Founding an online startup. Do I need to learn programming? - <AUTHOR>

So I have what I would consider a fantastic business plan with the online experience to back it up. I've done my research and have 3 very serious investors that want to invest as soon as they can.
The problem: The idea centers around marketing (I'm one of the best at SEO. I work for banks and fortune 500 companies) AND a machine learning mechanism to decide what content to deliver to the visitor.
The question is should I try to learn php and take the free Machine Learning course Stanford is offering right now? The other option is keep sub-contracting to development agencies, collecting my paycheck after all 10 hours of work, and hiring a ninja-programmer.
Another small issue, the tech talent in my area, Wilmington, NC, isn't the greatest.
I'd love to hear everyone's thoughts on this. <comment><USER2> _AND a machine learning mechanism to decide what content to deliver to the visitor._

This sounds like a pie-in-the-sky idea. How can you develop a startup around a ML algorithm when you can't code and have never studied ML? Do you have a technical co-founder?

What kind of "mechanism" (these are actually called algorithms or machines) will you use? What frameworks or languages (NumPy/SciPy, pandas, Weka, Mahout; Java, Python, R) will you use to implement this algo? Do you know what data you'll analyze? Or how you'll normalize that data?

Get to the point where you can answer these questions and you'll be on your way. Until then, you'll struggle to find a technical cofounder (or, if you have one, you'll struggle to communicate with them and evaluate whether they are good at what they do).

tl;dr: unless you have a technical co-founder, you'll need much more than a Stanford ML course and some PHP to make this work.

</comment><comment><USER3> If you weren't already intrigued about learning to program prior to this startup (and already doing something about it), the answer is 'no'.

You need a technical co-founder, or a technical partner/adviser you trust that can help guide development. What you miss with a development agency/contractor-only approach is the critical technical feedback loop and iterations that strengthen and develop your idea that you'd typically do with that co-founder. Agencies/contractors will say 'yes' to what you want (and are happy to take your money), absent the really rich and valuable feedback and collaboration you get from a technical partner who has a vested interest in a shared vision.

You are only 2 hours away from Raleigh which I understand is pretty good for for tech talent. ([http://www.fastcompany.com/1699323/why-you-should-start-a- co...](http://www.fastcompany.com/1699323/why-you-should-start-a-company-in- raleigh-durham)). Maybe set up shop there?

</comment><comment><USER4> Personally, I think you need a committed partner who can code. Like Steve Blank/ Eric Ries like to put it, a Startup is not a company - it is a hypothesis.

It's great that you have a business plan, but a business plan is a remnant of the 80s and 90s. What you really have is a hypothesis about how you believe the world is. You need to get your product out there to see if your hypothesis holds true. If you've done your research, it will be close to the mark. From there, you'll have to iterate your product until you've reached a product- market fit.

And to iterate rapidly, you cannot keep subcontracting coding. You're going to need a committed CTO that will be able to deploy code rapidly.

That's my two cents.

<comment><AUTHOR> It's funny you say that because I am on your side here, but a close mentor of mine who has successfully founded, raised venture funding, and sold 3 tech companies disagrees. He recommends doing as much as I can for now and then get funding rather quickly. I'm not saying he's right but he has some pretty good points to back up his recommendations.

The only problem I foresee with getting a committed CTO is finding one around my area. I had one incredible programmer who had just quit his job at Match.com, but he got offered a job he couldn't refuse with equity in the venture funded startup in the valley.

I guess I just need to start the process of finding the perfect fit. I'm probably going to reach out to Raleigh for this.

<comment><USER4> It can definitely be done like your mentor said. As a Rails developer myself, I'm kind of biased to coders being part of the DNA of the company and having a strong stake in it.

This is a great article on humbdledmba for non-tech co-founders: [http://www.humbledmba.com/please-please-please-stop- asking-h...](http://www.humbledmba.com/please-please-please-stop-asking-how- to-find)

They make a good point. The coder's biggest is fear is wasting his/her time. Do as much as you can to alleviate their fear. For example - start a blog, get a following.

I hope this is helpful for you.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> You're unlikely to learn php AND machine learning in a short amount of time. You should find someone to work with.

Move to a tech hub. If you're not committed enough to do that, you will have a tough time finding someone who'll build a product for you.

And learn to code anyway. You won't turn into a ninja any time soon, but it's another way to prove you're committed and technical partners can't bullshit you.

Most importantly, build your product without the machine learning. Do it manually. Do it in wordpress. It's just marketing content, right? If you're one of the best, you can prove the concept without code, then get someone to automate that.

</comment><comment><USER6> It takes a lot of time to become good at this.

HOWEVER:

I strongly feel that anyone who is going to be working with or managing programmers should spend at least some time learning to code. You will not be able to do their job, but you will have a much better understanding of the basic issues involved.

As a technical person, I also have much more respect for someone who wants to talk to me about an idea they have after they have taken the effort to make some sort of rough mock-up or prototype. I may have to throw it out and start over, but it shows commitment and it shows that you have been doing some serious thinking about the problem.

</comment><comment><USER7> Machine learning is hard. Depending on the quality you need, you may need to find an expert. (Also, I'd be surprised if you end up with calculating recommendations in PHP on every page load.)

</comment><comment><USER8> Dude! You're like that guy from that "how to spot a bad non-technical co- founder" article. Pretty sure this is a troll.

<comment><AUTHOR> Not sure who "that guy" is, but I can assure you I'm not a troll. I've been following ycombinator for a long time, I am just new to the Hacker News Section.

-Jim

<comment><USER8> Okay, I'm pretty new here too. Here's the article I'm referring to. It's quite interesting, give it a read

[http://blog.hirelite.com/warning-signs-in-a-non-technical- co...](http://blog.hirelite.com/warning-signs-in-a-non-technical-cofounder-ca)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> Banks and Fortune500's use SEO?</comment>


Control Over Domestic Decisions Reduces Women's Interest in Workplace Power [pdf] - <AUTHOR> http://goizueta.emory.edu/profiles/documents/publications_working_papers/williams/Williams_Chen_2014_GPIR.pdf <comment><AUTHOR> "Men's interest in workplace power, on the other hand, was unaffected by the degree to which they wielded power at home." \- Does this mean men desire power regardless of situation and do not substitute power in one scenario for that in another?</comment>


Show HN: a flowchart to help non-technical founders choose their tech stack - <AUTHOR> http://thectonetwork.com/blog

<comment><AUTHOR> The HN crowd might not be the target audience - this is targeted at non- technical people - but next time a friend of a friend tells you "so I have this website idea..." you can send them here.

</comment><comment><USER2> As someone who 'speaks' Ruby, Python _and_ PHP I don't think you can just say good coders use Python and Ruby and the 'journeymen' coders will use PHP. There's really little difference between all of these. Ruby and Python are simple languages for anyone to learn, just as PHP is. The biggest challenge I see isn't language, but thinking in terms of data structures and having an intuition about the right way to solve a problem. The language, or tech stack (most of the time) is irrelevant.

<comment><AUTHOR> Yes, you're right. There's some terrible Ruby and Python coders, and some of the best programmers in the world use PHP.

However, this post was aimed at non-technical people. If you don't know much about tech, and try to hire PHP programmers, the quality of talent will be very variable. If you stick with Ruby and Python, your chance of finding someone decent is much higher.

Likewise, in almost any market, the price of an hour of Ruby/Python coding is going to be greater than an hour of PHP coding.</comment></comment>


Ask HN: How to find a customer to build a new ERP product with? - <AUTHOR>

I want to build an watered down version of an ERP, and need to find a customer who can walk me through their process in order to figure out what to build.
How can I go about finding potential clients, approaching them, and so on?
Last thing I want to do is to build something nobody wants or wanted, so I want to actually find out how I can find and work with a end user client and get paid for building the solution so that I can than sell it to other clients.
Also suggestions on some ERP software ideas I can be inspired by would be great, I'm just very lost with all these business languages surrounding enterprise software, wondering also what is a good learning resource to dive into this field.
OR do you think being a reseller for an established brand is a better option? Do any of these reseller programs have white label solutions? <comment><USER2> This makes a lot of sense if you have a client or two that needs a custom ERP and you have decided that you need to build one from scratch.

I am little lost at why you would venture into this or think about being a reseller for an established brand seemingly out of the blue.

I do recall reading about some open source ERP software packages here on HN before. Here's a search: [http://hn.algolia.com/#!/story/forever/0/open](http://hn.algolia.com/#!/story/forever/0/open) source erp

<comment><AUTHOR> yes I want to look for clients that needs an ERP solution.

I mentioned reseller as a plan B because from what I understand you are just selling the software for a cut without having to build the whole software.

Thanks for your comment.

</comment></comment><comment><USER3> Building an ERP for a single customer will skew your product to their vertical.

You need to look at some of the open source alternatives and see exactly how you can improve on them.

ERP technology is fascinating. It seems like practically every business needs some form of ERP, but it is not 'sexy' enough for the Valley and the entrenched players are raking in billions.</comment>


Chomsky: In Israel, a Tsunami Warning - <AUTHOR> http://www.chomsky.info/articles/20110707.htm

<comment><USER2> Gaza, who's GDP places them in the twentieth percentile, has a life expectancy more similar to countries in the fiftieth percentile. Claims of Israeli prosecution are greatly and often exaggerated by Chomsky amongst others.

