How to Setup a Secure VPN Server on Raspberry Pi or DigitalOcean - <AUTHOR> https://blog.hsp.dk/how-to-setup-vpn-server-on-raspberry-pi-or-digitalocean/ <comment><USER2> The recommendation to use a 1024-bit RSA key worries me. In an era of passive, bulk surveillance, that seems too weak if you're not going to be using any additional transport-layer security.

The performance argument is only relevant for the establishment of the VPN connection and any periodic rekeying — it _shouldn 't_ have any impact on the tunnel's perf.

It's a shame openvpn's easy-rsa doesn't provide a straightforward mechanism to generate ECDSA certificates, which would've removed any performance concerns.

\--

edit: easy-rsa _does_ support ECDSA[1]:

 _Support for generating an ECDSA certificate chain is available in EasyRSA (in spite of it 's name) since EasyRSA 3.0. The parameters you're looking for are '\--use-algo=ec' and '\--curve=<curve_name>'. See the EasyRSA documentation for more details on generating ECDSA certificates._

[https://github.com/OpenVPN/openvpn/blob/master/README.ec](https://github.com/OpenVPN/openvpn/blob/master/README.ec)

</comment><comment><USER3> Using a socks 5 tunnel over ssh seems like an interesting ad hoc alternative for web browsing only: [https://www.digitalocean.com/community/tutorials/how- to-rout...](https://www.digitalocean.com/community/tutorials/how-to-route-web- traffic-securely-without-a-vpn-using-a-socks-tunnel)

But crucially you'd want to make your browser use the tunnel for DNS as well: [http://superuser.com/questions/103593/how-to-do-dns- through-...](http://superuser.com/questions/103593/how-to-do-dns-through-a- proxy-in-firefox/260658#260658)

Careful if you're using this for something dangerous. I'm not a computer security expert by any stretch and I don't know whether the people who have written these articles are. Chances are that this is completely broken and will reveal your IP address and identity.

<comment><USER4> Yeah, I use SOCKS5 over SSH all the time, although I didn't follow that particular guide. I am also not an expert but after making sure DNS requests were tunneled, I wasn't able to see any cleartext at all using Wireshark.

It is not a Tor replacement or anything. I think it should be effective at simple things like: masking personal browsing at work[0], masking browsing habits from your ISP.

[0] Obviously if you use a company computer, you could be keylogged/monitored in other ways. Use your judgement.

<comment><USER5> >masking browsing habits from your ISP

What I don't get is why people think that random VPS and VPN providers would somehow be better for your privacy than to let your ISP see the content of your traffic.

<comment><USER6> Your ISP and your government have a strong interest in monitoring what you do, and they are more likely to take action against you if they don't like what you do.

A random VPS service (preferably in another country) only cares about you insofar as you pay them and don't cause any trouble to them. They don't have as much of an incentive to invade your privacy as your home ISP does, and I trust incentive structures a lot more than I trust boilerplate words on a privacy policy.

It can also be a matter of opportunistic encryption. Most public wi-fi is vulnerable to anyone in the vicinity, in addition to the usual ISP and the NSA. Use a VPN and now you're only vulnerable to the VPS service and the NSA. That's quite a bit of improvement.

You also have the freedom to choose a VPS service with good connectivity in a relatively less snoopy country, a luxury you often don't have in choosing your home ISP.

<comment><USER7> > They don't have as much of an incentive to invade your privacy as your home > ISP does

The have a much better opportunity of correlating traffic than anyone else. It's not separated by an IP anymore. They've got a specific account they can connect to a specific person. (via billing) I believe if they wanted to sell the traffic logs, they'd easily find customers.

Also there have been companies like Hola ([https://torrentfreak.com/hola-vpn- sells-users-bandwidth-1505...](https://torrentfreak.com/hola-vpn-sells-users- bandwidth-150528/)) that do outright evil things just because you run their software. Facebook bought Onavo VPN which gave them more traffic visibility.

There's also a few VPN services which will replace / inject ads into pages you visit without https.

So yeah - a lot of reasons to invade both your security and your privacy here.

<comment><USER6> I said VPS service, not VPN service. I don't trust VPN services at all.

Meanwhile, I doubt that Linode has any interest in injecting ads or selling traffic logs.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> Regarding DigitalOcean VPNs, I think enough people have been doing this that it is starting to show in unpleasant ways. While using my DO VPN I've encountered captchas while using YouTube, of all sites, likely because of abuse they've seen at the hands of DO VPN users. I've also seen my DO IP range outright banned by other sites.

<comment><USER9> Probably similar for any other popular VM provider. Many webmasters, for example, block AWS IP ranges because there tends to be a lot of abusive traffic, crawlers, etc, from there.

Going with a smaller company for a VPS intended for use as a VPN is a good idea.

<comment><USER10> Any suggestions on smaller companies that are flying under the radar so far?

<comment><USER11> I'm the founder of SSD Nodes, Inc., which is a bootstrapped SSD-based hosting provider for startups that I've been working on since 2011. We have several locations which are great for VPNs: NYC, Dallas, Seattle, and Montreal. We're really good about curbing abuse, so our IPs usually don't have any issues (there's also a 14-day refund if it doesn't work out, we're very generous with refunds).

[https://www.ssdnodes.com/startup-specials/](https://www.ssdnodes.com/startup- specials/)

/utterly shameless plug

<comment> yjftsjthsd-h It might be worth it for the reasons you mention, but the lowest end plan is still far overpowered for VPN use and that's reflected in pricing.

<comment><USER9> $5.49 a month seems reasonable to me. I'm sure you could find something cheaper, but not much cheaper.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> I prefer to use layer2 bridging in OpenVPN with a separate hardware device (openwrt on a wallwart router, rackmount atom board). This way my client machines have no idea they are on a VPN and everything gets tunneled though the VPN (no DNS leaks unless my router is misconfigured).

In OpenWRT, it's basically:

-setup OpenVPN with a TAP device

-create a VLAN, assign some ports on the switch (optionally, a wifi SSID for VPNed wifi)

-bridge VLAN with TAP device

</comment><comment><USER13> this is not secure; it will leak your ipv6 address by default. use openvpn's ipv6 features to route ipv6 traffic as well[0]. using openvpn ipv6 is a PITA on digitalocean because they only provide a /124, when openvpn requires at least a /112\. you can get around this using ip6tables to route a /112 address range you don't actually have access to, and the only consequence will be a loopback if you try to access one of the digitalocean IPs you are claiming to have in your available pool while connected to the VPN.

also, 1024 dh prime is unsafe depending on your threat model[1]. use 2048 if nation states bother you, or 4096 if truly paranoid or at high risk / performance isn't an issue. no reason not to bump up the RSA keys too.

0\. [https://community.openvpn.net/openvpn/wiki/IPv6](https://community.openvpn.net/openvpn/wiki/IPv6)

1\. [https://weakdh.org/](https://weakdh.org/)

</comment><comment><USER14> Yet another setup which forgets that there is a world outside IPv4. Any IPv6 traffic will not pass through the VPN but instead bypass it.

</comment><comment><USER15> A good alternative is Algo: [https://github.com/trailofbits/algo](https://github.com/trailofbits/algo)

<comment><AUTHOR> Here's a few more:

[https://github.com/sovereign/sovereign](https://github.com/sovereign/sovereign)

[https://github.com/Nyr/openvpn-install](https://github.com/Nyr/openvpn- install)

[https://github.com/ttlequals0/autovpn](https://github.com/ttlequals0/autovpn)

[https://github.com/robbintt/popup-openvpn](https://github.com/robbintt/popup- openvpn)

[https://github.com/jlund/streisand](https://github.com/jlund/streisand)

<comment><USER16> I usually use Angristan's (improves on Nyr's):

[https://github.com/Angristan/OpenVPN- install](https://github.com/Angristan/OpenVPN-install)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER17> Nice post. I actually just wrote a post myself on setting up a native Cisco IPsec VPN sever on a Raspberry Pi 3. Cisco IPsec works natively on macOS and iOS with no 3rd party software which was a requirement for me.

[https://blog.elasticbyte.net/setting-up-a-native-cisco- ipsec...](https://blog.elasticbyte.net/setting-up-a-native-cisco-ipsec-vpn- server-using-a-raspberry-pi/)

</comment><comment><USER18> Another alternative (specific to the pi): [http://www.pivpn.io](http://www.pivpn.io)

</comment><comment><USER19> Is there an easy way to enable DNS over OpenVPN? That appears to be the biggest hole in this tutorial. Untrusted networks get to observe/spoof DNS, and the clients can't use the LAN DNS server to find stuff behind the firewall. (Or am I missing something?)

<comment><USER20> This tutorial includes configuring it as a "redirect-gateway" which will include all DNS traffic.

</comment></comment><comment><USER21> This seems a bit pointless to me.

If your aim is to hide your traffic from third-party networks you might be on (free wifi, school, hotels, etc) then a yearly VPN subscription is almost certainly cheaper than the cheapest DigitalOcean droplet. If you get a good provider (I use PIA but am not affiliated with them) then you get unlimited traffic, multiple clients, endpoints all over the world, tech support, all without having to setup and administer the server yourself.

If your aim is to disassociate traffic with yourself, your DigitalOcean IP will be tied back to you anyway.

If your aim is to stop government snooping, DigitalOcean is hosted in the USA so you may as well just send the NSA your browsing history.

<comment><USER22> I trust Digital Ocean much more than I trust PrivateInternetAccess. I also don't want to be associated with the _other_ traffic going through PIA or similar VPNs.

<comment><USER23> Curious, why don't you trust PIA? Have they done anything shady?

