Google 'mic drop' Gmail joke for April Fools' day backfires - <AUTHOR> http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/news/gmail-google-mic-drop-april-fool-prank-undo-send-see-email-backfired-a6962916.html <comment><USER3> Annual reminder: the development effort spent adding an animated minion GIF to Gmail could have kept Google Reader running all year

source: [https://twitter.com/Pinboard/status/715820699215138817](https://twitter.com/Pinboard/status/715820699215138817)

<comment><USER4> Annual response: no it couldn't have.

[https://www.quora.com/Why-did-Google-cancel-Reader-rather- th...](https://www.quora.com/Why-did-Google-cancel-Reader-rather-than-making- it-a-paid-service)

<comment><USER5> Short version: Google couldn't keep Reader going because it would take money to get it working on the new Google+ infrastructure that failed spectacularly.

Fun fact: Google+ also royally broke the Google contacts feature in Gmail and it still hasn't quite recovered, meaning you can't really trust it when you sync it to other things. I wound up with 2 or 3 duplicates of contacts, some linked to Google+ profiles and some not, that sometimes had invisible connections to each other. They wouldn't merge correctly. Sometimes when you deleted one of them, more than one would disappear and you'd lose everything that was in that contact. They appear to be trying to remedy with this with the new Contacts web app that's in beta.

<comment><USER6> It's worse than that- Google+ broke the basic syntax in google search. Adding + before a word used to make it mandatory. They change it to quotations marks so they could have +username instead of @username for google plus. That still bothers me and Google search doesn't work as well.

<comment><USER7> That is my single biggest complaint about G+, that they would have compromised search for the biggest boondoggle google has ever created.

I would definitely say that implementing that was 100% when I saw that google was done making good decisions and on the path towards making their core product worse.

<comment><USER8> Every company has their time in the wilderness - MS just emerged from theirs, Apple had theirs, and Google started theirs a while back.

They're usually caused by hubris, and learning humility, to not antagonize your customers, and that you can make mistakes - like Microsoft seems to have - usually fixes things.

<comment><USER7> Really good point, unfortunately I think one of the biggest reasons any big company does get out of "the woods" is through competition starting to scare them.

Its fairly obvious that google is not really afraid of any large competitor in their space.

More than anything they are just buying up the next google (like msft did) to ensure that nobody can come up from the depths.

<comment><USER9> Except that it was likely investors pushing Google to come up with a response to Facebook that caused them to create Google Plus, even though in the process they had to kill several more vibrant social networks that had organically grown around their existing products.

Desperate imitation of Apple caused additional problems.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> Wow, what an incredibly, obviously bad idea. I spotted this last night and immediately realized how this would go down. If you have 900 million users (as gmail does) and you add a button right next to the send button that also has the word "send" on it, you are going to have a significant numbers of users send emails using that button! AND it adds a gif AND it archives the email thread AND those features aren't explained when you hover over the button! I have a feeling the vast majority of gmail users don't know how to find their archived email threads, so those users will never see the replies to the email they sent. The gmail team was asleep at the wheel on this one.

<comment><USER11> > _gmail team was asleep at the wheel on this one_

No. They intentionally drove off the road for fun and somehow didn't understand humans enough to realize that it would be really infuriating to some of their ~1 billion users.

They did the same thing with their "Call your Dad today" calendar reminder and many other things. Google's product teams seem to be both deaf (help forums overflowing with "+1s" for simple fixes) and tone-deaf.

This whole thing makes me realize I should just switch to Microsoft's apps/ecosystem and retain my Gmail address. There's no reason to put up with Google's terrible product decisions anymore.

<comment><USER12> It seems to be a combination of the Silicon Valley echo chamber + groupthink. They're completely ignorant of any perspective that isn't their own.

It's the one thing I hate about Android. The UIs of Google apps have gotten consistently _worse_ over the years, mainly because they've been prioritizing aesthetics over functionality/ease of use.

I'm assuming their thought process is something along the lines of _" This is obvious to me. Therefore, it will be obvious to the millions of Android users"_. No, it's obvious to you because _you just thought of it_ , it's most definitely _not_ obvious to everyone else.

<comment><USER13> > It's the one thing I hate about Android. The UIs of Google > apps have > gotten consistently worse over the years, mainly > because they've been > prioritizing aesthetics over > functionality/ease of use.

Care to elaborate on this with a few examples? I have the opposite complaint. They seem to be focussing on ease of use precisely at the expense of functionality. I'd rather stuff was a little more complicated, because it would give me more control over stuff. Note that I don't want it complicated for the sake of complexity. But I've noticed a increase in "adding features makes stuff complicated" and joke memes about "just make it an option". Well, programming - proper programming - IS hard, but it's worth it because you get a better product.

<comment><USER14> Also not Android, but Google has rendered the App Engine/Compute Engine dashboard completely useless. Double overlapping sidebars and a huge amount of wasted space everywhere makes simple tasks like finding a log entry difficult. The old design at appengine.google.com which Google is slowly deprecating was highly functional despite not being flat and "pretty." This is just one example. It's my personal opinion that Google is showing a tremendous lack of design ability in areas that they should be getting right at this point.

/rant

<comment><USER9> Of all the Google things that doesn't need to imitate a spare Apple design, it's APPENGINE

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> I feel like no one is addressing one of the biggest problems with these April Fool's things: they're just not funny. PigeonRank might have been cute 10+ years ago, but now it's the same joke over and over.

You know how in your group of friends there's one or two who are just super funny and make everyone laugh out loud? But then there's your other friend who every once in a while cracks a joke and you just kinda smile a bit? Yeah, that's who's putting together these pranks.

<comment><USER16> What do you mean by no one? I'd say more than half the people I pay any attention to howl in pain all day long.

It's even been dubbed "Internet Jackass Day".

</comment></comment><comment><USER17> Wow... I was absolutely sure that this backfire story WAS the April Fools' joke. It just seemed so farfetched. The animated gif I could understand, but actually blocking all future replies? That's where I figured that nobody would ever actually implement something so stupid and dangerous.

<comment><USER18> Yes, it's the side effects and real world changes to outgoing mails that is just beyond stupid and uncharacteristically bad even for Google April Fool's jokes. I don't even understand how the mere idea could be approved. It's like if they got an intern to "come up with something fun".

</comment></comment><comment><USER19> Really an immature oversight not just in the tone, but in the actual understanding of the product. It's a utility for most users.

What if AT&T just played a fart sound in the middle of a call if you hit a button on your screen? Of course that would go wrong. How did they think this was any different? They're not just some startup anymore.

<comment><USER20> >What if AT&T just played a fart sound in the middle of a call if you hit a button on your screen?

That's actually hilarious.

<comment><USER21> Not in the context of all conversations!

<comment><USER22> I'll grant that in the middle of a phone conversation with a doctor about flatulence, it'll just be neutral.

But otherwise, I got nothing.

And let me stop you before you reply "but what if it's terminal flatulence?" because you just answered your own question.

<comment><USER21> Picture receiving a phone call from the police in which you learn that your son and daughter had been killed in a vehicle collision.

While you are collecting your thoughts, perhaps before you fully realise that your life has been changed forever, the silence is punctuated by a loud _tphrrrphththpht_.

Hilarious.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER23> Don't like ads? Didn't like this prank? Don't like it when the UI changes? Use an email client. Like a boss.

<comment><USER24> What email client would you recommend? I've been stuck in Thunderbird because I require PGP/GPG, but I really hate it. Do you have a favorite client? I really do like Google's Inbox, but the lack of PGP is a blocker for me.

<comment><USER25> Do you actually "require" PGP, or is it just a preference?

I ask because as Bruce Schneier pointed out, his email security's only as good as that of the people he messages. With so many people using gmail, outlook, yahoo, etc., striving for total privacy is expensive.

Thus, I politely wonder whether you've set unrealistic expectations.

<comment><USER24> It's required by my employer. Almost all email I get is encrypted and/or signed.

For services we have running that send email but don't know how to encrypt (like Redmine and Jenkins), I wrote a little smtp proxy that all it does is look at the from and to addresses, select appropriate keys, construct a new encrypted email and forward it to the real smtp server. It's written in Python and is super-simple but has worked for years now.

<comment><USER26> That's really interesting. I care a lot about email encryption -- I want to make something better and easier to use than current PGP programs. One major hurdle is apathy. Talking to potential users, even if we could wave a magic wand and make end-to-end encryption effortless, many people just don't care.

A few companies (and their associated governments) have vast central databases containing most of the world's mail. At one point that would've been considered dystopian, but today many people just take it for granted.

I've previously worked in financial technology, and even financial advisors dealing with sensitive client info would always just use plain email.

\--

If you're comfortable telling me: what country and industry are you in?

Is it the norm to require PGP use on the job, or is your employer an exception?

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER27> Not sure if this prank/feature appeared on google's "For Work" (paid offering), but if it did, that would be sucky.

However on the free gmail side of things - not to be a jerk about this - <USER2> perhaps this should remind users that they are not the real customers for google...and that free platforms like this do in fact come with baggage. I'm not saying google intentionally meant to screw over their users (I totally get this was all meant in jest). But what incentive does google have other than saying "Oops, sorry". Any expectations for compensation i think are silly; and many users forget that. Does it suck that someone lost their job because of this? Hellz yeah, no doubt about that! But can we really expect google to do anything else except shut down this prank even if only after-the-fact? Again, it sucks, but this should serve to show/remind some of those users that these free platforms are not like your local electric/water utility, and should not be fully depended upon, certainly not for such important things as jobs, etc.

<comment><USER28> It wasn't there, at least not by default. We use google for Work gmail and no one in the company saw the button.

