SarathW wrote: Nibban is not the end of greed, hatred and delusion..
"That which is the destruction of greed, hatred and delusion is nibbana."
If you suddenly find yourself being born as a deva, the fact that the Buddha was telling the truth about deities gives more credibility that Nibbāna is a possibility. I think that is what SarathW meant.
Although, I don't know if that would be how someone would think if he or she were reborn as a deva.
SarathW wrote: Nibban is not the end of greed, hatred and delusion.
There is a Sutta to support this which I can't locate it.
Nibbana is the remainder less cessation of perception and feeling.
You must be mistaken. I'm almost certain you misunderstood something.
SarathW wrote: Why cant we think about deity or other realms?
You can think about it but I doubt that you know the point of view of beings of other realms.
The arahant does not generate anymore, any volitional formations (abhisaṅkharo), of any sort.
Last edited by cobwith on Wed Nov 25, 2015 10:49 pm, edited 2 times in total.
samseva wrote: If you suddenly find yourself being born as a deva, the fact that the Buddha was telling the truth about deities gives more credibility that Nibbāna is a possibility. I think that is what SarathW meant.
At least we can get to the state of Dva by higher Jhanas.
If you attain higher Jhana, it will be much easier to understand Nibbana.
(Above Saṅkhāra - second link of paticcasamupada ).
This is basically the right knowledge and right release.
Interesting to note parinibbāyati translated as Nibbāna.
SarathW wrote: Interesting to note parinibbāyati translated as Nibbāna.
Bhikkhu Bodhi usually uses "final Nibbāna" in his other translations. He just forgot the "final" here.
‘etaṃ santaṃ etaṃ paṇītaṃ yadidaṃ sabba­saṅ­khā­ra­sama­tho sabbū­padhipa­ṭi­nissaggo taṇhākkhayo virāgo nirodho nibbānan’ti.
"Knowledge can be communicated but not wisdom"
So the second option is just death, right?
Spiny Norman wrote: So the second option is just death, right?
Both the first and second choices are death with no more continuance of any of the senses, not even consciousness; no remainder, no being that can be called upon.
The difference between the first and second is that the first one is the materialist-atheist position and the second one is what most believe to be the classical Buddhist position. In the second position, if there is no awakening / nibbana / parinibbana at death, then there is still becoming in the form of rebirth.
Death is the painful break-up of the body. Non-existence is "the absense of existence"
So nibbana is not death while it is non-existence.
Voting regarding this topic is meaningless. It is like voting on the ultimate meaning of truth, or the nature of dark energy by those who have never experienced it. The one's who can vote in this regard are The Buddhas. Best to reserve this thread just for them and then report the results.
Ron-The-Elder wrote: Voting regarding this topic is meaningless. It is like voting on the ultimate meaning of truth, or the nature of dark energy by those who have never experienced it. The one's who can vote in this regard are The Buddhas. Best to reserve this thread just for them and then report the results.
All we can do is just do this survey to see what Buddhists believe. The victor in this poll doesn't determine the absolute truth and was not meant to do that. Argumentum ad populum and history shows us that millions and even billions can follow obvious falsehoods.