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER24> Interesting. I have set up a few VPN servers of various kinds (and other network trickery) in Virtual Machine hosting services, and ultimately gave up due to issues with TSO (TCP Segmentation Offload [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Large_receive_offload](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Large_receive_offload)) interacting badly with PMTUD ([https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Path_MTU_Discovery](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Path_MTU_Discovery)). The result was that TCP streams (often Downton Abbey, fwiw) inbound from a remote server, tunneled to me via the VPN, would stall and generally suffer from poor QoS.

I spent some time submitting support tickets to all the hosting providers I had tried (many). Every one of them told me that they had no way to disable TSO and the other common TCP offload features on their hosts.

So now I use Packet.net which gives me a honest to goodness actual bare metal machine (over which I have complete control), for much the same price.

</comment><comment><USER25> This reminded me of [https://www.softether.org](https://www.softether.org) which is purported to be a faster and just as secure Alternative to openVPN and looks pretty straightforward to setup. I did post another thread in this but I'm not sure if it's inappropriate to post here too....wondering if anyone has had experience with it

Also shoutout to Dr Duh who gave a nice run down of setting up vpn on a VPS

[https://github.com/drduh/Debian-Privacy-Server- Guide/blob/ma...](https://github.com/drduh/Debian-Privacy-Server- Guide/blob/master/README.md#openvpn)

Edit: Just realized that others have already noted and commented about SoftEther. Sorry guys!

</comment><comment> git-sgmoore These are the steps I take: [https://github.com/git- sgmoore/OpenVPN_Ipsec_L2tp_server_on_...](https://github.com/git- sgmoore/OpenVPN_Ipsec_L2tp_server_on_Digital_Ocean)

</comment><comment><USER26> If it's just for yourself, install the OpenVPN AS (Access Server), and call it a day. You get 2 free simultaneous users, and it deals with all of the certificates, etc for you.

</comment><comment><USER27> I use zerotier instead of openvpn, I really like the p2p aspect of it.

</comment><comment><USER28> I use [https://www.softether.org/](https://www.softether.org/). Setup of a VPN server never was easier.

<comment><USER29> I like SoftEther, too. Braoad support of protocols (including OpenVPN) works well, too.

</comment></comment><comment><USER30> I did a reasonably detailed tutorial for setting up your own VPN with Softether

[http://www.selectedintelligence.com/post/128701492804/softet...](http://www.selectedintelligence.com/post/128701492804/softether)

</comment><comment><USER31> You can check oh-my-vpn to setup openvpn server in a oneliner command. [https://github.com/alaa/oh-my-vpn](https://github.com/alaa/oh-my-vpn)

</comment><comment><USER32> just in case [https://bettercrypto.org/](https://bettercrypto.org/)

</comment><comment><USER33> ... or just use a docker container.

</comment><comment><USER34> Not really that knowledgeable about maintaining servers, but is it really enough, but is it really enough to just straight away 'apt-get openvpn'.

Surely for it to be a 'secure VPN server' there has got to be some stuff set up first, like setting up key only login, disabling root ssh login, disabling everything ssh, setting up firewall, disabling ipv6 entirely in the case of openvpn?

I run a vpn on digital ocean and its amazing looking at the logs and seeing how quickly, and how many attempts there are to break into the server straight after setting it up. As a person who isnt completely sure of what i am doing when it comes to firewalls and setting up 'jails' or whatever, this kinda makes me uneasy. I wouldnt even be sure how to tell if anyone had broken in to my server...

[https://www.linode.com/docs/networking/vpn/set-up-a- hardened...](https://www.linode.com/docs/networking/vpn/set-up-a-hardened- openvpn-server)

This has been the most useful guide that I have found on setting up an openvpn server. It has a bunch of steps to go through before you get to actually installing openvpn. But as I said, I am not that knowledgeable myself when it comes to running a server, so this may all just be unnecessary.

<comment><AUTHOR> That's good advice. It's necessary and worth it to harden any server that you deploy bash recipes on. The amount of tutorials online that leave out the IPV6 advice in that Linode article is astonishing.</comment></comment>


Browser Innovations Started by Opera - <AUTHOR> http://www.geektechnica.com/2009/06/8-browser-innovations-started-by-opera/

<comment><USER2> "5) Full page Zoom: A better alternative to larger text, zooming increases the size of the page without distorting the layout by only increasing the text size. Introduced by opera in 1996, and now all major browsers have this feature."

And now only Opera still has this feature working properly! Seriously, no other webbrowser scales tables, images and videos properly like Opera. A relevant feature if you use a 30" monitor.

</comment><comment><USER3> In response to the opener on why he doesn't understand Opera's low market share: To me, it's the odd and sometimes clunky interface.

The initial impression is important and when I load up Opera for the first time (Version 9.x) it's not as pleasant as say Firefox, Safari, or Chrome. I don't know, it just lacks a certain visual flair.

To be honest, due to this I have never given Opera a really good chance. I know Opera has some great features, but I can't get past that initial hurdle. I downloaded Opera 10 beta just now to give it another go though.

<comment><USER4> _> I don't know, it just lacks a certain visual flair._

I'd say it's mostly familiarity. It's the same reason that keeps me from giving FF a fair try[1]. It just doesn't feel the same as Opera does.

[1] Well, that and my rather awful experiences in the past with it.

</comment></comment><comment><USER5> This article overlooks a favorite feature of mine which I have not seen on other browsers: quickly accessible site-specfic preferences.</comment>


The KDE Manifesto - <AUTHOR> http://manifesto.kde.org/index.html

<comment><USER2> I'd like to see some kind of vision, focus, or specific goals for the future on that page. Being nice to each other and concentrating on the end-user are certainly good things, but where is KDE going next? Broad strokes here. Is it going to focus on being the best desktop environment out there or is it going to try to include tablets? What kind of user is it going to focus on? Is it in a race to the newbie filled bottom with Unity and OSX or is it trying to appeal to power-users? What weaknesses most urgently need to be addressed?

Nobody has to lay down the law and say what can and cannot be done with KDE projects, but expressing specific aspirations to motivate developers would be very helpful to the platform.

<comment><USER3> > What kind of user is it going to focus on?

From the website:

> End-User Focus: to ensure our work is useful to _all_ people. [the emphasis > is mine]

Does somebody else have a problem with the idea of _focusing_ in being helpful to _all_ people? Is this supposedly opposed to "Developer-Focused" or something like that?

<comment><USER2> The problem with focusing on _all_ people is that KDE will never be used by such a broad group until how Linux is distributed is fundamentally changed. Maybe it's good to be ready for the unlikely scenario in which KDE one day comes installed on tablets being marketed to your mom, but perhaps KDE can become more useful to those who use it if those developing it recognize that it's appeal is inherently limited.

<comment><USER3> I agree.

To put it bluntly, focusing on _all_ people is not having a focus at all.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> <http://manifesto.kde.org/benefits.html>

<http://manifesto.kde.org/principles.html>

The above are a lot less touchy-feely than the main page.

I don't know that this is saying much besides "Join the club, we have cool hats."

<comment><USER5> Well, part of the reason the Manifesto was made up was to help answer the question of what it even means to be part of "the club" in the first place.

KDE was started to provide a complete desktop environment. Though the work there is certainly not _finished_ by any means, it's predominantly done (and has been so since KDE 3.5, if you ask some).

Yet, KDE developers are branching off into different software types and different hardware form factors. Plasma Active is a mobile platform built on KDE libraries. The ownCloud software stack was started by developers affiliated with KDE and even shared some infrastructure initially. None of these things are part of "the desktop" though.

So, we (at KDE) have had to come to grips with lots of questions. "Are we done? Is this it? If not, what's the reason for continuing, what do we accomplish further?". We've built the community and the software, where do we go from here? And at the end, what is "KDE.org" and what isn't? What does KDE give to those who contribute, and what do we expect of those who carry the imprimatur of a KDE-affiliated project?

It's probably touchy-feely and pretty generic, but then KDE has always been kind of amorphous in my experience, for better or worse.</comment></comment>


Singapore Air Takes Delivery of Jet for World's Longest Flight - <AUTHOR> https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-09-22/singapore-air-takes-delivery-of-jet-for-world-s-longest-flight <comment><USER2> My ancestors, not so many generations ago, got on a boat to the other side of the world not even sure how long it would take (75 to 120 days) or if they would get there: it's extraordinary to me that I can do the same journey 2 or 3 times a year, in 26 hours: 17 hours from Auckland to Dubai, 2 hour wait, 7 hours to London.

I fly a lot between hemispheres and I have to say, I LOVE the long range flights rather than being interrupted after 12 hours in Singapore then having to mentally prepare for another 12 hours. I prefer to just sink into myself on the 17 hour flight and then be excited for "only" another 7 hours. The day I can fly direct from Auckland to London I'll be delighted.

<comment><USER3> SpaceX will fulfill your dream soon. And, only they can do it - fly to anywhere in the world in less than 30 mins

<comment><USER4> Probably not even as comfortable(!) as a plane, however.

<comment><USER5> I'm not sure about you, but I think I can pretty easily deal with non-luxury accommodations for 30 minutes.

<comment><USER6> Agree with this, assuming price and risk of death are within reason.

For 30 minutes, I can just take some sleeping pills and be done with it, really.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> Interesting side note (for me anyway, or for any aviation or geography nerds or budding "Action" Jack Barkers out there): If they adhere to the shortest Great Circle distance, they'll be going north almost directly over the pole. (Because the two cities are almost 180º of longitude apart.) The flight will likely track north across SE Asia, China, Mongolia, Siberia, the Arctic Ocean, then south through Greenland, Canada, Upstate New York and finally New Jersey.

