Kierkegaard: Creativity Must Master Dread of the Unknown - <AUTHOR> https://www.skmurphy.com/blog/2016/07/10/kierkegaard-creativity-must-master-dread-of-the-unknown/ <comment><AUTHOR> Takes this quote by Soren Kierkegaard from "The Concept of Anxiety" as a point of departure: "Anxiety may be compared with dizziness. He whose eye happens to look down the yawning abyss becomes dizzy. But what is the reason for this? It is just as much in his own eye as in the abyss, for suppose he had not looked down. Hence, anxiety is the dizziness of freedom, which emerges when the spirit wants to posit the synthesis and freedom looks down into its own possibility, laying hold of finiteness to support itself. Freedom succumbs to dizziness."

Key take-away: Entrepreneurs can be paralyzed by the rich set of possibilities they face. It seems almost paradoxical that when you have one choice you can start immediately, when you have two you can flip a coin, but as possibilities multiply the desire to make the best choice can paralyze you. To fully embrace your creativity you must master your dread of the unknown.</comment>


IOS vs Android - <AUTHOR> http://macmagazine.com.br/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/03-ios-android.png

<comment><USER2> This is incredibly misleading. Saying that the difference between iOS 4 and iOS 7 is equivalent to the difference between Android 4.1 and Android 4.4 is absurd.

The big jump in Android was from Android 2 to Android 4 (Android 3 was mostly a release for tablets). Sure, there are differences between Android point releases, but they're not as substantial as the "major versions" the chart suggests.

</comment><comment><USER3> Is this a joke ? Should we really take this seriously ? Specially, because this is being reported by a Magazine from a country that iPhone runs Android ?</comment>


Software art: mp3 player (only 176kb) - <AUTHOR> http://mpesch3.de1.cc/1by1.html

<comment><USER2> Requirements mp3 ACM codec (present since XP) or mpglib

This is just a frontend to the decoder, that's not that small to what it does.

I agree that lately programs are too bloated, software that small are rare on windows.

</comment><comment><USER3> I don't wish to sound 'unappreciative', and it's not that I think all software must be open source, but I struggle to find it interesting/'art' without the source code.

And in reality, look at old versions of winamp, they were much better players available in this size.

</comment><comment><USER4> Look what the demoscene can do in 64k. I'd call that art. This? Not so much.

</comment><comment><USER5> I am not really impressed. Bass.dll is under 100kb and handle most of the formats mentioned.

WMA etc. can be played with pure system calls. I bet that the .exe himself is creating the window handles etc. with pure system calls instead of using an framework or resource files.

I have not looked into binary details but i would not be wondered if the file is packed with kkrunchy (.farbrausch) or similiar.

@michh, 4k is the new 64k ;)

</comment><comment><AUTHOR> For me this is a work of art. Tiny software that achieves a lot. Besides this one I only know UTORRENT, another diamond. If you know another great tiny software please post it here. Disclaimer: I don't have any conexion with this software and I DON'T have a CS background, so I'm just judging it from an user point of view.

<comment><USER6> Here's a short list:

<http://www.sheepfriends.com/?page=billy>

Billy is a lightweighted no nonsense audio player that allows you to quickly play an entire directory of MP3/FLAC files.

<http://www.foobar2000.org/>

foobar2000 is an advanced freeware audio player for the Windows platform. Some of the basic features include full unicode support, ReplayGain support and native support for several popular audio formats.

<http://twotoasts.de/> <http://www.twotoasts.de/media/midori-0.4.5.7z>

Midori: Webkit Web browserScribe is a small and fast email client with an intergrated contact database and calendar.

<http://www.memecode.com/scribe.php>

Scribe is a small and fast email client with an intergrated contact database and calendar.

<http://mmm3.sourceforge.net/>

Magic Mail Monitor (MMM) is a free POP3 mail monitor with multiple accounts support. It sits silently in your system tray, and notifies you about new messages in your mailboxes. Then you can preview messages and delete unwanted mail in order to avoid spam and viruses.</comment></comment>


Why Use Erlang? - <AUTHOR> http://amtal.github.com/2011/08/01/why-use-erlang.html

<comment><USER2> If you are considering writing any kind of fault tolerant distributed systems or frankly any client server system (In any language) I highly recommend reading the book "Erlang and OTP in Action." [1] It's a reasonably short read and will make you think through what needs to happen to build a robust system and get you to really understand and internalize the stuff that is talked about in this article in much greater detail.

The only downside is you might start to feel a bit dirty the next time you try to build anything with node.js, eventmachine, twisted or any of the other evented systems that are popular today.

[1] [http://www.amazon.com/Erlang-OTP-Action-Martin- Logan/dp/1933...](http://www.amazon.com/Erlang-OTP-Action-Martin- Logan/dp/1933988789)</comment>


Using Docker as a Python Development Environment - <AUTHOR> http://continuousdelivery.uglyduckling.nl/uncategorized/using-docker-as-a-python-development-environment/

<comment><USER2> I see a lot of 'but why' questions in the thread. When I started to work with Docker for the very first time, I soon realized that it is going to be fantastic for setting up dev environments (I was not that in to VMs anyway).

I have put pretty complex setup at work on docker and it made things really simple for people who wants to set it up on their work laptop. Especially the new hires (oh and interns).

Of course Docker is more stuff to learn but when it's just a bunch of instructions to follow on a readme file they would just run those and have the system running (mostly without much trouble) and later figure out what this Docker thing really is, if they are in to it.

</comment><comment><USER3> I'm confused how they created the docker image with python, postgresql and apache in the first place? Is it the FROM python_webapp that defines that? python_webapp being the name of a docker image already defined? How hard is it to set up the docker image initially?

Edit: NVM, it is documented here (I missed it the first read through) [http://continuousdelivery.uglyduckling.nl/continuous- deliver...](http://continuousdelivery.uglyduckling.nl/continuous- delivery/rapid-prototyping-a-python-web-application-with-vagrant-and-docker- part-1-development/)

<comment><USER4> I'm more curious as to how to get a lightweight Docker container running Python. The one they use pulls in an Ubuntu Quantal image, which isn't something that I'd normally use (I'm more in the RHEL/CentOS camp).

So, how would one go about building something like this that isn't tied to a container that pulls in a whole OS? Or is that just not the way these things work? Or am I just too used to virtualenv?

<comment><USER2> You can use CentOS if you prefer that. Also the OS is pulled just once.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> to be honest i _still_ usually implement virtualenv when constructing a container.

This way I'm sure that I'm not interfering with the os-level python dependencies, and any activation of the environment is handled by a "python- webapp" baseimage that I use for all of my projects.

</comment><comment><USER6> I'm not sure about this guy's list of issues with virtualenv.

Point 1 (he forgets to activate it) is not an issue at all. You could forget to "activate" your docker too.

Point 3 (he doesn't want to run it in production) but running docker in production is okay?

That said, he made a good point about non-python dependencies.

<comment><AUTHOR> Regarding point 1, the way in which I start the server has fundamentally changed but is still only one command - I know I have to do "docker run" to start it, rather than "python run.py" or similar. In virtualenv I have to remember two commands; "workon bla" and "python run.py".

Regarding point 3, yes I think docker in production is ok, or soon will be :)

<comment><USER7> How about you use a simple virtualenv wrapper such as [https://pypi.python.org/pypi/vex](https://pypi.python.org/pypi/vex) ?

Then you can easily type 'vex myenv python myapp.py', no need to spin up a linux container for simple development.

<comment><USER8> > no need to spin up a linux container for simple development

But why not do this, anyway?

These containers are very cheap and come with very little overhead, they are truly isolated and they are easily shareable. I'd say there is no need _not to_ spin up a container for everything, it's not like you're going to run out of RAM...

<comment><USER7> While they do make sense in certain situations, they also add more complications. On linux, it's much easier, but If I want to run this on windows, or osx, they tell you to run Docker inside of a full VBox VM (and maintain it), this is not ideal as VBox destroys my battery and other annoyances.

You also have to maintain those containers/images (not to mention lug around a 600+mb base OS image and update it). I am not sure how Docker handles keeping images updated, I assume overlayfs makes it easy to keep your base docker OS images updated, but not sure how it'd handle certain package configurations.

<comment><USER8> > If I want to run this on windows, or osx

Yeah, it's completely nonsense then, the whole point for this is to be extremely lightweight; if you have to run a full VM you may just as well use it directly.

> You also have to maintain those containers/images

Well, that's true, but due to the containers being lightweight and focused you don't really have that much to maintain. I'm not a supporter of one-process- per-container philosophy, but even 3 processes/services inside a container are easier to manage than a full VM.

> not to mention lug around a 600+mb base OS image and update it

Last I checked the base Ubuntu image was ~120Mb.

> I am not sure how Docker handles keeping images updated

You just rebuild them. Thanks to Dockerfiles it's fully automated, so you can plug it into your CI.

The whole point of Docker containers is that they are very easy and cheap to build, run, share and destroy. Personally, I use Docker as a replacement for VirtualBox - my containers are nearly-full-OSes, with sshd, cron, syslog etc. running on them. But building a new one for a new project - if the project doesn't need something exotic like different distro - takes tens of seconds at most and starting/running a new instance (which is equivalent of starting VirtualBox image) takes a few seconds at most.

The important thing to remember about Docker is that you can have as little or as much of an OS inside of a container as you want. The only thing shared between the container and native OS is the kernel - inside the container you can install any distro you want or even get by _without_ any explicit distro (although I don't know if someone tried this yet). You can have a full-fledged OS if you really need it - you can run the container, ssh on it and configure everything you need to. Or you can just run a single process inside a container. Or you can stay in the middle. Whatever you do, Docker gracefully adapts, unlike a VM, which will always need heaps of RAM, have problems with interop and so on.

