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Skip to comments.'Conservatism' -- Social movement or Political movement?
Posted on 05/31/2006 1:32:23 PM PDT by Dominic Harr
If I may, I'd like to ask for an informal 'poll' of FReepers:
There are 2 'Conservative' movements in this country.
All I would like to know is, what % of us are which? Please respond and say which, or both.
When you get right down to it, the federal government really has only three domestic tasks under the Constitution:
Secure our borders/defend the country.
Count everybody every ten years.
Deliver the mail.
Almost everything else is to be left for the states to do.
I disagree. It divides us.
I would argue that we can't explain ourselves to anyone. That the names, labels, etc we currently use only push people away from us, because the words literally don't mean what we are.
The traditional def of 'Conservative' that everyone seems to use is "opposed to change". Which does not describe us at all. And anyone who sees changes they want, will automatically assume that they can't be a C.
So I believe that it is past time for us to define ourselves. It makes no sense to tell people, "We are Cs. C means 'against change'. And we want these changes."
It's time for us to fix that. And part of fixing that means looking at those who call themselves C -- ALL folks who call themselves C -- and look at what is common amongst all.
Then *that* is what a C is.
Hence, I'd say, C means 'careful'. There is a definition of C, like in 'Conservative Estimates', that perfectly sums up what we all believe in.
It weakens the C movement to divide us. It strenghtens the movement to unite us.
Ha! Burn!
I think the idea of 'news' is what is worthless. News is about what is new or shocking or different. What we need is 'information'.
If an info org was going to cover daily Iraq happenings, then it needs to have *all* the info of everything that happened in Iraq. Stuff that is good, stuff that is bad. Facts, rumors, political, social, etc. Then people can surf thru it all, and learn what they want.
'News' is something else entirely.
Someone who believes as I do = Statesman/Conservative.
Someone who tells me what I want hear for my vote = Republican.
Someone who tells other people what they want to hear for their vote = Democrat.
Someone who calls me vile names and demands I vote for him = Liberal.
Someone who tells me once I have voted for him, I need never vote again = Communist.
I developed this list as an aid to categorize those who wish to engage me politically.
Great list. That's like those 'irregular' verbs.
I made a mistake with my taxes.
You are cheating on your taxes.
He has been charged with section 8 of the Federal Penal code . . .
Political Conservative. Social libertarian.
"that everyone seems to use"? Well,no, I don't know of any Conservative that equates 'Conservative' with 'opposed to change'. Refusal of radical schemes sometimes, but generally favoring steady improvement -- often toward localism/subsidiarity, education reform, and regulation against corruption.
Opposing statist centralizaton schemes as Conservatives have in the 20th century isn't merely "anti-change", but we have been mischaracterized that way by some liberal dictionary editors, and by Leftist political advocates.
100% absolutely BOTH!!
I have no idea.
But it'll take a website, not a print or TV media. They have limited bandwidth (so to speak).
I think if you read back into this thread, you'll see that this is in fact true. For one good example, post 123.
And that is certainly the def that the outside world knows us for. I've seen Cs on TV rationalize it as, "We only want a change *back* to the way things use to be", and that sort of rot. And this is why Cs are seen as wanting to stop progress. It's why Ls have now tried to switch to calling themselves "progressives", as opposed to Cs 'anti-progress' image.
And this is a big problem with kids growing up now, looking for a political identity. We *must* take back the debate. We must explain who we really are.
And it has nothing to do with being against change.
On other issues, much the same. I oppose interference with my fundamental right to make my own arrangements with others absent force or fraud.
Absolutely beautiful. How perfectly articulate. Thumbs up to you!
"Fiscal conservatives" are another thing altogether. Some of them aren't especially conservative about either cultural issues or economic freedom. Not that "fiscal conservatism" is a bad thing, or that they're bad people, but they aren't a team on the same playing field as the other traditionalists or libertarians.
One thing that accounts for a lot of the differences: whether one takes automatic knee-jerk positions or whether one tries to think things out for oneself. Ideological divisions are real, but much of the time people are just throwing slogans at one another, rather than trying to think things through.
Ha Ha Ha!!! I like it... I love it... I want some more of it!!!
Actually, this is the type of thinking that I'm trying to highlight, with this thread.
We better all be on the same team, or we're doomed in Nov. If we can't come to understand that, I don't know what will happen long-term.
'Political' conservatives are folks who believe in being careful with what govt does -- folks who believe in smaller govt, accountability, strong defense, etc. Not all of us are 'culture' conservatives. But they are the ones who were responsible for the '94 R party victory that brought them majority status.
Yet 'cultural' conservatives seem keen all over the place to label political conservatives as not being "real" conservatives. That pushes away the political Cs.
This is critical, I believe, cuz right now, the Rs are scrambling for ways to "pacify the base". But they're talking about things like a Constitutional ammendment to ban gay marriage . . . playing to the 'social' conservatives. Which will only further alienate us 'political' conservatives.
Which will only make things worse for the Rs.
"Intellectually Bankrupt." That's what "conservative" means if it means someone who claims to be conservative.
We don't need to tailer the word to fit what modern conservatives are, or even claim to be. The word either describes them or it doesn't. Anything else is something other than a conservative approach to the problem.
Well, whether we like it or not, that's the word applied to our grouping of beliefs/philosophies/voting patterns.
So I think it would be useful to come up with an accurate definition of "who we are".
Like I said, the media uses one definition. That def does not describe us. So I disagree with you -- pushing *our* definition of who we are and what we stand for is absolutely a 'conservative' approach.
Unfortunately, the Ls are united thru their hate of all things Bush-related.
And in the past 2 elections, a disjointed C movement has beaten a unified L movement. If we can find some way to focus on that which unites us, while still hashing out the things that divide us, we *can* turn this country.
I want to push *My* definition of "red" to include other possibilities like... "green." After all, "modern red" has so much more going on under the hood these days.
Words mean things, if you changes them to convenience a political convention they lose their original meaning. You can change conservative to mean the attitudes or philosophy of the modern political movement, but you will not be able to converse with those using the older meaning. You will be speaking a new speak.
'Red' can also mean a communist, tho.
Much like in this case -- a political movement exists. A large group of Americans, actually a majority, believe in 'smaller govt, strong defense, etc'. We call this 'Conservative'.
The current 'definition' that the world uses to describe us, is 'C = opposed to change'.
They have taken control of the debate by defining us.
Well I say it's time we define ourselves . . .
Social Conservative here with elements of the second.
I don't mind rocking the boat however.
Do they?
Whats wrong with that?
Well I say it's time we define ourselves . . .
You use words to describe something based upon what the word means, you do not change the word's meaning to fit what you are trying to describe.
This much I am certain of -- the majority of voters are politicallly conservative.
It's the 'social' issues that chase many people away from voting R.
Many socially liberal people vote D cuz they don't like the social Cs angle. But like with Reagan and with the contract with America, when a person comes along who promises not to push the 'social engineering' policies but instead focuses on the 'political C' ideas of govt accountability, etc . . . then we find out that the vast majority of Americans are politically conservative.
The problem is by far most people, on social issues, are "live and let live". And the social Cs agendas against Gays and such scare many, many voters away from the R party.
Words change their meanings with time.
Just like 'Liberal' doesn't mean what it use to mean. Now it means collectivist, basically. And in this case, I'm not inventing anything -- one definition of 'Conservative' is 'careful'. As in 'conservative with money'.
I'm not changing the meaning of the word at all, therefore. I am using a 'different' word, or in fact a different description of the same word, to describe who and what we are.
I completely disagree with your premise, I'm afraid. Maybe it would be more helpful if I asked you . . . what solution would you propose? What words would best describe people who are 'politically' in favor of smaller govt and strong defense?
See, I knew Bush was a liberal!!! ((Smile...))
How does smaller government translate to more government accountability? Accountable to what; more government, Or the people? The former means... well, more government, and the latter means more direct democratic populism; we might as well call ourselves democrats.