<comment><USER8> One article said that they choose the route based on the prevailing winds. If you look at the route that SQ21 takes compared to SQ22 you can see that EWR- SIN is the route you said but the reverse is over the north Pacific/Canada.

<comment><USER7> Interesting. Makes sense - the jetstream has enough of an effect that it's worth it to go a little out of the way, just to have an eastward component to your vector, Victor.

Found this kinda cool site... what came next will shock you! Just kidding, not affiliated with them:

[https://flightaware.com/live/flight/SIA21](https://flightaware.com/live/flight/SIA21)

[https://flightaware.com/live/flight/SIA22](https://flightaware.com/live/flight/SIA22)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> I'm just wondering if this will increase efficiency therefore reducing environmental impact, or whether it will drive demand therefore cancelling any reduction in resource consumption. Air travel is one of the worst offenders in terms of environmental impact (next to shipping... what the hell is wrong with people wanting unripe kiwis or wine shipped from the antipodes when we could - or rather should - regain touch with our surroundings and consume whatever local products the season has to offer!?)

<comment><USER10> It's less efficient than stopping half way as you have to lug more fuel and less passenger. So not a win environmentally.

<comment><USER11> Surely cruising is more efficient than landing and taking off again? I would have thought a significant volume is fuel is spent on the takeoff, and it's burnt over an inhabited area.

<comment><USER12> For long enough flights, the one-time costs of descending, re-fueling, and climbing back to cruising altitude are worth it to reduce the continuing cost of the additional weight during cruise.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER13> I live in Singapore, I love New York, I wanted to visit LA sometime next year too - I couldn't be more excited for this!

</comment><comment><USER14> I was surprised to see this flight was using an airbus plane. I remember the time when airbus choose the strategy of big huge planes going from hubs to hubs with the A380, and boeing decided to go for long distance direct flights. The second strategy seemed much better to me, and indeed i think the A380 isn't seeling that well.

It seems that it took them only a few years to catch up, and here we are, with airbus offering the best long distance flight plane. That's definitely a great company.

</comment><comment><USER4> [https://assets.bwbx.io/images/users/iqjWHBFdfxIU/iDdGphMz2nP...](https://assets.bwbx.io/images/users/iqjWHBFdfxIU/iDdGphMz2nPM/v5/640x-1.jpg)

Does anyone else think something looks off about this picture? The left engine seems unusually large.

<comment><USER15> It was taken with a long zoom lens, which makes objects along the axis of the lens look closer together.

</comment></comment><comment><USER16> Wow, finally. Can't wait for London to Sydney, which apparently is coming in the next few years. [https://www.ft.com/content/fcd01444-bc01-11e8-94b2-17176fbf9...](https://www.ft.com/content/fcd01444-bc01-11e8-94b2-17176fbf93f5)

</comment><comment><USER17> Toilets in the flight will be absolutely filthy during the last few hours of the flight.

<comment><USER18> There will only be ~160 passengers sharing 6 toilets, should be better than average for long hauls.

<comment><USER17> Toilet use is definitely linear in respect to time in my experience. 9 hour flight is very different from 12 hours. Many people want to 'hold it' but longer the flight less of them will.</comment></comment></comment>


WhatsApp bucks convention, quietly builds a messaging titan - <AUTHOR> http://gigaom.com/2011/11/11/whatsapp-bucks-convention-quietly-builds-a-messaging-titan/ <comment><USER2> A lot of people in this thread seem to be trying to pick apart Whatsapp's business model, but I can't seem to find anything to criticize.

1) Creating a new identity and communicating it to people is a chore. Whatsapp just uses your existing email and phone number.

2) Creating a new list of contacts is a chore. Whatsapp just uses your existing contact list of emails and phone numbers.

3) At least on iOS, signing in to a service and managing session timeouts is passé. With Whatsapp you install it, run it once, and the Push Notification API handles the persistent connection and receiving messages without ever having to launch the app again. Or without even making sure it's running.

4) iMessage and BBM do the same thing, but those are nonstarters in a multi platform world. Neither service is going to go multi platform any time soon if ever.

Whatsapp is the Dropbox of messaging. Everything else just looks outdated and clunky in comparison.

That said, I'm really disappointed in Google. Google is positioning GTalk as a competitive advantage for Android. There is no reason there shouldn't be official GTalk clients on every platform. GTalk on iOS would be more popular than all of Google's other iOS apps combined.

<comment><USER3> Good analysis, I think you're right. Not having to sign into a service is a great way to get people to at least try it out; I've noticed some others start-ups doing this (Staticloud comes to mind) and I hope it's a trend that continues.

Google needs to consolidate it's messaging offering. Right now it has Google Talk, Google Voice, Google+ Huddles, and up until a few months ago, Disco.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> Good for them. 17 engineers, 3 support reps and 2 founders, organic viral growth based strictly on product merits - my kind of startup.

However.

Now taking bets which established IM company will sue them first and over which (trivial) patent. Perhaps after refusing their acquisition offer.

<comment><USER5> I'm concerned less about lawsuits and more about in-grown group messaging technology. iOS 5 just brought about half my friends/my entire family over to iMessages, which duplicate IM features like seeing the other person typing. It's so nifty that it makes me wish I had an iMessage interface on my computer, or an integration at least with iChat. And it makes me a much less likely user of mobile IM applications, because now I have a built-in equivalent that works without my searching out (or paying for) an application.

Which is too bad, because I wish we had more start-ups this honest. Make something somebody wants, charge them at a rate they're willing to pay. I'm increasingly sick of advertising models, and of start-ups that start with funding and then move towards a profit model (which is usually advertising).

<comment><USER6> WhatsApp still has one thing going for it that 'in-grown' tech does not - interoperability. BBM and iMessages only work on those platforms, WhatsApp transcends them.

<comment><USER7> The thing I don't like about WhatsApp vs BBM/iMessages is that I must share my phone number (at least I don't know another way) to chat. I think sharing a phone number is more personal than a pin like in BB.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> As a data point, I went on a tour of the AT&T Global network operations center (in NJ) in mid October, and they showed us some stats -- one I recall is 2.3B texts on the AT&T network in the past 24 hours. So WhatsApp is closing in on half of AT&T's SMS volume.

<https://twitter.com/#!/savraj/status/126718943179190272>

<comment><USER9> I guess AT&T texts are mostly one-to-one, while WhatsApp's has much larger proportion of one-to-many.

If one sending 1000 messages per day to a group of 1M - you get 1B (+1000) messages per day.

<comment><USER10> What is also very different is the way WhatsApp is used, as you break up messages in multiple bits sometimes, which doesn't matter because it's free anyway

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER11> I'm getting really tired of all these proprietary instant messaging solutions. It won't be long before people will realize they will at some point have to pay for usage of WhatsApp. When that happens, something else will gain traction, restarting the cycle again once more.

I hope Google just acquires WhatsApp already and opens up the platform. It's been years now, and about bloody time for something to appear that's the standard, open, cross-platform and free way of sending messages over the internet.

<comment><USER12> There is Jabber which GTalk uses. Unfortunately it doesn't really get traction.

<comment><USER13> Jabber is now XMPP which is a hugely used platform all over the internet for many many purposes including web and in-app messaging. It is fully interoperable between domains (if the server allows it).

<comment><USER11> It's actually also used by WhatsApp, only not in a way that suggests they will ever open up their service for federation (and why would they?).

So yeah, XMPP is part of the solution, but not if it's used in a closed off proprietary way.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER14> This is the perfect example for "picking pennies in front of a charging steamroller". IM is already chosen as infrastructure by platform makers (Apple, Facebook), given that they've integrated in into their offerings. This is the kind of startup that withers after the next platform update.

Do they have some secret sauce that enables them to offer way more value than a vanilla IM app ? That's their only escape route.

<comment><USER3> Facebook is the only platform company that can really "win" this. If they made messaging a bigger priority in their mobile apps they could very well own the market. At the moment Facebook apps are made to reflect the Facebook website with the newsfeed being the center of everything. This is a shame, but fixable. IMessage is a supplement for SMS, not a replacement.

<comment><USER15> Well, there is Facebook Messenger? It's pretty much the same as WhatsApp...

<comment><USER3> I wasn't aware of this app, looks like it's available for iOS, Android, and Blackberry. That indeed does sound like a winner.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER16> WhatsApp gives me a warm fuzzy feeling every time I use it, knowing that my messages are whizzing through an Erlang application running on FreeBSD.

<comment><USER17> Question: how do you know Whatsapp infrastructure intimately and if you do, can you elaborate on it more?

I am thoroughly interested in their backend. I've always wondered why the app is quite efficient across all platforms and have fantastic uptimes given their global scale/reach.

<comment><USER18> They didn't write it, but based on that they were hiring XMPP devs before, it's likely that they are running ejabberd.

<comment><USER17> Ahhh.. I've came across XMPP before but not ejabberd. Many thanks mate! I am working on a similar project which is why I'm fairly intrested.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER19> What i really hate is that everyone tries to convince me to use that app. Why? What benefits does it have? Only the drawback that i have to transmit every phone number in my address book to them. I don't want them to have my phone number and yet half a dozen people i know transferred it to them without my knowledge.

In short: There is XMPP, ICQ, MSN, Yahoo, Facebook, Skype, etc. Why the hell another one? And one that will cost.. i really don't get it..

Next best thing to happen will be that some big advertising company (see myspace) will buy them.. hooray...

</comment><comment><USER20> It's no different compared to other IM's. There are other players like Nimbuzz in this space from a long time and also for all platforms.

The only cool thing they did was getting your phone numbers and mapping those contacts to your address book.

This opens a whole new dimension.

IM is the next SMS 2.0. IM will be tightly integrated to our address books and the platform makers will all enter this space and Kill the others. Like the iMessage in iOS?

