Dropbox but a big detriment to the ecosystem and other storage players. It's essentially like saying "Only works in IE6" - worked well to buy IE lock-in, but was a Bad Thing for the web. We, of course, want to help rectify this!

</comment></comment><comment><USER9> I wonder if it will work from mobile?

</comment><comment><USER10> Great partnership, however I do not want to become one with the Facebook collective. I spend too much time over there already.

Aside from my personal feelings about Facebook being the devil, congrats on a neat feature.

<comment><USER11> Whenever anything with Facebook goes up on Hacker News why does at least one person always feel like mentioning that either they "dislike using facebook" or "don't use facebook at all"?

<comment><USER12> Basically for the same reason that this onion article is funny:

[http://www.theonion.com/articles/area-man-constantly- mention...](http://www.theonion.com/articles/area-man-constantly-mentioning- he-doesnt-own-a-tel,429/)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER13> What's next? Stack overflow?</comment>


Nvidia Accelerates Real Time Speech to Text Transcription 3500x with Kaldi - <AUTHOR> https://devblogs.nvidia.com/nvidia-accelerates-speech-text-transcription-3500x-kaldi/ <comment><USER2> They took a very simple speech recognizer that was running at ~380x real time on a CPU and got it to run at ~3500x on a GPU. I would call that a ~9x acceleration. In terms of perf/watt it was more like 5x.

<comment><USER3> Agreed, super bad title.

As an engineer I'm always impressed by a 9X speed-up from state-of-the-art, but I'm guessing that "9X" would make tech-illiterate shareholders unhappy and cause them to short the stock?

Would love a Chrome plugin that "fixes" numbers like this on pages based on crowd-sourced human understanding. People flag incorrect numbers they see on websites; new visitors start to see corrected numbers after enough people flag it with the corrected number.

The same would be useful for e.g. scooters advertising 30 miles range (s/30/10/), laptop battery life of 10 hours (s/10/5/), hardware companies announcing "availability of" a certain product when it's actually not yet for sale (s/availability/unavailability/), etc.

<comment><USER4> Yeah, I've been wanting a similar chrome extension, actually. HN comments serve as a very valuable filter for information that I learn from, and I think it'd be great if the rest of the web benefitted from that kind of proofreading. Little annotations as a layer on top of the web.

Managing the community would be a bit tough, but if you seeded it with the HN community, and managed to keep the same self-regulating culture, I think that would be a strong base to start from.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> There's an open source tool that lets developers program by voice using Kaldi.

[https://www.reddit.com/r/speechrecognition/comments/5p3uxb/p...](https://www.reddit.com/r/speechrecognition/comments/5p3uxb/programming_using_speech_recognition/)

</comment><comment><USER6> Use GPU to run FST decoding is not something new. The major challenge is how to run it efficiently when model cannot fit into one GPU. The reason Kaldi still uses CPU for decoding is that with a beefy CPU machine many decoders can run in parallel with just one copy of the model in memory. With enough CPUs, the RTF isn't so bad.

</comment><comment><USER5> "This means 24 hours worth of human speech can be transcribed in 25 seconds."

With this kind of performance, can't a large body of video or audio (e.g podcasts) be transcribed then manually corrected to improve the model?

<comment><USER7> A little bit, but podcasts and other instances of performed speech represent a narrow sample of what human speech sounds like in the real world. Eventually, there is not much to gain from it.

</comment></comment><comment><USER8> Now imagine this with an ASIC or FPGA. They are usually 20 to 70x faster.</comment>


Somali Law - <AUTHOR> http://www.daviddfriedman.com/Academic/Legal_Systems_Draft/Systems/SomaliLawChapter.html <comment><USER2> Note that this is just one chapter in the larger book, "Legal Systems Very Different From Ours":

[http://www.daviddfriedman.com/Academic/Course_Pages/legal_sy...](http://www.daviddfriedman.com/Academic/Course_Pages/legal_systems_very_different_12/LegalSystemsDraft.html)

</comment><comment><USER3> You might also compare this with the traditional system of distributed dispute resolution that held sway in Iceland at the time of the sagas. While quite different cultures, many similar solutions and incentives acted to minimize violence between familial groups. In that case the system failed when it fell out of decentralization and into control of a sufficiently small elite for them to become a defacto government, but it took 300 years to reach that failure case.