Over in *BSD land they have jails - I've been using them for years before Docker existed - and they are really proven piece of technology. One interesting use case for them is in PC-BSD, which is FreeBSD-derived desktop system. There's this nifty "wizard-like" GUI for spinning up jails for installing packages from outside the official package manager (like from sources or ports). The system takes care of tunneling, symlinking userland and so on; you can install/build/compile three different versions of Firefox in their respective jails and run them seamlessly alongside each other on your native desktop. It's just one of the possibilities this technology - I mean very cheap kernel-level virtualization - can be used for.

<comment><USER7> Don't get me wrong, I've been using containers for many many years. I run pure LXC on my desktop at home for simple containers. Containers are great in many situations. It's a shame LXC didn't get as much hype as Docker (not sure if Docker is LXC based anymore, but was for quite sometime).

However, you do require Docker (or LXC), and you need proper cgroup support in your kernel if you want true isolation. This is perfectly fine for myself and perhaps a few of my developers running Linux, but it starts to look less appealing in other environments.

Personally, I have to maintain multiple FreeBSD servers and even have a local FreeBSD machine for related purposes. I've also had to develop and maintain python applications for SmartOS (solaris based) machines.

Perhaps one day Docker will support Solaris Zones or FreeBSD jails, who knows. :)

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> This could be really useful for non-python webapps.

Gtk and other libraries for stuff like Sound haven't caught up to the virtualenv age + getting them to work can involve ugly hacks.

</comment><comment><USER10> Why, why should I do this?) What's wrong with python3 and Postgresql which are packaged in last Ubuntu?

How about the principle of not adding unnecessary entities/complications?

<comment><USER11> That seems orthogonal to using virtual environments or not. Are you talking about putting them on your dev machine? In that case: reproducible development environments.

<comment><USER10> "reproducible development environments" \- what does this mean?)</comment></comment></comment>


Book: "Theory of the Integral" - <AUTHOR> http://banach.univ.gda.pl/e-saks.html

<comment><USER2> Capinski and Kopp's Measure, Integral and Probability is a good brisk introduction to the theory as well, albeit a bit hand-wavy at times.

If you're feeling brave, have a shot at Wheeden and Zygmund's "Measure and Integral" :-)

Zygmund does not do prerequisites, he assumes you know as much as he, so you will need to do a lot of heavy lifting on your own and augment his works with other resources. I accidentally bought "Trignometric Series" from Amazon for $100 once, and when it arrived, I couldn't read anything past the preface. It sat there on my desk for months; I was messing with signal processing at the time, so I was reading a lot of materials and going back to it every once in a while. I kept opening it up and forcing myself, out of guilt. Over time, this much loathed text became my best friend; whenever "intro" texts became too chatty, I turned to Zygmund to get the gist of a theorem or a technique. I started comparing proofs and eventually came to prefer it. Still, was overkill for someone who isn't an specialist.

[Edit:

I really don't recommend the book in the parent post. It feels a bit antique; I have had by first brush against analysis via Knopp's cheap Dover books. Excellent mathematics, yes, but the excessive syntax, weird conventions and unpronounceable German alphabet made it harder than it needs to be. I recommend people get set-theoretic intros to analysis; mathematics teaching has become far more accessible in the last few decades, and nowadays the yellow Springer-Verlag texts, specially for undergraduates, is doing a fine job combining rigor with readability. Serge Lang pretty much made mathematics playful.

After that, move to the hard-cover Princeton Series on Applied Mathematics, and reach to the blue Cambridge books for absolute rigor, and the company of masters.]

<comment><USER3> How do you feel about Rudin's Principles of Mathematical Analysis? I've been slogging my way though that for a while.

<comment><USER2> It's a beautiful text and kept me company for many months: I have probably slogged through it slower than you can came out victorious.

For every chapter on Rudin I must have done a whole complimentary text, though. It's scarce on fluff and every line requires careful attention, but it will prepare you for analysis better than any ghastly 2000 page beast on "Calculus".</comment></comment></comment>


Lawsuit details how Sackler family built an OxyContin fortune - <AUTHOR> https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2019/02/01/690556552/lawsuit-details-how-the-sackler-family-allegedly-built-an-oxycontin-fortune <comment><AUTHOR> In the mood for a long and juicy read? Check out the full legal papers embedded in this post.</comment>


Google policy is to get right up to the creepy line and not cross it (2013) - <AUTHOR> https://www.businessinsider.com/eric-schmidt-quotes-2013-11 <comment><USER2> (2013)</comment>


A Letter: Apple Wants Its Secret iPhone Back - <AUTHOR> http://gizmodo.com/5520479/a-letter-apple-wants-its-secret-iphone-back <comment><USER2> They knew it belonged to Apple.

They paid someone in order to obtain property that didn't belong to the seller.

They expose and mock the poor sod that lost it.

An extremely poor performance on Gizmodo's part. I appreciate their excitement at the discovery of this phone, but they really should _not_ have paid for the damn thing and they should have returned it voluntarily by now -- it's what honest people do.

As for "at least doing the right thing"; they don't deserve any credit for this, since they are _obligated_ to return it. It doesn't belong to them. In fact it could be easily described as receiving stolen property, since they knowingly bought something that belonged to Apple.

Gawker are a pretty sleazy mob as far as I can see.

</comment><comment><USER3> While I still think it was a low blow to personally name the employee who lost the phone, at least Giz is doing the right thing by returning the phone.

Obviously Apple would have wanted this to stay quiet, but there is no law (or even big ethical problem, though a small one, certainly) regarding the _announcement_ of the _discovery_ of an object. (IANAL)

</comment><comment><USER4> Ah, now I see. They couldn't just return it, because that wouldn't provide enough drama. They had to have proof on Apple letterhead that it's a real iPhone prototype.</comment>


Visualizing the Unreal Size of the Dutch East India Company at Its Peak - <AUTHOR> http://digg.com/2017/dutch-east-india-size <comment><USER2> So the moral of the story is government granted monopolies get ridiculously rich based on speculation?</comment>


Philanthroper - donate $1 a day to awesome NPOs - <AUTHOR> https://philanthroper.com

<comment><AUTHOR> Hey! I'm the developer behind Philanthroper.com, and would love to see some discussion here and answer any questions you have.

We've gotten some good press so far [1], and we're completely thrilled to finally be live.

Today's featured NPO is particularly great; Computer Aid International refurbishes the computers you would have thrown out -- or, at least recycled -- and distributes them throughout Africa and Latin America (over 175,000 since they started in 1998).

Seems like just the sort of thing HN would be interested in!

[1] [http://arstechnica.com/web/news/2011/01/philanthroper- hopes-...](http://arstechnica.com/web/news/2011/01/philanthroper-hopes-to- boost-charity-of-the-day-1-at-a-time.ars)

<comment><USER2> Your page doesn't function well as a landing page or give enough information straight away about how it all works. The comment from Ben Thacker (facebook comment) is the kind of thing you need to get to the user quickly:

"For US bank-account-holders only, an interesting idea. Choose whether or not to donate $1 per day to a variety of charities pre-vetted by Philanthroper. Religious/personal appeals are excluded, and the website makes its money from ads, not by taking a cut. The only fee is a 1% charge for the payment processing."

<https://www.banksimple.com/> has a pretty epic page/intro, open source too. Do some testing anyway, but it's a good idea you have got going there. Congratulations on your launch.

<comment><AUTHOR> Thanks for the feedback. We'll definitely be thinking about the best way to draw in new visitors and give them a clear understanding of what the site's about.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER3> What do you think about Give Well's analysis of charities? <http://www.givewell.org/charities/top-charities>

<comment><USER4> Hey, this is Mark Wilson, Founder of Philanthroper.

I truly respect their approach in that they're really going after impact measurement and tangible metrics. But if we all listened to GiveWell, there would be 10 charities in business. Literally. That's how many they've deemed worthy of your support.

GiveWell is kind of like that kid you knew in grade school who said he'd only marry a supermodel. Standards are great, until you realize that sleeping alone for your entire life might not be the best way to actually live.

<comment><USER5> This is Holden Karnofsky, co-founder of GiveWell. Mark, we're glad to see your new project, and we appreciate the kind words re: respect for what we do. A couple points of clarification:

1\. We don't claim (and have never claimed) that our recommended charities are the only ones worthy of support. Our goal is to identify, and drive money to, outstanding charities; our audience is donors who want to do as much good as possible, but don't have the time/resources to research charities on their own. We recognize that our methodology is not the only way to identify promising groups (though we believe it is most efficient for serving our audience). Think of us as investors: we work to find outstanding opportunities, but don't claim that all non-recommended opportunities are bad ones.

You can see more about how we think about this issue at [http://blog.givewell.org/2009/05/07/small-unproven- charities...](http://blog.givewell.org/2009/05/07/small-unproven-charities/)

2\. In your analogy, it seems to me that the problem with "that kid's" behavior is that you can't unilaterally decide whom to marry. But you pretty much have your pick of where to give - there aren't any major charities that will turn you down as a donor. Given that situation, why not give to the best charity/charities you can find? We don't encourage anyone to "sleep alone," i.e., not give to charity.

Our recommendations aren't for everyone. We recognize the value of Philanthroper as a way to hopefully get people to give more than they would otherwise, and wish you the best with this mission. We hope that you'll consider featuring our top charities among others, because - like the others you plan on featuring - they are organizations with something special to offer.

