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Rob Reiner's coming of age tale, an adaptation of Stephen King's short story The Body, is a classic. It was a great joy to share it with my sons and two of their friends on the weekend.
Set in the 1950s, four friends set off on a "don't tell our parents" camping trip, in search of the body of a missing teenager. They have ambitions of being heroes for finding the missing boy, even though they've overheard that he has been killed in an accident.
The four characters are each on a different emotional journey, leaving behind different challenges at home. Each one is explored with sensitivity and insight as the group approaches the inevitable conclusion of their quest.
River Pheonix is astonishingly good in this film, at age 14 or 15. This, and his performance in My Own Private Idaho, give us just a hint of what he might have achieved if his life had not spiralled out of control and ended so tragically and so young.
The construct of the film, with one of the boys telling the story as an now adult writer, adds some depth and perspective to the narrative. His closing wisdom about the friends you have when you are 12 years old is an interesting thing to reflect on.
With a great soundtrack, Stand by Me is rated M for frequent strong language from the four street wise leads. This is a must see.


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eleepAdvanced Members
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Celiac-Friendly Summer Camps
eleep posted a topic in Traveling with Celiac DiseaseIn case anyone is interested in finding a summer camp that's safe for a celiac kid to attend, I'm working for the next six months at Ballibay Camps, Inc. -- which is one campus with several different fine and performing arts programs (as well as more traditional camp activities). We have a new food program (this is our second year) focusing on sustainable whole ingredients that are locally-sourced and organic whenever possible (we also have a camp garden) -- we've been accommodating the needs of several celiacs over the course of the past three summers without needing the kids to bring any of their own food -- kitchen staff are conscientious about avoiding cross-contamination and using alternative grains and ingredients. The main camp website with our theatre and performing arts program (which includes further discussion of the food program): http://www.ballibay.com Our shorter, more traditional fine arts camp program: http://thefarmartscamp.com The rock music program: http://rockfarmcamp.com Our dance intensive: http://www.endlessmountainsdancecamp.com/ I can vouch for how great this place is -- I'm returning to teach here for the summer after 14 years away and kids have an amazing time here!
How Do You Deal With The Fatigue?
eleep replied to loxleynew's topic in Coping with Celiac DiseaseAfter about two years of being gluten-free, I still had a lot of fatigue and started seeing an acupuncturist around every other week. Within a couple of months, I had a lot more energy and I have also found that my reactions to cross-contamination are less extreme. Chinese medicine works on different principles, but basically I had what's called spleen qi deficiency -- which was largely caused by having untreated celiac for years. It does seem like my digestion overall is much better as well. So you might consider that if you're looking for ways to encourage the healing process.
Great Site For Quinoa Recipes
eleep replied to Roda's topic in Gluten-Free Recipes & Cooking TipsMy favorite thing to do w/ Quinoa is this vegetarian chowder recipe by Deborah Madison: http://whatdidyoueat.typepad.com/what_did_...a_chowder_.html
How Long Did It Take You To Heal?
eleep replied to clnewberry1's topic in Coping with Celiac DiseaseIt really took me about a year and a half to begin to put on weight. I went through a nasty breakup right after my diagnosis, which definitely stressed me out and hampered the healing process -- it also made me lose my appetite for a while. Even after a year an a half, I hadn't gained a whole lot of weight - but I'd always been skinny, so I assumed that was the way it would be. Actually -- that's changed a lot in just the past year -- I've gone from size 0 to size 4 -- and it's a very good thing, let me tell you. I've been gluten free for three years and about a year ago I started to see an acupuncturist every other week. Although I'd assumed that I was "healed" before then, the acupuncture has really accelerated the process even more and I have more energy and feel better than I ever though possible -- I've also gained a really healthy amount of weight since then and my weight seems to have balanced out. Also -- I've been making a lot of Socca -- which is kind of a chickpea flatbread -- it's all olive oil, chickpea flour and water -- no yeast or dairy -- quite wonderful. I've been using Mark Bittman's recipe, which you can find by googling Bittman and Socca.
Arranging To Work From Home
eleep posted a topic in Coping with Celiac DiseaseI'd like to petition my employer to be able to work from home 1 day a week so that I can work with a pot of soup on the stove or a casserole in the oven. I'll also have a bit more free time to shop those days because I'll cut down on commute time and be closer to stores which carry gluten-free food and fresh produce. I'm an editor working for a large university, so most of my work can be done from home -- and I'm fully confident that I'll actually be more productive with this arrangement. Has anyone else tried to set up an arrangement like this? I'm the most productive among my colleagues, so am in a good position to make this request. I'm also going to get letters from my g.p. and my acupuncturist to help support my claims. Anything else I might include?
Sushi Rice A Problem?
eleep posted a topic in Gluten-Free RestaurantsI swear I've eaten the sushi rice at my favorite sushi place since my diagnosis and not gotten sick, but they seem to now be insisting that their sushi rice can't be guaranteed to be gluten free -- I can't really get a detailed answer out of them (they use rice vinegar to season it), but I've run into this at a couple of local sushi places and I was wondering what the likelihood was that they might be being over-careful about the rice vinegar. Has anyone else run into this?
What Dry Cereals Have You Found
eleep replied to jmomee99's topic in Parents' CornerI like Nature's Path's "Mesa Sunrise" flakes -- they're amaranth and a few other gluten-free things. Not sugary in the least however -- I know that Envirokidz makes some gluten-free sugary-type things.
Talk Of Making Carry Out Containers Out Of Wheat Starch?
eleep replied to angel42's topic in Coping with Celiac DiseaseSince the original article was published in 2004, I'd be curious to know whether this idea ever actually took off.
Gluten Free Oats
eleep replied to rsm's topic in Coping with Celiac DiseaseI've switched to the Creamhill Estates oats with absolutely no problem and I think I'm relatively sensitive -- although I haven't exactly tested that very much. I had been eating the McCann's for a while and I think I occasionally felt a little over-fatigued and such sometimes with them (but there's been a lot of on-off stressful change in my life over the past year -- so it's hard to tell). I can't say that I "reacted" concretely to the McCann's, but I'm not going back, in any case. Creamhill Estates was either founded by a celiac or someone with celiac in the family and they package the oats with a survey on gluten-free eating, reactions, etc.....
Camping - Frustrations
eleep replied to corinne's topic in Post Diagnosis, Recovery & Treatment of Celiac DiseaseI don't know brand names off-hand, but there are some decent turkey and chicken-based jerkys out there that might provide a decent alternative protein source as well if they don't contain spices you can't consume. Dehydrated veggies and fruits can be cooked as well.
5 Days To Gluten Free
eleep replied to lob6796's topic in Coping with Celiac Disease2nd on the croissant -- actually, pretty much anything from a bakery involving really good baguettes and/or puff pastry (heck -- I'd buy a package of puff pastry in the freezer section and wrap it around everything I could see...). Asian dumplings -- potstickers. Pizza from the best local pizzeria I knew. Really good dark beer.
I've heard Colbert on an NPR interview (I think?) talk about having struggled with depression, so I'm not entirely surprised that he's interested in neurological and health issues.
Anyone Around Albany Ny?
eleep replied to bremac's topic in Meeting RoomI live in Florida now, but I'm originally from Niskayuna and I've lived in both Albany and Troy -- I'm actually thinking I might move back up there within a year or so!
Am I Old?
eleep replied to JerryK's topic in Gab/Chat Roomlol! The mulleteers! Does the guy with the floppy 80's rock hair and gold chain count? Seriously, I don't have any idea what I'm doing. I'm about to retreat back to not-dating until I figure a few more things out. I think I was sick for all my earlier dating experiences, so this is a whole new ballgame and it's overwhelming!
How Long Til 100% Better
eleep replied to holdthegluten's topic in Post Diagnosis, Recovery & Treatment of Celiac DiseaseI would also say that it took me a year to feel like I was 100% -- I'd also been sick for quite a while, so I didn't really have much of a sense of what 100% meant for me. So I got to be more and more pleasantly surprised as things got better and better.