Indeed the Palestinians have never missed an opportunity to miss an opportunity to find peace with Israel. Notice that in this attempt, they are asking for statehood without mentioning their willingness to end the government funded (and thus foreign aid funded) indoctrination of children into hatred, both in Gaza and the West Bank. This attempt to unilaterally declare statehood is a negotiation tactic--to not negotiate.

What's the next step? If this passes and Hamas still does not revise their charter, calling for the "obliteration of Israel", what will Israel be able to negotiate with in exchange for peace? Tel Aviv? All of Jerusalem?

And this doesn't take into account the absolutely ridiculous notion of any country exchanging tangible land for an intangible promise of a cessation of terrorism.

The fact that so many countries support this initiative paints a bleak picture about the world's willingness to sell out a country in exchange for favor in the eyes of the resource abundant Middle Eastern nations.

</comment><comment><USER3> Interesting data.

2009 Israeli military spending [1]: $13 billion*

2009 West Bank GDP [2]: $12.8 billion

\- - - - -

*excludes the $3 billion per year in US military aid to Israel (<http://www.forbes.com/feeds/afx/2007/07/29/afx3963706.html>)

Sources

1\. [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_military_e...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_military_expenditures)

2\. [https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world- factbook/...](https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world- factbook/geos/we.html)

</comment><comment><USER4> What's interesting is this combined with housing-price protests... there are interesting times ahead for Israel: [http://972mag.com/breaking-protesters- block-streets-in-centr...](http://972mag.com/breaking-protesters-block- streets-in-central-tel-aviv/)</comment>


Why I'm Not Surprised When I Hear That Powerful Men Are F**king Creeps - <AUTHOR> https://medium.com/@edenthecat/why-im-not-surprised-when-i-hear-that-powerful-men-are-fucking-creeps-119f0cbd3f07 <comment><USER2> > "You're already in shaky territory from reporting the designer."

Chilling...and sadly common.</comment>


Code Rush - Netscape Mozilla Documentary 1998 - 2000 - <AUTHOR> http://www.organizedwonder.com/videos/1109 <comment><USER2> If you liked that documentary, here's more: <http://www.clickmovement.org/coderush>

Comes with lots of extra footage: <http://clickmovement.org/code_rush_footage_nods>

<comment><USER3> Thank you!

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> Even though most of the non-tech people on camera made little sense, I thought this was a great documentary.

It shows how people trade health for little reward in the end. And so many people just go flying under the radar, while they are the real people behind the products we use today.

It's all about the entrepreneurs these days, what happened to those C++ hackers working long into the night?

Ah that's right, they don't look great on magazine covers.

<comment><USER5> Oh, those hackers are still hacking, on C and C++ and a few other languages.

All of these cloud technologies? All of this high performance storage, networking, virtualization? It's not written in ruby...

I think the difference is that you're on Hacker News, run by a startup accelerator. It's in their interest (albeit unintentionally as far as I can tell) to create a culture/cult around the value of being the founder, not the hacker.

</comment></comment><comment><USER6> I wish there was more documentarians around, following anyone doing something interesting. Not sure how to help make that happen, but there are so many projects that I would love to see how they were developed, even if years later.

For example: I'd love if documentarians followed Elon Musk around..

</comment><comment><USER7> There's a really nicely annotated version on waxy.org

<http://waxy.org/2009/07/code_rush_in_the_creative_commons/>

if you haven't watched code rush yet, the annotations are really a fantastic addition to it and i'd suggest starting there instead.

edit/comment: the annotations are mostly useful, if like me, you want to rewind to some particular scene when showing part of the film to a friend. i found them pretty useful, but, ymmv :)

</comment><comment><USER6> Are there any other good documentaries about the dot-com bubble era that people here would recommend? I've only seen Startup.com:

<http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0256408/>

As a younger person who lives thousands of miles away from Silicon Valley, I'd love to see more video from that time. I read tons about it, but reading and seeing are different things. AS the end of Code Rush, the investment banker who talks about how in a couple years physical banks might not be around and how the GAP shouldn't be renovating its store but rather invest more money in its website said so much about the kind of mania that took place at the time. I'd love to see more.

<comment><USER8> It's not a movie but I'd definitely recommend the book about the Boo.com fiasco: <http://www.amazon.com/Boo-Hoo-Dot-Com-Story/dp/0099418371> .. I believe it was Europe's biggest dot com era implosion and you can almost see why from page one. An enjoyable read.

</comment></comment><comment><USER9> 53:36: "This could all turn into television again. It could all be controlled by a small number of companies who control what we see and hear..."

Nice catch, thanks for posting this.

</comment><comment><USER8> If you like this sort of thing, Fog Creek released their 2005 Aardvark'd documentary for free on YouTube last year: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0NRL7YsXjSg> .. not balls off the wall exciting but an interesting look at a team of interns developing a product.

<comment><USER10> "Sort of thing" for classes of things like computers, coders and offices. Otherwise _Code Rush_ and _Aardvark'd_ are not comparable. I suggest _Aardvark'd_ is not worth the time. _Code Rush_ is of interest both historically & for it's insight into the values and attitudes of some damn effective programmers (these people practically made the web accessible for all in a few short years).

</comment></comment><comment><USER11> My favorite part:

"Not all companies succeed, some fail to embrace change. This is the way technology in the free market works. The software industries success has not been driven by government regulation but by freedom and the basic human desire to learn, to innovate, and to excel." ~Bill Gates

</comment><comment><USER12> Direct link: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u404SLJj7ig>

</comment><comment><USER13> Highly recommended. Gives a "behind-the-scenes" feel. I like JWZ's comment about how he won the "startup lottery."

</comment><comment><USER14> Is it available to download from a torrent?

<comment><USER15> Yup. And it's been released under a Creative Commons license, so it's completely legal: <http://thepiratebay.se/torrent/5003144/></comment></comment>


On Erlang's Syntax - <AUTHOR> http://ferd.ca/on-erlang-s-syntax.html

<comment><AUTHOR> Note that while I generally like the Erlang syntax, there's one main issue where syntax quirks come back to bite me: the combination of Erlang records with a missed line ending. This topic comes up on occasion on the mailing list and apparently it's a side effect of a change that was made to make Erlang records a little easier to work with.

In short, if you've got two records in a list, and forget to end the first one with the comma line ending, the behavior becomes a bit unpredictable.

      [
       #myrecord{
        field1="whatever",
        field2=123
       }
       #myrecord{
        field1="booyah",
        field3=3.14
       }
      ].

That statement would mysteriously return a list with a single element:

      [ #myrecord{field1="booyah", field2=123, field3=3.14 } ]

And all because of the missed comma after the first #myrecord { }.

What's happening can be visualized by the (sort of) equivalent version here:

      R1 = #myrecord{
       field1="whatever",
       field2=123
      },
      [
       R1
       #myrecord{
        field1="booyah",
        field2=3.14
       }
      ].

So you can see that the second #myrecord is overwriting the values in R1, since you can do syntax like R1#myrecord{ ... } to take the values of R1, and overwrite them with whatever you need to.

The reason that happens is due to a compiler change a while back to make record syntax no longer require being wrapped in parens. This is due to having records with values in them being records, and it makes it easier to access those records.

For example:

      Mybook#book.author#author.name

Which is an OOP language's equivalent of something like:

      Mybook.author.name

This previously used to be required to be written like this (correct me if I'm wrong, this syntax is before my time):

      ((Mybook#book.author)#author.name).

Which removed ambiguity. Errors like my first example then would be caught by the runtime if records were written in the "old" style:

      [
       (#myrecord{
        field1="whatever",
        field2=123
       })
       (#myrecord{
        field1="booyah",
        field3=3.14
       })
      ].

Will generate an invalid function error (still not a great error, but it makes sense in this regard.

My hope is that this class of error caused by the syntax will be somewhat minimized if Ericcson decides to merge the erlson[1] project into an official release of Erlang, replacing the somewhat clunky record syntax with something a little more "modern".

[1] <https://github.com/alavrik/erlson> \- An object notation for Erlang, but which in order to be a decent record replacement will need to support pattern matching.

</comment><comment><USER2> I used to dislike the use of different punctuation characters as they make it "difficult" to re-arrange code. I've, however, grown to love them as they are very explicit and gives the reader a good indication on what will happen next (f. ex. an alternate function clause).

All in all, I pretty much love Erlang's syntax. It's the perfect mix of readability, terseness and structure; and it has that cozy nerd-air about it, the one that makes you want to sit up all night dishing out code.

</comment><comment><USER3> Coming from Ruby, I was pretty excited to see Elixir[0] (and before that, Reia[1]), a language that runs on the Erlang VM but is more approachable for me syntactically and that adds some interesting features. I think it's worth checking out for anyone who wants to 'learn them some Erlang' over winter break.

[0]: <https://github.com/josevalim/elixir>

[1]: <http://reia-lang.org/> (abandoned; author points user to Elixir now)

<comment><USER4> Syntax is not as important at all.

Semantics is important.

If you think about a piece of code you should have AST's in your mind anyway -- not strings of characters.

<comment><USER5> Disagree completely: the language is there to make programming the computer easier for me, the human. If I have to parse it in my head, it has failed at that, at least for 'everyday use'.

In particular, one place where Erlang gets in your way is if you swap two lines of code, there's a good chance you'll have to check the "ant turd token" at the end of the line, and change it.

It's certainly not an insurmountable difficulty, but it is an annoyance.

