From the Warp: Why add a squad of Scouts to Deathwing?
Why add a squad of Scouts to Deathwing?
The other day, I posted the new Scout squad I added to my Deathwing army. I know it's not keeping in line with "pure Deathwing," but I like Scouts and I think they'll work perfectly for how I like to play.
But why Scouts in my force?
1. I had 140 points to spend and they cost me 140 points.
2. For some reason, I really like painting Scouts.
Some of them go over 140 points when I add termie armour so that's puts them out of play and of what's left, what do I do with a Company Master in power armour?
Deathwing tolerates these guys, they aren't part of the Inner Circle, but they are cool models. He would need some Servitors to add some power and then he becomes a squad that really only excells at range. Sometimes I need to get in there and this guy won't help much in that department.
The reason I didn't add one of these is because I feared it would force me to rely on a static shooting base too much and I would lose some of my mobility. I've already got two Mortis pattern dreads for mobile support as it is.
Definitely cool, but I think adding these guys would mean that I would have to play them aggressively and always get up close to get the most out of them. They seem too small of a unit to me for that and I don't want to "have to" play a unit a certain way to get them to work best. Besides, these guys can't get into a Land Raider either.
I've already got two tanks and both can transport my termies. I'd hate to add a tank that I can't use as a transport as well.
Another Ravenwing option that are fairly fragile (but fast) and usually require getting up close to do the most damage. Maybe not close, but if I'm in range to do the most damage, so is the enemy.
Sure the Tactical guys are scoring, but how would I use any of these in my force that I don't already do with my Terminator squads?
Again, I would have to get up close (or stay back and just shoot respectively) to really use these guys and I don't want to be forced to use a part of my army in one particular way to get the most from it.
Even though the Assault squad could Deep Strike if I needed them too.
And that's why I chose the Scouts.
It's not that they can fill a role like shooting or assault or something specific, but they are flexible for me. Mine aren't scoring, they're Elites, but there's nothing I can do about that.
When it comes to flexibility, let's look at what these guys have to offer.
Can potentially pin enemy units and reach out and hit enemy units at a distance. Also have bolt pistols in case fighting gets up close.
2. The ability to sweeping advance.
Sure, my Dreads can do it, but my termies can't and it might be nice to have this ability if I need it to end combat decisively.
I can deploy these guys in a number of places and not just in my deployment zone. They even fit inside my Land Raiders if need be too.
Not a big deal, but it makes them easier to keep in terrain and still get where they need to be in a hurry.
There are some downsides to picking this unit though.
1. They are not Fearless.
2. They are only 5 men strong wearing Scout armour.
3. They are not scoring, but can still contest objectives.
All in all, I think they give me more options than my other choices and won't require me to play them a certain way to get the most out of them.
Army building, did you build what you wanted?
I've found you'd get more from adding the Ravenwing Bikers. Just a squad or so will get you a TON of mileage during the Deathwing Assault. Plus, the mobile melta isn't anything to complain about. They're fundamentally expendable, but I almost always get my points' worth from when when I drop some terminator squads on their location.
And really, the Ravenwing bikers are supposed to fill the niche that Scouts normally field.
I guess I'm a bit confused about using a scout squad for a sweeping advance - they're too close to Guardsmen, with only a 5-strong squad, that I'd be reluctant to get them stuck into combat with many things.
I think Rush's point about the Ravenwing bikers is solid. Also, I'm not sure why having a Dreadnought turns into static-fire - give the dude an assault cannon, CCW + flamer, and get him stuck in!
I disagree with both posters. I think scouts for Dark Angels is a great choice for the points. a 3 man ravenwing squad will be cut down like grass, why would you waste the points? Ron did not state anything about deathwing assault in his original post, just deployment via transports. I'm not sure how helpful ravenwing will be for him.
use the rocket + infiltrate + scout move to get a shot off on turn 1. can easily take out a transport, dread, defiler right off the start.
Space the scouts far away from where you want the bulk of your force, make your opponent make a choice of who to go after, most times leaving your scouts alone for a couple more rounds of shooting.
just some reasons why I love using scouts, again it is all dependent on how you want to play your army Ron.
Cornelius: I think you've very much missed the context of Ron's army. It's not just a Dark Angels army, it's a Deathwing army. Lots of terminators.
Terminators are pretty well equipped to take out Anvil units.
Ravenwing Bikers, with meltaguns x2, are more likely to take out any sort of armor than scouts with a single rocket launcher. That melta's flat-out better at cracking armor than krak missiles, there's twice as many dice coming out of them, and the bikes + scout make it very likely that you might be in melta range when they shoot.
Given that Ron's running Deathwing Terminators, unless he's putting them in a Land Raider, he's almost certainly using DWA. Hell, DWA is one of the DA's few strengths. It might not be as big of a concern to Ron as it should be, but it's certainly a factor.
I also think you're overestimating the "choice of who to go after." Between scoring terminators and non-scoring scouts, there is no choice: kill the terminators! So, sure, that might mean the Scouts stick around on the table, but who cares? All of the things you've listed that Scouts bring to the table... the Ravenwing bikers do better, for negligibly more points. (Scouts w/ Sniper x4, ML x1 costs 20 points less than 3 Bikers w/ Meltaguns x2.) And, again, the Ravenwing bikers are fluffier.
And I really cannot stress how useful teleport homers are to a all-terminator force.
I don't dislike Scouts... but I've never used them. I think they're probably the second least impressive unit the book (behind DA Assault troops, who are inarguably the worst unit in the book).
Scouts are cool and yours have a nice paint job. It'd be a shame not to bring them to the tabletop. After all, what better training can those rookies get than training with the Deathwing itself?
All deathwing assault usually gets is one chance to do something then they get shot to pieces next turn. Not a great investment for a 200+pt unit. The scouts can do two things. The first is MC hunt and pin down units, giving the rest of the force some breathing room. Second, two squads will allow you to field this army as another marine codex force if he wishes to. I plan on painting two units of these guys myself along with a master of the forge for that reason alone.
Ravenwing have teleport homers, I would take them just to increase the accuracy of deep strike. And they don't need to be played one way or another, they frankly are better at range, and can turboboost to contest objectives. They're just a better unit than scouts in terms of complementing Deathwing in a lot of ways.