Early Decision - <AUTHOR> https://blog.ycombinator.com/early-decision/ <comment><USER3> Interestingly enough I got a YC email yesterday asking me to apply for the current batch.

I'd never received that type of email from YC in the past, and immediately thought their application numbers must be dropping. After all YC historically seemed to market and advertise the fact that statistically it's more difficult to get in than Harvard.

This announcement the very next day seems to support YC is looking for more applications. Then again maybe the total application numbers and acceptance rate are public info and I'm way off.

<comment><USER4> Yes, you are off. Our apps submitted metric is growing.

The reason we started sending out emails to remind people of the deadlines is the sheer # of founders we talk to in person and over email that complain that they missed the application deadline and they didnt know when the date would be.

Questions about when the app deadline is, if you can submit late, when the deadline is for the following batch, etc is the #1 most common type of question in our support queue, and sending out reminders seemed like the best solution.

</comment></comment><comment><USER5> "Early Decision" implies that if a student is accepted they are bound to attend that school. It's offered by colleges primarily because it greatly simplifies their yield planning. (Colleges admit many more than they actually can accommodate since they know many won't matriculate.)

This program should really be called Early Action, which is non-binding!

<comment><USER6> You actually go into a legally binding contract to attend the school? I've never heard of such a thing. Do they sue you for breach if you don't show up?

<comment><USER7> If you don't show with "good" reason (finances, health issue, etc) they usually do nothing.

If you don't show with a "bad" reason then what they do varies, but I've never heard of someone being sued. Instead it seems to be things like, "we will tell your high school and it may be mentioned if you try to apply to another university."

<comment><USER8> It's documented at [https://www.nacacnet.org/globalassets/documents/advocacy- and...](https://www.nacacnet.org/globalassets/documents/advocacy-and- ethics/statement-of-principles-of-good-practice/2017_spgp_cepp_final.pdf) as "if a candidate has been admitted Early Decision, then the college may notify the candidate's high school and other colleges of the candidate's application status." This is linked from [https://www.nacacnet.org/advocacy--ethics/SPGP- NACAC-Code-of...](https://www.nacacnet.org/advocacy--ethics/SPGP-NACAC-Code- of-Ethics/) on the NACAC's website.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> Seems like a great idea. I would be interested to hear about the indicators used to show that students sometimes didn't bother applying in these cases. It seems intuitive that college students, having to plan in Fall of N for full- time employment or even internships in Summer of N+1, would have been adversely affected by the normal application schedule. Were there a large number of potential founders that raised the alarm about this?

</comment><comment><USER10> Odd. This seems to go against one of PG's essays.

> School

>

> That's what I'd advise college students to do, rather than trying to learn > about "entrepreneurship." "Entrepreneurship" is something you learn best by > doing it. The examples of the most successful founders make that clear. What > you should be spending your time on in college is ratcheting yourself into > the future. College is an incomparable opportunity to do that. What a waste > to sacrifice an opportunity to solve the hard part of starting a startup — > becoming the sort of person who can have organic startup ideas — by spending > time learning about the easy part. Especially since you won't even really > learn about it, any more than you'd learn about sex in a class. All you'll > learn is the words for things.

[1]: [http://paulgraham.com/startupideas.html](http://paulgraham.com/startupideas.html)

<comment><USER11> What part of this essay is in conflict? The essay is advising that you not take entrepreneurship classes, but instead take classes in futuristic stuff like genetics. It doesn't have anything to do with whether it should be possible to apply to YC early.

<comment><USER10> You raise a good point.

I see it encouraging students to come up with ideas _for_ YC companies inorganically. Obviously that is not the intent, but I see it as a very likely side effect.

If the student organically has a great idea, then sure this has nothing to do with it. For the ones that didn't and wasted time in college? I guess they should have read some of PG's essays. ;)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> When I read the title, I assumed it worked like college early decision, where admission is binding. This is not the case, so this sounds like a great thing for YC to be doing

<comment><USER13> Things are different where I'm from (Canada) so please forgive me if this is a dumb question, but... in what way is early college admission binding on students? Even if a student accepts an offer, can't they just not turn up?

<comment><USER14> Early admissions are not binding (compared to early action which is less common.) [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_admission](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_admission) Many colleges also have a waitlist for admissions to backfill from.

<comment><USER12> Early Decision !== Early Action. Early action is non-binding and is less popular in top-tier colleges. Early action is generally binding - [https://professionals.collegeboard.org/guidance/applications...](https://professionals.collegeboard.org/guidance/applications/early)

There's also restricted early action, which restricts what schools you can apply to along side the REA school, but is non-binding

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> The down side of this is that someone accepted then will focus on the startup instead of finishing up their studies. You could argue that would happen either way but I think 'having it in the can' means more chance of doing so. And perhaps also not uncovering and turning down other opportunities or overlooking them. (Similar to when you buy a house you are not going to any other open houses..ditto for buying a car and many other things).

How are you supposed to focus on learning and school work if you already known that you are getting in YC to do a startup? Which more often than not is going to fail instead of focusing on your studies which you are paying big dollars for (potentially at least).

Also to a smaller degree you are giving up info to YC which in theory would also allow them to identify a trend to fund someone else ahead of you. (Relevant if they turn you down).

</comment><comment><USER16> Early decision plans for colleges are not without their disadvantages, the biggest being that it forces a decision before the student has the time to know what all of their options and offers may be. This is frequently mitigated by financial aid packages that compensate for the loss of choice, but even so, such plans have the downside of not knowing what other packages might have come to fruition.

YC seems to be walking that same path - seeking a commitment before the student knows all the choices that may be available post-graduation. Is there an intent to also give some incentive to compensate for that? Or is YC not asking for a commitment, and instead just making it an invitation that can be taken or not?

<comment><USER17> It doesn't appear to be binding so there really isn't any downside I can see.

<comment><USER18> Then isn't that more analogous to Early Action which is nonbinding yet still being able to apply and hear your decision earlier.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER19> Kudos to YC for taking this approach. A lot of founders want to quit status- quo and pursue startup full time but are not able to due to a number of reasons including college, immigration, teams being risk averse etc. With this, they get the validation that they have a good investor backing them and also get the time to test out their PM fit before getting into the batch, giving them enough time to learn and iterate on their mistakes.

</comment><comment><USER20> Can you also get early rejection? Asking for a friend ;)

<comment><USER21>
      If you're accepted, you will be early accepted into the Summer 2019 batch which begins in June. If you're not accepted, you can apply again during the regular Summer 2019 application cycle which begins in March.

I assume that means you'll find out at the same time as everyone else - <USER2> yes, "Early Rejection"

<comment><USER20> They should add:

 _Early Rejection will make it even easier for students to abandon the idea of building their startup after graduation._

Then It'll be perfectly balanced, as all thing should be.

<comment><USER21> Well then that would just be silly. A large number of YC companies don't get in the first few times they apply with an idea. Getting rejected from YC doesn't mean your startup isn't viable - it may just mean it's not ready for investment (from them) yet.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER22> Interesting, YCombinator is now working hard to attract recent college grads out of school!

</comment><comment><USER23> I'm surprised to hear YC courting would-be founders who are more interested in finishing college (grad school, even!). Affinity to the norms of academic institutions (not unlike large corporations) and to converging on their pre- formulated problems would seem incompatible with the traits of successful startup founders.

It's even more surprising given research correlating founder age and industry experience to the likelihood of big exits. [https://insight.kellogg.northwestern.edu/article/younger- vs-...](https://insight.kellogg.northwestern.edu/article/younger-vs-older- tech-entrpreneurs)

This solidifies the view that YC is modeled as a "founder college" for the young and cash-starved, weened as they are on ready-made social support systems, institutional authority, and formal rewards.</comment>


Stuxnet may have destroyed 1,000 centrifuges at Natanz - <AUTHOR> http://www.jpost.com/Defense/Article.aspx?id=200843

<comment><USER2> There is another possible explanation, though it sounds even more like an airport novel than the Stuxnet story does.

Consider that a lot of people, including the US, Israel, and just about everyone else on the planet would like to do anything possible to derail the Iranian nuclear activities. Making the centerfuges self-destruct by introducing Stuxnet would do that - but making the Iranians _think_ that a virus was the problem would have the same effect. I'm sure that the Iranians spent a lot of effort trying to remove the malware from the computers controlling the centerfuges and they probably even took them off-line until they were sure that the controllers were clean. Why would you risk the very valuable remaining centerfuges until you were sure the problem was fixed? They might have even tried to replace the Windows controllers with something running Linux or Solaris or something. It's quite likely that the clean-up from Stuxnet delayed the enrichment process even more than the original damage.