By 'politically conservative', I mean 'politically careful'.
Smaller govt means less govt intrusion into private life and business.
Accountable means when someone is caught doing something wrong, they are fired/prosecuted, etc.
Which doesn't require any more govt, what an unusual suggestion.
This is an interesting conversation, one I didn't expect to need to have.
In that speach, Reagan was saying all the same things we're talking about here.
Outstanding find, thank you.
This is the only way we can save the R party.
"Our first job is to get this message across to those who share most of our principles. If we allow ourselves to be portrayed as ideological shock troops without correcting this error we are doing ourselves and our cause a disservice. Wherever and whenever we can, we should gently but firmly correct our political and media friends who have been perpetuating the myth of conservatism as a narrow ideology. Whatever the word may have meant in the past, today conservatism means principles evolving from experience and a belief in change when necessary, but not just for the sake of change."
Yes -very nice!
I found it to be a good test.
Well you have to understand where I'm coming from to understand my answer.
I'm an arch-conservative liberal. Smiler to a libertarian but with a great mistrust of humanity, and no faith at all in the politics of populism. And as such, as much as I like liberty I believe there are limits. As it's impossible for any democracy to be founded on a constitution so strong as to remain permanently inviolate from the effects of the system, so too, there are no guarantees on freedom. Thus I prefer a more organic solution to problems, ie, a solution that relies on natural human instincts and behavior as a fundamental element of its operation. That's the part of me that's conservative. I'm so far to the right in a traditional way that most people on FR are to the left of me.
Thus I'm wary of any popular reactionism, because any such movement would have its only justification in popular will, which however morally and politically orthodox it may be in its ideals at the moment, it is still morally ambiguous in the long run and prone to progressive ideology as a consequence of its form.
So as to your question, I'm not sure, but I do believe the modern political movement under discussion is, (based upon the thoughts and understandings I've gleaned from your posts, and assuming you are a fairly garden-variety example), an idealistic one. So perhaps Idealistic Neo-Rightist Political-Populism. Of course such as description doesn't beg but demands the question... so it can't be used in our modern political arena as it's to complicated. In any case conservative only describes part of it, and not the most significant vis-a-vis its modern ascendancy.
Which doesn't require any more govt, what an unusual suggestion.
What you are talking about is some kind of governmental oversight. How do you implement oversight in a government without adding to said government? Note: I was talking in a general sense as a political philosophy, not the particulars of our system in which we have extra elements of government who handle that.
That is a mouthful.
Altho I'd quibble a bit -- no 'idealism' here at all. In fact, 'Idealism' is what I'm fighting against.
I'm suggesting that politically 'conservative' means careful. Careful to only push for policies and solutions which are proven solid workable systemic solutions.
As Reagan pointed out in that speach, it is the 'ideologues' who are the problem with the R party. The folks on this thread who say, "if you don't believe x and y, you aren't one of us, regardless of your other views".
How do you implement oversight in a government without adding to said government?
By voting the bums out, of course.
My point is we need to vote for politicians who aggressively police their own party. When they don't, when they turn their backs on misdeeds by "their own", we vote them out.
For the past generation, liberalism has become more identified with the status quo and change is seen as coming from the right. That's why I said that "fiscal conservatives" didn't seem to be playing the same game as traditionalists (social conservatives) or libertarians (economic conservatives).
There's a lot that's admirable in the older style of conservatism (which you apparently are calling "political conservatism"). I'm not a "movement" guy. But the problem is that such old style, centrist conservatives tend to accept liberal policies if they've been entrenched for a while.
I'm not talking about social security or environmental protection so much as about the judicially-imposed social changes of the the last thirty years or so. I don't think you're going to get any kind of major "rollback" of government economic and social policies (if such a thing ever does come, it will be part of a bigger shift that makes current left-right thinking irrelevant), but I don't trust the Rockefeller-Ford sort of Republicans who simply contented themselves with administering the policy changes imposed by the left.
Are you talking about accountability in a criminal sense, or as representatives of the people's will?
If the former, all that needs to be done is define what is unacceptable corruption and prosecute according to the law. But if you mean the latter, that could easily lead to government dependent on popular mandate for any action, and eventually government would devolve into rule by plebiscite. I don't see that as careful.
"And if the town votes to allow prostitution or recreational drug use?"
In Nevada, all of the cities forbid prostitution but most (perhaps all) of the counties permit it. Cities do have strip joints.
Perhaps if someone wanted to open a club where you could go to smoke a joint I think there might be liability issues to think about. Might be solved with an overnight or 12 hour stay on premises required. Or usage of public transportation. I don't know I'm not a dope user.
I suggest that you wait until Monday evening.
If it needs done, then do it right. If it isn't worth the effort to do it right, then it didn't really need done.
Short answer it is both and inseperable.
The effort to split the two is a Moby product of the Lackoff "win with words" propaganda scam to try and revitalize the left by arguing the myth that the two are seperate.
To: Dominic Harr
You guys like taking advantage of the organizational skills and the dedication of religious conservatives, but boy you hate it when it comes time to respect them for what they value!!!
Oh, you hit that one right between the eyes! Nice shooting...
Are all cultures equal? Hell no...
Only a cultural Marxist would think so.
Some just have an ax to grind with the Christians and the Jews... I do not. In fact, I have very little problem with the Hindu or the Buddhist (I have practiced the martial arts all my life, which is really a form of Buddhist movement meditation).
The Islamics and neo-pagans are another story. Their cultures exist only to tear things down.
Like a few quislings here and there, who have no other purpose but to tear down the conservatives in the Republican party and the culture that made this country what it is, I would rather just openly wage war upon them, just as I would unceremoniously nuke Mecca if given the opportunity.
It is no coincidence Islamic pagans hate Israel, Jews, Christians and Western Civilization. The entire basis of Western Civilization is Mosaic Law, something both the Neo-Pagan Left and the pagan Islamic thugs cannot abide and wish to destroy.
It is truly the only reason some are here now and within the Republican party, interlopers from the left who can only defeat America and the Republicans by rotting the party from the inside out.
They want more open primaries, non-partisan state legislatures (making it easier for them to hide and gut the primary process) for just this reason; like they want in Oregon, like the one Leon Puñetta tried to pull off in California, or some other electoral tampering scheme.
There are a few litmus issues you can tell who the enemy is. Just because they have a designer label, doesn't mean they can be trusted...
People that want radical change BACK to Americas roots..
And that "conservatives"(of all types) are in fact RINOs.. and FEAR the word radical..
When radical political change is what most/many "conservatives" what..
When the "center" is defacto leftist(and it is) radical change is needed.. Gutting the federal givernment is(has become) a radical political platform.. Just USING the word conservative IS disinformation.. Words are important.. and the left has bogarded the language we use for far too long..
Time for a CHANGE, a radical change, when the "right" decides what "the WORDS" mean.. ANY so'called conservative knows that radical change is needed and the Federal Givernment NEEDS to be downsized. gutted like a fish..
Any that DON'T believe that are either a democrat or a RINO.. and that to happen (the gutting) would take radical political change..
NO... conservative MEANS "more of the same".. "Conservative" in ANY of its iterations.. Gradations of the word "conservative" is defeatism masked as intelligent.. using the word DEMOCRATS/leftists have given us.. and its as incorrect as the word "progressive" is.. There is absolutely NOTHING progressive about socialism.. And absolutely NOTHING conservative about destroying it.. It is purely a radical quest..
There is a time for conservatism and a time to be radical.. NOW is NOT the time to be conservative.. So I think you're premise is WRONG.. UNless you are a RINO.. talking to RINOs.. in this thread.. In that case, sorry.. d;-)~',',
Even your tagline has a super "ring" to it! The ring of solid American freedom and liberty. I just makes me wanna salute!!! Salutations to you, Sir Francis...
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.


