writer, as well as that of an academic in undergraduate writing. Bartholomae posits that Elbow "comes down on the side of credulity as the governing idea in the undergraduate writing course," whereas he, himself, expresses more skepticism. The debate continued with these differing views: Elbow believes that writing belongs to the writer from the beginning; Bartholomae counters that he is more dismissive, not necessarily granting the writer her own presence. He believes that Elbow is too accepting while he, himself, thinks that the writer should prove himself first. In his response, Elbow agrees with Bartholomae that training for academic writing should be a crucial part of an undergraduate's career; however, Elbow says that this training can't be completed in just one semester. Elbow says that perhaps one of their greatest differences is that Bartholomae believes the classroom to be a "'real space, not an idealized utopian space'" (88). This implies to Elbow that Bartholomae believes that "a classroom cannot be utopian, and that utopian spaces are not real spaces" (88). Another major aspect of the debate comes from the idea of writing without teachers, a concept that Bartholomae states doesn't exist. Elbow cites diaries, letters, stories, poems, and so forth as ways that students write for themselves with no teachers involved. Elbow acknowledges that unequal power, however, is ubiquitous, and not just in writing, but believes that there is still plenty of writing being done for the students' own enjoyment. The debate has, over the years, helped to shape the understanding and teaching of composition theory, especially in regard to how much power is granted the writer. It has also caused writers to consider audience in ways they may not have before. In the end, the two have essentially agreed to disagree, with Bartholomae saying that the writer should have the role of authorship to work towards, and Elbow maintaining that writers be accepted as writers from the beginning. References Selected bibliography Bartholomae, David. "Writing with Teachers: A Conversation with Peter Elbow." College Composition and Communication 46:1 (1995): 62-71. Bartholomae, David and Peter Elbow. "Responses to Bartholomae and Elbow." College Composition and Communication 46:1 (1995): 84-92. Elbow, Peter. "Being a Writer vs. Being an Academic: A Conflict in Goals." College Composition and Communication 46:1 (1995): 72-83. Elbow, Peter. Selected Works of Peter Elbow. Mar. 31, 2009. <http://works.bepress.com/peter_elbow/>. Elbow, Peter. Writing Without Teachers. 2nd ed. New York: Oxford UP, 1973,1998. Elbow,