Malware is a convenient excuse for computer problems. "I don't have my homework because the computer crashed" certainly sounds valid but it's also an excuse that people immediately understand and have a hard time disputing. The Iranians may have internally blamed Stuxnet for the problems but isn't it possible that someone at Natanz might be using that to off-load blame for some other problem?

It's also a convenient story for Israeli and Western Intelligence. Perhaps the Israelis really did do something to destroy the centerfuges - perhaps they had a mole on the inside who unbalanced the centerfuges with sweaty fingerprints or grains of sand. It's reasonably likely, especially this close to the time of the event, that the story they would want the Iranians to believe isn't the actual story. Put out a false account and watch the Iranians running around reformatting their computers while your man on the inside stays safe and ready to act again.

If the Stuxnet story is true it shows remarkable technical cleverness by whoever did it. But if they're _that_ clever they might be even slightly more cunning - enough to throw off the Iranians as to the _actual_ cause and retain the ability to bung up the works again.

</comment><comment><USER3> These ultra-centifuges spin at 1000-1500 revolutions _per second_ and can easily break when not carefully controlled. The Zippe-type centrifuges (<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zippe-type_centrifuge>) are probably used in Natanz for enrichment. During the spinning, a temperature gradient of 300C is applied to the cylinder which induces a convection inside (filled with uranium-fluoride gas). The lighter fraction collects at the top and is captured. These centrifuges operate in a vacuum, and can turn frictionless due to magnetic bearing.

</comment><comment><USER4> Great hack, or greatest hack of all time? I am inclined to think the latter.

<comment><USER5> I'd say neither: there are 10000 centrifuges and only 1000 were replaced, it's not certain that that has anything to do with the virus, the virus gained a lot of press early on which prevented it from staying put and silently disrupting for any longer period of time (which was the supposed mode of operation). Not to mention that it was so "overdesigned" that it was too obvious that it's a too well funded operation etc.

<comment><USER6> The virus had been in place a relatively long time before it's public disclosure in June. Also the way the virus was designed it wasn't going to damage all of the rotors anyway.

<comment><USER5> > the way the virus was designed it wasn't going to damage all of the rotors > anyway

Why not? Why shouldn't it make as much damage as possible, as it attracted too much attention anyway?

> had been in place a relatively long time

I think the version that became analyzed all over the world (with the last certificate) was discovered very soon after it was introduced.

It still sounds to me more like something for what somebody got some promotion than something that did the damage appropriate to the money/time invested.

<comment><USER6> I'd suggest anyone who has a real interest in this checks out the Symantec dossier: <http://www.symantec.com/connect/blogs/w32stuxnet-dossier>

The virus was first identified in late 2008, and was in the wild, in various forms until June 2010 when it was identified and advertised to the world. Let's assume it went 2 years from release to June. That's a relatively long time, even if half of that was reconnaissance.

To quote the Symantec document: "Thus, the targeted system is using Profibus to communicate with at least 33 frequency converter drives from one or both of the two manufacturers, where sequence A is chosen if more Vacon devices are present and sequence B is chosen if more Fararo Paya devices are present."

The upshot (to my understanding) is that only one type of frequency converter drive can be targeted per bus. If the buses are mixed, e.g. 50/50, only half the drives on that bus will be targeted.

Additionally, if the bus has less than 31 devices on it, then it is not targeted. We can assume that at least a few of these buses were not hooked up to a full compliment of converter drivers.

<comment><USER5> > The virus was first identified in late 2008

No. According to the document you link, the first known exploit of the vuln _used later by Stuxnet_ was in Nov 2008, but _by some other trojan_. The oldest known Stuxnet is from June 2009, one year later it was already prominent. It had just a little over one year to "quietly do its magic." Results? Already one month ago:

[http://www.iranlivenews.com/2010/11/20/stuxnet-worm-was- perf...](http://www.iranlivenews.com/2010/11/20/stuxnet-worm-was-perfect-for- sabotaging-bushehr-centrifuges/)

"Iran has experienced many problems keeping its centrifuges running, with hundreds removed from active service since summer 2009."

And that, compared to what? How often do you have to remove the centrifuges during the normal operation if you have 10 thousands of them on one location and you are just developing the process? Couldn't it be the normal rate of failure for that situation?

Note also that the latest _brand new certificate_ used in the latest Stuxnet variant was from July 2010 (at the time it was already known by antivirus companies) which means that the authors still failed to have it at the target, otherwise they wouldn't need to make the new variant with the new certs! Doesn't it seem like they panicked because the goal was not reached at the time the antivirus companies started to actively detect it?

<comment><USER6> I stand corrected as to the date. I should have fact checked against the dossier :-(

Well if you've been successfully exploiting a broken certificate, and it gets busted, and you have another spare one, are you going to use it or leave it? Probably use it.

Ahmadinejad is quoted by Reuters as saying "They succeeded in creating problems for a limited number of our centrifuges with the software they had installed in electronic parts". Sounds like it got in to me.

<comment><USER5> > Well if you've been successfully exploiting a broken certificate, and it > gets busted, and you have another spare one, are you going to use it or > leave it? Probably use it.

No: if you reached the target with your trojan and if your trojan is made to quietly disrupt then the last thing you want is to raise the awareness of your target by making a newer version with a newer certificate, which is then immediately recognized by all antivirus vendors, and which induces your target to recheck all their configurations and add the protections.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> Prime example of cyberwarfare.

</comment><comment><USER8> ..or it may have not. But it doesn't make such a great headline.

Anyway, if it is true and I had to make a bet about authorship, it would be on the USA. The USA has been doing that since 1970s (Siberian pipeline incident). Mossad is great at machinegunning waiters at Norwegian ski resorts, but high- tech ops have not been their strength.

</comment><comment><USER9> They've probably switched to homegrown motor drives now, but other weaknesses are probably waiting to be exploited.

<comment><USER10> > They've probably switched to homegrown motor drives now

According to Wikipedia [1]: _it was reported in 2006 that the tiny amount of material deposited in fingerprints on Iran's prototype centrifuges were enough to cause the machines to shatter._

It's not like that's the kind of stuff anyone can build at home.

[1] <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zippe-type_centrifuge>

<comment><USER9> If you can build a centrifuge, you'd think you could build a variable speed motor drive which is about 100 times easier.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER11> I find that attack awesome in the true sense of the word, I am in awe.

</comment><comment><USER12> Well, I don't know how smart is to piss off people with nuclear material, and not to much to lose. Attack other nation territory is considered a Casus belli.

<comment><USER13> Nuclear material != nuclear weapons. And I'm not sure why you think they'd feel they don't have much to lose.

</comment></comment><comment><USER14> What are the sources for these news?

<comment><USER15> Well, the picture at least is cited as "Photo by: Courtesy", but you can find a bigger version on wikipedia.

<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Gas_centrifuge_cascade.jpg></comment></comment>


Hidden Cameras in AirBnBs - <AUTHOR> https://twitter.com/textfiles/status/935305053258125312 <comment><USER2> To everyone in this thread arguing that it's "your own house," it's worth noting that Airbnb requires all cameras to be disclosed to guests, and cameras are forbidden in private areas of the property.

[https://www.airbnb.com/help/article/887/what-are-airbnb-s- ru...](https://www.airbnb.com/help/article/887/what-are-airbnb-s-rules-about- electronic-surveillance-devices-in-listings)

"Legal gray area" or not, it's not allowed by Airbnb.

<comment><USER3> Even if it's technically not allowed, AirBnB is not proactively enforcing the ToS by checking the properties prior to rental. Without a legal framework for prosecution, the most we can realistically expect is a refund to the consumer and banishment of the property owner.

<comment><USER2> Does it matter? I don't expect someone from corporate to be regularly sweeping my Motel 6 room for hidden cameras. That doesn't mean I don't have an expectation of privacy or that Motel 6 has no responsibility to protect that expectation. If there's no legal recourse where I'm staying, I'd expect to be reasonably compensated for any trouble, which it sounds like is happening.

<comment><USER4> You actually do. An employee of Motel 6 (the housekeeper) sweeps your Motel 6 room every single day, or at least between stays. Furthermore the onsite management is explicitly expected to enforce corporate regulations. Yet no ABNB employee comes anywhere near your 'rental', and there exists framework for enforcing ABNB policy beyond the good-will of the 'hosts'.

<comment><USER2> If the motel housekeeping or management is the one planting the camera, then I don't see how this is any different than case with Airbnb. Airbnb hosts are explicitly expected to follow the terms of service, just as hotel management is expected to follow corporate policy.

Plus, the whole point of a hidden camera is that it's hidden. If anything, it would be far harder to find a hidden camera as the number of rooms to search increases.