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On my local computer everything is ok, but on the web hosting site the Permalink Settings are wrong.
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subset: commoncrawl


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Myles Kimmerly
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Andrew LaCross July 5 at 2:30am
Any locals wanna play a round tomorrow morning?? Look ing for some one to throw with.. hmu with a text 2484671671
Ryley Millar March 7 at 5:40am
Can anyone tell me how the course looks? I few of my buddies and I are trying to find a nice course to go to that's opened for the winter while we are vacationing in the area. Any information will help!
Read next comment down course re-opened on November 6th.
Open all year. Usually one of the last courses to lose its snow in the spring. But now with less trees it will get more sunlight, so maybe that'll change.
Chuck H. January 29 at 5:27pm
Does anyone know if Myles Kimmerly is open now, or will be open this spring?
Currently open. The snow does get a little deep out there.
Did they repair the damage from the wind storm out there?
Yes, the storm damage was cleaned up and the course reopened on November 6.
A lot of trees missing, but most of the fairway lines are the same. Mostly on holes 13-16. Luckily no baskets damaged, and only one teepad (#16) got cracked.
That's good news. It's one of my favorite courses to play!
Ric Evans October 15 at 2:12am
Hola Folks - some fun dubs at Rocky Top & Odyssey Farm this weekend - check it out! http://www.discgolfscene.com/tournaments/Rocky_Top_Odyssey_Farm_Fall_Doubles_2015
richard bell September 18 at 4:08am
Open we are yet?
Not yet. Leelanau County is accepting bids for the project. It will open again, but it's still weeks away, and may not even open back up this year.
Nick Pacific September 3 at 7:05pm
Has the course been reopened yet?
Not yet. The county has it on its list, but their list is pretty long. Soon we hope.
Ok thank you, what a bummer
Do you know if they pulled the baskets out?
Baskets are still in, but holes 12-16 are extremely dangerous to play. Most of the tees and baskets back there are buried under huge fallen trees. Luckily no damage to pads or baskets, but real hard to even walk around.
Ok thanks for the heads up, bummer I will be up there next weekend and I won't be able to play it. Maybe I can get an invite to the private backyard course ha!
Joshua N August 31 at 11:05pm
Bring your own doubles tournament at pioneer trail park in Escanaba Mi on Oct 17th!!! We have five bands signed already and hope to have another 5 by the time of event! We also have pumpkin carving contest and costume contest along with SICK AIR FMX...... Camping on site also or we have Best Western as sponsor for event and they will give discount on rooms for the weekend :) anyone interested let me know.... Only four hours from traverse city
richard bell August 9, 2015 at 12:14pm
No, sorry. Course closed until further notice due to excessive storm damage and dangerous hazards. Page will be updated once it's open again.
Man... I hope it's open by the 22nd. We're planning on heading up that way for a weekend, and Hickory Hills gets way to crowded to play after early morning. I love this course and was pretty eager to play it after the upgrades to the tee pads. Any other suggestions on good courses to play in the Traverse City area?
Kingsley civic center (kingsley) hanson hills (grayling) rivers side (petoskey) mount mc sauba (charlevoix)
Herman park (suttons bay)
Thanks, Kyle. I'm not sure we can make some of those courses due to distance from Traverse City (suppose to meet back up with the wives for lunch or dinner), but I'm going to try and push us into that direction. A lot of those courses would be new to us. Hanson Hills has a tournament that weekend, but we've played it before (love that one too). I appreciate the assist! :)
Marc Hamlin - Team Tilley's August 3, 2015 at 11:07pm
Myles Kimmerly disc golf course suffered a lot of damage from the huge storm that rolled through Northern Michigan last night. The course is CLOSED until further notice. Leelanau County officials need to assess the damage and make sure the park is safe to use. There are obviously more pressing needs going on out here at the moment, so it may take a while before the course reopens.
Mike Spagneto August 2, 2015 at 8:51pm
Such a bad ass course. Will be back.
Greg Argyle June 6, 2015 at 11:56pm
The concrete teepad installation project at Myles Kimmerly Park was a success! Thank you to everyone who came out and helped, and of course, Tilleys Party Store And Disc Golf, Northern Waters Disc Golf Series, and Grand Traverse Vapor, for all your amazing contributions.
The course will remain closed until Monday, June 8, to allow for the concrete to cure longer..
RETIRED ... June 6, 2015 at 1:26am
Forms are ready for crete. Thanks to everyone that helped so far. Maybe we should start a local disc golf club with like 30 or so members who could help do this MASSIVE amount of work. Oh well maybe next time we put concrete tees in at myles kimmerly we will be "more prepared".
Greg Argyle June 4, 2015 at 2:00pm
Cement teepads are being installed. Will re-open Monday, June 8
Josh Allen May 25, 2015 at 2:20am
Left a yellow star teerex on hole 18. Gladly will give a reward and pay for shipping if returned.
- br33zy - September 19, 2014 at 6:51pm
Left an Orange Echo Star Destroyer on hole 1 last year thanksgiving weekend on hole 1 in 12 inches of snow.
Jay B June 15, 2014 at 9:50pm
Left behind a pink star monster on 18, gladly pay a reward and shipping for its return
Rick Little March 20, 2012 at 9:39pm
Baskets are up, i don't think they ever take them out, there's no reason since its only a dg course and not a ski hill, got my first ace on hole # 11 there 2 days ago and i played again today, it was hot, def bring hydration
Nick Pacific March 20, 2012 at 2:16pm
Anyone know if the baskets are in? (that is, if they were pulled for the winter)
Misty Howard June 28, 2010 at 6:42pm
i would like to join the tourney for sleeping bear summit but can't get threw with the website...i will be traveling from texas so would like to make sure i have a spot in rec women


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Today the Canadian Health Minister said, in a nice way, that his country should block bulk drug sales meaning to American states and municipalities that have been indicating interest. Helen Palmer reports from the Health Desk at WGBH.
The Commerce Department's report on personal income and consumer spending, due out tomorrow, is thought of as a pretty good gauge of how wokers are feeling. But Marketplace commentator Robert Reich says all workers and all salaries are not created equal.
Some Republican lawmakers do. They're calling on the White House to consider the national-security implications of the proposed Unocal sale to Chinese oil company CNOOC. From Washington, Jessica Smith has the story of CNOOC's plan to win the hearts of Americans.
Last week the House changed its plan for proposed cuts to federal funding for public broadcasting, after public oppostion. Most funding was restored. In a report produced with support from the Economist Magazine, Marketplace's Nate DiMeo takes a look at the changes and challenges facing public TV.
In the interest of full disclosure, our parent company, American Public Media, would have been affected by the cuts.


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I am trying to make an author box that displays the author's Twitter username if it's available. I tried copying this code:
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the_author_meta('twitter') but for some reason it just outputs my Twitter username (and yes I put twitter.com/ in the href). How can I get this to work?
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User talk:Virusattacked233
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
my world is never found either virtually or imaginably
In response to your feedback[edit]
Hi, Virusattacked233!
I'm sorry, but our software automatically capitalizes the first letter of your name. It's a technical limitation of our software that can't be changed.
Sorry about that. If you have any other questions, feel free to drop me a line.
~ Matthewrbowker Talk to me 02:25, 2 May 2012 (UTC)


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The new British Olympic boss, Andy Hunt, has called the formation of men's and women's British teams 'a must' for the Olympics in 2012. There has been a lot of opposition to the proposal from the Football Associations of Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland. Scotland especially, but Hunt is determined to bring the four country's together for the one off event.
"The national football associations need to come together to resolve this matter for the British people." – Olympic Head Honcho Andy Hunt.
I had my say on the matter a while back!
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A full moon and start of the FOT on Lake Malawi
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We had been trying to keep the kids entertained and ...


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Kim Zolciak And Jessica Simpson: Could They Pass Off As Twins? (Photos)Joanna Mazewski
Former chart topper Jessica Simpson and Real Housewives of Atlanta star Kim Zolciak sure do have a lot in common not only is there big blonde hair their signature look, but they also share plenty of similarities when it comes to their fashion sense, too.
Both Jessica and Kim who both became household names thanks to their reality shows (remember Jess' MTV hit Newlyweds with ex-hubby Nick Lachey?) love to flaunt their curves in body-hugging numbers, big brand-name handbags and blinged-out shoes.
It must be a southern girl thing, right?
Check out our style photos of these celebrity moms (or mom-to-be in Jessica's case) and tell us, do you think they could pass off as twins? They sure do look alike!
Kim Zolciak 1 of 19Kim and her big blonde hair
Jessica Simpson 2 of 19Jessica sure does love her bags...
Jessica Simpson 3 of 19As she loves her style!
Kim Zolciak 4 of 19What do you think of Kim's red carpet style?
Kim Zolciak 5 of 19She loves to show off her bling!
Kim Zolciak 6 of 19What's up with celebrities and car photos?
Kim Zolciak 7 of 19Is this Kim or Jessica?
Jessica Simpson 8 of 19Here's Jessica with friends.
Kim Zolciak 9 of 19Is that hair real or fake?
Jessica Simpson 10 of 19Jessica sporting a loose leopard print dress.
Jessica Simpson 11 of 19Jessica Simpson is spotted leaving an office wearing a black dress and a denim jacket in Los Angeles.
Jessica Simpson 12 of 19Jessica Simpson walks to a waiting car after doing some shopping at Bergdorf Goodman in New York City.
Kim Zolciak 13 of 19Kim smiling for the paps.
Kim Zolciak 14 of 19Kim loves her mom curves!
Kim Zolciak 15 of 19Kim Zolciak of "The Real Housewives of Atlanta" is in high spirits as she arrives at Katsuya for dinner.
Jessica Simpson 16 of 19Jessica Simpson walks to a waiting car after doing some shopping at Bergdorf Goodman in New York City.
Jessica Simpson 17 of 19Jessica Simpson show off her burgeoning belly in a tight fitting black top as she heads to dinner at a Soho restaurant in New York Jessica left a building in Midtown and was spotted arriving back at her hotel following dinner in Soho.
Jessica Simpson 18 of 19Jessica and hubby-to-be Eric.
Jessica Simpson 19 of 19Isn't she the goofiest celebrity mom out there?
Photos: PacificCoastNews.com/Prphotos.com/Twitter.com
Check out more Moms Who Match in Hollywood!