subset: commoncrawl


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John Dailey
Prior to its settlement in the 18th century, Chili was the swampy and densely forested hunting grounds of the Seneca Natives, one of the six nations of the Iroquois. Although there is not enough information to suggest that these peoples established a permanent village in the expansive swamp that we call 'Chili', archived records buried deep in library shelves evidence that hunting parties transiently combed the woods, making tentative settlements near small streams and ponds. Deer, turkey, and other small game were permanent residents in Chili's primeval forests, with a visiting bear or wolf from time to time. Chili, before the metallic melee of the saw and plow, was a hunting haven; the wetlands a biotic heart, pumping out prodigal life that thrived on what these wet soils offered, including the Seneca.
What happened to this fecundity? To date, roughly 28,000 people have moved into these hunting grounds, clearing the forests and filling the wetlands, plowing fields, and laying extensive webs of asphalt, cutting open a landscape that can be only found in text and pictures. The Seneca were the first to leave. As the land subsided to the exploits of the white man, the wildlife began to leave as well, concentrating smaller and smaller populations in the fragmented remains. And what happened to the spirit of the hunter? Although graceful footprints of the Seneca are no longer found pressed in the mud, the heavily treded tracks that trod across our remaining open places reveal that the legacy lives; that unexplainable yet innate instincts are indeed heeded. The spirit of the hunter still persists in our heavily modernized landscape, and although they are a categorical minority, the heritage they preserve is one essential for the health of the Chili's wetlands, as well as Chili's identity.
John Dailey, an employee of Chili's DPW and a member of the volunteer fire department, is one of the few individuals that cherishes a more primal, archaic paradigm of man and the wild. He hunts, and loves it. John was fourteen when he was started hunting, an interest that was catalyzed by his father and his neighbor down the street. Ever since his introduction to this particular lifestyle, he has remained steeped in it, hunting deer and turkey in South Chili, near the Genesee Land Trust's Reed Road Bird Preserve. But, tradition aside, what compels someone to don a heavy camouflaged suit and a heavy gun in (usually) inclement November weather? What compels this particular breed of people to leave the comfort of their televisions and lazy-boys to tramp around muddy forests for hours on end? Don't forget, November is peak football season. "I enjoy going out, and filling my freezer," John described to me. "It saves a lot of money. Between Steven [my step-son] and me, we put five and a half deer in the freezer [last year]". You are probably asking the same question to yourself as I was: what does a half-deer look like in the wild? The half deer, as I later learned, was a gift from a neighbor, who shot a whole deer and decided to share. My second, more pertinent question: how long will two hundred pounds of venison feed John Dailey's family? "That should make us to November," John answered with a hearty laugh. "You know, that sounds like a lot, but if you have a 150 pound deer, you're probably only looking at forty to fifty pounds of meat. You got the hide, the bones, and all that. I do what I can to get every little scrap off of it. So you're only talking about a good sized pig out of five deer." Considering the fact that the hunting season opens November 20 and closes December 21, John can hunt enough in a small, permissible amount of time to supply enough meat for his family until the calendar flips to November again. Remember, the Seneca could hunt all year.
Hunting in the twenty first century bears some similarity to hunting to centuries past, but there are quite a few, remarkable differences. For instance, the Seneca did not have a Gander Mountain to supply them with sleek, perfectly honed broad heads, barrels, and bullets, all with price tags declaring small fortunes. Nor did they have to wade through the bureaucratic quagmire of training courses, permits, regulations, and leases. Hunting of yore was quite simple and unbounded, while the hunting of today seems to accrue much time and money before you can even climb into the deer stand. And if you are hunting by principle of subsistence instead of sport, is it even economical anymore? It can be, if you are willing to take more responsibility for the processes that transform 'dead deer' into 'delicious burger on the Char-Broil'. In addition to hunting his own animals, John processes his own animals, avoiding many production costs that are factored into the final market price of the meat you buy in a grocery store. Even though consumers of sliced sandwich ham, for instance, never touch the animal before its viscera is squeezed into plastic wrap, they are still paying for the slaughter, processing, packaging, and transport, which John does by himself for a marginal cost. "To butcher [five deer] and put it in the freezer, it is probably fifty to a hundred dollars out of my pocket," John stated. "You have to buy the bags, and you have to buy the spices. I also buy pork to add to the grind to make it sticky….If you put a value on the venison per pound, if you tried to buy it somewhere, it is twenty to thirty dollars a pound. You don't think of it, but it is a high end meat; a specialty meat. We put away close to two-hundred pounds [last year]….Most guys charge, depending on what you are giving them, sixty to a hundred dollars to butcher one deer. That is not including the sausage or stuff like that. The family that I started hunting with butchered their own deer, and I learned [from them]." By inheriting the knowledge of hunting and butchering from family and fellow hunters, John directly gleans his meals from nearby wetlands without having to drive to a grocery. And venison, of course, cannot even be compared to anything you can find in the meat aisle.
However, as unabated population growth continues to alter and destroy local landscapes and wild tracts of land that preserve ecological diversity, cultural diversity atrophies as well. Undeveloped open spaces, especially wetlands and woodlands, are not only necessary for healthy ecosystems; they are sanctuaries of local culture. These places offer a place to enjoy freedoms that subdivisions and private property cannot; rivers to paddle, wildlife to photograph, game to hunt, birds to watch…the list is unending. The diversity of utility in open places facilitates Chili's diversity of thought and perspective, which are essential components in the foundation of Chili's character. An ecosystem with only one or two species cannot function; likewise, a town with only suburbs and parking lots is trapped in precarious monotony, doomed if you will. Unfortunately, many people in Chili are either ignorant of, or opposed to the protection of healthy wetland ecosystems, which makes it much harder for John and other hunters to pursue their passion. Without wetlands, you will not have turkey and deer, as well as thousands of other species that we love and sometimes rely on. "It's not like they're wasted space, there is all kinds of life in it," John asserted. "You need them for cleaning the water you drink….Even the Green Way down here, you got that canal through there, there is all kinds of turtles, muskrats, ducks, and all kinds of birds….[Most people think] they're just wastelands, there is only a few [who don't]. Your hunters know that they are worth something, and maybe some of your environmentalists. People don't care. They don't know. [They feel that] 'as long as my brush is picked up and my streets are plowed, what else is there to care about'? It's a sad truth, but that's the way it is." Is it the only way though? Can we work for new truths that will create a healthy balance between the people and the environment? There are possibilities.
Interestingly enough, not only is John a hunter, he is also a hunter safety instructor, a position he willingly volunteers for in order to ensure that the spirit of hunting is passed to future generations. Even though the land is disappearing, and the hunting community is waning, John is the living link between the Seneca hunters and today's youth. "I think it has been declining, but the classes that we teach are full; it is on an incline," John described to me. It's whether they stick with it, since [the classes] are mostly kids. The problem is private property. People start buying it up and posting it, and they don't let anyone on it….It's tough to find a piece of property." Private property, coupled with subdivision and fragmentation, is an anathema to the hunting community in Chili. But there are also solutions. South Chili is replete with open space, and it is quite feasible for the hunting community to partner with large land owners, especially since most of the large land owners are farmers who lose a percentage of their crops to wildlife every year. In addition, large, public open spaces could consider limited hunting access in order to broaden the available range for hunters – the deer population has certainly expanded theirs. Letchworth State Park has allowed hunting for quite some time now, and it would not be unreasonable to allow hunters into other public spaces, with strict conditions of course. But whether or not these particular solutions are considered, we must not forget that our culture depends on hunting, and hunting is inextricable from diverse open spaces. The spirit of the hunter should always have a place in Chili's identity, for the hunter's insights enhance the value of untrammeled open space and wildlife.
"I value [wildlife] differently than they do. I look at it and its dinner, and someone else may say 'oh, it's pretty'. [Deer] are a beautiful animal, but that is the difference. It's pretty until it's in your backyard eating all your flowers, then it's a pain in the butt. But that's the kind of people you will deal with; either hunting it, or looking at it, or [saying] 'it's just something my car will hit'.


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Monday, January 23, 2017
Hell or High Water
Tanner: "This is Mr. Pibb. I asked for a Dr. Pepper."
Toby: "So?"
Tanner: "Only assholes drink Mr. Pibb."
Toby: "Drink up."
The boys have taken to robbing banks in west Texas to pay off a debt on the family ranch which is on the brink of foreclosure by the Texas Midlands Bank. Texas Ranger Marcus Hamilton (Jeff Bridges) along with his partner Alberto Parker (Gil Birmingham) are tracking the Howard's. Marcus is near retirement and is thankful for the last-minute reprieve from the rocking chair as he stakes out a bank he suspects the brothers will hit next.
The final showdown is action-packed perfection, but the real joy is the sharp dialogue written by Taylor Sheridan, accompanied with dynamic music from Nick Cave and Warren Ellis who also collaborated on THE PROPOSITION (2005).
11 comments:
- Bill Crider said...
Good movie. The DP comment made me wonder if someone had read Sherrif Rhodes.
- January 23, 2017 at 9:11 PM
- David Cranmer said...
Yes! I think they did, Bill.
- January 23, 2017 at 9:12 PM
- Prashant C. Trikannad said...
I like such movies, so I will be watching it. And then there's Jeff Bridges.
- January 24, 2017 at 5:18 AM
- David Cranmer said...
Jeff turns in a decidedly un-Jeff performance which I enjoyed. A real fine movie, Prashant.
- January 24, 2017 at 6:29 AM
- Scott Parker said...
Loved the DP comment. The sentiment is true. I half wondered if they were going to comment on DP with sugar vs. corn syrup. BTW, there is only one true DP.
The old waitress scene--"What don't you want?"--had me and my wife laughing out loud. We know folks like that.
Really enjoyable film. But, oddly, not filmed in Texas. WTH?
- January 24, 2017 at 8:16 AM
- David Cranmer said...
Scott, I laughed at the old waitress scene too though I have never been served by that particular personality—I can only imagine. Admit I have drank Mr. P in a pinch but prefer D.P. Must have been cheaper to film in Eastern New Mexico.
- January 24, 2017 at 8:29 AM
- Charles Gramlich said...
Definitely looks good. seems like we're living in a bit of a golden age for smaller movies and good TV
- January 24, 2017 at 10:49 AM
- David Cranmer said...
I would agree, Charles. Last few years have seen some remarkable films especially on the small screen.
- January 24, 2017 at 11:53 AM
- oscar case said...
I'll have to watch it!
- January 24, 2017 at 12:39 PM
- David Cranmer said...
It's a good one, Oscar.
- January 24, 2017 at 12:41 PM
- Elgin Bleecker said...
This was my favorite film of 2016. Good story, good acting. Glad to see that Oscar remembered it.
- January 25, 2017 at 6:21 PM


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I had to run a few errands in SoHo this morning and made a stop at the Apple Store. They had a single 12″ PowerBook on display and it was amazing!
The size has been bothering me until now. I was not sure that I would like the screen size / resolution, but now that I have seen it I can say with all honesty that I would not miss having 3 more inches of real estate if I had to get the smaller book. I still want to see the 17″ when it comes in, and would still like to check out the pending revision to the 15″ the rumor sites have already been whispering about.
The 12 inch book, has some very nice design elements to it. The hinge for the screen is terrific and seems more like the iBook than the TiBook. All the ports are on the left side with the slot drive taking up about 2/3 of the right edge. I would take a day or two to adjust to some new hand positions with the keyboard after 2 years with my current machine since everything is repositioned on the smaller platform.
Interestingly the machine had no internet connection since they are actually waiting on the Airport Extreme card and base stations to come in. In a quick browse I would say that apps started much faster than on my TiBook 500 and overall the general performance was nice. Apple did not ship the machine with Safari and defaulted to IE which was also a bit strange. Otherwise, I can't think of anything but wow. The size, weight and general feel of the machine were all excellent. My prediction is that Apple is not going to be able to keep up with the demand for these. The bang for the buck is the best they have offered. Loaded for less than $2000 + Airport Extreme which is a BTO option…