<comment><USER4> If the motel housekeeping or management is the one planting the camera, then the corporation will be held account. On the other hand, if a host plants the camera, AirBNB's language makes it clear that there is no accountability or responsibility on AirBNB's part. So the incentives to actually enforce that policy are entirely different.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> As I work in hardware / cameras and I've done online sourcing of chinese goods, my email has been collectively added to more and more companies' mailing lists. I get spam for spy cameras all the time. Tissue boxes are popular, clocks, clock radios:

Talitor seems to have plenty of various types of hidden cameras: [http://www.talitor.com/](http://www.talitor.com/)

[http://www.talitor.com/products/DVR/CH0721w/page_CH0721w.htm](http://www.talitor.com/products/DVR/CH0721w/page_CH0721w.htm)

[https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Wireless-Table-Clock- Camera-...](https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Wireless-Table-Clock- Camera-1080P-720P-Mini-Wifi-IP-Clock-Camera-Alarming-Setting-IR-Night- Vision/32838090757.html)

[https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Table-Clock-Camera-Alarm- Set...](https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Table-Clock-Camera-Alarm- Setting-720P-HD-H-264-Mini-Camera-IR-Night-Vision-Wifi-IP/32841142584.html)

<comment><USER6> Hidden cameras are a regular staple of Japanese crime news. They hide cameras in literally anything. Inside smoke detectors and back-of-stall-door coathangers are two of the more nefarious ones I've seen.

</comment></comment><comment><USER7> Operators of unregulated flophouses engage in shady, unethical practices? Color me shocked.

<comment><USER8> _unregulated_

They're not unregulated everywhere, you know. Short-term house rentals were not exactly invented yesterday.

</comment></comment><comment><USER9> Devil's advocate:

The use of cameras can help prosecute and provide proof to back up destruction claims - something airbnb providers probably run up against regularly.

And given the legal grey area airbnb hosts exist in, it's probably not explicitly illegal, since they're filming their own property.

Non-devil's advocate:

Creepy as hell. Especially since there's only a camera in the bedroom.

<comment><USER10> > they're filming their own property

What? No. Guests have reasonable expectation of privacy, same as hotels.

<comment><USER3> AirBnB is explicitly hiding in a gray area. The same hotel protections do not necessarily extend to having a friend over at your house (which is closer to the legal interpretation AirBnB prefers) You are legally permitted to put up cameras in your own house, and it's a common practice to set up "nanny cams" when leaving the house to a babysitter

<comment><USER11> I'm pretty sure secretly filming your guest's bedroom is also covered by existing laws, even without the rental.

<comment><USER12> There is also possibility the existing laws take into account intent. Filming with a nanny cam that is visible (even if you don't call it out) to protect your kid is allowed. Filming with a hidden cam for prurient reasons is illegal. Proving intent would be case by case and up to a prosecutor/court.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER13> Here is another report on Twitter about a similar case, it seems like it didn't get the required attention at the time:

[https://twitter.com/goodyerin/status/859119557654523906](https://twitter.com/goodyerin/status/859119557654523906)

</comment><comment><USER14> This should be a criminal offence with jail time; not a refund.

<comment><USER15> This is a criminal offence in the UK, providing intent can be proven. [https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2003/42/section/67](https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2003/42/section/67)

<comment><USER16> "I'm sorry judge, I really didn't know! How could have I known that my cheap motion detector sold from China had an embedded spy cam?! When I was installing it, I just wanted to plug in all the cables and the internet plug was the only one that fit, computers are meant to be user-friendly like this..."

<comment><USER17> Are UK judges _that_ credulous?

<comment><USER18> UK judges are generally very reasonable in my experience (though I should acknowledge that my experience is limited to being an observer or witness in a small number of cases).

If something really does seem like an honest mistake, they may take that into account when passing a sentence.

On the other hand, if someone not only did something bad but then the judge thinks they tried to cover it up even in court, that is likely to count against them, possibly heavily.

<comment><USER17> Right, the other poster's story is along the same lines as someone claiming that they like to shadowbox in the street when they get drunk.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER19> In Germany it is illegal to own or sell hidden cameras.

<comment><USER20> How are "hidden" cameras defined?

There's a lot of devices including smartphones that have tiny, almost invisible-to-the-naked-eye pin-hole cameras. Do those count? If I want to have a hidden cam to watch my birdfeeder, is that illegal?

<comment><USER19> If you can read German: [https://dejure.org/gesetze/TKG/90.html](https://dejure.org/gesetze/TKG/90.html)

Basically, cameras that appear to be everyday objects and are particularly suited for recording non-public locations without those being recorded being aware of the fact.

IANAL, but because Smartphones are expected to have some recording device they may be okay, a hidden camera to watch your bird feeder seems more of a grey area because it can also be used to record humans.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER21> As the reply in the thread below the main tweet mentions, similar problems exist in hotels as well. Probably there is a market for making a simple and affordable "bug detector" which we can carry?

<comment><USER22> That's a thing: [http://www.dx.com/s/bug+detector?cateId=0&cateName=All%20Cat...](http://www.dx.com/s/bug+detector?cateId=0&cateName=All%20Categories)

(Not a recommendation - haven't tried any of these)

<comment><USER23> Would any of those have found this (non-wireless) camera?

<comment><USER24> If it's active IR then it's pretty easy to find using a detector. If it's a passive optical device with a wired connection, then you can't find it with a detector that wouldn't also find a ton of other signal cables.

It's then probably easier to find a camera by looking in the network rather than physically. The problem with that is you can only find it when it's transmitting and not if it's sleeping (unless it happens to also have a public endpoint that's always open).

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER25> Key detail:

> He left at 3am, reported, host is suspended, colleague got refund.

Airbnb can't check everything, but at least they respond in a good and timely manner.

<comment><USER26> I once ended up in an AirBnB that had large cockroaches that came out at night (and landed on the bed, freaking my wife out). Called AirBnB at 2AM, they asked for proof (sent them a video). Finally, at 5AM I told them that we were leaving.

They just cancelled the reservation, giving us no chance to leave a review. AFAIK, that host is still renting out her cockroach-riddled place in Oahu.

<comment><USER27> I've lived in Hawaii. Unfortunately, there is not a lot you can do about the cockroaches. You can keep things as clean as possible, but there will always be a few. Especially, after it rains, they tend to come indoors where it is dry. I would just try to smash them, so they didn't start breeding in my house.

EDIT: I did not witness your Airbnb, of course; it is entirely possible that the place was infested. I was just put in mind of a friend who freaked out when she saw one single cockroach and told us our place was infested.

<comment><USER26> The place was at fault. There were crumbs in the edges of the floor in the kitchen and other nooks and crannies. If you don't want insects infesting your place, you should keep it clean and not feed them. I stayed in other AirBnBs too, and never saw cockroaches that size and in those numbers.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER28> In a separate incident, Korean tourists in Fukuoka, Japan found hidden cameras in their AirBnB.

That said, AirBnB seems like a great example of a business that many would have thought impossible because of various kinds of social risks -- sexual assault, theft, etc. -- yet, with care taken, human decency prevails.

<comment><USER29> I'm not really sure an AirBnB would be any less safe then a previous small boutique licensed private hotel/bnb, these also operated out of peoples homes or even larger hotels for that matter. Basically anyone can gain access to a hotel and wait for your to leave your room and break in or assault you as you enter/exit.

At least with AirBnB you can leave reviews that are easily read by potential future guests.

</comment></comment><comment><USER30> An interesting thought exercise is to think about how much of your life is now being spent under surveillance. Not only all the cameras everywhere, but also Gmail, Facebook, and whatever else you might use. Maybe George Orwell's predictions aren't too far off.

<comment><USER18> _Not only all the cameras everywhere, but also Gmail, Facebook, and whatever else you might use._

Personally, I believe a greater concern is the things _other people_ are using.

If I choose to use Google or Facebook services or to carry a smartphone loaded with sensors and networking and spyware, that's down to me. There are plenty of valid concerns about transparency, but at least I have the option to not participate at all.

On the other hand, I have no control over whether someone on the next table over at a restaurant chooses to carry a smartphone that has some sort of always-observing technology built in, nor do I get any warning if they are doing so and my dinner conversation that would normally be reasonably private is being picked up by a mic and transmitted to the mothership.

Likewise, if I send an email to someone, while it has never been a 100% secure medium, it used to be the case that it was unlikely any third parties would see the message unless it was a system admin dealing with some sort of problem. Today a significant number of recipients are using a service like Google's to handle their mail, but possibly hidden behind their own domains and identity/branding. Consequently, those big mail services may in practice have access to a large amount of the email I have sent and may be processing it for all kinds of reasons without my knowledge or consent.