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The Great Divide in Tokyo: Monetary and Fiscal Policy Views at IMF Meetings
By Nouriel Roubini / Oct 23, 2012
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Sports Calendar
Published: Tuesday, October 16, 2007 at 12:23 p.m.
Last Modified: Tuesday, October 16, 2007 at 12:23 p.m.
Today. Central Lafourche at H.L. Bourgeois, 4 p.m.
Today. South Lafourche at Terrebonne, 4 p.m.
Today. South Terrebonne at Thibodaux, 4 p.m.
Today. Helen Cox at Vandebilt Catholic, 4:30 p.m.
Today. Northside Christian at Houma Christian, 5 p.m.
Today. St. James at John Curtis, 5:30 p.m.
Wednesday. H.L. Bourgeois at South Terrebonne, 4 p.m.
Wednesday. Assumption Invitational at Assumption, 4 p.m.
Today. Terrebonne Parish Recreation will be registering boys and girls ages 7-12 for the upcoming basketball season until Thursday and Oct. 22-25 at area recreation gyms. Registration will also be accepted at the TPR office until Nov. 2.
Sunday. The Thibodaux High School swim team is selling jambalaya dinners from 10 a.m. to 3 p.m. at the school's stadium for $6. For information, call 447-4071.
Monday. The Bayou Sports Foundations Quarterback Club will meet at 6 p.m. every Monday until Nov. 15 at Bubbas II Seafood Restaurant and Sports Lounge in Thibodaux. Coaches from Nicholls State, E.D. White Catholic and Thibodaux are invited to address the group.
Reader comments posted to this article may be published in our print edition. All rights reserved. This copyrighted material may not be re-published without permission. Links are encouraged.
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When I posted about the gardens of Tredegar House I did say I would come back to write about the interior of the mansion in Newport, South East Wales. I'm a bit reluctant now, as my pictures are a bit sparse and badly framed, but here goes anyway. (more…)
Posts Tagged 'History'
Inside Tredegar House
Posted in Gwent, History, Uncategorized, Wales, tagged Gwent, History, Wales on February 23, 2016 | 8 Comments »
West Bay or Broadchurch for killer views
Posted in Dorset, Uncategorized, tagged dorset, History on October 31, 2015 | 11 Comments »
As we were leaving Bridport in Dorset I persuaded the husband to take me down to nearby West Bay, in the hope of snapping a good picture of that amazing Jurassic cliff that featured in the ITV crime series Broadchurch, first aired in 2013. (more…)
Snapshots of Bridport
Posted in Dorset, History, Uncategorized, tagged architecture, dorset, History on October 25, 2015 | 22 Comments »
I am always looking for new places to visit in Dorset and I had never even thought of Bridport until I noticed it in the postings of fellow blogger Sarah, who lives near there (see Down by the Sea).
So about a month ago, just after the schools had gone back after summer, we went there for a few hours – and were very impressed. It's such a friendly place, and the streets are clean and full of quirky little shops – it was also very easy to find somewhere to park. (more…)
A look at some Ludlow landmarks
Posted in History, Shropshire, Uncategorized, tagged History on April 7, 2015 | 8 Comments »
It's spring cleaning time and a chance to declutter. Which also means clearing out the 2014 summer holiday pictures I took that I haven't "processed" and blogged about yet. So this is a collection of images of Ludlow, in Shropshire on the Welsh border, taken last August. I dare say (more…)
Happy New Year – and St David's Day
Posted in History, Uncategorized, Wales, tagged History, Spring, traditions on March 1, 2015 | 7 Comments »
I wasn't planning on posting today, until the husband asked "Why is February so short?" Had I never asked that myself? Anyway, I had to find out in a hurry, as the days were running out and today was going to be March 1, marked as our St David's Day here in Wales.
The history of calendars is ever so complicated, so I don't think for a minute that what I am about to say is "correct", but it's my interpretation of what I found online, including Wikipedia and various question-and-answer forums.
The main point (more…)
Two Shrewsbury churches
Posted in Art & Design, England, History, Shropshire, Uncategorized, tagged architecture, art, History, Shropshire on December 30, 2014 | 7 Comments »
Continuing my memories of Shropshire in summer, here are two excellent churches we visited in Shrewsbury – St Alkmund's and St Mary's. There are many more but these are just two we happened upon.
Some Shrewsbury sights…
Posted in Art & Design, England, History, Uncategorized, tagged architecture, History, Shropshire on December 22, 2014 | 7 Comments »
It's nearly the end of the year but I still have unfinished business with my summer holidays – so I am catching up with sorting my Shropshire pictures from August. I'll leave Shrewsbury churches for another day, but here are some great old buildings in the county town, many of them in the timber-framed black-and-white Tudor style that has sometimes given this area the nickname "magpie country" – or at least I saw it called that in the Reader's Digest once when I was a child. (more…)


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Untouched 18th century woodworking shop foundBreaking News
Imagine peeking into an old garden shed and discovering the oldest woodworking shop in United States. It's a kind of traditional woodworker's dream. This is basically what happened to a University of Delaware professor recently.
"The first time I saw it, I about fell over," said Ritchie Garrison, professor of history professor and director of the Winterthur Program in American Material Culture at the University of Delaware. "It was a bit like walking into the past."
The discovery was entirely accidental. Garrison and Michael Burrey were in the process of revamping Garrison's 19th century house in Plymouth, Mass. Burrey was also working on a project at a local preschool in Duxbury, Mass., where he discovered what turns out to be a 18th century joiner's shop. Garrison invited several experts in material culture got to see the shop for themselves....
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I don't see the how the author derived that $\frac { dv }{ dt } \leftrightarrow\overrightarrow { V } j\omega$.
I don't see the how the author derived that $\frac { dv }{ dt } \leftrightarrow\overrightarrow { V } j\omega$.
closed as too localized by Qmechanic♦ Apr 24 '13 at 10:42
This question is unlikely to help any future visitors; it is only relevant to a small geographic area, a specific moment in time, or an extraordinarily narrow situation that is not generally applicable to the worldwide audience of the internet. For help making this question more broadly applicable, visit the help center.If this question can be reworded to fit the rules in the help center, please edit the question.
(1) $v(t) = V_m\cos(\omega t + \phi) = Re(V_me^{j\omega t}e^{j\phi})$
(2) $\dfrac{dv}{dt}= \omega V_m\cos(\omega t + \phi + \frac{\pi}{2})=Re(\omega V_me^{j\omega t}e^{j\phi}e^{j\frac{\pi}{2}})= Re(j\omega V_me^{j\omega t}e^{j\phi})$
By inspection, comparing the last term in (1) and (2), the phasor corresponding to $v(t)$ is $V_me^{j\phi} = \vec V$ while the phasor corresponding to $\frac{dv}{dt}$ is $j\omega V_me^{j\phi} = j\omega \vec V$


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I'm a Kanban and Agile enthusiast, and as such, I'm doing my best to help my fellow colleagues to be better at their profession. It is also important to me to give ideas back to the community and exchange practical things with others, so I started the Budapest Lean and Kanban Meetup group, where organise events and keep presentations and workshops.
Professional career and more details on my website.
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Maui's historic Bed and Breakfast Inn. Ten exquisite Bedrooms with private baths, TV, VCR, Telephones, AC. Full Breakfast. AAA rated, nationally touted as one of America's Finest Bed and Breakfasts (Travel and Leisure Magazine).
Huelo Point Lookout is a remote north shore treasure, selected by National Geographic Traveler and Hawaii Magazine as part of the "real Maui". Four separate unique accommodations: features include mountain and ocean views, pool & hot tubs
True Zen design, Aloha Cottage perched atop the highest spot on the property with giant Eucalyptus trees, sweeping forest like views from its large, covered lanai. This special vacation cottage was designed for comfort, style, charm and seclusion.
2 beautiful properties: Oceanview B&B & Oceanfront condo, both near Maalaea Bay, views of West Maui Mountains & Maui's gorgeous sunsets. Short walk to Maui's longest beach. Walk, run, swim, snorkel, kayak, surf, golf, relax. Reasonable rates.
Large HEATED pool, Jacuzzi, putting green, 2 tennis courts - Walk across the street walk on the beach or enjoy one of Maui's many ocean activities
The Maui Vista Resort is a quality condominium complex centrally located in S.Kihei on Maui's sunny southwest shore. Restaurants, shops, activities even a movie theater are within walking distance; and nearby golf courses, beaches & other attraction
Select your destination in Maui Hawaii. Browse thousands of listings for accommodations, adventures, tours and travel services.