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Bridlington NewBuild
Glen Etive
Wheelhouse Added to Newbuild Number 3
Scottish Salmon Newbuild No.3
Gibson Fishing Vessel
Clare Anne
The Scotia
Clyde Puffer
Launched in July 2004, the "Mary Hill" is a detailed replica of a clyde coal puffer. The 42ft vessel has been commissioned by Sir Robert Smith and will be used as a pleasure craft for hire on the Forth & Clyde canal. The "Mary Hill" will be on display at the Scottish Boat Show being held this year at the Falkirk Wheel between 13-15 August.
Designed specifically for comfortable Scottish inland cruising, the accommodation comprises –
• 2 double cabins
• A spacious light saloon
• heads (WC)
• Galley area
• Full standing room throughout
• Wheelhouse steering position with all round visibility
• Side, fore and aft decks with rails all round.
Technical Specifications
Length Overall – 12.8m / 42 ft
Beam – 3.08m / 10.1 ft
Draught – .925m / 3 ft
Displacement – 19220kg / 42380lb
Engine – 50 hp
MCA – Category C (3)
RCD – C Inshore


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Family History UK is the FREE UK family tree, genealogy and ancestry community portal website, connecting ancestors and living relatives all over the UK.
Get help and support to help break down those brickwalls
|On May 22, 1974
|Irmgard Flügge-Lotz, Stanford University's first woman Professor of Engineering who specialised in fluid dynamics and control systems, died.
|Copyright by FHUK (Family History UK).version 1.3
|Find your ancestors today with a FREE 14 day trial to Ancestry.co.uk - Click here!
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We were pretty taken with the recent flick The Walk – Robert Zemickis's visually stunning look at the real-life adventure of Philippe Petite, the man who walked a tightrope suspended between the towers of the World Trade Centre.
We're also pretty taken with alternative film posters, which can often turn out better than a film's original one-sheet. Honestly, what would you rather see: half of a movie star's head, with a tagline about them living in a world where justice is a memory? Or the result of some of our most inventive graphic designers let loose on the most interesting intellectual property around?
This is where you come in...
To mark The Walk's triumphant arrival on Blu-ray, 3D Blu-ray and DVD, we're offering a 32-in LED TV and Blu-Ray player to the enterprising soul who can produce what we deem to be the best poster for the film, with the five runners bagging themselves a Blu-ray of the film.
To enter, Tweet us your best effort to @shortlist or email it to email@example.com. The deadline is Friday Feb 12.
So get doodling – we're looking for the most inventive posters we can find.


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GRAHAM HENRY'S reign as Wales coach is over following crisis talks last night between the New Zealander and senior Welsh Rugby Union officials.
Henry will leave his #250,000-ayear post this week, departing by mutual consent, according to the WRU.
The bombshell comes just three days after Wales suffered a 54-10 Lloyds TSB Six Nations Championship mauling against Ireland in Dublin.
Henry, 54, still has some 20 months remaining of a five-year contract which should have taken him through to the 2003 World Cup.
But Wales will now have a new coach - albeit probably a caretaker one - at the helm for Saturday week's Six Nations appointment with France.
"The Welsh Rugby Union general committee regrets to have to announce that after a meeting between the Welsh national coach Graham Henry and senior officers of the union it has been agreed by both parties that Graham will leave his position this week," the WRU said in a statement released last night.
"Both sides have thought deeply about this decision and believe it has been taken with the best interests of Welsh rugby in mind."
WRU chairman Glanmor Griffiths added: "The WRU general committee would like to thank Graham Henry for his contribution to Welsh rugby since his appointment as our national coach in August 1998 and would like to wish him and his family all the best in the future."
Griffiths will front a press conference at the Millennium Stadium today to discuss what the WRU term "the immediate way forward for the Wales national team".
A full written statement from Henry will be distributed then, but last night he requested privacy for both himself and his players.
The WRU say that nobody from the union, Welsh management, coaching or playing teams will be available for comment before the press conference. But it is certain to be one of the biggest media events Welsh rugby has seen in recent times.
Henry coached Wales in 34 Tests - winning 20, drawing one and losing 13 - with scalps including South Africa, England and two momentous victories over France in Paris where Wales had not previously won since 1975.
There was also a run of 10 successive victories; yet recent times were not so good, with Ireland (twice), Argentina and Australia all defeating Wales this season.
Despite last weekend's Dublin debacle provoking a national outcry, it had been thought Henry would ride out the storm. But clearly the time had come for a parting of the ways.
Henry, who also coached the Lions to a 2-1 Test series defeat in Australia last summer, now looks set for a return down under.
But, while the former Auckland headmaster ponders his future - possibly away from rugby - the WRU must find a new man, and quickly.
Wales A coach Mike Ruddock, former supremo at Swansea and Leinster and now in charge at Ebbw Vale, could be the short-term solution.
Another Kiwi Steve Hansen, recently appointed by Henry as his assistant, could be asked to take temporary charge of the Welsh until a permanent successor is announced.
But the man most rugby watchers in Wales would want to take over is Llanelli coach Gareth Jenkins.
He recently steered Llanelli to their second Heineken Cup semi-final in three seasons and has the pedigree - and respect - required for Welsh rugby's top job.
Former Wales forward Phil Davies, director of rugby at Zurich Premiership side Leeds Tykes, also has impressive credentials.
But whoever takes over will be entering a lion's den where pressure and expectation go hand in hand.


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In Chicago's overtime win against Detroit yesterday, Derrick Rose dropped 24 and hit a dagger triple at the end of regulation to save the Bulls. But that wasn't all he talked about afterwards. According to K.C. Johnson of the Chicago Tribune's Twitter, Rose said "I was mad, man. I'm sick and tired of people trying to take cheap shots at me. I gotta say something." Who brought this out from the reigning MVP? Charlie Villanueva.
With 4:31 to go in regulation, Rose drove to the rim on a fast break, and Charlie V smacked him across the arms and face. The foul drew blood on a cut on Rose's face and as the Bulls' point guard left to get the cut taken care of, the two players starting talk smack.
Because he's missed 23 games this season with an assortment of injuries, getting whacked is a touchy subject for Rose. He's no longer unbreakable. Opponents have seem his vulnerability. But still, that might not be his frustration's root.
Chicago fans have been complaining all year Rose doesn't get the same preferential treatment other superstar perimeter players like Kobe, D-Wade and LeBron receive. While Rose averages just 6.4 free-throws attempts a night, Bryant and James are both at 7.9. Wade actually averages less at 6.2, and even though Rose may not hit the charity stripe as often as the league's leading scorers, he's still in the top 10.
Now Corey Maggette does shoots it more often from the line, so Chicago fans do have some ammo. But then again, that's really Bad Porn's only redeeming quality right now.
Do you agree with Rose?
Follow Sean on Twitter at @SEANesweeney.
Follow Dime on Twitter at @DimeMag.
Become a fan of Dime Magazine on Facebook HERE.


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Membership Application Process
To set up your introductory meeting with a member of our team please contact us
Operational Risk Consortium Limited is a company registered in England and Wales with Company Number 05510364.
Its Registered Office is One America Square, 17 Crosswall, London EC3N 2LB. VAT Registration No. 882 3901 09


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For adults:
- 1 oz cake vodka
- 1 oz vanilla vodka
- 1 oz white chocolate liqueur (to make vegan, you can use chocolate syrup)
- 2 c vegan vanilla ice cream
- 7 Newman O's chocolate creme cookies, divided
- Frosting, colored with whatever colors you want
- Chocolate chips for eyes
For kids:
- Substitute all liquor/liqueur with non-dairy milk, and then follow recipe as is
Blend vodkas and liqueur (or syrup), ice cream and 5 of the Newman O's chocolate creme cookies in a blender until smooth. Pour into two daiquiri glasses. Top with frosting until it reaches the top of the glass. Stick the last two cookies at an angle on the tops of the frosting to make mouths. Add chocolate chips for eyes. Enjoy!
For kids, simply blend non-dairy milk, vegan ice cream and 5 cookies in blender until smooth. Follow directions above to finish.


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How to Select An Engagement Party Venue in Melbourne
Once a couple gets engaged, they would like to share this announcement with relatives, and friends and wish to share their joy with them. Hosting an engagement party to put the focus on the commitment is not new and these events might be kept in the home or even better at a nice venue, that can host the whole family. The place needs to be amazing and fit your guests and budget.
You can search online and discover various engagement venues in melbourne which can be suited to hosting your party. From there you can choose a few of the venues depending on your requirement. There are numerous aspects to be viewed before picking an engagement party venue.
Budget – You need to be clear about how much cash you would like to use on the party. Marriages are very pricey; therefore, choosing an expensive venue will not be considered the best choice.
Guest List – how many people you would like to invite will also be a big factor for choosing the venue. If there are a big number of visitors to be invited it's important to choose a venue that can serve everyone.
Refreshments Services – Select a location that could give you the catering services you need and provide products and food to your friends. You may call the venue and have them explaining about their menu and price estimates.
Distance – Make sure to pick a place that is easy for your guests and for yourself.
Availability – check out with all the venues whether they are available on the day you intend to host your event.
Visit Individually – It's important to make a trip to the venues you're considering. You are able to discuss regarding the various items and arrangements so that you will get what you would like and you want to have. You also can inquire about the different add-ons the chosen venue could offer you.
If you take into consideration the above-mentioned tips while deciding on an engagement party in Melbourne it's an easier job.