Today Platform is the king; content isn't.

<comment><USER3> All platforms can do here is make the experience easy when you stay on their platform. That is what IMessage does, make it transparent. Similar to how some carriers have "unlimited mobile-to-mobile" within their network.

</comment></comment><comment><USER21> > And it's used in 250 countries on 750 networks.

There aren't 250 countries in the world. Must be a typo?

<comment><USER9> Maybe they count each US state as a country?

</comment></comment><comment><USER22> While I prefer kik over WhatsApp because it's cleaner and free, I kinda like WhatsApp being paid and still growing much more than the free alternatives. This might be related to the ban kik had on Blackberry phones.

</comment><comment><USER23> Is it bad that I've never heard of this app or seen it been used in the wild before? The iPhone app looks really ugly, and I can't see myself convincing my friends to start using it if they have to pay for the app when we could just be using iMessage, SMS, or Facebook Messenger. What's the draw here?

<comment><USER24> iMessage is iOS only, SMS costs (unless its included in your plan) and requires phone reception (as opposed to just wifi), I find facebook messenger ends up with too many people on the web interface just saying hello to me as if I'm at my PC wanting to smalltalk.

The draw is its free per message, cross platform, internet based and is a direct replacement for sms/mms as opposed to being an existing chat program pushed onto mobile.

</comment></comment><comment><USER25> To those suggesting that messaging should be replaced by instant messengers: No thanks. WhatsApp, iMessage and this kind of solutions have one feature that they carry over from SMS that makes all the difference to me: they don't have the concept of presence.

I don't need to be "online" to receive messages, people don't know if I'm "online", "away", "offline", they just send me a message and they know I'll eventually get it. Exactly like email.

That is one great feature. How many times have you found yourself or your buddies "hacking" the status indicator because you don't want to give away your real status? I hate when people are always "away" or "busy":it makes the status indicator useless and I just came to ignore it, it is just that annoying thing that when it's gray it prevents me from messaging you.

If we just remove the status indicator, all that stress disappears. I don't want IM to replace SMS-like solutions.

<comment><USER26> Yes, the absence of a status indicator is a feature I really like as well. It takes time and attention to keep it up-to-date, which I simply don't bother with, so I am one of those people that is eternally 'busy' on other IMs.</comment></comment>


Goodbye Fossil - <AUTHOR> https://roy.marples.name/blog/goodbye-fossil <comment><USER2> I have found Fossil very good for solo version control. I swear by it, but then again I don't work in the industry.</comment>


New Technology 2013 - <AUTHOR> http://techod.com/new-technology-2013/ <comment><AUTHOR> I really can't wait for the Leap Motion to go on sale, technology is out of this world nowadays!!

What do you all think?</comment>


Turkish coup – bridges, social media blocked - <AUTHOR> http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36809083 <comment><USER2> Good live coverage also at the guardian. Latest news is that the military has full control.

[https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2016/jul/15/turkey- co...](https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2016/jul/15/turkey-coup-attempt- military-gunfire-ankara)

<comment><USER3> > Latest news is that the military has full control.

Is there a source for this other than the military itself? Because this is one of those situations where you can't really trust any reports until everything shakes out: right now the Turkish state media is, of course, claiming the coup has failed.

</comment></comment><comment><AUTHOR> Looks like social media is going down: [https://twitter.com/Holbornlolz/status/754044391656914944](https://twitter.com/Holbornlolz/status/754044391656914944)</comment>


Investing and Human Psychology - <AUTHOR> https://leveragethoughts.substack.com/p/investing-and-human-psychology?r=66m4g&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web&utm_source=hackernews <comment><AUTHOR> I wrote a post that can help people new to investing avoid a common investment trap</comment>


Getting up earlier by not eating late: anecdotal bodyhacking - <AUTHOR> http://www.trendpreneur.com/lifestyle/resetting-the-clock-successful-bodyhacking/

<comment><USER2> Try having kids you young whippersnappers. You won't have any problem waking up when your 1 and 3 year old are awake at 5-7am looking for breakfast. You also won't have any problem sleeping as I practically pass out every night once the last one is tucked in for the night.

<comment><USER3> Problems waking you up isn't a good solution to having a problem waking up.

<comment><USER4> I had to read that about 5 times. As a father of 2... I agree completely :)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> Interesting how physical activity is not showing up in any of these so called experiments. Why is this trend to outsmart the body? Give it a bit of work and you'll have a balance and energy that no wii fit and alarm clock can asses. No gadget nor habit can outperform a few push-ups with an intense workout or an energetic soccer game. Your body will tell you when it's time to sleep and when it's time to eat and believe me it will correlate with your working day.

Mens sana in corpore sano.

<comment><USER6> First, the article never explicitly states that the author didn't try exercise.

Second, getting up and exercising is a complementary behavior to changing your eating habits. Neither negates the other and both together are best.

With luck, the author will feel more energetic after the diet change, and will then be motivated to start an exercise program. (or just nail the early donut, _shrugs_ )

<comment><AUTHOR> I do exercise, but not as much as I'd like to. Half the trouble is finding time in a busy day when I still think of myself as horribly unfit (I recently lost 70 pounds and am a lot fitter than I used to be!).

One of the first things I tried to get my body clock sorted out was morning gym sessions, but I just couldn't afford the time or subscription cost.

<comment><USER7> Try morning jogs outside. Start slow. It does wonders for my energy level and clarity of thought for the rest of the day.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> I am going to definitely give this a shot. As a side note... typically after a rough night of drinking I automatically wake up super super early in the morning... Like if my typical routine is sleeping at 4+am and getting up close to noon every day... after a rough drinking binge I'll be up bright and early at 8-9.

That's clearly not the answer to my problems but there have been certain occasions where when I know that I need to be up early I'll drink a six pack before going to bed.

This might not have anything to do with the alcohol, it might simply be because of the fact that I really need to take a piss when I get up. Or it's that combined with the fact that alcohol dehydrates you... so my body is waking itself up not out of hunger but out of thirst?

Just something I thought I would point out... maybe someone else shares this feeling?

Note: I too am writing this at 3:28 am, hah. Time for bed! I ate around... 10pm :|

<comment><USER8> Note 2 of 2: Apparently others feel this sentiment as well, I should have done a better job scanning the replies before posting.

</comment></comment><comment><USER9> The original Buddhist monastic precepts required that food be restricted to one meal a day before noon. It's a good way to live, but I've only ever kept it up for a couple of months at any one time. It's socially restrictive.

<comment><USER10> i believe that the key is no to not be in excess, to truly be minimalistic about it, and not a slave to impulse.

here in california, we often expend more energy in our daily routines, rest less, and use up more mental energy doing all our problem solving and anxieties and such, than would be the case if we were practicing mindfulness most of the day, instead of feeding into our concerns (attachments) to the various things we do. during mindfulness and zazen, the mind goes into a different mode, which is in many ways, rejuvenating in itself, but this is not the case with how we - or at least i - approach problems at work.

comprehending why a practice is done, and then being true to your comprehensions is where it is at, and it is not in mimicking the implementations/practices of others.

</comment></comment><comment><USER11> My sleeping schedule is unimpressed by my eating schedule.

On the other hand, obeying the golden rule in the article helps me lose weight. I tracked my weight for the past 4 months with the Wii Fit, and there's pretty good correlation between not eating 12 hours before wake-up time and the day-to-day weight delta.

My bottom line: the rule about not eating too late helps, one way or another.

<comment><USER12> The explanation I have heard for this is that your metabolism (which break down molecules into smaller units and release energy) slows down some hours before you go to bed.

</comment></comment><comment><USER13> When you eat near bedtime you get much less restfull sleep during the first part of the night (i.e. the most important part of the night for sleep) because your metabolism is still active digesting the food.

Simple as that.

</comment><comment><USER14> I wonder if the converse may be more true: that by eating you extend your sleep cycle for longer. I find if having to do multiple long nights, no matter how fit I am I have to eat to keep up energy.

I find the more tired, the more sugary stuff I crave.

<comment><USER15> When you're pulling long days or all nighters, you need to watch your diet. It's easy to eat too much and gain weight. At the same time, if you're really only sleeping 4 hours a night, then you need extra calories to burn for those extra waking hours.

<comment><USER14> Definitely. I usually up the volume of short intervals (tabata) when doing this type of work - less time training than usual and more metabolic effect.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER16> anecdotal counterpoint: Last night was a session of midnight gluttony. I ate a 12" pizza, an order of fried calamari, lots of miscellaneous finger food, four beers and two mojitos. I was asleep about 2:30 am and awoke about 6 am. I drank lots of water so alcohol dehydration was not likely the cause. Usually I go to sleep around around 2 am and wake up at 7-8 am. Make of this what you will.

<comment><USER17> Pregnant?

<comment><USER16> Well I'm not sure how dangerous it really is to drink booze while gravid, but it's one form of self-experimentation I wouldn't recommend. There's plenty of _real_ experimentation establishing the risk of things like fetal alcohol syndrome etc.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER18> This seems (externally) similar to the idea of drinking lots of water so that you'll have to wake up to take a piss - except here it's being hungry that's waking you up.

My problem with sleeping, though, is falling asleep - I can wake up when I need to with sufficient alarms, but getting to sleep when I need to can be tough. There is one time when I have trouble waking up, though - after flying. However, I tend to take day flights, and doing this would end up with a day of my fasting in a widebody air plane, which would take an already-unhappy me to a whole new level.

</comment><comment><USER19> I'm writing this at 4AM, completely off-kilter sleep schedule, so I will definitely be giving this a try from tomorrow. Other suggestions I've heard are to turn off the computer an hour before you sleep, but it's always very difficult for me to tear myself away - but not eating, that's something I can manage easily enough.

