General Politics Thread

The truth being that the left is root and branch and to the core anti-Semitic, that there is something fundamentally anti-Semitic about the left, ingrained in its ideology, to be left leaning is synonymous with anti-Semitism.

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You really should not put words in people's mouths. It is childish, dishonest, and not worthy of serious debate.

OK, not obsessed. Focused on ? My examples were just that. Plenty from other parties. Munich was a tory effort.
What interests me is politicians claiming the moral high ground rather than arguing the politics. Its a way of avoiding hard issues and tries to silence other voices. So fumble pretends the charge of anti semitism is a cover for something else. He had better talk to Jon Landesman, a Jew and founder of Momentum, who is clear that it exists within his own organisation.

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I've been in the Labour party all my life and never observed any anti-Semitism, so you need to be a bit more specific, is it a few bad apples or symptomatic of something ingrained in the party? If it is symptomatic of some deeper malaise then what is it? And if you can't or won't identify this malaise then it's more right wing mischief, move on nothing to see.

Here's a context for you that uses them in the same sentence. How about

"Tony Blair is the most successful New Labour politician in the history of the Labour Party and the only one to win elections and pass transformative legislation in half a decade. The Labour Party has had 5 clear election wins in the entire history of the Party and Tony Blair brought 3 of them. He is the longest serving Labour Prime Minister. He is one of two Labour Prime Ministers to ever win a landslide re-election. In vote share on election, he's 8th and 10th in election history despite being in a three Party system compared to others who were in a two Party system. Taken by number of seats, Tony Blair's disastrous 2005 election victory was the fifth most successful Labour result in history. He led the Party for 4 more years than Attlee and 3 years more than Wilson. He is one of the Party's most historic figures and there will be great volumes written on the work he performed in decades to come as one of the three pillars of the Party along with Attlee and Wilson."

Ok maybe that's more than a sentence, you're right.

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Blair hijacked the Labour party and created New Labour - a right leaning shadow of the party which he used to get elected to Parliament in the first place. What he did was the same as what Militant was trying to do on the hard left of the party prior to him. Neither were core central Labour and were piggybacking on the back of an existing party because they were both aware that New Labour or Militant as a stand alone concept, a party coming from a standing start had no chance of success. Labour dropped the " New" like a hot potato as soon as possible because whilst Blair may have sated the thirst for power for some in the party his " brand " was and remains as toxic as ever. I would say that even today he is reviled in the Labour party as much as Thatcher. He is most respected by those on the right who can't bring themselves to jump camp and vote for either Labour or Conservative - he was the ultimate cross over candidate, a snake oil salesman.

I've been in the Labour party all my life and never observed any anti-Semitism, so you need to be a bit more specific, is it a few bad apples or symptomatic of something ingrained in the party? If it is symptomatic of some deeper malaise then what is it? And if you can't or won't identify this malaise then it's more right wing mischief, move on nothing to see.

1. Jon Landesman's not here, you are, you made the assertion.
2. What's dishonest about asking why you think the Labour Party is anti-Semitic?

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1. See today's Labour List.. see Jonathan Freedman in the Guardian 27 September. Hardly right wing mischief makers. Both available on line. Google Anti semitism in the Labour movement to see many other examples.
2 What's dishonest is that you are a member of the party, pretending not to know of these events.

1. See today's Labour List.. see Jonathan Freedman in the Guardian 27 September. Hardly right wing mischief makers. Both available on line. Google Anti semitism in the Labour movement to see many other examples.
2 What's dishonest is that you are a member of the party, pretending not to know of these events.

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I know about the right wing media and I know about Zionism and I know about manufactured outrage and that's all I'm ever going to know, as you seem to be reluctant to enlighten me.

Is this a new thing that old farts like me have missed? Someone makes an assertion, they are asked to justify it and they think an adequate response is Google it!

I know about the right wing media and I know about Zionism and I know about manufactured outrage and that's all I'm ever going to know, as you seem to be reluctant to enlighten me.

Is this a new thing that old farts like me have missed? Someone makes an assertion, they are asked to justify it and they think an adequate response is Google it!

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Now youre being silly, I have given you 2 references. I dont have to copy or write them out for you .In the first one Landesman himself says they have problem; in the second you would find criticism of people's denial. Grow up. OUT.

If you are a member, how come you missed the events at the conference, widely reported anti semitic shouts from the floor.?

Now youre being silly, I have given you 2 references. I dont have to copy or write them out for you .In the first one Landesman himself says they have problem; in the second you would find criticism of people's denial. Grow up. OUT.

If you are a member, how come you missed the events at the conference, widely reported anti semitic shouts from the floor.?

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How many shouts real or alleged makes a Party anti-Semitic? One? Ten? Twenty? And what constitutes an anti-Semitic shout? And who was it? And Landesman says there's a problem, but there was a Party investigation about this and it came to the conclusion there was no problem, so there's been a cover up? How can this be? And is it coincidental that Labour has Corbyn as leader and suddenly Labour is anti-Semitic?

I have to smile, we support a club owned by a company owned by an oligarchy that doesn't even recognise the State of Israel but you're happy to peddle right wing BS about anti-Semitism in the Labour Party! Wake up, it has no foundation, it's just Zionist mischief.