<comment><USER6> Honest question: do you find yourself really thinking about a languages syntax after you've spent 40-50 hours coding in it? To me it kind of fades into the background, becomes hard wired in my brain. (I'm not suggesting I'm an awesome coder or anything of course)

<comment><USER5> Mostly, yes, but the line endings in Erlang fail the "don't make me think" test. They make you stop and look and make sure everything is in the right place.

It's not _that_ big a deal, and the language has lots of other great qualities, so I wouldn't get too hung up on it, but it's not fair to say it's not irritating.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> tldr - The user simply reads , as 'and', ; as 'or' and . as being done.

<comment><USER8> This syntax isn't any less weird than C's _& &_, _||_ , and _;_ operators. :)

Do any C/C++ developers #include<iso646.h> so they can use _and_ , _or_ , and _not_ as friendly operator names? This seems like a simple step for prettier C code, but I have never seen it in practice.

<comment><USER9> I've been writing C/C++ before and thought it would be nice to use those forms of the operators, but having never ever seen C++ code that does I wonder if I'm setting myself to be made fun of.

<comment><USER8> I guess it's a slippery slope. If people _#define and &&_ then someone else will _#define then {_ and _#define endif }_. Everyone will have their own silly dialect. In fact, that is not unlike the current state of C++ usage..

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> Learn Prolog first and it will all make sense.

</comment><comment><USER11> I up'd this just because 1) I love me some Erlang 'Learn you some Erlang' and 2) I love to see Erlang entries on HN

</comment><comment><USER12> most of it is beautiful <3</comment>


Valve's GDC Talk: Porting Source to Linux [pdf] - <AUTHOR> https://developer.nvidia.com/sites/default/files/akamai/gamedev/docs/Porting%20Source%20to%20Linux.pdf <comment><USER2> This isn't my area but, they appear to be saying that by using OpenGL instead of Microsoft's equivalent, not only do they get Linux support and a stepping stone to mobile support, they can also use more up-to-date code that Microsoft doesn't support on XP (highlighting China as a place where they have modern machines running the old operating system) _and_ get a 20% performance improvement even when going through a translation layer.

That's a very interesting result.

<comment><USER3> I'm actually surprised that there isn't more support for a native Linux version of Direct3D. It is by far the better of the two APIs, both in terms of ease of use and more closely conforming to the model used by video hardware itself. Since the future of remote Linux desktops is going to be based on Microsoft's RDP rather than X, it makes sense for the open source community to adopt a better Microsoft technology when it comes along.

<comment><USER4> >surprised that there isn't more support for a native Linux version of Direct3D

There is no surprise. D3D is proprietary while OpenGL is open standard.

>It is by far the better of the two APIs

I highly disagree. Do you have any examples?

>Linux desktops is going to be based on Microsoft's RDP

What?? I've seen plenty of VNC in the wild, but yet to see any RDP

<comment><USER5> _I highly disagree. Do you have any examples?_

OpenGL is a dog's breakfast of an API. It's everything an API shouldn't be -- stateful, verbose, and committee-driven. Just take a look at Valve's .PDF.

An OpenGL programmer spends a large part of his/her time trying to maintain a mental model of the underlying driver's state and behavior. And God(s) help you if you step off the path used by popular applications and game engines. You can expect combinatorial bugs out the wazoo, again because the API and driver layers are so stateful.

I agree with the grandparent -- it's well past time that a D3D-like API was adopted by other players. I've used OpenGL since the Quake 1 days and I've never understood why so many people sing its praises. The days when D3D was an inferior API are more than a decade behind us.

<comment><USER6> One reason to sing opengl's praises - cross platform.

<comment><USER3> That's bullshit. In practice different GPU parts support different subsets of OpenGL's shader model, leading to broken graphics depending on the GPU. This is a huge problem in, for example, Android games, where you have to test on just about every device to see what works and what doesn't.

OpenGL is cross-platform because it's legacy. It is primarily of interest to outdated CAD software vendors, because that's who's driving the API specs, hence why it took so long for the fixed-function pipeline to finally be dropped. Modern CAD vendors, such as Autodesk, render through a Direct3D pipeline.

<comment><USER7> The Android issue is entirely caused by shitty drivers. Pretty much all mobile hardware after the original iPhone fully supports OpenGL ES 2.0 shaders which haven't changed since inception.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> And today I learned about the existence of cGDB (a curses frontend for GDB, <http://cgdb.github.com/> ). It seems very nice and I agree with what is said in one slide of the Valve talk:

«* gdb: debugging from 1970

* cgdb: debugging from 2000»

<comment><USER9> cgdb looks promising. I really, really liked the Turbo Debugger in the 90's. No debugger has offered me the same experience since. It was fast, the text- based windowed interface allowed efficiently jumping to assembly as well as to the source, view registers, editable hex dumps of memory, view watchpoints etc.

gdb is super-powerful but was a bit of a setback interface-wise because everything has to be done on a plain command line. And the GUI-based wrappers around it don't appeal to me much (don't know why, the ones I tried felt somewhat clunky).

<comment><USER10> Eclipse on Linux has great C programming support including interactive debugging using the CDT (C development toolkit) plugin. I used it to interactively debug operating system code running in a virtual machine on my Linux box recently and it worked great.

<comment><USER11> You might be interested in the Eclispe Linux Tools project[0], which integrates a lot of popular Linux profiling and debugging tools with Eclipse.

[0]<http://www.eclipse.org/linuxtools/>

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> It's not directly related to games, but I was very surprised to see their graph of operating system usage. In the last few months (which, admittedly, are not at all typical), their Linux usage increased by 1% every one to two months. At that rate, it would pass OS X use by April. It would be really cool if these numbers made other companies, including non-game ones, become more serious about Linux development.

<comment><USER13> Steam for Linux just came out of beta, and they marketed that fact fairly heavily.

<comment><USER14> By merely signing in on the Linux beta you got a tux hat for TF2. Adoption would have been pretty heavily affected by this.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> >Why port? >Linux is open

Well, GNU/Linux may be open overall, but the NVIDIA drivers and in-house dev tools that are making all the magic happen certainly aren't.

</comment><comment><USER16> The real question is, can we expect a FOSS release of old (or new) valve code any time soon? It seems natural given their modder-friendly nature and their shift towards GNU/Linux. Plus, it's about time someone else followed Carmack's example.

<comment><USER17> Their approach has generally to release their tools and SDK so others can build using their tools. I don't think they have much interest in releasing the code, but they have always wanted (and benefited from) the community taking their tools and engine and building cool stuff.

<comment><USER16> I think they should have an interest in it. The toolchain they publish is notoriously out of date and suffers from poor documentation. Why not let the community work on it? There seems to be demand for it.

<comment><USER18> Perhaps they could release the source for GoldSrc, considering it isn't used by any of their current games.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER19> While I understand why, I still find it a bit funny seeing Windows screenshots on a Linux porting pdf.

<comment><USER20> We're a pretty Windows-centric shop, I often see great effort to do OSX/Linux development via some convoluted toolchains just to be able to do the brunt of the work on Windows in Visual Studio.

</comment></comment><comment><USER21> Is there a video/audio for this talk? Or can we expect it?

<comment><USER22> This was a talk given at GDC, so it will no doubt end up on <http://www.gdcvault.com/> sooner or later - but it will very likely be behind a paywall.

<comment><USER23> A $495 paywall, non the less. Probably a good buy for many, but a little out of reach for hobbyists.

<comment><USER24> Sometimes they release old videos for free, but it can take years.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER25> The point about China is interesting, if this gets China to start switching to Linux on the desktop then MS has real problems.

I wonder why they are mainly using XP in china? Is it just that 7/8 are more difficult to pirate?

<comment><USER18> Perhaps there is a lot of software written for XP, many computers can't run Vista or 7, and there is little incentive to upgrade anyway? Those would be my guesses.

</comment></comment><comment><USER26> Telemetry definitely sounds neat. anybody know about pricing?

</comment><comment><USER27> than you for writing were, rather than was</comment>


Tech giant up for sale must be saved for Britain (ARM) - <AUTHOR> https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/aug/09/this-tech-giant-up-for-sale-is-a-homegrown-miracle-it-must-be-saved-for-britain <comment><USER2> When it comes to technology, The UK loves selling their own businesses rather than selling goods and growing into large tech companies these days. Just look at Imagination Technologies which was sold to a chinese private equity firm [0] and Apple is now producing their own graphics chips. Brexit just made the price tag cheaper for them and Softbank.

ARM is beyond saving at this point when NVIDIA and other companies may be bidding for it. What a lost opportunity for the state of UK technology companies even when they keep comparing it to the crown jewels being sold off. [1]

[0] [https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-41369376](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-41369376)

[1] [https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-53637463](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-53637463)

</comment><comment><USER3> I posted this yesterday also - [https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24098096](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24098096)</comment>


Show HN: Building a Clean Clutter-free and Intuitive Android App — Vakai Quotes - <AUTHOR> https://medium.com/@laxmena/building-a-clean-clutter-free-and-intuitive-android-application-vakai-quotes-8f30699eeca3 <comment><USER2> Simple design but looks clean. Could add more feature, as you said in your blog, do not saturate your application with overwhelming features. Great going on your first mobile application.

<comment><AUTHOR> Thanks for your review, I would highly appreciate it.</comment></comment>


DreamHost offers free hosting (select apps, needs invite) - <AUTHOR> http://dreamhostapps.com/

<comment><USER2> Considering how oversold their servers are, and how draconian their copyright policies are, and abysmal service, you wouldn't want to host your app there.