A very high-level summary: [https://mises.org/library/medieval-iceland-and- absence-gover...](https://mises.org/library/medieval-iceland-and-absence- government)

<comment><USER4> "Machinery of Freedom" by the same author: [http://daviddfriedman.com/The_Machinery_of_Freedom_.pdf](http://daviddfriedman.com/The_Machinery_of_Freedom_.pdf)

The chapter "Private law enforcement, medieval iceland, and libertarianism" is specifically about Iceland.

<comment> atom-morgan A fantastic book in general for those interested in political theory.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> Related: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xeer](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xeer)

</comment><comment><USER6> Somali Law (daviddfriedman.com) 70 points by Tomte 8 hours ago | past | web | 9 comments

Somali Law (daviddfriedman.com) 2 points by Tomte 41 days ago | past | web

Somali Law (daviddfriedman.com) 4 points by Tomte 75 days ago | past | web

Somali Law (daviddfriedman.com) 1 point by Tomte 116 days ago | past | web

<comment><USER7> Resubmissions are allowed and there's even a thing for moderators to automate it hours or maybe days later on submissions they like.

<comment><USER6> not saying it isn't, just a comment I think people could be interested in

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> I am sure this has a lot of appeal for libertarians. One has to ask, though, can this system of law support a high-GNP economy, with high-efficiency complex interactions among strangers.

<comment><USER9> Somalia is often brought up by Libertarians as an example of a distributed legal system. The argument is that Somalia has done better than their African peers over recent years...no idea if that is still the case or not.

<comment><USER10> IME it's far more often brought up as a cautionary example by "antilibertarians". As in, if we limit the authority of some official government agency in some small fashion, we'll soon live in a poor violent sub-Saharan hellhole. (Not my characterization, but rather that of the antilibertarians.)</comment></comment></comment>


On Bitcoin and South America - <AUTHOR> https://medium.com/@JDcarlu/on-bitcoin-south-america-a080fe17179e

<comment><USER2> Bring bitcoin to South America? Again?</comment>


"For Rent" signs are popping up all over Portland - <AUTHOR> http://cityobservatory.org/signs-of-the-times/ <comment><USER2> Nono, wait.

The housing being built in Portland over the past handful of years is of a specific type and a certain price range. I regularly check the rental rates for units in these new complexes as they come on line and I have yet to find units that I can afford.

Portland is very lax with it's high density zoning, or strict depending on how you look at it. They promoted high density housing by disincentivizing alternative zoning types (making it extremely difficult to find non retail commercial spaces).

The lack of rent control combined with the proliferation of high-end retail + housing spaces contributes to housing as an investment opportunity which in turn makes low end rent unstable and rare. This past year over half of the renters on my block were kicked out of their homes when owner decided to sell.

Sure, there's a glut of $1,500 studios and one bedroom units available, but there's a real lack of rooms or units below $1,000.

<comment><USER3> > The housing being built in Portland over the past handful of years is of a > specific type and a certain price range.

This is true for every city. Developers don't really build low-end units. They build high-end units and rely on the age/deterioration of other buildings to eventually turn them into lower-end buildings.

This is sort of working out because people are generally moving back into cities and are willing to pay a premium for it.

The reason why I think this article about Portland is interesting is either their influx of people into the city has slowed/stopped, or they've built so many units that its outpaced the influx. A common narrative in cities is "we're building so many units yet prices are still high!!!" But clearly the equation should be rate of new units coming into the market vs rate of change of city population.

Which also feels like common sense. But maybe its more like, this article is interesting because it shows there's light at the end of the tunnel.

<comment><USER4> What part of "age/deterioration" makes units lose value, exactly? Is it just that buildings aren't built to last, or is it that newer buildings have newer amenities?

If the former, would a trend of "over-engineering" buildings—or more rigorous building codes—mean that buildings will take longer to lose value, and so there will be fewer low-value units on the market at a time?

If the latter, would a lack of recent domestic innovations mean that new units are basically "just like" old units, and thus stall the aging-down process?