<comment><USER4> Holden, this is a pretty fair response - and I of all people know the difficulty of digging through the noise of the industry. I do think that, intrinsically, there's an implication that comes with that pie chart on your front page and a choice of 10.

There are a lot of NPOs, but there is just as much fear-mongering that justifies that little voice in peoples' head, tipping the scales as to whether they donate or not. This voice stops people from donating to anyone, lest their dollar be the dollar that buys an office supply rather than an air- dropped meal. In this economic climate, the impact of that voice is far worse than the consequence donating to an inefficient charity.

I think that this is something you could deal with by simply rebranding that idea a bit. 'The 10 Best Charities' is such a better sell than "There Are Only 10 Worthy Charities We've Found So Far." I really feel like that pie graph says the latter.

Again, it's not your mission - I'm sincere in saying that. I think it's the presentation. And that presentation alone would never be enough for me to exclude your top picks.

But clearly, we should chat more in another venue. I'm markATphilanthroper.com.

<comment><USER5> Mark, thanks for the feedback. I think you raise a fair point. We always have a little bit of a balancing act with "headline" communications (i.e., introductory/"hook" content as opposed to pages deep on our site). No headline/chart can capture everything we're trying to say (and not say) while still being simple and intuitive. We're always discussing the tradeoffs and would be happy to speak further with you; I'll shoot you an email.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> My company is part of One Percent for the Planet. When you are part of it, you give 1% of your turnover to accredited environmental organisations. I like these kind of "give something no matter what to help the others/the Planet". The more people will be part of these actions, the better we will be.

<http://www.onepercentfortheplanet.org/>

</comment><comment><USER7> just some feedback...

i would drop the registration process for new donors, or at least make it optional (ie put it at the end of the donation process where all they do is just enter a password or something).

i really dislike these things on shopping carts and moreso on donation sites. great idea!

<comment><USER8> I agree with ookblah above. Also, letting people donate with PayPal would decrease the friction of making one. Best of luck!</comment></comment>


Difficult Clients Are Still Your Clients | Joanna Ciolek - <AUTHOR> http://joannaciolek.com/wordpress/difficult-clients-are-still-your-clients/ <comment><USER2> They shouldn't be.

Working in the job shop business I've seen that 20% of clients are responsible for 80% of unprofitable projects.

They should be your competitor's clients -- your competitors will lose so much money servicing them that your competitors won't be able to compete for and service profitable clients.</comment>


How the Plummeting Price of Cocaine Fueled the Nationwide Drop in Violent Crime - <AUTHOR> http://www.theatlanticcities.com/jobs-and-economy/2011/11/cocaine-plummeting-price-nationwide-drop-violent-crime/474/ <comment><USER2> In other words, high drug prices give money to gangs. Also, some drugs inherently encourage large gangs - stuff like heroin and cocaine has offshore production, which requires complicated supply chains with large (and therefore violent) gangs. As deplorable as meth cookers are, their small scale and low margins mean they only cause limited damage. Since they work alone, they don't need to shoot disloyal gang members, and they are too small to have real turf wars. And they compete against each other, cutting each others margins, so they don't have the money to hire mercenaries, and it's just not worth getting shot in a gangwar to hold their turf.

I don't like the effect meth seems to have on users though. It would be _much_ better (IMO) to legalise some less damaging drugs. That's the best of both worlds - cheap drugs (so no money goes to gangs, and addicts don't need to steal as much to pay for them), and safer drugs.

<comment><USER3> Meth production tends to change surrounding the availability of ephedrine and pseudoephedrine:

<http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/meth/etc/cron.html>

(The gist is that large labs tend to spring up whenever they find a bulk source for either chemical and then go away when that bulk source is eliminated)

<comment><USER4> I guess that explains why people complain that pharmacies refuse to give them cold medicine [0].

[0] "Give me some pseudoephedrine geez!!" <http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies.cfm?t=1488355>

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> The most interesting point in this article (for me) was the argument that disruptive market pressure from methamphetamine (in particular, low barrier to entry on the production side) didn't just show "War on Drugs" activity to be ineffective; it showed it to be _orthogonal_ to meaningful consequences.

Production by cartels outpacing interdiction by law enforcement isn't nearly as convincing as an argument for ending WoD activity. On the contrary, it's something that WoD hawks can point to and say "See? We need more [crazy expensive/attractive-nuisance-for-thugs resource X]!"

Modest proposal: The U.S. needs a Manhattan Project for weed/coke/heroin poppy production. Legality of demand isn't required; production just needs to completely undercut the market value of weed/heroin currently imported to the U.S. (or exported from Afghanistan, for example).

Beats subsidizing corn for ethanol, at least.

<comment><USER6> Ending the WoD?

That's only what, about one-third to one-half of all law enforcement (and the prison system)?

Do you realize how many jobs there are at stake here.

Of course I've got my tongue in my cheek, but you do see the problem with the problem of ending the war on drugs?

<comment><USER7> Solution: anyone who is going to lose their job because of the end of the war on drugs just continues to receive their current salary until their Social Security retirement age, regardless of whether they take a new job or just stop working. It's the only way you'll get buy in from the lower levels of the prison-industrial complex, and ultimately cheaper than continuing what we have now.

<comment><USER8> Make them do some other type of gov't job. Post office, making roads, whatever. Paying them to sit on their butts - no thanks.

<comment><USER9> It's better than paying them to ruin other people's lives.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> For interesting reads on the politics of cocaine, in addition to the mentioned story in Freakonomics, take a look at:

Dark Alliance by Gary Webb: [http://www.amazon.com/Dark-Alliance-Contras- Cocaine-Explosio...](http://www.amazon.com/Dark-Alliance-Contras-Cocaine- Explosion/dp/1888363681)

Snowblind: [http://www.amazon.com/Snowblind-Brief-Career-Cocaine- Trade/d...](http://www.amazon.com/Snowblind-Brief-Career-Cocaine- Trade/dp/0802135897)

</comment><comment><USER11> Interesting that the report only mentions incarceration rates at the end, but doesn't seem to give any credence to the idea that 'permanently' locking everyone up reduces crime.

The incarceration rate in the US is unbelieveably high, and started exploding in the late 80s. Increasing the incarcerated population fivefold isn't considered to have had a causal effect on the decrease in crime across the board? Come on, pull the other one.

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incarceration_in_the_United_Sta...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incarceration_in_the_United_States)

<comment><USER12> My personal sympathies lie with ending the WoD and lowering the incarceration rate. However, I think a nearly fivefold increase in the rate of incarceration probably has something to do with declining crime as well.

Does anyone have any solid evidence that the jump in incarceration was not the driver of the decline in crime?

Maybe the Levitt paper addresses this. I'll check it out.

</comment></comment><comment><USER12> The article Levitt's article. I want to note that in that paper Levitt found that the increase in the incarceration rate was a the biggest driver of the decline in crime:

[http://pricetheory.uchicago.edu/levitt/Papers/LevittUndersta...](http://pricetheory.uchicago.edu/levitt/Papers/LevittUnderstandingWhyCrime2004.pdf)

See Tables 5 and 6 on pages 184-185.

</comment><comment><USER13> This last paragraph was very interesting:

>>As a counter-example, drug use in Mexico is relatively low, approximately 2 percent, whereas in America it hovers around 8 percent. Yet, violence there is at an all-time high. The market and the crime surrounding the trade might have crashed in the U.S., but the death toll has only increased South of the border ever since that region inherited the title of lead cocaine importer. Currently valued at over $3 billion annually, the Mexican cocaine market shows no signs of subsiding, and as long as such a high-valued market exists, violence will most likely follow. <<

</comment><comment><USER14> We should make cocaine legal in half of the states at random, measure crime, and consider it an A/B test.

<comment><USER15> That would make interstate commerce regulation pretty interesting.

</comment></comment><comment><USER16> What about the increase in corruption in Mexico? An increase in corruption means more criminals can have drug businesses without being stopped by the cops.

So, when more drug businesses pop-up, there will be less of a monopoly on the supply and the cost will go down over time. It's the same as any normal business.

Even if we legalized all drugs tomorrow, it won't stop the violence. If the Mexican police were actually doing their job, the criminals wouldn't be running the show.

<comment><USER17> What do you think would happen to a Mexican police officer and his family if he tried to simply "just do his job"?

There is a reason the _police_ are the ones wearing ski masks down there: [http://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/WO- AG531_MEXICO_G_...](http://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/WO- AG531_MEXICO_G_20110802190729.jpg)

<comment><USER16> I'm shocked at the number of closed-minded members of the HN community. If the answer to the violence in Mexico isn't: "let's legalize all drugs!", I get down voted.

I wasn't a troll and explained my points, yet nobody wants to listen. It's sad. It's becoming more and more difficult to fight this mentality.

I thought this was a community of intelligent people, yet I'm beginning to realize that this just isn't the case anymore.

<comment><USER18> Your third paragraph doesn't follow from the first two paragraphs. The first two paragraphs make the interesting conjecture that increased police corruption in Mexico _lowers_ drug prices in the US. This is something potentially worth discussing.

The third paragraph asserts that legalizing drugs won't stop the violence, and that Mexican police aren't "doing their job." The first point contradicts the original article, and thus requires supporting evidence (e.g. quotations from the original article, followed by references to contradictory studies). The second point is simply unnecessarily accusatory, and is ignorant of the reality expressed by burgerbrain (<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3228850>).