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HUM 103: Introduction to the Humanities - 20th Century to Present
This course introduces students to various artistic periods and movements from the early 20th Century to the Present. The creative disciplines of human artistic output are explored, focusing on the Western World. This course can be presented in chronological or topical format. Classes will cover a minimum of 8 movements through various interdisciplinary media. Movements (selection): Dada, Surrealism, Cubism, Fauvism, Expressionism, Abstract Expressionism, Pop Art, Minimalism, Realism, Harlem Renaissance, Conceptual Art, Post-Modern, etc. Media: History, Visual Arts (including Photography and Film), Architecture, Literature, Philosophy, Music and Religion. The title of this course was previously Introduction to Humanities - 20th Century.
Level I Prereq: Academic Reading and Writing Levels of 6
Level II Prereq: Computer Literacy
- Credits
- 3
- Lecture Hours
- 45
- Clinical Hours
- 0
- Lab Hours
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- Other Hours
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- Total Hours
- 45
Some classes are not offered every term. To see if this class is currently available, check the schedule.
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Save time and gas: Get your books online through WCC's Barnes & Noble Bookstore.more »
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"I was very reluctant to take online classes, but because of my various roles as a wife, mother, full-time employee, and student my time was limited…. Online classes have helped with managing my time in these various roles, and have been a true blessing to both my family and my learning experience at WCC."—F. Robertson


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Mark joined LWSC for the start of the 2012-2013 season after completing 14 years with Mission Ridge Ski Resort. For several years he's lived in Leavenworth, been a Club member and helped coordinate Hog Loppet.
Ben has been grooming ski terrain for more than 20 years. He takes great pride in providing a great product for our skiers from the Icicle to the Hog Loppet trail. Have you thanked your groomer today?
Linda has been a familiar face with LWSC since 2007. She can often be found helping that first time skier get in their bindings and sent on their way, making sure they leave and return with a smile. She loves the outdoors; free time is spent skiing, biking or casting her fly rod.
Austin is a junior at Cascade High School taking classes at Wenatchee Valley College through the Running Start program. Austin loves to run, swim, ski, bike, and pole vault when he can. After completing high school, he plans on attending a four year university to study either aerospace or bio-mechanical engineering.
Rob has lived in Leavenworth since 2002. He and his wife Shannon love the recreational opportunities that kids have in this valley.
Rob and the other coaches encourage all the kids to become well-rounded skiers. Jumping, Alpine racing and Nordic skiing are all brought together during the Bakke Cup which is typically held in early February.
Come out and support the kids on the LWSC Alpine Team!
David is a Level 3 Certified instructor and spends his winters between Edmonds and Leavenworth. He enjoys students of all ages and loves to see the smiling faces as they learn to turn. His great instructors make our Ski Hill a really magical place. When the snow melts he runs a medical insurance agency.
Susan has been with the LWSC for the past five years, managing the Ski Hill ticket office, training staff and working many of our special events.
She chose to live and raise her three children in the Upper Valley because of the quality of the schools and the community's commitment to youth programs.
Susan brings her positive, outgoing personality to her new position and is excited to continue sharing the Club's fun activities with our youth and visitors.


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I wanted to email one of these ads to a friend, but I don't remember the exact phrasing / how to Google for it. It was something in the spirit of "we hire monkeys, so you don't need to".
Meta Stack Exchange is where users like you discuss bugs, features, and support issues that affect the software powering all 158 Stack Exchange communities.
What is meta?
What is meta?
Here's how it works:
- Any Stack Exchange user can ask a question
- The community provides support, votes on ideas, and reports bugs
- Your voice helps shape the way Stack Exchange operates
There used to be one here:
but apparently that one is deleted.
Why's that? Can anybody with 10K+ maybe see on that question why it has been removed?
There's also this one:
in which one mr. Alex 'advertisement' Papadingsken himself proposes to create such a list.


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Traditionally on Diwali day Tamil producers advertise their forthcoming films.
This year too nearly half a dozen Tamil producers put out 'first look' ads in newspapers.
The most impressive ad of the lot, which had the industry talking, was the Vettai ads.
It was attention grabbing and stirred a curiosity among those who saw it. The film is a Christmas release.
Says a spokesperson of an ad agency: "The best designed was the Vettai ad. The Sameera Reddy- Amala Paul riding a two wheeler, and another one with Madhavan and Arya in dhoti's were eyecatching, as it was unique and created the right buzz about the film as a family entertainer."
UTV Motion Pictures and Thirrupathi Brothers, the producers of Vettai had taken extra care over the design of the print ad.
Lingusamy directed Vettai has Madhavan, Arya, Sameera Reddy and Amala Paul in the lead with music by Yuvan Shankar Raja.


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'Doctor Who' - 'The Big Bang': The waiting's over
Several weeks back, I promised that I would take the next few "Doctor Who" episodes off, then return with a review after the finale. At the time I made that promise, I didn't realize that the finale would air during Comic-Con, nor that I wouldn't have time to write anything sooner due to Comic-Con prep. But a promise is a promise, so my thoughts (perhaps not as elaborate as I'd otherwise like) on "The Big Bang," and this first Steven Moffat/Matt Smith season as a whole, coming up just as soon as I tell you that I wear a fez now...
"In your dreams, I'll still be there. The Doctor and Amy Pond. And days that never came." -The Doctor
With "The Pandorica Opens," it seemed like Moffat was trying out one of those Russell T. Davies-esque finales that's mainly concerned with topping the ones that came before. Most of The Doctor's significant enemies banding together to stop him? Amy being killed? The universe being destroyed?
"The Big Bang" had the same stakes, but it felt much more like a Moffat-sized episode. Because the universe had been destroyed, the only characters we were dealing with were The Doctor, Amy, plastic Rory, River and young Amelia, plus a stray Dalek who was mainly there to provide some jeopardy before the climax. As tales of the apocalypse go, it was surprisingly intimate, and madcap (the bit with the women's hatred of the fez in particular, but pretty much any deed The Doctor performed with the vortex manipulator). And in Rory's insistence on staying with Amy through the centuries, it not only created this great romantic backstory for Rory - making him a clearly worthy companion and not just the guy tagging along with Amy - but revisited one of Moffat's pet themes for the series: people having to travel through time the long way.
There was a lot of wibbley-wobbley-timey-wimey hand-waving about how The Doctor rebooted the universe, and then about how he set up Amy to remember him and bring him back to life, but the emotions were spot-on, Smith was fantastic at both the silly stuff (his Doctor has become more stubbornly childlike as the season went on) and his exhausted, dramatic sacrifice, and The Doctor's appearance at Amy's wedding was a marvelous moment.
I also was pleased to see just how much this entire season tied into the two-part finale, from the extended prologue to "The Pandorica Opens" featuring Van Gogh, Churchill, Liz Ten, etc. to the revelation that Amy's conversation with The Doctor in the forest in "Flesh and Stone" didn't involve The Doctor from that episode. (And good on the many eagle-eyed viewers among you who were suspicious about The Doctor's outfit being different in that scene.)
It's also interesting that the finale only resolved part of the season-long arc. We find out what caused the cracks in the universe (the TARDIS ran into a trap and exploded), but not who or what caused the event that caused the cracks. So there's a whole additional mystery for The Doctor, Amy and Rory to chase next season, on top of finding out who it was River killed that put her in prison.(*) And after River's fantastic showdown with the Dalek, where she made it beg for mercy, I hope we see as much of her as possible next season.
(*) So many of us have predicted that River kills The Doctor himself that I have to assume it's misdirection on Moffat's part. Though I did have a long conversation with a fellow fan last night at Comic-Con where we discussed the possibility of River having killed the Paul McGann Doctor (since it's never been 100% clear whether McGann ended the time war and then regenerated into Eccleston, or if Eccleston himself ended the time war). So the show does have a kind of loophole if it wants to kill a Doctor and not get rid of Matt Smith after only a season.
The Moffat/Smith "Doctor Who" is not a radical departure from the Davies/Tennant era, which is reassuring for some and frustrating for others, I'm sure. Me, I've loved it - Moffat's been able to combine his usual cerebral plotting with a style that more openly tugs at heartstrings - and the next Christmas movie can't come soon enough.
What did everybody else think?