At least, no sensible person hosting an app with five or more users would.

<comment><AUTHOR> Agreed. They are going for the 'hobby/early/novice hacker' market, which seems to be quite large as well.</comment></comment>


Stoosbahn Funicular, world's steepest, has a maximum gradient of 47.7 degrees - <AUTHOR> https://youtu.be/GO9J7NsM0Ck <comment><USER2> The 'rotating barrel' passenger carriages are a sweet engineering touch ...

</comment><comment><USER3> My old vw beetle was good for 48 degrees</comment>


AT&T Call Centers Sold Mobile Customer Information to Criminals - <AUTHOR> http://transition.fcc.gov/Daily_Releases/Daily_Business/2015/db0408/DOC-332911A1.txt

<comment><AUTHOR> Easier to read: [http://www.itworld.com/article/2907675/atandt-call- centers-s...](http://www.itworld.com/article/2907675/atandt-call-centers-sold- mobile-customer-information-to-criminals.html)</comment>


Ask HN: What todo app do you use? - <AUTHOR>

I need a simple, clean and good looking TODO app for IPhone, IPad and web.<p>What is your preference? <comment><USER2> You should give <https://workflowy.com/> a try. Probably the best thing the internet threw at me last year. While it's great for todo you can do lots of stuff with this website.

</comment><comment><USER3> I use Things. It's expensive, but I like it. (<http://culturedcode.com/things/>)

</comment><comment><USER4> Fantastical integration with Reminders for the longer term stuff. It's lovely to have your todo and calendaring information in one simple app. The natural language processing rocks. Like a little assistant. They have an iPhone app in addition to OS X.

For the day to day stuff, good old memory or per-project notebooks.

</comment><comment><USER5> I use Trello: <https://trello.com>

<comment><USER6> Trello user here. Its great.

</comment></comment><comment><USER7> I'm still looking for one where I can share with specific people (who can then update), and sublists. Closest thing I can find is Workflowy, possibly Cotton, but neither say what each person did, or even what's new.

</comment><comment><USER8> I'm happy with Remember The Milk (and pay the US$25/year to get it to sync properly with my iphone; my girlfriend is happy using the web version on her ipad), but I haven't tried anything else to compare it to.

</comment><comment><USER9> <http://www.realmacsoftware.com/clear/> I'm using this on wp and it's great.

</comment><comment><USER10> I use Symphonical: www.symphonical.com

It's only for web atm, but mobile should be around the corner..

</comment><comment><USER11> Remember the Milk for me. The right balance of simplicity & features. Plus a Chrome extension.

</comment><comment><USER12> <https://catch.com/> is really nicely done.

</comment><comment><USER13> I use Any.do <http://www.any.do/>

</comment><comment><USER14> todo.txt (<http://todotxt.com/>). It works from the command line, has mobile apps, syncs nicely with ssh / dropbox, and saves into a simple to read / port text file.

</comment><comment><USER15> Wunderlist is great.

</comment><comment><USER16> after trying a few, I gotta stick with wunderlist

</comment><comment><USER17> post-it notes</comment>


Black dot bug is the latest Unicode text handling flaw to crash iPhone and iPad - <AUTHOR> https://9to5mac.com/2018/05/09/black-dot-bug-unicode-text-bug-to-crash-iphone-and-ipads/ <comment><USER2> Have they never thought of fuzzing unicode renderers?</comment>


A tale of two tech cities: Silicon Valley vs LA - <AUTHOR> http://www.jasonnazar.com/2008/11/23/a-tale-of-two-tech-cities-%E2%80%93-silicon-valley-vs-los-angeles/ <comment><USER3> And yet oddly enough SV is where most of the most profitable startups have been. Focusing too much on revenue at the expense of strategic vision is not sound business sense, but premature optimization: you ride a greedy algorithm to the top of whatever local maximum is nearest, and you're done.

</comment><comment><USER4> Docstoc is a rip off clone of Scribd. An LA company copying an SV company.

I don't think it's a coincidence that Scribd is Linux/Rails and Docstoc is Windows/ASP.NET.

SV vs LA indeed: [http://trends.google.com/websites?q=docstoc.com%2C+scribd.co...](http://trends.google.com/websites?q=docstoc.com%2C+scribd.com&geo=all&date=all&sort=1)

<comment><USER5> "YouTube for documents" was a pretty obvious permutation to try. Do you have evidence DocStoc saw-and-copied rather than independently-devised?

<comment><USER4> I do know that Scribd launched, got a lot of fanfare, and then DocStoc launched a remarkably similar thing. But that could be just coincidence. Their CEO being an MBA? I'd call that proof!

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> Los Angeles is a tech city? I've lived in LA forever, but just now started to really notice an actual tech community..I never really felt the same vibe here as I do in the bay. And of course it annoys me to no end that half the tech events and startups here are entertainment related. I can see why, but I'm still annoyed :)

<comment><USER7> I would say there is a higher concentration of tech companies in the orange county area and cities like Irvine as opposed to the immediate LA area. In general, a lot less web startups and more biotech and videogame/entertainment companies.

<comment><USER6> Oh, that would make a lot more sense. I live in LA proper and don't really venture out to meetups outside of the city. There's plenty of game companies here (the significant other works at one), but I suppose I meant more along the lines of Hollywood when I say entertainment.

<comment><USER8> There are some nice meetups in LA, though they're a bit rare. I'm a big fan of netsquared, but mahalo meetups can be nice. Also LAWINE, depending on your taste and knowledge.

I live in Orange County, and haven't had much luck finding suitable meetup venues here (web-related anyway).

If anyone is in/from the area and knows of anything worthwhile, please speak up.

<comment><USER9> I do several tech events in SoCal through Mixergy.com. I just did one in OC last week. It was held at a PR company's office. There's a growing tech community in LA, OC & San Diego.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> I only lived in LA for about a year, when I worked for a small film compositing software company that was later acquired by apple (like a genius, I left for grad school before that happened). We were located in hollywood, right in the middle of it all.

It was kind of fun to be in LA. It has a different vibe from SF. But all in all, the hacker culture seemed pretty similar to me. Very friendly folks - <USER2> dude who had an academy award (the science achievement kind) was willing to sit down with me to explain how to use a plugin for a couple of hours.

This was back in the late 90s, before things truly exploded. Maybe it's different now... I also didn't get around all that much, so I can't say if my experience was typical of hollywood high tech.

BTW, Kathy Sierra had an interesting post on the "hollywood model"

</comment><comment><USER11> _"The goal is to be monetization masters who are focused on consumers and build viral, capital efficient products, and to leave behind the full of shit, spam artists who are snobby about not making money."_

In other words, do everything right.</comment>


Startup Weekend Tips & Tricks - <AUTHOR> http://swanson.github.com/blog/2011/06/18/startup-weekend-tip-tricks.html

<comment><USER2> Matt's (submitter, author) point about pushing something, /anything/ out of the door by the end of the weekend is a great point. I had the pleasure of working with him at last year's SocialDevCamp hackathon and we ended up using MongoDB as a poor man's message passing system. Why not, we were already using it as a document store! Also, researching and demoing APIs that you might potentially use before the hackathon is very important. We wasted a lot of time fighting with OAuth to get Twitter's streams working.

</comment><comment><USER3> I wrote up some other tips based on my experience at Madrona Startup Weekend in Seattle at [http://www.readwritehack.com/how-to-succeed-at-startup- weeke...](http://www.readwritehack.com/how-to-succeed-at-startup-weekend)</comment>


If These 5 People Who Tried Windows 8 Are Normal, Microsoft Has A Big Problem - <AUTHOR> http://www.businessinsider.com/microsoft-has-big-problem-with-windows-8-2012-10

<comment><USER2> Microsoft might have a problem. But I think it's not huge as many people think it is. Microsoft made a a choice, to change, to evolve. And so they did, if because of the fear of change they would never advance other companies would have stepped over. I see people complaining about no start button. what a big deal, Macs don't have a start button but I have never seen someone complaining. People will learn, I have no doubt, and in some years we will wonder we did we used to have a start button. Let's see what this new OS has really to offer to the mass before judging. Let's not be irrationally afraid of change.

</comment><comment><USER3> I like how the article completely disregards the positive things said by the customers in the video. Typical BI crap.</comment>


I reverse engineered some big job portal systems – here's what I found - <AUTHOR> http://www.littleroboto.com/index.html#newrules

<comment><AUTHOR> Hi I'm an indie software developer based in London and I decided to take apart job portal software to check expert resume tips (these are the automated systems/filters people talk about) I think I'm the first to do that.

Five candidate analysis packages cover most of the recruitment market, there are others out there but these are the big ones. Our resumes interact with one or more of these at the data centre every time they're submitted (the packages are: Sovren, Daxtra, BurningGlass, TextKernel and Trovix - who were bought by Monster.com a while ago) if you work backwards from the code in these systems, which is a few months work, you arrive at five very similar looking CV templates and some high level resume writing rules that they all seem to agree on. There are some differences between them but to hack the process from the candidate side you have to take an 80:20 view.

There may be hundreds of different ATS systems out there but one thing they all tend to outsource is the resume analysis functionality which generally comes from one of these 5 suppliers.

The rules supplied were found, through a variety of methods: decompiling code, live testing with dummy data, dummy recruiter accounts on job portals - whatever I could do to check what was happening to the data.

Wondered if any of you guys had anything to add? if you think it's a good idea going forward or had any feedback?