Meta: you've commented (and I've responded) in this pattern before. You start with something that will be perceived as inflammatory by the typical HN crowd (e.g. <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3172594>), then follow up with a complaint about the votes you receive or the changing HN culture (<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3172744>). Maybe you're not trolling on purpose, but it sure looks like it.

As I said before (<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3173159>), you'd do a better job of conveying your message and be less likely to start a flame war if you restructured your arguments to be more appropriate to the audience -- present evidence, apply logical analysis, and draw a logical conclusion. State your assumptions (e.g. in this case if you believe that absolute societal order is more important than individual freedom, state up front that your argument depends on that). Most importantly, if you want others to change their minds, be willing to change yours if the argument goes the other way.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER19> I thought the drop in crime rates coincides with the advent of video games. More teenagers spending time on the consoles and less time shooting each other.

<comment><USER20> Drops in rape rates coincide with the increased availability of pornography and prostitutes.

So I wouldn't be surprised if violence decreases with the availability of alcohol/drugs and entertainment.

I think kids are probably less likely to get into gangs if they're at home playing WoW and smoking pot.

</comment></comment><comment><USER21> I remember writing a report on the failure of the war on drugs...and this was 13 some years ago when I was in junior high. Sad to see drug policies still haven't changed much since then.

<comment><USER22> It hasn't changed much because it is working great for a very well connected sub-set of our society.

<comment><USER23> Who are those people? Politicians? (serious question)

<comment><USER24> Prison guard unions would be one. The War on Drugs is a major contributor to the sad statistic that the US has more prisoners than any other country on the planet (not per capita, more prisoners, period). That means good business for prison guards, and the prison guard union wields a disproportionate amount of power, at least in California.

<comment><USER25> Yes! Exactly right. The prison guard union in California lobbies hard against any attempt at even mild reforms of drug laws. Here's a taste:

[http://reason.com/blog/2011/06/07/prison-guards-union- locks-...](http://reason.com/blog/2011/06/07/prison-guards-union-locks-up-b)

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER26> What I'm most curious about is what keeps the demand for drugs in the US so high? If the demand dropped off, so would the supply, prices, and number of criminals.

I recognize that I'm a deviant on the other side - I abstain from drugs, alcohol, and smoking. A bias for optimum brain, liver, and lung capacity/health seems like the rational choice. So why do so many forgo that? More pointedly, why do more Americans forgo that than citizens in other countries? My hunch is pop cultural influences (is there an episode of Entourage or How To Make It In America where someone doesn't use?), but a root cause analysis would be nice. Maybe it's related to per capita GDP? Education? Economic divide?

<comment><USER27> _I recognize that I'm a deviant on the other side - I abstain from drugs, alcohol, and smoking._

Same here and for similar reasons (although I still strongly oppose the WOD). But at least with alcohol, I'm pretty sure the optimal amount isn't zero in our current society. Not drinking has definitely interfered with my social development, which wasn't great to begin with. I don't plan to start now-- among other reasons I can't stand the taste--but the advice I'd give to my 18 year old self is "go to parties, get drunk, and learn to enjoy it".

<comment><USER26> I, too, dislike the taste, although if that's your only issue there are drinks with enough other ingredients to mask it (mudslides, pina coladas, daiquiris, etc.).

Supposedly the max health benefit is 1 drink a day, followed by zero, and more than one is detrimental. However, there are studies that say a glass of red grape juice give similar benefits as one drink. I don't know anybody who follows that advice with any discipline, though.

Not drinking doesn't affect my social enjoyment in the least. First, I find that most professionals (my social group) these days drink less than they did 10 years ago. But I was in a social fraternity in college and have no problem being at parties, bars, clubs, etc. with other people who are drinking. In fact, it's the opposite - I've found my NOT drinking affects the enjoyment of some drinkers. They get self-conscious about it, perhaps guilty. People don't want to drink alone, so if I'm with only one other person they usually won't imbibe. And I've found that those who are actively agitated by my not drinking are those who are alcoholics or marijuana addicts. That's rare, and they stop socializing with me, but I'm dodging a bullet and I'm not at a loss for friends.

<comment><USER28> Just to note that those studies that suggest some alcohol is good for you are observational, and they conflate two different kinds of non-drinkers:

1) those who do not drink for personal reasons 2) former alcoholics.

Its quite plausible that the poor health of recovering alcoholics is responsible for the differences in observed health seen in these studies.

I agree with the rest of your post.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER29> The article claims lower prices mean less profit / less incentive for dealers, and that sounds logical, but I would think that an important knock on effect is that the incentive for corrupt police officers is lower and there is less money available to buy off politicians/judges/contract killers/etc.

</comment><comment><USER30> Interesting. The assertion here is that violent crimes is a coercive measure used by gangs to maintain a monopoly, when enables them to become price setters through inducing artificial scarcity.

</comment><comment><USER31> after doing some research, i'm not sure if this article is accurate. the price of cocaine plummeted in the late 1980's, but the drop off in homicide didn't start until mid 1990's.

</comment><comment><USER32> flagged. Never understood HNs interest in drugs. Hardly on topic is it.

<comment><USER33> did you read the article? It's all about how a traditional market (cocaine) got disrupted by startups (meth labs). With the lovely side effects of proving the War on Drugs as useless as we thought it was.

<comment><USER34> If you play this game, you can stretch anything to be "on topic".

<comment> brown9-2 And what's wrong with that? "On topic" is anything that interests the group.

<comment><USER35> Agree. People sometimes see geeks as (dont have a good english word for it, in german we say "Fachidioten", maybe One-subject-idiots) One-Subject-Idiots.

I think its awesome that HN somethims gets into other subjects, the community holds a nice balance without to much regulation.</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment>


Ask HN: What would happen to your project if you unexpectedly died? - <AUTHOR>

I work on an iOS app by myself, and it's been picking up some traction.
I'm the only person who has the source code, and I have the only copy of the key needed to publish to the App Store. I encrypt my hard drives. It occurs to me that if anything ever happened to me, simple updates to keep it working with new OS versions would be impossible.
I'd like to form a contingency plan to ensure my users could at least get updates for new OS's and my family could continue to get the revenue. However, I don't have any close friends who do iOS development, and I'm not sure whom to trust with my code and keys.
Has anyone else ever had to solve this type of problem? <comment><USER2> Technical executor will probably become a thing in the coming years.

If you want your family to get the revenue after you pass, then it would take a very rare and altruistic outsider to keep that going for little to no return.

Bring someone in your family into your project. Teach them. They don't have to start on code, they could help you with administration of your app store account, or documentation. Eventually they should learn how to code, or at least to maintain your app. But they should learn where everything is and how it all fits together as soon as possible.

<comment><AUTHOR> I should clarify that I would expect this outsider to be compensated fairly for the maintenance work, but ideally I'm handing over the keys to the castle while the family still maintains ownership, control and excess revenue beyond maintenance costs.

Interesting idea about bringing someone in the family up on it. I could at least leave instructions about how to log in and publish.

</comment></comment><comment><USER3> Everything I work on is open sourced. Most projects are maintained by me only, one of them gathered a small team around me.

When I die, anyone will fork my one-man projects, and I expect my "team" project to be taken over by one of them. If not, again, anyone will be able to fork it.</comment>


Secrets of Cocoa's dispatch_once - <AUTHOR> https://www.mikeash.com/pyblog/friday-qa-2014-06-06-secrets-of-dispatch_once.html <comment><USER2> I really like this article, because it's a great description of the level of hardware knowledge you must be programming with in order to successfully elide atomics on the fast path for concurrent programming on multicore.

If you aren't familiar with your CPU architecture on the _microcode_ level, don't risk it. Your naive double-checked locking code is almost certainly broken. Just use atomics on the fast path.

<comment><USER3> > Your naive double-checked locking code is almost certainly broken

Is there anywhere I can read a little more about this?

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> [https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7860531](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7860531)

</comment><comment><USER5> (2014)</comment>


Why is electricity so hard to understand? (1995) - <AUTHOR> http://amasci.com/miscon/whyhard1.html <comment><USER2> This is very interesting. I read some, skimmed some, and saved the doc.

But I _wish_ the author had a section that attempted to explain electricity in a simple, yet accurate way. He complains about the problems that prevent it from being understood, but never tries to explain it correctly.

Fair enough for him to make that choice, but I'd much rather read a correct explanation than a list of why all the other explanations are flawed.

<comment><USER3> bingo. i read about 5 paragraphs before i started scrolling rapidly, until I realized that this entire page was a litany of wrong-ness, an ode to fuck-ups, a waste of my time.

please please for the love of anything decent and good in this world: TEACH US ABOUT ELECTRICITY!

it's ok if it's only based upon the "current understanding" of it... just give us an update as to the canonical way to describe "electrical phenomena" (er how should we refer to this subject?)

<comment><USER4> Heh.

The very first line says that THIS IS 1989 RAW UNEDITED NOTES.

[http://amasci.com/ele-edu.html](http://amasci.com/ele-edu.html) is the large collection of finished articles.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> "We use "lies to children" to avoid complicated explanations, but then we're never up-front with older high-school students about the misconceptions they probably acquired in grades K-6."

This pretty sums most of the "science" textbooks my daughter used. I self- learned about electricity concepts from a book using closed hydraulic system analogy ([https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydraulic_analogy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydraulic_analogy))

I'm an EE now :-)</comment>


The Lonely End: in aging Japan, thousands die alone and unnoticed - <AUTHOR> http://roadsandkingdoms.com/2015/the-lonely-end/ <comment><USER3> The article is written is if this is unique to Japan. But lonely deaths, unnoticed for months happens every day in every (modern) society. And it is mostly men.