</comment></comment><comment><USER29> Verified - this is true and still working for me.

1\. You press "SEND+drop mic" button (note how close the buttons are: [http://imgur.com/5gBZVOh](http://imgur.com/5gBZVOh) )

2\. It says message sent and archived: [http://imgur.com/GpOhiLY](http://imgur.com/GpOhiLY)

3\. Go to other recipient email, it contains attachment of mic drop image. [http://imgur.com/Bs0iISe](http://imgur.com/Bs0iISe)

4\. Reply and it doesn't show up in inbox because conversation was archived (only accessible from "All Mail")

<comment><USER30> As a colorblind user I'm not quite sure what color the send+mic button is, but I'm drawn to it much more strongly than the normal send button. At the very least you'd think they would have had a pop-up confirmation message...

<comment><USER31> As a person who reads and is mindful of what I click, I click the button that says what I want it to do.

<comment> nommm-nommm Except they both say send. The stupid icon on the other one looks like a maraca. I would have never guessed "mic drop." Let's ignore that "mic drop" is a cultural expression that someone who grew up in a different country may not be familiar with. To be honest it look like a "send and play music" button to me.

<comment><USER32> Not just you. I've lived in the USA since I was a young lad and work for Google. I had never heard of 'mic drop' until this prank.

Then again, I don't watch TV so maybe I missed out on it being used.

<comment> nommm-nommm I grew up in the Northeast US. I only heard the expression be used in the last year or so. I'm not even sure what it means. I do watch TV.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER27> Just to think how much control google (or any other operator of free platform/service) has over the content of any messages pumped through their platform: Instead of google inserting that minion GIF, what if they simply added "...Not" to the end of every email?

Fictional example #1: Hi everyone, We're having a baby!...Not (Then google appends "...Not" to the end.)

Fictional example #2: Hi everyone, Grandma passed away...Not

Fictional example #3: Hi everyone, We're moving away to city/state/country XYZ!...Not

Fictional example #4: Hi everyone, We're getting a divorce!...Not

Encrypted messaging or not, that's a lot of control to have (by a provider) over what users send out. Or maybe i'm thinking too pessimistically?

<comment><USER33> I really hope if your grandma passes away you get a phone call. Maybe I am old fashioned.

<comment><USER34> I was one of around 30 grandchildren of my grandma's 12 children. I heard about her death via email— it would have been impractical to share the news otherwise, or to ask her caretakers to make 50 or even 12 calls while dealing with all the exigencies of the funeral.

<comment><USER33> Calling trees. That's the way we did it years ago.

<comment><USER35> I'd rather receive an email from the source than a call from someone who heard from someone who heard from someone that grandma is probably dead.

And they take a ton of work to organize.

<comment> nommm-nommm Friend/Family calling trees take no effort to organize and happen organically. You mostly just call the people who you are closest to and the others do the same with a few people making sure so and so who isn't close to anyone gets the word. I have an absolutely gigantic family on both sides (50 or so cousins total) and this had always been the way it operated on both sides of the family and there was never any advanced planning.

In fact when the news is very distressing (spouse death) the person usually only notifies one or two very close people. Those people make sure the word gets out.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER36> If somebody told me it's meta April fools day this year I would believe it.

</comment><comment> yoz-y I really do not like what Google did here.

If anything, they have introduced unnecessary code to an already complex application that people actually use. More code means more bugs. They should take Microsofts 'no more easter eggs' approach and stop dicking around.

<comment><USER37> Writing software is the company's function. "More code means more bugs" implies there is no opportunity or freedom for improvement.

(Also, Microsoft took a 'no more easter eggs' approach? Wow, I didn't know. That's.... Well, if I want to go program somewhere with no personal freedom or trust from management, I know where I can go!).

<comment> yoz-y > "More code means more bugs" implies there is no opportunity or freedom for > improvement.

This twists a bit the meaning of what I have said. This particular feature is made to be throw-away and is useless. Programmers should strive to make their code as simple as possible while keeping all of the _necessary_ features of the software. This feature was not necessary.

As for the Microsoft policy here is the source: [https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/larryosterman/2005/10/21/wh...](https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/larryosterman/2005/10/21/why- no-easter-eggs/)

Personally I would hope that the programmers' personal freedom is not expressed in easter eggs in mission critical software

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER38> Google sabotaging their own product just for a few laughs is a great way of reminding people that they don't really care about providing any services other than selling ads.

Also, what's the point of this prank when Gmail has a global audience? Only a minority of users will be aware that their tools might fail today because it's April Fools in the US.

<comment><USER39> Looks to me like there was a disconnect between what marketing wanted and what was delivered. Marketing saw this idea as a bit of fun, something that would create some good press and be playful.

Unfortunately the implementation was terrible, it confused users and lead people trying to seriously use the product to send silly pictures around.

Saying they don't care about the product because of this is silly. So many people use it because it is one of the best email applications around. A botched bit of fun doesn't mean the product is going to shit.

</comment></comment><comment><USER40> Typical Google. Sending UX down the drain in a whim

Apparently none of their "interviewed to death" workers noticed the potential ways this could backfire

<comment><USER41> > Typical Google. Sending UX down the drain in a whim

While doesn't seem like their brightest idea I still miss the old whimsy Google.

> Apparently none of their "interviewed to death" workers noticed the > potential ways this could backfire

This is IMO the really interesting part but I guess there is a strong groupthink culture there.

<comment><USER19> I think the old whimsy Google would think adding a minion gif to emails was a completely lazy and boring idea.

<comment><USER42> Yeah. Making Google Maps for the moon (with cheese at the maximum zoom level) was a combination of interesting and funny _in a way that wasn't absolutely contemptuous of the user_

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER43> I think the worst thing about this is that once you hit the button, you wouldn't get any more replies from that thread. Is this really how it worked — that Gmail essentially shut you out of subsequent replies to the conversation in a non-undoable way? (Edit: Maybe you could revive the ability to get replies by un-archiving the thread? Does anybody know?) It just makes explaining yourself in the event of a mistake (and even viewing the fallout) that much harder.

It also looks like they put the button where "Send" would normally go. Mistakes seem inevitable; this is pretty mind-boggling.

<comment><USER44> This uses an existing feature called "muting" a conversation, and yes they can be un-muted. See [https://support.google.com/mail/answer/47787?hl=en](https://support.google.com/mail/answer/47787?hl=en)

<comment><USER45> I would bet real money that a proper survey would show that 95% of Gmail users don't know about that feature, let alone understand how to use it or undo it.

Note I am not disagreeing with you, just adding to the point that this was a super-bad idea.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER46> I think the lesson here isn't so much about April Fools as it is about user interface design. Google put an orange warning on the button to let users know that the button would do something different, and people _still_ clicked it out of habit. We users simply don't expect that buttons will suddenly change functionality. Google felt that the warnings they had in place were sufficient. Clearly they weren't.

<comment><USER47> What if tomorrow some fools at Google think it is okay to play April fools prank with their automated cars? or their robots? and the car/robot goes berserk due to that?

This type of foolish pranks should backfire more strikingly. If they cannot treat their main (or at least one of the very important) business seriously, then they may face some very unpleasant things later.

<comment><USER48> What if tomorrow some engineers at Google think it is okay to do a normal update to their automated cars? or their robots? and the car/robot goes berserk due to that?

<comment><USER47> I did not say that this is impossible. It seems you are confused between accidental bugs and deliberate pranks. So, to address your issue: 1) it would not be unreasonable to expect that the "normal update" to their cars/robots should have passed some serious and rigorous testing/verification and the business/physical impact on end-user experience must have been assessed before rolling the "normal" updates; 2) and a serious business entity will not allow any such deliberate/damaging prank to slip through such a process.

<comment><USER48> > 1) it would not be unreasonable to expect that the "normal update" to their > cars/robots should have passed some serious and rigorous > testing/verification and the business/physical impact on end-user experience > must have been assessed before rolling the "normal" updates;

So your point here is that safety-critical updates need to be rigorously tested? I agree with that, but I don't see any connection to whether it's okay to have pranks. I'm not confusing bugs and pranks, my entire point is that they're quite separate. Your bug risk is there with or without pranks. So if you feel like adding a prank, go ahead, just subject it to the same safety testing. That they released a UI update that annoys people does not imply anything about their ability to do safety testing.

> 2) and a serious business entity will not allow any such deliberate/damaging > prank to slip through such a process.

I'll split "deliberate/damaging" into multiple cases.

Deliberate pranks: those are deliberate, they don't "slip through".

Safety-related damages: these are important, and not what happened here.

Non-safety-related damages: this getting through does not imply they have bad safey testing, so the comment about cars/robots going berserk is a non- sequitur.

<comment><USER47> >>Safety-related damages: these are important, and not what happened here.

Please define safety.

People lost their jobs due to this irresponsible prank. People might have missed replies from their doctors due to such foolishness. If now Google says that that's according to their "terms and conditions" then well, it clearly shows that Google is unreliable.

<comment><USER48> 'Safety' being the kind of worry you were trying to project when you mentioned cars and robots going berserk.

<comment><USER47> That's your notion of safety. For me (and I am sure for many others too) it means a product that is critical to my my workflow and the one on which my financial, health and other such critical aspects of life depend, if such a product (here Gmail) goes berserk due to some foolish prank played by the company then the company (here Google) is irresponsible and unreliable. Cars and robots present only some kinds of safety problems, not all.

<comment><USER48> If you weren't making any distinction then I don't understand why you brought up cars/robots going berserk in the first place.

(Or do you make a distinction, but you would call it something different? Then just say that, and I'll use the term you want. My contention has nothing to do with word choice. Nobody wins an argument about word choice.)