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Searchable Databases
Date story was published: Sunday, December 2, 1984
WEST LAFAYETTE, Ind. - When Joe Hall accepted congratulations on his 56th birthday Friday, he insisted he was really 58 years old.
"I aged three years last season," the Kentucky coach quipped.
Yesterday, Hall's aging process took another beating in the form of a 66-56 loss to Purdue. This time the UK coach let those who witnessed his youthful team's growing pains supply their own punch lines.
A combination of Kentucky turnovers and Purdue defense doomed the Wildkittens, er, Wildcats to their first loss of this young season. UK committed 22 turnovers, each seeming to quell a mounting comeback.
If that wasn't frustrating enough, Kentucky was whistled for 34 personal fouls. Purdue was called for 20 fouls as the officials made good on their pre- game warning to both teams that the action would be called close.
For all its starts and stops, Kentucky hung tough to the bitter end. Trailing by as much as 16 points (56-40) with less than six minutes remaining, UK whittled the margin to six (60-54) in the final minute.
Four Purdue free throws - the Boilermakers made 30 of 41 on the game - protected the victory.
Purdue's defense, both sides agreed, was the difference. Except for late in the first half when Purdue had to protect against its own foul trouble, the Boilermakers played man-to-man defense.
Particularly effective was a man-to-man press, which Purdue used to break out to a 15-4 lead in the game's opening 10 minutes. The pressure troubled UK again in the early minutes of the second half when Purdue built its 16-point advantage.
"Naturally, we think that defense won the game," Purdue coach Gene Keady said. "The great defense in the first 10 minutes probably won the game."
Playing strictly man-to-man defense, Purdue limited Kentucky's offense to two baskets in the first 10 minutes. At one point, the Wildcats went almost six minutes without a field goal.
Purdue missed the chance to blow open the game early because of poor shooting. Keady called it poor shot selection. The Boilermakers made only 30 percent of their first-half shots (six of 20) and actually fell behind by as much as five (24-19) before intermission.
UK got a lift from the return of Winston Bennett, who sat out last week's opening-night victory over Toledo because of a knee injury. Playing his usual damn-the-torpedoes style, Bennett contributed six points and 24 minutes, about twice the amount of playing time UK coach Joe Hall said he expected from the 6-6 sophomore forward.
"He's a great kid," Hall said of Bennett. "He gave a tremendous effort. He's a courageous individual."
But Bennett and his teammates were powerless to prevent Purdue's second- half breakout. As in the first half, the Boilermakers choked off UK's offense. The Cats were limited to just two baskets in the first eight minutes of the second half and had only four in the first 13 minutes.
That dry spell, which saw UK add only two free throws to its feeble offensive output, propelled Purdue to its 16-point lead.
"As I look back on it, I credit Purdue's defense," Hall said. "It was excellent. They made it hard for us to have any offensive consistency. And at the start of the second half, they took the game away from us."
Keady and several of his players said that meeting a team with the tradition of Kentucky inspired the defensive effort. One Purdue player, guard Steve Reid, added that UK's inexperience certainly helped make the press more effective.
"It helped a lot," said Reid, who scored 13 points for Purdue. "With 14,000 (14,123 to be exact) in the stands, that had a lot to do with it."
As will probably become a custom this season, UK's Kenny Walker received special defensive attention. Although he and James Blackmon shared high- scoring honors with 16 points each, Walker could work free for only four points in the second half.
"Every time I tried to post, there were two or three guys there," Walker said. "There were some times when the guards tried to force it inside when they should have taken the shot."
Purdue's defense produced a fast-breaking attack. When the Boilermakers took control early in the second half, outscoring UK 18-8 in the first 10 minutes, eight of those points came from an early offense.
"We just didn't execute well and they got three or four quick baskets," Blackmon said. "We weren't creating good shots inside like we wanted to."
Neither team created much of substance in the game's first six minutes. After almost five minutes of futile action, Kentucky had two points. Purdue had one.
During one stretch, UK committed turnovers on six of seven possessions. The exception was a rushed shot by Bret Bearup as the shot clock reached its final five seconds.
"We had turnovers of every form," Hall said. "Again, it was good defense."
The referees also had a hand in muddling the game. The crew - Jim Bain and Ted Hillary of the Big Ten and Reggie Copeland of the Southeastern Conference - called 27 fouls in the first half. At the 11:57 mark of the first half, 16 fouls had already been called.
"That was the closest game I've ever seen called," Reid said. "But they were consistent on both sides. That's all you can ask."
Both team captains, Reid and Walker, said they were told by the referees before the tip-off that the game would be called close.
"They said they'd call the hand check and not let anything go by inside by the big men," Walker said.
Kentucky, 1-1, returns to Rupp Arena for its next game. The Wildcats will play Southern Methodist University Tuesday night.


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Update on West Virginia Pooling Legislation
On January 18, 2016, West Virginia House Delegates Folk, McGeehan, Faircloth, Azinger, Wagner, Butler Ihle, Canterbury, Hill, J. Nelson and Kurcaba introduced House Bill 4037 which amends W.Va. Code §22C-9-7 titled Drilling Units and the Pooling of Interests in Drilling Units in Connection with Deep Oil or Gas Wells. In HB 4037, it is proposed that the following provision be added to the statute:
Notwithstanding any other provision of this code, the owner or lessor of subsurface oil or gas resources connected to a deep oil or gas well may not be required or compelled to integrate or unitize his or her interest with another owner's interest or be required to permit extraction of that resource. No surface operations or disturbances to the surface of land in a drilling unit connected to a deep oil or gas well may occur without the written consent of the surface owner that approves the operations or disturbances: Provided, That nothing in this subsection may be applied retroactively to void a unitization agreement or order entered prior to the enactment of the provisions in this subsection.
According to the statement contained in the Bill, the purpose of HB 4037 is "to prohibit the state from requiring persons with oil or gas rights connected to deep oil or gas wells to involuntarily integrate their interests in a drilling unit and to require a surface owner's consent for operations or disturbances to the surface of the land in a drilling unit."
We will keep you posted as this Bill progresses through the House and will send a Client Alert as to the outcome of any votes. Leech Tishman's Oil & Gas and Government Relations attorneys can be helpful if you wish to address impacts of this pending legislation on your business.
For more questions about this issue, please contact Leech Tishman's Energy Practice Group here.
Leech Tishman's Facebook Page: https://www.facebook.com/leechtishman
Leech Tishman's Energy Group Twitter: https://twitter.com/LTEnergyGroup
Leech Tishman's Company Page on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/leech-tishman
Leech Tishman Fuscaldo & Lampl is a full-service law firm dedicated to assisting individuals, businesses, and institutions. Leech Tishman offers legal services in alternative dispute resolution, bankruptcy & creditors' rights, construction, corporate, employee benefits, employment, energy, environmental, safety & toxic torts, estates & trusts, government relations, immigration, insurance coverage & corporate risk mitigation, intellectual property, internal investigations, international legal matters, litigation, real estate, and taxation. Headquartered in Pittsburgh, PA, Leech Tishman also has offices in Chicago, Los Angeles, New York and Wilmington, DE. For more information call 412.261.1600 or visit us at www.leechtishman.com.


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DJI GO App Videos
DJI GO App - the best way to fly
Using the DJI Go App is simple and easy to use and probides all the settings right at your finger tip. Familiarize yourself with the button layout of the app prior to flight and you will surely be in the air in no time.
To assist with your viewing pleasure whilst in the air, make sure you check out some of the handy accessories to block glare, shorter cable and controller straps.


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If I were cooking Pinto Beans they would get just a little ham and some onions plus a little salt and pepper. Navy Beans get ham, onions and a little carrot too. I also had about a cup of chicken broth in the fridge, so I added that to the water too.
l lb Navy Beans - $.99 - 99c Store & Dollar Tree
1 c baby carrots cut in half - $.50 - 99c Store & Dollar Tree - I only used about half the pkg.
1 onion - $.20 - on sale 88c lb.
1 c chicken broth - $.50 - 1/2 can left over from another recipe
Ham - scraps leftover from Father's Day dinner. (I always save all those odd pieces of ham in a freezer bag for use later. Great for soups and for Scalloped Potatoes and Ham)
Salt & Pepper to taste
Total - $2.19
These even look good cooking in the pot. Simmer half covered on med. low several hours until beans are soft. Add more water as it cooks down, but don't get too soupy. You want this to be a nice flavored broth, not water.
I have some really nice ham in this pot, that is going to be soooooooooo good.
Cornbread - Ok I do make cornbread from scratch, but this is house cleaning/laundry day, so I am using shortcuts. Having the beans cooking slowly on the stove all day means dinner will be ready when I am tired after all that cleaning. A little shortcut on the cornbread and I will have a fabulous clean house and dinner for my family. I always have this stuff on hand, it really does make decent cornbread and it is so economical too.
You will need two packages for an 8 x 8 dish. - Grease the dish really well.
Pour contents of two packages into a bowl - add 2 beaten eggs and 2/3 c milk. I had some left over half and half so I used 1/3 c milk and 1/3 c half and half. Add 1/4 c sugar & 2 tbl. melted butter and beat until mixed. Do not over mix - it will be lumpy. Pour into your greased pan and let rest for about 3 minutes. Bake in 400° oven for approx 15 to 25 minutes or until toothpick inserted in center comes out clean. Do not overbake.
Jiffy - 3/100 = $.66
Great cornbread, nice and hot and a pat of butter melts in and makes it even better.
This really is such a good meal. We added some chopped green onions and a little shredded cheese as garnishes. Plain is also fabulous, so garnish as you like.