Also, step three is, in my recent experience, deadly. You'll either miss/delay the meeting, or it will be a painful hour or so while others expect you to be thinking hard.

<comment><USER20>
      turn off the computer an hour before you sleep, but it's
      always very difficult for me to tear myself away - but not
      eating, that's something I can manage easily enough.

You know, that's a potential health issue in its own. The key is to strike a balance.

<comment><USER19> Well, of course, I didn't mean to stop eating entirely. Just after 8PM, as suggested in the article. That seems easy enough.

I agree with you regarding the health issues of spending too much time on a computer deeply absorbed in a problem. Ignoring one's basic needs becomes almost the default.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER21> To the people talking about alcohol: it has a well-known disruptive effect on the second half of the sleep cycle. It makes you wake up earlier with less REM sleep. (For example, [http://www.websciences.org/cftemplate/NAPS/archives/indiv.cf...](http://www.websciences.org/cftemplate/NAPS/archives/indiv.cfm?ID=19972321.))

</comment><comment><USER22> The only thing that has worked for me is setting the alarm for when I want to wake up, getting myself out of bed, getting ready for the day, then leaving. Get away from the bed. That's the key.

I can sleep much longer than eight hours if I can just lay in the bed. Get up, get out, get going.

</comment><comment><USER23> I've been having success doing this for a few years. The next thing I should try is experimenting with different fluids before sleeping. A glass of water would be a good start ... maybe an Emergen-C packet to vary.

</comment><comment><USER24> Anecodotally, I've experienced this too. I fast from food from time to time, and whenever I do, I'm ready to sleep earlier at night and ready to get up earlier the next morning.

</comment><comment><USER25> I should try this strategy. I haven't woken up before 2 PM for over a month now.</comment>


Brexit and the IT Sector - <AUTHOR> https://cloudscapeit.co.uk/brexit-and-it-technology/ <comment><USER2> It's funny how all of the threats of Brexit basically involve the EU increasing prices and making it extremely difficult for the UK to do business with other EU members.

Yet, nobody blames the EU. The EU is a bully and starting to become like a de facto federal government for the entire European Union.

I'm glad they had the courage to leave the EU now, which will result in some short-term pain...but much better in the long run. I hope other countries follow suit.

<comment><USER3> Except this article starts off with a counter-example to your assertion:

"one of the main selling points of Brexit is that it will reduce immigration into Britain. Naturally, obtaining a visa will become more difficult for those outside of Britain and this could have a huge impact on the resources available."

and has another counter-example:

"UK data protection will no longer have to match existing EU regulations, so this could seriously impact the free flow of data between the two. Without the freedom to share information easily or legally, firms in the IT sector are going to find that communication and business with their most local export markets could be seriously hampered."</comment></comment>


Shared Components Across Multiple Laravel/Lumen Micro-Services - <AUTHOR> https://medium.com/@stomt/shared-components-across-multiple-laravel-lumen-micro-services-44ebee128fa1#.rao5hhryd <comment><AUTHOR> Feel free to ask questions and give feedback on our approach.</comment>


How to Sell a Product That is Still in Prototype - <AUTHOR> http://nerdbusiness.com/blog/how-sell-product-still-prototype

<comment><USER2> An interesting article. The concept of asking to pay for a trial, and a trial of a prototype at that, seems a bit weird for me, though. I don't know I would pay for this. I've come to expect that trials are free, especially of new services.

<comment><AUTHOR> Same here, beta releases of major games and operating systems are free to select people; and I'm about to do a beta release of my company's first product to which I'll give access for free.

</comment></comment><comment><AUTHOR> Apologies if this was submitted in the past - couldn't find it after a quick search.

Definitely an interesting article.</comment>


Ask HN: Do we need caffeine? - <AUTHOR>

Whenever I sleep for less than 8 or so hours, I feel really tired the next day and have trouble getting out of bed. This is true even if I sleep for slightly less, like 6 hours. In fact, even if I sleep for 8 hours, I still get really tired before many of my friends at night.
Many people I know past college sleep 6 or less hours a night and appear to be doing fine. But of these people, 100% are habitual caffeine consumers.
I have read some articles and journals in the past (sorry, no sources off hand) that claim that caffeine comes with a list of side effects, some of which effect your ability to think at the highest levels, and this has always prevented me from becoming a caffeine consumer.
But I have been wondering lately if it is physically possible to be someone who runs off 5-6 hours of sleep a night and never consume caffeine. As hackers who like to work on their own projects before work or late at night, this seems of particular interest to people around here.
Has anyone had any personal success (no myths please) extending the amount of productive, awake hours you get each day? Or do you believe that we need caffeine to live this lifestyle? <comment><USER2> I do drink coffee every day, but I haven't found Caffeine to increase my overall amount of wakefulness. It just gives me a bit more control over it. I actually analogize caffeine to a high interest loan.

I think a lot of hackers consume it the way I do. Start out with moderate amounts, then increase the intake week by week for a while, then cut way back (sometimes with some withdrawal symptoms) then repeat. When used this way, I think it's fairly appealing because you're essentially spending future alertness as you go, making for longer stretches or better focus, but then after a while you have to catch up, sleep extra, and re-calibrate to low/no caffeine or else you may end up with stomach irritation, jitters, insomnia, etc.

I'm not sure whether it impairs high level cognitive functioning. It does help me focus better, and I have found that my most focused state is not always my most creative, but I always assumed that's unique to me.

</comment><comment><USER3> When you're in your twenties, you could eat styrofoam and still function appropriately. I like to believe I can still do what I used to do in my twenties...just can't do it as often.

A twenty minute nap in the middle of the day is hugely beneficial. Just enough to not get into deep REM. I read somewhere, maybe it was apocryphal, DaVinci or Michelangelo would doze off with a spoon in their hand, over a metal platter. When they were just about to fall into deep sleep, the spoon would fall out and hit the platter and wake them up.

We don't NEED caffeine but in moderation it is no more detrimental than working at your desk. [http://www.informationweek.com/news/hardware/showArticle.jht...](http://www.informationweek.com/news/hardware/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=197006785)

</comment><comment><USER4> Most studies I read on caffeine are either inconclusive or they contradict other studies done on the subject.

So there is basically only one good way to find if caffeine works for you. Try it. But do it scientifically an be strict about it. Try different drinking patterns and amounts during different weeks. Write down your experiences. This is important.

From my personal experience it helps me to stabilize my wake and sleep cycle. I am more awake during the day and get more tired at night, which is a good thing. I might add that I only dring 2 cups daily and I never drink coffee after 3:00 pm.

</comment><comment><USER5> I have monitored my caffeine intake for quite a while and keep it down to 1-2 cups a day.

For the past week or so, I find it extremely beneficial at around 3-4 pm when it gives me the boost required for me to shift from low energy items to high concentration items.

I guess it might be possible to work without caffeine, but you would have to get a trigger to switch yourself from low energy to high energy zone, good substitutes could be a walk, workout, a game of foosball etc.

</comment><comment><USER6> I know people who drink 5-6 cups a day and are able to be quite productive with strangely little sleep, but it's never worked for me, so either I'm missing something or it doesn't work the same way on me. For me, a single cup of coffee, or occasionally two, can help me feel a bit more awake and energetic. But once it gets to 3+, I get jittery and can't concentrate--- have to get up and go for a walk outside or something.

</comment><comment><USER7> I have 4-5 a day and I have no trouble in sleeping (sleep well from 1am to 6-7am). Actually, I work better when I wake up early and work during the day then working at night and sleeping in the afternoon. When I was younger, I use to work late, at night, but I was wasting my time procrastinating and doing side-stuffs than just focusing on my task.

</comment><comment><USER8> This seems to be the general opinion of the specialists: The amount of sleep a person needs is not universal. If you don't sleep what _you_ need you'll be harming yourself, and abusing coffee will only worsen things.

</comment><comment><USER9> how refreshed you are when you wake up is more a function of when you wake up relative to your sleep cycles. you can do two things -- set yourself a consistent, permanent sleep schedule (always go to bed and wake up at the same time), or research your own sleep patterns to try and determine about when you hit phase 2 non-REM sleep, and set your alarm clock accordingly.

</comment><comment><USER10> <http://lesswrong.com/lw/1w1/effects_of_caffeine/>

</comment><comment><USER11> Caffeine is a complex substance, its interaction with your body is going to have a personal element.

Some of its properties: it is a diuretic, a vitamin C inhibitor, it increases your blood pressure.

Anadin Extra is merely Anadin with added caffeine.

So you should treat it with appropriate measures. Just saying it affects sleep from its stimulation effects is not the whole story.

Your body has a daily cycle. I would contend that staying up after midnight creates more imbalance than not. "Early to bed, early to rise makes a man healthy, wealthy and wise" is not as glib a suggestion as it sounds.

I know from direct experience as my doctor told me "go to bed before midnight and throw away your alarm clock" and I've thanked him for it ever since.

Back to the coffee : I've experiemented with it on myself. My results are "no more than 1 litre fresh ground a day (about 30g of beans I think), all before 14:00hrs".

And if you want to lose weight, drink it right after meals.

<comment><USER8> >I know from direct experience as my doctor told me "go to bed before midnight and throw away your alarm clock" and I've thanked him for it ever since.

I wish I could be a morning person. I've been trying for years. I started running first thing in the morning, and I loved it. I would give up sex for it.

What ends up happening is, I start sleeping 4-6h each night and become sleep deprived. After 3-5 months I'm burned off.

Now, my neurologyst, who does sleep research, says it will be probably impossible to make me a morning person. She put me on melatonin and english breakfasts, and on a 10-to-2-AM cycle, and I found out about a new state of being, well rested and fresh.