<comment><USER5> Houses have general wear and tear that need to get fixed.

Housing designs and styles go out of date. Code gets updated to add new standards such as better insulation, earthquake resistance, plumbing. Roofs need to be replaced, walls need to be repainted, floors need replacement after general wear and tear. Electrical standards change since our demands have changed over generations. And most units don't keep all of this stuff up to date through renovation other than the bare minimum. Like a used car.

Since buildings last a long time, a 1920s-1970s building is what is considered an aged building. 1980s is on the edge and 1990s is relatively new. A older building that was overengineered will retain better value and so on.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> The market can never provide housing as cheaply as a properly functioning local/state government.

* The state can borrow money far cheaper than private developers.

* The state has far fewer regulatory risks (getting permits, etc).

* The state does not need to make a profit but only needs to pay the bond payments.

* The state profits even when it doesn't make immediate profits on the particular housing development. It does so by increased local spending (by housing tenants who pay affordable rents instead of every penny they earn, etc) and also by higher taxes on increased incomes/output due to higher productivity, the higher productivity due to reduced stress and churn in the community caused by a lack of funds for life expenses due to high rents. (Remember lower income tenants spend _all_ of their money, with a high proportion spent locally. High earning landlords are exactly the opposite. A much larger proportion of their income flows internationally, to wherever capital gets the highest return, or whereever luxury goods are made)

* The state gets an implicit discount on labour costs in development since it gets tax income from the workers.

With all of these incentives in play the state can provide housing for less than the state borrowing cost of the money for labour/materials to build an apartment. Since in Portland it costs 175-200/sqft to build multifamily units, a 1000sqft 1BR should cost the equivalent of state borrowing costs/month for $175k at 2.2% = $320. Imagine how much better life would be if we had a government that used all of these incentives to provide well-built housing for its people.

There is also the cost for land but the state owns a lot of land, and it has the ability to get land by rezoning, and also by using eminent domain as a last resort. At any rate for high density buildings, this is not the dominant cost.

<comment><USER7> Your argument is clearly flawed because it goes way too far. It applies to literally any sort of economic activity it's possible to be engaged in. For example, I could make all your arguments as reasons why the California state government should take over pornography production from private producers. We know from experience that private industry is more successful than the government at many things…including building housing:

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_housing_in_the_United_S...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_housing_in_the_United_States)

<comment><USER6> Top down state organisation is prone to corruption. It takes effort to keep that at bay. The public oversight required is an overhead that should only be used in select tasks.

The state is not suited for all tasks, especially those with rapid iteration, experimentation, low capital costs, and low cost of failure. Housing technology moves slower and is dominated by capital and bureaucratic concerns. It is also one of the dominating costs in modern life. The state is capable of doing this task and the public oversight burden is warranted.

For products and services that do not absolutely require the state, I believe worker cooperatives, incentivised by the state are a much better solution

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> Why is that surprising? This is eco 101 no?

<comment><USER9> Every time you talk about building more housing in a desirable place, there's always someone who brings up the argument "But if you build more housing then even MORE people will want to move here". Nothing wrong with some empirical evidence.

<comment><USER10> They're not wrong. There will be more people moving there if prices are lowered, and over the long run unless Portland can absorb the entire movable population whatever it is, it will be helping to lower rent everywhere in the country. So thanks!

<comment><USER11> What I _think_ you're saying is, prices drop in Portland, so people move there from city X, which drops demand in X, so prices drop in X.

One problem, though, is "stickiness". I wouldn't move to a different city for $1/month. I probably wouldn't move even for $100/month. Why not? Well, I'm not single, and I have kids. It's not just that I'd upset everyone's routine - I'd also have to move all this stuff. I'd also have to sell my place and buy (or rent) a new one. Total cost to me: Probably in the $20,000 range. I'm going to do that for $100/month? No way. Even for $1000/month, it would take 20 months to pay back, not counting the time and aggravation.

So cities are "sticky". I'm stuck here; it takes a _seriously_ better situation to break me loose.

Many people have lower thresholds than I do; but for most people, the threshold is some way above zero. (Exceptions do exist; if the current situation is socially or emotionally difficult, they may move to something even if it's economically worse.)