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Our vision for the future is that every young disabled person's life is full of fun, friendship and experiences. Just like any other kid's. We also believe they have a right to an accessible and inclusive community supporting them and their families.
We believe:
- Every young disabled person has the right to a fun and active childhood, and the chance to develop their full potential in life.
- All disabled children, young people and their families have the right to be included.
- Access is getting in – inclusion equals wanting to stay.
- Parents of disabled children are experts on their own children.
Our ethos is to work in partnership with parents, carers, charities, special schools and support groups to enable young disabled people to develop their physical, social and cognitive skills on inclusive and accessible days out.
Our work relies on your support, so please get involved or donate today.
What We Do:
We work in two ways. Firstly by offering grants towards group day trips throughout the UK organized by special schools, charities or support groups. And secondly, by organizing our own large-scale events, offering a variety of activities for young disabled people and their families to join us on for free.
We work with children and young people from the age of 5 to 25 who are disabled; that is they have a physical, sensory or mental impairment (including mental health issues) which in interaction with social, attitudinal and environmental constraints creates barriers which hinder their full and equal participation in society.
Our daytrips and events allow Daytrippers children to experience what life has to offer in a safe, fun, inclusive and accessible environment whilst also developing social, cognitive and physical goals while also potentially reliving stress for the family and or carer.


text:
"Ghostbusters": 10 Facts About the Franchise You Thought You Knew
After a long, exhausting day of lopping off heads, ripping out hearts and snapping spines, there's no better way to unwind than with an ice-cold beer. A Mortal Kombat X beer.
Poulsbo, Washington's Sound Brewery has teamed with Warner Bros. to release a beer series inspired by the 10th installment of the blockbuster fighting game.
Toys R Us has revealed a lineup of Comic-Con International exclusives that includes a Batman classic TV series Batgirl action figure, a Batman vs. Harley Quinn set, and a first look at a new addition to Star Wars: The Black Series.
The retail chain has also announced a "Collector Vector," a new shop dedicated to collectibles for "the mature collectible community," featuring more than 100 items from the likes of Bandai, Diamond Select, Mezco Toys, McFarlane Toys and NECA. The new hub can be found at Toysrus.com and in stores nationwide.
The Warp Zone are back. Yes, those nerdy a cappella dudes who jammed the earworm that is the X-Men: The Animated Series theme song back into your head have returned with more geeked out harmonies.
This time, the quintet have decided to celebrate the release of Mortal Kombat X by tackling the lasting techno theme song from the original series. Sure, some of the adrenaline-pumping power of the original version is a bit lost in the little "doot-doots," but it's still pretty fun. Plus, their reactions to the fatality at the end are exactly how I feel every time I see one of the new death scenes. Brutal.
Todd McFarlane has revealed he gave permission for Spawn to appear in such NetherRealm Studios games as Injustice: Gods Among Us and Mortal Kombat X, due out in April from Warner Bros. Interactive Entertainment.
However, he tells GamerFitNation there's a catch: It's a "short deal" that comes with a ticking clock.
Creators | A U.K. researcher argues that Marie Duval was the real creative force behind the wildly popular 19th-century British comic Ally Sloper, which is largely credited to her husband Charles Ross. Duval, the pen name of French cartoonist Emilie de Tessier, drew the character at the height of his popularity in the 1860s and '70s, but historian David Kunzle now questions what role Ross actually played in his creation. [The Guardian]
Commentary | Chase Magnett pushes back on Chris Suellentrop's statement, made in a column about GamerGate, that comics are "a medium that has never outgrown its reputation for power fantasies and is only very occasionally marked by transcendent work (Maus, or the books of Chris Ware) that demands that the rest of the culture pay attention to it." [Comicbook.com]
Chuck BB and Andy MacDonald have launched a new sketch blog called Hey! Draw Something! While it's still fairly new, they have posted a couple of Mortal Kombat sketches, with more to come, I'm sure.


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Using Cast Iron Cookware on a Ceramic CooktopNov 7th, 2010 | Category: Cookware
Another good question was asked over at thekitchn.com
"Can I Use a Cast Iron Pan on a Ceramic Range?"
I do not use a ceramic cooktop but I cannot imagine it would cialis reviews be a problem to use cast iron on a ceramic range. There are suggestions on HOW to use it and these are listed below. Basically don't slide it around. For some chefs, that may hamper your cooking style.
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Celebrated American fashion designer Michael Kors defines his aesthetic as "everyday luxury." His contemporary designs have garnered rave reviews from fashion aficionados and critics worldwide. Expanding his fashion empire, Kors launched MICHAEL Michael Kors in 2004. Neiman Marcus offers a wide range of MICHAEL Michael Kors handbags, including totes, wallets, satchels, and more.
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Credits & Info
- Uploaded
- Apr 20, 2009 | 10:52 AM EDT
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- 1 min 46 sec
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- 4.08 / 5.00
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Rated 4.5 / 5 stars
Seemed like it was too short, though. Anyway, the lyrics were cleverly written. I've enjoyed a lot of what I've heard from you, though this one's by far my favorite. It had an upbeat and very enjoyable tune. I look forward to more from you.
cheers, man. Yeah... too short... but in a way, that leaves people hanging out for more. Thanks for the listen and for checking out a couple of my othes.... you rock!
Rated 5 / 5 stars
hmmmm... so i guess the Earth was finished in 8 days
i love the bass riff
this could b a newgrounds classic!!!!
(o)(o) (.)(.) nd for the guys who like 'em huge... ( O )( O )
they look like eyes... but who cares???
hahaha... but aren't they the nipples? huge nipples?
thanks a lot for checking this out... you rock!
Rated 4.5 / 5 stars
currently singing at the titty club
Im more of a butt man my self but great all the same
haha... you'd be surprised how many people told me that after listening to this :D
Rated 5 / 5 stars
You really did a great job!
i like the rythm, and you've got yourself some nice lyrics. are you singing it yourself? if so, i love your voice ^^
yeah, i sang it... cheers a lot man!
Rated 5 / 5 stars
This song is great, I love it!
( . )( . ) rules!


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Email this article from PlasticsNews.com
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Located in the center of the Magnificent Mile, and steps from the Michigan Avenue Bridge, The Wrigley Building has been a hallmark of Chicago's skyline since 1920. Designed as the headquarters for the successful chewing gum, the building was modeled after the Seville Cathedral's Giralda Tower in Spain. Today, it is still home to Wm Wrigley Jr. Company, and is perhaps best known for its dazzling white towers that illuminate the city at night.
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Since 1978, Zanies has presented the best in stand-up comedy. Past performers have included Jay Leno, Jerry Seinfeld, and Richard Lewis. Photo Credit: ©Adam Alexander Photography


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posted by June 25 at 10:00 AMon
The city's hired gun from K&L Gates, Paul Lawrence, has gotten a reputation during the Sonics trial for being snippy with the judge (and for having his objections routinely overruled while objections to his line of questioning from Bennett's lawyers are regularly sustained.)
I know you can't read anything into courtroom dynamics like that, and frankly, reading over the transcripts from the first week of the trial earlier this week shows the city has done a much better job arguing its case then comes across live. On the written page, Lawrence's direct examination of Bennett, for example, is devastating to the Sonics' case. With a hard-hitting series of questions about things like a warning memo Bennett sent to potential investors acknowledging all the problems with the lease, Lawrence showed Bennett knew all about the Sonics financial problems and all about the self-defeating terms of the lease before signing it.
However, there was a moment during the trial last Friday [excerpted below] when Lawrence's grating courtroom personahe has a terrible habit, for example, of telling the judge when its time to breaktook center stage along with some sloppy lawyering. It outdid all of Lawrence's other mini-catastrophes.
And not just because it's such an embarrassing exchange in its own right (Judge Marsha Pechman sternly overruled Lawrence, "No, Mr. Lawrence, you are reading the rule incorrectly," after the longwinded Lawrence saw fit to read to the judge from the rule book), but more because Judge Pechman's decision to overrule supported a key part of the Sonics' legal defense.
The Sonics argue that the city's case is part of a larger "Machiavellian" plot to force the Sonics to sell. The Sonics hope that this "unclean hands" defense will taint the city's case and lead to a dismissal.
During the following exchange, Lawrence is trying to halt Bennett's lawyer's damning line of questioning to former Sonics CEO, Wally Walker. The dramatic series of questionswhy was Walker simultaneously consulting for the city on the Sonics case while also holding secret meetings at his house with K&L Gates attorney Slade Gorton to go over plans to force Bennett to sell?revealed, at the least, lousy judgement by the city.
The following (delicious) excerpt from the trialafter a pompous display, Lawrence is forced to apologize to the judgeis muddled in convoluted Bleak House legal speak, but stick with it. It's totally worth it.
Basically, what's happening is this: Lawrence is trying to have an email rejected as hearsay, but in making his case that it's hearsay he segues into anticipating the Sonics response that it's notand gets his definitions all mixed up. The judge slaps his face and, it seems to me, loudly supports the Sonics' main defense: The idea that Walker was simultaneously consulting for the city on the Sonics case and working to force Bennett to sell.
LAWRENCE: I would object. It is a hearsay document byit is a hearsay document. There is no evidence Mr. Walker was under a consulting agreement with the City at the time, and I dont think it was inconsistent with his testimony either. His testimonythis is not a document under oath as required to be a hearsay exception for prior inconsistent statements.
THE COURT: You think that a prior inconsistent statement has to be under oath in order for it to be inconsistent?
LAWRENCE: I Would be happy to read the rule, your honor. The rule says for it to be a prior inconsistent statement, not related to an admission to a party opponent, sorry, I have to get my glasses on, it has to be a statement, A, inconsistent with the declarents testimony and was given under oath subject to the penalty of perjury at a trial, hearing or other proceeding or in a deposition.
THE COURT: Well, thats when a statement is not hearsay. You just told me that this was hearsay.
LAWRENCE: I am saying it is hearsay. But to get the hearsay exception for a prior statement of a witness it needs to be under oath. This is hearsay because it is an out-of-court-statement.
THE COURT: No, Mr. Lawrence, you are reading the rule incorrectly. Hearsay is defined, and then it says what is not hearsay. That gives a definition of what is not hearsay. This is not a statement under oath, so it is hearsay. But it is not being offered for its truth, it is being offered to impeach his recollection.
[Slog note: This would be about the right the time to give it up, Mr. Lawrence….]
LAWRENCE: But his recollection was consistent with the e-mail, so it is not offered for impeachment. He agreed with exactly what this says. [They] tried to make it otherwise. But it isMy objection is that it is hearsay and it does not fall within a hearsay objection
THE COURT: So you agree with me that your reference to the rule is incorrect.
LAWRENCE: Your honor, I was anticipating their argument as to why it would fall outside the hearsay rule. I assert that it hearsay and does not fall within an objectiondoes not fall into an exception, and I agree what I read you was the exception to the hearsay rule.
THE COURT: Actually
LAWRENCE: Im sorry, your honor. Youre right. It says statements which are not hearsay.
THE COURT: It is not the exception, it is the definition of the exception.
LAWRENCE: Youre right. I apologize.
The COURT: All right. Overruled.