Same goes for services like social networks when they do things like uploading someone's whole address book from their phone after their app is installed. Now it's not just my friend or business contact who has my details, it's a social network, and they can associate those details with everyone else involved as well and start building up a detailed profile about me, again without my having any sort of direct relationship with them and without my knowledge or consent.

</comment></comment><comment><AUTHOR> I posted this not because of AirBnB and rather as a good example to show how low the barrier for surveillance through hardware (& software) is by now.

A few years ago this would have been quite expensive and not easy to do.

</comment><comment><USER31> FWIW, hidden cams might not even have been installed by the host, but by a previous guest. On the other hand, the host would probably notice unless it's really well-hidden, unlike this one here.

</comment><comment><USER32> >refund

This is pretty severe.

Don't get them get away with it. Sue.

<comment><USER33> How about getting the police involved? My guess is that this is a felony.

<comment><USER34> ISTR from reading the twitter threads they did call the cops.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER35> Also been reported elsewhere recently:

[http://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and- advice/airbnb-h...](http://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and- advice/airbnb-hidden-camera-couple-bedroom-florida-longboat-key-video- voyeurism-a7994071.html)

</comment><comment><USER36> I guess disconnecting the apartment's wifi could prevent the camera from transmitting anything?

<comment><USER8> Could still record locally for later access, though.

<comment><USER36> True. Any other recommendations? Disconnect the electricity? Scan the network to find any devices that look weird?

<comment><USER8> Cheap cameras can record to SD cards, so the network doesn't necessarily help. I'd say disconnecting the electricity would probably work, but makes it a bit hard to use the house, no?

My suggestion would be to assume you might be being filmed, rather than assume you can avoid it.

<comment><USER37> > assume you might be being filmed

If that's the assumption, my response would be to never stay in an AirBnB. What good is a house you're not comfortable changing or showering in, much less having sex?

<comment><USER38> Might as well up the paranoia level one click and never stay in a hotel, either.

<comment><USER37> Maybe my response was too paranoid. But certainly a well-known hotel chain has more to lose by misbehavior and bad publicity than an individual renting out their house does.

<comment><USER39> Usually hidden cameras are installed in hotels not by owners, but by staff.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER40> How does one scan for these? I stay in AirBnbs all the time.

<comment><USER41> I would start scanning a local network to see if there's any devices that I can't identify. If there are, I would try to trace them down, and, if unsuccessful, turn the router off and switch to mobile hotspot.

This is under the assumption that the cameras don't store the data locally, which they probably do. In that case, I don't have any ideas what to do if you can spot them on the local network but can't trace them down physically.

<comment><USER40> Upvoted, but is there not some sort of device I could buy to find electronics? I literally have spent 85% of the past half year in AirBnbs and I hate worrying about this.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER42> Some way to improve this : make the camera difficult to access by the guest. Remove all label or marking indicating its a camera.

</comment><comment><USER43> Tweet the address so he's an embarrassment to his neighbors. Maybe that'll deter some people.

<comment><USER43> I'm unexpectedly being downvoted. In case it's because I was misunderstood, I meant that people such as this tweeter should "name and shame" the hosts who do this, so that future hosts are afraid to do it.

</comment></comment><comment><USER44> Its a two way street. I had friends put an annoyatron in an airbnb they were staying in and knew I was going to stay in a few days later. So its not just the hosts you have to worry about...

</comment><comment><USER45> This is one of the reasons we created Point which we just released the 2nd generation of on Kickstarter: [https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/minut/pointthe- friendly...](https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/minut/pointthe-friendly- home-alarm)

<comment><USER46> You created Point to find hidden cameras in AirBNBs?

I mean nice try pumping your product, but come on.

<comment><USER45> One of the reasons I think we've seen this over and over is due to lack of alternatives to monitor homes in a non-invasive way. Hosts naturally care about their apartments when they rent out. And hiding a camera is, judging from many comments here and Airbnb, not the right way.

But yes, you're right. I'm definitely pumping our own product :)</comment></comment></comment>


Assessing the reliability of a clothing-based forensic identification - <AUTHOR> https://www.pnas.org/content/117/10/5176 <comment><USER2> This is the 2009 report quoted in the article, [https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/nij/grants/228091.pdf](https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/nij/grants/228091.pdf) wonder how many of these techniques will turn out to be BS?</comment>


Uncrackable? The Collatz Conjecture - <AUTHOR> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5mFpVDpKX70 <comment><USER2> Some folks might like this: [https://gist.github.com/kiyoto/4dbe676711e8e91659b02d72eced5...](https://gist.github.com/kiyoto/4dbe676711e8e91659b02d72eced5446)</comment>


Real and Virtual Firearms Nurture a Marketing Link - <AUTHOR> http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/25/business/real-and-virtual-firearms-nurture-marketing-link.html

<comment><AUTHOR> This story was cross-posted under an alternative headline, via the International Herald Tribune.[1]

 _The video game company Electronic Arts has created a Web site that promotes the manufacturers of guns, knives and combat-style gear...[linked to those used in the game]_

== Per the IHT article.

________

[1] [http://rendezvous.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/12/25/warfighter- vi...](http://rendezvous.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/12/25/warfighter-video-game- offers-links-to-actual-guns/)</comment>


Transport-Triggered Architectures - <AUTHOR> http://tce.cs.tut.fi/tta.html <comment><USER2> This is very interesting but does not appear to be helpful for the development of my TTA processor design. It appears that this project aims for more parallelism similar to VLIW than my simple MOVE architecture targets.

I would very much appreciate feedback and suggestions regarding my preliminary specifications which will be changing in the near future (before year's end) to include MUL, DIV, and floating point support. I really want to have a firm specification before proceeding with the VHDL implementation.

You can view what I have done at [https://github.com/BillBohan/NISC](https://github.com/BillBohan/NISC) .

</comment><comment><USER3> Which of course, sounds awesome. Are there any implementations/examples we can check out? Does this relate to the concept of a "systolic array" in some way?

<comment><USER4> I know the Maxim MaxQ is a microcontroller that implements a transport triggered architecture.

<comment><USER5> Maxim seems to have quietly EOL'd most if not all of them.</comment></comment></comment>


A web crawler that can handle any number of websites - <AUTHOR> https://www.mixnode.com/ <comment><USER2> What's the largest crawl you can handle? meaning your upper limit...

<comment><AUTHOR> We've done crawls of over 250TB and 3 billion web pages. If you need to crawl more than this you can simply shoot us an email and we'll provision resources for your mega crawl.</comment></comment>


When Asbestos Was a Gift Fit for a King - <AUTHOR> https://daily.jstor.org/when-asbestos-was-a-gift-fit-for-a-king/ <comment><USER2> For a short backstory on Wittenoom, an former asbestos mining town in remote Western Australia see this video [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3LDoI7H1Gc](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3LDoI7H1Gc)

I once worked with an environmental engineer who had a grandfather that worked at Wittenoom. He passed away due to mesothelioma, but her father who grew up there has not been affected, which is quite amazing given the circumstances. I have seen footage from Wittenoom of children playing in mounds of asbestos.

Today there are two general types of legacy asbestos products, friable and non-friable. Generally non-friable products such as asbestos-cement sheeting are considered safe to leave in place and are only dangerous when cut, broken or otherwise damaged. Friable products such as pipe lagging are very dangerous as they easily break down into fibers that can be inhaled.

It can be found in many old homes in odd places. I was removing some old putty around a window and a friend of mine who was an asbestos hygienist suggested that it could contain asbestos and took a sample for testing (all clear thankfully).

In another instance I worked on a demolition of a 1960's era multistory apartment complex. During construction of the concrete core walls the builder had used asbestos in the formwork, leaving some embedded in the wall at regular intervals. This meant that all of demolition waste was considered contaminated and was going to a special dump at a huge cost.

Finally, there was an infamous case in Canberra, Australia where a company called Mr Fluffy [1] installed loose friable asbestos as insulation in homes. A cleanup program in the 90's did not adequately fix the problem and so in 2014 the government finally purchased affected properties and demolished the houses.

Asbestos is bad stuff, but exposure causing mesothelioma seems to be a bit like Russian roulette. You might get it, you might not. But if you do, you will die.

[1] [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mr_Fluffy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mr_Fluffy)

<comment><USER3> From what I know and was also told by several doctors when a family member was dying of mesothelioma in his early 70's (despite never having worked more than casually a few times around asbestos in his much younger years), the illness is strongly suspected of being tied to a genetic predisposition that only affects a certain small percentage of people.