<comment><USER47> >>If you weren't making any distinction then I don't understand why you brought up cars/robots going berserk in the first place.

I brought up the issue mainly for these reasons: a) safety issues in cars/robots are more obvious; b) if google can do this (such harmful pranks) with email, then they can do such (harmful) pranks with their other products too, including cars/robots. I wanted to bring out these issues on the discussion.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER49> Maybe the Gmail team should realize we're all not children.

<comment><USER50> First off, yes, Google messed up here. They even acknowledged it themselves and took it down asap once they realized it.

But second, people need to cut Google a little slack here. We all make mistakes, or errors in judgement, and Google is no different. Do we really want to live in a world where companies are afraid to innovate and try anything new, because people are going to jump on their backs if things don't work out? Part of the reason why Google was able to create so many great products, like Maps, Mail and so on, is because they've created an environment that's very conducive to creativity and experimentation.

As a consumer, I love the fact that Google has given me so many awesome productivity tools, with great features, completely for free, and I don't want them to ever lose the creative/experimental culture that made it possible. If you're not a fan of such a culture, if you just want a no-nonsense humorless stable suit-driven product, well, Microsoft has you well covered.

<comment><USER51> Microsoft is actually trying out all sorts of stuff lately. Ubuntu for Windows? VS Code? OSS, cross-platform build tools? Lots of interesting things.

<comment><USER37> Racist chatbot AIs! ;)

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> Fun side effect of long-running AJAX apps: even though Google disabled the feature, it will still be live for everyone who has a gmail window since (at least) yesterday. The feature must have had a timed activation.

You have to refresh the page. And apparently even that may not be enough. I Ctrl-R refreshed in Firefox and still saw the button (aggressive caching?). I closed the tab and loaded gmail in a new tab, and finally button went away.

<comment> nommm-nommm I still have the button too! Refreshed and it didn't go away. I assume I have to log out to actually remove it. I'm not sure how long this tab has been open for.

</comment></comment><comment><USER52> I sent an accidental mic drop email as a response to an important conversation I was having regarding my career. Thanks a lot google.

<comment><USER53> Send a follow-up email with a brief explanation and a link to this article. If your employer/benefactor/whatever still insists on feeling slighted then you may want to reconsider if you want business relationship with them.

<comment><USER54> Impressions can go a long ways. What if you were emailing you exwife's lawyer or judge? Potential new customer that may save your business? Email is a critical communication tool of the modern day, it was ill conceived and clearly not thought out on Google's behalf.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER55> >Everyone will get your message, but that's the last you'll ever hear about it. Yes, even if folks try to respond, you won't see it."

Soo... they again purposely broke the whole idea behind email?

<comment><USER56> they replaced the reply & archive button. I might be mistaken since I don't use it, but it sounds like its normal behavior.

<comment><USER57> No, it isn't. the button only moves the thread to the archive, hiding it from the inbox until another mail belonging to it arrives.

<comment><USER58> It also mutes the conversation, which suppresses replies from showing up in Inbox.

<comment><USER57> The normal "reply and archive" button?

<comment><USER58> The mic drop button mutes, whereas send and archive does not. Therefore the behavior of mic drop is not "normal".

<comment><USER57> That's what I said/tried to say. Not very clearly though, it seems.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER59> I saw this last night while on a call with a friend. I emailed him and asked him to reply and saw that I didn't get the reply, and we both agreed that this was a spectacularly bad idea. About an hour later I saw my wife hovering over the mic drop button and warned her that she probably didn't want to use it. I love that Google's brand is fun and whimsical, but there are some things that are not OK for such a critical service. It's like if the electric company sent a signal down the wire on July 4th to make every AC motor start humming the national anthem.

</comment><comment><USER60> please make this an actual feature in labs. lose the gif and have it send an auto reply to all future responses indicating I am no longer reading the email thread. in the auto-reply have a link leading to how to use bcc

</comment><comment><USER61> This makes me wonder what the process is for these "jokes". Has anyone here been involved in an April Fools day joke that was as visible as this or on as important a product as Gmail? Where does the idea originate? How many people are involved in its approval? How much time and attention is paid to it? I think the answers to these type of questions would be pretty interesting.

We need an April Fools day postmortem.

<comment><USER62> I was the push behind Opera Softwares 'Face Gestures' April fool. This was concise over a lunch time chat, vetted by my manager and went to production (I would link the video but struggling to copy/paste). I felt it was amusing and some might believe it at the beginning but 99% of people would realise it's a joke by the end of the video. The response was good. It was fun for us to make something different and gave our users a laugh and got a bit of press for the brand. I think this is the goal more than actually fooling large numbers of people. Some harmless fun so to say.

That said over the years we had a few people asking about this feature as a serious option...

</comment></comment><comment><USER63> I think this is the actual April Fools' prank: the story about the failed prank. Nobody sane will approve a product feature such as this.

<comment><USER64> You could say the same thing about the last redesigns to gmail and maps, but those were real too.

<comment><USER63> Weird thing to say, considering that this "feature" goes to alter the conversation. No matter what the UI changes other, the primary tenet is to not alter and obfuscate the conversation. So, from this point of view, they actually messed with the core feature of the app: sending and receiving emails/messages, without alteration to the message.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER65> I think this article itself is an April fools joke.

<comment><USER66> I thought so too, at first, but it's getting a lot of seemingly-real coverage.

[http://time.com/4278950/april-fools-gmail-mic- drop/](http://time.com/4278950/april-fools-gmail-mic-drop/)

[http://fortune.com/2016/04/01/google-mic- drop/](http://fortune.com/2016/04/01/google-mic-drop/)

[http://www.theverge.com/2016/4/1/11344044/google-gmail- mic-d...](http://www.theverge.com/2016/4/1/11344044/google-gmail-mic-drop- button-april-fool)

Now, they could be in on the joke and/or all just picking up the original story and parroting it without any fact checking. I'm still hoping the real prank here was getting the media to cover a fake prank, but I'm becoming less sure of my instincts.

<comment><USER67> It's also worth noting that I saw the button in my GMail interface early this morning (as well as the little pop-up explaining it), and now, a few hours later, that button is gone, and it is still very much 1 April. I would think if the backlash was just part of the joke, the button would still be there.

<comment><USER66> Yeah, okay, that sounds pretty conclusive. When I replied, I hadn't yet seen a non-jokey-sounding report of a real person saying they'd experienced it. That sucks – both because the apparent negative impact on real people's lives and because I was really hoping it was an elaborate prank on the media.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER68> I believe we have all witnessed the end of April Fools Day jokes at Google.

<comment><USER69> I sincerely hope so. Every single company has to be April Fools and they are never cute or funny. Worst. Holiday. Ever.

</comment></comment><comment><USER70> If your brogrammer idea means some poor sysadmin is going to get a bunch of panicked questions, then don't do the damn joke.

<comment><USER71> Somehow I don't think Minions appeal to brogrammers.

<comment><USER70> Its one of the most popular mic drop gifs, so it was probably easy to get.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER72> The two autoplaying ads on the site may be worse than the mic-drop feature.

I definitely got a layover notice telling me about it last night around 8PM CST.

>to a bug, the Mic Drop feature inadvertently caused more headaches than laughs. We're truly sorry. The feature has been turned off.

I did enjoy the it's a feature/bug dual language though.

<comment><USER73> > The two autoplaying ads on the site may be worse than the mic-drop feature.

There is a fix available for this issue:

[https://github.com/gorhill/uBlock#installation](https://github.com/gorhill/uBlock#installation)

</comment></comment><comment><USER74> "Google is bringing back Google Reader", that would be a better April Fool's joke.

</comment><comment><USER75> Congratulations Google, you played yourself.

</comment><comment><USER76> I thought when reading about that "Drop the mic" joke, that gmail will temporarily drop recording from the users microphone, and will not send the audio to google, so they won't be able to listen what is spoken in that room. I thought that's a neat feature, unfortunately only temporary.

Romanian government used that tactic for some years on all old cable phones, until google brought that feature to the masses with the new smartphone and laptop technology.

</comment><comment><USER77> Does every single service of every single company need to have an April Fools' joke? The internet is incredibly obnoxious on April 1sts nowadays.

<comment><USER78> Some people enjoy fun traditions.

</comment></comment><comment><USER79> If your "professional relationship" is "destroyed" by something like this then it wasn't a real relationship anyway

<comment><USER80> Agreed — If someone fires you because of this do you really want to be working for them?

I think it was a great, if risky, marketing move — people all over the internet are talking about Gmail today.

Sure, some may have had a bit of trouble, but the Gmail team apologized publicly, thus providing a finger-pointing target for stressed office workers.

<comment><USER80> An addendum to my comment above: Three days later I have now also been bitten by Google's April Fool's feature/bug!

Today I received an email from someone asking why I was not replying to the other email thread started on April 1st. The person had clicked the 'drop the mic' button, and was not seeing any further replies to that thread. Not good!

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER81> Are we sure these stories aren't the actual joke? Did anyone here actually see this feature in person?

<comment><USER82> Yup. [https://www.dropbox.com/s/28xcoithtls9wo5/Screenshot%202016-...](https://www.dropbox.com/s/28xcoithtls9wo5/Screenshot%202016-04-01%2007.52.35.png?dl=0) (I thought it was kind of funny, FWIW, particularly when it hit a mailing list. :)

</comment></comment><comment><USER83> Well, there goes Google's cute April Fool's jokes from here on out.

</comment><comment><USER84> Did anyone take a screenshot of the Mic Drop button before it was removed? There are GIFs showing the sent email with the minion, but could find any showing the /button/ in action.

<comment><USER85> [http://i.imgur.com/5gBZVOh.png](http://i.imgur.com/5gBZVOh.png)

Seems obvious this was a bad idea.