</comment><comment><USER4> I used to help out in roujin hoomu (homes for the elderly) when I was a missionary in Japan. Meeting Japanese people who worked there and really gave a care was a huge experience for me. They genuinely tried their hardest to make the experience pleasant in these under-budgeted, dreary places. While we Americans were just a temporary sideshow, they were there to help for as long as they could live off the salary. Makes me sad but also a bit hopeful that those waves could build up over time. If I ever go back I will happily exchange my fascination with Manga or cool stationery or whatever for some more time trying to help out.

</comment><comment><USER5> A very good related movie: Departures [http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1069238](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1069238)

</comment><comment><USER6> Loneliness is deadly: [http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/medical_exa...](http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/medical_examiner/2013/08/dangers_of_loneliness_social_isolation_is_deadlier_than_obesity.html)

The "epidemic of loneliness" has spread to many places. If you haven't read "The Lonely American" I implore you to do so if you care about this topic at all. An incredibly sobering read.

Book blurb:

"In today's world, it is more acceptable to be depressed than to be lonely-yet loneliness appears to be the inevitable byproduct of our frenetic contemporary lifestyle. According to the 2004 General Social Survey, one out of four Americans talked to no one about something of importance to them during the last six months. Another remarkable fact emerged from the 2000 U.S. Census: more people are living alone today than at any point in the country's history—fully 25 percent of households consist of one person only.

In The Lonely American, cutting-edge research on the physiological and cognitive effects of social exclusion and emerging work in the neurobiology of attachment uncover startling, sobering ripple effects of loneliness in areas as varied as physical health, children's emotional problems, substance abuse, and even global warming. Surprising new studies tell a grim truth about social isolation: being disconnected diminishes happiness, health, and longevity; increases aggression; and correlates with increasing rates of violent crime. Loneliness doesn't apply simply to single people, either—today's busy parents 'cocoon' themselves by devoting most of their non-work hours to children, leaving little time for friends, and other forms of social contact, and unhealthily relying on the marriage to fulfill all social needs."

Here's an article for Britain:

[http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and- families/...](http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and- families/features/the-loneliness-epidemic-more-connected-than-ever-but- feeling-more-alone-10143206.html)

It's everywhere.

</comment><comment><USER7> is this a causation correlation issue of generations?

could i die alone without any great effort to do so having grown up on the internet?

i have seen promotional material for teaching seniors computer skills.. and there seem to be so many similar services and efforts that a search was unable to lead me to the specific video..

the internet is filled with a mess of stuff but within there are many communities covering very many interests

why imagine yourself alone?

<comment><USER8> I didn't grow up on the Internet, but I have gotten a lot older on it. I'm married and social, so I probably won't die alone, unless I flee and hide ;) But it's clearly much easier to meet people online who share my interests.

</comment></comment><comment><USER9> It doesn't seem to have much to do with the eldery age, or even (physical) sickness. None of the people described have been at very old age, or terminally sick. This is just an illustration of how limited is society based on collectivism, obedience and hard work. It helped them out a great lot in the industrial age, and even then made many of them mentally broken, or outright sick, and completely stopped working in the post-industrial era.

<comment><USER10> > how limited is society based on collectivism, obedience and hard work.

So you are implying a society based on independence, rebellion, and slacking would do better at treating its elderly?

Whether a culture cares for its elders only has to do whether they care for their elders, and in Japan they do. Making any other association is racism.

The fact is only because they care have they associated a dreadful term "lonely death" that anyone can relate with and fear, and have made it the center of social debate.

The fact is the US doesn't talk about this problem. They don't even have a word for it. But statistically more seniors live alone at 28% vs 20%.

In fact, I don't know of a culture that cares more for their elderly than Japan. They care so much that the way they've highlighted the problem has made western headlines. If that isn't proactivism at its finest, I do not know what is.

They're even voluntarily combing neighborhoods to identify elders living alone so that the police and local help workers can be aware.

Yes, there is ageism in the workplace, and there are those that are blatantly ageist, as there are anywhere, but Google has been cited for ageism, and to many they epitomize modern western corporate (IT) culture. Granted, the west certainly provides more tools to do something about professional ageism, but to generalize that obedient, hard working people go crazy and die alone in a culture that couldn't care less is the exact opposite of what is really happening.

I would add that the younger generation are less obedient and do not work as hard. There is a word they gave this problem too, and it is _yutori-sedai_.

refs: [http://www.aplaceformom.com/blog/10-17-14-facts-about- senior...](http://www.aplaceformom.com/blog/10-17-14-facts-about-senior- isolation/) [http://www8.cao.go.jp/kourei/whitepaper/w-2013/gaiyou/s1_2_1...](http://www8.cao.go.jp/kourei/whitepaper/w-2013/gaiyou/s1_2_1.html) [http://www.bloomberg.com/bw/articles/2013-02-28/in-japan- the...](http://www.bloomberg.com/bw/articles/2013-02-28/in-japan-the-rising- cost-of-elder-care-and-dying-alone) [http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/06/05/us-column- miller-a...](http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/06/05/us-column-miller-aging- idUSKBN0EG1ZM20140605) [http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/06/05/us-column- miller-a...](http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/06/05/us-column-miller-aging- idUSKBN0EG1ZM20140605) [https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E3%82%86%E3%81%A8%E3%82%8A%E4...](https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E3%82%86%E3%81%A8%E3%82%8A%E4%B8%96%E4%BB%A3)

<comment><USER9> In every culture or country, the elderly will have a higher chance to live alone than the population in general, simply because they spouses have died. I thought that was pretty logical, and unavoidable.

Again, the article in question did not tell much about the very old people. 60 year old man with a heart condition? In a country where life expectancy at birth for males is 81.13 years? He wasn't old at all, he could marry and live a happy life for another about 30 years, that's what life expectancy for males at 60 in Japan is. This is not about ageism, nor about treatment of the eldery. It is simply about how people are systematically depressed and feel lost, having worked for industrial super-machine their whole life - a machine which is now gone.

<comment><USER10> > It is simply about how people are systematically depressed and feel lost, > having worked for industrial super-machine their whole life - a machine > which is now gone

This has nothing to do with the youth caring for the lone elderly. That is what this story is about. There is no story in the US not because the elderly aren't dying alone, but because the youth don't care. And more are dying in the US. And plenty are dying everywhere.

Just because a culture made a reputation for itself as hard working and obedient it does not follow that there is systematic depression. If you don't care to highlight the real cause of this completely separate problem, then you are just racist.

Also, many who are dying in their 80s and 90s retired long ago. There are even stories of working elders happier and healthier for having the motivation and exercise they otherwise would not have. Japanese work ethic has nothing to do with this story or with your drawn bigoted conclusions.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER11> >We enter the world alone, we leave the world alone.

...or...

>For none of us lives to himself alone and none of us dies to himself alone.

<comment><USER12> Unless you were born in a vat, you probably didn't enter the world alone.

<comment><USER13> I interpret it as "we enter the world greeted by a bunch of strangers" and "when we die no one follows us to the other side".

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER14> My wife is a hospice nurse here in Japan visiting terminally ill patients at their homes.

She comes home with many different stories. Some people are incredibly wealthy but their family doesn't want anything to do with them so they basically wait to die alone. Some people are poor and mentally ill and are basically living in dumps with rodents running around. Some people do have good situations in which they are cared for and can die surrounded by loved ones.

My wife is the only person I've met who wants to die young (around 40 or 50). Death is usually hidden from our lives - especially when we're young and only comes up infrequently.

While some people who are poor do use their service due to government subsidies, a lot of people don't and there is no public service for the elderly. Stories like this will become much more common over the next 20 years as a huge proportion of the Japanese populations passes on.

<comment><USER15> Instead of the elderly living in homes/apartments by themselves, why not try to get them to live in elderly communities where they can engage with other elderpeople and have caregivers oversee their journey into eol.

@timhon, I meant as a society, why not invest in elderly communities. Their pop is only going to get older, so it behooves them to address this option.

As, a side note, there is a curious phenomenon of relatives going along with the rouse of their dead elders living so they can cash their checks. Seems to be in the news on occasion.

<comment><USER16> Why not put untouchables in communities where they can engage with other untouchables, with software monitors which call robot helpers if there's a problem and they are dying of loneliness and despair unacceptably quickly.

As long as it all happens to _them_ , at a distance, and we're not having to get involved, eh?

<comment><USER17> That's basically segregation/caste systems and the foundation of ensuring that the rest of the population considers it "that groups problem." And a few short steps from "god what is their problem."

It's the opposite of what you want a group to do, which is to engage with the problem, internalize it and reduce barriers with other humans.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER18> This is scary. This is the first time I read such article. I live alone, never married ( no plans to marry either ), have no friends. I have a decent job though.

This article scares me.

<comment><USER19> Me too. I live in a city far from where I grew up. Good job. Lots of money. Don't know a soul.

<comment><USER20> Do something like go joint meetup.com. If you job isn't something like brain surgeon or another essential item then it's the old adage: nobody ever wished they had spent more time at work on their death bed.

<comment><USER21> > go joint meetup.com

Not really a fan of that advice (although better than no action) - I believe it is difficult to avoid shallow connections with a shifting group of people.

I personally (A) choose to share accommodation (shared house), (B) live in a part of the city that has that community feel (not the "best" neighborhood). Now meaningful long-term connections just happen without trying (in fact it would take effort to avoid it).