So, that may not be possibility for everyone...</comment></comment>


Show HN: Send real postcards like updating your social media - <AUTHOR> https://bird.cards <comment><AUTHOR> Story (problem) I'm Dave the developer of Bird. I created Bird because of my aunt (Truus she's 86) She has never been online and doesn't own a smartphone or computer . When I moved to a different country I couldn't come by every week, like I normally did. So I started to send her pictures/updates via postcards. But all apps I tried weren't as easy as updating friends and family that do live on the internet.

Solution I build an app (without code on Bubble.is) that allows you:

1\. Upload a photo from any device 2\. Add an address & message (max 240 characters) 3\. Send the postcard

Plans The plan for Bird is to make it so complete as possible but keep the UX as simple as possible. Currently, I'm building an iOS & Android app so Bird is even easier to use on mobile devices.

\- Edit the photo you upload \- Multiple photos on a grid \- Mobile Apps \- More options for sizes \- Pre-designed cards

Authentic Use Bird to send postcards, as easy as you update your social media status. Update your friends and family, be authentic.

Like paying for a latte Send a custom postcard for the price of a latte. (€2,79)

Shipping Bird ships your postcard wherever you like. Enjoy free worldwide shipping.

Environment For every ten postcards, we send. We plant a new tree.

Size The postcards are 4x6" (10x15cm) Let me know if you would like to have more options.</comment>


Proof School - <AUTHOR> http://proofschool.org/

<comment><USER2> I have met and corresponded with one of the Proof School founders, Paul Zeitz, and I am very encouraged by this effort to build a school in the United States with a deep mathematics curriculum. (There are already schools with deep mathematical curricula in China and in Russia.) Zeitz is very thoughtful about mathematics education, and one of his stories has become an inspiration to my local students.[1]

[1] [http://www.epsiloncamp.org/CourageandStupidity.php](http://www.epsiloncamp.org/CourageandStupidity.php)

<comment><AUTHOR> Trying to find courage in the face of stupidity sounds like the story of my life :)</comment></comment>


Video Games in Communist East Germany [video] - <AUTHOR> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b7xndvitLa8 <comment><AUTHOR> I've always wondered why muck around with GitHub when they can just share source code via magazines that are delivered through the postal service, like these guys were.</comment>


Display of structured directed graphs? - <AUTHOR>

I manage a few global ERP systems. I constantly get requests to display things like our supply chain graphically. Essentially the data is a directed graph, e.g., make A at plant X, ship a to Y, process A to B at Y ... etc. All the libraries I've seen make it quite simple to do a force directed graph depicting this, but what if you want to structure the nodes, e.g., vertically align steps based on material type or process step. Any solutions for something like this, or libraries that are well-suited for this sort of customization? I'm aware of things like sigma, d3, etc. I'm more looking for which solutions like this best fit the problem. <comment><USER2> Not sure if this could help you, but the graph migration in the south ORM for django might be a useful starting point if you can code in python. Basically it outputs an image representing the relations in a database. If you took the part above the database out it might fit your needs.

[http://south.readthedocs.org/en/latest/commands.html#graphmi...](http://south.readthedocs.org/en/latest/commands.html#graphmigrations)</comment>


Jevons Paradox - <AUTHOR> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jevons_paradox <comment><USER4> People view technology as a deus ex machina that will enable them to keep doing what they're doing but magically it won't pollute any more.

For example, many think that solar powered planes will enable flying without pollution, which somehow justifies their current flying. The "logic" doesn't work, but they just want a story to help them sleep at night while they read that the arctic is 45 degrees above normal, knowing somewhere in the backs of their minds that the jet fuel they paid to burn to move their share of a plane around the world and back contributed more to that climate change than nearly anyone in hundreds of thousands of years of human existence.

Technology has helped humanity out of many problems, as have markets and economic growth. Now we're facing problems that technology, markets, and growth are _causing_ (extinctions, resource depletion, pollution, litter, climate change, etc), Jevon's paradox contributing significantly (the tragedy of the commons and principle agent problem being others) and people haven't realized that applying more of what solved other problems isn't helping but _exacerbating_ current problems.

Technology can buy us time, but systems change generally requires changing the goals and beliefs driving the system, which are social and emotional issues, not technological.

<comment><USER5> > many think that solar powered planes will enable flying without pollution, > which somehow justifies their current flying.

That's an incredibly silly thing to think, where do you come across such people?

>applying more of what solved other problems isn't helping but exacerbating current problems.

While possible in principle, I don't see that happening. Installing LED lights doesn't lead to people using _more_ electricity. Driving electric cars doesn't lead to more driving. And it seems that switching jets to synthetic/biofuels won't lead to more flying.

Jevon's paradox does not apply everywhere, just where there's supply restricted usage.

Further, technology is disconnecting carbon intensity and even energy intensity from GDP. The connection between these was an article of faith for prior generations, both from conservationists and economic conservatives, but it is changing now.

We need to rethink plans in light of these changing fundamentals: Jevon's paradox happens many places but not everywhere, and economic activity is going to be disconnected from carbon intensity.

<comment><USER4> > Installing LED lights doesn't lead to people using more electricity.

My quick research suggests otherwise.

The first result when I searched on "people with led lights use more electricity" was _The Lighting Paradox: Cheaper, Efficient LEDs Save Energy, and People Use More_ [https://insideclimatenews.org/news/20082015/lighting- paradox...](https://insideclimatenews.org/news/20082015/lighting-paradox- cheaper-efficient-led-save-energy-use-rises).

It linked to research results including:

"A 2010 study looked at lighting use around the world for the past 300 years as lighting technology improved from whale oil lamps to gas and kerosene lamps to electric incandescent bulbs. The study [http://www.sandia.gov/~jytsao/tsao_jy_2010_04_app_for_light_...](http://www.sandia.gov/~jytsao/tsao_jy_2010_04_app_for_light_LEUKOS.pdf), conducted by researchers at Sandia National Laboratories in Albuquerque, New Mexico found a direct relationship between decreased cost and increased consumption."

and

"A study published earlier this year in the Journal of Industrial Ecology [http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/jiec.12281/abstra...](http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/jiec.12281/abstract) concluded we will likely see a drop in energy use for residential lighting in the short term, but energy savings will likely be reduced or perhaps eliminated entirely as the amount of lit space increases.

"It's not just a question of turning on a light to read a book or to see something on your kitchen counter, you can do lots of stuff with LEDs that you really couldn't do very well with other kinds of artificial light sources," said Theis, a co-author of the study. "They are being incorporated into wearable lighting now, there is just no end to it.""

I didn't look up electric cars, but I expect to find similar research there. I'm pretty sure I read in HN that ride sharing is leading to more traffic.

I agree Jevon's paradox doesn't happen everywhere, but it looks like it does in your first proposed counterexample. It happens a lot.

<comment><USER6> The authors of that paper are estimating that energy use for lighting will eventually reach past levels because of the rebound effect and population growth, not Jevon's paradox.

Jevon's paradox occurs when an increase in efficiency results in so much additional use that per capita energy consumption increases. If the average car is made twice as efficient and that leads to it being driven three times it's annual mileage, that's Jevon's. If it's driven one and a half times it's annual mileage, that's the rebound effect.

<comment><USER4> > Jevon's paradox occurs when an increase in efficiency results in so much > additional use that per capita energy consumption increases.

They also describe that we are lighting things we didn't use to light, keeping the lights on longer ( not just households but decorative building lights, decorative bridge lights, etc), and other per capita increases.

The quote above states per capita increases clearly:

> "It's not just a question of turning on a light to read a book or to see > something on your kitchen counter, you can do lots of stuff with LEDs that > you really couldn't do very well with other kinds of artificial light > sources," said Theis, a co-author of the study. "They are being incorporated > into wearable lighting now, there is just no end to it."

The Sandia article also states clearly about per-capita increases, " _No empirical evidence is found for a saturation in per-capita consumption of light_ "

> We have collected and self-consistently analyzed data for per-capita > consumption of artificial light, per-capita gross domestic product, and > ownership cost of light. The data span a wide range (three centuries, six > continents, five lighting technologies, and five orders of magnitude), and > are consistent with a linear variation of per-capita consumption of light > with the ratio between per-capita gross domestic product and ownership cost > of light. No empirical evidence is found for a saturation in per-capita > consumption of light, even in contemporary developed nations.

<comment><USER6> Per-capita light use does increase. In order for Jevon's paradox to apply, per capita energy use would have to increase more than the decrease from improved efficiency. So if LEDs are ten times more efficient, per capita light use would have to increase by 10+ times for Jevon's to apply.

Putting it another way, Jevon's is just an example of the rebound effect where more energy is used after the efficiency improvement than before. It can happen, but it's not very common.

If people were to switch to LEDs and their energy consumption dropped to a tenth of what it was, they could triple the number of lights in their house, leave those lights on 24/7/365 (as opposed to for 8 hours a day), and still be using less energy than with incandescents. That's the rebound effect. If they quadruple the number of lights and triple the time those lights are on, they would use more energy than they did before the switch to LEDs. That's Jevon's paradox.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> One can observe that, on a global level, CO2 emissions have never been higher.

In other words, not only have we not made progress, we have gone backwards. I believe Jevon's paradox is a major cause, along with a lack of understanding of it.

A clearer way of presentint Jevon's paradox is: price decline, usage increases. Which is such a standard economic statement that it hardly needs saying. The unintuitive part of the paradox is that we measure the price of a unit of energy, not what we can do with it.

I think the best way to combat this is to negotiate for countries to implement a tax on carbon.