If one has this genetic disposition, it's apparently possible that even moderate or modest exposure early in life is enough to cause the (extremely deadly and almost impossible to treat) disease at some point later in life. This point can come years or decades after exposure.

And if one isn't predisposed, then even heavy exposure to asbestos probably won't cause mesothelioma. It is of course still possible to get other really shitty lung problems from the mineral regardless of genetic factors, but meso itself seems to be very selective. This apparently is why it's relatively rare despite widespread asbestos use for decades before recent years in much of the world.

<comment><USER4> Smoking also _greatly increases_ the chances: [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3749214/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3749214/)

<comment><USER5> Now to find the construction worker in the 1970s who did not smoke

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> Build on this even in 1942, just prior to the discovery of the link to Mesothelioma, we were busily figuring out every use case we could for asbestos - [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tC8L8ooBSgQ&t=1m8s](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tC8L8ooBSgQ&t=1m8s)

Despite the recognition of Mesothelioma in the early 1900s it took almost 40 years to associate the disease with Asbestos.

My understanding is that this was due to the 10 - 40 year average post exposure timeline for Mesothelioma to show up.

If Asbestos was discovered today would our contemporary understanding of materials science & safety prevent us from spinning up factories and use cases like this?

(1) [https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases- conditions/asbestosis/sy...](https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases- conditions/asbestosis/symptoms-causes/syc-20354637)

<comment><USER7> At least we think about it. The miracle material, graphene, has properties that could potentially cause problems when breathed in [0]. So at least we know what to look for and can mitigate.

That said, who knows what other material might come about that causes problems 40 years later in a different way. We will learn when it comes but at least we're starting to be more aware of potential problems.

[0] [https://www.materialstoday.com/carbon/articles/s136970211270...](https://www.materialstoday.com/carbon/articles/s1369702112701013/)

<comment><USER8> Somewhat related: carbon nanotubes have been shown to cause mesothelioma, just like asbestos

<comment><USER9> That sounds amazing and seems like a huge set-back to certain envisioned application areas of carbon nanotubes. Do you have a link to a study?

<comment><USER8> Here you are: [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4243371/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4243371/)

<comment><USER10> Interesting thanks.

If this guy is to be believed, asbestos and other "amphiboles" are different from nanotubes insofar as they have small metal/iron content, which you can imagine reacting with oxygen in the lungs in a harmful way that something made from pure carbon may not.

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KuHL7hiFTnc](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KuHL7hiFTnc)

Now, on the other hand, if those carbon nanotube particles were all as sharp as tiny diamonds, you could imagine them being pretty bad to inhale.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER11> I've heard this Charlemagne legend before but I'd love to see somebody put it to the test. I'm thinking the tablecloth would come out of the fire soiled with ash and bits of charcoal. I suppose it might still impress his guests but I don't think this party trick would work quite as well as the legend suggests.

Also, 'Salamander Cotton' is a delightful name for asbestos.

<comment><USER12> Less a tablecloth, more a placemat. And it is doubtful it was thrown _onto_ the fire, where it would probably put the fire mostly out, rather than thrown _into_ the fireplace to hang on something over the fire. There are also translation issues from royal to plain speak. Royals like this rarely did physical things. When the king is observed to "throw" something, it is more likely that he _had it thrown_ by a servant who then placed the valuable object on a rack as planned. Readers of the time would not see a practical difference.

<comment><USER13> > Royals like this rarely did physical things.

That might be true now but historically kings led armies into war, and had to be skilled enough to fight.

We know the name of Charlemagne's sword, Joyeuse.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER14> For those that are unaware, if you or a loved one was diagnosed with Mesothelioma you may be entitled to financial compensation.

<comment><USER15> who's paying out?

<comment><USER16> I believe the parent post is sarcastically referring to the pervasive mesothelioma lawsuit commercials on US television.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER17> The town of Asbestos, Quebec, Canada is planning on changing its name this year to get away from the stigma.

[https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/asbestos-quebec- chan...](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/asbestos-quebec-change- name-1.5375703)

</comment><comment><USER4> Franklin's asbestos purse can be seen here: [https://www.sciencephoto.com/media/530102/view/benjamin- fran...](https://www.sciencephoto.com/media/530102/view/benjamin-franklin-s- asbestos-purse)

You may also enjoy this 1940 book from an asbestos manufacturer: [https://archive.org/details/LegendsOfAsbestosBeingAnIllustra...](https://archive.org/details/LegendsOfAsbestosBeingAnIllustratedCompilationOfUnusualHistorical)

<comment><USER18> Haha wow, that didn't look as impressive as I imagined it.

Were it hard/impossible to finely weave it back in those days?

</comment></comment><comment><USER19> Tiger's Eye. A rock that is pretty much stabilized (sealed) asbestos. It's pretty popular with kids. You can buy it at rock shops. And yes, if it breaks in half, get rid of all traces of it.

</comment><comment><USER20> >>Asbestos is the only exception; it's the only rock that can be woven into cloth.

Not true anymore. Basalt fiber is now commercially available.

<comment><USER21> If remelting counts then fiberglass would also be included.

</comment></comment><comment><USER22> An exquisite read. The author (Amelia Soth) should be proud of something so captivating.

</comment><comment><USER23> There is a fascinating 16 minute documentary about an Australian ghost town that once was a thriving asbestos mining town:

Australia's Ghost Town: The contaminated city Wittenoom [https://youtu.be/PaHw_bGI2ME](https://youtu.be/PaHw_bGI2ME)

SPOILER ALERT: it turns out the town is not uninhabited.

</comment><comment><USER24> Funnily "gift" in German means "poison" in English.

<comment><USER25> In Swedish, it can mean both "poison" (noun) and "married" (adjective).

<comment><USER24> OK Swedish definitely wins. That's upping it by one, _chuckles_.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER26> "Trump is on our side," said Vladimir V. Kochelayev, chairman of the board of Uralasbest, one of the world's few remaining producers of asbestos, citing what he said were reports that the Trump administration was easing restrictions on asbestos use.

Remember the good old times, before the thousand deaths per day, when the President of the United States stepped in front of the television cameras and went on and on about the virtues of Asbestos to help out a struggling Russian town? Fun times, fun times...

[https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/trump- as...](https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/trump- asbestos-707642/)

[https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/07/world/europe/asbestos- rus...](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/07/world/europe/asbestos-russia- mine.html)

</comment><comment><USER27> Did we overreact in banning asbestos from everything? In many applications it seems well contained. Maybe we can use it if we're careful about its manufacture and disposal?

UPDATE: Apparently it's not outright banned in the US, but it is in many other countries. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asbestos#United_States](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asbestos#United_States)

<comment><USER28> It's not just the danger in consumer products. Asbestos mining is incredibly dangerous and has led to serious health problems for thousands of people.

[https://mesowatch.com/asbestos-exposure/risk- industries/asbe...](https://mesowatch.com/asbestos-exposure/risk- industries/asbestos-mining/)

>Because of this enormous risk of death from asbestos exposure and general mining operations, many experts consider asbestos mining to be one of the most dangerous occupations in history.

</comment></comment><comment><USER29> is asbestos really that bad? or is it the long term affects. if charlemagne just used it a show off thing in the diner would it have really mattered?

<comment><USER30> Yes, but in insidious ways. In the era of Charlemagne, many other things would have had significantly higher micromorts. As a dinner guest, I would have enjoyed the show rather than headed for the doors. At a dinner party today? No way.

According to the official CDC report which was used by the EPA to ban new uses of asbestos [1] the gist is that asbestos isn't a traditional poison. We measure most "poisons" in terms of Lethal Dose (LD50) or roughly paraphrased "how much of this would it take to kill 50% of subjects." We tend to think of something, like cyanide, as "very poisonous" if a small amount of something will kill you very quickly. But we measure lethality in other ways - "lethal concentration" (LC0 - whats the lowest concentration in air that has been observed to caused a fatality, LC50 at what concentration is 50% affected), lowest observed adverse affects level (will this mess you up like lead poisoning?), lethal time (LT0 - lowest amount of time observed to cause fatality, LT50 - time to cause fatality in 50% of population), and a host of others.

Asbestos doesn't have an observed LD50 (at least not in that report). No one has died within a few hours of inhaling asbestos like they would if, say, they ate Fugu pufferfish.

What it does have, is a very low LC0 and very long LT0 numbers. Only a little bit needs to get into your lungs, which unlike the pathway we observe in cigarettes, will stick around for a very long time, where it will eventually (on a long enough timeline) cause cancer. Exposure makes these numbers go up. 10% of asbestos mill workers die of mesothelioma, 2% of people who work with asbestos insulating boats and planes die of mesothelioma or related cancers - most within 5-20 years. If you're a smoker, the synergistic effects can further increase your risk of cancer by 90x(!). Other figures in other reports are a bit lower, but the panic was over the issue that there was no 'safe' dose of asbestos unlike with other toxins and no trivial environmental remediation.