[There's a free sample resume on my site if you want to take a look - it's less exotic than you'd expect]

<comment><USER2> The dependence on capitalization interests me because I've found that when you scan paperwork, you can get pretty far in terms of recall (say 94%) by insisting on perfect capitalization, and you only get to 97% when you relax this cconstraint.

I would say overall though, there is a huge focus on "hiring as a problem" and "getting hired as a problem" and not very much on "what do you do with these people once you've hired them." And I think the latter is the thing that really matters because you won't (1) get the results you are paying for or (2) retain people if you don't fix it.</comment></comment>


Python Yesterday, Today and Tomorrow - <AUTHOR> http://www.catonmat.net/blog/better-faster-smarter-python-yesterday-today-and-tomorrow/

<comment><USER2> Stellar presentation. Opened my eyes to what python has done for the last few years - one of my pet peeves, in place sorting of lists, has been resolved with the sorted function. Thank the gods. 90 seconds later I was at Amazon.com purchasing the latest copy of Learning Python. I've already been inspired enough to get my hands dirty and write a network strafeing harness in python for a project I'm working on. Thanks Sunshine!</comment>


Montana to FCC: You can't stop us from protecting net neutrality - <AUTHOR> https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2018/01/montana-to-fcc-you-cant-stop-us-from-protecting-net-neutrality/ <comment><USER2> As a Montana resident, I applaud Governor Steve Bullock's action to require net neutrality in the state of Montana. Agit Pai's controversial FCC decision to drop net neutrality seems to me to be a bad one, one which will be partially mitigated here by requiring network neutrality to be the local law of the land in Montana.

I was a bothered by the down-voting of a block of 13 comments although Moderator Dang was right to tag the comments as "shallow" and "partisan" and, therefore, inappropriate, since they stray substantially from the topic at hand.

</comment><comment><USER3> I just want to say that I LOVE the irony here. The party that has long pushed for States Rights is now, through their own federal-level decisions _against_ the states, triggering states rights fights.

<comment><USER4> States have pushed for gay marriage reform, sane drug policy and now this. Can we agree supporting states rights doesn't make you a racist now?

<comment><USER5> Very few people ever supported "state's rights" on principle: not a single of 5+ political issues mentioned in this threat have different answers from state to state. If you're for legalization in Oregon, you'll also be for legalization in Mississippi.

Claiming "state's rights" is therefore never more than a convenient argument when you want to avoid the substance of the issue. And if that substance is racist, you are likely to be called a racist no matter what.

<comment><USER6> That's not a good argument at all. Thinking that legalization should happen in every state has nothing to do with thinking that it will probably happen in some states before others. Why would a legalization supporter want to make it a federal issue when fewer than 50% of states support the idea?

If people with different views are concentrated in different areas, we can maximize total democracy (i.e. representation of citizen's opinions in government) by allowing them to pick their own local laws.</comment></comment></comment></comment>


Google Chrome Comic Book - <AUTHOR> http://www.google.com/googlebooks/chrome/index.html

<comment><USER2> This was released when Chrome first came out.</comment>


Microsoft Unveils AKS, a Fully Managed Kubernetes Service - <AUTHOR> http://www.crn.com/news/cloud/300094356/microsoft-unveils-aks-a-fully-managed-kubernetes-service-thats-looking-to-be-a-cost-leader.htm?itc=refresh <comment><USER2> Just in case you want to see the official announcement:

[https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/blog/introducing-azure- con...](https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/blog/introducing-azure-container- service-aks-managed-kubernetes-and-azure-container-registry-geo-replication/)

</comment><comment><USER3> Seems cool, didn't RTFA, but I know a lot of people all over the map have wanted a more portable system like Kubernetes for container management.</comment>


In-depth with Android Wear, Google's quantum leap of a smartwatch OS - <AUTHOR> http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2014/03/in-depth-with-android-wear-googles-quantum-leap-of-a-smartwatch-os/

<comment><AUTHOR> If Apple's smartwatch has a round face, I'll bet they're screaming bloody murder over there right now.</comment>


Fun with Fingerprint Readers - <AUTHOR> http://www.schneier.com/crypto-gram-0205.html#5

<comment><USER2> Mythbusters also tried some different methods for beating the system <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LA4Xx5Noxyo>

<comment><USER3> The most interesting bit of that show was how they beat that serious-looking fingerprint sensor with a licked piece of paper:

Photocopy a fingerprint, lick the copy, push it onto the reader.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> It's from May 15, 2002.

I wonder how the situation is today. Any new findings?

<comment><USER5> Yeah, now you can just pick the fingerprint locks with a paperclip in about 10 seconds. [http://www.privacydigest.com/2010/08/03/biometric%20and%20ot...](http://www.privacydigest.com/2010/08/03/biometric%20and%20other%20locks%20fail%20foil%20hackers%20defcon) That's progress for you.

</comment></comment><comment><USER6> "After it lets you in, eat the evidence."

This is genius.

</comment><comment><USER7> I was thinking the first gelatin finger he made was just a smooth finger- shaped mold and inferred that it worked by simply pressing the pattern left by the oil residue of the last person to place their finger on the pad. I thought that was pretty cool, but then wondered why they considered the second more arduous process of printing and etching a fingerprint with the same success rate more interesting. I was thinking, well that can be solved simply with software. Like don't let the same person enter a door twice in a certain time- window.

Then I realized the first method meant you actually had to mold a finger that already has access, fingerprint and all. Oh, ok now the second more arduous method is more impressive.

</comment><comment><USER8> Biometrics of this sort have been known for years as a soft security system - similar to a text password.

<comment><USER9> A fingerprint is actually worse than a password. You can't change your fingerprints and you leave them everywhere. You don't go around sticking post- its with your unchangeable password everywhere.

<comment><USER10> Plus you can't actually encrypt anything with your fingerprint, you can only compare it with an earlier training version.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER11> Matsumoto's paper is not on the Web. You can get a copy by asking. :(

<comment><AUTHOR> <http://cryptome.org/gummy.htm></comment></comment>


The Org Fellowship – 10 positions open worldwide (Sequoia and FF backed) - <AUTHOR> https://medium.com/the-org/the-org-fellowship-555f175df4e5 <comment><AUTHOR> We are excited to announce The Org Fellowship. Applications due June 12th.

Founded in November 2017, The Org is a community of over 50,000 companies and 182,000 professionals. We're backed by some of the world's leading investors including Founders Fund, Sequoia, and Balderton.

Today we're launching The Org Fellowship to expand our presence beyond the U.S. and Denmark. We're inviting 10 of the highest potential individuals to join us as regional Fellows and represent The Org in their home country.

The Fellowship program is an exclusive group of the most entrepreneurial and connected individuals from all corners of the globe. We're on a mission to discover, partner with, and publicize the very best companies and teams from our local regions.

The Org Fellowship is the perfect precursor to a career as an investor, entrepreneur, or journalist. Your aim will be to know everyone doing something important, help them, and write about them. You'll also build a personal brand as a global leader of the next great business trend: transparency. It's also a paid position :)

Read more and apply or refer a friend here: [https://medium.com/the-org/the- org-fellowship-555f175df4e5](https://medium.com/the-org/the-org- fellowship-555f175df4e5)</comment>


StarNet launches 1Gbps Internet in Moldova for ~30$/month - <AUTHOR> https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fstarnet.md%2Fro%2Finternet-alone%2F&edit-text=&act=url

<comment><USER2> The most advanced countries over the last 20 years have worse internet speeds and policies than financially distress nations without many resources. Irony at work?

</comment><comment><USER3> It's ~$20 in its neighbor Romania.

[http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2354886](http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2354886)</comment>


Practical Facts about the Human Brain - <AUTHOR> https://leowid.com/brain-facts/ <comment><USER2> I wish people would be more skeptical about their recall of memories.

In particular I wish people would stop thinking their memories are especially accurate if they were especially "vivid".

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flashbulb_memory](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flashbulb_memory)

<comment><USER3> I agree. Memory biases may either enhance or impair the recall of memory, or they may alter the content of what we report remembering.

There are many memory biases including the humor effect, positivity effect and the generation effect.

The humor effect states that humorous items are more easily remembered than non-humorous ones.

Positivity effects states that older adults favor positive over negative information in their memories.

Generation effect states that self-generated information is remembered best.

<comment><USER4> How universal are these biases? Anecdotally, I feel as though i have a stronger recall of negative experiences than equivalently good ones. If that is a thing, i wonder if it might be due to, or perhaps a cause of, depression.

<comment><USER5> I think the better question to ask is, what _kind_ of memory? Research I cannot conveniently find at the moment shows that raw declarative memory is improved under trauma. For example, most people who were old enough, nationwide, can recall where they were and what they were doing on 9/11\. Other kinds of memory, like skill automating (e.g. playing the chords effortlessly on a guitar or mastering the core grammar of a language) are much harder to do when you're under stress.

<comment><USER6> Interestingly, though, it often turns out that recalling "where they were and what they were doing on 9/11" is very often wrong. And that when you're wrong, you're more certain you're right.

Malcolm Gladwell did a very interesting podcast episode on that: [http://revisionisthistory.com/episodes/24-free-brian- william...](http://revisionisthistory.com/episodes/24-free-brian-williams)

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><AUTHOR> Hi everyone, Leo here. I feel grateful for the HN community's response to this post. I only emerged recently to the "real world" again and feel still some hesitation and fear around showing a much more vulnerable part of myself with the work I do now. (Building marketing software was fun too!) So yeah, just want to say thanks and would love to discuss anything this sparks.