Edit: Google's animated gif showing the whole UI: [https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-GYnAKaZY9v4/Vv2RkU5hIcI/AAAAAAAAB...](https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-GYnAKaZY9v4/Vv2RkU5hIcI/AAAAAAAAB4w/78RP9KC9uZYL8c93kWtkZV50yfGH1gipg/s1600/Gmail%2BMic%2BDrop_Send.gif)

I would guess they missed the idea that people use muscle memory to close irritating pop-ups without trying to figure out why it's there, or what it relates to. They are then left with 2 send buttons, one with a now ambiguous microphone icon.

<comment><USER37> It would be cool if people took this as a lesson to not close dialogs without reading them.

That's, of course, not what's going to happen.

<comment><USER85> Unfortunately, the popup Google chose to use looks like an advertisement. The red "new" banner and animated gif.

They might have reacted differently to an actual dialog at first click that says "This will inject an image into your outbound email, and mute the conversation. Continue?" (with the default choice set to "NO".

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER86> I wish I would have saw this feature before it was taken down so I would have a better understanding of why people were accidentally clicking it.

</comment><comment><USER64> From now on when you want to illustrate the difference between "knowing things" and "wisdom" just link here.

</comment><comment><USER87> I'm just gonna leave these here...

[https://www.fastmail.com](https://www.fastmail.com)

</comment><comment><USER88> Fools day in April sucks. I haven't even got mic dropped yet ;_;

</comment><comment><USER89> So in other words the prank worked.

April Fools day never claimed not to be devious.

</comment><comment><USER90> Did the button actually operate as advertised? It wouldn't surprise me if it did nothing, and the real April fools joke were planted fake outrage "I got fired over this!" tweets.

<comment><USER91> It inserted an animation of a minion dropping a mic into your email. You can see it in screen grabs.

</comment></comment><comment><USER92> I though that it was a really well done metaprank.

</comment><comment><USER93> I'm not seeing this in my UI, is it an independent april fool's joke here? ah I see it's supposedly been taken down, now I don't know if it actually ever existed.

<comment><USER88> I'm starting to wonder if the whole thing was just faked. That would be good.

</comment></comment><comment><USER94> Ya just don't mess with peoples email.

</comment><comment><USER95> I honestly thought this was an April fools article from the newspaper and the links would never lead back to Google.

Would be crazy if it was another level deep of April Fools.

</comment><comment><USER96> what a terrible idea for a prank. I can't believe this made it through all channels and got the OK.

</comment><comment><USER97> I think people should learn to read instructions and to search for explanations when they don't know something

</comment><comment><USER98> People lack sense of humor :S

</comment><comment><USER99> hint: Thunderbird, K9, Roundcube and Rainloop.

</comment><comment><USER100> "Well, it looks like we pranked ourselves this year. Due to a bug, the Mic Drop feature inadvertently caused more headaches than laughs."

It wasn't a bug it was a feature. Maybe I'm too much of an engineer but I HATE when PM's/managers/PR representatives just classify all unexpected and undesired behaviour as "bugs". A "bug" implies I made a mistake. I didn't make a mistake. I developed EXACTLY what you told me, after numerous rounds of confirmation and feedback loops. It's not a bug if it's doing exactly what it was supposed to.

<comment><USER101> In the pop-out compose, it _replaced_ the send&archive. In the regular compose/reply/forward, it added another button to the side. I'm thinking the "bug" is that in the pop-out, it replaced the send&archive, so people _inadvertently_ clicked it out of muscle memory.

<comment><USER102> Nah, the bug is that it actually triggered on the normal send button as well, for some people.

[https://twitter.com/waxpancake/status/715770400555315202](https://twitter.com/waxpancake/status/715770400555315202)

<comment><USER103> The actual bug was apparently a little more nuanced than 'for some people'. If you tried the mic drop button in an empty email, it would fail to send. If you then used that same email draft and sent it regularly, the effect would still apply.

[https://twitter.com/cabel/status/715769273545785344](https://twitter.com/cabel/status/715769273545785344)

<comment><USER104> That is brutal.

I guess this kind of thing is why we no longer have flight simulators in our spreadsheets and so forth.

<comment><USER105> For fun, on our site one of the developers made it so that if you entered the Konami code, every image would be replaced by random cat pictures. This was immediately ripped out of prod a few weeks later when a client asked why there were a bunch of cat photos in their dashboard. Still no idea how they triggered it.

We all felt very stupid and unprofessional.

<comment><USER106> I once did this on an internal app, we had a hotkeys library installed, so I added the GTA cheats to raise and lower your wanted level. It just added a temporary notice in the top right of your screen, nothing major. Turns out that if you mashed the keyboard, the library didn't properly handle 6+ character combinations, and would fire the callback anyways.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment> obj-g Wow, what a bunch of babies. I'm sorry, I just don't see how sending a "mic drop" email could ruin so many lives in just a few hours. It's not like it sent some NSFW gif or random insults or something. Accidentally sent one? Just send a new email to the person with a link to an article about it and say, oops, I got pranked, sorry?

<comment><USER107> I agree completely. The prank may not have been funny, but are we so tightly wound that this upsets us?

<comment><USER108> Jesus, have some empathy.

This doesn't upset _me_. This doesn't upset _you_. This doesn't upset hundreds of thousands of people and as unfunny as this is, I'm sure many are laughing about it.

However, it _can_ upset _some_ people. Some people who would mistakenly click the button because, god forbid, they forgot not to use the internet at all on April 1st, and that mistake would appear in an extremely important conversation.

And that mistake would appear during career discussions. And that mistake would get someone not hired, or fired, or whatever.

You guys want to complain, talk about how they should "look harder", how they should "take responsibility" and "own up to their mistakes", how they should "be happy not to work somewhere people are so uptight"? _Have some fucking empathy_.

I'd wager the majority of HN is well off, or well off enough that they don't have to worry about the rent or their water bill. But I'd like to see some of the people here struggling to make ends meet. Maybe you won't be so sociopathic about the potential for serious harm.

This thread makes me sick.

<comment><USER107> But you _are_ upset at the _idea_ of people potentially being upset by it. This thread makes you sick. Are you suggesting it's classist to observe the prank as harmless?

I understand where you're coming from, and I understand how someone may have clicked it by accident. I am struggling to empathize with the recipient who would see this, and a follow-up email explaining it was a mistake, and let that affect them.

<comment><USER108> The prank doesn't upset me. Where did I suggest that the _thread_ doesn't upset me? Damn right the thread upsets me. People are downvoting left and right those that dare to suggest jobs are not a commodity you can just throw away and replace a week later. _Not for everyone_.

And no, there's no classism at play. It's purely and simply a lack of empathy. A lack of understanding of what it's like to be in a situation where losing your job may cost you your home, your children or even your life.

> I am struggling to empathize with the recipient who would see this

Then don't empathize with the recipient. Plenty of bosses are jerks. But empathize with the _sender_ , who would lose a job they cared about and can't necessarily get a new one like they grow on trees.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER109> [insensitive/ignorant comment withdrawn]

<comment><USER110> > more people use GMail professionally

I think email is /primarily/ used as a professional communication tool today. Casual and personal uses of email have been largely replaced by social media.

</comment></comment><comment><USER111> Is this an April Fools joke itself?

</comment><comment><USER112> Was it real or it's a meta joke?

<comment><USER113> The people want to know! We don't have time for this.

</comment></comment><comment><USER114> "Please return all your mail to Google for a full refund."

It's a free product...you got what you paid for!

<comment><USER91> I don't know if it also showed up for Google for Domains / Google Business / whatever they're calling it now, but there are people who pay for Gmail.

</comment></comment><comment><USER115> I love how so many people are butthurt about this. Google owes you nothing. They are a business and you are their customer using their product for free. If you don't like it, GTFO.

<comment><USER116> Some businesses pay for it, actually.

I don't know if they also received this feature.

<comment><USER115> The widespread consensus is they didn't, so that's an irrelevant point.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER117> I think this article is a joke, making it a really good April fools joke. This is a real Google style April fools joke: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSZPNwZex9s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSZPNwZex9s)

</comment><comment><USER118> Stuff like this makes me consider less about ever applying to Google. idk, they've got smart people at their company, but there seems to be an underlying disconnect with real everyday users. I think autistic would be too harsh to describe their collective mindset...

<comment><USER119> Collectively autistic?

Their real everyday users amount in the millions. But please give us more insight using highly inappropriate analogies.

<comment><USER120> They have real every day users, but Google doesn't understand those users. Many Googlers eat at Google, play at Google, and _most of their friends are other Googlers_.

You'll notice Google has almost no comprehension of real people's lives. Google designers have never had to do work on a 1024x768 screen at the office.

Googlers live in a bubble where technology is perfect, which is why they seem to believe technology can solve a lot of human issues much easier than they actually can. For them, it's possible.

<comment><USER121> Google understands users better than you think. They mine millions of interactions to see what people are doing so understand what is liked and not liked. This prank was not a data driven so back fired.

<comment><USER120> Google has automated this process. They don't do nearly enough actual interaction with actual users about problems. This is actually an example of what I'm talking about. Where they assume an automated data collector is more valuable than even just sitting down with one person and watching them use the website.

<comment><USER122> So look, I literally can't even right about now.

The UX researchers here at Google DO in fact sit down with many people and watch them use all sorts of parts of google, gmail, etc. In fact they go out of their way to run usability studies in various parts of the countries, because, you know, selection bias.

Also automated data is collected.

The real problem here is, if you have X million users, can you really know them as a unified set of people? Of course not.