I only gave it a scan; happy to be corrected by someone more informed on the subject.

[1] [https://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/toxprofiles/tp61.pdf](https://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/toxprofiles/tp61.pdf) \- since updated in 2001

<comment><USER31> Interesting info. Thanks!

By the way, whatever happened with Lockitron? I backed it in 2012 and the device I received never really worked. Reached out and was told there was a fix coming but nothing ever happened. I've never backed any sort of crowdfunding since.

<comment><USER30> The short version is we came out with an updated model in 2014 which fixed those issues and sold to Chamberlain in 2018. It's now the "Keyless Smart Lock by Liftmaster" [1].

With a few exceptions, crowdfunding is much more tame these days. You should look into again. There are some particularly great products on [https://www.crowdsupply.com/](https://www.crowdsupply.com/) for instance. Aside from a few COVID delays from March-June, I back and receive projects nearly every month.

[1] [https://www.liftmaster.com/keyless-smart- lock](https://www.liftmaster.com/keyless-smart-lock)

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER32> Apparently asbestos has been used since at least 5000 years ago[0]. I wonder what prevented large scale extraction between then and the 19th century.

[0] [https://books.google.com/books?id=eYHEEWhye94C&pg=PA449#v=on...](https://books.google.com/books?id=eYHEEWhye94C&pg=PA449#v=onepage&q&f=false)

</comment><comment><USER33> Asbestos is amazing and has undoubtedly saved many lives.

But thanks to technology we can do even better, we don't live like Kings, we live better than Kings. (Those of us in the 1%, aka West)

<comment><USER34> Has anyone compiled a list of all the everyday things that used belong only to the fabulously wealthy? Ice cream remains my favorite example.</comment></comment>


Ask HN: Best Twitter Lists to Follow? - <AUTHOR>

What are your favorite lists? <comment><USER2> Shameless Plug: If you are interesting in Racing esp. Formula 1, I maintain a list - [https://twitter.com/shortsightedsid/lists/formula-1](https://twitter.com/shortsightedsid/lists/formula-1). For those interested in Electronics, Semiconductor and Embedded Software I have another list - [https://twitter.com/shortsightedsid/lists/semicon-and- embedd...](https://twitter.com/shortsightedsid/lists/semicon-and-embedded)

</comment><comment><USER3> Tech News People from Robert Scoble can be good to follow ;)

[https://twitter.com/Scobleizer/lists/tech-news- people](https://twitter.com/Scobleizer/lists/tech-news-people)</comment>


Moonlighting to Full-time venture. How successful have you been? - <AUTHOR>

This is probably something a lot of first-time entrepreneurs face. You have an idea. You start working on it, toiling away nights and weekends. But you realize you need to devote far more time and effort to really elevate your startup to a greater level. Execution is the key that unlocks the door. To execute you need to promote, listen to your customers, spend countless waking hours thinking and working on it, invest, pitch, hire, and much more.
Working a full-time gig gives you only so much time and mental bandwidth to do this - your odds of failing I suppose go up exponentially. Probably the worst and saddest outcome being your startup and energy just fizzling away.
I'm curious to know the experiences of some of who have started off moonlighting and successfully transitioned. If you haven't yet, what are your thoughts? What were your experiences? Did some of you quit your jobs to pursue the dream from day one?
If there has been an earlier discussion about this, I'd appreciate pointers. <comment><USER2> I'm currently in that boat. It's tough. I've been at it 1.5 years, and I'm still optimistic.

One thing that made things significantly better was moving from full-time to part-time on my day job. I did that about six months ago. It helped significantly, but now I loathe even the 20 hours a week at the day job as a distraction from my "real" job.

The main thing I'd recommend is stay connected to the "full time" entrepreneur community. Network, have coffee with other entrepreneurs.

Also, remember that this is a marathon, not a sprint. Get into a pace that you can comfortably keep up for years.

<comment><AUTHOR> I've been at something for over an year and half now. It has been a stellar learning experience. However, while I hate to say this, in a way it's always been a half-hearted attempt. I'm now working on a new idea that seems quite promising in an emerging market. I don't want to repeat the same mistakes however. The fact that majority of my waking time is spent at a job is like driving a nail into my own coffin.

The part-time suggestion is a good one.</comment></comment>


Red Hat – Why We Voted NO on Java Modules JSR 376 - <AUTHOR> https://developer.jboss.org/blogs/mark.little/2017/05/11/why-we-voted-no-on-jsr-376 <comment><USER2> What about the part that Java modules would have simplified Java, making it easier for software that is not over-engineered?

<comment><USER3> How exactly would jigsaw project achieved this?</comment></comment>


My Startup Had All of Our iMacs Stolen & Here's How We Saved the Company - <AUTHOR> http://nextshark.com/my-startup-was-burglarized-heres-how-i-managed-to-stay-in-business-still-sell-the-company/

<comment><USER2> Sad story dude...glad it turned out well in the end!</comment>


Touch-typing feels good but isn't for me - <AUTHOR> https://medium.freecodecamp.org/touch-typing-feels-good-but-isnt-for-me-2cfbafee2074 <comment><USER2> As a programmer I needed the keyboard to be an extension of myself. I can't be looking down every 2 seconds to position my hands correctly or find that one key.

Originally I never followed home row position and had orchestrated my own abomination of touch typing that would work for all letters. The problem began when I started needing to use () and {} more often since my old typing position would never let me do that with ease. Not to mention capitalizing letters and even using numbers I would almost always need to look down or lose my position and train of thought.

I was at about 30 WPM using this method. Eventually I took about 2 months using www.ratatype.com and following through the lessons to pick up home row position and such. Now I can average 80 WPM without trying on most of those speed typing games and 120 WPM on rare occasion.

Now I can easily find home row and the keyboard is truly an extension of myself where I don't feel bogged down by typing (using VIM now too). The mental barrier is gone and I only think about the problem and not having to switch context between looking down and finding a key while thinking about the problem. 10/10 would recommend anyone not using home row to try and learn it.

side note: I would never have picked up VIM/Emacs if it wasn't for me using home row.

<comment><USER3> > I can't be looking down every 2 seconds to position my hands correctly or > find that one key.

Agreed 100%. I bought 2 blank keyboards[0] a few years ago. I relish the looks people give. I usually follow up by asking "Do you know how to type?"

[0] [https://www.daskeyboard.com/daskeyboard-4-ultimate/](https://www.daskeyboard.com/daskeyboard-4-ultimate/)

<comment><USER4> One option if you're on a laptop, is to use a Dremel to remove the labels from each key.

<comment><USER5> Ow. Reading that physically hurt me, lol. I'd rather use a marker or a sticker.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> My experience with a guitar suggests that it is a wrong mood to learning new tricks. When I was told that my right hand thumb position is not right, and I should try to change it, I didn't challenged the idea at first, I knew that if I try to change it, I would face problems, it would be harder for me to make it right, even if "right" is a way to a mastery. A few hours a day in a month or two, and I learned how to do it right. Now I can do both ways, because each has its upsides and downsides. I'm playing classical pieces with "right" position of my thumb, it is really good, but when I use guitar as a rhythm- driver I prefer to use thumb to silence some strings.

There are no point to compare a new way and the old one before you mastered new. And there are no point in thoughts like "my natural ways are different and should be preserved for the sake of keeping my personality". If your physiology is near enough to averages, than all the differences are neurological or mental. These differences can be overcome. But because they are mental, the mood of yours when you are learning is the very important to a learning.

<comment><USER7> > _If your physiology is near enough to averages, than all the differences are > neurological or mental._

Independent control over the last three fingers of the hand is one of the places where there are some pretty important anatomical differences between people.

[https://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=anatomical+variation+fi...](https://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=anatomical+variation+finger+extensor)

<comment><USER8> Huh! I don't have this independent control in either hand -- I can't bend my pinky without also bending ring finger -- but I touchtype at 130wpm peak. Maybe this isn't actually relevant for speed typing?

(Despite trying most mech keyboards/switch types, I've always been faster on chiclet/low profile/low force style: it would've saved a lot of time if someone had pointed out that mech keys aren't actually about typing efficiency at all.)