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER22> If only there was something like World Of Warcraft that is suitable for the elderly.

I'm not joking. I keep wondering if I should introduce my grandma to such a game, but I live far away and they all seem too complicated. Would be happy about suggestions.

<comment><USER23> Bridge, or chess, or mah-Jong, or any number of other games. Sudoku, different solitaire variations, crosswords...

<comment><USER22> Sure, but they might lack the social aspect of MMORPGs (guilds?)?

And what would be good sites for those games?

<comment><USER23> > they might lack the social aspect of MMORPGs (guilds?)?

The first games I listed are highly social though with a relatively small number of players in a single session.

> And what would be good sites for those games?

local community centers, senior living centers, coffee shops, parks, private residences, etc.

<comment><USER22> I meant online games. A lot of elderly people are not really mobile anymore, after several falls and broken hips.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER24> That's a big problem with technological progress. It fulfills more and more of our needs, making it harder and harder to fulfill our _need to be needed_. Sure, you can give everyone basic income and robot caretakers, but people who aren't needed by other people will still suffer. I would much prefer it if society somehow changed itself to want and need all of its members, not just the young productive desirable ones. That's a kind of utopia I've never read about, it just kind of crystallized in my mind after years of thinking about this.

<comment><USER25> That sounds insanely dystopian to me, for the fact that any member of that society is viscerally dependent on others -- anyone who claims to value freedom needs to think again.

Being needed is crucially instrumental toward controlling one's own experience in the current environment. But why would it ever be a terminal value?

<comment><USER24> If it's only an instrumental value, how do you work around it? Put people in holodecks and give them illusions of loving friends? Or modify people's minds to make them content with not having any loving friends, because they already have guaranteed food/shelter/entertainment? I think many people wouldn't agree to either of those alternatives. They want to "actually" have someone who cares about them, whatever that means.

<comment><USER25> They might be given that kind of control without their will.

Sorry to get all Jed-McKenna-Theory-Of-Everything here, but no being has proof that they are not in such a situation. In fact it is arguably the only consistent possibility.

Expect that pure power would eventually (partially) allow itself to experience a situation without the ability to recall its own construction of that situation. (Imagining temporal bounds for that situation can be a helpful way of thinking about it from the human perspective, but of course temporality is a construction within the limited frame rather than something inherent.)

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER26> Sad but not uncommon I think. There was a guy who had a radio show that interviewed people with odd jobs. One such jobs was sort of like Toru's but was "special cleaning". Basically the guy started a business to clean up crime scenes. But found that most of his business came from landlords and others discovering deceased elders in their rooms. His suggestion was to crawl your grandparents from time to time to say hi. Several times he had cleaned up places where the person had simply fallen and then died where they were because they could not get up to get any help.

This is probably especially challenging with people who don't have relatives or the relatives never check up on them.

<comment><USER15> This could be addressed with monitoring. We have more and more alternatives to choose from. Either from external sensors (movement within the house, toilet usage, phone activity, bank account activity; or, alternatively, from devices worn by the people. This would be a great use of the IoT.

<comment><USER27> There's a boiling water pot in Japan which will send an sms to you when it's used - since making tea / miso soup is so integral to the lives of especially the elderly here. The idea is if you don't get your morning SMS from gradma's pot something might be up.

Edit : this is the pot [http://www.mimamori.net/service/index.html](http://www.mimamori.net/service/index.html)

<comment><USER28> That's kind of clever.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER29> Why are there so many stories HN on social problems in Asia? I would have expected that smart people on HN would make some effort to understand Orientalism[0]. In the case of this story, this is a phenomenon that is occurring all around the developed world. Japan is in many ways just another developed country. But through the eyes of Orientalism, Japan's problems are unique and quaint, and the objective Westerner can dispose some sage wisdom[1].

[0] [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orientalism](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orientalism)

[1] I don't want to pick on anyone, but there are already some great examples in the thread.

<comment><USER10> There certainly are cases of orientalist depiction in journalism, but I don't feel that is the case here. It could simply be the case that the volume of their social debate is loud enough that it is being picked up by other countries, because, as you say, it is a common problem.

As it turns out, senior isolation is at 28% in the US vs 20% in Japan. In the US, we don't even talk about it. To me, that is a far more serious problem.

<comment><USER30> I would argue that it's not because the volume of the social debate is louder in Japan than the states. It's because of a tendency to see another country's problems from outside the country allows journalism articles like this.

I'm sure there are plenty of articles in other countries talking about how Americans are having an elderly crisis that no one is talking about, as well. Certain things like leaving your elderly in a retirement home away from the family are downright unthinkable. My parents (Chinese, I'm a 1st gen Chinese American) have told me they don't want me to treat them like the Americans treat their parents (e.g. putting your grandma in a nursing home to rot alone). I'm sure they get this from their own Chinese media sources.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER31> This is so sad. Dying alone is more frightening than death itself. It is articles like this that force me to stop working so hard and spend more time with family.

<comment><USER32> I genuinely want to know: why is that frightening? I have thought through this a few times and I did not come to this conclusion at all.

<comment><USER33> I don't understand it either. Why is it frightening?

I also didn't quite understand the family comment either. Whose family are you talking about?

When you are born, you have your mom (and possibly Dad) around you. But as you grow older, Mom and Dad will pass away and you'll thus be alone. Unless you have kids, you'll die alone.

Even if you do have kids, life happens. I know plenty of people who don't talk to their kids or they hate their mom or dad and there is no relation. Thus some people have died alone.

I think some people have this fantasy, that they are on their death bed and there is 3 generations weeping around them.

Sorry, but is this even true any more? Quite honestly for me. I'm quite happy to leave as unnoticed.

Oh and another thing. Friends. Unless you make seriously good friends and not those on facebook or acquaintances. They may be around you a long time. But I have rarely met someone in their 50s/60s that still knows their childhood friends.

So strike that one off the list. I think a life well-meant is what you did with it. Rather than who is in it.

<comment><USER34> _I think some people have this fantasy, that they are on their death bed and there is 3 generations weeping around them. Sorry, but is this even true any more?_

Well, at least here in my Southern European country, it sure is. While there are many more elderly people dying alone than a couple of decades ago, I'd say most people I know still keep in close contact with their parents and grandparents, and they spend their last days (usually in the hospital) with them.

In fact, that's one thing I always found disconcerting in online conversations with US Americans - the willingness to just move hundreds of miles from their parents and grandparents. I've never considered myself a family-oriented person -I've always disliked family reunions and the "you have to go visit your great-uncle"\- but the idea of leaving now, when my grandmothers probably just have a few more years to live, just sounds so ungrateful and selfish :|

<comment> vezzy-fnord _In fact, that 's one thing I always found disconcerting in online conversations with US Americans - the willingness to just move hundreds of miles from their parents and grandparents._

In practice, this doesn't seem to occur often: [http://phys.org/news/2010-05-americans-surprisingly- mothers....](http://phys.org/news/2010-05-americans-surprisingly-mothers.html)

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER35> > _His epiphany came when his current partner told him how she had lost her > grandmother. Unlike Koremura's loss, her grandmother had died alone—a > kodokushi. It was seeing the deep regret in her, and accepting his own > ennui, that made Koremura finally take action. He left his job as a > stockbroker and set up his own removal company dedicated to the cleanup of > kodokushi victims. He wanted to give something back to the generation of his > grandmother, and he also wanted to change who he was. "I was ready for the > prospect of change, but looking back, perhaps I wasn't quite so ready for > how different my life was to become," he remembers._

It's odd that Toru Koremura's reaction to lonely elderly deaths was to go into the corpse-cleaning-up business, rather than starting a social outreach program for the lonely elderly. I understand there's dignity in how we treat the dead, but it doesn't solve the problem at all.

<comment><USER36> Japan is incredibly stubborn and ignorant when it comes to addressing core social and psychological problems in their society. It isn't even recognized by most of the population so when people begin to complain of their own social issues or depression, people around them will slowly distance themselves from that person. As a result, most people will choose to hide their issues until it is unbearable. At the point they feel they cannot continue is when they do something drastic which includes suicide.

If you bring the problem to light, people will just shy away from the debate (Japanese avoid arguments at all costs) and act ignorant. So to anyone that understands Japanese culture, Koremura's response is understandable. At least in the position he is in, he can do _something_.

<comment><USER37> How has your country (you must be American) distinguished itself by doing these same core social and psychological issues? Or are Americans stubborn and ignorant?

<comment><USER38> Britains of a certain age are stoic and stubborn.

I was in hospital with my gran (born in 1922) in ICU (a pulse of 33bpm - <USER2> turns out she had kidney failure too), when alone with me she was gripping my hand and saying "this is the worst I have ever felt", when a few minutes later the doctor arrive d and asked "how are you feeling?" she replied "I'm fine thank you".

I think the current crop of younger people will be more vocal, if their sense of entitlement about their current lives is anything to go by.

<comment><USER39> Not stoic so much, but my uk wife sliced her hand open on a can of cat food (in the US). 3 inch gash right across her palm. Bleeding. A lot. Wrapped it up in towel and said "we're going to the emergency room, get in the car". She replied "oh no, I don't want to bother them, they might be busy."

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER40> In my mind I see this as a social health crisis. The elderly provide an unbelievable amount of wisdom to the next generation. By abandoning them, we abandon our children's future. I think of the elderly as an essential vitamin for children. They impart valuable social memes and at the same time tell the children, by there mere existence in their lives, that we value our family and when the children's time comes to age and pass away, they can expect to be valued as well.