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Looks like you can't just hint at stuff around here for too long, so here's my take on why citizen journalism is an impossible dream that we should shake off as soon as possible.
Before I launch into a tirade, though, I should define exactly what I mean by citizen (or participatory) journalism; namely, the theory that readers (or users) can effectively use the web to report on news and current affairs. That citizens, to quote the seminal We Media can play "an active role in the process of collecting, reporting, analysing and disseminating news and information".
Let's think about that. How difficult is it to collect, report, analyse and disseminate? Easy huh! Just aggregate information through something like RSS, or go to the game or event or be on the spot when something happens. Then you've just got to "report" on that, which also couldn't be simpler, could it not? Just write some copy or select the video or photograph and package it, not a problem. Analysis? Even easier: just a case of saying what you think about stuff. And the dissemination part? Easy peasy: simply develop and design a website, or join a website where people are doing similar to the above and that's that.
But guess what? If you've just completed any or all of the above, you're no longer a citizen, you're a journalist. You're investigative and on the scene, putting together balanced, objective articles on the events or selecting media to illustrate them, applying your analytic skills and then distributing the final product through what is commonly called a "news and information site" (previously known as a newspaper).
The only question now is whether you're any good at it. And I'm just guessing here, but as you've never studied or practised journalism, the odds are that you're not. There are exceptions, yes, but as a rule the quality 'aint great.
The very term is a somewhat insulting assumption. Journalists suffer a similar fate to teachers in that everyone is or has been exposed to their work on a very regular basis - everyone's got an opinion and they're not afraid to share it. As a bit of a reality check, when was the last time you encountered a "citizen doctor", valued a report by a "citizen researcher", took off in a plane flown by a "citizen pilot" or saw justice meted out by "citizen policeman"?
But that's not to say that readers and users of news and information sites (and the ol' paper-based versions too!) don't have a very significant role to play. Let's just not call it journalism, let's call it media instead.
Citizen media, in my book, is about web users publishing their photos, videos and opinions online (for the sake of argument, let's just talk about online). It's about blogs, YouTube, myspace and SMS/email/upload opportunities on sites like theage.com.au. It's where everyone can create their own media, in any form and for whoever might be interested - and if that's just their mum, then that's great.
In the context of a site like this one, citizen media is when our amazing readers send pictures, images, tip-offs and more by email or SMS. It's also about us finding great videos or images online, like we did during the World Cup. For sites like Norway's VG Nett it's also about harvesting content from some of their many bloggers using VG spaces.
The material that we get from this is great. Often the grainier and more "in-the-moment" the better. It can lead to stories we'd never otherwise have and frequently - especially in the case of VG and the Boxing Day tsunami - beat other news sources in terms of speed and unique content.
But it's not journalism. Journalism is a profession and journalism provides for the quality and breadth of content that keeps an enormous number of readers coming back for more. Sites that are based around "citizen reporting" are unlikely to ever have appeal outside of uber-niche areas. Citizen experts? Yes, and we have publications to cater to them. But, citizen journalists? No.
Of the "CitJ" sites that have been successful, Newsvine leads more often than not with AP stories. OhMyNews employs scores of editors and many participants are journalists (or student/amateur journalists) in Australia there are apparently two. I know one of them and he's an associate professor of journalism!
And as for sites like Digg - it's simply a more transparent form of editorialising. Inspired but not particularly new. One could quite easily argue that all good technology is regressive in some way and Digg-like sites are just a better way of finding and tracing what readers value and find interesting - exactly what we have always done at theage.com.au by tracking reader habits.
So bring on the revolution. Let's have sites that are built on citizen media and far greater and more worthwhile interaction between readers, journalists and editors. It's a riveting and powerful development in the world of online news, information and entertainment, but it's not citizen journalism and nor will it ever be.
- James Farmer
- More of Citizen
- More Age blogs
this article is a perfect example of why we need citizen journalism - it's poorly argued, misinformed, and it tries to protect the mythos of journalism at the expense of journalism itself.
and yes, i've studied journalism. and taught it. and practised it.
for a well thought out perspective on citizen journalism, go here.
- Posted by: barry on October 5, 2006 12:12 PM
"...journalism provides for the quality and breadth of content..." You're having a laugh, aren't you? Not much of this is evident in Oz. Don't they just re-hash some old tripe doled out by PR flacks?
- Posted by: Account on October 5, 2006 12:16 PM
Thanks Barry - an interesting link.
I have to say that the concept of Citizen Journalism holds little interest for me when it comes to breaking news, for all the reasons you've gone into. Is there a companion concept of 'Citizen Opinion'? That's what I find compelling (and underexploited here at The Age).
And please, JR - proofread your entries. If you're looking for authenticity, the errant punctuation certainly does it.
- Posted by: Twist on October 5, 2006 12:34 PM
Enjoyed the blog. More for the tangent I folowed after the following statement:
"If you've just completed any or all of the above, you're no longer a citizen, you're a journalist"
Remember the "work for the dole" scheme? If you are being paid for working, why wouldn't you call it a job?
Apologies for the tangent.
In relation to "citizen journalism" it would seem to be a case of individuals seeking (and/or providing) a voice that the mainstream media either won't or is unable to provide. The question is indeed whether what is offered is any good. Still a big chunk of society prefers to read garbage rather than good journalism, so why pay for it when you can get it for free off the net?
The benefit of the mainstream press is that it has the responsibility to provide work of satisfactory quality. It also doesn't take a genius to guess the editorial directions being given and when in doubt "Media Watch" will probably pick up on any miscalculations, omissions or errors.
- Posted by: Peter on October 5, 2006 12:37 PM
I sympathise James. But if you want a field of expertise where everyone thinks they're an expert, try graphic design.
Heh, not wrong, I too have sinned! - JF
- Posted by: TooManyArtDirectors on October 5, 2006 12:39 PM
The problem is that real journalists son't practice much journalism anymore. They rely on feeds from the AAP or CNN or on media releases. I'm doing research at the moment which requires me to read papers written in 1917 and I'm constantly astonished at the level of detail in reports - evidence that the journos actually got out and witnessed stuff themselves.
Because this doesn't happen anymore "citizen journalists" are filling the void.
- Posted by: Robert Bollard on October 5, 2006 12:44 PM
All power-mongers resist threats to their power. If reporting was fair, unbiased and accurate, most would have no problem with it. But instead its a miss-mash of information important to the ecconomic perpetuation of the media, and pandering to the more superficial interests of the public (for the same ecconomic gains). This is not a criticism of any one paper (or news service), but all of them.
Want examples? The continual concentration on the deaths of Irwin and Brock compared to many other deserving cases that warrent only a brief mention. Video footage of a Irwin-like child whose lizard was stolen versus the thousands of children who are dieing every day from causes that we could prevent. Coverage of the popular war on terror versus the genocides that are happining in other countries such as Tibet.
Publish to make money seems to be the basic requirement - so you can only expect Citizen Journalists and weblogs and so forth to proliferate. The information oppressed are on the move .....
- Posted by: lightsmith on October 5, 2006 12:45 PM
Something that might be worthwhile asking is whether journalism is a trade or a profession - a perennial debate amongst journalists and journalism scholars.
If journalism is a trade, then the example of a citizen doctor is less useful. Perhaps it's more useful to think of journalism like we think of home renovation - some people specialise in it, but there are tools out there to allow ordinary people to do so too. (This also parallels the quality of citizen journalism efforts - some are amazing, some are poorly constructed and unstable )
Ordinary people already have a number of the skills that journalists are taught - asking questions, writing stories - where ordinary citizens have none of the skills that doctors learn.
- Posted by: barry on October 5, 2006 1:09 PM
Hmmm ... no such thing as citizen journalism and yet I don't hear you arguing that Today Tonight, A Current Affair and Sixty Minutes 'journalists' are anything but.
Sounds like the exact same elitism that made me drop out of journalism at UQ.
- Posted by: Lee on October 5, 2006 1:13 PM
You do have a profile on the Age's website! Why didn't you want to tell us about it the other day?
Short but sweet: http://about.theage.com.au/view_profile.asp?intid=1400
Well I never - JF
- Posted by: Ben C on October 5, 2006 1:19 PM
"The very term is a somewhat insulting assumption."
You then go on to compare journalists to doctors. Now that's an insult!
Doctors acquire a raft of complex technical skills and take other people's lives into their own hands, as well as having to stay up to date with all the latest research and technology.
- Posted by: Ben C on October 5, 2006 1:31 PM
Sorry James, but there is less and less to admire about journalists in this day and age of spin. You are a mob of lickspittle yes-men-and-women who have given the government of this country the cosiest of rides. I don't trust a single one of you. Have a nice day.
- Posted by: Trevor Williams on October 5, 2006 1:41 PM
It is rather hypocritical for journalists to complain about "non-experts" doing their job given that they put themselves up as "experts" and "opinion makers" on every subject known to man. Maybe if we had fewer journalists and more "citizen" experts informing us on subjects such as industrial relations, conflict, ethnicity, the environment, arts, literature food, sport etc. (journalists know about everthing) we might actually some serious informed debate on these subjects.
- Posted by: Tim on October 5, 2006 1:41 PM
The trouble with the actual profession of journalism is that journalists are rarely ever uncompromised.
News is what sells, not what is newsworthy.
Articles must be popular, there are ads to sell, circulation to consider, data to gather from online readership behaviour etc.
Journalists must tailor what they write and what they report to these specifications in ALL corporate media. Also increasingly, to the diealogy and interests of whoever currently owns the media outlet.
Unlike James, I do not see a simple, clear cut line between 'media' and 'journalism'.
I'd also suggest The Age has trouble with this distinction, though this is not necessarily something I disagree with.
Ownership of traditional and new media outlets is being concentrated into the hands of a diminishing number of people and corporations.
This is cause for concern for many.
I see 'citizen journalism' as a web based phenomena in it's infancy.
There will always be lite, non newsworthy pieces, penned both by those who do and those who don't call themselves journalists.
There will always be crap articles, with irrelevant or reasonless focus written by those with dubious journalistic talents (and yes, some of these will be written by people with journalist qualifications).
But increasingly, there will be news sites and networks devoted to those who make the effort to get out there and report on newsworthy situations, or even by those who find themselves in situations that are newsworthy (say Iraq).