Negotiating for emissions reductions directly causes problems: you are asking countries to slow their growth. So, they will look for solutions. Increasing efficieny is the natural way, to get more use out of the CO2 you're allowed to use. But then....every unit of CO2 is suddenly more tempting.

Hence, our emissions have gone up, not down. There's just so much you can do with it now!

If countries agreed to tax carbon, that tax would deal with the externality caused by carbon emissions, and give an incentive to develop non-carbon electricity.

This is so obviously the market based solution that I am baffled more people don't advocate for it. It doesn't even have to raise overall taxes. You just cut the income tax or corporate tax to compensate.

</comment><comment><USER8> People sometimes confuse the Jevons Paradox with rebound effects in general. Reminder: "The Jevons paradox occurs when the rebound effect is greater than 100%, exceeding the original efficiency gains."

"People save on electricity by replacing incandescent lights with LED lights, and _also_ make their living rooms 25% brighter at the same time" is an example of a rebound effect. Some of the efficiency gain on the input side is offset by increased output consumption. But it's not an example of the Jevons Paradox. If you replace light sources with ones that are 5x as efficient, you'd have to also use _more than 5x as much_ lighting as before to qualify as a Jevons Paradox.

The Jevons Paradox is a specific, fairly narrow, empirically observable phenomenon. Fatalistic notions that technological efficiency improvements can't reduce per-capita energy consumption, "because of Jevons Paradox," are not empirically supported. Energy rebound effects are common, but when the rebound is less than 100% (as it usually is) then there are real net energy savings and it's not a Jevons Paradox.

</comment><comment><USER9> I suppose a nice example would be city lights. There was an article lately about how electrical consumption for city lights increased despite the switch to LEDs.

Can't quite find the article though, but here is one about light pollution increasing (which does not necessarily correlate with electrical consumption, but still):

[https://www.cbsnews.com/news/light-pollution-increasing- arou...](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/light-pollution-increasing-around- globe/)

<comment><USER10> > There was an article lately about how electrical consumption for city lights > increased despite the switch to LEDs.

Its something like a 6x reduction in electric usage vs incandescent, how would people manage to use 6x more light?

OR was this a switch from CFL to LED that led to more usage?

<comment><USER11> Most streetlamps had been HID lamps for a long time:

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High- intensity_discharge_lamp](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High- intensity_discharge_lamp)

Efficiency was one reason for this, but the bigger reason was just that (for the duty cycle of a streetlamp) they require fewer installations and last _way_ longer than incandescent bulbs. This means that the maintenance costs are much lower.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> A related concept in microeconomics: The Giffen Good [0]

0: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giffen_good](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giffen_good)

</comment><comment><USER13> If you _make it easy_ for someone to take an inch, they take a mile, even if they only took a foot before.

</comment><comment><USER14> So, if, for instance, the price of energy dropped to zero, people's consumption of it would become infinite. And ditto for anything else that people use. For some reason I find that rather improbable.

<comment><USER15> I don't think this applies to division by zero.

But I expect that in general, for most things humans consume, as efficiency has increased, consumption has increased too.

</comment></comment><comment><USER16> Which is why you need an energy tax to actually reduce consumption.

<comment><USER17> But why would we need to reduce consumption? We need _emissions_ tax -- a tax proportional to the environmental cost. If power consumption carried little or no environmental cost, we'd want to use a huge amount, and that wouldn't be an issue.

<comment><USER18> Renewable energy has an environmental cost as well.

The solar and wind energy that isn't currently used by humans is dissipated by atmospheric, marine, geological and biological processes.

It is a zero-sum game, and increasing our consumption will disrupt other processes.

<comment><USER17> > It is a zero-sum game, and increasing our consumption will disrupt other > processes.

You need to define what you mean by "being a zero-sum game". For example, in terms of entropy (which is a possible metric in the context of "dissipation") it isn't a zero-sum game -- certain processes increase entropy more, some less. In terms of total instantaneous thermal absorption, which defines the temperature of the Earth, it also isn't a zero-sum game -- If there was a white surface and it is made black, then the temperature of the Earth will rise; the same goes for emitting CO2 which in effect increases the global absorptivity (energy that wouldn't be absorbed if the Earth didn't contain as much GHG). Putting solar cells in barren deserts isn't going to disrupt local lifeforms simply because there aren't any. So it seems in almost every definition of zero-sum it indeed isn't a zero-sum game -- which is good!

Note that I didn't claim renewable energy has no environmental cost. It most definitely has. Every activity will have certain impacts, greater or lower, on resource availability, thermal balance, and on other lifeform habitats. The key is pricing adequately those impacts so any damage could be repaired or compensated. The effect of pricing is usually just impact minimization, since the cost of repair or compensation is usually much greater than prevention.

So it is a matter of seeking technologies that give the greatest return (power output in this case) for total cost (environmental and economic) -- and better alternatives than current ones are constantly being discovered, thankfully.

<comment><USER18> The sun output and the earth surface are constant, that's the zero sum resources I was talking about.

> Putting solar cells in barren deserts isn't going to disrupt local lifeforms > simply because there aren't any.

No, but it will cool down the places, which will affect winds patterns and rainfall, which can in turn affect life forms at a distance. I suppose you could paint the ground around the pannels black, and carefully chose the panel/reflector density to have a neutral thermal effect.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER19> To the best of my knowledge, coal consumption reduced eventually, and exactly technology apparently did play some role.

<comment><USER15> Coal consumption increased steadily since 1865 and is almost at its all time high right now. There was a tiny dip in the last few years, but oil consumption is still increasing.

</comment></comment><comment><USER20> Are cars going to be an example of this? New electric cars are more fuel efficient but they will have so much processing and laser power (for autonomous driving) that they will actually consume more energy.

</comment><comment><USER21> This offers an interesting take on Moore's law.

</comment><comment><USER22> Applying this paradox in reverse (which is paraphrasing the wiki article) - <USER2> introducing energy efficiency measures causes energy use to go down then someone needs to ask probing questions about what is going on. Increased efficiency should be linked, all else equal, to increased use of a resource.

<comment><USER23> It's not hard to find examples where this "rule" doesn't seem to hold. If you give me water heated for free, I may shower twice on some days, but I will not take infinite hot showers. If you gave me shoes that cause less ablation of the pavement I walk on, I wouldn't find other ways to remove the same amount of material, I would simply use up less resources wherever I go, being none the wiser.

<comment><USER22> Actually, Jeveron's paradox would hold in the case you mentioned. Someone who gave you heated water would give it to you _with an implicit quota_ otherwise a rational actor use an infinite amount of it.

If I actually had free no-holds-barred heated water, I'd run a pipe down to the local laundry and sell it at a profit. That is the rational response - <USER3> reason you don't see people doing that is because nobody offers free heated water at scale.

Your mistake here is thinking that resources have an implicit purpose (hot water => warm showers). If that were true, Jeveron's paradox would not hold. The paradox holds because once something becomes more abundant, it can be used for totally new activities.

<comment><USER24> If hot water were free, you couldn't sell it. There is a point at which people don't need more water; they aren't Singularity-minded water maximizers.

<comment><USER25> In communist countries, hot water was sort of free i.e. the cost was shared. People were having open windows during winter in order to have fresh air and heating in order to have warmth, also heating outside as a by-product :) . Hot water usage went drastically down in building where capitalist rules were introduced and water meters were installed per flat.</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment>


The iPad Pro as main computer for a programmer - <AUTHOR> https://jann.is/ipad-pro-for-programming/ <comment><USER2> For frontend web developers like me, the last big thing I miss is the web inspector. Ain't gonna get anything done without that.

<comment><USER3> [https://www.macstories.net/news/web-tools-a-web-inspector- fo...](https://www.macstories.net/news/web-tools-a-web-inspector-for-ipad/)

Not ideal, but it's one option that's out there.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> I did this as well last year: [https://www.reddit.com/r/apple/comments/4db0ce/so_i_used_the...](https://www.reddit.com/r/apple/comments/4db0ce/so_i_used_the_129_ipad_pro_as_a_computer_for_two)

I thought it was going to be perfect since it's much lighter and thinner than a Surface Pro 4.

You _need_ a remote server for this to work, since you won't get access to the underlying shell without jailbreaking. Depending on reliable networks was mistake #1.

Also, while Panic was a good enough terminal emulator, its redrawing was unreliable when switching from app to app. This might have changed with iOS 11, but it bugged me to no end before.

Lastly, I learned that much of the web (and some apps in particular, namely Remote Desktop) still thinks that you have a mouse. I used Cloudcraft when it first came out to draw some diagrams for an interview. I straight-up _could not_ do it without a mouse, and iOS (stubbornly) does not support mousing. This on top of buggy CMD+TAB functionality and some apps straight up not working without a mouse ended the experiment for me.

</comment><comment><USER5> The Apple USB Camera adapter[1] would let you connect your Ergodox to the iPad. If you need power too there's a USB 3 version with an extra lightning port.

[1]: [https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MD821AM/A/lightning-to- us...](https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MD821AM/A/lightning-to-usb-camera- adapter)

<comment><AUTHOR> I wasn't aware, that's pretty cool! Thanks!

</comment></comment><comment><USER6> Please tell more about how you find the Apple Pencil useful. It seems like the exact opposite end of the spectrum from a tmux toolset.

</comment><comment><USER7> After I returned a MBP '17 (twice) because of the horrible keyboard I also switched to an iPad. I'm still a student so all I need to do is write code in an editor and SSH into my Mac or Pi to compile/run it. It works great, and it's a huge step up from my non-retina MBP that's now a desktop computer.

The only two things I have not been able to replace is (yup..) the proprietary Xcode for the occasional venture into iOS development, and oddly enough: Sketch. You'd expect that the iPad is the perfect device for a Sketch-type app (bar 3rd-party plugins..), but nothing ticks all the boxes just yet.