<comment><USER7> Chris:If you get a chance see if you can try some of these Alps switches from the 1980s in decent condition,

[https://deskthority.net/wiki/Alps_SKCP_series](https://deskthority.net/wiki/Alps_SKCP_series)

I am guessing you could type faster on those than whatever chiclet board. The advantage they have is that the plate spring pops back up, reducing the amount you need to use the extensors (it's faster to just contract and then relax the flexors than to deliberately lift the fingers). [Unfortunately they weren't built into too many keyboards, and some of the ones that do have them are crappy for other reasons.]

There are a bunch of relevant keyboard design factors which are not really properly considered by keyboard makers. For example:

\+ The relative height of the tops of the keys (sadly most keyboards ever made have screwed this up, and it has only gotten worse over time, because most keyboard designers were just copying past designs without understanding the anatomical considerations). If the further rows (top letter row, number row, F row) are aggressively raised, the fingertips can reach them without needing to bend at the first knuckle, meaning those keys can be pressed without as much hand movement while the fingers remain in the most comfortable and fastest part of the main flexors' range of motion. By contast the bottom row of letters should be the same height as the home row.

\+ The separation, tilt, and tent of the two halves of the keyboard. Ideally the keyboard should be oriented so that the forearms and back of the hand are comfortably flat with wrists and arms in a neutral position, and key axis on each half of the keyboard should be perpendicular to the plane of the forearm/hand.

\+ The placement of more keys within a close range of hand/finger motion, and the elimination of keys further away. (This gets us decidedly away from standard keyboard shape.) In particular there should be a lot more more accessible thumb keys.

\+ The letter arrangement. Qwerty is optimized for the original keyboard from the 19th century. Dvorak is optimized for the shape of 1930s typewriters (where the consistent aggressive height differences mean that the close letter row is quite hard to reach but further rows are relatively easy). More recent efforts to optimize arrangement make no effort to make sure that several-key sequences on one hand can be typed in one fluid motion. In practice people who type quickly can line up several fingers on the same hand and press the keys in quick succession using one medium-scale motion, alternating between stretches on one hand and the other.

<comment><USER8> Thanks, I'll try to! At the moment the fastest mech board I've found is the (cheap, as mech keebs go) Havit with new low-profile switches:

[https://www.amazon.com/Mechanical-Keyboard-Extra-Thin- Switch...](https://www.amazon.com/Mechanical-Keyboard-Extra-Thin-Switches- Rollover/dp/B0722GG88M)

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment> nevi-me For someone who "float" types, that's an impressive speed. I tried out the typing website that 's mentioned on the post, and it reminds me/makes me realise the potential flaw in these types of typing tests.

After trying it out for about 10 minutes, I get an average 40 WPM; but I see that it's because I pause for a few seconds after each round of words (probably my brain adjusting from the garbage that it just digested).

Typing, and fast typing, is a function of the brain being able to process either an auditory, mental or visual data source, and the hands converting it to keystrokes. If one thinks of the brain as a data buffer, the brain receives info and interprets it, and sends it to the hands. There's almost always some lag, and that lag is mainly how fast one types (my opinion of course).

When you're given a test that's got words that don't have much meaning, it takes some adjusting to process them, because I had to rely on reading them word-by-word (I learnt some speed-reading when I was younger, so I tend to process a lot more words at a time). I noticed that I typed better when the words made sense, because the brain could buffer words, which I'd rely on not reading completely, but using my previous knowledge of how to spell them.

The test also doesn't account for the human mind self-correcting. It was only after about 3 minutes where I reduced the habit of backspacing to correct what I noticed to be a typo, but don't know if I get penalised for it.

Going back to the author's views on touch typing. I think if he/she spends more time on it, they could improve their speed. The micro/milliseconds that your 4 fingers spend moving would make a difference.

<comment><USER9> I completely agree with the criticism you raise towards the website. The nonsensical words make typing them much more difficult, but the real crux of the issue is that you can't issue corrections.

I prefer 10fastfingers as a typing test, because it's a list of actual easy words without silly capitalization and symbols. In my opinion, it's more representative of the way I would type most of the time than most of the other tests I've seen.

I will say though, that 40 WPM blows my mind. What kind of a result do you get on 10fastfingers.com? Because I can do 30-40 WPM on my phone with Swype.

EDIT: I used keybr for a longer period of time now and I think the start of the website gives a bad impression. The lessons don't feel quite normal, but once you finish them it ends up much similar to regular typing tests, where most of the words are actual English words.

<comment><USER10> > _I prefer 10fastfingers as a typing test, because it 's a list of actual > easy words without silly capitalization and symbols._

Well, if you write novels, sure.

But programming is all about typing silly capitalization and symbols.

<comment><USER11> eh, I disagree.

More symbols? sure. But most everything is still an English language word. Admittedly, sometimes smashed together in the thisVarIsHere way, or this_var_is_there way, but mostly still just normal words where having a "typing vocabulary" of words you can type from muscle memory is hugely important.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> I'm kind of gobsmacked that anyone working in a modern office hasn't learned to touch type. The payoff seems so clear to me.

Thankfully my parent (mom) was an amazing typist (scientific secretary) and encouraged me to take typing in high school. This was just as personal computers were coming around (Apple II, IBM PC). I was the only boy in the class ... which was fine by me (hey, I was 14). When I began college, being able to type papers without hunt-and-peck was a clear win, and as terminals/computers became the norm the advantage proved even greater.

FWIW, I'm considering trying out a non-QWERTY layout and so far the Workman scheme looks like the best-of-breed; the designer is an engineer who gave it real analysis and it's wisely thought out, IMHO.

<comment><USER11> I guess I'd ask you to define touch typing then.

I can certainly type without looking at the keyboard (hell, I can air type every key/symbol from memory) but I sure as shit don't use the standard touch typing scheme.

I float over the keyboard with my primary 3 fingers on each hand doing most of the work and my thumb and pinky handling modifiers.

I happen to have hands the size of large dinner plates though, and just keeping fingers on the home row starts to cramp after a little bit. I probably have about half my spoken vocab as muscle memory on a keyboard and I reach about 100 WPM without having to deal with wrist/finger pain at the end of the day.

</comment></comment><comment><USER13> 25 days is, admittedly, longer than I expected him to try, but I still have trouble accepting the conclusion that it's just not right for the author. There are many reasons touch typing is the preferred method and why it's taught in schools and typing speed isn't necessarily the most important.

As someone who does touch type and has tried to switch from QWERTY to DVORAK it's also widely advocated that you switch entirely, even if you're dirt slow at first, because the real gains come after your brain finally switches over and it truly becomes muscle memory, not actively remembering where keys are in whichever layout you're using at the time.

In another 10 years I wonder if he'll regret not switching to get that decreased muscle strain benefit too...

<comment><USER14> >because the real gains come after your brain finally switches over and it truly becomes muscle memory This was half the reason I picked up blanks for my keyboard, sure the first few weeks were absolutely filled with glances downwards toward nothing useful, but eventually my brain managed to compensate. I found the hardest part was homing back to a known position on the board and would frequently mistype as I was floating back and forth. Turns out that was most of my issue.

Somehow I ended up designing a keyboard (Gergo & Georgi!) and eventually settled on a layout that minimized wrist motion (or in the case of Georgi, finger motion). The default layouts ([0], [1]) naturally happened over a few months of programming, once the brackets were moved to be accessible with index fingers, thumbs for mods and enter and the funky Control/Backspace. It's entirely different to any other board that exists, but it works, for me and has helped with ergonomics.

I guess trackballs are kind of the same, once you pick it up you'll be inefficient and clumsy. If you throw out your mice you'll be good enough before you know it.

[0] [https://qmk.fm/keyboards/gergo/keymap.png](https://qmk.fm/keyboards/gergo/keymap.png) [1] [http://docs.gboards.ca/Unboxing- Georgi#modes](http://docs.gboards.ca/Unboxing-Georgi#modes)

</comment></comment><comment><USER15> I used a typewriter long before I could read or write, banging out sheet after sheet of gibberish. In school, I turned in any assignment typewritten whenever I could get away with it. My own two-finger system, of course, but I did get reasonably proficient over time.

Come seventh or eighth grade, an optional typewriting class made it unto the curriculum (this was in the seventies, a good while before computers entered the picture). A walkover for me, of course, the _only_ one in class who had ever done any typing at all.

Except it wasn't. I flunked. Miserably. The only one to do so. My habits turned out to be a hindrance, I never got the hang of ten fingers and a keyboard shielded from view and strange, difficult ways of doing things. To this day I haven't. Whether because of my early, possibly misguided training, or because catastrophic failure convinced me for good that I couldn't do it, I am not entirely decided.

<comment><USER16> I had similar results in the 90s with school courses and I still haven't learned the sightless method.

</comment></comment><comment><USER17> Somewhat off-topic, but the touch-typing website linked showed an example of simpsons paradox after I tried it for 10 minutes to get a baseline.