I think it's too early to dismiss an entire movement because many of it's proponents and active 'members' are not 'qualified' to report the news.
- Posted by: meg on October 5, 2006 1:53 PM
What is about journalists that is professional? They can write a sentence, or put together a news article? So can any satirist. The difference beteen a citizen and a journalist is not competence at all - it is independence. And as long as journalists continue to put their duty to their editor ahead of their duty to their readers (that is, as long as they act like employees rather than professionals), they will be regarded simply as publicists with pretensions. It is a trade, not a profession.
- Posted by: david on October 5, 2006 1:54 PM
I sympathize with your story also. Volunteering to write for publications and websites of any news provider is a fantastic method of having your work scrutinized and praised by editors and readers.
I'm sure you'll agree that perspective writers and journalists need audiences; I am disappointed that you, as a journalist, would not be encouraging this.
- Posted by: suzyo on October 5, 2006 2:02 PM
Indeed Tim has hit the issue on the head. I'd rather hear from a water expert directly on his blog than hear what he had to say filtered through the misunderstandings of a journo who is not expert at anything.
So for breaking news, those closest are best. More often than not it's citizens with their accounts and cameras.
And for expert news, the experts are best.
And for politics, well, journalists have become beholden to the parties. They are as much implicated in all the things that a wrong with politics as the pollies themselves. This is show especially in the United States where the best news program is the Daily Show and Fox news is just an arm of a political party.
Academics are much better journalists than journalists. Look for example at economist John Quggin's blog - http://johnquiggin.com/ . It's an impressive site, and especially so when you consider he's teaching AND he's got some top flight research going on (18 articles this year).
The only people who share this "Journalism cannot be replaced" meme seem to be the journalists themselves. I rarely hear anyone other than them utter it. Interesting.
It's all a bit of chuckles watching this industry circle the drain.
- Posted by: chuckles on October 5, 2006 2:05 PM
The best thing about citizin journalism is that it opens up the discussion about what qualifies you to call yourself a hournalist. Even better people are beginning to engage in the process - moving away from the passive consumption of news. As a result they come to realise that professional journalists still only present their (biased) version of events/news - it is not "THE TRUTH" as such.
Hopefully the end of "it must be true I read it in the paper ..."
- Posted by: being_sk on October 5, 2006 2:07 PM
Along with many other posters here, I'd more strongly agree with JF if journalists displayed consistently high standards of research, reporting and writing (use of language). Until they do, it's very hard to distinguish them from the better citizen journalists around, and trained journalists lose the moral high-ground accordingly.
Having said that, there are some terrible citizen journalists out there who prove James' point somewhat!!
- Posted by: Jo the First on October 5, 2006 2:11 PM
The main difference between journalists and citizens is time and money. Citizens who write well are usually professionals... working in a profession. Not journalists, who are not professionals, as they owe no duty to anyone anymore. Sure, there was once an era of journalistic integrity, during which time objectivity and a duty to report the truth reigned. Now the majority of journalists' voices are controlled by a few people at the top. This is not always the case, but it is largely the case.
Whereas your citizen doesn't have the time to gather, analyse draft, redraft and report because they're busy earning a dollar doing something constructive, not creating spin. It's not an issue of not having the ability, but not having the time or the inclination.
Some journalists have earned my genuine respect by breaking from corporate media ownership shackles. But the majority have not.
My point is that citizen journalism is, as you have pointed out, not journalism at all. The sad reality is that most of what is labelled journalism these days is even less deserving of the title. At least citizen's contributions are honest opinions, subjective, bias and otherwise. But so much of what we read in mainstream media is just "one man's" opinion being spruiked by a group of key tappers who have sold out.
If Coonan gets her way, it's going to get a lot worse, too.
So it may not be journalism, but that doesn't make it any less valid.
- Posted by: Hutz on October 5, 2006 2:13 PM
Every journalist working for The Age should be compelled to read this page of comments. There is an undeniable common thread amongst the vast majority of people's opinions here - that nobody trusts or respects the media anymore.
I think the article itself highlights the insecurities that journalists rightly feel in this day and age - no there are no citizen doctors, pilots, lawyers, dentists... but that's because they all do their jobs at a standard which can't be replicated by the public at large. Journalistic professionalism has taken such a dive that literally anyone can do it.
Go to AP, Reuters, hit ctrl+c, pay the licensing fees and hit ctrl+v. The rest of the crap in the paper is rubbish. TV is even worse.
- Posted by: Hutz on October 5, 2006 2:19 PM
Ha, try being a web designer...
- Posted by: pj on October 5, 2006 2:30 PM
Tim and Chuckles - interesting views. So you see it as a case of 'Those who can, do (and write about it, if they have the talent and time); those who can't, write about it'?
I'd hate to be a journalist. I'd be too much of a perfectionist to write anything without wanting to fully understand the topic at hand.
- Posted by: Twist on October 5, 2006 2:40 PM
Jon Stewart on the Daily Show pretty much said it all in the "I Report for CNN" piece he did last week (that applies to Faifax which has a similar program.) Clip on YouTube or wherever if you want to look for it.
- Posted by: Tim Chmielewski on October 5, 2006 3:00 PM
citizen journalist vs prof.journalist is a joke , have we already forgotten namoi and the wa wa saga , or ever switched on tele in the evening - cant miss a current affair or today tonight or pay tv's fox-news 'fair and balanced', if this is professional journalist's in media then i'll go with Mr.Citizen journalist any day
- Posted by: malchikmelb on October 5, 2006 3:04 PM
The problem is the large amount of bias, ignorance, two-sidedness and stupidity that professional journalists get up to which has totally erroded journalistic credibility.
Even a few years ago journalists only just beat the total bottom of "used car salesmen" in terms of public surveys of public trust.
While I sympathise with the lack of respect for the detail and rigour of what journalists need to do, most journalists don't do that stuff and are so no better and in fact worse than "citizen journalists." At least citizen journalists where their biases openly when they have them.
Here are some relatively recent examples of professional journalism:
Bias: Continuing to parot the line of haveing to start a war to get rid of "The weapons of mass descruction" in Iraq when almost half the population were dead against it and blind Freddy could have punched a hole in the shallowly constructed obvious lies that did not tally with what was comming out of the UN inpectors, the past intellegence reports etc etc. All publicly available information.
And yet Professional Journalists insist that they are protecting liberties and freedoms and don't just have their foot in a door to make a buck.
Ignorance: Tracey Spicer bubbly reading a "News" item stating "Australia invents the first renewable energy powered ship" over footage of a cat covered in solar cells. Had noone in the newsroom heard of sailing ships? And what about galleys - slaves are renewable!
Stupidity: Ignoring important stories people can do something about such as poverty, global warming and the reversal of the onus of proof in Australia while focusing obsessively on the Steve Irwin death (at the expense, by the way, of adequately reporting on the deaths of people who shapped the last 25 years of Australian life such as Don Chipp)
Two-sidedness: Thinking that "There are two sides to every story" and as long as we find some loopy strawman for the other side of the "debate" professional journalists can fairly deal with complex and subtle issues by dividing them up into two camps: one right and one wrong. Real problems have many points of view.
This goes to two other points: Avoiding the facts and Constraining the debate to the media controllers own agendas.
Classic example: a 1 page long column in page 2 of the Australian on a single by-election in the UK, first half was how the Torries had shocking lost the safe seat and how they were going down in the polls second half was how "New Labour" was a new and rising political force. Last sentence: "The seat was won by the Liberal Democrats."
So until paid journalists lift their game and become Professional which includes being ethical, I and many others will give far more credance to "citizen bloggers, informants, whistleblowers" because at least they are honest about where they come from and don't try to put themselves up as "Neutral".
- Posted by: Wayne on October 5, 2006 3:07 PM
I see two reasons to value 'citizen journalism'.
First is that the demise of objectivity and (unrelated) growth in communications means we are, and should be drawing opinions from the largest possible range of viewpoints.
Second is that, with no editorial line to push, there is none of the self-interested, navel-gazing narcissism that pervades much of the mainstream media. As media corporations become larger, and their content increasingly bland, there is no choice but to 'make the news yourself', and though journalists might be good wordsmiths, they often lack expertise in any other field.
Plus, since the media's complicity in the attack on Iraq, people now trust the mainstream media even less.
- Posted by: Will on October 5, 2006 3:17 PM
"...journalism provides for the quality and breadth of content..."
Hahaha....o dear! I have not really seen any evidence of this in Australia. The media never seems to be interested in the stories that I find important.
- Posted by: Melissa on October 5, 2006 3:28 PM
We need citizen journalism because a major issue such as the Defence Debate in Australia has been hijacked by politicians, academics and media commentators without military experience, known as Desk Warriors.
These people have a stranglehold on information being passed to the general public.
They are making a lot of money writing articles, books and appearing on television providing their expert views on Defence and Security.
But a lot of the info they pass on is not creditable such as they ignore inadequate equipment our soldiers are given to use on operations overseas.
This is only one example.
They have a vested interest in keeping people in the dark.
As a society we don't tolerate doctors, lawyers or plumbers who are not "trade tested," yet the mainstream media does not scrutinise the "war credentials" of Desk Warriors.
Not once has a leading media organisation asked why a Desk Warrior does not have hands on military experience.
Sasha Uzunov
freelance journalist (Balkans & Iraq)
ex-Australian soldier (East Timor)
- Posted by: Sasha Uzunov on October 5, 2006 3:33 PM
Seems like James has just written a resignation note to me - he wants out of the blog business.
Or is it that he would like a little more censorship on some of the other blogs. Bit hard to tell actually.
It's funny how many people say this kind of stuff to me - it sometimes feels like you can't be engaged with technology and the web unless you add -vangelist to whatever it is you do. - JF
- Posted by: Barb Dwyer on October 5, 2006 4:01 PM
bwaaahahaha. How quickly the paycheck can influence the man.
Heh :) Now a good question is what The Podcast Network is... journalism or not? Me, I reckon you've got some seriously talented broadcasters there... I wouldn't call them 'citizen' - JF
- Posted by: Cameron Reilly on October 5, 2006 4:06 PM
"Heh :) Now a good question is what The Podcast Network is... journalism or not? Me, I reckon you've got some seriously talented broadcasters there... I wouldn't call them 'citizen' - JF"
But then what is the definition of a 'citizen' journalist then James?
A bad writer? Untalented? Doesn't pursue all angles evenly?
What of the journalists I would classify as untalented? Are they then 'citizen'?
Who makes the call if these are the parameters?