In other words, by abandoning our elderly, we're sending a clear message to our children that human life has no inherent value if you can't produce. No wonder children in industrialized nations can't seem to feel a sense of belonging.

<comment><USER41> Society is bizarre in innumerable ways. The number of people who I know that have contempt for children or people having children is repugnant to me. I think the disdain for the young and old is a sign of decadence.

<comment><USER42> Having children is the single most damaging thing to the environment a person will realistically do in their lifetime.

Edit: why all the downvotes?

<comment><USER28> The way I see it the environment exists for people. Otherwise it has no use at all.

<comment><USER43> > the environment exists for people. Otherwise it has no use at all.

There's some disgusting and ignorant comments on this page, but this one takes the prize.

<comment><USER28> "Disgusting and ignorant"? Because I don't share your religion? That's pretty narrow minded.

<comment><USER43> What???

Your religion claims that the universe is here just for mankind's benefit? You really believe that?

This planet was here for millions of years before mankind came along, and hopefully will be here for millions afterwards.

<comment><USER44> There is nothing you can ever do to destroy the planet. Check your hubris. Most of what you like about the planet is _its suitability for human life_ , which is to say, it isn't the planet you like, but your descendants.</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment>


How PayPal is being revolutionized by Node.js and Lean UX - <AUTHOR> http://www.nearform.com/nodecrunch/?p=109 <comment><USER2> I'm not so sure that it was node.js that revolutionized paypal... seems like the gains were from switching to a more agile process (and adding some supporting tools). A lot of the fixes seem pretty agnostic to the actual platform that they switched to.

Note that all those open source modules that they talk about aren't released yet. krakenjs.com doesn't even resolve (for me at least).

<comment><USER3> Its will be a little saying too much, to say node.js revolutionized paypal. But speaking as a matter of fact programming languages do play significant role in the overall productivity of the teams.

I wouldn't be too surprised if they are saying using Java was making it difficult to turnaround issues. The problem isn't Java the language itself, but the processes involved in taking changes to production with these languages are generally so much ceremony large turnaround times become the norm.

Add to this issues like fixing build failures, test failures, code reviews that span meta aspects of code(config changes, xmls etc), running around to get libraries standardized per your company standards(getting it into your local maven repo etc); and much more. These sort of things really slow you down. With these if you are tending to multiples issues, or if you have dependencies on your colleagues- I wouldn't be surprised with the 6-month delays mentioned in the article are actually true.

<comment><USER4> Better said, since there is no compilation step, so you can push non working js through and it will look "green".

Java isn't defined by a process, that's sad most people don't seem to understand that. Look at projects like dropwizard, happily throwing away what they dont like.

<comment><USER5> I think you are close to the mark. There are ways to work in Java/JSP environment that is pretty quick cycle time. But I will say that our experience at PayPal is the code is more terse, less files, npm so much better than maven for managing dependencies, coupled with the fact that our javascript templating allows portability between server & client.

The Shift-Refresh style of programming is hard to overstate how much that creates a different mindset.

And to my point in the talk, the blending of prototyping and production tech stacks is also huge for being able to quickly iterate with users.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> PayPal is still running on something they call XPT and their admin tools are built with something called Maxcode (Max Levchin wrote it).

As of 2 years ago they revolutionized CSS by having it being generated from Java because their fellowship of the ring wanted control over which properties you can use and how. Everything they do from a tech perspective has been to allow them to hire cheap labor while restricting which HTML/CSS they have access to. It's probably a good business strategy (like making sure they don't get classified as a bank) but it fosters an abysmal tech culture.

I have no way to prove the points above you'd just have to trust that I worked there as a UI dev.

<comment><USER7> I worked in PayPal's mobile team for a few months last year (acqui-hire). I can confirm that as of two years ago, everything you said is true, but as of last year the groundwork was laid for everything in this article being true today.

I used the PayPal Node stuff in its infancy (i.e., before anything was working). At that point it was a thirdhand tarball being passed around. Even in its preliminary state it was about 500% less shitty than using the old stuff (Sparta, JSP, etc).

I am glad to see that the (small, relatively insulated) team could deliver. I expect this migration will make many PP engineers obsolete, but I don't have a problem with that.

<comment><USER8> Is there anywhere I can read about the technologies that PayPal is using in production ?

<comment><USER7> New hire orientation!

Seriously though, I doubt it. Most of it is very in-house.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> Interesting article, but I'm in the UK and Paypal still looks and works exactly the same for me as it has for years. It's very slow, rather ugly, and very inconsistent - the splash page seems styled differently to the login page seems styled differently to the help page... I could go on.

I know this is mostly superficial stuff, but it doesn't contribute to a good experience at all.

Slightly OT, but why is it suddenly all the rage for sites to have persistent nav-bars that follow you down the page? The one on this blog is obnoxiously huge, and obscures a lot of content. What's wrong with scrolling to the top of the page?

<comment><USER10> I put a persistent nav bar at the top of my latest site ([http://bosscheck.me](http://bosscheck.me)) so that potential customers are always looking at a "book now" option. Shallow and obvious, perhaps, but my assumption is that this is optimal for conversion.

<comment><USER11> Your navbar is much nicer and less intrusive though, I like it. Have you thought about differentiating the booking button from the rest of your navbar elements?

<comment><USER10> Yes, I've thought about that exact idea probably more than it deserves, but I'm trying to err on the side of not appearing spammy while simultaneously keeping the "book now" button always in easy reach.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> "Head count: Node.js. Typically they are seeing anywhere from ⅓ to 1/10 the number of developers needed on the new stack vs the old stack."

That's ridiculously implausible. I know node is more concise, but 300-1000% productivity increase doesn't come from less typing. Even if we assume they had a lengthy build/restart cycle on some J2EE web container, that could only plausibly increase output by 10-20%. Sounds like they had an absolutely shitty application architecture and he convinced them to do something both reasonable and modern with the former being the biggest improvement.

<comment><USER13> First of all, J2EE web container lengthy restart is a huge overhead alone, and in case of iterating over a feature, I can easily see a 30-50% difference.

But second of all, from the article: "You didn't write html, css or javascript – you wrote css in java, you wrote html in java and you wrote javascript in java." Can you imagine developing that?

A Google search reveals: "the only thing worse than XML/XSLT is a proprietary form of XML/XSLT -- which of course is what PayPal was built on (C++ on the backend)." (from [http://looksgoodworkswell.blogspot.com/2012/09/why-you- shoul...](http://looksgoodworkswell.blogspot.com/2012/09/why-you-should-work- with-me-at-paypal.html))

I've been involved with writing Javascript in Java using GWT and it has poor developer productivity, especially as the project gets to anything beyond a medium size. At a medium size, compilation times get well above 5 minutes, and I can't even imagine a large app the size of a PayPal.

Imagine having to figure out the right XML/XSLT to transform into the right Javascript.

So it's not at all ridiculously implausible. At previous jobs, I worked with some really arcane stacks and you can't imagine the number of unnecessary layers that get in the way of good old GSD.

<comment><USER12> Poor separation of concerns can be easily solved in J2EE and build/restart can be solved with something like JRebel or just using a lighter contain like Jetty for dev. I'm just saying Java to Node is not going to give everyone a huge increase in productivity. Programming in itself doesn't even solve most of the worst bottlenecks.

<comment><USER13> I agree that Java to Node is not a magic solution. Clearly, like posters below have mention, it's the old architecture/stack that's the problem. J2EE containers have come a long way now, I can restart my Tomcat/Jetty containers in a flash, unlike Weblogic/Websphere of the days past ( _shudder_ ).

I mean, I still think Java and the JVM are great for many many a use case, not trying to pine for node here.

<comment><USER5> I agree. I am actually not a Java hater :-) In fact I have built 4 distinct Java/JSP frameworks since 1996.

You can really create some very nice frameworks with Java using some of what you say below. The Java framework at PayPal made a few mistakes (in my opinion) that made the environment harder to work in than it should have been.

But I started with needed to rapidly iterate, move between prototype & production easily, take advantage of asynchronous nature of node for our web apps to scale better, simplify the engineering team makeup (not have multiple types of engineers). These all led to deciding to move forward with node.

Oh, and let's face it, recruiting is a little easier with nodejs.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER14> A little off topic but that giant fixed header that obscures 30% of the vertical space I have available on my 15" macbook pro retina so I can see a lot of whitespace. This is terrible and made me not want to read the post.

<comment><USER15> right click - inspect element - select "<nav>" element following body tag. right click -> "delete".

<comment><USER14> Command+W to close the tab is just so much more convenient though.

<comment><USER16> Throwing your computer out the window will save you even more time.

<comment><USER14> Somedays I want to do that.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER17> PayPal has so much legacy UI cruft even their own employees can't figure it out. I was talking to a support rep on the phone last week who was telling me to click something on my home screen that wasn't there. It wasn't there because she couldn't figure out which of the 4 home screen interfaces my account was on -- having a business account with PP Pro subscription means I have extra reporting menus but none of the updated design of the past few years. Going from their public site to my logged-in profile page exposes me to 3 totally different page layouts.

</comment><comment><USER18> In most cases position: fixed is unnecessary. But it's _especially_ unnecessary when your navbar takes up a quarter of the height of the screen. Please reconsider this approach, it's really not needed for users to see your sitemap at all times while reading a technical article.