<comment><USER7> 1) "80% of your body's signals are sent to the brain from the body and only 20% the other way around."

This is pretty interesting. The idea of not attempt to "command" the body but work with the body and unconscious process is common in a wide variety of martial arts and healing art modalities (Alexander Technique, Qigong, hypnosis, etc).

2) "When your amygdala is active, you can't have empathy for others"

Unfortunately, this statement seems to suffer from the weakness of popular psychology expositions - a series of fairly pat cause-and-effect statement when the causes of virtually all behavior is more complex and much less certain.

The human brain is fantastically complex thing. Neurologists and psychologists have done many experiments on it. The "replication crisis" is a good indicator how difficult is to go from experiments on a few particulars to a general understanding of how the brain works. I think the criticism of "functional areas" that Luria made in The Working Brain should be read carefully.

The thing about this is: neurological research is great to add if what you're looking for is " _what might be_ ", using methods that _possibly_ have scientific and seem effective. But if you operate in terms of " _how things absolutely are_ ", then one risks going into the realm of pseudo-science. And there's a lot of supposedly neurologically based new age quackery out there - much of it based things that "the latest findings" whenever said quack happened to get their start.

<comment><USER8> Thank you.

There is _some_ stuff in post that is somewhat useful, but the conviction of the statements is a bit much. Nothing in the brain is simple, and most of neuroscience is in it's infancy today. Dandy-Walker syndrome is an especially extreme, but illustrative, case of how strange the brain can be on the inside, yet present as normal on the outside[0].

[0] [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dandy%E2%80%93Walker_syndrome](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dandy%E2%80%93Walker_syndrome)

<comment><USER9> _In the majority of individuals with Dandy–Walker malformation, signs and symptoms caused by abnormal brain development are present at birth or develop within the first year of life_

Doesn't seem like "normal" presentation to me.

<comment><USER8> [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrocephalus#Exceptional_case](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrocephalus#Exceptional_case)

"The person was a married father of two children, and worked as a civil servant, leading an at least superficially normal life, despite having enlarged ventricles with a decreased volume of brain tissue. "What I find amazing to this day is how the brain can deal with something which you think should not be compatible with life", commented Dr. Max Muenke, a pediatric brain-defect specialist at the National Human Genome Research Institute. "If something happens very slowly over quite some time, maybe over decades, the different parts of the brain take up functions that would normally be done by the part that is pushed to the side.""

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> "What is my body trying to tell me with that tight stomach, sunken heart, clenched shoulders?"

I have been reading Radical Acceptance by Tara Brach and this is one of the themes that keeps repeating in that book and in general in meditation. To understand one's mind and the root cause of an emotion one need to focus the attention on how one's body feels and what it's trying to say. While meditation is now widely accepted as beneficial, I have generally been less accepting or even dismissive of the surrounding teachings and method. I think it's time to revisit my views and be more open to it.

<comment><USER11> I've had a similar experience. I think the reason is that there's a lot of noise in the field. A ton of low quality thought and half baked ideas or pure nonsense.

But that really should not close one off to reputable sources like Tara Brach (highly recommend people start with her guided sessions which are available free on her site) who have a well of experience honed over the years.

One time in India, some family members took me to an astrologer. I was extremely skeptical but this person was famous in town and well known regionally as well. And when I voiced my concerns that the whole field was all hocus pocus, one of my relatives said that may well be true for many individual practitioners in the field, but if you think about it as a person communicating to you using their own finely tuned heuristic for outcomes, it's a different story. Maybe the more reputable sources in these fields should be thought of in that way, where you shouldn't expect perfect accuracy but you should use their thoughts and knowledge as a rough guide to a kind of knowledge we have very few tools to directly explore rather than pure truths.

<comment><USER12> Pure truths one of the most important tools in developing self-knowledge. IMO going to an astrologer is akin to using a prostitute blindfolded.

You want to understand yourself, spirituality or even the universe? Study the laws of nature, the 112 names of Shiva, the 72 names of God, 613 Mitzvot of the Torah, the 4 worlds and 125 degrees of Kabbalah etc. etc. etc.

Heck, study the alphabet and how to write and pronounce it. Ladders abound. Just pick one that seems like a challenge, and then pick a fun method of studying it. I like to mix calligraphy and pronunciation practice in.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER13> I upvoted because I like to see popularizations of results from neuroscience, but I would also caution against cherry picking papers and placing interpretations atop them.

<comment><USER14> > caution against cherry picking papers and placing interpretations atop them

I worry about this every time I read a "practical" article about the brain. Can anyone tell if the main points in this article is generally accepted in the scientific community?

<comment><USER15> I'd save yourself the trouble and throw it all in the garbage.

>Feeling heart-broken? Feeling angry and frustrated? Feeling sunken and collapsed? Feeling energized and happy? All of these feelings will have had their origin as sensations from vagus nerve.

This is a fundamental misunderstanding of everything to do with neurology. There is simply no way to write a point by point rebuttal of how much is wrong in this article.

<comment><USER13> Wow.. I had read through diagonally and missed this one, otherwise I would've been a bit more negative.

The real shame is that reading about the different systems that do give rise to these feelings is actually really interesting.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER16> My simplified main takeaway from this post is: chronic stress seems to be at least as bad as chronic alcoholism [1] and therefore we really _really_ need to be masters at the art of relaxation.

The two forms of evidence that stood out to me: (1) the effect of an overactive amygdala and (2) the negative effect of stress on the neocortex.

[1] Alcoholism isn't mentioned in the post, that's my own interpretation of the potential damage it can go. I'm going to do an online search for it to see whether that comparison has any merit.

<comment><USER15> I'd caution against taking anything in this article as truth. This is written by a self help guru, not a neurologist.

<comment><USER16> I know, fortunately I know enough neuroscience to know to what extent I should believe this.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER17> > Feeling heart-broken? Feeling angry and frustrated? Feeling sunken and > collapsed? Feeling energized and happy? All of these feelings will have had > their origin as sensations from vagus nerve.

I thought emotions can from the limbic system?

<comment><USER18> Emotions come from the entire body, as interpreted by the insular cortex (internal sensation) and cingulate cortex (internal motor planning).

I'd have to check the source, but I'm pretty damn skeptical on _all_ interoceptive information flowing through the vagus nerve. I'm pretty sure my adviser has told me that's Just Plain Wrong.

</comment></comment><comment><USER19> I wonder how it is determined which neurons send signals "to" vs. "from" brain. This 80/20 to/from split is surprising.

The reason I'm asking is because sending electrons up a wire isn't the only way to signal with electricity. When the output that was high-impedance suddenly opens up, allowing you to send electricity through, that actually can be a signal _to_ you, that something on the other end has changed.

<comment><USER20> Neurons can be understood to be fairly directional. There is no direct electrical connection between neurons: there's actually a small gap between the upstream neuron and the downstream neuron. When the electrical signal reaches this gap, the up-stream neuron releases a chemical signal, which is processed by the down-stream.

So the state of the up-stream neuron depends very little on the down-stream neuron: if the down-stream neuron is in it's refractory period and can't process the chemical signal, the up-stream neuron can still fire all day, and the chemicals it releases will essentially fall on deaf ears.

That is a somewhat simplified view, and there is such a thing as retrograde signaling (chemical messaging from the post-synaptic neuron to the pre- synaptic neuron), but it's believed these signals have less to do with the primary flow of information in the brain, and probably relate to slower processes like modifying the strength of the chemical signal in the affected synapse.

</comment></comment><comment><USER21> "When your amygdala is active, you can't have empathy for others"

This is an excellent example of those aspects of our existence that are deterministic. No matter your willpower, you may be bound by biology to act a certain way. Part of being a good person is to recognize these deterministic effects and plan your life accordingly.

For example, if you get "hangry" often, keep a food item on hand at all times so that you can address your hunger before you say something mean to your partner et al.

<comment><USER22> bound may be too strict, plasticity allows for reshaping your emotions, senses, how you process them

<comment><USER21> I suppose that falls under "Part of being a good person is to recognize these deterministic effects and plan your life accordingly."

The type of "reshaping" you're referring to would go beyond willpower in a single moment. Probably something like cognitive behavioral therapy?

<comment><USER22> Yeah CBT is in that box and it's indeed not a oneshot effort more like a year- scale (if not decade) process. The ideas aren't that complex, but like music .. it's subtle and requires life experience.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER23> > 2.) When your amygdala is active, you can't have empathy for others

I'm curious is this is a mechanism behind social anxiety. In some social situations I very clearly lose the ability to think - all thats left is an empty mind and my body going through the motions. Its completely different than my regular way of living (from my perspective, maybe not from other people's perspective) but definitely makes it more difficult to connect with others and build friendships.

</comment><comment><USER24> > When your amygdala is active, you can't have empathy for others

Do being late for something and driving in traffic activate the amygdala? I think I can feel that combination drain my empathy. I'm trying to actively avoid those two things. Anecdotally, it sure seems to have a similar effect on quite a few others too.

</comment><comment> happy-go-lucky > I went to live in buddhist monasteries for a few years. There I was able to > turn my focus away from outside of myself towards my own body, feelings and > inner world.

That's from their Main Story.

I'm trying to tell myself that I can think effectively as long as I'm in focus.

</comment><comment><USER25> Would have been better form to more substantially attribute Stephen Porges' work here, only a small mention is placed under his chart.