An interesting advantage of iOS that I find is the focus gained. It feels as though switching to a different app requires more deliberate thought than on macOS. I used to do 9 things at once and completely lose my train of thought in all of them and I have less of that on iOS. Or I suffer from Stockholm's Syndrome, that could also be it.

</comment><comment><USER8> The containerised terminal toolset is really nice idea.

There's some value in using a hybrid approach with a lightweight laptop though the iPad Pro offers a pencil and probably better battery life.

<comment><AUTHOR> Yeah, the only really useful thing that came out of this is the my shell docker image with everything I need. That way you can use the iPad if you really have (or want) to, and your normal computers otherwise.

</comment></comment><comment><USER9> Next up: twisting your environment into a pretzel to use Apple Watch as your main computer for programming!

<comment><AUTHOR> Way ahead of you!

</comment></comment><comment><USER10> I wouldn't use it as my main computer, but I've gone to Hackathons with a cheap Android tablet, wireless mouse, and keyboard. It's a lot of fun unless you get one (like the 2nd gen Nexus 7) that can't do Bluetooth and Wi-Fi reliably at the same time.

</comment><comment><USER11> And running stuff on a server? So the iPad Pro, as an interface to the main computer?

<comment><USER12> Yeah this is not working with the iPad as main computer, it's just routing stuff to the main computer THROUGH an ipad.

<comment><AUTHOR> I have almost that sentence in the blog post, search for mainframe or terminal.

<comment><USER12> Then read your title again. You're not using the iPad as a main computer, so don't name your blog post that.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER13> Please share your Dockerfile

<comment><AUTHOR> [https://github.com/jayniz/zsh-tmux-neovim- docker](https://github.com/jayniz/zsh-tmux-neovim-docker)</comment></comment>


I took the world's first 20-hour flight. Here's what it did to me - <AUTHOR> https://www.latimes.com/business/story/2019-10-19/i-just-took-the-worlds-first-20-hour-flight-heres-what-it-did-to-me <comment><USER2> However, non-stop flights from NY to Sydney still seem to be quite far away from being a profitable business:

> _But don't go booking your round-the-world flights just yet. Qantas needs > new planes from Boeing or Airbus SE that can do the job with a full load of > passengers [all the economy-class seats were empty on this flight], and a > new deal with crew to work longer than 20 hours. "It needs everything to > come together," Joyce says. He initially had dreams of turning these super- > long flights into flying hotels, with sleeping berths or a work-out zone. > That vision gave way to reality when profit margins proved too tight to > waste space on such luxuries._

> _Our plane doesn't have the range to haul a full load of passengers with > luggage to Sydney. It took off with its fuel tanks maxed out — about 101 > tons. To keep the weight down, there's no cargo, and food and drink are > limited. In New York, the captain had seemed confident we'd make it to > Sydney with gas to spare. He planned on landing with six tons of fuel, > enough to stay airborne for another 90 minutes._

</comment><comment><USER3> I don't seem to be able to read the article - it won't scroll for me at all. Arrow keys, PgUp, PgDn, End, no scroll bars, nothing.

Is it just me? What am I doing wrong?

Using the latest Firefox on Ubuntu on a laptop.

 _Edit ..._

So I did this:

      % wget $URL -O x.html
      % lynx -dump x.html | less

Does anyone else want the results?</comment>


What's really going on in OneDrive for Business - <AUTHOR> http://www.zdnet.com/whats-really-going-on-in-onedrive-for-business-7000029002/

<comment><USER2> OneDrive for Business is really just sharepoint. Sharepoint has always done this.

<comment><USER3> The name really hints at the product being like OneDrive, but for businesses. Why didn't they call it sharepoint365 or something :-/</comment></comment>


Show HN: Space Shooter in QBasic - Jean-Philipe https://github.com/strathausen/qtrek.bas <comment><AUTHOR> Looking at the demo without running it yet, that looks amazing. It reminds me a lot of the QBasic game Outer Space Wars that I wrote when I was 14, having taught myself QBasic from reading a book checked out from the local library. I too made a font editor using some crazy string manipulation to make up for not yet understanding the modulus operator at the time. I so need to try to find those disks and take a look back at some of the first code I ever wrote as a fledgling self-taught teenage programmer.

OP, thank you for bringing back the memories.

To younger programmers, Internet access was not quite a thing that I had access to then. Before my dad got AOL, I was only allowed to log into the county library BBS and not any public system. One actually used a modem to dial directly in at that time and no one else could use it simultaneously. Once my family had AOL, I later was able to participate in a programmer chat room on AOL, which was the entry into a whole new world.

<comment><USER2> To further enlighten our younger programmers, I only had BBS access for the first time on a summer job internship just before going to the university. No way my parents would pay for a modem on those days nor for the regional phone rates.

That BBS was the only one in a probably 80 KM radius and with a maximum of 4 connections.

So yeah, learning to code meant demoscene parties, magazine listenings, get programming books as gift or being able to find something at the local library (usually from the 70's and early 80's).

As for development software, we would either type the compiler/interpreter ourselves from those magazines and books, or use one of those bundled tapes/disks if lucky to find them.

Also during those days, the local street markets where a common source of software.

</comment></comment><comment><USER3> Oh man, QBasic was the first programming language I ever encountered and started playing around--what great times!

At the time (I was probably 11 or so) I knew that it was important to learn to write serious stuff, and knew that an operating system was probably "serious stuff," and so I thought it might be a good learning experiment to write an operating system in QBasic. Needless to say I was missing a few links in how "serious stuff" was written back then, but it sure was a fun intro!

<comment><USER4> Same here. Even had an 8-note keyboard-driven music player built in, iirc. Although it lead to a life-long interest, I never really wrote anything 'serious' from scratch since then. Scripts and editing others' code was about my limit.

And this is despite trying at 12-13 to 'go pro' with Visual C++ ordered through a student discount and the C++ For Dummies book (I had no idea where to start) that never took off the ground. A wish there was a local group or mentor I knew about back then!

</comment></comment><comment><USER5> For someone who could never figure out how gorillas.bas was able to display anything to the screen (all of my basic code just wrote text to the screen), this is amazing.

<comment><USER6> Sounds a bit like me, except I could draw lines and circles. I made a small text based adventure game this way.

</comment></comment><comment><USER7> One of the first programming hobby projects I ever did was a level editor for a similar qbasic game called mono space. So fun!

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_K6yB3OsGs](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_K6yB3OsGs)

<comment><USER8> I loved this game back in my qbasic days.

RIP Milo!

</comment></comment><comment><USER9> I was very fortunate to get an Amstrad 6128 when I was 12. A big expense in New Zealand 29 years ago 8-). It came with a huge manual with lots of example programs to type in. Amstrad basic was a cool language with commands like move 0,0; draw 320,200; rem a line from corner to corner; and even while/wend.

</comment><comment><USER10> Looking at what you wrote at 15, I'm curious to know what you are doing nowdays?

<comment> Jean-Philipe I co-founded [http://www.fitanalytics.com/](http://www.fitanalytics.com/) as the only technical guy, been working on that for the first four years (started with nodejs 0.4.x back then and CoffeeScript).

Now I have a small team in Berlin (5 devs), doing some mobile apps and a project for Wix: www.wixeducation.com (ES2015, Postgres)

We don't have a real website, because we're so busy :D but there's a logo online: www.code-pan.com

</comment></comment><comment><USER11> Does it work in [http://www.qb64.net/](http://www.qb64.net/) ?

<comment><USER12> I got it running with FreeBasic with a few changes: several arrays were not declared (does QB just guess the correct size? Resize them as they are indexed??), and I had to comment out the PLAY commands, which FB doesn't support.

[http://pastebin.com/QrnvyVAH](http://pastebin.com/QrnvyVAH)

Turns out it runs insanely fast, there's no speed control. It's also really hard to see in a tiny window.

<comment><USER2> If I remember correctly you always needed to do a DIM or REDIM at some point before really using them.

But it is so long time ago and I never really used QBasic, by the time it came out I was already into Turbo Pascal, leaving Turbo Basic behind.

I did however spend long evenings trying to understand it, as QBasic was one of the first languages I tried to implement a compiler for.

<comment><USER12> This code didn't DIM some of those arrays at all, and others were DIMed as integers instead of integer arrays! IIRC QB allows variables with different types to have exactly the same name, so I guess that's equivalent to not DIMing any of them.

I think I might remember something about a default size for undeclared arrays...

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER13> woah, this would've been _much_ more fun to play than my qbasic space shooter: i did not know about timers, etc. and focused on making graphics out of draw primitives.

i wonder, what were others using for documentation? as i recall, i'd found a short introductory book on BASIC (not qbasic specifically, I don't think?) at the library.

</comment><comment><USER14> It's really interesting how the sprites are implemented with PSETs

<comment> Jean-Philipe I actually wrote an editor just for that: [https://github.com/strathausen/qed.bas](https://github.com/strathausen/qed.bas)

I've been setting each pixel by hand using that editor.

<comment><USER14> It's a really good-looking editor for a 15 year old kid to have coded back then.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> Wow, just had a nostalgic moment. I remember QBasic. I remember my elementary school having a book about Basic and being able to do some of the example games and apps. And a few not working. BASIC/QBASIC differences?

But mostly I remember complaining to my dad. QBasic "compiled" to some intermediate that required QBasic to run... I remember never being happy with that.

I thought I had eventually found out... but QB64 only supports XP, and I know that I was doing QBasic on something much older than that... Maybe older versions of QB64 supported earlier versions of Windows.

anyway, a nice little 5 minute trip down memory lane.</comment>