</comment><comment><USER19> Who cares about Paypal? they have screwed so many people and companies one has to wonder how they get away with it and still are in business

Bitcoin (or bitcoinlike replacement) is the future and the most interesting thing to come out (Technologywise) since email, bittorent or social networks

<comment><USER20> Business who accept payment online. People who use eBay.

Let's compare that to the number of people who know what Bitcoin is.

<comment><USER19> See the comment above comparing Paypal vs Bitcoin to Microsoft vs Linux

in the long run (10 years) either bitcoin or bitcoinlike replacement is going to trash Paypal in same manner that Linux, android etc is trashing Microsoft now, yes Microsoft still make billions but bitcoin is growing rapidly, many people wrote off Linux years ago too for very similar sounding reasons.

<comment><USER21> Yes, but your question wasn't a long run question, was it? It was a teenage- angst filled question: "Who cares about Paypal?" $44,000,000,000 in payments processed in three months - I think that is another way of saying, "Most of the people who pay for things online care about PayPal."

<comment><USER19> its not too far behind paypal already and growing rapidly in use [http://coinometrics.com/bitcoin/btix](http://coinometrics.com/bitcoin/btix)

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER22> "Node.js and javascript all the way up from just above the services layer to the frontend layer"

Sounds like a glorified web GUI layer. Good old statically-typed Java is still used for the stuff that does the actual work.

I propose a new article title "How PayPal switched to a more reasonable web GUI approach".

<comment><USER23> I propose you read the article past step 5

<comment><USER22> I did. That quote is from step 6. Read again - everything revolves around front-end.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> Content (text only) mirrored here: [http://pastebin.com/aFPtzPpD](http://pastebin.com/aFPtzPpD)

</comment><comment><USER24> Here in our company we are also changing everything to Node.js (currently abandoning C#) and it's being an amazing experience.

<comment><USER21> Another "What - how does that work?" question here. What you've said just isn't making sense - you're replacing a server side programming language with a client-side JS framework. There's obviously other "things" going on - I'd be interested to hear much more. C# is such a great language but ASP.NET is so slow...

<comment><USER25> Well for starters, node.js isn't a client-side JS framework, it's a server- side JavaScript platform.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER26> "Lines of code: In general they have seen code size shrink by factor of 3-5 by moving from the Java stack to the Node stack. Even the number of files shrunk by a similar factor."

How do they went to 3-5 times less files without recurring to several classes, controllers, etc in the same file?

<comment><USER27> I'm guessing that a good chunk of that came from either reducing the actual complexity of their UI, or from simplifying horribly-fragmented old code. And I would guess more of the former than the latter.

<comment><USER5> We actually had the luxury of comparing parallel efforts. While Node was being readied for production we were writing our new consumer/wallet app with the PayPal Java framework (based on Spring). Meanwhile we started writing the Node version. Once we got to a certain point the Java team insisted that they stop the Java development and start on Node with the node team. At this point we had two versions of the app built in two stacks and thus could compare code size, developer productivity & scale.

Of course, if we compare the new node apps vs the old PayPal code... well that would be a poor comparison as they really were old and monolithic.

<comment><USER27> Cool - it's great to hear that you guys actually got to put it to a head-to- head comparison with the old ways.

How heavily have you customized Spring, versus how much did you use various Node modules out of the box (versus having to adapt things to your backend)? Do you think part of the productivity gap comes from the large learning curve of your PayPal framework or just from Spring in general?

<comment><USER5> Not from Spring. Spring is a solid reasonable framework. Unfortunately the modifications were enough to cause confusion, the Windows-biased support (not good support for Mac) for the dev environment, forcing people to use Eclipse, having lots of server-side solutions for stuff that is already readily available on github as a simple JS library and on and on.

I still feel that even set against Spring or GWT or any Java server-side UI framework, Node plays much nicer and really gets you to the Shift-Refresh type of programming that is perfect for app development.

We used (and use) node modules completely out of the box. We add additional modules to augment. We are really adamant not to follow the roll your own mindset. We have had numerous times that we threw away our work in lieu of a new npm module that did what we were doing as good or better than ours. Why spend time doing that when we have so much technical debt to overcome to get to the state of really innovating.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER28> If they had that many developers I am not sure why they invented such a complex alternative to a private npm repo with the full replication. I mean it only took half a day to set up and then two days to load. Heh.

But I glad they did it. I really feel like someone should take some code like the core if Kappa and integrate it into npm so you don't have to wait two days or whatever to replicate a giant database just so you can have private modules. I know that will make a few peoples business model go away but I hope that's not what is stopping it from happening.

</comment><comment><USER29> This is interesting. We researched Node.js a bit and found many arguments on StackOverflow against using it for apps that require heavy DB interaction and/or non-real-time apps. Also, there seemed to be many people pointing to the single-process model as risky. Is this no longer the case or have these issues been addressed through configuration? I would love to give Node.js a try again.

<comment><USER30> It never was the case. Ignore the stack overflow dribble.

</comment></comment><comment><USER31> I do not agree that node.js revolutionized the company and everyone should start using node.js everywhere. Rather a better approach is what suggested by Nicholas - [http://www.nczonline.net/blog/2013/10/07/node-js-and-the- new...](http://www.nczonline.net/blog/2013/10/07/node-js-and-the-new-web- front-end/)

<comment><USER5> Hmmm... That is kind of humorous, given that Nicholas was a consultant for us early last year as we started this effort. His team was also at PayPal today (from Box). That article was influenced to some degree by me giving a talk at Box HQ on this very topic.

Also, maybe you misunderstand what we are doing. We are using nodejs for the web app layer. But it could be used for services (like Walmart Labs is doing). You really have to determine the context, the people, the technology, the amount of risk, and so on to decide.

But I do agree, no one should see nodejs as a silver bullet.

</comment></comment><comment><USER32> Why would anyone let an unregulated internet company have control of their money? Especially one with a track record like PayPal.

<comment><USER33> _unregulated_

PayPayl is licensed and regulated as a money transmitter in multiple US states and as a bank in the EU¹. The idea that states would allow it to transfer the amounts it does without being regulated is funny, but not realistic (and not true).

¹ [https://www.paypal-media.com/licenses](https://www.paypal- media.com/licenses)

</comment></comment><comment><USER34> I read through the article, hard to believe they will be processing billions of dollars on top of JavaScript. Maybe I've been wrong and now it's time to dump Java and go all script.

<comment><USER35> I'm guessing this is just the front-end of paypal. The backend is most likely Java-based and is never going to be changed to Node.

</comment></comment><comment><USER36> Article really confirms my suspicion that node.js is pretty much the new perl. (Although modern perl is still an excellent choice for new projects if you need small team high impact stuff).

</comment><comment><USER37> it's interesting how some established startups (if paypal could even be referred to as that anymore) have been getting gains by leveraging node.js into existing stacks.

<comment><USER38> To me, it's more interesting to see the willingness of large companies like PayPal to leverage "new" technologies in any way. The common narrative of large companies suggests otherwise.

</comment></comment><comment><USER39> As of today, Paypal still shows an interstitial progress screen after you enter your userid and password and hit sign-in.

</comment><comment><USER40> PayPal sux! that's all.</comment>


Show HN: my weekend project, Gumb.io - a Gumroad Marketplace - <AUTHOR> http://gumb.io <comment><AUTHOR> Over this past weekend I had the idea to build a marketplace for Gumroad links. I am really impressed by Sahil's Gumroad project.

But, I feel what it really needs are marketplaces for people's Gumroad links. I wanted to see what people were posting for sale - especially in terms of code projects.

So I got to work on Gumb.io - <http://gumb.io>. There is much more planned. I think it has some potential. What are your thoughts?

<comment><USER3> you were impressed with Sahil project -- in terms of idea or execution (so far). I for once still fail to see how he will fight with fraud and overall if enough people would want to use it. What do you think?

<comment><AUTHOR> In terms of both.

Yes, fraud is an issue, but it doesn't scare me from the idea. You risk 'fraud' when you purchase a rug from a souk in Marrakech. There is a chance that rug was made in China, but you chat with the store owner, inspect the rug, and you make an educated decision. Buying on Gumroad will be like that, and with a reputation system I feel most of the fraud can be mitigated.

Concerning if enough people would want to use it, Sahil could speak to that better than I. However, I feel like enough people 'use' flea markets, right? What's stopping them from doing the same with their digital goods - <USER2> if there is a known digital 'flea market' to publish your gumlinks to.

Or maybe a consignment store is a better example with the website owner purging and sorting the digital 'product'. Gumroad marketplaces like a poetry corner or upcoming garage bands might start cropping up.

<comment><USER4> Even people can use gumroad for donations for open source projects or anything.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> I see you're selling source code to one of your projects. May I ask why it was shutdown and if the domain is for sale?

<comment><AUTHOR> I could never find someone to sponsor the text messages. It was time to focus on other projects.

And yes, I am ready and willing to sell the domain. Others have been interested as well, but I'd ask you to contact me directly. Here are all the details I've sent others: <http://dl.dropbox.com/u/190299/miss%20mint%20for%20sale.zip> (I'm new to Hacker News so I hope this is not inappropriate to the community's commenting guidelines)

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> I really like the idea here. Good lucrative opportunity.

So I can start selling some projects and source codes I have crafted.

<comment><USER4> BTW, it would be nice to have the ability to delete link and re-enter the link because I have modified details @ gumroad and then your site is still saved old information.

For example:

I updated info: <https://gumroad.com/l/gsg>

<comment><AUTHOR> I've updated it for you now.

Agreed. Eventually you will be able to claim your links with an account (update, delete, sort, possibly your own storefront, etc)</comment></comment></comment>