Sure this prank backfired, but hey, have some compassion for the people who worked on it. They were trying to be funny, and trying to bring a little light to people's life. There was no intention of ruining anyone's day.

<comment><USER120> I am opted into their user studies group. I haven't seen a new invitation in a couple of years now. And the way they handle user studies, opt in via Google Form, they still see a particularly biased community: Hardcore Google users, most likely technical in nature.

If Google went to a senior citizens' home, and watched how some of their less technically inclined users used their products, I'm confident Google would fire everyone with the word "designer" in their title and start over.

But this is largely immaterial to this particular joke. The joke was funny. The choice to implement it for real was not.

<comment><USER122> So, what you're saying is, from your limited view point, you have a conclusive overview of all of UX? Also, Google designers are intensely incompetent and deserve to be fired?

I dunno, you sure are quick to judge a very difficult subject area.

<comment><USER120> Google designers ARE intensely incompetent. And design's a pretty simple subject area. The problem is, designers need to justify their continued jobs, after a product is launched. So there's a constant set of increasingly more complicated overengineering projects to "redesign" things to stay "trendy". Generally sacrificing usability in exchange.

Ever since Google hired their "VP of Design", their products have heavily shifted away from being functionally useful.

There's a reason Gmail is the last bastion of competent design at Google. There's a reason that even Googlers said they wouldn't use Gmail if Inbox became the "new Gmail", and this is probably where this conversation rounds back to this prank:

You don't %$@# with email.

<comment><USER119> What does constitute good design? Does this:

[http://www.ocdtrekkie.com/](http://www.ocdtrekkie.com/)

Because if _that_ is "functionally useful" then I will happily continue using trendy. The thing with design is that it _is not_ a simple subject area. You are constantly balancing several (somtimes mutually exclusive) objectives.

At the end of the day, blame end-users. They use the products that are "trendy" and look nice. They dictate good design.

<comment><USER120> My not really updated portfolio page isn't really intended to be 'useful', lol. Though the navigation is much clearer than many websites today, and the pages load on pretty much any device nearly instantaneously.

<comment><USER119> You highlight my exact point: To you design is purely functional. To the overwhelming majority of people it isn't. That's the reason Google's Design initiative (Material Design) was started in the first place. Good design practices across all Google Services.

You want bad design, try most of the AWS tools. You can have both functionality and appeal. Pretending they are mutually exclusive is silly.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER33> Let's just say for the sake of argument that this were a serious new feature and not an April 1 joke. Like a fast reply or something that could cause similar outcomes.

Are they allowed to rearrange the buttons then? Or should they never change the UI in fear that users might bump the wrong button due to muscle memory.

</comment><comment><USER123> If I try some time-math:

The article posted to a UK site with a byline that says "Posted 43 minutes ago". At the time of writing this comment; 43 minutes was ~2pm in the UK, give or take a few minutes.

The article also has an update on 11:50. That update either came ~2 hours before the article was posted, or 8-9 hours in the future.

So, I'm going to guess the whole article is fake.

<comment><USER124> >So, I'm going to guess the whole article is fake.

Honestly this is the best April Fools I've seen on the internet in years because I've no idea whether the mic drop feature existed or not. The uncertainty in whether it's real owns

<comment><USER125> The mic drop feature did exist; I had the pleasure of actively not clicking it on an email I sent last night.

<comment><USER124> I'd like to believe you, but how can I trust anything I read on the internet today?

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER126> Anyone else thought about the fact that now that they have removed this feature, they have put the "job death" sentence on those that accidentally used it and would have had a reasonable explanation to their boss?

"Look, this button is right here and I thought it was send." Now a non- technical boss will just assume that person is lying because no button is in gmail anymore. Thanks Google. Stay Classy.

<comment><USER127> Well, there's plenty of references to this on the internet already.

</comment></comment><comment><USER128> I was wondering if this would have some serious legal repercussions for Google.

In the US I believe normal mail cannot be substantially modified in transit, and that this is a Federal offense. For instance for a postal worker to open letters and insert cartoons because it was April Fool's day he would not only lose his job but also be subject to prosecution.

Certainly an email server is in some way exempt as it is possible for software to add headers to an email, but if the server modifies the message and the manner of communication substantially, there might be serious legal ramifications to this practical joke of Google. Especially since this joke impeded the response in a way similar to scratching out the return address of a postal letter.

The very fact that Google thought it worthwhile to do such a thing with personal communication absolutely boggles the mind. Any responsible organization would be insane put their email on their servers after such a stunt.

<comment><USER129> Just because it has mail in the name doesn't in anyway imply it falls under the same jurisdiction of our federal mail system.

<comment><USER128> This is more a sign of the sluggishness of the legal system to follow the reality. More people use email now than regular mail, even for official things. Most companies even accept a pdf of a signed contract as an attachment these days.

The thing is though, if email was treated in a way similar to Federal mail, the whole debate about encryption and due process could be handled by laws that already protect privacy. For some strange reason, because it uses a computer, we lose many fundmental rights that we already had with Federal mail. In a certain way email is a service so fundamental to society now, that it becomes a necessary utility - so many things can't be done without an email address today.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER130> <obligatory rant about April Fools day>

April Fools is such a collective waste of time. Not only does it lower productivity of many people for a day, some "pranks" actually take days to prepare. I imagine that producing SnoopaVision for Youtube [1] wasn't exactly cheap.

[1] [https://www.youtube.com/snoopavision](https://www.youtube.com/snoopavision)

<comment><USER131> Yes, just like Christmas, New Years' Eve, and the rest.

</comment></comment><comment><USER132> TL;DR "people are careless and stupid, use a new feature on important messages without checking to see what it does first, then whine about it when they get burned"

The modern world is pathetic.

<comment><USER133> It's important to avoid the thought-terminating cliche "Oh, it was just human error" and look at the problems in the UI that cause the errors in the first place. If the ignition in your car was one day replaced by an ejector seat, and you hit it without thinking because that's what you do every day, I doubt you'd be placing the blame on yourself.

<comment><USER132> Given that a car is a dangerous piece of machinery that could quite easily kill myself and people around me if it malfunctions, yes I do give it a once- over every time I get into it throughout the day, which includes the interior controls.

Getting back on topic, given historical data, it's foolish to not expect something to happen/change on April 1st, especially on google products.

So yes, I place the blame on the users.

<comment><USER134> @ShitHNSays</comment></comment></comment></comment>


Facebook stored millions of Instagram passwords in plain text - <AUTHOR> https://www.theverge.com/2019/4/18/18485599/facebook-instagram-passwords-plain-text-millions-users <comment><USER2> Literally every single time Facebook announces something like this, they always announce low numbers and then repeatedly revise them upwards.

Is there no penalty to them for basically lying to everyone in their initial announcement? Doing it once can be explained as they sincerely thought their original number was correct, but they have a history of doing this and there's no chance I believe now that they aren't doing this on purpose.

<comment><USER3> I think revising upwards is them looking for other bugs of the same type, and finding lots.

I can totally imagine someone on the instagram photo pinch-to-zoom team saying "Whoa - if someone re-logs in while a photo is partially zoomed, our metrics capture the password. Thats bad!". They find thats super-rare, and only impacts 10k users.

Later, other logfiles are grepped for passwords (possibly even by doing a fulltext search across all fields and blobs for common passwords), and more and more are found.

Then someone says "but some of our data is in fields base64 encoded - did you try grepping for base64 encoded plaintext", and even more are found, etc.

<comment><USER2> You're giving them far too much credit.

<comment><USER4> Benefit of the doubt.

<comment><USER2> Benefit of the doubt is something you give to a company the very first time it does something like this. Not something you give the umpteenth time they do something like this, and especially not when they try and hide their "sorry it was waaaay worse" update amid other high-profile news.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> New rule: whenever facebook announces a breach and scale of effect, just square the scale of effect right off the bat. You'll probably still be a little low, but you'll be a lot closer to the number in the second (or third or fourth) press release.

<comment><USER6> 1e6^2 = 1e12, trillions of passwords? ...

<comment><USER7> "The security lapse was first reported last month, but at the time, Facebook said it only happened to "tens of thousands of Instagram users," whereas the number is now being revised up to "millions." The issue also affected "hundreds of millions of Facebook Lite users" and "tens of millions of other Facebook users.""

<comment><USER8> I wonder how much of this is the responsibility on how Instagram was built. Like Instagram may have been built so fast that those things never were accounted for.

Not that I'm giving Facebook excuses, but maybe something was overlooked before acquisition. Then again, Facebook is breaching security protocols left and right.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> "...various errors seem to have caused Facebook's systems to log some passwords in plain text since as early as 2012."

1) As a software engineer I can't imagine how such errors could possibly have entered production code accidentally, especially after code review. If precise details of these errors are released I am open to have my mind changed.

2) Even if it did, I can't see how it would take facebook's tens of thousands of engineers 7 years to find this "bug".

<comment><USER10> During a job interview at one mid-size startup one of the interview questions involved handing me a 2 page excerpt of server logs and asking me to identify bugs/issues from the messages and tracebacks in the logs. (neat idea!)

The logs contained user credentials, and they hadn't noticed. I pointed it out to the CTO.

<comment><USER11> Wow, their interview question (in the hands of the wrong interviewee) could have caused a data breach.

<comment><USER3> If it's a plaintext password, the minute it hits _any_ human eyes, it is IMO compromised and the user should be required to change it. Employee, Interviewee, Hacker - doesn't matter.

<comment><USER12> I'd go a step further. IMO the second it hits a hard drive it's compromised so just the act of having that in the log would count.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER13> Obviously you shouldn't log passwords, but what kind of security mechanism have been effective to catch this error?