I think that I mentioned it in the article - if you do the kind of things that a journalist does, then you're a journalist, the question is how good you are at it. Much of the time people don't - or simply don't want to (and that's fair enough) go through those processes, and frequently when they do, they suck at it. I'm not saying citizen journalism doesn't necessarily exist, just that it sucks and there are better ways of describing what people generally do. - JF
- Posted by: meg on October 5, 2006 4:13 PM
"when was the last time you encountered a "citizen doctor", valued a report by a "citizen researcher", took off in a plane flown by a "citizen pilot" or saw justice meted out by "citizen policeman"?"
I'm not sure when commenting on the latest idiocy of Paris Hilton or the inanity of John Howard's bucolic 19th Century vision of Australia became a life and death matter for the reader, but from that statement, it is. Journos aren't doctors, cops or pilots, they are wordsmiths.
- Posted by: Kultguru on October 5, 2006 4:15 PM
In some ways that's a fair point James - people can certainly get ridiculously evangelical about technology and the "information revolution". I remember feeling that way at blogtalk last year in fact :)
By the same token though, given that you have so far objected to comments, your say and citizen journalism , are you bringing some other biases in. (Though I guess if it's an opinion piece as opposed to objective journalism, this isn't necessarily the end of the world)
Just for the record though, other than getting paid, what exactly defines a professional journalist? Doing a cadetship? A degree? Years of experience? Having an editor to straighten out structure and language in articles?
- Posted by: col on October 5, 2006 4:20 PM
This article sounds like a PR piece for hacks, with a degree
Yes journalists are formally trained. They learn how to write about things in a format in which we can digest with ease. They learn how to gather, frame and produce copy. Farmer sets out the way in which journalists do this by telling us about the system, or technique that journalists use when they do so. Having such a method however does not mean that the journalist does not bring their own baggage to collecting, interpreting and distributing what they see, hear and write about.
Theres nothing wrong with the journalist journalist being citizen journalist. Farmer is right, there is a distinction to be made, it just may not be as clear as it once was.
As these boundaries gradually erode and new ways communication spread, accompanied by new professional sprecialisations such as 'online community editor', i think we can expect more of this 'boundary keeping' to take place; ie. 'im like you in some ways, but in other ways, im actually kind of different'. Yes you are special!
- Posted by: stuart raetz on October 5, 2006 4:31 PM
James, have you visited the site perthnorg.com.au yet? This site has been live for 8 weeks,and has over 180 registered Cit J's contributing stories to it. The content on the site is entirely sourced by Cit J's and site visitors. It contains a mix of original stories and links, and it seems to be gathering quite a following, despite not being supported or marketed by any large media outlets. It is worth a look...
P.S. I am enjoying the delicious irony that judging from your bio, you are not a "highly trained" journalist yourself. You, my friend, are a Citizen Journalist!!!
Spot on Liz, more of a writer though, whatever that is :) - JF
- Posted by: Liz on October 5, 2006 4:47 PM
and this article is what they call in the online communities a 'flamer'. it is meant to cause a reaction.
i'm not sure why it was written because people will make their own decisions. complaining, trying to defend or arguing about it is not going to change it. there is space for both, you just are going to have to accept that you don't have a monopoly on it anymore..
please concentrate on writing interesting articles instead and let the people choose, not that you can change that anyway.
i'm glad that you are starting take notice though..it's taken a while.
- Posted by: tom schuring on October 5, 2006 4:50 PM
View of the Citizen or Citizen journalism. I think it has its drawbacks, it sounds a bit impersonal. Too individualistic, too basic, almost inhumane. Sort of every one is for themselves, but it's not like that in real world. We have many ovelapping qualities in being human like feelings. It's not all about individual boundaries that "Citizen" carries. Boundaries are great for safety, they are not great for engaging, finding commonalities. So, I am interested in what your experiment will achieve. But I think approaching it with a light hearted attitude might be the key.
- Posted by: JERRY on October 5, 2006 5:05 PM
James: This is a big issue. Probably deserves a book or three. People have a deep interest in journalism and media. I also sense a frustration with mainstream media.
In my more depressed moments, I fear for the future of journalism. Too many people have horror stories about journalists, especially regarding ethical breaches and accuracy.
Many professional people such as analysts know more about their area of expertise than reporters allocated to those areas. If those analysts chose to write a blog, they would be more readable than reporters. What is it about a journalist that makes them employable? In some cases they cost less than thode analysts and others who earn big bucks for their knowledge.
Reporters can write and package their content in a way that makes it accessible to the general public. This is a under-appreciated skill. The ability to express complex ideas in a way that people can easily understand is not appreciated. Because most reporters write clearly, people confuse ease of reading with ease of writing.
Apart from clear writing, and the ability to package content into manageagle chunks, what else does a journalist have going for him or herself? Trust. People return to by-lines and mastheads they trust. Which returns us neatly to the fact that ethical breaches are killing trust and ultimately journalists' credibility. As I said, a VERY big issue. Thanks for bringing it up.
- Posted by: stephen quinn on October 5, 2006 5:20 PM
James, citizen journalism is part of the revolution you triumph, I prefer evolution � but I will refrain from playing semantics :)
The words are �citizen journalism�, the word �citizen� is there to describe the fact that it is different to journalism. That is not to say that it is any less valued.
In this day and age and for reasons I hope all your readers have made obvious, the role of citizen journalists is becoming more and more important.
If you free up the media so that everyone can have their say, then you only get objectivity. Up until then you�re stuck in the old media rut.
I think you simplify the value of Digg � transparent editorialising is new. Tracking reader habits is not.
On another note and since you directly refer to "Cit Js", there are more than two in Australia. There are 190 registered Cit Js at PerthNorg and yes, Eric Shackle is one of them.
Hi Bronwen, I was referring to OhMyNews and it was anecdotal - JF
- Posted by: Bronwen Clune on October 5, 2006 5:33 PM
Quote: I'm not saying citizen journalism doesn't necessarily exist, just that it sucks and there are better ways of describing what people generally do. - JF
This is where you and your blog respondents disagree - 90% of journalism by professionals in papers like the Age does in fact suck. I'd just as soon read the amateurs version - its got its own benefits. There are good journalists out there, usually in the UK and US. Australia can count its ones on a hand.
- Posted by: pete on October 5, 2006 5:56 PM
If you look at the mass media empire through internet gogles you will notice the emporer has no clothes. Journalisim is an art, research is a skill.
- Posted by: Alan on October 5, 2006 6:34 PM
Please, black comment me!
Sure thing Brendan
- Posted by: Brendan on October 5, 2006 7:22 PM
what's amusing is that most contemporary journalism doesn't fit your description
one wonders if this artice was taken from reuters or Ap
That's quite a compliment ;) - JF
- Posted by: Stephan Gyory on October 5, 2006 7:45 PM
Seems to me the only thing ''professional journo's have over the ''norm''...is an ability to turn nothing into a story...generally by adding a pack of LIES...false tangents...smears...and twisted inuendos...which all seem to be part of the ''training'' to be an editor.
HOWEVER...I like...this format of an article being used as aspringboard for community commentary...I think it is revolutionalizing newspapers...
HOW long before papers STUFF it up...by planting...distorted facts and stories to create....''interest''
- Posted by: paul on October 5, 2006 7:59 PM
citizen journalism is an extension of free speech, it also creates media diversity which should always be encouraged.
- Posted by: ray on October 5, 2006 10:17 PM
"As a bit of a reality check, when was the last time you encountered a "citizen doctor", valued a report by a "citizen researcher", took off in a plane flown by a "citizen pilot" or saw justice meted out by "citizen policeman"?"
Wow, amazing. You're right! You need training to become a doctor, or a pilot. Even a ploiceman. Because these are professions where knowledge and skill is necessary.
Journalism... well, put it this way mate, some of the bs lazy journalist out there at the moment are the reason 'citizen journalism' is becoming highly regarded. Remember, necessity is the mother of invention.
"Yes journalists are formally trained. They learn how to write about things in a format in which we can digest with ease. They learn how to �gather�, �frame� and produce �copy�. Farmer sets out the way in which journalists do this by telling us about the system, or technique that journalists use when they do so. Having such a method however does not mean that the journalist does not bring their own baggage to collecting, interpreting and distributing what they see, hear and write about."
Or simply put: anyone with the capacity to write and observe is capable of being a journalist. IT'S TOO EASY.
Please don't bignote yourself and your colleages (I direct this comment at no-one in particular, sort of a spray over the entire profession)
- Posted by: Jim on October 6, 2006 12:22 AM
Sounds to me James that you're still very much in awe of actually being a journalist.
I don't see journalists are not respected. But there is a lot of healthy cynicism and suspicion about motives. So it should be. Too much power to influence governments and community opinion for that to go unchecked.
Clearly the training for a journalist is vital. Although I suspect most of the real training happens on the job. The ability to whip together a story with super tight deadlines is something to be admired. That said, in my working life, every, and I mean every project I've been closely involved in that has got news coverage has had important facts either missing or misreported in that coverage. Every one. I've also been involved in projects where it's bleedingly obvious that journalists have been the toys of spin-doctors and people with entirely suspect motives. That's not a denouncement of journalism, it's just a recognition that journalists can be vulnerable. Citizens ripping in with alternative sources of news puts journalism as a profession on its toes and that's precisely where it needs to be.
PS: Nice work Barry (12.12).
- Posted by: Deferens on October 6, 2006 9:27 AM
I've been following this thread and didn't really have anything to contribute until a thought occurred to me. When I was 19 I wrote a novel in a hell-for-leather two week rush. Don't go looking for it, because it is not published. Because it is crap.
However, imagine if I had published. Don't call me a "citizen" novelist. Just novelist would do. Or at least "author".
I suppose the "citizen" tag can be added if the contributer isn't getting paid for the effort. But I think it's a bit redundant.
So to get back to my ill-fated, crap novel, is it "citizen novelization" just because the only glowing reveiw that can be applied to it is "the most original assortment of cliches ever written"?
- Posted by: David A on October 6, 2006 11:03 AM
James, I have said many times in public forums and on my show that I think the majority of bloggers and podcasters don't consider themselves to be journalists and in fact shudder at the suggestion. I place myself in that category. I can't speak for the rest of the TPN crew, but I know none of them are "professional" journalists, so I guess that makes them "citizens". We're just people who are talking, on blogs and on podcasts, about things that we're interested in and passionate about. Is that journalism? I don't think it fits the usual definition.