<comment><AUTHOR> Great point, I feel incredibly indebted to Stephen Porges', both for my own internal well-being and the lessons I've learned and can share with others.

</comment></comment><comment><USER26> So, 2. + 5. + 6. might be the sources of bipolar disorders? Brain chemistry out of balance means that activation patterns are being modulated differently than before, and stress causes that in one way or another. Changed modulation might trigger changing/cycling states of peace or alertness, shrinking or widening associative activation. But why are some people more susceptible to stress than others? What is different?

<comment><USER15> Bipolar is not related to stress disorders. Please don't try to use this article as a primary source, because it misinterprets everything and tries to put a "self-help" spin on it, which is just going to confuse you more.

<comment><USER26> Why are you patronizing? And what are "stress disorders"?

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER27> Haven't read it completely, but hoping it has something related to guts' connection with brain</comment>


AOL Plans to Sell or Close Bebo - <AUTHOR> http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/04/06/aol-looking-to-sell-or-close-bebo/

<comment><USER2> AOL confirm as being notorious for making bad bets.

<comment><USER3> I really can't believe how often these giant corporations throw hundreds of millions of dollars at companies they then shelve or sell at a loss just a few years later.

<comment><USER4> There's some accounting voodoo with capex that brings incentives into the whole process.

<comment><USER5> No they are just clueless, Bebo was purchased for cash.

<comment><USER4> Perhaps I'll rephrase: they use the accounting voodoo as an excuse to buy stuff they have no business acquiring, as their MBA textbooks told them about capex and operational leverage.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> I've been on Bebo the site design is wonky and confusing. What do you expect?

</comment><comment><USER7> dumb and dumber...

</comment><comment><USER8> No! They be taking Bebo's moeny!

(sorry, couldn't resist. That typo just reads like lolcat to me)</comment>


T.E.C.H. Foundation Spring Beer Tasting featuring Family House - San Francisco - <AUTHOR>

We recently launched the T.E.C.H. Foundation ("Tech Entrepreneurs Caring and Helping"), the aim of which is to encourage those in the tech community to become more philanthropic through fun events involving fun people.
This month's event is a beer tasting at the Beer Hall featuring local beers. Tickets cost $50, which will cover your $30 beer tasting plus a donation to this month's featured charity, Family House (http://www.familyhouseinc.org/).
Family House is a local charity which serves as a home away from home for families of children with cancer and other life-threatening illnesses by providing physical comfort and emotional support, free from financial concerns.
Tickets are limited and must be purchased prior to the event by visiting http://techfoundation-familyhouse.eventbrite.com. For more information, you can also visit our website at http://techfoundation.weebly.com/.
Get involved! We hope to see you there! <comment><USER2> I see the date of the event is on your eventbrite site, but you might get more participation from HN readers by having the date right here -- readers may fail to realize this is coming right up.</comment>


Multiple.js: Experiment of sharing background over multiple elements - <AUTHOR> https://nexts.github.io/Multiple.js/ <comment><USER2> This is excellent work!

<comment><USER3> Thanks!</comment></comment>


Facebook Privacy Policies Draw Criticism by 15 Consumer Groups - <AUTHOR> http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-05-06/facebook-privacy-policies-draw-criticism-by-15-consumer-groups.html <comment><USER2> While I can completely understand some of the criticism leveled at Facebook, I don't understand the hysteria that is going along with it.

Everyone seems to be screaming loudly at Facebook right now but lets put things in perspective.

You should never put anything on the internet that you don't want others to see. You shouldn't talk about things online that you dont want others to hear and you shouldnt complain when a free website you are using has bugs in it.

All the people that are complaining have a choice here. Nobody is forcing them to take part in this. They are doing it voluntarily.

Stop using Facebook if it is becoming a problem for you.

<comment><USER3> _Stop using Facebook if it is becoming a problem for you._

That certainly sounds like a winning slogan for the company.

<comment><USER2> I was thinking more about the users as their rights seem to be the main topic of submission.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> In certain countries there is law protecting information about people held digitally. My understanding of this legislation is to allow the citizen to access information held on themselves and give them rights over that information.

<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Data_Protection_Act_1998>

How does this affect facebook? What about other European laws? It sounds like using data on a purpose collected on another premise, without agreement, could be illegal.

</comment><comment><USER5> While I normally do not endorse identity theft, I think it's time people start to dig out everything about Mark Zuckerberg and start to spam him, steal his identity to do nasty things with, harras him and so on, he needs to feel what it means to have all your data out there because his opinion is a big slap in the face of all these victims of such criminal activity, he is starting to behave like an arrogant #%$%#$@.

<comment><USER6> Two wrongs don't make a right.

The solution isn't to hurt Mark directly. The solution stop using facebook.

<comment><AUTHOR> In Germany a bunch of hackers distributed the fingerprints of politicians in favor of storing the finger prints of all the citizens:

[http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/03/30/german_interior_mini...](http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/03/30/german_interior_minister_fingerprint_appropriated/)

Two wrongs may not make a right, but there is a certain amount of satisfaction in such things.

<comment><USER7> Ihre Finger, bitte.</comment></comment></comment></comment>


Ask HN: Looking for workout inspiration - <AUTHOR>

Im 165 lbs (up from 150-155 after 2 kids in 2.5 years, i am a guy, i also crossed 30 during that timeframe). I understand working out is healthy and all that but i find it boring and pointless. I have found that unless i take a near fanatical approach to working out, i stick with it a max of 2 weeks.
I am assuming there are more people like myself who may find working out boring, and i was looking for suggestions and or inspiration. I thought working out like 'ninja warrior' would be fun, but i havent really got a whole lot setup yet, so whole a few pieces of wood on a crossbeam to hang from sounds neat,and for about 5 minutes (exagerating the shortness of the duration) it is. But, unless i put more together I suspect Ill keep finding it boring.
Thoughts? <comment><USER2> I find it boring too. What works for me is that I do weights (the routine doesn't vary) before I brush my teeth in the morning. Part of my daily ablutions ritual, I don't think about it or need to enjoy it, it just happens.

Routine works, I've done it every day for 20 or so years barring sickness/travel. I suspect people who get that 'high' from running or working out are just different from the rest of us.

Oh I force myself to run in the evenings before dinner, just 2km. I hate that too. Have only been doing that the last year or so.

<comment><AUTHOR> Ok glad im not the only one. Yea making it a habit is probably a good approach, although i wonder the health benefits (dont know the intensity/duration you do)

Running is another killer for me, unless im specifically going somewhere for a reason... why am i running. Ugh

<comment><USER2> Well, I haven't varied the routine much at all since I was 14 and it still feels intensive. It is an exhausting 3-4 minutes. I don't put on extra muscle, I maintain what I have. So I look much stronger than I am.

<comment><AUTHOR> Fair enough. Thanks for the perspective. just posting about this got me going building 'ninja' obstacles again in the garage, nothing crazy more borderline rock climbing similarity, but still something.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER3> What are you doing right now to work out in terms of how often you go, what you do at the gym, and so forth? More importantly, what are your goals? I'd love to help.

<comment><AUTHOR> I actually do little or not dedicated working out, we have pedometers from work, and i hit 7k easily during the week, and 12k over the weekend. I am pretty sure i can run a sub 10 minute mile (but would have to run one to confirm).

Goals.... one thing id like to try is eating basicaly paleo and working out to see if it relieves allergies, and i guess of course id love to be able to see abs and have a good uooer body, however to reach that level (and i suppose workout/paleo), will likely require a deep time/cognition effort

<comment><AUTHOR> Also ive been having more stiff necks/neck pain in the mornings and wondered if getting some sort of exercise would help, i grew up being pretty active, but since the kiddos i think there is a marked difference in level of activity.</comment></comment></comment>


On the linkability of Zcash transactions - <AUTHOR> http://jeffq.com/blog/on-the-linkability-of-zcash-transactions/ <comment><USER2> > Since no exchanges or web wallets support z-addrs, users are forced to > operate mainly through t-addrs if they want to use their coins.

This lines puts the whole thing in perspective.

The other privacy oriented coin - Monero didn't have a web or GUI based wallet for a long time.

This whole privacy aspect provides an interesting problem - most of the exchange volumes are off chain to allow faster movement. So you send coins to the exchange, it gets added to the larger pool ie cold/hot wallet, you trade and if you cash out exchange deducts money and then you see your coins on the wallet.

Now the only way you are sure that exchange has the coins is by looking at the cold/hot wallet address. If not, the coins can simply be "numbers" on an exchange.

Privacy focused coins means there is no provable way to see if the exchanges have the coins.

Sure, exchanges can engage in some form of "auditing" but for that access to the whole system is required.

</comment><comment><USER3> Interesting article, I remember reading about the different anonymous cryptocurrencies and ZCash was apparently the strongest from the reading I had done. This makes me want to look more into it, perhaps there is still more work to be done in this space or maybe the pipe dream is not actually possible.

<comment><USER4> The low transaction volume of the private/fungible coins means that time-of- transaction analysis like this should probably always be a concern.

The weird was-it-or-wasn't-it-surveillance during The Ceremony [1] is terribly odd IMO. But none of it could have ever occurred if ZCash were designed to be trustless.

I seriously wonder whether the algorithms used for ZCash or Monero or your- favorite-altcoin-with-a-new-signing-alg have enough runtime/experience to be trusted with their market cap. I'm optimistic about Monero at least, but TBH I don't have much research or evidence on my side.