One thing I can think of is have some production test accounts that are regularly used and have a unique password. Then have an automated task that periodically greps the production logs for the password to see if you have a log leak.

Any other approaches?

<comment><USER14> You could grep production logs and other data stores for commonly used passwords like "password123".

<comment><USER15> More dependable would be tests that inject unique privileged information and then check for that appearing anywhere it shouldn't.

<comment><USER3> You need to do both.

Real users will find routes through your app that automated tests never consider. For example, what if the users 1-year login cookie expires as they're on step 3 of a 4 step "change your avatar" process. That's highly unlikely, and probably not even tested. Yet it might well work (due to good modular design), but also log inappropriate data.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> OK, this is getting ridiculous. There is no best practices. You think a company worth Billions would have a standard of ethics.

Afterall, that's what they interview on. Best Practices. Ethics.

Doesn't Facebook have blogs on things like efficient servers, algorithms and such. They are obviously at the forefront of technology (or know about it). Why aren't they implementing these things?

It seems to me that the more your company is worth, the less you get to bend rules, all to chase more money. HR an lawyers will take care of the rest.

</comment><comment><USER16> Maybe instead of quizzing obscure sort algorithms at interviews, they should have simple yes/no questions such as:

Should you store plaintext password on the server side?

</comment><comment><USER17> Earlier post of the exact same story.

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19693233](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19693233)

</comment><comment><USER18> And they announced it while they thought the attention was elsewhere (due to the Muller report release), and in an easy to miss manner (as an update to a blog post). Very trust inspiring.

<comment><USER19> Edit: The following is correct but misleading. The Muller report was reported to be released before the Facebook security update.

Facebook announced this before the Muller report was released.

The Facebook security post was updated April 18, 2019 at 7AM PT [1].

The Muller report was released "Thursday morning, shortly after 11 am [EDT]" [2]

[1] [https://newsroom.fb.com/news/2019/03/keeping-passwords- secur...](https://newsroom.fb.com/news/2019/03/keeping-passwords-secure/)

[2] [https://www.vox.com/2019/4/18/18411966/mueller-report- releas...](https://www.vox.com/2019/4/18/18411966/mueller-report-release-time- trump-russia-redactions)

Disclosure: I work for a big tech company but not Facebook. All opinions are my own.

<comment><USER20> Sure, but the Mueller report was widely reported[0][1][2] to be released Thursday morning days ago.

[0]: [https://deadline.com/2019/04/redacted-robert-mueller- report-...](https://deadline.com/2019/04/redacted-robert-mueller-report- coming-thursday-morning-donald-trump-bill-barr-russia-1202596040/)

[1]: [https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national- security/muell...](https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national- security/mueller-reports-release-is-expected-thursday-justice-dept- says/2019/04/15/dd44eb02-5f91-11e9-9412-daf3d2e67c6d_story.html)

[2]: [https://www.cnbc.com/2019/04/15/mueller-report-expected- to-b...](https://www.cnbc.com/2019/04/15/mueller-report-expected-to-be- released-thursday-morning.html)

<comment><USER19> I wasn't aware of this. I updated my comment to reflect this.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER21> How does Facebook, hiring some of the _best_ engineers in the industry with the biggest bucks ends up in such a mess

<comment><USER22> maybe they need passwords to login as user?

<comment><USER16> even if they want to emulate a user, they can do so without their password. Or if doing so in a simplistic way, they can login with said user's hashed password, instead of the original plaintext.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER23> I feel like this could be avoided by hashing the password on the client side as well before sending it to the server, no?

<comment><USER24> Yes, but while "storing passwords in plaintext is bad, mkay?" is accepted in the industry, "transmitting passwords to the server is bad, mkay?" is, in fact, not accepted. It is usually considered "best practice" to transmit passwords to the server, which is obviously wrong.

<comment><USER12> That doesn't work. If you hash on the client then the hash IS the "password" and is thus sensitive info that you'd need to hash again on the server and shouldn't be stored anywhere in plain text.

<comment><USER25> While I agree with what you say, one could argue there is the additional element of protecting against user password reuse between sites.

If the client-side hash is strong enough it means that your plaintext password leak becoming a hashed password leaks at least protects the user from reuse on other sites.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER26> If you do layer 7 NSM/DPI then you're most likely logging passwords. The good news is this data typically has significantly stronger controls over access logs as it's collected for secops.

</comment><comment><USER27> I am wondering why sending onetime login link to an email is still not a thing?</comment>


Textile's protocol-based approach to decentralized photo sharing on mobile - <AUTHOR> https://medium.com/textileio/wip-textile-threads-whitepaper-just-kidding-6ce3a6624338 <comment><USER2> ...and data recovery.</comment>


GitHub has 20,927,907 closed issues - <AUTHOR> https://github.com/issues?q=is%3Aissue+is%3Aclosed <comment><USER2> And they frown upon reddit for 'low-quality' content.

#2 post, my ass...

Face it, reddit won because it's objectively better with its lax moderation against this restricted garden.

<comment><USER3> Do you mean Hacker News vs. Reddit in terms of popularity? HN deliberately tries not to be as popular as Reddit.

A few years ago HN was featured in a relatively popular publication, (TechCrunch maybe? I forget) and we flooded the front page with stories about Haskell (I'm pretty sure, or some other esoteric topic) to drive away any would be newcomers from that piece.

HN is trying to appeal to a particular type of demographic - people interested in computer science / programming and start ups.[1] The more you try to be all things to all people, the more you end up with the blandest content with the broadest appeal, like many of the more popular subreddits.

[1] Contrary to some people's beliefs, I don't think this means there should be stories _only_ about computer science, programming, and startups, just that the stories should be interesting to people who find those things interesting. Of course, even among a similar group of people not everyone is going to agree what other things are interesting, but that's what we have the voting for.

<comment><USER4> > _HN deliberately tries not to be as popular as Reddit._

No they/we don't. They might like to pretend that, because, after all, it's cool to be an "exclusive club". But this is just another internet forum that happens to have content you/I like.

<comment><USER3> See above about flooding the front page with Haskell stories. That was a real thing that happened. And yes there was a post from pg at the time actually asking people to make the site seem unappealing to newcomers until the traffic surge from TC died down. It is a very deliberate attempt to limit the growth rate to a manageable amount and maintain a certain type of culture.

It's not because we're an "exclusive" or "elite" club, it's just that with a broader community there would be a need to appeal to broader, more general interests that would eventually drive away the people who originally came here for the tech-business related content.

<comment><USER5> It was Erlang, not Haskell, but yes, pg asked user to do that, and they complied, a bit too literally (he meant Erlang as an example).

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> I was waiting for this post. Or rather, I was hoping that the first "Open Issues" post would mention the number of closed issues or the total of all issues. Giving one random number of X is not very useful without some context. And if the context is in my mind, great. If it's not, I appreciate it when a poster gives that to me.

</comment><comment><USER7> Please post this too.

GitHub has 880,159 open PRs ([https://github.com/pulls?q=is%3Aopen+is%3Apr](https://github.com/pulls?q=is%3Aopen+is%3Apr))

GitHub has 12,558,530 closed PRs ([https://github.com/pulls?q=is%3Apr+is%3Aclosed](https://github.com/pulls?q=is%3Apr+is%3Aclosed))

(sarcasm)

<comment><USER8> This is the type of content that appeals to the sterotypical HN user. Not clickbait, highly technical, very informative, potentially useful trivia.

It is absolutely boring for a normal person though.

</comment></comment><comment><USER9> Most commented issue: [https://github.com/taolee/scalahooks/issues/1](https://github.com/taolee/scalahooks/issues/1)

Looks like someone went wild with the api

<comment> why-el Well from this I learned that the maximum number of comments is 2,500.

<comment><USER10> Oh really? [https://github.com/peej/to.uri.st/issues/128](https://github.com/peej/to.uri.st/issues/128) is at 16k.

"If we spam ourselves we'll know which bugs are most serious and are sure to fix those" perhaps?

<comment><USER11> That was probably from before they enforced a limit.

<comment><USER12> By looking at that I'm thinking that maybe their spamming is the reason for the limit in the first place.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><AUTHOR> For the people who don't get the idea of the post: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Is_the_glass_half_empty_or_hal...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Is_the_glass_half_empty_or_half_full%3F)

</comment><comment><USER13> Such a convenient way to see your issues mentioned in -> [https://github.com/issues?q=is%3Aissue+thomasdavis+is%3Aopen](https://github.com/issues?q=is%3Aissue+thomasdavis+is%3Aopen)

</comment><comment><USER14> So for extra karma, someone can post this: [https://github.com/pulls?utf8=%E2%9C%93&q=is%3Apr+is%3Aopen](https://github.com/pulls?utf8=%E2%9C%93&q=is%3Apr+is%3Aopen)

</comment><comment><USER15> This was posted only 3 hours ago as "GiHub has X open issues", and is still at the top of the front page. Why repost with the opposite title?

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11578191](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11578191)

</comment><comment><USER16> The number changes to between 21m - 18m on page reload

</comment><comment><USER17> Who gives a sh*t?

</comment><comment><USER18> What the..</comment>


British 15-year-old gained access to intelligence, pretending to be head of CIA - <AUTHOR> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/01/19/british-15-year-old-gained-access-intelligence-operations-afghanistan <comment><USER2> It's also pretty crazy to me how easily he received access to these top secret databases when he was pretending to be essentially the CEO.

I would never let my manager into my Linux systems, just to make an analogy. I give my manager a report on what's going on but I'd never let them in. Because they're not competent enough to handle them.

Yet these top directors are able to get access to essentially any database or system just because of their title.

<comment><USER3> That struck me as odd do not US phone companies secure their sensitive customers information. When I worked at BT they took this very seriously and say looking up the queens unlisted telephone number you would get into serious trouble.