The question your employer (and now that you've drunk the kool-aid, you as well) need to seriously consider is: what impact will people reading and listening and watching millions upon millions of blog and podcasts every day have on our ability as "the media" to continue to generate the fat, juicy margins we've enjoyed in the past? And, if we cannot sustain those fat, juicy margins, will we continue to have to let go of "real" journalists every year and replace them with Naomi Robsons? And how long can we continue that trend before we are even less relevant as a source of "news" than we are today?
Bill Gates, Warren Buffett and Rupert Murdoch all have said publicly in the last 12 months that the era of "big media" is rapidly coming to a close. But you are free to disagree with them of course. :-)
- Posted by: Cameron Reilly on October 6, 2006 11:54 AM
Citizen journalism. No thanks.
If the media started depending on untrained people for their news reports, they'd better make Media Watch a 1 hour program and cancel the Walkley awards.
Putting tabloid reporting aside, good journalism deserves to be called a profession and good journalists have the upperhand over citizen journalists in terms of training, code of ethics and standards, resources, research, access, balance, objectivity and credibility.
I want my news from trained journalists who abide by a code of conduct and who have the means and resources to gain a first hand account from the original sources.
When you depend on citizen journalists, you have to question their background, their credentials, their accuracy, and motives.
Not that I believe everything I read in the media.
Schools also have their part to play in educating their students to read the media critically, and to think independently.
- Posted by: Tristan on October 6, 2006 1:02 PM
I want to throw in some balancing comments following my previous slagging off about the quality of the news report journalism. I am a big fan of investigative journalism. I don't think the citizen journalists can match the time and resources needed to dig up things like government corruption and all that stuff investigative journalism is good at. (Hardly worth mentioning I don't put the ACAffair trash in the category of investigative journalism.) The Age used to be hot on that sort of thing. Way back in the late 70's I was told by one of those old crusty old-school journos that the only reason that The Age could do the investigative stuff was because they generated so much of their income from the classified ads. They weren't behoven to major advertising clients so they could dig deep on issues that could get big business and government's noses out of joint. Presumably those days are gone. But they need to come back and quickly.
- Posted by: Deferens on October 6, 2006 1:28 PM
I think that any argument which has as a premise that the quality of journalism in Australia's traditional media is high is, well, pretty unconvincing. This is not to say there's nothing worthwhile being said, but I very frequently find myself thinking "How is this getting published?" So far as being an informed person with well thought-out opinions goes, I think the "news" is next to useless. For one, the news we get is what someone else has decided is newsworthy, or entertaining, or not offensive to advertisers. Then there's the fact that so much of journalism is about being up-to-the-minute rather than being detailed, considered analysis. For idle entertainment, I check out the Age. But to learn something? Give me a journal, a book or even the opinion of an intelligent amatuer over the false objectivity of professional journalism any day.
And Lee - I dropped Intro to Journalism at UQ after one lecture which consisted of (a) lecturer's lengthy self-congratulation and glorification of journalists (b) listening to "You're the Voice" while supposed "journalism mentors" danced down the aisles and (c) being told that media ownership was a complete non-issue! And I'm meant to be looking to these people for research and analysis? PLEASE.
- Posted by: Caitlin on October 7, 2006 12:29 PM
Interesting! I tend to agree with Adam McEwen, who said "History is a Perpetual Virgin endlessly and repeatedly Deflowered by successive generations of F---ing Liars."
- Posted by: Elle on October 8, 2006 5:52 PM
Sasha, noice. Where is the bulldog journo when someone in a suit who's just spend half a billion dollars doesn't want to explain what went wrong and who's actually responsible for their stuff-ups (see the Seasprite issue, though it think that was more in the order of $1 billion worth of mistake).
Elle, lovely metaphor.
James, there's another example which does support soem of your contention. "Citizens" make calls into crimestoppers each day. Their calls are recorded and, in Victoria, sent out to local police to investigate. First, though, they do a bit of work to find out if a crime has actually been committed, then if there's any clues at all in the file to point them in the right direction (an address, a full name). Information is evaluated for accuracy and integrity, collated, analysed (and that's a specialised and lengthy part of a course in itself) and disseminated to investigators.
Can the average Bob do all of this himself before sending the information into Crimestoppers? He could. Is he likely to be able to do it, or do it well? No.
How many journos run down the sources of their information and look for original data? Or how much is a summative assessment or secondary analysis based on original data they've picked up?
- Posted by: Ulsyus on October 9, 2006 2:17 PM
Prof Stockwell once described print journalism as writing an article that the average 7 year old reader could understand, as well as anyone else who chooses.
Who what where why and how... it aint rocket science!
- Posted by: jv on October 9, 2006 5:01 PM
Its short sighted to think that collaborative communities will only affect traditional and 'new' media. It will in fact affect many areas - every sector that has passionate, committed people willing to do research to solve a small (or large) problem. And share their answers. For free.
Citizen doctor and/or researcher? Hmmm lots of cases, watch the movie Lorenzo's Oil for a well known one. 'Wiki' it for a quick summary. Will every citizen be able to cure major diseases simply through passion and research? No. But don't think it doesn't happen. Pharmaceutical companies are underwriting large forums to provide patients with peer2peer support - while quietly plugging their drugs.
Citizen lawyers (Creative Commons), citizen venture capitalists and peer2peer banks (Zopa).. well the list goes on. 'Citizen' anything has long been with us - as long as there are people with an urgent and focussed need to do something, but now we have the means to collaborate and as me dear ol' ma used to say "two heads are better than one, so BOTH of you do the washing up!" :)
As usual with online revolutions - it hits the incumbent media first and then flows on to other sectors. Think Amazon vs bookstores. Yessir, the underlying technology and infrastructure of the internet is coming of age, and will affect ALL sectors. Don't kid yourself otherwise.
- Posted by: Laurel Papworth on October 10, 2006 6:56 AM
Citizen Jounalism? I prefer to call it Citizen Opinionism. Lets face it, there are few areas where the average citizen can report "news" in a breaking fashion. What is usually going around the internet these days are opinions on current issues in the form of free lance writing made available to an audience.
Given that we spend less time socially interacting than we used to, its great that people are still expressing themselves and allowing others to share their views as well irrespective of their opinion.
As to people doing "research" using the internet or what have you to write "stories", all stories require solid evidence. Volume/source of evidence doesn't necessarily dictate the relevance of someones opinion.
- Posted by: S2H on October 10, 2006 12:08 PM
Want further reason for the negative response to 'Journalists' versus Citizen journalism?
Why did we not read the following on this web site (or any other mainstream newspaper)?
"A young Tibetan nun has been shot dead by Chinese border patrols and at least one other Tibetan was killed while on their way into exile in Nepal. A number of international climbers at Mount Cho Oyu base camp saw Chinese military personnel kneel down, take aim and open fire on a group of 70 Tibetans, some of whom were children as young as ten."
Citizen Journalism is not based on loyalties and ecconomic mandates. Give me the truth any time.
Erm - are you arguing that citizens are free from bias, loyalties and economic necessities? - JF
- Posted by: lightsmith on October 10, 2006 12:45 PM
Citizens free from bias, loyalties and ecconomic necessities? I probably implied it of course, but the answer is no - almost. Citizen journalism can be biased and involve loyalties - but the impact of ecconomics is far less I think.
I don't know who is to blame, for example, when something happens in the world but is litle reported. Who makes the decision to ignore it rather than highlight it? How many times does your editor veto one of your stories? Who makes the decision that an Irwin Lizard-Boy is more important than humanities neglect of about 3000 children per day (leading to their deaths)?
Citizen Journalism (I prefer the word amateur those most probably dont) provides at least a forum for news that should be heard. Of course, sometimes it can be biased or inaccurate but then no press in the entire world has a blameless record on that account and it is unreasonable to expect less.
Thanks for responding. It shows you care. I believe that there is an immense responsibility on the all media, whether citizen or otherwise, to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Well, that's my opinion anyway :-)
- Posted by: lightsmith on October 10, 2006 1:29 PM
Whether you or anyone at The Age likes it or not, James, what is called 'pro-am' journalism in the States has just been given a huge kick along by Reuters, who have provided $100,000 to Jay Rosen's new project, NewsAssignment.net, some of which will be used to employ an editor.
While those in other professions sneer at bloggers, information managers and researchers everywhere are being shown the ropes of aggregation and RSS so they can maximise their clients' current awareness of what's flowing around the blogosphere. An argument like this one about citizen journalism is fast becoming obsolete, as bloggers' reports are valued for properties that mainstream journalists often don't have: an obsessive desire to get people talking, to check the facts and correct them if needed in close to real time, to update discussions and include fresh information from other sources. MSM and blogs are feeding off each other all the time.
It is true that the print newsrooms still provide a lot of the hard news that is fodder for all other media. However there's a synergy between blogs and papers in larger populations (not necessarily here, BTW) that is not going to go away anytime soon.
- Posted by: genevieve on October 10, 2006 7:48 PM
Congratulations, folks - some very well thought-out responses to what unfortunately isn't a very well-considered attack on journalism. The irony of seeing these responses demonstrate so very clearly why we urgently need more citizen journalists to act as a corrective to the very limited quality of industrial journalism in Australia certainly can't be lost on anyone.
I'm amazed to see the old chestnut 'there aren't any citizen doctors' rolled out again - well, there aren't any self-proclaimed freelance doctors, either, and yet we see plenty of those in journalism...
Good to see a few familiar names amongst the respondents, too. I'm coming late to this party, and won't add a lengthy comment here - as this site is claiming to be a blog, I'll respond blog-style with a commentary on my own site, at http://snurb.info/index.php?q=node/603.
Hey Axel, we can't be churning out 5,000 word articles all the time - James
- Posted by: Axel Bruns on October 17, 2006 9:48 PM
It is obvious to the many viewers here. That you have a few insecurities about your so called profession, that you wish to get out in the open.
Professionalism is the attitude you have in making your money or income for the services or product you provide. Good on you James for going against the flow!
Journalism after all is the recording of important events and issues that effect society and influence democracy (hence the journal part). After all it was citizens that started the first printing press, in the early years of information gathering for the public.
Just in case you are wondering! Yes I am what you refer to as a "Citizen Journalist" and I am proud to be doing something worthwhile for the community and the society that I am a part of. As well as encouraging others to do the same and become more involved in a healthy democracy in this country.
If you are interested in my website. It is www.citizenjourno.com.au
Good luck with your professional career!
- Posted by: Ross D. Hopkins on April 21, 2007 4:53 PM


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