[1] [http://www.radiolab.org/story/ceremony/](http://www.radiolab.org/story/ceremony/)</comment></comment>


Facebook limits spread of 'Boogaloo' groups amid protests - <AUTHOR> https://www.reuters.com/article/us-facebook-boogaloo/facebook-moves-to-limit-spread-of-boogaloo-groups-after-charges-idUSKBN23C011 <comment><USER2> Free speech balances delicately, and that should be debated vigorously, but it should not be treated as an absolute.

You shouldn't be free to incite violence. Nor should a company help that speech spread.

<comment><USER3> > "You shouldn't be free to incite violence. Nor should a company help that > speech spread."

only the fringiest of fringes argue for absolutes. everyone (else) is arguing about where the line is drawn. for instance, if we take yours at face value, you'd be arguing against the american revolution.

<comment><USER4> I find your absolutist interpretation hard to understand. I think if the occurrence of a situation in which violence is appropriate necessitates an exception to a rule, that doesn't necessarily indicate a bad rule. For example, even though the Founding Fathers were presumably well aware that circumstances may exist in which violent revolution would be justified, note that the constitution they drafted didn't make allowances for a new American Revolution to able to occur without any laws being broken.

<comment><USER3> the founding fathers didn't draw that line. they didn't say "free speech, except inciting revolution", they said "freedom of speech", particularly allowing for insurrection speech. the supreme court upheld this interpretation a number of times, for instance[0],

> "In Brandenburg, the US Supreme Court referred to the right even to speak > openly of violent action and revolution in broad terms"

no one is breaking any rules or laws here, as far as the constitution is concerned.

but see, that's all beside the point regarding facebook. they have no binding legal requirement to that same standard of free speech. the debate there is how much corporate censorship people are willing to tolerate without injury to facebook's bottom line and stature.

[0] [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_speech](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_speech)

<comment><USER4> > the debate there is how much corporate censorship people are willing to > tolerate without injury to facebook's bottom line and stature.

Facebook doesn't need to respond to what its users think it should do, because its users aren't organized enough to achieve the collective action necessary to threaten its bottom line. More generally, what Facebook "should" do, from the perspective of the public good, is a wrong question. Facebook's business model is fundamentally misaligned with the public interest, so even if we could pool our strength to force it to the right policies, it couldn't be trusted to enforce them faithfully. What's right for Facebook isn't what's right for Us; with perpetual struggle we could at best narrow the gap.

In contrast, a federated structure, like Diaspora, is conducive to democracy, because Diaspora is not a company with its own interests. Diaspora is Us. In a federated system, the question is not "what speech do I wish the monopolistic enterprise I've subjected myself to would allow". The question is "what speech will I allow on my server" and "what servers do I want to network with". These questions are inherently more democratic. When the right model is chosen, the problem of endlessly tuning parameters disappears. Fit can be achieved without all the work of overfitting.

So I use Diaspora. I don't have any friends. But I know I'm right.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> This is the first time I've heard the word boogaloo in connection with insurrection. Banning it makes it sound like a genuine threat/possibility, something I should learn more about.

Facebook is streisanding boogaloo.

<comment><USER6> It's not facebook streisanding, they've gone mainstream after years of alt- right/incel/QANON build-up. A lot of outlets are covering it and having not heard of it by now is probably getting on the back end of the bellcurve.

They're getting arrested routinely by FBI counter-terrorist police e.g. [https://www.justice.gov/usao-nv/pr/joint-terrorism-task- forc...](https://www.justice.gov/usao-nv/pr/joint-terrorism-task-force- charges-three-men-who-allegedly-sought-exploit-protests-las)

Hawaiian shirts, Race War Electric Boogaloo, "Great Awakening", the radical right has gone off the deep end

<comment><USER7> I've seen it around. Pretty sure it's just a joke taken way out of context, or I'm just not aware of it being taken too far. I've seen the amusing memes about ATF only knowing how to shoot dogs, then there's dog whistles for mildly illegal things like hiding their now-outlawed Bump Stocks and describing that as a "boating accident" i.e. "losing" them in a lake.

<comment><USER8> It's no joke when they show up to any demo wielding guns.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> sometimes I wonder if the cosplaytriot types are even aware that they're Googlebombing.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boogaloo_(funk_dance)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boogaloo_\(funk_dance\)) has the semantics I had expected for the syntax.

It even made it across the Iron Curtain: [https://youtu.be/QSc3uk8Q5w4?t=4881](https://youtu.be/QSc3uk8Q5w4?t=4881)

(1986, so a bit later than 1984's Electric Boogaloo, and a bit earlier than the 1989 end of the wall)

<comment><AUTHOR> The alt-right usage etymology is ... convoluted, but dates to a gratuitously terrible film sequel ("Breakin' 2: Electric Boogaloo", 1984), and came to be a go-to reference for any sequel or return, here, with race war connotations:

[https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/electric- boogaloo](https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/electric-boogaloo)

Appropriation of language and symbology is quite common among similar movements.

<comment><USER9> Yikes on appropriation. I had been assuming the "Trump on a Tank" image was obviously parody, both from subject matter and from the black power fist on the tank (on the mudguard just behind the sprocket). Now I wonder if this may actually be a case of "any sufficiently advanced ideology is indistinguishable from satire"?

<comment><USER8> It's meta that sometimes gets people injured or killed. It's also a sort of natural balancing act.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> What can we do, as a community, to limit the spread of fascism? It seems that it's quite a problem.

<comment><USER11> As a start:

Education.

People need to believe justice is applied equally: white as well as black, rich as well as poor.

Close the extreme and growing wealth gap in the country.

<comment><USER12> I'm always confused by the suggestion that education is some sort of panacea for totalitarian ideology.

Someone who is racist or fascist by definition rejects the notion that justice _ought_ to be applied equally and just about anything else that you would likely consider moral or proper.

And fascism also is not a function of wealth inequality. Fascism has historically grown out of the middle-class. Seymour Martin Lipset identified fascism as _" Extremismus der Mitte"_ in Germany. It's well at home in the petite bourgeoisie or in the US I guess you'd say the suburban middle class.

<comment><USER13> People like throwing education out there because it's less politically charged than anything meaningful.

<comment><USER11> Not really.

I see _fear_ behind most of the worst behavior in our modern politics. Education goes a long way to address fear.

Want politically charged? I suspect the reason the U.S. has its current president is due in part to a emasculated voting class lashing out from feelings of powerlessness. Education would have gone a long way to making them feel more relevant in a constantly changing economy/society.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER14> One of the more obvious psyops I've seen.

Last week, for about a day, media tried to pin the rioting and violence on some nebulous white nationalist actors but obviously that didn't test well in the face of overwhelming audiovisual evidence and remnants of critical thinking so they quickly returned to the tried minimizing and voxsplaining.

But apparently they're not quite done yet.

<comment><USER15> Can you elaborate on this?

</comment></comment><comment><USER16> These groups seem to have sprung out of nowhere suddenly and that smells off to me. Or at least they have appeared in the media suddenly in the last week. I don't watch too much news.

I suppose once the evidence and interviews with members on the ground occur we should be in a better position than assuming the boogaloo is not a fake boogeyman.

<comment><USER17> All Facebook groups are made up, and are brand new at some point (which is the same as having sprung out of nowhere suddenly). But the boogaloo folks who create and join these groups exist IRL.

</comment></comment><comment><USER18> I've been thinking for a while about what would happen if the slippery slope doesn't happen and big tech companies stick to censoring only the things that you can't say in nice costal elite company or can't say in China. I think I have finally worked out what the analogy would be for that. It is analogous to what some would call "systemic racism." Systemic racism is defined as a constant headwind against minorities that is composed not of organized pogroms against innocents, but as thousands of tiny cuts combined with a few _isolated_ pogroms that can be denied as the work of radicals. _Our_ violent criminals get a little less punishment than _their_ violent criminals. _Our_ political radicals are pushed away by the media a little less than _their_ political radicals. We have a _few_ instances of doing something clearly unfair to them, which are understood as exceptions and quickly forgotten, but whenever they do something clearly unfair to us, it's held up for years as an example of their moral inferiority.

That's the kind of constant headwind that can add up over time and distort a society beyond recognition. Why? Because the disadvantaged group will see their disadvantage get worse over time, because in the vast average of thousands of interactions, they slide slightly backwards. As the disadvantage gets worse, the bias gets worse along with it. This can play out in many situations, from the ones that seem totally indefensible ("What do you mean we're being unfair, he's a murderer!"), to the ones that seem ridiculously minor.

<comment><USER19> Just to be clear about your argument here - you are suggesting that Facebook changing its recommendation algorithm to not suggest that people join groups run by white supremacist paramilitaries advocating for a second civil war is akin to systemic racism?

<comment><USER20> COINTELPRO was an FBI program to discredit the Black Panthers, whose public image is marred to this day by the program. So these things do happen.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO)

> Beginning in 1969, leaders of the Black Panther Party were targeted by the > COINTELPRO and "neutralized" by being assassinated, imprisoned, publicly > humiliated or falsely charged with crimes. Some of the Black Panthers > affected included Fred Hampton, Mark Clark, Zayd Shakur, Geronimo Pratt, > Mumia Abu-Jamal,[18] and Marshall Conway. Common tactics used by COINTELPRO > were perjury, witness harassment, witness intimidation, and withholding of > evidence</comment></comment></comment>