My overall speed decreased over the 10 minutes of practice, but each letter either was flat or improved; the tool is apparently designed to give you more practice with the keys you are slower at, so as it figured out which keys I'm slow with, my overall speed decreased.

</comment><comment><USER18> I like the way the author characterizes the "feel-good" nature of bouncing between keys with traditional touch typing. I type mostly in Dvorak these days (with some modifications to make it less terrible for programming), but when I do foray back into QWERTY there's often a moment where I'm struck by how nice it feels to stretch my fingers away from the home row, and the novelty of typing mid-size words with only my left hand. It doesn't hold up over time with QWERTY, but now I'm pondering devising a keyboard layout that optimizes for "fun" motions the way modern layouts optimize for finger-travel distance (and how awful the results would be in terms of hand strain!).

</comment><comment><USER19> Speed and accuracy may be the wrong metrics to focus on as they don't necessarily account for ergonomics. On the other hand the brief mention that it feels better to touch type should probably be seen as an indicator warning to the author that perhaps their self-taught method may be anti-ergonomic. If so, the author should maybe consider the switch to avoid future pain/trouble.

(My self-taught form was an "float" of sorts with my right hand travelling a lot to compensate for a left-shifted left hand, which favored the modifier keys. I very much believe that I was very close to needing RSI surgery in grad school, and am very glad I relearned to touch type.)

</comment><comment><USER9> I do touch-type, but I don't seem to do it in the quite orthodox way. My "homerow" seems to be shift-A-W-D or F and K-O-P-between ' and ENTER. Sometimes my right hand's homerow is also between K and L-P-[-ENTER. When I touch-type my hands actually encroach on each other's territory at times, where the middle buttons can be pressed by either hand.

I do find keybr to be very non-representative of typing AT FIRST. It becomes much better after you get through the "lessons". After the lessons it ends up being more like a regular typing test.

<comment><USER20> >I do touch-type, but I don't seem to do it in the quite orthodox way. My "homerow" seems to be shift-A-W-D or F and K-O-P-between ' and ENTER.

The problem here is your QWERTY keyboard. We're taught to use the "home row" and to keep our hands in that position, yet the keys are layed out in almost the _most_ unoptimal way for this: the home-row keys are some of the least- used keys! It's an entirely idiotic layout for a keyboard if you want speed and comfort (from moving your fingers the least).

If you want to actually touch-type correctly, you need a different keyboard layout like Dvorak, where the home-row keys are actually the ones you use the most.

<comment><USER9> But why would I want the keys I use the most to be all near one another? I find that I type the fastest when I have to press keys that are far from one another. What complicates the Dvorak suggestion further is that I use the same keyboard to type two other languages.

My hands rest where they do because of games, because that's what I'm most used to.

<comment><USER20> >But why would I want the keys I use the most to be all near one another? I find that I type the fastest when I have to press keys that are far from one another.

Science and physics says you're wrong. Also, it sounds like you've never actually tried learning another keyboard layout.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER21> From personal experience as someone who types 140-150WPM on average and 200+ in short bursts without using the "official" key-finger mapping but something quite close, the key point (no pun intended) to typing effectively can be summarised in a single sentence:

It is more important to know where the keys are, than to know which fingers to use to press them.

Once you don't have to think to know where the keys are, and force yourself to use all your fingers, you'll naturally use whichever finger happens to be closest, and that will give you the first big jump in speed. Then type long enough and you'll "chord" keys, typing frequent combinations as a single uninterrupted sequence instead of letter-by-letter. I discovered I could type 60-70WPM _with only one hand_ , because I see entire "words" at a time and already know where on the keyboard to reach.

I tried out that keybr.com site and got penalised badly due to the "almost- words" that I constantly mentally autocorrected, it felt like I was typing phrases from the poem Jabberwocky; nonetheless I don't think I did too badly:

[https://i.imgur.com/T85hFdn.png](https://i.imgur.com/T85hFdn.png)

(I found it amusing that the automatically generated sentences had very high occurrences of "cons", "tory", "taxes", "the union", and "war"...)

</comment><comment><USER22> Of course you can also go all-in on touch-typing, even going so far as to look for keyboards that minimize travel distance, etc.

I'm mostly done assembling my own ErgoDox ([https://www.ergodox.io/](https://www.ergodox.io/)) but haven't used it yet. I'm hoping that it'll make it easier to type (less stress/tension in my hands). It'll be more fun, for sure.

Anyone else here interested in assembling/designing their own keyboards?

<comment><USER23> I've got the Ergodox as well and like it in general but I think the thumb keys are a bit too far away from the rest of the keys. A very interesting project is Mitosis[1] which uses PCBs both for keeping the switches in place as well as connecting the swithces.

[1]: [https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicalKeyboards/comments/66588f...](https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicalKeyboards/comments/66588f/wireless_split_qmk_mitosis/)

<comment><USER22> And it looks beautiful!

And it looks cheap (-ish, of course).

Do I understand this correctly that it's essentially two separate keyboards wirelessly connecting to the computer?

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER24> I've been typing since I was six or seven and I guess I just sorta picked up touch-typing. I was never taught how to type but I don't have to look at the keyboard. (Usually, that is. I switch between English and Icelandic layouts, and it takes me a moment to find punctuation/special characters after switching. And Icelandic keyboards are _awful_ for programming.) I think starting at such a young age got it wired in deep.

I find that I rest my fingers on the officially designated home row, but aside from that I couldn't even begin to tell you if I'm touch-typing "correctly." According to keybr.com I have trouble with Q and W (top left/pinky keys, which seem to require repositioning my hand) and B and Y (which I discovered I use the "wrong" hand for when I tried a split keyboard).

Whatever I'm doing, it works: I average 100 wpm, and max out at 150 if I'm in a hurry. My partner says my typing sounds like "evil bugs." :)

<comment><USER25> I found that using a split keyboard for a while helped me identify and correct cases where I used the "wrong" finger for a key, which improved my overall typing speed and comfort in the end. (And I still use a split keyboard because I prefer it now.)

<comment><USER26> When I decided it was time to knuckle down and learn to type properly I bought myself one of those Microsoft ergonomic keyboards for exactly that reason, to help force myself to use the correct fingers. I ended up loving it and now use a Kinesis Advantage.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER27> Keybr.com is great. I really appreciated their charts on layouts.

I typed above 85 wpm on average, maxing at about 110. My left hand is proper home row. My right hand is angled with index and middle on j and n, moving around a bit. The chart finally explains why I do this. The left hand side is mostly evenly distributed (on QWERTY). The right hand side is sort of diagonally bimodal. It also clicked with me that I do this to get quick access to backspace with my pinky. Backspace doesn't appear as a consideration for many keyboard layouts. I hit it a lot.

</comment><comment><USER28> Can someone list good resources (preferably free or low cost) to learn touch typing on a QWERTY U.S. English keyboard?

</comment><comment><USER29> the problem I find with touch typing and programming is that the right pinky area is responsible for far too much

things like -> I do by "floating hand", given I use Vim bindings I often think about trying to make certain things work nicer with homerow touch typing

</comment><comment><USER30> If most of your time programming is spent typing, you're doing it wrong.</comment>


Neo-Victorian computing (2007) - <AUTHOR> http://www.markbernstein.org/NeoVictorian.html

<comment><USER2> Totally fine as long as I don't have to use or maintain anything they build.

There is certainly space for an elite and useless parasitic upperclass of programmers working on things that only appeal to them (which I assume is the portion of Victorian society he is referring to: during that period most people were involved in mindless drudgery on the factory floor.) There just isn't space where one expects to be _paid_.</comment>


Twitter to Ban All Political Advertising - <AUTHOR> https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/30/tech/twitter-political-ads-2020-election/index.html <comment><USER2> Discussion: [https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21401973](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21401973) (twitter.com)

Currently #1 on the front page.

Other sources for this story, possibly with a different take and hence possibly worth a compare-n-contrast:

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21401965](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21401965) (nytimes.com)

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21402083](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21402083) (vice.com)

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21402101](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21402101) (thehill.com)

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21402388](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21402388) (bbc.co.uk)

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21402405](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21402405) (theverge.com)

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21402448](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21402448) (nbcnews.com)

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21402938](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21402938) (twitter.com)</comment>


OctogatosConf20 - <AUTHOR> https://sessionize.com/octogatosconf20 <comment><AUTHOR> Save the date friends! Sep 24-25 the @octogatos are proud to present #Octogatosconf20 a 100% free (Speakers paid) trilingual conference, submit your talks at [https://sessionize.com/octogatosconf20](https://sessionize.com/octogatosconf20)</comment>