For some systems team leaders who needed wide access to data had to pass security clearing at the TS / DV level I was told.

<comment><USER4> Hah, the queen has an unlisted phone? Well I guess she has a private landline...

Reading your comment makes me imagine HM The Queen in the royal carriage, being bored at the slow pace, staring at her smartphone, scrolling through Instagram.

<comment><USER3> Yep there was a big scandal in Scotland when a some what sketchy journalist got a job in a call centre and did that.

The irony was the press office was on the floor above and didn't notice.

<comment><USER5> Lol, how did that go? I am thinking... something along these lines:

Telemarketer: When you sign up with ShitWare, our Platinum partner, you get a free BigMac (tm) with a crumpet and a small drink! This exciting promotion is only available to our subscribers! Limited time offer. Quantities are limited. Only in participating restaurants. Some conditions apply. Taxes (incl. VAT) not included.

Queen: Goodness gracious, did you just say free BigMac (tm) and crumpets? That is, like, fucking amazing! OK I clicked on that link, it says "Your Windows is infected! Click here to clean!" Is that OK? Btw where is my food.

Telemarketer: It is, indeed, perfectly OK! Just click on where it says "I Agree". BTW it is one crumpet (not "crumpets") or a hashbrown, subject to availability. This exciting, time-limited offer is ---

Queen: Yeah whatever dude, just send the food in.

Queen: This is good. Most good.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> Someone clearly needs to be punished. Several someones. I'd let this intrepid and talented 15 year old go, and let the US (and whoever else concerned) prosecute the living crap out of all those in public positions of trust and clearly not up to it.

Suggest starting from the top. A head of CIA with classified material stored on his computer in such a way that access is dependent on some external internet provider? Under the always ressourceful American penal system, that sounds to me like any number of centuries on the inside looking out.

<comment><USER7> Why should the person committing the crimes be let go? Because you identify with them? Because they are seemingly intelligent in how they committed their crimes? I don't understand wanting to punish "dumb" criminals when the "smart" ones are far more dangerous

<comment><USER8> > Why should the person committing the crimes be let go?

Because a child calling a helpdesk and pretending to be someone else is a prank. Slap on the wrist, followed by a job offer. It seems on a similar level to ringing a bar and asking for 'Amanda Hugginkiss' or 'Mike Hunt'. At least this kid found the problem before the Russians did.

<comment><USER7> Crimes are not pranks

<comment><USER9> Most pranks can be prosecuted as crimes. Broad disturbing the peace and harassment statutes apply to most.

Here's 3 that come to mind:

\- toilet-papering a house/tree

\- ding-dong-ditch (harassment, possibly even rising to a hate crime in the right circumstances)

\- flaming shit on doorstep (obviously)

Whether something is a crime or not is a pretty bad test for whether a child should be held accountable as an adult for the act.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> Just a reminder of how fucked we all are any time a social engineering attacker wants to target us.

I once thought I was safer since I don't even have an American address anymore and have been living abroad for years.

Nah, Amazon customer support answered an attacker's "so where was my last item shipped to" question after they authenticated by giving the support rep an address I used as a shipping address for one item almost 10 years ago.

The poor kid in TFA was doing some free social engineering pen testing.

<comment><USER11> He would've been a "poor kid" had he not swatted people and harassed their families saying he'd bang their daughter.

What a waste of talent.

<comment><USER12> What?

<comment><USER13> maybe he meant "he would NOT have been" instead of "He would've been a poor kid had he not swatted people"

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER14> > He used similar methods to access Mr Brennan's AOL account and eventually > Gamble was able to access his emails, contacts, his iCloud storage account > and his wife's iPad remotely.

Too crazy.

<comment><USER15> Is there something similar to Google's Advanced Protection for iCloud?

<comment><USER16> After the iCloud celebrity "hacking" scandals they added phone-based 2FA and now have "your iOS device can be trusted":

[https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT204915](https://support.apple.com/en- us/HT204915)

though I don't know if the security question reset path is closed.

There was a small flare up earlier this year about people hijacking cell phone numbers, which then of course let's you take over all sorts of accounts since you can defeat the (relatively) poor security of SMS-based OTP.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER17> Was it always this easy or have we gotten soft since the Cold War ended?

Why weasel into an organization and steal piddly shit when you can just pretend to be the director and ask anybody for anything?

</comment><comment><USER18> One takeaway here is that the professionalization, training, oversight and salaries of IT support staff all need to follow the same ascending curve as the sensitivity of the staff and systems they are supporting.

</comment><comment><USER19> he could have continued this for years if he hadn't been blatantly harassing people

<comment><USER20> He seems to have some anti US sentiments, but went with trolling random members of the machine rather than quietly collecting information & passing it off to wikileaks

<comment><USER21> I think of that approach as the Anon legacy.

That group (if one can even call it that) taught a generation to go for trolling/harassment rather than subversion.

<comment><USER22> False dichotomy. One can do both and each can act as the other. Trolling is a tool.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER16> Sigh. These organizations clearly need mandated 2FA, and no "security questions". I like that some people use a password manager to fill in the security questions with random strings, but sensitive systems just shouldn't allow such easy attacks.

</comment><comment><USER23> Anyone surprised should read up on Mitnick career and specially his book: The Art of Deception

</comment><comment><USER24> This is incredible (in a bad way). How is it not on the front page of every news site?

<comment><USER25> Attention diversion</comment></comment>


Friendfeed gets $5m - congrats Paul Buchheit - <AUTHOR> http://mashable.com/2008/02/25/friendfeed-funded/

<comment><USER2> FriendFeed looks like a potentially distributed version of Facebook, if used properly at an individual/friend/local level and evangelized properly as a company. I really like the relatively loose association between friends and services. Right now you have many of the photo/link sharing capabilities in Facebook tied down to Facebook-centric/based apps but FriendFeed allows you to transfer that level of interaction to highly specialized apps that have fairly focused goals.

The way I see the potential competition for Facebook from FriendFeed is by visualizing highly specialized apps connected together like nodes on a graph by the interaction between people who know each other in real life; the sum total of interaction between people brings equivalent value as Facebook does. I think Facebook creates this graph in exactly the opposite way: the individuals are represented as the nodes and the applications become the connectors. In both cases it is the interaction between the nodes that result in the edges of the node, but the impetus for placing a node on the graph are different - and this difference is ultimately to the detriment of Facebook at the moment as it puts Facebook at a disadvantage (the factual presence of all the highly specialized apps that are already popular at some level is what I'm referring to).

Facebook is one account and it enables you to do many things; these many activities are bound to Facebook. On the other hand it is more likely that you will have many different accounts at highly specialized apps/communities and the fact that you can connect the activity with other people gives FriendFeed an additional use over using Facebook.

The way these social graphs are created is a very significant distinction for the upside potential of FriendFeed and symmetrically the downside potential of Facebook. This can be further illustrated by picturing Facebook as a graph that grows from the inside out like how patches of mushrooms would grow, and FriendFeed is a graph that "condenses" from out of nowhere (I'm thinking of the bright yellow PbO2 condensation reaction from my chemistry days).

If I were a Facebook employee, I'd be terrified of FriendFeed as the interactions that arise from using FriendFeed are potentially more nebulous than what Facebook could hope to achieve. The value of the interaction between the nodes of the graph is the most overlooked principle in why social networks grow (this is reaffirmed for me each time I read about the next "Digg killer"!). I have a feeling that FriendFeeders know just how valuable this is...

</comment><comment><USER3> most of it is self funded isnt it ?</comment>


News sites are fatter and slower than ever - <AUTHOR> http://www.mondaynote.com/2015/07/13/news-sites-are-fatter-and-slower-than-ever/

<comment><USER2> Are you listening to this, Indie??

[http://www.independent.co.uk/](http://www.independent.co.uk/)

^ 'Guaranteed to slow down any computer'

Such a mess, sadly.

(Don't open it up in more than one tab concurrently)</comment>


YC Rejection letters are out - <AUTHOR>

Looks like very same email from last time. <comment><USER2> I have got neither rejection or selection email :(

<comment><AUTHOR> So you are in the middle of bell curve!

<comment><USER2> middle would mean a reject, if y axis is # of startups. I hope not, but looks like it.</comment></comment></comment>


Is it possible for web developer to work in a bank? - <AUTHOR>

All the IT roles that Banks need requires knowledge of C++,C# or Java. I don't really see any opening for web developers at all. <comment><USER2> There are some banks that are focusing heavily on having a strong web presence.

Bank Simple (<http://banksimple.com>), they're currently looking for front-end dev's. It's possible but most large banks don't care about their web presence and most wouldn't be looking for PHP developers.

</comment><comment><USER3> Banks don't make money developing websites

</comment><comment><USER4> What is your definition of Web Developer?

The web is a platform - it shouldn't matter what the language is.

<comment><AUTHOR> php/javascript in specific

<comment><USER4> So your question should be, can a PHP developer get a job in a bank. And the answer is... banks hire Java developers.

Why would banks hire someone without the proper skillset?</comment></comment></comment>


Three areas which every start-up should focus their attention on - <AUTHOR> http://www.virgin.com/entrepreneur/richard-branson-launching-a-business-do-these-three-things-or-fail <comment><USER2> In short, the article says do these 3 things or fail...

1\. have fun 2\. differentiate from competition 3\. nurture employees

The title of the article is over dramatic. There are lots of examples of businesses that don't do any of the above and yet they still turn a profit. Even then, you can do all 3 and still fail.

Solid advice nonetheless, just have to take it with a grain of salt.

<comment><USER3> It's less advice and more PR.

<comment><USER4> I would say 0 advice and 100% PR.