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> This is good news. Is more apartment availability also curbing the recent price increases for owner-occupied detached home sales? They're rather different goods, but the effects from lower apartment rents might spill over to some extent.

<comment><USER13> The article says that the increasing numbers of For Rent signs were all found on older suburban houses, which includes owner-occupied detached homes. So it seems they are all feeling pressure to reduce prices.

<comment><USER2> Detatched homes, or HUDS, have a really aggressive tax policy in Portland making them very expensive to rent out as apartments. The policy promotes using these units as airBnB rentals in place of longer term housing for residents.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER14> Am I the only one who doesn't understand what actually was done to stop rents to grow from reading the article?

Seems like this one sentence may be the key:

        prompted the City to adopt an ill-advised
        inclusionary zoning ordinance, and
        led the state to flirt with authorizing rent control

But it's unclear whether that was just a flirt or some control was actually implemented? Did the "prompting" result in "city adopting"? What's "ill- advised" in this context?

Lots is unclear

<comment><USER15> What has happened is all the large multi-apartment buildings under construction for the last 2 years have come online. There's a lot more that will be ready to move into starting 2018 and into 2019. These are quick construction 4 to 6 story 100+ unit buildings that are being built _everywhere_ in portland. Heck, home owners are event getting into the game, where they are making ADUs out of existing garages and basements. The city has waived a bunch of the development fees normally associated with ADUs. Not a game changing number coming online every year, maybe 100 or so, but the combined effect is that rental units are popping up everywhere.

Side note: many of these large buildings are built around a model that includes staggering the release of units over two years, so as to not flood the market with new units, lowering the price. I wouldn't be surprised if a few of these projects scheduled for move in late 2018 or early 2019 turned less of a profit than planned, given the sheer quantity of them being built.

Side note: We've had more than one random person looking into our business our office from the hall, who upon questioning, turned out to be a random wealthy dude from CA or NY, who is looking for some real estate in which to park a few million dollars, lead around by a hawkish businessy looking person, neither of which even know the term triple net. It's a wild market here right now, it'll be interesting to see how it all turns out.

<comment><USER14> Who finances that construction? If that's private developers, then what so suddenly incentivizes them?

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER16> A naïve application of supply and demand isn't always right, but it often is.

<comment><USER17> It tends to work well enough over broad stretches, including the end points.

Since the model for the last couple generations was expanding in to the "green field" suburbs and that model is now breaking down due to the distances finally becoming too insane / growth boundaries being enforced, there has now been a building pressure that is finally being re-directed in to other areas.

Unfortunately civic codes are focused more on preventing the loss of life than on making life a quality affair. I would really love to have actual peace and quiet at home; being completely unable to hear those on the other side of the walls, and requiring that build in appliances be similarly quiet instead of the cheapest possible and least effective exhaust fans.

</comment></comment><comment><USER18> I hate those year-over-year charts. Show me the data, not the first derivative of it.

</comment><comment><USER19> I live in Portland and MANY of those signs are left out constantly and have been out for YEARS.

American Property Management leaves them out front of all units and just funnels you to wherever they have an opening.

<comment><USER20> Yep. Long-time residents know these signs all too well. The best way to find a rental in this particular neighborhood is by calling these numbers.

</comment></comment><comment><USER20> This does not make me feel any better about losing the best home I ever had when it got sold in the 2015 buyout race, with "plans to remodel" which were later rescinded just before being put back on the market at 180% the rent I paid.

2014 and 2015 was hell for many of the city's residents and put family's literally sleeping on the streets. If this is "how markets work" then we need to stop wondering why socialism is becoming such a popular notion.

<comment><USER21> I think if you're wondering why it's becoming popular you've got wool over your eyes. Events that hurt people due to how the market works like you've described, are not rare

<comment><USER20> I am wondering that, or suggesting it is rare.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER22> All these rent signs point to is people being pushed out by rent increases due to a perceived demand provided by people with higher incomes. It doesn't point to a change in the housing crisis at all. I lived in this area about 6 years ago and prices were already becoming highly unaffordable for the 'unprofessional' set back then.