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Oh I how I wish I could miss that voice. One of these days, maybe I'll set the world on fire just like Feit has.
I dunno if I agree with this.
Bus service in the suburbs is extremely unused. i doubt that many people who don't already ride the bus there would be induced to start doing so on account of increased service.
Increasing service is very inducive to people like me that are always waiting somewhere for a bus to come and often find it over-full.
In the suburbs (where I have in fact tried to take the bus), bus service is far OVER-provided. The bus that goes in front of my parents' house would be most efficiently served by a Honda Civic. Nobody there wants to ride the bus. They don't just not care how often it comes. They probably don't even know.
Oh oh also wondering... does Everett Transit get left out? That would sort of piss me off, considering that Everett the 3rd densest settlement north of Shoreline.
So let me get this straight -- ST is looking at exactly the same level of taxation they were in Prop 1 -- but with much, much less light rail.
So glad we voted Prop 1 down!
Me too.
Cuz a rail-only, with some increase in bus service, will pass in Obama '08... If we had passed the $17 billion package last year, we'd be paying a lot more ... and it'd be for 182 miles of roads.
John @2, there are two kinds of suburban bus routes, those that are over-used and those that are under-used. The under-used tend to be part of the original systems laid out years ago and then largely forgotten. Newer routes, laid out in response to obvious demands, tend to be well used. Time for KCMetro to update the old stuff and make it all productive.
MHD at 4, the reason ST2.1 yields less light rail than Prop 1 would've, at the same tax rate, is time frame: ST2.1 has a 12-year time horizon, ST2.0 was a 20-year plan.
I'm tree-hugging, transit-riding leftie. But please.
Somehow I don't think voters are going to vote to impose forty years of freakishly high sales taxes on their neighbors so Metro, CT, and PT can get a lot more buses going now. King Co. just approved a FAR smaller sales tax increase for METRO, and it (Transit Now) hasn't even kicked in.
Look - the cost of ST's trains is way too high, because every other light rail system in the country is paid for mostly by federal grants. Noplace - including Portland, Denver, LA, etc. - would have any light rail if those regions tried to pull the shit ST does (massive sales tax increases and what does U-Link cost - $550 million PER MILE???).
What ST wants on the cost side is so far out of line it doesn't come close to being funny. TCC gets most of its money from ST and the ATU bus driver locals, so I can see why Johnson is so hot for it. But this is a lousy deal from the standpoint of 99.9% of the people here.
Want more light rail? Convince the legislature to give ST a tax on employer payrolls, a tax on miles driven, or just make it get the money from the feds. Commercial real estate owners and developers, and a handful of big employers, are who benefit from light rail. Make them pay, not the families who pay too much sales tax already. Most of them wouldn't ever ride the trains.
"Bus service in the suburbs is extremely unused. In the suburbs (where I have in fact tried to take the bus), bus service is far OVER-provided. The bus that goes in front of my parents' house would be most efficiently served by a Honda Civic. Nobody there wants to ride the bus"
Nice, john. I like how you throw all "the suburbs" into one heap. Nothing like applying a narrow snapshot approach to a region of 3.5 million people.
The middle class suburbs of South King County, Pierce County and Snohomish County are filling buses and commuter trains up. The big problem is too MANY transit users. Not too few. And last time I checked, congestion wasn't getting any better, and gas + parking wasn't getting any cheaper.
The story is different in high-end East King County....which is why light rail makes a lot of sense connecting Bellevue to Seattle with light rail.
"I'm tree-hugging, transit-riding leftie. But please.
Apparently, rh has a whole bunch more cheap crap made in China to purchase.
Hundred bucks per year for the median household. Buy more stuff to pile in landfills, pay more. Buy less stuff, pay less. Buy food or medicine, pay nothing.
Since when did tree-huggers embrace rampant consumerism? Or, maybe rh believes in "the right to dine out?"
Is this attitude particular to the Wal*Mart generation, or what?
Interesting. So basically, the world is not coming to an end, and we're just arguing about how much it will take to get the parties in bed together.
Sure hope they don't forget to calculate global warming emissions net impact of the build ...
"Look - the cost of ST's trains is way too high, because every other light rail system in the country is paid for mostly by federal grants."
Where does catspit come up with this spit? Just making it up as he goes along, along with all the other anti-rail whiners?
"Noplace - including Portland, Denver, LA, etc. - would have any light rail if those regions tried to pull the shit ST does (massive sales tax increases and what does U-Link cost - $550 million PER MILE???)."
This is classic axe-grinding. First, catspit complains about the lack of federal funding, then he bitches about the U Link segment - one of the most productive lines in the coutry in terms of ridership - which is half paid for by the feds.
The dollars for mile figure is meaningless. The dollar per rider (or passenger mile) numbers are how rail systems are evaluated.
If somebody were to know what they are talking about, of course.
"The shit ST pulls" is called a public vote. I wonder what catshit would prefer - that general fund monies are used to build light rail (as they do in PDX) or where the government simply increases the taxes without a public vote (like they do in Vancouver).
Once anti-rail nuts figured out they were swimming against the tide of public opinion, they came up with a whole host of different excuses as to why "we can't build light rail here." I wish these clowns would just be honest with their internal-comubustion-loving ways. But I won't hold my breath.
The last time I saw this level of nitpicking around a particular issue, it was loopy Naderites telling us that Al Gore was a slave to Big Oil in 2000. And we all know how well that turned out.....
What percentage of the sales tax comes from North King County? Will the bus funds be divided 40 - 40 - 20 screwing Seattle?
Since even Resolution 75 requires the agency to limit their spending to regional problems, so will the buses only be regional out of city service or will they try to fund streetcars like the Waterfront line?
That's pretty much clear indication that sub-area equity, at least on taxation, is silly.
@13 - yes. But since we pay 40 percent of the taxes, it should be different. Once again we do the lifting and the suburbs do the grifting.
I look forward to Eyman running for Gov.
@13: No, Sound Transit doesn't use the 40-40-20 formula. They follow subarea equity, which basically means money raised in a certain taxing district (North King, South King, East King, Pierce, and Snohomish) stays in that taxing district.
But I think Josh or somebody at TCC did their math wrong, because if you divvy up $1.2 million by population among the three counties, King constitutes a much larger than 50 percent share of these counties' population and would be due for more than $650 million. If that's all King is scheduled to get, then they're not using a direct population formula.
a bit of deja vu
During the JRPC days in the early 1990s, the concept of adding three-tenths for local service to the RTA measure got a lot of play. It may have been advanced by Councilmembers Street and Choe. The discussion also led to a debate about the allocation of the new service hours on the Metro Council. The suburban cause was led by Councilmember Barden who advanced the position that all new funds should be spent in the suburbs until they had Seattle levels of service. The Seattle debaters were led by Councilmember Jane Noland (e.g., density, ridership, street grid). The split of new hours proportional to subarea population was the compromise chosen. The more recent 40-40-20 is latest iteration.
In the JRPC days, the guesses at the LRT costs were vastly underestimated, so they thought they had more fiscal capacity.
Johnson is smart. He needed to add something to his argument. He correctly points out that folks are eager for more service. If ST2.1 only had east Link LRT, service levels would not improve much or happen very soon.
I suspect it would be legal. The RTA authorizing legislation allows interim bus service; they provided shuttle service on Mercer Island; they provided shuttle service to Lynnwood transit center. Another approach would be to have large bus element in ST2.1, since ST relies on others to actually operate its bus service anyway. Of course, Everett should be included; it has a great street grid and will take more growth in the coming decades.