The PR department who runs the blog thought would be cool to have some Richard Branson words there. So they sent up an email asking Mr. Branson to write a short advice post. He started writing easy stories he use to share every other interview or lecture, and create a title to make his particular case sounds like a general advice.

The blog guy thinks it is still necessary to put a little more context to make it sound like cool, wise advice. So he writes an intro that resonate with founders. That's it. Out of the microwave advice to generate traffic.

For me, not a single word of value for my startup management. The HN upvotes tricked me. Just some curiosities about how Richard Branson do business.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> Three things your start up is probably already doing, plus some pictures and stories that make Richard Bronson seem like some kind of visionary.

</comment><comment><USER6> Pretty smart, and should be common sense. Retain your customers and talent by building strong and meaningful relationships with both. It's telling that this sort of shit is now practically rocket science for people who think they've found some new way to build businesses that work (using disruptive big data bump apps in the cloud or some horseshit).

</comment><comment><USER7> I'd re-write these slightly:

1\. Know your users. If you understand what they want, you can provide value or fun, and they'll both be well-recieved.

2\. Know the problem you're solving. Starbucks was solving the problem of creating a "3rd space", and they monetized with coffee.

3\. Nurture employees, I'd keep the same.

<comment><USER8> I've never heard that about Starbucks - I'm genuinely curious to know more. Do you have any recommended reading?

</comment></comment><comment><USER9> "Here's a record store... with a lounge." \- success

"Here's an airline... with a lounge." \- success

"Here's a bank... wait for it...... with a lounge." \- success

</comment><comment><USER10> We had a billionaire in India who followed his foot steps now he is pauper. His airline went bust and he had sell his beer factory.

</comment><comment><USER4> One question for HN moderators: Is _flag_ the same as _downvote_?

For example, I think this is useless PR stuff, not interesting in any manner. So should I flag it like I would downvote a comment?

Or flag is mostly for more harmful things suchs as spammy or innacurate posts; and I should just hope less people upvote it and its buried?

<comment><USER11> You should flag a story if you think it's off-topic for HN, i.e. you think it shouldn't be here. Since useless PR stuff shouldn't be here, that's definitely a legit reason to flag a story.

<comment><USER4> thanks!

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> Area number one: not ending headlines with prepositions.

<comment><USER4> Why not? (serious question from a non-native english speaker)

<comment><USER12> The Latinate syntactical construction norms that moved over to English included, among many others, one around prepositions (from the Latin prae, meaning before) being placed _before_ the object with which it is linked, never after.

It certainly isn't a rule, per se; and ending a sentence with a preposition is not wrong. But it is stylistically less desirable.

Dryden hated that Ben Jonson occasionally ended sentences with prepositions. He gave the norm added power and it has lasted, since his 1672 criticism, another 250 years. Dryden never said that ending a sentence with a preposition was wrong, only that it was ugly.

(Incidentally, Winston Churchill never said that this was a grammar rule "up with which I will not put." See: [http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/001715.h...](http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/001715.html))</comment></comment></comment>


Haskell logo fail - <AUTHOR> http://blog.plover.com/prog/haskell/logo.html <comment><USER2> This is just one of those coincidences you find in logo and identity design, especially when you're building a logo out of simple shapes.

Not sure what's being suggested here. Is the implication that the logo is a ripoff or that the logo wasn't properly vetted against existing IDs?

Out of a bajillion logos, there is one that looks similar to the new haskell logo. WOW.

</comment><comment><USER3> This logo was chosen by a vote of the community. Here are the other choices.

<http://www.haskell.org/logos/poll.html>

Multiple people came up with this same design independently, because its meaningful: a combination of a lambda and the bind operator, >>=, two of the most fundamental operators in Haskell.

Anyway this was months ago. And if you want to point a fail-finger, point it at the guy who chose >>= for the bind operator. "LOL yer operater looks like the train logo!" (And I'm being facetious. That operator is awesome.)

</comment><comment><USER4> I kinda like it. Its nonglossy and simple, opposite to most amatuer stuff these days. But i like the amtrack one more which is kinda similar in shape but tries to visullay communicate something completly different - so whats the point of comparing these two?! They are not very much alike if you go into the details.

</comment><comment><USER5> For all you comp-vision folks: provide a service where you can do an image- matching search on a proposed logo, and get a list of similar logos.

</comment><comment><USER6> I don't see the problem. It doesn't use the same colours and it isn't that similar. And the Amtrak logo is only known to Americans anyway.

</comment><comment><USER7> still a really cool logo.</comment>


Ask HN: Tools to achieve your goals? - <AUTHOR>

Are there any apps that allow you to set goals at a certain due date, and then let you subdivide the goals into smaller subgoals and set due dates for those as well? <comment><USER2> It's not exactly a stand-alone app, but Org-mode in Emacs is pretty excellent for this. I like it because I can take text files with me anywhere (even onto a smartphone if I'm using a syncing app like SpiderOak).

Here's a link to get you started: [http://orgmode.org/worg/org-gtd- etc.html](http://orgmode.org/worg/org-gtd-etc.html)

</comment><comment><USER3> "Commit" is a nicely designed iPhone app that does this.

[https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/commit/id473527073?mt=8](https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/commit/id473527073?mt=8)

</comment><comment><USER4> I am using app called Everest on the iPhone. You can set due date for the goal(dream) and break it down into smaller tasks. Its awesome.

</comment><comment><USER5> That´s exactly how dev management tools like Jira work.

<comment><USER5> Or did you want something for your phone only ?

<comment><AUTHOR> Nope, web apps are just as good.

<comment><USER5> Then i think that any recent issue tracking software can be used for that :). That s what I do already with Jira</comment></comment></comment></comment>


Show HN: Reportr - Your life's personal dashboard - <AUTHOR> https://github.com/SamyPesse/reportr#

<comment><USER2> This is awesome - been wanting to hack up something similar for a long time.

I am surprised that most similar commercial services tank (Google Health, Microsoft HealthVault.) The issue is they are not providing any visualization tools to be useful, they just store your data.

<comment><AUTHOR> Thank you, the next step is to build trackers for online data (Facebook, Twitter, GitHub, ...) using their APIs and offline data (using connected hardware).

<comment><USER3> I too have wanted this for some time (have it on my todo projects list). A tool to track all my web usage, commits (both public and private), laptop sleep time, battery status, temperatures and more. This will make things a lot easier. Thank you!

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> This is an oblique comment but it reminded me of Ken Thompson's quote:

 _" Ken Thompson was once asked what he would do differently if he were redesigning the UNIX system. His reply: 'I'd spell creat with an e.'"_ [1]

[1] [http://books.google.com/books?id=poFQAAAAMAAJ&q=%22spell+cre...](http://books.google.com/books?id=poFQAAAAMAAJ&q=%22spell+creat+with+an+e%22&dq=%22spell+creat+with+an+e%22)

</comment><comment><USER5> I haven't dived into the code much so the answer might be obvious. But, where would this trackers live? Would I have to host them somewhere (I presume they can be written in whatever language I want since you have an API)? Or how would that work.

Do you have any plans on adding a "manual entry" form or something? I'd love to use this to track how many cigarettes I smoke per day for instance (currently I'm using a small app I made myself).

<comment><AUTHOR> For the moment, the only tracker is the web navigation tracker and it lives as a chrome extension, using the API and jsonp, it sends events to reportr.io or your own instance.

For trackers for Facebook (twitter, github ...), I planned to add a system of addons to add in one click a tracker for the service (which use the Facebook API), but I'm not sure yet what is the best implementation for this. For the moment, you can use the API (or a library : python or javascript) to track events with scripts.

No manual entry yet, but it'll be added soon. But you can write a python script (10 lines of code) to do it for you : [https://gist.github.com/SamyPesse/6859673](https://gist.github.com/SamyPesse/6859673)

(Sorry for my english, I'm french).

<comment><USER6> Pretty cool! It took me a few minutes to figure out how exactly to send data, but a quick php-script did the trick!

[https://gist.github.com/larrybolt/6860232](https://gist.github.com/larrybolt/6860232)

Really this is what I have been thinking about building myself, awesome that you actually built it! I think I found a github project that I actually would love and can contribute to!

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> This might be a really good compliment to my project, Huginn. [https://github.com/cantino/huginn](https://github.com/cantino/huginn)

Huginn excels at getting data out of various Internet sources and reacting to it. Your project looks like it's great at presenting it.

Send me a note and we can chat about it!

<comment><AUTHOR> I just contact you using your website form.

<comment><USER8> ^ Would love to hear what comes of this.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> Tried installing it in a heroku instance following your directions, sign-ups don't seem to work though. Do you have any ideas?

WebSocket connection to 'ws://[instance].herokuapp.com/socket.io/1/websocket/KqW6Fh7TtpdmUelBVVly' failed: Unexpected response code: 503

</comment><comment><USER10> Very cool, I'm going to give this a whirl.

Suggestion: if you're up for folks helping you with creating new add-ons, add some documentation on how they can do that. I'm definitely interested in contributing.

</comment><comment><USER11> Hey Samy,

I signed up on [http://www.reportr.io](http://www.reportr.io)

But now what do I do? Any instructions on what to do next will help.

<comment><AUTHOR> Check out "Track your web navigation" [https://github.com/SamyPesse/reportr#track-your-web- navigati...](https://github.com/SamyPesse/reportr#track-your-web-navigation) Or you can use the http api (or the python library) to track events from wherever you want.

</comment></comment><comment><USER12> This looks pretty rad and a good start to build upon for a completely open- source tracker. Will follow up with some thoughts/contributions after checking it out more.

<comment><AUTHOR> Thanks :)</comment></comment>