</comment><comment><USER23> IF you want to measure affordability, why not actually measure rent, or rent/sf or something directly?

Why would you measure the number of pictures of rent signs and then assume this means that prices will fall or not?

I would understand if counting pictures of signs were harder than collecting rent data, but it seems to be the opposite.

<comment> vertex-four It's potentially useful for forecasting rent drops - if there were no "for rent" signs last year and there are this year, but rent hasn't dropped in the meantime, it may signal a market correction.

</comment></comment><comment><USER24> There are two counter arguments to this:

1) Some areas have geographic or legal limits to constructions (maximum building hight, water, etc). There is simply no way to build more building without first demolishing existing buildings, which is costly.

2) Most people want to live close to work, and work tends to be close to the centre. A house that is an hour commute away will not influence the price in the immediate vicinity.

If space was infinite, it would be Econ 101, but given that space is not, elected officials need to protect the voting population from inflation, through whatever means possible.

<comment><USER25> _Some areas have geographic or legal limits to constructions (maximum building hight, water, etc). There is simply no way to build more building without first demolishing existing buildings, which is costly._

But not as costly as sticking to the status quo - if you account for opportunity costs.

 _Most people want to live close to work, and work tends to be close to the centre. A house that is an hour commute away will not influence the price in the immediate vicinity._

that's not true at all. Look at commuter suburbs and exurbs that get developed.

 _If space was infinite, it would be Econ 101, but given that space is not, elected officials need to protect the voting population from inflation, through whatever means possible._

Space is not the issue - space utilization absolutely is and zoning laws produce suboptimal space utilization. There should be a lot more residental sky scrapers in the bay area than there currently are. If San Fran adopted the zoning of say Dallas, things would be different and probably more affordable.

<comment><USER24> > that's not true at all. Look at commuter suburbs and exurbs that get > developed

It's only through the construction of highways that suburbs can be accessible. There was a great study done to show that the cost of highways is mostly subsidized by the inner city, not the suburbs themselves.

This is what I mean about keeping inflation low through use of the government: only the resources of a centralized government can undertake the construction of highways that keep the cost of downtown areas "low". In effect, this is one of the strategies to reduce inflation: infrastructure.

For the space issue, see my answer below to bmcusick

<comment><USER25> _It 's only through the construction of highways that suburbs can be accessible. There was a great study done to show that the cost of highways is mostly subsidized by the inner city, not the suburbs themselves._

Are you intentionally confusing separate issues? An hour away from the city is an hour away from a city, infrastructure can change the distance you can travel in an hour (e.g in countries with high speed rail, it's not uncommon for people to commute over 100 miles, that'd be a very long commute anywhere in America).

The highways extend the amount of land that's available for commuters, maybe cities should pay for them as the highways make it possible for cities to get away with inefficient zoning.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER26> Good to hear! A couple years ago, it wasn't unusual to see friends getting 25 or 30% increases in their rent in Portland.

</comment><comment><USER27> Am I missing the part where they show how increasing supply lowered rent?

Note: the previous title was worded to imply that rents were falling.

</comment><comment><USER28> I guarantee those apartments are nearly all without parking.

</comment><comment><USER29> Wish same could be said about NYC.

</comment><comment><USER10> Why should we have density? The US is a huge country with vast empty lands. The new economy with air travel and internet means jobs require no specific geography like easy access to ports, waterways, or railroads. Why should people be packed into a few places living like rats? Keep the rent high and let economics take care of jobs going elsewhere to new, livable settlements and perhaps cities. Whatever happened to the pioneering spirit?

<comment><USER30> How do I telecommute to a dinner date with friends? There's many, many benefits to living close to other people, most of them not work related.

<comment><USER10> By your logic people should never move and there should never be new cities.</comment></comment></comment>


Marathon Business - <AUTHOR> http://www.entrepreneur.com/management/operations/article185854.html

<comment><USER2> Am I missing something or does this seem like a very profitable business?

<comment><USER3> Screaming for a web 2.0 ish management tool as well... think google map route management with mashed-in plots for aid stations etc...

Unfortunately, I don't know enough about setting up a marathon...</comment></comment>