John at 2 should visit the Kent Transit Center and examine loads on routes 164, 166, 166, 168, and 169, or look at Route 174 on SR-99, or Route 253 at Crossroads.
It's really refreshing that, whatever reservations Pierce and Snohomish counties have about ST2 '08, it comes down to wanting more transit in the package.
Concerning Rob Johnson's proposal Hey, if that's what it takes to give the package the momentum it needs to (A) get on the ballot and then (B) pass, then great. Still, this idea smacks more of political wheeling and dealing than of real regional system planning. I'd much rather see the extra 10th of a cent used to do something Sound Transit had been planning to do anyway, especially if that something is extending light rail farther north and farther south.
Even then, I'm a bit leery of how they would extend light rail, especially to the north into Snohomish. If you build the stations close to I-5 and away from urban centers, you doom the line eternally to being nothing more than a commuter rail line.
Now if Ladenburg and Reardon get on board and Ron Sims is left as the only major stumbling block, then that should be a clear indication that the political stars have aligned. Sims is going to be against any viable light rail package. In fact, if Sims did support some package going to the ballot, that might be an indication it's a loser.
"@13 - yes. But since we pay 40 percent of the taxes, it should be different. Once again we do the lifting and the suburbs do the grifting."
ALWAYS count on Will getting it wrong. 40-40-20 is King County Metro, all the way.
Lorax got it right. ST does not subscribe to 40-40-20. Ron Sims' brilliant plan to allocate bus service according to political whims, rather than ridership demand / farebox recovery, has been a catastrophe. On the council side, Sims had Maggi Fimia and Rob McKenna pitching this plan. Any time you have those three flakes pushing a particular policy, watch out!
And, yes, Ron Sims has lost his mind. Whatever mind he had left.
LOL, you just got p0wned by someone that pointed out we should get 50 percent in King County ... and you attack me for saying it should be a high percentage in Seattle of the King County revenue?
Look, we in Seattle are where the votes are. Period. We're the margin of victory - mess with us again and try to shove something down our throats that disrespect us and ST2.1 will look like RTID/ST2 did.
We're the margin of victory - period.
@19 - "we pay 40 percent of the taxes."
No we don't. What it should be is an income tax on corporations that run a profit.
Those taxes would land on whom the commuter trains benefit. Direct a tax at them, not families who have to buy clothes, shoes, soap and light bulbs to survive, and other things to allow their children to function.
Income tax?
Are you that out of it that you have no idea you're in WASHINGTON STATE - where my IRS forms are telling me we have NO STATE INCOME TAX?
Go sleep with Rossi.
That we don't currently have a state income tax doesn't preclude us from having one -- albeit a limited one -- in the future. Though I don't believe ST has the statutory authority to levy one currently.
Also, I really don't understand the Rossi comment.
"Those taxes would land on whom the commuter trains benefit. Direct a tax at them, not families who have to buy clothes, shoes, soap and light bulbs to survive, and other things to allow their children to function."
No We Don't is concerned about his kids upgrading their PlayStation2 to a PlayStation3. This is a heavy burden to carry.
Have you seen the cost of bars of soap lately? Why, a .4ths sales tax increase might increase the yearly soap budget by...10 cents!!!
And since the average cost of parking in downtown Seattle is now $250 per month, and No We Don'ts Belltown dinner budget is roughly equivalent (for one night out) it's obvious we're reaching the breaking point.
Plus, No We Don't is so socially aware, he is committed to defending the 23rd Amendment whenever he can: the Right To Own A Brand New Car Amendment. NWD realizes all our money should be flushed down Detroit Auto Inc's toilet, Saudi Oil Inc's sinkhole, or wasted on just about everything Made In China...but the LAST thing we should spend money on is a mechanism to get to work. Or, a method to continue economic expansion and sprawl-fighting land use patterns. Don't spend money on transportation infrastructure at a time when people have to export the bulk of their money to large banks...why, Morgan Stanley needs that money!
It's tough to tell if No We Don't is living in a Blue Blood bubble, or a homeless activist rathole. Either way, his perspective is equally twisted.
Not surprisingly, this No We Don't clown doesn't propose a tax on those who "benefit from roads." Since we're so good at fighting wars to make sure said roads are consistently jammed with cars, such talk would be considered totally un-American.
Hey, NWD. If you need a light bulb, let me know. I just picked a bunch of long-lasting low wattage bulbs up at Ikea. The 2 extra cents I would have had to pay for the four-pack (had light rail taxes been imposed) would have certainly broken the bank. Thank God I have my expensive car, and shitty, unreliable bus service to pull me through!
What basement did these nuts crawl out of, anyways??? My dog has better reasoning skills. Seriously.
Whether it goes to the ballot this year, next or later, it's probably going to get voted down. This area has a tax-averse population that continues to grow, and Prop 1 has left people feeling out of favor about taxing themselves even more to fund ST.
The agency has learned its lessons, the hard way. As an initial step, it needs to be pointed out that all the financial planning to date for ST2 presumes ST1 money will be extended for phase 1 work and bonds, but kept separate from the ST2 projects and bonds.
The concerns expressed above about the money issues will be dealt with in the plan going before voters (in 2008 or 2010) in several ways:
- no more than $2.6 billion of bonds will be sold (30-year term);
- taxes will not be used for operations after 2025; and
- the taxes will be reduced after 2030, to .15% (from the .8% or .9% up until then).
Thats three layers of protection for taxpayers. The agency is committed to fiscal responsibility in the next phase.
-This area has a tax-averse population that continues to grow-
Excellent reasoning, as usual, Gomez.
Those Obama voters are a conservative bunch!
Just - please provide proof. ST has never and will never make a promise without an out.
Use all the money from the extra 10th of a percent ($1.2 billion) and give it directly to the Snohomish, Pierce, and King County transit. agencies.
Over how many years? And why wouldn't the 40-40-20 rule be in place if it was given to directly Metro?
Another 1/2 cent sales tax increase? You've got to be kidding! We already have a crazy high sales tax...and it hits the poor the most. It will only reinforce what many of us already know: Reardon, Patterson and Ladenberg are tax-and-spend Dems who dont give a crap about poor people.
Look, we in Seattle are where the votes are. Period.
There's 580,000 people in Seattle. There's 974,000 in the East King and South King ST districts combined. There's another 1,047,000 in the Pierce and Snohomish ST districts combined. That means there's over 2,000,000 people in ST's taxing area that are not in Seattle.
Do you try to make stupid comments or does it just come naturally?
No one seems to have said this yet, but aren't sales taxes considered totally regressive?
Comments Closed
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Topic: Kiss
Kiss and Sell: How a Glam Band Makes Millions
From Hello Kitty to coffins, Kiss cashes in
By Robert Klara on Jun. 12, 2014 - 7:32 AM EDT
Gene Simmons, the bassist and most recognizable member of 1970s rock band Kiss, was once asked what he learned from his first job delivering newspapers in Queens, New York. "If…
The Worst Brand Extensions of 2013
What were they thinking?
By Robert Klara on Jan. 14, 2014 - 12:53 AM EST
CP+B Creative Director Makes Short Film About Kiss Song 'Beth' From Her Point of View
Bob Winter turns the tables
By Andrew McMains on Apr. 24, 2013 - 11:24 AM EDT
A classic rock ballad, "Beth" by Kiss, that inspired a thought balloon—"Wouldn't it be funny to hear Beth's side of the story?"—is now a short film. The four-and-a-half-minute piece from…
First Mover: Bob Winter
Crispin's new Miami ecd on his love of Kiss and embracing his dorky side
By Andrew McMains on Jan. 7, 2013 - 12:00 AM EST
Specs Age 46 New gig Executive creative director, Crispin Porter + Bogusky, Miami Old gig Chief creative officer, Young & Rubicam, Chicago What are the biggest challenges of your new job? To continue to build…